36pollici Announces the First Carbon 36er Mountain Bike
We've previously spoken about DirtySixer, who make larger wheeled bikes for taller riders including LeBron James and last year Trek told us that they are also testing larger wheels (although they seem to have settled with just going to 32" for now). In fact, when you go digging there are actually quite a few companies building larger wheeled bikes including some who use titanium, but none have ever created a carbon frame until now.
The 36pollici bike was unveiled at Garda Bike Festival and is part of a three-model range that the brand is planning on producing. It is the brainchild of Bruno Vittorio who has been toying with the idea of 36ers since 2016. Even when Focus designed one for an April Fools joke he was not deterred and forged on inspired by the models coming out of the USA. Unfortunately, Bruno passed away in August 2021 so never got to see his dream come to life but his project has been carried on by his daughter Eleonora and a team of friends who work in bike production in Italy.
The front triangle is a monocoque with the stays bonded
While Eleonora works on creating the moulds and laminating the carbon in Brescia, the rest of the bike spec has been created in collaboration with a number of other Italian companies. Bright Racing Shocks provided the rigid fork. Some 36" mountain bikes do have suspension forks, such as the Truebike MTB, but 36pollici believes that the 36" wheel's angle of attack combined with high volume tyre and flex built into the BRS fork will be enough to smooth out.
The other Italian contribution comes from Braus Components who make the carbon wheels. One of the biggest drawbacks for the 36" design is the massive increase in rotational weight over a 29er. By building the first carbon 36er wheel, Braus was able to reduce the weight of a rim down to 460 grams per rim in the “lightened” version and about 680 grams in the standard version.
The wheels come from Braus components and are probably the lightest 36ers on the market.
Bright Racing Shocks designed the fork to have some built in flex.
While the rims are a big improvement, 36pollici is struggling to find appropriate tires for a 36er. The best models are designed for unicycles and they currently spec the VeeTire T-Monster 36x2.25 72TPI that weighs about 1400 grams per wheel. The bike is set up tubeless but if you were running innertubes, you would have to add around 325 grams on top of that. They are hoping that their collaboration with Braus will result in more tire manufacturers producing higher quality 36" tyres.
The curved seat tube allows the wheel to be brought inwards for shorter and stiffer stays but it does mean a dropper post can't be fitter. The bike is one size only but 36pollici says it will fit riders from 165 cm up to about 190 cm.
In total, the bike weight comes to 12 kg, or 26.5 lb, which isn't a heavyweight in the grand scheme of things but is about a 3kg or 6lb penalty over the lightest carbon fibre hardtails on the market. 36pollici will be hoping that the weight cost is overruled by the advantages of a 36" wheel that include more stability thanks to the “increased gyroscopic effect”, and more rollover than other mountain bike wheel sizes.
36pollici is also planning to release an aluminium/carbon version of the bike.
36pollici is hoping to begin selling the bike at the start of 2022, depending on supply chain issues, and will announce pricing then. Alongside the full carbon version, it is also creating a fully aluminum version and a bike with an aluminum front triangle and carbon stays. More info, here.
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I'm not sure where you ride but for me, Ive even running 2.5 minions on my trail bikes since 2005. Plus tires were not the gateway to fat tires on mtb's, 3.0 gazzy's, IRC Kujo and intense DH2.8 were what really showed the industry what a wide tire could do in the early 2000's
On the other hand, I don't understand why the road cycling world never dared to enlarge the diameters of their wheels from 28" to something bigger. That would probably make sense in term of inertia/performances, but road cycling and MTB are really not the same kinds of chapels in term of changement.
But would have to be tall to have a chance of riding it good?
Maybe big ben Cathro would be the one to show everyone how good it could be?
Did UCI give its green light to let 27.5 and 29" wheels exist in MTB? No. UCI adapted to their existence.
Do UCI rules concern 99,9% of the mtbikers and road cyclists who don't compete? No again.
Imagine Specialized or Colnago developping a 31" bike which is unanimously convincing. Marketing and press will make their job, more and more amateur cyclists will want that bike; progressively you read things like "28inchesaredead" on forums, competitors appropriate these bikes as well and progressively ban the smaller wheels, then they claim to use the 31" wheels for competition. What the UCI would say, despite its rigidity?
The UCI doesn't always make the weather... fortunately.
It's brilliant. I'd love to turn that exact idea into a 32" or something. 36 seems way too limiting for frame geometry.
so maybe the key for more roadie speed is actually smaller wheels, i'd imagine the increase in bearing drag would be negligible, and the increased frame drag from needing more frame would be more than offset by the decreased wheel drag.
If the majority of newcomers are going to ride for 30+ kms with no technical sections a 32" or a 36" makes a lot of sense.
That sort of riding/racing is done as cyclocross in the UK.
But you have a point, it would rip on long fire road rides!
Marathon XC is just fireroad cycling
a gravel bike event and is confused.
Does marathon XC exist in the uk as a thing then?
Do people really ride hardtails on fireroad-only long distance endurance races in the uk then?
Definitely not my cuppa tea. Happily do 50km on an enduro event though if there is lots of tech involved!
Lets not forget how awkward and shitty 29ers used to look and ride...
https://content.mtbr.com/channels/mtbreview/images/products/large/product_501404_58067.jpg
Fast forward to 2021, and you can now get a great riding and totally proportional 29er for even medium and small riders.
Now, I'm not suggesting that 32" or 36" will take over the entire industry- 29" is probably as big as we can go for smaller riders and still see a benefit with tire buzz, etc. However- if 29" works for medium riders, (and works very well) clearly a larger rider could benefit from an even larger wheel.
Do the math: a 6' 4" rider is about 11.8% taller than a 5' 8" rider. A 32" wheel is only about 10.4% larger than a 29. With appropriately scaled geometry, you could actually build an XXL bike that fits it's intended rider the same way a medium does. Crazy stuff, but maybe not as crazy as it seems.
I don’t really see how leg/arm/torso proportion has anything to do with it- There are short people with long legs and short torsos, just like there are gangly tall people. But there are also tall people who are simply big. So that’s nothing we aren’t already dealing with for bike fits at any size. More options is always good.
Don’t forget that dangling your ass off the bike isn’t all that effective with modern geometry, so probably not as critical as it once was.
End of the day I don’t really care what happens. People ride for different reasons, and some people just want to go as fast as possible. Big wheels = speed, and for some that will always be worth it.
There’s no doubt the 36er is weirder, but that Giant is still seriously bad. Flip between it and the 2022 version in another tab, it’s hilarious.
I seriously doubt 36” could ever be mainstream outside of bikes for basketball players, but I wouldn’t be so sure about 32”.
Think about it- the bike industry is always looking for new things to sell, and changing sizes and dimensions of components is an easy way to have a ‘new thing’ without any actual technological innovation. And there is a legitimate need to better serve the XXL part of the bike market, which isn’t quite as niche as you might think.
It kinda looks like, a Big pair of eye glasses w/ a bike frame in the middle
Just waiting ,for a comment
Or maybe you would be rolling corners so fast it wouldn't matter
-Walt
Not saying any of these would be aesthetically pleasing!
Then again, looking at MX kids climbing onto bikes for adults via the bike stand this might still be legit.
I found this write-up with some good calculations to reinforce the idea - www2.eng.cam.ac.uk/~hemh1/gyrobike.htm
I'm not saying it's totally negligible, but if increasing the gyroscopic effect was all that useful, I think we'd see some different trends in rim/tire weight, no? Wouldn't you want them as heavy as possible?
However, if you think of big off road grand tours, trekking, off road bikepacking, this is a good shout. Long marathon slogs, multi day wilderness adventures, long distance endurance races, you want a reliable bike that you can ride in a straight line comfortably for a long period of time and I think a big wheeled rigid bike is a good shout.
Saying that, 36 might be too big…
Also.
May we hope for a fat-bike version?
The lack of suspension is going to be just as much of an issue for a 36” wheel as it is for a 29” wheel, the builders excuse is just that.
Having ridden these wheel sizes off road, I honestly don’t expect to see them on the trails anytime soon, there’s a lot of rotational weight and it’s a lot of wheel to move around.
Horses for course’s y’all say so apply that logic to fit variables.
Been riding 700c/29” since 1990 when the Panaracer Smoke 700x45 were introduced so have a grasp on getting heckled for trying things out of the mainstream.
Also don’t forget market forces. If rich really tall people want to pony up the coin then good for those who cater to there needs.
Besides, nothing ages worse than a mountain bike if you want to keep on the bleeding edge of technology.
Headtube seems to be 70°, and effective seat angle 75°, down to 73° with the offset of the seat post.
I'm thinking there could be a dropper.
There's a big space between the tire and seattube, you could bring the tube closer, and make it go straighter to the downtube to fit a dropper.
And bring the seatstays more in line with the headtube to make the shape more dynamic.
“People say the riding of bicycle makes you happy but for most of them it is just an empty phrase. Do you know why? They don't ride a proper bicycle and they've never known a real joy of riding. Truebike, the unique 36 inch wheeled bicycle! This bicycle gives you the real feeling that you ride something special. It is not only look amazing but you can have an extraordinary riding experience, too. It's like riding a limo with a sports engine. Comfort meets elegance. And if you take part in some kind of race, doesn't matter if you win, be sure that everybody will notice you. You can feel like a champion, this bike gives you an attention of audience.”
Some strong claims.
Their design team must have been inspired by pausing Pinkbike Huck to Flat challenge when the bikes had bottomed out...
Narrator: "It won't."
So we're just going to skip over 30.5", 32", 33.5" and 35? This is escalating quickly. How is the industry supposed to sell 4x more bikes if you do 36 now?
And of course you’ll need a frame with a down tube that tire won’t hit at bottom out.
I struggle to imagine that the rollover benefits of a 36 front wheel are so amazing that it’s worth giving up 160mm of suspension travel.
Another thought experiment for the enduro set: to maintain geometry while putting a 36 front wheel on a Transition Spire you should run a rigid fork.
Wha? dangit SIRI
I said, To-day
Now look what you’ve done
Obviously the industry is moving in 1,5" increments...Who is this man exactly to make the jump from 29" to 36" ?????
oldglorymtb.com/waltworks-custom-36er-mountain-bike