The 2020 Last Tarvo Claims to be the Lightest Enduro Frame Ever

May 5, 2020 at 4:19
by Dan Roberts  
2020 Last Tarvo


Years ago, Last were gracing the pages of Dirt Magazine, with superlative things being written about the performance of their Herb bike. More recently, the brand saw a bit of a re-birth with their Fastforward steel hardtail. Many members of the industry grabbed one of these beautiful frames, I was one of them.

The German brand has been coming out with incredibly well-engineered full suspension aluminium frames coming in at under the 3kg mark for the past few years. But with the launch of their new bike, the Tarvo, Last sought to drop that weight dramatically to improve upon their already proven performance while maintaining a reliable and easy to ride bike. In doing so, they may have just made one of the lightest enduro frames in the world.

Last Tarvo Details

• 160mm rear travel (170mm with the MX conversion)
• 170mm fork travel
• 2.08kg frame weight
• Geometry and suspension adjusted per size
• Bike park approved 5-year warranty
• Developed and made in Germany

More info: Last Bikes

2020 Last Tarvo





2020 Last Tarvo
There are two options for the linkage for use with different wheel sizes and travel.
2020 Last Tarvo
No rear mechanical pivot saves weight and instead the engineered flex of the structure is used to provide the movement for the suspension.

Construction & Details

The incredible low frame weight is one of the biggest headlines about the Tarvo. Last already felt that their current bikes had a high level of suspension performance, and so then looked to the weight to improve the overall performance of the bike. But this couldn't come at a cost to the reliability of the bike or the ease of riding, as Last also wanted to create a fast and easy to control bike. It tips the scale at a claimed 2.08kg, which includes all pivot and shock mounting hardware plus the cable routing parts and frame protection on the down tube and chain stay.

The Tarvo is a carbon fibre composite construction with a machined aluminium linkage. The front triangle and rear triangle are moulded in single pieces to avoid the increased material and glue needed when gluing separately moulded parts together. That lack of joints also offers Last slightly better control of fibres around the frame structure without the need to transmit forces across the joints. Their composite also uses a resin with increased impact resistance and is UV stable meaning the raw carbon frame would not react or degrade when out in the sunlight.

Also conscious in their responsibilities to source and manufacture sustainably and ethically, the raw fibres come from Japan where they are then converted into pre-preg in Italy with the laminating being done in Germany at All Ahead. Frame painting is done in Germany, so too is the frame and complete bike assembly. This supply chain location also lends itself very well to an increased level of control on quality available to Last as well as the ability to react faster to any issues that may have presented themselves during development or production.

2020 Last Tarvo
The optional down tube storage uses the lid to mount the bottle cage and a bag to keep your bits and pieces safe inside the frame.
2020 Last Tarvo
Internal cable routing is guided inside the down tube and actually acts to help stiffen the frame.

To drop weight, and to take advantage of the ability engineer in flex into the structure, Last removed the rear pivot on the seat stay. Instead, the seat stay itself flexes to provide the necessary movement for going through the suspension travel. Not something new, as other shorter travel bikes use this method, but not something so commonly seen on longer travel bikes.

There's an optional upgrade of a down tube storage compartment, costing €199, which sees a modified layup to accommodate the hole but apparently causes no compromise in frame stiffness. So, if you'd like some added frame storage then you're covered with the accompanying bag to go inside the down tube. Frames use internal cable routing with moulded tubes inside that actually act to stiffen the downtube.

Frames use the UDH from SRAM and utilise a threaded BB for reliability and to hold in the optional ISCG tab if it's needed. There's even captive shock hardware at the link to stop any washers falling out when you take the shock out. The frames are tested at EFBe in Germany to the ASTM 5 standard, allowing Last not only the chance to label the Tarvo as bike park approved, but to offer a 5-year warranty that extends past the first owner to any subsequent owners. There's even a further 3-year crash replacement scheme and Last are also keen to say they are able to repair composite damage if possible. Spare parts are of course available and they include the front and rear triangles. And any composite parts that need replacing can be taken care of by Last and recycled into fibre reinforced thermoplastic parts.







2020 Last Tarvo
2020 Last Tarvo

Geometry

The Tarvo is designed as a long travel bike for aggressive riding, and as such uses a 64-degree head angle combined with nice reach numbers for each of the four sizes ranging from 429mm to 518mm. The sizing is based around the typical rider sizes of 165, 175, 185 and 195cm tall.

Last change not only the chainstay length per size, to have a good front to back balance, but also the seat angle. Larger frames get a steeper seat angle to adjust the rider's weight between the contact patches when sat. BB height for the smallest 165 size is 5mm lower than the others. This was done as Last uses a shorter crank length for those smaller riders and saw that they could take advantage of the increased ground clearance on that frame.

Seat post lengths should play well with long dropper posts and the head tube lengths are generous enough to put the bars in a good position for aggressive riding without needing a mountain of stem spacers.







2020 Last Tarvo

Suspension

Last's Flex Pivot takes advantage of the ability to engineer flex into the carbon structure and provide a pivot at the rear of the bike. The kinematic design minimizes the amount of deflection needed in the seat stays so keeps the stress and strain at a low level.

Last have always used very progressive leverage ratios on their bikes, something that they say contributes to those glowing reviews of the Herb back in the day. The Tarvo retains this same philosophy and has an overall progression of 55% (when looking at how much of percentage is the final ratio from the starting ratio), but Last tend to use their progression percentage from the sag point onwards, which in this case is 34%. So just be aware of that when comparing bikes on paper.

Last recommend using, and spec, shocks with damping adjustment rather than with a lockout switch. This gives Last and the user more adjustment options to dial the bike in for their weight and riding.

2020 Last Tarvo
2020 Last Tarvo

Not only did Last adjust the geometry of the frame dependant on the size, but they also altered the kinematics. Leverage ratio stays the same but the anti-squat and anti-rise are tweaked to bring the acceleration and deceleration responses of the bike closer together, giving a more consistent ride feel between sizes and adapting to the changing CoG heights of the different riders.

Last's anti-squat graph compares the bikes at sag changing through the gears on the cassette. In the biggest climbing gear, all the frame sizes share the same anti-squat values and are even very close as you go to a mid-cassette 24-tooth cog. It's only further out at the 10-tooth extreme is there a bit more variation in the frame sizes. For comparison, the grey lines on the graph show the anti-squat values if Last hadn't adapted each frame size and show a much bigger spread in values between the frames.

The same is true of the anti-rise, where all frame sizes show the same values and will then share the same characteristics. Not many brands change their geometry, like chain stay and seat angle, per size, and even fewer change their suspension characteristics. So for Last to do both is a show of how focussed they were on every part of the Tarvo in its role in the bike’s performance.

Also available is the MX option. Using only a different link the Tarvo can be converted into a 170mm travel, 27.5" rear wheeled bike. The MX link adjusts the suspension and geometry for the smaller wheels, increased travel and change in dynamic sag. Inside Last they have found that generally their larger riders prefer the larger rear wheel and the smaller riders prefer the smaller rear wheel, but it's also an option they wanted to offer to everyone to give the freedom of movement that the smaller rear wheel offers.







2020 Last Tarvo
2020 Last Tarvo

Builds, Pricing & Availability

The Tarvo comes in a raw carbon finish with the upgrade to the painted blue matte metallic available for €399. Custom colours are also available at a €799 upgrade.

Frames cost between €4038 and €4158 depending on the choice of Fox X2 shocks in coil or air or Superdeluxe Ultimate RCT shocks in coil or air. You can also purchase the frame without shock if you have your own 205 x 65mm shock for €3599.

Complete bikes are available with a customer by customer dialogue to determine the best parts for your needs based on the many options Last have. Complete bikes start at €5799 and can be built as light as 12.4kg.

International shipping is available, but if you can visit Last in Dortmund, Germany they will offer a set up and guided first ride to get the bike settings fine-tuned. Test sessions are also available to try out the Tarvo and other Last bikes with details are available on their website.

185 and 175 frame sizes are available right now with 165 and 195 available in August.




2020 Last Tarvo









304 Comments

  • 229 22
 With that price, it's definitely Last on my list
  • 36 9
 Yeah, especially since weight has so low negative impact on the descents.
  • 38 2
 It should be called Next.
  • 16 15
 You must be a dentist if this is even on your list.
  • 5 1
 LIFO - Last In First Out!
  • 1 0
 If they made a carbon version of their Glen MX I would consider it seriously.
  • 13 1
 5 year warranty. This rig is build to Last!
  • 10 3
 @Endurip: I don't think frame weight has much to do with the climbs either.
  • 11 14
 better get used to these prices as inflation starts kicking in. eu and us printed a lot of money and thats the price to pay sadly.
  • 1 1
 @nug12182: haha brilliant
  • 56 1
 @mi-bike: Sure it is!
Acutiually we do not save that weight by reducing stabilty. We save the weight by a supreme fibre qualtiy and absoulte production process controll here in Germany.
+We did not desing some fancy design features that only produce weight without any function or strenght gain!
  • 7 0
 Imagine if you come last on your Last.
  • 54 14
 If a bike has the benefit of not coming from a dictatorship that deliberately lied about the dangers of a virus that caused thousands of deaths, that has to be a major plus doesn’t it?
  • 9 11
 Flex stays on an Enduro bike? Hmm... methinks that’s a hard sell.
  • 15 0
 @hamncheez: The Dogma has to be just about the worst value in any discipline of bike riding.
  • 11 0
 @Endurip: I question this. Low weight means faster acceleration out of every corner, and the ability to throw the bike around with less effort spent.

However, look at my username, and the fact that Loic Bruni prefers a 40 pound bike with aluminum everything, so what do I know?
  • 11 21
flag stepf (May 5, 2020 at 10:10) (Below Threshold)
 @bankz: What a Trump Style Comment.
  • 12 6
 @stepf: Or, simply economics.

Trump being a con man, and a dolt outside of the con, doesn't mean that economic theory is wrong, correct?
  • 6 27
flag VelkePivo (May 5, 2020 at 10:23) (Below Threshold)
 @jclnv: you know a little something about German history, right?
  • 12 0
 @VelkePivo: Current history?
  • 5 38
flag VelkePivo (May 5, 2020 at 10:40) (Below Threshold)
 @jclnv: Ruining Europe with mass immigration? Big Grin
  • 2 1
 @kinematix: It should be named after a tooth.
  • 47 3
 @slimjimihendrix: no, its a great value. You're just not seeing its intended purpose.

It exists not to make you faster, but to make you BETTER than others in your riding group. You're 47. Your wife left you a while ago, and you only see the kids on weekends. You're upper management at a tech company, or a lawyer. You already have a Tesla, and you can't afford to also have a $200k BMW. You make a ton of money, but with alimony and child support you can't go too crazy.

Enter this bike. You show up with your other riding buddies, all in their 40s and 50s, all 30 pounds overweight wearing $500 sunglasses. Everyone has Enve rims. Everyone has a Kuat rack. The only thing left to you to oneup them is Pinarello. Boom- instant top of the pecking order.
  • 3 0
 @Svinyard: only if you're not trying to be competitive during riding or racing. Hard to argue that power to weight doesn't have an impact on performance though
  • 4 1
 @VelkePivo: No comment!
  • 11 0
 @hamncheez: How do you know so much about my life?
  • 2 0
 @jclnv: there's almost no one left making carbon bikes in China at this point. Most everyone has gone to Myanmar, Cambodia and Vietnam.
  • 3 1
 @azogas413: Sure, XC spandex racing. Not really enduro racing tho (within reason of course). Pros don't seem to be real concerned with with weight in EWS all that much. Durability yes...weight no. Hence the reason for many running aluminum hoops. And those guys are certainly trying to be competitive.
  • 6 6
 @LAST-BIKECOMPANY: okay saving bearings and saving color saves weight but a one link rear triangle saves break performance. When i see that other manufacturer spend their bike a four link bigger bearings and awesome color for only 500 grams more and less money which bike will i buy ??? I think simple answer not the Last.
  • 2 0
 Something telling me a very light bike like that will get tossed around on the trail and specially in the air.
  • 1 0
 @shredddr: Yes I’ve been told that. Is that the case with aluminum too?
  • 1 0
 @Svinyard: Agreed. I only commented what I did because you specifically mentioned climbing which isn't really a factor in enduro as you pointed out.
  • 42 2
 Sure a pivot without bearings is a bad thing if you're super keen on swapping out worn out bearings. I always enjoined that lots! ????

Actiually I can totally understand your concerns, because it's new, because it's something that has not been done before on a gravity orientated bike.
But does that mean it's bad?

If you look at the numbers of leverage ratio, anti squat and even anti rise we could hardly have created a kinematic that was more suitable for a full on enduro racing machine. Even if we had added 28 more bearings and a slider (which sure would have looked super awesome and therefore would have made it a way more reasonable discussion with your wife ???? or your husband to be fair to all the fast girls out there❤️)

So the only remaining worries could be that the flex is so strong that it negatively affects the spring curve of your rear suspension and that the flex is so strong that seatstay may break. But neighter is the case.
You may not belive me but actiually we engineered the kinematics with a flex needed so little that once you have removed the shock you can push the swingarm through its travel by just slightly touching it with your little finger. I'm pretty sure some of the magazines will demonstrate that once they have the bike Smile Realy hard to argue that there is any drawback on suspension performance.
And because the fiber layup is made in a way that supports this flexible movement only in the desired direction the swingarm remains stiff and 100% play free in the sideways direction. You will also never nerd to service that Pivot.

The bike was designed to be light not because we wanted to build the lightest enduro bike the wold has seen, but because we realized we could do it without any drawbacks.
  • 10 0
 @WasatchEnduro:

Sure a pivot without bearings is a bad thing if you're super keen on swapping out worn out bearings. I always enjoined that lots! Big Grin

Actiually I can totally understand your concerns, because it's new, because it's something that has not been done before on a gravity orientated bike.
But does that mean it's bad?

If you look at the numbers of leverage ratio, anti squat and even anti rise we could hardly have created a kinematic that was more suitable for a full on enduro racing machine. Even if we had added 28 more bearings and a slider (which sure would have looked super awesome and therefore would have made it a way more reasonable discussion with your wife Big Grin or your husband to be fair to all the fast girls out there❤️)

So the only remaining worries could be that the flex is so strong that it negatively affects the spring curve of your rear suspension and that the flex is so strong that seatstay may break. But neighter is the case.
You may not belive me but actiually we engineered the kinematics with a flex needed so little that once you have removed the shock you can push the swingarm through its travel by just slightly touching it with your little finger. I'm pretty sure some of the magazines will demonstrate that once they have the bike Smile Realy hard to argue that there is any drawback on suspension performance.
And because the fiber layup is made in a way that supports this flexible movement only in the desired direction the swingarm remains stiff and 100% play free in the sideways direction. You will also never nerd to service that Pivot.

The bike was designed to be light not because we wanted to build the lightest enduro bike the wold has seen, but because we realized we could do it without any drawbacks.
  • 2 3
 @LAST-BIKECOMPANY: how come it’s not designed to be pedaled up hill? 193 tall and that top tube is at least 40mm short. Can you even buy a 80mm stem?
  • 4 2
 @hamncheez: $6500 for a frameset and they can't even put the forks on the right way round (joke)
  • 2 0
 @Endurip: The axis powers seem to be at it again...hmmm....global MTB war!!
  • 2 0
 @jclnv: I believe most of the higher-end aluminum and steel still gets done in Taiwan. The rest I've heard is Cambodia, Nam, and I would imagine some is still done in China.
  • 22 1
 @LAST-BIKECOMPANY: Dude, you are talking to pink bike commenters. There is no winning for you here. These people will hate anything from amazing bikes that cost more than a hundred dollars to fluffy kitty cat photos. Call 27.5 “little wheels” and watch the amount of garbage comments that follow. Save your thumbs, and the bike looks rad!
  • 3 0
 @Svinyard: if you have infinite power, then no, weight is no issue
  • 3 1
 @jclnv: Yes you're correct. It isn't American made!
  • 1 1
 @LAST-BIKECOMPANY: Hey, what's with that top tube lengths??
  • 2 0
 @DHhack: the TT lengths don’t make sense with the other measurements. My bike with a 76 seat angle and 522 reach has a 680 top tube. Where did those 60mm go on this frame?
  • 6 0
 @pakleni: @srstudent: There is a typo in this table, we did put the correct values on our website(LAST-Bikes.com) but we cannot change them in this article.
Correct Toptube length are : 581 for Medium, 604 for Large , 633 for XL and 666mm for XXL
  • 1 1
 @LAST-BIKECOMPANY:

Really nice loolong and I fully understand tge oremium orice considering the production. BUT at that price the storage should be included. 200 for that alone ist not that nice. On other frames you pay more for different carbon layup but not for the stealth storage or so. That is a
New price politics.
  • 1 0
 @LAST-BIKECOMPANY: that makes a lot more sense given the wheelbase
  • 2 5
 @LAST-BIKECOMPANY: Swapping out worn bearings?

Most bikes don't tend to go through seatstay/chainstay bearings, for precisely the same reason why you are able to avoid using them on your frame.

I keep my bikes for 6+ years, and the only bearings I've ever had to replace are at the shock rocker link (once at 5 years on my current bike). My old bike used to chew through shock DU bushings every couple of years, but never had problems with any of the bearings and I had it for 8 years before selling it.

I acknowledge your frame has gone through EFBe ASTM certification, designs, layups and resins are different etc, but some of us are old enough to remember what used to happen to Yeti 575 frames with their carbon flex pivot. People aren't concerned because it's never been done before, they're concerned because it _has_ been done before, and the results weren't great, even on a "trail bike".

PS If you're going to be responding on forums, try and keep your tone a bit more professional, the post I'm responding to sounds like it was written by a defensive teenager.
  • 1 0
 @LAST-BIKECOMPANY: makes sense, thank you!
  • 2 0
 @dsut4392: Regarding your concerns to the Flexpivot please have a look at this video.

videos.mtb-news.de/52987/ihr_fragt_wir_antworten_last_tarvo

It't been made for answearing some questions in the mostly german mtb-news.com forum but I think even without english subtitle it may be interesting to see how little flex there is. As I said above, its hard to argue that there is any influence on the suspension dynamics.
  • 174 8
 Why so much negativity? Ok, so it's expensive. But lots of nice things are expensive. You can buy a perfectly useable phone for £200, or you can buy an iPhone 11promax for £1500. And nobody's forcing you to buy either. I personally think it's really clean looking, sizing based on rider height makes so much sense and it has a decent warranty including park use. No, I can't afford it, but it's nice to see boundaries being pushed, because that's how the human race learns.
  • 77 1
 + considering its made in Germany in a likely high-tech facitlity its not that expensive (where people get decent wages)
The cost per unit is likely a tad (Just a tad) Higher than a 4000€ Yeti oder 3500€ SC frame.
  • 49 0
 As much as I'm staggered by the price, I can't disagree with you. If you don't like it, don't buy it. If nobody buys bikes that are this expensive, no one (almost) will make them.
  • 13 0
 @rrolly: iIlike this thread. Level-headed and intelligent.....
  • 17 0
 if you think about it, spesh, yeti, sc etc are expensive, given are made in far east and are even heavier, at least this one has a park warranty.
  • 11 0
 I agree! This is how innovation in frame technology works. Be the first to bring out a lighter, stronger manufacturing process and charge more for it while everyone catches up. Then prices will come down. Carbon wheels, Linkage Forks, Dropper Posts, Wireless Technology, etc...It's how things work.
  • 1 26
flag nickfranko (May 5, 2020 at 11:01) (Below Threshold)
 You dismissed the very reason people dislike it using a false comparison fallacy.

You’re seriously trying to compare expensive frames like Yeti to a $/pound 200 phone? No, the Yeti is like the iPhone 11 Pro. And this is like the iPhone 11 Pro with different paint on it, then marked up by a factor of 5
  • 4 8
flag max41 (May 5, 2020 at 11:33) (Below Threshold)
 You only encourage ridiculously expensive stuff by purchasing ridiculously expensive stuff like this. You won't notice barely anything in your sesh by riding this bike or some more affordable bike like Ibis. The industry has gone nuts with the prices!
  • 8 0
 @nickfranko: the yeti and this bike are at pretty similar price points champ, hence the comparison. A $200 I phone might be like a used 2012 stumpjumper in this case.
  • 5 0
 I'd definitely buy one, but I'm a dentist. So its the perfect bike for me..lol.
  • 8 0
 @max41: you won't notice the time being told any better on a Rolex than a Casio. There are enough rich people buying Rolexes to pay the salaries of the not so rich people making them. You and me can carry on buying Casios. But in the meantime, let people buy Rolexes and fancy bikes, and we can feel smug when we fly past them whenever we see them on the trail. Or if they overtake us, we can just blame the bike.
  • 2 2
 @thisspock: ya but yeti comes with lifetime frame warranty
  • 6 0
 Maybe it would be interesting to have Pinkbike make an article about "the right price ?", a didactic article about production costs, labour costs, margins, etc.
I'm not saying this one is the right price, just that some people seem to look not so much for a bike than for a price.
Our "modern" and "developped" societies have totally lost track of the cost of things, one of those things being the cost of life. This whole world is a mirage based on cheap energy and no one seems to be bothered. Amaizing.
  • 2 0
 @Will-narayan: it'd be amusing to see the last time the word didactic was used in these forums - bravo sir or madam!
  • 1 0
 @NotNamed: regarding the high tech facility! I‘ve been there and saw how they work where they manufacture the frames and i‘ts all built to perfection!
  • 88 2
 A lot of Pinkbikers have gone nuts. A small, probably rider owned brand, manufactures a bike in Europe, designed by the owners, with all the right things - threaded BB, coil shock, good sizing, geometry spec choices, good warranty etc etc - and people complain like crazy ! And the main complaint is that it is expensive ?! And too light?!! It's not even that expensive compared to the mass produced brands that feature on Pinkbike every day. Scott Ransom - more money - Megatower - more money - Yeti - more money - for the full bike at least 1-2000 euros more - and they are all made in China or Taiwan. What's happened to supporting the smaller brands ? When Specialized release their mass produced Enduro "Elite" at the same price - do people cry this much?
Brands have to innovate, make new stuff and it isn't going to be for everyone but bloody hell, why don't you all post your attempt at a carbon super bike before you rubbish it. It looks pretty awesome to me. We just need a review to see how it rides!
  • 4 0
 +1 Some just don't understand the true implications of redistributing capital outside of your region. Reminds me of a bug zapper.
  • 3 0
 +2 Yeah, that's why I refuse to buy gasoline.
  • 2 0
 Definitely rider owned, one of the owners is dominating the masters class of the enduro race series i attend from time to time Smile
  • 53 11
 I am not usually one to complain about prices and I loved the herb, but we used to get a whole frame for what they charge you for a layer of paint nowadays. What is this madness?
  • 11 0
 High end bikes are going the way of flash cars
  • 10 8
 Right, 800 Euros for a 'custom' colour paint - wtf is that about - 400Eur more just because they put a different colour of paint in the pot, I just don't get it....

Purely guessing here but surely you could drop it off to a custom painters and get a full, elaborate hand masked / painted job for that kind of money, or less?

So if I want one painted in red with the X2 shock, I will have to pay five thousand euros for the privilege.. it makes Yetis look decent value.
  • 10 3
 @justanotherusername: Ultra lightweight Formula 1 grade paint is really expensive. Yes there is such a paint before you ask!
  • 11 12
 After all that work and attention to detail to justify a premium price, they could have done something other than an unimaginative single pivot design.
  • 11 15
flag Alturis (May 5, 2020 at 6:46) (Below Threshold)
 @SlodownU: Actually it is an Horst Link with flex seatstays. Satisfied?
  • 5 0
 800 Euros is worth Yeti turquoise, isn't it?
  • 22 1
 @justanotherusername: It's expensive, but bear in mind the paint has to be set up - so pigment ordered, mixed correctly, loaded into the painting system (I'm assuming it is sprayed on by hand and not baked on) and then everything has to be cleaned out afterwards. This shuts down the painter, tools and booths for this time and stops them from painting the usual production bikes. It might be that a custom painter would be the same price and I guess there is nothing stopping you from going that route.
Not associated with this company, but I work in product development so figured I'd jump in and mansplain the crap out of it.
  • 12 0
 @Alturis: nope, still a single pivot because the flex happens at the seatstay, not the chainstay.
  • 4 0
 @Alturis: how do you have a flex stay Horst link?
  • 71 4
 @justanotherusername:
Sure we could do it for less in Bangladesh.
Those frames are custom Paintet by 70ID in Hagen, Germany.
If you want supreme quality custom paintjob made by hand in Germany thats quite a fair price Smile

Yeti builds great bikes, cant deny that! But if you consider value its good to know that Yeti Frames (and most other boutique brands frames) are made in Asia while this Frame is 100% Produced in Germany.

Big plus for Yeit ist that you get 1kg extra material for free Big Grin Realy like their bikes so no offense Smile
  • 1 0
 @TheBearDen: doable if the flex is happening at the chainstay instead of the seatstay. There were spyshots a couple months back of Cannondale's new XC racer and they had the chainstay covered to hide something. It was speculated that they might be hiding a carbon hinge or flex point where a horst link pivot would normally be.
  • 12 0
 @LAST-BIKECOMPANY: Haha, shots fired! Love it! Lovely frame you guys have concocted ???? Nice to have someone showing what is possible in the enduro category.
  • 7 2
 @LAST-BIKECOMPANY: As a co owner of a company that makes product in the UK I respect the ethos and difficulty involved in making parts in your home country but this can’t be at the expense of realistic value to the customer. I think I draw the line at €800 to paint a bicycle frame.

Lovely frame though.
  • 3 0
 @Alturis: No, not really. For this money I'd rather have a bike with a variation of DW-Link or some other creative suspension design, other than Horst-Link, or HL with flexy seatstays. I've ridden enough HL and single-pivot bikes vs. the others to know that I prefer the other designs out there. Just my preference, as someone who is actively searching for their next bike. HL is kind of low-hanging fruit since the patent expired.
  • 2 0
 @SlodownU: it works, don't know why this supposed to be an issue
  • 2 4
 @d-mass: It looks like they are using a ‘custom painter’ if you look up 70ID - they paint lots of WC specials etc and it’s lovely work.

Still completely obscene to charge €400 extra to change just a single colour - starling charge £120 for custom colour, Stanton similar I believe? Neither will be ‘F1 light paint’ but they won’t be painted in Bangladesh either as Last seem to assume is the only other option....
  • 2 1
 @WheelNut: yea ‘shots fired’ - just like the guy who specced a single colour paint job out at 1/5th of the cost of the whole frame extra....
  • 2 0
 800 euros is a lot but about the same as Trek custom paint, no? They have insane paint job but 1000+ canadian dollars too if I'm right...
  • 2 0
 @Timo82: equally ridiculous but at least they offer paint on standard models without asking for a €400 surcharge....
  • 9 1
 @justanotherusername: "but this can’t be at the expense of realistic value to the customer" - Tell that to watchmakers Wink An expensive bike is a luxury product and is probably more about perceived value than "realistic" (whatever that means). If enough people believe it's worth it enough to buy it, it's worth it. At least this bike offers some real sound in-house engineering and manufacturing and will be rare unlike some of the most overpriced watch brands which in reality are mass produced garbage with third party movements.

That being said, in very real terms this frame is made in low volume, in the country with some of the highest wages in the world and does not cost THAT much more than a mass produced Yeti which is made by some of the lowest paid workers on the planet. While that in itself does not add any value/functionality out on the trail, at least it justifies the price - quite simply, Last employees have to afford to live in Germany from selling a small number of frames.

Think about it. That Yeti SB 140 just reviewed here, in terms of real world value and where/how it's made is closer to a Nukeproof Reactor (that's almost exactly £2000 cheaper for a similar build) than it is to the Last. Yes, the Last is more expensive than a Yeti, but quite possibly it's the Yeti that is more overpriced.
  • 3 0
 @justanotherusername: But why paye for the paint? Did you see the raw one??? It is really IN-SA-NE!!! I thought the blue was nice but the raw f*ckkk yeah!!! :O Classyyyy!! Still really expensive for a frame but I would rather pay that for this frame than a Santa Cruz or Yeti.... I can't afford any of them anyway but just to say that this makes more sense to me than a cad $20 000 specialized!!!! Razz
  • 1 1
 @bananowy: it’s a push bicycle frame, for riding around the woods, putting on a chairlift, getting muddy and smashed around, it isn’t male jewellery, unless that’s how we should see bikes now?

As I said above, I understand better than most the costs and issues involved with manufacturing on home soil, we make choices Last make choices - they chose a painter that charges an astronomically high sum for painting their frames in a single colour, that has nothing to do with Last employees affording to live in Germany, unless of course charging a ridiculous amount for paint they don’t sell enough to pay the bills that is.
  • 21 0
 @justanotherusername: So it is somehow ok for Treck to ask a 1000$ for a custom paintjob because they do not charge you extra for a standard paintjob on a massproduction carbon frame from Asia that they produce for a bargin but also ask 3699$ for? That does not soud quite fair.

I totaly understand that 400$ for a paintjob sounds a lot! But 70ID is doing a great Job in (hand)spraying those frames. If there was a painter nearby that could do it in the same quality and relability as Lars from 70ID is doing it we probaply would have chosen him.
Whenever we chose a suplier we ask ourselves if we were willing to work at that place and only if all of us can agree on that we will chose that suplier!
Those who have been to our showroom or know us from the trails may know that we are good guys and that engineering and riding bikes is our passion. And that passion is something that we always liked to share at a price that we (knowing about all the nice little details and the quality of the product) think is fair to ask.

Honestly, if any of us was after the big money we would probaply be in another industry Big Grin
  • 1 3
 @LAST-BIKECOMPANY: If you read my reply regarding Trek you will see I said It was equally ridiculous (Why wouldn’t it be?) but that at least you can buy a frame from them with paint as standard without a 10% up charge, they just have the offer available to those that really want it.

I think I find the comment about the alternative to a €400 basic paint job is one from ‘Bangladesh’ the most odd - a strange comment to make on many levels.

Let me ask this, if an absolutely identical product is made in ‘china’ V Germany - aside from more complicated concerns of economics and politics, what benefit will the customer see if one is 25% more expensive?

I’m not doubting your passion, the performance of the bike, the quality of the finish of the paint even, If you feel it is worth it and your customers will appreciate it then that’s great and I genuinely wish you all success, beautiful frame and probably worth the money, just maybe not the paint ;-)
  • 1 0
 @SlodownU: Lots of successful single pivots out there - Evil and Focus come to mind.
  • 2 2
 @LAST-BIKECOMPANY:
Id rather a lifetime warranty Than a f*cking paint job...
  • 1 2
 @adespotoskyli: It works says who? Have you ridden one yet?
  • 1 1
 @JohanG: Successful by what measure? Neither are mentioned when you're talking about the best riding bikes out there. Dollar for dollar, are you going to get either of those 2 bikes over an Ibis, Yeti, or Pivot? And those are pretty relevant bikes when we're talking the price point that this bike is playing in. Shit, for this money I'm going to build a custom bike over at the Atherton Bike site.
  • 4 0
 @TheBearDen: A 5 year warranty is pretty brave considering the light weight. It's easy to see the commenters who have never designed or run a business in their life.
  • 1 0
 @SlodownU: I have a Focus single pivot and a Pivot DW, lol.
  • 1 2
 @JohanG: And which one rides better? Be honest.
  • 1 0
 @JohanG: and Orange bikes.
  • 4 0
 @SlodownU: not everyone's a dw whore. Still plenty of us that appreciate a single pivot, linkage activated or not. Not all of us want to plow our life away.
  • 3 0
 @ plenty of single pivots out there that work, it's not black magic as some of you are made to believe, and complicated designs aren't better at all, actually they mostly suck as the get many things off. So if you don't like sp don't buy them you can alway buy whatever the marketing sep of x brand sells you, fancy acronyms and patented design charged at premium prices for nothing. No ones stopping you
  • 35 0
 This will be the bike I'd be happy to tell my wife about... Honey this is my Last bike. Who knows, she might pay for it.
  • 4 0
 If you buy that bike , she will give it to you as part of the divorce settlement . ????
  • 2 0
 @Sirios: Last bike _and_ last wife!
  • 26 1
 Price is not unreasonable at all given that produktion method vs Dirty Asian Carbon frames from Transition, Evil, SC, Yeti for 3200+ Euros. 4000 for a super engineered recyclable frame not produced by pouring resin waste into the ocean seems fair then. Nice work Last!

But the completes are better value!
  • 19 1
 Absolutely stunning bike! Probably the most gorgeous carbon frame I've seen. Man those clean lines really do the trick for me. On looks alone, I'd be sold.
  • 10 1
 For someone 145lbs this is my dream bike. The fact that it's flex stay makes me want it even more.
  • 4 0
 @reverend27:flex stays still creep me out. I think I'd feel okay if they were CroMo, but other materials flexing around like that just seems wrong...even if its been proven to be right. Sorta like watching an AR barrel in slow-mo shaking around...it's unnerving even if its designed that way.
  • 1 0
 @reverend27: Big up on the weight thing - I look like someone dropped a pencil case. Most bikes are made, with a margin of safety, for riders twice my weight. On the plus side though, it means I very rarely break wheels!
  • 1 0
 @Warburrito: flex stays typically don’t bother me but the placement of the caliper on this frame looks like it’s a stressed member and would reduce flex ....
  • 2 0
 @reverend27: weight matters on bikes that are still intended to be pedaled up big climbs. The lighter the rider, the more true it is
  • 1 0
 @Ozziefish: yep. We ride bikes meant to take the worst a 220+lb man can dish out.
  • 1 0
 @mountaincross: oh I know. I ride undulating terrain with bursty ups and downs.
In the summer it's 95-100F with at least 80% humidity.
Add on a pack of horse flies dive bombing your head.
My skinny ass don't want any extra weight.
  • 1 0
 @mountaincross: The main weight to be concerned with is rotational weight tho for climbing. Frame weight is probably the last on the list of weight concerns. Its unsprung and mostly central to the bike...not at the end of a lever. It will win you points when your bros throw your bike on the rack tho.
  • 1 0
 @reverend27: how am I breaking bikes at 70kg/155lb then haha
  • 1 0
 @Warburrito: If you look at a video of how little a Horst link moves, the flex design will make more sense.
  • 21 4
 I appreciate the effort that went into this frame, but light and plastic just don't make me excited when I look at bike frames.
  • 10 9
 Weight is such a stupid measure of anything bike related. The lightest enduro bike? WGAF.
  • 15 2
 Would heavy and plastic make you more excited?
  • 13 0
 @WheelNut: that was a gold standard comment! Big Grin Big Grin

@nouseforaname I totaly agree with you, weight for itself is worth almost noting! But as I said above,
the bike was designed to be light not because we wanted to build the lightest enduro bike the wold has seen, but because we realized we could do it without any drawbacks.
  • 5 0
 @LAST-BIKECOMPANY: This....is a nice statement.
  • 2 0
 @LAST-BIKECOMPANY: I'm just being tongue in cheek and not trying to make a point, but your website says "From the start it was our dream to make the TARVO the lightest Enduro bike of the world. ". :p
  • 17 3
 Get back to us when it’s the lightest enduro bike to compete an EWS season.
  • 2 0
 *complete* on one frame?
  • 16 1
 But how long will it last?
  • 12 3
 They've got a pretty good rep for their warranty and service. They'll stand by that 5 years pretty well I'd say.
  • 12 2
 @sethius: Woosh.
  • 15 3
 I'm not sold on the "engineered flex" and on the lightweight carbon park hitter thing but this level of effort should be every boutique bike brand's standard.
  • 10 2
 I can't really understand all the negativity concerning the price. Sure, it's expensive... But so are Santa Cruz, Yeti, Trek, Specialized.

A Megatower XO1 costs 7499€; a very simililar build Last Tarvo (for my taste even better components) costs around 7300€ (8000€ with dhX2, Fox 38, XO1, Code RSC and carbon cockpit).
So why the hate?!

Awesome bike made by two excellent brands!

If you are really interested you should check the pricelist: www.last-bikes-shop.com/epages/62262325.sf/en_GB/?ViewObjectPath=%2FShops%2F62262325%2FProducts%2F161
  • 15 4
 Seriously? Enduro race bike with a name last???
????
  • 19 6
 At least its not an enduro race bike named enduro.
  • 5 1
 @acali: Bike was named enduro well before enduro racing.
  • 5 0
 This bike was made for me
  • 1 0
 @markg1150:
Me to.... claiming first to roll in last!
  • 1 0
 @acali: Hilarious!
  • 6 0
 "Last change not only the chainstay length per size, to have a good front to back balance, but also the seat angle. Larger frames get a steeper seat angle to adjust the rider's weight between the contact patches when sat."

Boom, nailed it!

Though, that smallest size, 165, gets shafted on this: its chainstays are only 2mm shorter than the next size up while the rest change by 8mm. Maybe should have done 27 or mullet on that size...
  • 1 0
 Mullet Options are available
  • 1 0
 @Raymond-Shreddington: Doesn't change the chainstays on the Small size though. I'm talking dedicated 27 rear on the Small to keep the chainstay shortening going right down the line.
  • 12 3
 This is the last bike you'll ever need.
  • 17 1
 For 4 months
  • 8 1
 Wow, that is one clean looking frame. With enduro bike geo and suspension kinematics mostly sorted these days maybe we'll see more brands focusing on lightweight.
  • 9 2
 Lets hope they also focused on durability.
  • 6 5
 Weight is a terrible thing to focus on. Unfortunately it is easy to flash people with.
  • 5 0
 Firar carbon bike I could ser myself buying, ie built in countries with environmental rules and recyclable. Price of course reflects this and the warranty/crash replacement program. Fair, we cant all keep buying cheap, dirty asian low cost stuff and let the ocean and climate pay.

Super well engineered and thought through. Will probably buy a Last att some point. Looked att the Clay V2 and Glen but landed in A Knolly Fugitive. Well engineered bikes ftw.
  • 3 0
 I got the Fugitive too. Great bike.
  • 2 0
 *First carbon bike could *see myself buying. Autocorrect into swedish got me there.
  • 1 0
 @MattInNZ: Indeed, the Fugitive is an awesome bike! In some ways Last and Knolly have a lot of similarities. Well engineered, adaptable/modular, rebuildable no-nonsense bikes and both are also companies who support their customers with spares for a loooong time.
  • 7 1
 Sick bike, but pricey. 4.58 lbs is super light which is awesome, but probably not really for the full send guys hucking park jumps.
  • 1 0
 It's probably ok but you can only crash it once.
  • 6 2
 What could Dangerholm do with a frame like this???

In all reality, this is really cool engineering, but at that price you can get a Scott Ransom with a frame weight of 2.6kg, barely heavier but with a solid reputation for durability, ride quality, and customer support.
  • 4 0
 The idea of flex stays scared me at first, but after experiencing riding and working on a friend's 2016 Decree for a while I have no reservations anymore. Carbon Fiber can easily be engineered for flexibility and long term durability - look at the carbon transverse leaf springs in modern Corvettes, or the Boeing 777 wing. The Decree is laterally stiff and rides excellently for an aggressive 140/160mm trail bike, and is still holding up well with no signs of fatigue.
  • 4 0
 Beautiful and well thought out frame. Would be interested in reading a full review. If it had one of those built in dropper's I'd have to buy the thing I'm afraid. Bike prices don't matter much when divided up over how much use you get and running it a few years.
  • 12 5
 Too light is sketchy, but what do I know. Ask Randy.
  • 4 1
 anybody know what the original "Randy" article was? I would love to be able to read that thread again
  • 1 0
 Randy is full send. Hucks everything bigger.
  • 4 0
 From the sounds of it, they've shaved weight in pretty reasonable ways: flex stays, no gluing, and no paint needed. I'm not sure if they cut material to get that weight right down, but the three methods listed above are all pretty tried and tested.
  • 4 0
 Having just gone from a very light frame to a heavier but much burlier one, I agree: I’ll take an extra 1-2lbs of frame weight for a better and more durable ride. As one of the founders of Cervelo said, “we don’t want to make the bike that’s best to lift over your head, we want to make the bike that’s best to ride”
  • 2 0
 @Damo6-6-6: thank you so much for this, made my day Smile
  • 1 0
 @Tannerstolt: I'm glad its not just me, I've been confused for months XD
  • 3 0
 Carbon Madonna. I mean that in a good sense (and a price premium). This bike was given some proper size specific geometry engineering. Industry leading frame size/COG-specific anti-squat and anti-rise graphs. This should be a standard.
  • 2 0
 I love it that they engineered the anti-squat and anti-rise to match their chain stay lengths and their actual seat tube angles to match the typical seat post extensions that different-height riders use. I don't think any other company has put that level of engineering into their S and XL bikes.
  • 2 0
 I think a lot of people are overlooking that this is the pinnacle of frame building technology and hence that comes at a cost. Without pioneering designs and companies like this there would be no such thing as the dropper post, narrow-wide or wireless gears etc. Yes, it’s not for everyone, but I would at least expect people to be able to appreciate something that is designed and crafted down to the last mm/gram with no stone unturned. It’s not made in Taiwan and chosen from a catalogue, hence the economics of paying the workers proper wages and buying materials at a higher cost. Don’t forget an insane level of R&D to bring a project like this to fruition.
  • 2 0
 Did they just mentioned in a side sentence that Last uses a Recyclable Resin?
If thats true, that is amazing! As far as i know the are the first company to do so.
I would feel a bit less like a Planet destroyer if im on a Recyclabel Bike, riding aroumd on 2kg of hazardous waste.
  • 6 0
 NO Suspension flex vid?
  • 4 0
 Size specific geo and suspension, and all these options... nice! What's with the short horz top tube measurements though?
  • 1 2
 Must be a typo. And if they've made a typo like that, how good is their actual engineering detail?
  • 4 0
 Thanks for that commen! We just fixed the typo on our webiste Smile

Correct Toptube length are : 581 for Medium, 604 for Large , 633 for XL and 666mm for XXL
  • 4 1
 This certainly won’t be the “Last” time Pinkbike users whine about pricing on a bike they would most likely never consider owning in the first place.
  • 6 5
 Remains to be seen if its any good. Leightweight construction becomes a negative feature as soon as it has an unreasonably negative impact on weight/strength balance in order to make the frame even more leightweight.

Also I'm not really a big fan of flexible seat stays. The flex/characteristics of your rear shock can be adjusted to your liking, whereas you obviously can't adjust frame flex for compression- and rebound damping. I guess thats not really a problem on short travel XC racing missiles like the Trek Supercaliber or Canyon Lux, but on these longer travel bikes it's basically as if your rear shock was kinda limited in its adjustable range.

Might just be me, but I prefer a frame that feels rock solid instead of flexible.
  • 11 1
 I think you are mistaken in all your assumptions. Flex in vertical axis doesn't necessarily translate to flex in all other dimensions. Especially in carbon construction where you have control over every parameter. When it comes to adjustable range. It's just like with shitty and good bushings. With big friction you'll need less LSC and less LSR. The same here. I think modern shocks will allow more than enough range.
  • 2 3
 @goroncy: I think this has aluminum stays though...or maybe I need to learn to read. IDK
  • 2 0
 @Warburrito: carbon rear and front triangle.
  • 3 0
 @goroncy: machined aluminum linkage...not rear triangle. My bad.
  • 1 2
 @goroncy: I don't think you got what I was trying to say. Yes, the seat stays are engineered to have a defined amount of vertical flex/movement/travel/what ever you want to call it - they essentially act like a leaf spring. Thats all well and good and I'm sure the engineers have come up with a very defined characteristics. The problem with that is that there is a element of flex to the frame which you can not effectively control or lock out like you could with your rear shock. And with 160mm of rear travel and 455mm long chainstays, the amount of flex in the seat stays is going to be quite significant.
  • 5 0
 @benmoosmann: its just copy paste from my comment above but i hope it can sort out your worries Smile


Actiually I can totally understand your concerns, because it's new, because it's something that has not been done before on a gravity orientated bike.
But does that mean it's bad?

If you look at the numbers of leverage ratio, anti squat and even anti rise we could hardly have created a kinematic that was more suitable for a full on enduro racing machine. Even if we had added 28 more bearings and a slider (which sure would have looked super awesome and therefore would have made it a way more reasonable discussion with your wife Big Grin or your husband to be fair to all the fast girls out there❤️)

So the only remaining worries could be that the flex is so strong that it negatively affects the spring curve of your rear suspension and that the flex is so strong that seatstay may break. But neighter is the case.
You may not belive me but actiually we engineered the kinematics with a flex needed so little that once you have removed the shock you can push the swingarm through its travel by just slightly touching it with your little finger. I'm pretty sure some of the magazines will demonstrate that once they have the bike Smile Realy hard to argue that there is any drawback on suspension performance.
And because the fiber layup is made in a way that supports this flexible movement only in the desired direction the swingarm remains stiff and 100% play free in the sideways direction. You will also never nerd to service that Pivot.

The bike was designed to be light not because we wanted to build the lightest enduro bike the wold has seen, but because we realized we could do it without any drawbacks.
  • 3 0
 Ooof that price tag made me go from 12 to 6 real quick... I'll go with a Scott Ransom. About as light but a bit more affordable.
  • 2 0
 Interested to know more about how ASTM 5 testing allows Last to market this as Bike Park Certified in Germany. Here in NA we just look at a bike while drinking a beer and say Yup looks burly enuff.
  • 1 0
 Looks pretty sharp. That blue color is an eye-catcher but it'd look even better with an orange accent IMO. Even if it adds weight Wink . Inboard brake mounts offer a clean look but I find that those of us with bigger feet may experience a bit of heel rub.
  • 1 0
 Imagine paying 400 euros just to make the frame blue. you can buy some pretty nice bikes for less than the frame alone, and shaving grams off a frame is only effective if everything else on the bike is the lightest in the industry, so therefore also the most expensive in the industry. I just can't see my self buying this when I can buy multiple bikes that are probably not that much heavier for the same price, especially in enduro, where weight isn't as important as it is in XC or trail bikes.
  • 1 0
 A very nice bike and I like how it’s not some so-so china catalogue stuff sold at a premium price. Sure it is not cheap, but it seems to be a high-end product with lots of thought put into.

I’d be interested in one, but because of my personal proportions the seat angle is too slack for me. 74 actual like on my Raaw Madonna is fantastic for me. Do you offer custom geometry of some sort?
  • 4 0
 I'll be damned...an Enduro bike with flex stays. Where's the huck-to-flat?
  • 2 1
 I've got nothing against Last, but carbon Giant Reign Advanced 29 costs as much as this bike and it's frame weighs around 2.4kg without shock but comes with proper suspension platform, lifetime warranty at what - 300gram penalty and well - rest of the bike and not frame only.

Giant alu and carbon frames are really light, my Trance Advanced 29 in XL comes at around 12kg without pedals and that's with 1800gr wheels, GX gearing, Fox performance grip fork and dpx2 shock (but with light cockpit, nobby nics and carbon cranks), with proper tires, Code brakes and larger rotors it's still under 12.5kg.
  • 2 1
 Swat box is the win, so for now only 3 brands offering this, all of them competitive price tag for the top of the line frame; it looks nice, check a lot of must have boxes for the modern frame;

Awesome frame, thank you for making this!
  • 12 8
 How much dick could Dick Pound pound, if Dick Pound could pound dick?
  • 6 3
 How much wood, could a woodchuck chuck? Hey you woodchucks! Quit chucking my wood. 15 minutes could save you 15% or more with car insurance with Geico.
  • 4 0
 Would be lighter with a short seat tube.
  • 2 2
 You’re the First, the Last, My Everything...

No.I will keep my Last Ffwd, steel forever no plastic superlight build. I dont need that, even If it would be my last bike (seriously). And NO: trunnion mount, flexing chainstays....
  • 1 0
 Whats the issue with trunnion mount rear shocks?
  • 1 0
 @benmoosmann: trunnions exacerbate bushing wear from side loads on poorly designed suspensions.
  • 2 2
 Little concerned about the wrinkling, and what looks like rough edges on the inside of that storage port. Do they have porosity in the carbon under there? Blobs of epoxy? Just a wavy carbon layup (that effects strength)? What's with the rough edges; did they get to the edge of the roll of fabric, or have a bad cutter day?
I mean, for 4kEuro, I'd expect _everything_ to be immaculate.
  • 3 0
 Maybe it is the storage bag and not the inside of the frame - that would explain the textile-like ripples and seams.
  • 1 0
 Probably a case of one of those infamous "pre production" frames...
  • 1 1
 "This was done as Last uses a shorter crank length for those smaller riders and saw that they could take advantage of the increased ground clearance on that frame."

Why not vary the cranks all across the line? Or just put the short ones on every size? Changing just one size's crank length doesn't make any sense. They are implying that it matters more for the shortest riders than the tallest riders...Does it matter or not? (It doesn't, for the most part. This has been shown with empirical data.)
  • 1 0
 I’m over 6’ and prefer only 165 cranks on full susp bike, however rode 175 bmx on street bike;
I would say shorter cranks makes more sense in overall bike park/trail riding

For the street bike, just too lazy to find 165
  • 3 0
 Flex stays + super progressive LR curve = good luck using that LAST bit of travel
  • 1 0
 coil time!
  • 2 0
 Imagine if this bike came stock with Intend BC suspension. Ridiculously expensive, All German manufacturing, sponsored by Mercedes Benz.
  • 1 0
 "Internal cable routing is guided inside the down tube and actually acts to help stiffen the frame."

Took me too long to realise they weren't suggesting cables were increasing the stiffness of the frame.
  • 3 0
 If it's that light I dont think it will Last...
  • 3 0
 €4158! At the price it better Last.
  • 3 0
 71 degree actual seat angle, I'm out.
  • 3 0
 I like this. I prefer the Unno Burn for the $$$´s
  • 2 1
 When we talking about new bikes from Germany, is there any chance that we see on Pinkbike new Rose ROOT MILLER 2020. That bike looks great and price is even better.
  • 2 2
 Yeah, even with warranty I don't think I could trust it. It's a cool looking bike and extremely light, but just don't want to be hitting a rough line and hear the chainstay snap.
  • 2 0
 I love the look of that bike.. if I had any excess cash lying around, I would consider that bike...
  • 2 0
 Hey, does anyone understands how to open / close their down tube storage compartment ?
  • 8 0
 You have speak the word "friend" in an ancient Germanic language.
  • 6 7
 I recently upgraded my bike. Went from 13,9kg to 14,4. It rides noticably better. Not because of upgrades. It's just more stable in the air because it's heavier. Sub 13kg will be sketchy AF. I may be biased. My weight with gear is 88kg.
  • 3 2
 I agree with you. I find heavier bikes to be more stable than i do a sub-30 lb one
  • 3 2
 @stumphumper92: I honestly don't know why more people down voted my post than up voted it. It's not like I can't fly a light bike. But the observation is hardly a placebo. I put DH tires and build heavier wheels. Overall it added around half a kilo weight. And theoretically in the place people always say it's bad because of energy loss. But it is how it is. It became more stable and I don't have to put as much effort into the takeoff to keep it flying like I want. Doing tabletops and bunny hops didn't change a bit.
  • 2 2
 @goroncy: Exactly. I am assuming the people downvoting own carbon bikes. Which makes sense as to why people are gonna be biased. I had a tank of a DH bike and it was the most stable bike I've ever ridden downhill. Of course there is a happy medium but my 33.5 lb trail bike keeps up with all the carbon ones and it feels good to me. I never felt that good on my previous carbon bike. Plus I would always be worried about my carbon frame. Yes, yes I know some people will downvote me for that but i'd always be checking my carbon frame to make sure it's ok. I have never ever worried about my alu bike breaking. guess it's just a preference. Obviously that's not to say alu won't break either...
  • 1 0
 Accidentally downvoted this comment, sorry. I absolutely agree.
  • 2 1
 ok so you expect me to believe a half a percentage point change in weight of the system made you more stable in the air?
  • 1 2
 @JohanG: Yes I think that was the whole point of the comment. Believe what you want. It's all opinion based. This is PB after all....
  • 2 0
 The lines are gorgeous. Beautiful bike. Alas, I'm forced to shop elsewhere.
  • 2 0
 Love the idea that you will need a tool to open the toolbox to get your tools out????
  • 1 0
 I think it looks awesome! Geometry is in the database for comparison purposes...
geometrygeeks.bike/bike/last-tarvo-2021
  • 1 2
 Too light for an enduro bike. But hey, at least they came up with all original ideas. Like that suspension design and the downtube storage that's never been seen before. Also they really nailed that 64 degree HTA that is mandatory in the Enduro segment.
  • 1 0
 @SlodownU: @Alturis is correct - try and get that sort of Anti-Squat result with a single pivot. Perhaps read the article and look at the graphs first.
  • 1 1
 You know what I like about engineers specifically valuing light weight in things that get abused every day of their life?
f*ckING NOTHING.
Life risking landfill trash is what that shit is.
  • 5 5
 You could save even more weigh if you only put spokes on one side as well, maybe cut 4 - 5 inches off each end of the bars, only run a front brake... that kind of thing.
  • 2 2
 It Looks good and it is certainly thought through but that price and the still to slack seat and not enough reach is a no go for me.
  • 1 1
 what xl 518mm.. not enough? did I sleep for too long?
  • 1 0
 @likehell: I guess so, I tested the Nicolai G1 in 2018 so yeah It is short Wink
The problem would be that the frame is to slack with that seat angle to get a nice and easy ride to the top.
Compare the Privateer, Pole or something else who really think about long reach numbers and compare the seat angle.
  • 2 0
 568 tt on size large sounds cramped
  • 3 0
 I suspect that's a typo. Judging from the pics, there's a lot more saddle to grip distance than on a Privateer 161.
  • 2 0
 @Varaxis: i think its because actual sta is 71 compared to privs 78 79
  • 5 0
 Well that would realy be a littel cramped Big Grin Thanks for that commen! We just fixed the typo on our webiste Smile

Correct Toptube length are : 581 for Medium, 604 for Large , 633 for XL and 666mm for XXL
  • 1 0
 Agreed. Sounds like it was a typo, but for me on a medium 581 is still too short. I may be alone on this, or maybe someone could help me with bike setup. I'm 5'8", ride a '17 Fuel EX in a medium with ETT of 600, 60mm stem, and still have to slide the saddle all the way back on its rails so my hands don't go numb. As all newer bikes have shorter ETTs and stems what do I do?
  • 1 0
 @SL13: For some reason the bikes made in Germany have short and high top tubes.
  • 2 0
 Well that's the Last time I say "looks like a bargain!"
  • 2 0
 I was excited..... and then get to the price section..
  • 1 0
 I’d ride it just for that leverage rate. Almost everyone else is slacking compared to that
  • 3 0
 One word: Privateer.
  • 1 0
 This had my interest until I saw the price .. too bad because the geo numbers are great
  • 2 2
 I already have issues with breaking bikes that aren't touted as the lightest. Gram counting just doesn't matter unless you're racing uphill.
  • 2 0
 Because German dentists deserve a German bike Wink
  • 1 1
 If it didn’t have racist routing and had 130mm, I would be interested. About time someone put some effort into reducing weight.
  • 1 0
 I'll put that on my list of bikes, along with Santa Cruz, that i will never purchase
  • 2 0
 The color Green continues to flow through the comments sections on PB lol
  • 1 0
 I like it! under 30lb bike ready to go. that is good. my old 2015 scott voltage is 34lb but completly different bike
  • 1 0
 Here is the official film with the bike:

www.pinkbike.com/video/516968
  • 3 2
 Relabel as transition and comments will change Wink
  • 2 2
 Let me guess... I didn´t read nothing yet (even the comments)... just to know... It´s German???!!
  • 1 0
 yes it is
  • 2 0
 Nevermind, read further.
  • 1 0
 I’m assuming top two measurements are a typo?
  • 2 1
 Looks fantastic! Numbers read fantastic! would like to ride it!
  • 1 0
 How light is the entire bike??
  • 2 0
 review please . . .
  • 1 0
 That bike is incredible . Incredibly beautiful and incredibly expensive
  • 1 0
 Give us the new FAST FORWARD already!
  • 1 0
 Nice looking frame! Solid numbers, way to go Last!!
  • 2 2
 I only speak freedom units so I have no idea how much this costs or what it weights. /s

That's a hella light bike.
  • 1 0
 Nicolai never looked so affordable before !
  • 1 0
 Hmm, I could build this into a capable 27lb trail bike. Love the blue.
  • 1 0
 Looks great! Way out of a normal rider's budget though.
  • 1 0
 That is a REALLY good looking bike.
  • 1 0
 1400 Cad for a custom colour...
  • 1 0
 With how hard I’m gonna case this thing, I hope they have good insurance
  • 1 0
 This would work my last choice probably.
  • 1 0
 Is there a stimulus check friendly version?
  • 1 0
 27.5 and I'm in, it looks great and the storage...
  • 1 0
 Removing a pivot point is so hot right now!
  • 1 0
 Internal cable routing actually helps stiffen the frame??????
  • 2 5
 I've gotta ask @dan-roberts, why does the seat tube on the black one extend so much higher from the downtube than the blue model as seen side by side in the second to last image set above?
  • 16 0
 bike frames have these things called....>sizes...its like they are different >sized for different >sized people.

Its gonna be all over Eurobike this year.
  • 1 3
 @thedirtyburritto: yeah ok. Personally I'm a large rider at 6'3" and yet I prefer to have my seat slammed out of the way when I'm descending the big stuff. I don't see it as a benefit to increase that element of the frame sizing, better to just stick a dropper with a greater stroke in. But maybe I'm alone in this.
  • 3 0
 @landscapeben: good thing you are not a frame engineer then. The 'benefit' that you dont see is so that the frame doesnt break the F"çK in half due to the extra leverage created by the longer tall guy seat post.

enjoy your day.
  • 2 2
 @thedirtyburritto: the enjoyment of my day doesn't rest on the content of the pinkbike comment section and my guess from that response is that you aren't a frame engineer either. I would also guess that a proper frame engineer could easily change the design tolerance by placing that extra material in the carbon layup lower down to strengthen against those forces if it was genuinely an issue to put a longer dropper on. It's not like these companies don't think about the possibility of a rider installing a longer dropper and I highly doubt that they design the frame to snap in half if a buyer sticks a longer dropper in.
  • 1 1
 Does anyone has experience with SR Suntour Zeron? Looking for a review.
  • 1 0
 Zeron is a range like Aeffect is for Race Face. What are you looking at cranks? Fork? If fork, air or coil? I have no answers for these just trying to help.
  • 1 0
 * Top tube
  • 6 0
 Thanks for that commen! We just fixed the typo on our webiste Smile

Correct Toptube length are : 581 for Medium, 604 for Large , 633 for XL and 666mm for XXL
  • 1 0
 @LAST-BIKECOMPANY: so are the numbers in the chart above wrong then? I was actually going to comment that the top tubes seen incredibly short.
  • 4 0
 @KxPop: Yes, the Toptube values given in the table are not correct. We did put in the correct values on our website but we sadly can not change them in the pinkbike article.
Our Website is WWW.LAST-Bikes.com
  • 1 0
 @LAST-BIKECOMPANY: Thanks. The numbers on the website make a heck of a lot more sense Smile
  • 1 1
 800€ for a paint upgrade . f*ck off you're crazy
  • 1 0
 Looks like a bicycle
  • 1 0
 Balls.
  • 1 1
 Looks flexy.
  • 4 6
 Best bike ever? Certainly not... But is it the lightest? Also no
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