Cascade Components Announces SB130 and SB150 Links

Aug 3, 2020 at 11:40
by Cascade Components  
photo


Press Release: Cascade Components

We are excited to bring you our SB130 and SB150 links. Both of these links improve the suspension's square edge performance, small bump sensitivity, mid-stroke support, and bottom out resistance. This is accomplished through an increase in progression and a slight increase in travel. The amount of speed these links will allow you to carry while being confident in traction for breaking and ability to absorb large impacts is quite confidence inspiring.

Yeti link colors
Both the SB130 and SB150 links are offered in black, silver, and orange

These links have been out for a little bit, but due to initial demand we have waited on the official release until stock levels have stabilized. We will have plenty in stock and available to ship next week. Because the links have been out for a little, if you're curious about whether or not the links really do what we claim you can find info on that in various forums and groups. As we've said before, if it isn't the real deal we don't make it.

SB130 Link

Our SB130 link is designed to work with both the stock shock size and the longer stroke "lunch ride" shock size. Since both of these shocks are the same eye-to-eye length, the set ups share the same unweighted geometry. Keep in mind dynamic ride height is what really drives a bike's feel. If you run the same percent sag with the longer stroke shock it will sag a large distance at the wheel and result in a lower BB and less anti-squat at the sag height. Speaking of pedaling, this link is designed to have similar pedaling performance compared to the stock link, however it excels on technical climbs where better traction is nice.


• 135 mm of travel with stock shock, 140 mm with 210x55 (lunch ride) shock
• Increased to 25% progression over 15% with stock link
• Slackens bike 0.5 degrees and lowers BB 7 mm
• Sealed Enduro MAX bearings (same as stock)
• CNC'd out of 6061-T6 in the USA
• $269USD
SB130 leverage curve comparison

SB150 Link

The SB150 link is designed around the stock shock size. One of the goals of this link was to improve performance with larger volume air shocks as well as coil shocks. Despite having a similar progression percentage to the SB130, this set up provides more bottom out resistance because it's used in conjunction with a longer stroke shock. If you have ever felt like the rear can get a little hung up on square edge hits, this eliminates that feeling.


• 155 mm of travel with stock shock
• Increased to 26% progression over 17% with stock link
• Slackens bike 0.5 degrees and lowers BB 7 mm
• Sealed Enduro MAX bearings (same as stock)
• CNC'd out of 6061-T6 in the USA
• $269USD
SB150 leverage curve comparison

For more information please visit cascadecomponents.bike/yeti-linkages.

Production link machining
One of the Yeti links on the machine


Author Info:
CascadeComponents avatar

Member since May 21, 2019
26 articles
Must Read This Week
Thank You For Everything, Pinkbike
76352 views
Pole Bicycles Has Filed for Bankruptcy
55837 views
First Ride: The Sub-$600 RockShox Domain and Psylo Forks
42704 views
[UPDATED] Final Elite XC Results & Overall Standings from the Mairiporã XC World Cup 2024
42148 views
Tree Root Pierces Harriet Harnden's Foot at Round 1 of the British National Downhill Series
38124 views
Pinkbike's DH Fantasy League: Get Your Team On The Line - Fort William is in TWO WEEKS!
34640 views
Review: Race Face's Era Chainring Uses Steel, Carbon, & Aluminum
28290 views
First Ride: Fox's New Transfer Dropper Post - Adjustable Travel, Up to 240mm of Drop
26921 views
Sign Up for the Pinkbike Newsletter - All the Biggest, Most Interesting Stories in your Inbox
PB Newsletter Signup

149 Comments
  • 114 0
 Can you design one for my orange?
  • 1 0
 lol
  • 6 0
 and my SC BullIt.
  • 1 0
 After the Lemon test.
  • 8 24
flag vjunior21 (Aug 4, 2020 at 8:46) (Below Threshold)
 How do you sell a link for $269 to someone who already has one almost exactly like it? Make it for a $4k frame and tell people it is better.
  • 19 3
 @vjunior21: You aren't up to speed on leverage ratios, suspension designs and how that affects ride characteristics are you? People have been fine tuning, hot rodding, tinkering with everything from planes, trains, autos, motos bikes, etc. since the machines existed. Why be a d*ck about it?
  • 5 0
 @CascadeComponents can you please start making mullet links? There is a market for this! Megatower first.
  • 1 3
 @bman33:
Just had my opinion about it much like your response is your opinion about it. Why be a d*ck about it?
  • 99 23
 Yeah, getting a 4k frame with the need for a suspension retune. #winning
  • 24 15
 Haters going hate
  • 36 5
 Gonna need a source on the "need" part.
  • 11 9
 @Rodeodave: it’s in the graphs above ☝????
  • 15 32
flag Leo48333 (Aug 4, 2020 at 6:19) (Below Threshold)
 Nobody needs this BS. Trying to solve problems for issues we don't have. Thanks.
  • 9 17
flag stumphumper92 (Aug 4, 2020 at 6:24) (Below Threshold)
 @Leo48333: That's marketing for ya!
  • 13 28
flag truehipster (Aug 4, 2020 at 7:20) (Below Threshold)
 @Leo48333: So some small company can out think Yeti with all of It’s resources? Who are their test riders and more progression is not always better!
  • 9 0
 I love it...just like tuner cars; hot rods!
  • 45 0
 Mountain bikes are like Jeep Wranglers. Sure, we can do anything and go anywhere on them in their stock format, but part of the fun is trying little accessories that customize your ride. Tinkering is part of the fun.
  • 2 8
flag foggnm (Aug 4, 2020 at 7:36) (Below Threshold)
 @truehipster: I agree, a leverage curve is not a substitute for trail-feel.
  • 4 0
 @truehipster: Spoken like a true Hipster.
  • 5 0
 You don't 'need' a retune, but its nice to have an option
  • 24 1
 You wouldn't hesitate to upgrade your brakes, get a different drivetrain, spring for carbon rims, even pop for the newest shock, not to mention sending your fork to Avalanche for tuning, but adding a custom link is no go?

Ya need to think about this a little bit longer ... those of us who can tell the difference will be all over this product and will yammer for one to fit their bike.

I just popped for some offset bushings, super excited to try those out!
  • 6 0
 @nurseben: Totally agree. Riding and fiddling with mountain bikes is a sport/hobby. If we don't waste the money on a linkage, we'll waste it on something else. Unless you're one of those people that keeps a bike for 20 years and says "I've never had to service that XYZ."
  • 2 0
 @nurseben: seems like a legit point wondering why they are able to design better linkages than the factory designed for their bike in the first place.
  • 1 0
 Does it do anything to help with the rear end lateral flex issue we read so much about? Smile
  • 3 1
 @friendlyfoe: yeah, not really. Linkage designs are all about compromises - trading performance in a given parameter for performance in another. It is not hard to imagine that a slightly different set of compromises - caused by a different top link - could yield more optimized performance for a set of users.
  • 1 0
 @nurseben: What do you mean by offset bushings? Were you able to longshock your Sb150?
  • 52 5
 The thing that keeps coming to my mind when I see these links is, if they're so good, why don't the bike manufacturers make them like this in the first place? And then consequently I think, there must be a trade off?
  • 28 2
 Could be the difference between what a team rider would ride and a more "punter friendly" bike. End of the day the bike needs to sell to average riders as its largest volumes, that could be the trade off.
  • 13 2
 It's not that the factory tune is bad, just different. I've not read this properly, but it looks like the first link sacrifices a bit of pedaling efficiency for small bump compliance. Whether that is a trade off that is worthwhile depends on the rider and area they ride, but it's not a bad thing to have the option to tune your ride...
  • 9 1
 I'd be questioning how many mules get built to assess geometry and kinematics, or is it a case of, that looks good and will sell, so get it on sale already. Then let the punters figure out the shock tune is way off, as its the same shock tune for all four sizes, when in reality it would be sensible to have at least two, if not one per size. Alternatively, sell them as a frame only and get one of the suspension companies to supply a tuned shock.
  • 1 0
 @slimboyjim: I think that's valid, what is an average joe going to notice more, a little bit of small bump and square edge absorption or pedal efficiency, I would say the latter personally.
  • 3 0
 @sir-hc: yeah they do seem to have a pretty quick turn around to market; have some chat and generate a fever on mtbr forums then within a month or two its released. could just be good manufacturing and testing though, I might be being over cynical.
  • 14 0
 There's a trade off with everything in suspension design. Having aftermarket links gives more choice about how you want your bike to behave. To some the stock link will be "better", to others the aftermarket link will be "better".
  • 7 2
 Because lot of people buy bikes with no clue about Suspension etc and just ride the bike once a week They arent armchair engineers like us who need good suspension lol.
  • 2 1
 @sir-hc: I think that it is fair to assume that all bike manufactures - especially those who are heavily invested in racing - go through lots and lots of R&D, mules, shock tunes and extensive testing before committing to making molds for carbon frames- or in this case, a series of carbon frames (since the rear suspension design is consistent across the entire SB-lineup). These links together with the shock size and positioning is what changes between the 130/140/150/165 frames with the rest of the linkage parts being the same across all bikes, so I would assume Yeti has spent a lot of time optimizing them to their requirements. Yeah, shock tunes is perhaps something that remain to be optimized by the end user, but that is quite different than the fairly substatial effects these links seemingly will have to the system, and the lack of data on anything but changes in geo and the leverage curve.
  • 2 1
 @oatkinso: I see it as having 2 bikes if you get the link..
  • 3 1
 @JoeyBratten: I've certainly seen some *very* average riders on a yeti!
  • 1 1
 Like upgrading tires on a car...
  • 21 1
 I would point to the Transition Sentinel to answer your question. The first generation has a progression ratio around 7% if I am not mistaken. The Cascade link ups that to around 20%. This is almost EXACTLY what Transition did with the second generation of Sentinel. Are you under the assumption that everything that goes to market is perfect the first time? I have been riding a sentinel with the cascade link for over a month now and I can tell you it is a radical improvement in everything about the bike. I can now run a coil shock without it blowing through every millimeter of travel on the slightest bump. The mid stroke support is incredible. The old link with air shock acted like a trap door and just collapsed on itself. This changes the bike in the best possible way and I am sure they did the same thing with their other products. It isn't marketing speak, it is a real measurable improvement. I am very pleased with the changes. Thank you Cascade components for doing the homework that the bike company didn't.
  • 2 0
 @garrisond5: im just posing the question. as @klinkekule has pointed out below, neither the manufacturer nor cascade point out the potential downsides to their designs, so instead of reading between the lines im interested in what the real world opinion is instead of being potentially misled by marketing claims. FYI im weighing up buying a link for my Sentinel, so thanks for the info.

I do also worry that we're getting to a point where people seem to fear using all their available travel. Bryn Atkinson did an insta post a while ago talking about how he often plays around with removing all volume spacers from his fork in order to use more travel.
  • 3 0
 You could say the same about many things that are mass produced:

Why get different tires and have your shock/fork tuned on your mountain bike?

If the stock stem and bars are good enough for the the Karen's and Joey's, why change yours?
  • 5 1
 I own a cascade link on my Megatower. I also have an sb150, no link. I'd say if you look at their linkages you'll see they are primarily going for more progression. I can't say I'd want more progression on my rides in places like Moab, Sedona, etc. I'd rather my shock use full travel more frequently.
  • 6 2
 Bikes are linear and shitty because totally rad trail dads need to use full travel to be happy with their bike and they also need the latest 170/150mm trail shredder
  • 1 0
 There’s always trade offs.
  • 2 2
 @oatkinso: I totally agree there must be trade offs and my guess is that Cascade knows what they are. There are many kinematics that affect the way suspension and bike feel but they only post the leverage ratio chart. I'm not saying they're hiding some dirty secret but I AM curious how the link affects anti-squat, anti-rise, and even pedal kickback.
  • 6 0
 @skierdud89: Affects on anti-squat, anti-rise, and pedal kick back are negligible. It's hard to really alter those without making a link that's ridiculous or changing more than just the link. The catch is that anyone who isn't using full travel with the stock link will have an even harder time using it with this link. Some people also might not like the geometry changes. We view it as essentially a low setting.
  • 1 0
 @CascadeComponents: right on thanks for setting the record straight! I have a stumpy Evo on the way and one of your links for that may be in my future.
  • 2 0
 @oatkinso: I see zero downsides in this. Like I said, I have been on it for a little over a month and the bike is so much improved I have canceled my pre-order for a new frame. I will be riding the "old" sentinel for the remainder of this season and probably next season too.
  • 1 6
flag klinkekule (Aug 4, 2020 at 14:36) (Below Threshold)
 @CascadeComponents: "Affects on anti-squat, anti-rise, and pedal kick back are negligible." Would you mind posting data / graphs backing this statement up? The changes might be slight or tiny, yet might still change how the system works as a whole. I remember reading your press release and checking your site when the SC links were introduced, and was fairly suprised when fairly substantial geo changes that again will affect the rear kinematics a fair bit were seemingly mentioned in passing as minor trivialities while "leverage rate" and "increased progression" was seemingly mentioned in every other sentence. Don't get me wrong, I think more progression is great, a lower BB is great and a slacker front end is great. I just find it less than perfect thatthe real world effects of the changes caused by you link are presented in a one sided manner, potentially dismissing adverse effects as neglible w/o data, while the postives are backed by data. Seems like an easy fix.
  • 2 6
flag klinkekule (Aug 4, 2020 at 14:46) (Below Threshold)
 @CascadeComponents: And also - from your site "The link makes the bike 0.5 degrees slacker and lowers the BB 7 mm. The reach technically decreases a little, but it’s a small enough amount that it’s not noticeable. The same can be said for saddle position and seat tube angle. The 0.5 degree change in seat tube angle is such a small change in saddle position that the difference isn’t noticeable." For real? So all changes that might give an adverse effect are not noticeable, but the once that can give a desired effect is really noticeable? I am sure that the links can provide some desired effects for a lot of users, but this way of presenting your product is one side and not very confidence inspiring imho.
  • 6 1
 @klinkekule: open up a calculator and put in 450*cos(0.5degrees) and you'll see why 0.5 degrees is not especially noticeable when it comes to saddle position or reach. Like I've said, the drawback is that some people might not be able to use full travel with it. You might want to give some of the MTBR threads a read, because like you said it's about the big picture and number sheets don't do that justice. Or you could give a link a try and see for yourself.
  • 5 7
 @CascadeComponents: Honest question - why not just post the graphs instead of downplaying the potentially negative effects and let the numbers speak for themselves? It sure as hell would negate some of the questions this comment section has provided. And btw, suggesting that I do not know what I am talking about or have not read up on the subject is pretty petty. I've been on various forums including MTBR and reading on the subject for what a decade+ now, delving into the world of rear kinematics before it became fashionable. This is not the first time I ponder on geo or rear kinematics. The main reason I even bother to comment here is that I find your product very interesting, but am less then impressed with how you market it. If you can't take some genuine questions and constructive criticism without replying "just trust me" or implying that the questions is caused by a lack of understanding, then why do you even bother to engage with potential customers?
  • 1 0
 Yeah-companies spend a lot of time and money getting suspension tunes dialed. A Specialized, or Yeti, or Santa Cruz rides the way their engineers and test riders intend them to. So.......are these links a bad product? No-they're well made and alter the suspension as claimed. But unless a stock tune doesn't work for you, I'd stick with it.
  • 3 1
 @klinkekule: the reason we don't include tons of graphs in press releases is because we are trying not to inundate people with too much information to the point that it doesn't get read. I wasn't suggesting you don't know what you're talking about. It's just that the easiest way to see our point about the effect on geo is to do some quick trig. Reach is changed by less than 0.1 mm and saddle position moves about 3 mm depending on the person.
  • 7 3
 @klinkekule: you're insufferable dude. I'm riding one. It does all they claim. I'm my opinion it's under marketed based on real world impressions. Go ponder anti squat... I'll be ripping trails on my Cascade equipped wonder bike!
  • 3 8
flag klinkekule (Aug 4, 2020 at 23:54) (Below Threshold)
 @CascadeComponents: If those are the actual numbers and you already did the math, then why just not post the info on your webpage instead of describing it with adjectives? Similarly, if the press release needs to be short and snappy, why not post the full set of graphs on your web page? A lot of potential customers are able to understand what the changes in geo and linkage design will translate to on the trail. How large are the changes in the position of the lower link during the stroke? The answer cannot be "its the same" as the position of the lower link is a dictated by the upper, and the upper has changed. Again, the effects I am trying to understand here are what is once again given by the graphs. Wink
  • 5 6
 @garrisond5: Cascade is selling an engineering product, making relatively substatintial changes in a rear linkage design aka a spot where relatively small changes can make for huge changes in how the system works. Is it unreasonable that one would expect that the actual data be presented with the product in the place of unprecise adjectives? It is clearly in their interest, preventing misunderstandings and questions. I am also happy to hear that the link does what you hoped it would. Too bad you could not make that point without attacking me as a person, and not the message that I am conveying. And to repeat myself - I think this product is very, very interesting and something I will strongly consider buying. I just think it is shame that the information provided is at times lacking and boils to "trust me, I've done a better jo here than Yeti".
  • 2 7
flag klinkekule (Aug 5, 2020 at 0:21) (Below Threshold)
 @CascadeComponents: and to repeat myself again and be crystal clear - I really think the added progressiveness of your revised link is a huge benefit, while the geo changes are well worth it as a trade off. Hell, the changes in the geo are all postive going downhill imho. That being said, I have spent a lot of time understanding nuances of linkage designs, and on the setup of my bikes over the year. The reason I am asking for the extra details is to understand how the system works given your link, pending a future upgrade of the link. I am not trying to knock your product or indicate that it is not a terrific product for customers valuing downhill performance over uphill. If the way I am asking for this is wordy and seemingly pedantic, well - my bad, I will try to be more precise in the future. After all, what I am asking for here is more precision in how your products are marketed Wink
  • 4 0
 @klinkekule: We haven't been attacking you personally sorry you feel that way. I just got a chance to upload the graphs you were talking about so if you look at the album the press release images are in you will find them there now. If you look you will see that both the SB150 and SB130 links sit a hair above the stock link before dropping below. On the trail this difference isn't noticeable since it is so small. We aren't going to draw attention to that because people will latch onto the notion that it might pedal better and feel mislead when it pedals the same. Just note that we analyze anti-squat a little differently. Anti-squat as it's all too often done generalizes a number of variables that can change wildly from bike to bike and rider to rider such as cassette size and range, chain ring size, and rider size. We use chain growth rate to quantify how it will feel while pedaling because this is something that is not specific to any particular set up.
  • 25 0
 I had the Bronson LT link. The Bronson suffers from a fairly flat ratio graph making it blow through travel. The Bronson link from Cascade fixed this and also made it possible to use a coil which I found to be the best setup. The BB and geo changes were noticeable but made the bike handle steep, fast, rough stuff a little better while not ruining its mellow trail handling. I didn't notice any detrimental affects to any other part of the ride quality. The gentleman designing these isn't just some goof with machining equipment. He has a pretty good handle on what he is doing and thoroughly field tests every product.
  • 15 0
 I have a Cascade link on my Stumpjumper Evo. The best upgrade I've done to a bike. The stock Evo was much too linear for my taste. I had my DVO Topaz shock maxed out with volume spacers and the bike still bottomed out way more frequently that I liked. If I ran less sag the ride became pretty harsh. With the Cascade link it made a significant difference in progression. I increased air pressure about 15 PSI to reach 30% sag and removed one volume spacer. The bike now is still supple off the top but the mid stroke support is far better while being incredibly composed over fast and rough trails. The bike is much more eager to boost off of jumps and trail features. I love how it jumps now. Overall, it transformed the ride from mediocre to outstanding.
  • 2 0
 That's awesome to hear it worked so well for you. Do you think that your scenario was a bit different than the sb130/150 given that there have definitely been "complaints" about how linear the current stumpjumpers are? (Same for the linkage cascade did for a Transition bike, though the model escapes me). I feel like there hasn't been many complaints about the yeti frames and how they ride. Is the incremental gains/tuning or unnecessary change in the name of progression?
  • 2 0
 @neologisticzand: I haven't ridden either of those Yetis and don't know anything about their rear suspension to really comment on how necessary one of these links is. The Stumpjumper link is 70% more progressive than the stock link where these Yeti links are not nearly as drastic of a change. On paper these Yeti links seem like a much smaller incremental change compared to the Stumpjumper link.
  • 2 3
 Why wouldn't you buy a bike that suit you out of the box? Why buying a bike and need to change the suspension design right away? What's so special about that bike to buy it if you didnt like the tune?
  • 2 0
 @ybsurf: Honestly, if I had known the suspension was as linear as it is I may have bought something different. Beyond the suspension being too linear, the geometry is dialed and I love everything about the Stumpjumper Evo.
  • 3 1
 @ybsurf: Ever buy a custom surfboard and change the out the fins that came with it? Same concept.
  • 1 2
 @Eatsdirt: surfboards dont comes with fins anymore, but I see your point. Usually you know how's the surfboard will feel based on shape and dimensions but for a bike I will demo as much and often as I can before pulling the trigger.
  • 5 1
 @ybsurf: As a board builder and surfer at a high level, I can tell you that if you don't play with fin template, foil, and flex pattern to find the sweet spot for a board/conditions you might be missing out... or have low performance standards. Same with bikes.
  • 1 2
 @Eatsdirt: I'm not on that level of surfing or biking to see a difference on fin flex and template. I know theres is a difference but when I buy at 5000 or 6000$ bike I try it first to be sure I like it. I do upgrade my bike as well but the suspension kinematics and geo it's the only thing I want to be sure I like before pulling the trigger but I can see how a link can make it better.
  • 2 0
 @ybsurf: not everyone has the luxury of access to somewhere to try a bike, let alone a range of bikes, before buying.
  • 15 1
 I really think these guys are on to the future. Custom shock links at sensible prices make so much sense.
  • 5 12
flag stumphumper92 (Aug 4, 2020 at 6:24) (Below Threshold)
 sensible price is questionable...
  • 12 0
 @stumphumper92: ya bc their time spent figuring it all out wasn't too valuable...?
  • 11 0
 How do these links improve mid stroke support? (I'm not saying that they don't - it's a genuine question). The way I'm looking at it, mid stroke support is likely to decrease??

The link increases the leverage ratio at the start, and reduces it at the end, so I get that it will improve small bump compliance at the start of the stroke and bottom out at the end of the stroke. But the leverage ratio line is pretty much parallel to the stock link until the final 20% of the stroke, so what's the difference in the middle of the stroke? As a proportion of the initial leverage ratio, the mid-stroke leverage ratio is the same between the two shocks.

If anything, you might end up running proportionally less air in the new link compared to the stock link as the bottom out force is greater on the new link. The actual pressure might be higher to account for the higher leverage ratio, but the amount of extra pressure you put in for the new link will be less than the extra you would have put in if the lines were parallel all the way along the stroke. Wouldn't this give less force in the middle of the stroke than the stock link? If, say, the leverage ratio has gone up 10% at the start of the stroke, you might only put 5% extra pressure in, as the bottom out force is increased. This will give a softer initial stroke. But if the leverage ratio in the mid stroke has also gone up 10%, then increasing pressure by 5% will lead to a softer mid-stroke, not a firmer one?
  • 13 1
 There's interesting claims made, basically standard marketing wording that only looks at one half of the picture to suit their sales pitch.

The increased leverage ratio for the first 75% ish of travel means you would have to run more preload/air pressure with the new link over the standard in order to achieve the same amount of sag, this means you actually have a firmer spring rate, which is negated by the increased leverage ratio, so no actual difference.

The main effect is a slower shaft speed on the shock in the first 75% of travel, which means a reduction in damping if you don't touch the dials after switching the link over.

So the claim of increased small bump compliance and square edge performance is true if you don't adjust the shock, however, if you want the same damping support and feel as before, as most likely would if they had their shock dialled, you would increase the damping to compensate and end up with suspension that feels no different to the old link for the first 75% ish of travel.

So basically if you change the link and increase your air pressure/preload and damping to suit, you wouldn't notice any difference for most of the travel.

The new link would require substantially more force to bottom out though, which is where the claim of 'increased mid stroke support' comes from, its a misnomer as it doesn't give more 'support' (actually less if you didn't increase your damping to match), it just means you will spend more time in the 'middle of the stroke', as the shock won't spend as much time [wallow] in the last part of its travel.
  • 8 8
 It looks like it will soften the suspension until the very end of travel when it becomes more progressive. "Mid stroke support" should decrease noticeably.
Also, 269$ for a single-pass machined alu piece and 2 bearings... mhhh congrats!
  • 17 2
 Also, 269$ for a single-pass machined alu piece and 2 bearings... mhhh congrats! @romphaia:

Are you a machinist? I am a machinist and see at least 3 setups with 3 to 4 tool changes, then there is the programming time, engineering time, anodizing, etc. Everyone thinks CNC machining is easy having no idea what is involved.
  • 1 6
flag 5poundplumbbob (Aug 4, 2020 at 8:44) (Below Threshold)
 @romphaia: Single pass that they didn't even bother to do finish passes on and get rid of all the witness marks.
  • 3 3
 @romphaia: I mean their tools aren't even shrink-fit. Who do these people think they are with all their claims!?
  • 9 1
 The mid-stroke starts to come together when you look at force at the wheel as opposed to leverage ratio. The higher initial leverage ratio means a higher spring rate or air pressure to achieve the proper amount of sag. What this means, though, as that at all points below the sag point the force at the wheel is lower than with the stock link and at all points above it's higher. This is true because the derivative of the leverage curve is more negative than that of the stock link. The link is intended to be run with the same sag point as the stock link. While the link doesn't have an affect on anti-squat, running less pressure or a lower spring rate will make the bike sit lower in a portion of its travel where anti-squat is lower. As for damping, damping plays no role in support relative to any portion of the bike's travel because it is purely speed dependent. Because the leverage ratio increases the shaft speed decreases so damping force is less. Part of the intention of the link is to rely less on damping to prevent bottom outs since excess amounts of damping make the bike not respond to high frequency impacts as well. Think about how many times you've reached for the dial to increase damping and thought about whether it would be worth it because it would make small bump worse. If you're curious what the downside of the link might be it's that anyone who isn't able to use full travel with the stock link definitely won't be able to with this link. The link is about being able to balance support and small bump for people who use all their travel too often.
  • 2 2
 @blurringthelines: are you kidding? With a basic 4th axis or just a simple 4 position rotating table it can be done in one time. Tool changes can be 3 seconds each nowadays
  • 1 1
 @CascadeComponents: So the actual end of travel progression must be much greater that one might think by looking at the leverage graphs. Showing people a comparison graph of the wheel force would be more helpful.
  • 10 0
 @romphaia: You would be correct. One thing I would hazard against people weighing too heavily are force numbers though. Suspension is an energy equation so force can get people sidetracked. Bottom out resistance isn't dictated by the amount of force at the bottom of travel but rather the total amount of energy the shock absorbs between top and bottom of travel. This is something that gets swept over all the time in the bike industry which is why everyone assumes more progression equals lower spring rate. It's all about what progression buys you in this energy equation.
  • 4 0
 Cascade, thank you for chiming in with your answers!
  • 7 0
 @romphaia: I think you're paying for the technology, not the component. It isn't a stem. But if you think about a fancy cnc stem cost about $150 for something that is more or less a bike part that hasn't changed much recently. I'd say the prices are fairly reasonable.
  • 2 0
 @ctd07: I take from this (just trying to wrap my head around what is actually happening and other options) that if I were to leave shock setting the same and add volume reduction tokens, then i should be able to get more bottom out resistance without changing the initial stroke much. I doubt the volume reducers would give the same bottom out resistance, but better than no spacers?

How would this link compare to just adding in volume reducers? Im running my SB130 with no spacers but have the air pressure quite high. Yeti recommends 218 PSI but im currently at 245 PSI @~190 lbs rider weight. My sag is spot on 29%.
  • 10 0
 I've had this link on a SB150 for a week now, and it does what it claims to do. The bike handles much better in fast choppy/square edge sections and read end traction is greatly improved...finally feels balance with the front. However...it does decrease climbing efficiency more than I expected. Not a deal breaker...the positives out weigh that negative quite a bit for me, but be ready for climbing a gear lower than you used to be.
  • 3 0
 Yes I have it and I love it , Makes a faster bike on the downs no question. More sensitive on the initial stroke and more bottom out support. More braking traction , you cant go wrong. I did put my seat pretty much all the way forward tho and slightly less sag
  • 1 2
 Now that makes sense, and matched the leverage graph posted. Unlike their claim of improved "mid stroke support"
  • 1 0
 I’m curious - did you adjust your spring rate and damping, or is the decrease in climbing efficiency without any changes to your suspension settings?
  • 5 1
 @sdurant12: Decrease in climbing is simply because STA and HTA is 0.5 degree slacker
I upped the pressure 10 PSI to have the same sag setting, backed out the High speed compression 3-4 clicks and increase high speed rebound a few clicks. Magic carpet now
  • 8 2
 I’d love to see someone from yeti weigh in here and explain why someone shouldn’t buy this. Explain why the actual design of the bike they came up with is the right way to go.
  • 4 0
 That'd be cool, but I don't think they will. For starters, they don't really seem like the kind of company that actually engages with their customers on forums and such. And, I bet they love this kind of stuff. They don't want to sell you the "perfect" bike. Cascade is establishing that there is room for improvement and this will be one of the marginal improvements that the next generation of SB bikes will tout as a feature.
  • 4 1
 @thegoodflow: But your claim that there is "room for improvement" is exactly why I'd love to hear from them. The idea that this is an improvement is subjective, which is why I'd love to hear why Yeti didn't design the bike this way, when they obviously could have if they wanted to. I don't believe that Yeti's designers are now sitting around saying why didn't I think of that.
  • 7 2
 All of the haters are only hating because this if for a YETI, which unfortunately has become a "dentist" bike company. If it were for more of a dirt bag bike company, they would be totally fine.

What is a joke to me is that YETI was the most grass roots dirt bag race team in the effin world in the 90s. The YETI race support box truck had it's lights on until wee hours of the morning and the racers were gritty to the core. They still are in my book, and a lot of bass riders choose YETI.

Loser haters need to stay up makin money so they can buy what they want instead of spending their time hating on what they are jealous of.
  • 2 1
 could it be that people voiced similar misgivings with the SC VPP links? I know I thought excactly the same things then as I do not. And please do not confuse haters with people voicing concerns or criticisms - it is not the same thing. Wink
  • 1 0
 @klinkekule: Basing my "haters" terminology on the post by JohSch (1 days ago)
Yeah, getting a 4k frame with the need for a suspension retune. #winning. And the many corresponding replies that used the word "haters".
  • 1 0
 Also, ppl hate on Yeti b/c they are expensive, what about Pivot or SC? Ppl who can't afford them say they are over priced...I dare them to ride one and THEN tell me they cost to much,not gonna happen.
  • 8 4
 There is more to a suspension design then the leverage curve! How does these aftermarket links alter the bikes anti squat, anti rise, chain growth etc etc? The 130/150s geo changes quite a bit - a 7mm lower bb mated with a slacker front will change how the bike rides. So if the handling of the bike changes, so too must the rest of the system and how it works change, yet no hard data is provided for those, equally important parameters. Paying 269usd for an "upgrade" where the pros and cons to the rest of the system is unknown seems overly optimistic at best, even if the machining is nice. It is not like Yeti did not sweat the details when they designed the system in the first place...
  • 2 1
 yeah, and don't get me wrong - I would def not mind a bit more progression in the rear on my SB150, that would be a welcome change. I am just saying that the effects on the rest of the system should be disclosed as well so that people can make informed decisions, not narrowly focusing on a particular parameter at the expense of all others. These things must have been considered when designing these links (or if not these links are just poor engineering), so why not just disclose all the relevant data?
  • 3 0
 To be fair they say on their website that antisquat is unchanged
  • 1 0
 @klinkekule: Why is it that you want more progression on your sb150 (I'm asking with genuine curiosity)? I have a sb130 and feel somewhat the same way, but I believe my bike is less progressive in design (12 vs 15% progression if I remember the marketing). In your search for more progression, are you looking for progression provided without bottomless tokens?
  • 1 0
 @neologisticzand: i run a coil (ElevenSix) and am used to very progressive designs (YT Capra first gen and current gen Jeffsy 29er). I just find progressive designs to ride really well, increasing both top end speed and the bike's ability to generate speed from the terrain. I am not a huge fiddler, so I guess I can get a lot more of the desired traits from the shock given a bit of time. I've run the SB150 bback to back with a mini endurofied current gen Jeffsy 29er (1.5 slacker + 160mm up front, ElevenSix in the rear), and the Jeffsy's ability to build speed in rolling/pumpable terrain is borderline rediculous - even if the top end speed is noticeably lower than the SB150.
  • 1 1
 @Bobadeebob: that sounds odd. With the bb being 7mm lower the lower pivot relative to the rear axle is changed. As such, I would assume the curves are slightly changed as well. I dunno - it is really easy to prove -> just post the graphs. Smile
  • 4 0
 First of all, this is very cool to see aftermarket parts coming out like this!
BUT the concern is; has @CascadeComponents validated that the higher leverage ratios that these link are putting out, can be handle by the carbon frame? Specifically can the layup of the carbon handle the greater forces or are people going to start damaging frames, voiding warranties, etc?
I'm not a sceptic, but being an engineer myself, there is usually a reason why "low hanging fruit" such as this isn't "picked" during the initial design.
  • 3 0
 I bought the sentinel link last week and I am using the stock shock 57.5 stroke which gives me 146mm travel on my V1 aluminium sentinel. One thing I always found with the stock transition link was that you were either over sprung (to much air in the shock) or bottoming out too easily if you ran the recommended sag. The Cascade link has improved things considerably. There is more progression in the suspension and the initial stoke is more supple. It has changed the ride feel for the better and I am really happy that I can now head into rock gardens without fear of the hangup that used to occur as the rear end bottomed out. I'd say if you are struggling to find the right feel in your bike this is a great way to improve the rear end and give more useable shock ranges. I weight 98kg (216lbs) fully geared up. I was sceptical at first but I needed to do something to improve things. I guess motocross setups from the manufacturers are standard kit and it is pretty normal to modify suspension tunes, components to improve the ride feel. I liken these links to those modifications certainly for the transition sentinel.
  • 6 1
 Lost me at "lowers bb 7mm". The 130 is already lower than the older 5.5 was and pedal strikes are much more common if care isn't taken. Lowering it further? No thanks.
  • 1 0
 I noticed no difference in pedal strikes.
  • 2 0
 Cool product and glad it's an available option, however I couldn't live with a 7mm lower BB on my SB150.
Yeti hit the right compromise with the stock geometry and leverage curve for most people IMO.
I wouldn't compromise a lower BB for the optimized kinematics for my trails in New England. I'm already getting lots of pedal and bash guard hits, I doubt the "increased mid stroke support" would overcome the 7mm drop enough to make that issue better.

Great option for someone on faster or more open trails looking for ultimate suspension feel though.
  • 1 0
 The hate level on this thread is High...

I recently ordered a Yeti SB130 (150mm x 130mm x 29er) to replace my Cannondale Trigger (150mm x 145mm x 27.5) bike. I have found my current 145mm rear travel to be sufficient for my riding level and the type of chunky trails I end up riding - I am a little concerned about going down to a 130mm travel rear shock.

I have been considering what options are available to increase the rear travel of the SB130. Would adding the Cascade Components Link by itself (no shock upgrade or volume spacers) be a "sufficient" upgrade to the rear travel (135mm) to get it closer to my current bike travel?
  • 1 0
 Add the link and remove the stroke reducer on the shock to make it 210x55 and you will have 140 mm of travel without needing to do anything else. Removing the stroke reducer can easily be done if you are familiar with the insides of you shock or by any suspension service center. A number of people have talked about their experiences with the link on MTBR. It starts about here on the thread www.mtbr.com/threads/yeti-sb130-discussion-performance-and-build.1087878/post-14850111.
  • 5 0
 Great press release: "confident in traction for breaking"
  • 4 0
 I caught that as well. But don’t worry, it only applies to the pre-production models.
  • 4 0
 while there is a lot of comment on stuff here...isn't this just a link that makes the bikes more Coil friendly??
  • 2 1
 Agree. IMO only an improvement for coil users. With air shocks ou can get very similar results with tokens.
  • 1 0
 I've been on this link on my SB130 LR version for a couple of months. I immediately noticed a big increase in small bump compliance and I no longer blew the o-ring off my shock. I'm not the most "in-tune with my bike" kind of rider, but the difference felt significant. The SB130 stock is great for long pedals and some rough terrain, but not really rough trails at speed. Most of my riding is on trails where people think they need 160mm of travel (Spoiler: You don't).

A friend who is very technically in tune with his V1 Sentinel (and an engineer) has had a similar appreciation for what these links offer.
  • 1 0
 There is no way I would do any mod on my SB130 that lowers the already too low BB. I have never had to pay so much attention to timing pedal strokes than I have on this bike. Already annoys me. That and these bikes are not light. But that’s another story...
  • 2 2
 Aftermarket can measure the kinematics on a bike or two and then “improve” them but they have NO access to the tolerance stack ups. Will the link improve every bike across the possible range of dimensions that the molds make in production? I doubt it.
  • 1 1
 Not sure if it would be a great upgrade. It's good to have some progressiveness, but the head angle of SB150 is already very very very slack and I don't want it to be slacker. And actually I felt my SB150 with a customed tuned RS Super Deluex doesn't bottom out that much because although SB150's suspension curve is very linear, the leverage ratio is relatively low, making the suspensive fairly stiff. Anyway, really want to try it out and see if it really works.
  • 2 1
 "gets hung up on square edges" ... is this with or without chainforce pulling on the suspension? Regardless.. it all sounds like a fix for buying the wrong bike in the first place.
  • 1 0
 Makes me think how fast Rude and the rest of the Yeti team would be if they ran this link?
Kasper is killing it in Canada right now. I wonder what link he is using? Maybe this link is just for average Joe riders?
  • 1 1
 lol. Coming from a guy selling a nearly new Nomad for a different SC bike because that will make all the difference... This link isn't going to save you minutes on your favorite trail. But if you like tinkering and think this would make your bike feel better, so cares. Clearly a sponsored athlete (save Gwin) can't just swap out brand parts for something else that would call into question the company's original design.
  • 1 0
 @cascadecomponents Would you consider making a link for Norco Sight with a decreased leverage ratio (for bigger and heavier riders)?
  • 3 0
 You should be able to remove a token and add another 10+ PSI. It'll somewhat counteract that extra suppleness off the top while having a fairly similar rampup at the end.
  • 3 0
 Will it void the frame warranty?
  • 2 1
 How would Yeti know though?
  • 1 0
 How would yeti know unless your foolish enough to post pictures of your bike on socials with questionable upgrades etc?
  • 5 0
 @jrocksdh & @Tmackstab: That's not the point of my question. I think Cascade should be upfront and mention this in their advertising. But if you want to know, I ride with shop owners who are Yeti dealers, one of whom sold me my bike. Why drag em into a potential mess for a few elective changes? A simple question deserves a simple answer.
  • 1 0
 @Staktup: exactly, why drag them into it..frame cracks, back to stock it goes and warranty started. Just as if u put diff fork or shock on it from stock.
  • 6 0
 @Staktup: Call Yeti. We can't answer this question for them.
  • 2 3
 If you bought X bike and then these so "mods" all of a sudden made you ride better then you bought the wrong bike in the first place. Just like the overforker's line of thinking that adding a longer fork by 20-30mm all of a sudden makes their bike better. People love to buy the wrong bike but never own it so they turn to band-aids like this one to feel better.
  • 1 0
 1st ride in and very impressed, the sharp bump feedback is what swung it for me and it does exactly what they say
  • 3 1
 you can choose basic amalgam version or pay extra for composit
  • 2 0
 Have you got any 7” travel plates in stock for my Kona Stab?
  • 4 0
 I wouldn't be joking if I said I had looked at used ones on PB just to do that.
  • 1 0
 If it improves the Yeti half as much as the Cascade link improved my Sentinel its worth while.
  • 1 0
 This time Cascade C were faster that Yeti. (130 --> 135)
  • 1 0
 Make a Gt Sensor link please!
  • 1 0
 Can they make one for my Tacoma, too?
  • 1 0
 You rad superstar ????????
  • 1 3
 i want to buy a SB150 so bad to add this to it! Can't wait to join the marketing BS Tri..wohhhwohhhWOHHHHH...not this word at least!
  • 1 0
 SB100-115 PLEASE!!!!
  • 1 0
 Got one and love it.
  • 6 8
 I find it strange that it doesn't come in "dentist teeth white" options.
  • 2 5
 Good luck feeling half a degree lol
  • 9 4
 Half a degree and 7mm bb height? Good luck tying your shoes before you leave your house.
  • 2 1
 @thegoodflow: Best comment ever posted! Cheers !!
Below threshold threads are hidden







Copyright © 2000 - 2024. Pinkbike.com. All rights reserved.
dv42 0.559615
Mobile Version of Website