Update: Atherton Bikes Seeking Around £600,000 in Crowd Funding Investment

 Here is a novel idea. How about, I give you money. You give me a bike. And that is how you fund your business. Crazy I know but think about it.

 Give them a break! Crowdfunding sounds like a Sick idea to me..

 "We’re sorry but residents of Japan, Canada and the US are not allowed to invest unless they are SEC accredited"
So much for growing your business in 2 of the biggest markets in the world!
#RIPAthertonBikes

 As an esoteric brand appreciator, I'll just say that any time that a brand goes the crowdfunding route, it's almost never, ever, ever a good sign. Basically means they can't get funded through your normal investor channels/financing options. Big oof.

 Haven't all three of the Atherton's been making six figure money for years now? Aren't they RedBull athletes? Can they not put some skin in the game and...gasp...sell bicycles to finance their own operations? I live in a relatively affluent area (Front Range, CO) and have never heard anyone talking about an Atherton bike, let alone seen one in the flesh. Perhaps they need to get some bikes out into the public so people can exchange cash for them, and fund future expansion that way. Otherwise, 6.1% return ain't that great; you can do better on your own with a little bit of research.

 If 1 000 000 people give me every month 1$ then I would have a pretty nice life.
Anyone interested???
This is no scam, I would be really happy for the money, also I need the money, so help me!!!!!

 Our first round of fund raising was so successful that we decided to stop fund raising so we could leave room for crowdsourcing...wut

 (removed due to potential legal reasons)

 The endless delays and the huge sums of money being thrown around is ringing alarm bells for me - seems like they are getting this really wrong somehow.
How can it possibly have taken them this long to get bikes to market when they basically took over what was already a functioning bike brand (Robot bikes) in order to start this off. It’s like they’ve been going backwards for a year or two now.
I really hope I’m wrong but I’m fully expecting this whole thing to end in tears.

 The numbers don’t seem to add up. 1500 frames a year at 16 hours a print. That’s 24,000 printing hours. Even if they managed to run 24hrs a day, 6 days a week (a massive ask in the world of production) that would still need 3.25 printers. RenAM 5000’s are £500,000 each. So they are either finding £2M for the 4 machines they’ll need, or paying Renishaw a huge amount of money to print for them. (And I find it highly unlikely that renishaw have that much spare printing capacity) Then there’s the conventional machining times to seperate and finish the printed lugs. And we’ve not even got round to the actual bonding together of 1500 frames a year, that’s 6 a day based on a normal working week. All of a sudden the £600,000 is a tiny drop in the ocean (or the 1500 frame sales are pie in the sky?)
Having said all that, I really REALLY hope it works for them. I’ve spent a fair bit of time with Brownie and the Atherton’s you couldn’t meet a nicer bunch.

 Will there be an opportunity for potential interested parties to perform some basic due diligence on the business before investment occurs?

 To me crowdfunding is to allow an idea to get off the ground.

The Athertons are an established brand in their own right, have already received ‘angel funding’ and realistically tweaked and rebranded a design and process robot previously put in place - probably at great expense in terms of time at least.

I’m not sure this thing is at the crowd fund stage anymore, essentially the money is wanted to purchase machinery and market the product they already have - at this stage, in my eyes it’s asset finance and putting your own ass on the line (been there, still paying it back...)

I think it’s always good to see a business where the owners believe in it enough to stake their assets / future on it before asking others for money, maybe they already have though?

 Seems there's a few folk that don't know basic business running. Can't expand bike sales if bike production costs more to outsource it rather than do it in house, hence crowd funding for in house manufacturering equipment.

 I'm gonna add my two cents, seeing as everybody else has. Ladies and gentlemen, and those of you who are clearly offended that somebody or a group of somebodys are asking for help. First and foremost, this is not a tax, and this you have the OPTION to partake.... Now moving on the obvious.
The concept and idea behind Atherton Bikes is new, and this industry has not yet seen long term results of this process.
Adding in the refinement of the linkage design and kinematics, flex, and overall ride quality takes alot of testing and time. I for one would prefer a company takes their time to produce a truly high end product, rather than spitting out mounds of turds for a dollar. Many of you must be forgetting that they are competing against companies with millions... even billions, that have almost infinite resources for production. Here's the thing most people need to consider. If it doesn't effect you, then why are you so opinionated? Do you have enough knowledge and education to properly even form an opinion? Relax, and be happy that there are people out there trying to take tech to the next level. May not be for you, but its might inspire something that is. Thats evolution of ingenuity.

 I think we need to actually understand what this is before rushing to judgement here. This isn't "crowd funding" in the sense of how many other companies have done it or what most are familiar with. This is an actual investment in the equity of the company while most crowd funding you have seen in the past (such as kick starter) is just on a donation/reward model where you are essentially just giving funds in exchange for some kind of tangible good or service (usually the product they are trying to develop).

Crowdcube is funding platform in the UK which is similar to things like AngelList and Funders Club (among others) that we have here in the US. These are very popular and very attractive way for businesses like these to raise money.

I also see that alot of people wonder why a regular venture capital firm or PE firm wouldn't invest. The reason is really that its too small. While it sounds like alot of money, $775K is a very small investment for even an early stage VC firm, let alone a large PE firm. This size investment is really still more of an Angel type investment and not something most VC's would be looking at.

 Crowdfunding can work well for consumer-facing companies as it's essentially marketing, and once you have a few hundred (or thousand) investors, that's good word-of-mouth. It can be a very cheap (in terms of % of ownership given away) form of growth finance. Crowdfunding a B2B business is a red flag for me, but here it could be a good move.

It wouldn't surprise me if making bikes from 3D-printed lugs, carbon tubes and adhesives is really hard. Once they have it nailed, that's a strong competitive advantage. Yes, they could have been more actively selling but... what if they sold more than they can deliver and piss people off? Or what if it's not quite ready for volume production yet? A serious failure in the field, under a paying customer, could kill the business.

More transparency would be good, because a vacuum of information causes speculation. However, this type of finance is regulated to high heaven in the UK, so they will have chosen their words on the website very carefully. They need to spend the money on what they've said they will - selling and manufacturing capacity.

Note Atherton Bikes is not predicting a 6.1% CAGR on investments, they're saying the cycling market is growing at 6.1% CAGR. No prediction is made for a return on investment, either as capital growth or dividends.

I wish them all the best... I may even buy a few shares.

 I have long suspected the Atherton Bikes business model to be fishier than an otter's breath. I would sooner invest in an Eddie Masters range of volumising shampoos. To quote Dragon's Den, "I'm out".

 I heard taking out bank loans and selling bikes has the potential to make a profit too.

 So they plan to sell 1500 frames/bikes per year the next 5 years? They managed to produce and sell 50 frames/bikes in almost 2 years(not counting prototypes and bikes for Gee, Rachel, etc)

Say a year has 250 working days, they plan to produce 6 frames per day? Not sure how long the 3D printing of the lugs takes, but this sounds pretty optimistic? I mean going from 50 frames in 2 years to 1500 a year is a HUGE step

What are these forecasts based on? Have there been tests? Have people committed to buying the frames? Don not get me wrong, I like the frame(but would have kept the Ti lugs raw titanium for them to stand out more, highlight the Titanium against the carbon tubes) but what is the warranty, turn around when ordered, and when something goes wrong?

Is there more information on how they plan to get to 1500 units per year and also sell them. Is this realistic compared to other high end brands?

Is a business plan available?

 "Atherton Bikes is a private company, which means it doesn’t trade on a stock exchange. This means you can only sell Atherton Bikes shares when a ‘liquidity event’ occurs., that is when the whole or part of the company is sold, it lists on an exchange, or it sells a major asset such as a brand."

...and for that reason, I'm out.

 and how many bikes was sold until now?

 What's up with you all? You don't have to invest if you don't want to. Mind you, pandemic and Brexit (that totally unnecessary business killer) might make it a tad of a struggle. Get doing a few EWS rounds to promote these bikes Athertons!!

 The Athertons' have each invested £11k into it and the "millionaire dragon" Piers Linney has invested £10k into it. The business has no cash, nos assets, no liabilities and a net worth of zero. They are asking for the price or thereabouts of a Renishaw 500Q AM machine. Seems like they could all invest a little more themselves before asking 64000 rounds of £11 from Joe Public.

But what do I know?

Oh and the there are five active directors, four past directors and the shareholder equity is also zero.

 The reality of additive manufacturing hits hard don't it. There is a reason most machine sales are medical, aerospace and automotive.

 I’d be more interested in crowd funding the grim donut if I want to throw away some cash. That beast could ‘disrupt the mountain bike industry’

 So the big problem is your money is stuck until a liquidity event.
Given most bike manufacturers on are not publicly traded the likelihood of an IPO (getting listed and becoming publicly traded) is incredibly low.
I mean heck even Specialized are still a private company!
This means you are stuck waiting until they decide to "sell" part of all of the company but there is absolutely timelines for when that would be.
There is very little benefits to "investing" apart from the moonshot that they grow to the size of Specialized/Giant and so an IPO but given the amount of competition out there from cool rider owned brands who struggle to get to this size why would Atherton bikes be any different?

 After years and years racing., cashing in on the. "name" "brand" there but willing to invest there own money to fund there own project, THE GREED IS REAL..
can't win any races so I'll ask the public to fund our business

 Funnily enough I was only wondering what was happening with the Atherton bikes recently and went on their website yesterday.

They really need to get a move on and get bikes out there being ridden by customers.

I feel the Atherton name was going to be one of the selling points but they’re no longer n the spot light like they once where and the project, to an outsider, looks as if it’s lost a bit of momentum.

Hopefully they’ll get things sorted and prove me wrong.

 "I'll take a truck please. Where do I sign?"

"How would you like to buy the whole dealership today? It is shockingly profitable -if you look at these figures-. Chance to get in on the ground floor. What payment would work for you?"

"Just a truck thanks..."

 They’re looking to bring the additive manufacturing process in house instead of having to sub it out to another manufacturer that probably manufactures parts for other companies, not just bike components. That means with every order they need to get online and wait for their parts instead of being able to simply have a dedicated setup under their own roof that can run as much as they need it to. Makes complete sense. They’ve got the design and the manufacturing process down beyond prototypes. They need the control of being able to make them in house so they can be delivered quickly. Why so much suspicion towards the Athertons in these comments? They’ve never presented themselves as anything less than completely professional, and they’re clearly devoted to their brand. Also, I’ve never seen such a highly functioning family group. They’ll get it done.

 If you access the details on the ask, it shows that this round of funding is actually about them accessing a larger UK government grant. If they can raise 500k then they get the grant to take them to the £2m they would need for the expansion. Its why the figures dont add up on the surface because this isnt obvious in the comms. They have done this which is great and I hope it helps drive costs down. Good luck to them.

 i looks like every other full squish why do we need to build your company for you ?

 $775,000 motherf*ckingUSandA dollars?! Just listen to @freestyIAM and sell your f*cking bikes! jezzzz!

 I like the Athertons and all...... but......

 Business lesson, never go into a business with a failing company! Get out while you still have your shirt on your back!

 Looks like a great investment if you enjoy throwing money into a fire. No, at least that will warm you up.

 I would only invest if I knew the company would aim to create a loss leader product with the goal of establishing itself through market share. The frames are too expensive, and that fact alone is at risk of ruining the company.

 so I give you money, and you give me nothing unless you sell one day? And what if you stay ‘rider owned’? And you haven’t sold more than 50 bikes yet claim a 15000% increase in sales?

This is not much different to those emails from Nigeria asking for a £10,000 to release my share in a lost royal fortune.

Sorry but you have lost all your creditability with this scam.

 This has to be looked at purely as a marketing stunt, albeit a poorly presented one. My reasoning is such:

1. Piers Linney is a shrewd and successful investor. If they needed the money and he believed in the project, they would have it. He probably does and they probably do have access to his money.
2. The sums on capital expenditure vs production vs requested amount dont add up. The would need 4x that amount to cover bringing the manufacturing in house.
3. They state that this is allowing the community to invest, so its not necessarily business motivated. They should be more open about motive here and where the money is going.

So assuming this isnt about really needing the money then one has to look at what value an equity share would be but.....

1. The brand is closely associated with the Athertons, making a sale of the company unlikely in the medium term. Their brand is marketing for the bike brand.
2. They have sold 50 bikes. There are no real world reviews of their bikes and the range is limited.
3. They haven't announced the price per share or the overall share available.
4. They state how the company 'may' grow in future but they dont state what kind of 'equity event' they might consider in future. My suspicion is they aren't considering one or the only one they would consider is a buy back if things get profitable.
5. They is no info about dividends/profit share. If there was then it might encourage people to consider this more. Return on investment isnt just about sale of shares.
6. Its really not clear who is running the business. With the distractions of the WC and running a bike park, it cant be the Athertons themselves.

As someone who invests, too much of this rings alarm bells to me which is a real shame. I really like the Athertons and would love to invest in their company and also to keep manufacturing in the UK but Im not sure I would ever see a return. I do think they will be successful with this but to invest I would need to know:

1. Amount of equity on offer and price per share.
2. Where dividends are being paid.
3. What is the intention and type of equity release planned for the future.
4. What the money is really going to be used for.
5. Who is running the business

Personally I think they would have been better getting a bunch of great reviews and then crowd funding the first batch of bikes at a discounted rate to raise the 2m they need to bring it in house. Or to offer a equity stake with a significant discount on a bike so there is medium term value to the investor. The business can be run at break even while they scale up.

Shame really, if it had been clearer I would have supported it.

 Fully funded inside 24 hours......
You couldn't raise that through conventional investors in the same time.....
www.crowdcube.com/companies/atherton-bikes/pitches/bj9Q5Z

 All this investment talk aside, i always had another problem with their concept nobody seems to ever mention.
The fast lived nature of the cycling world.
While i as an enthusiast view their process as an advantage and certainly a useful technology to further flexibility in bike design and customization, my problem with it when it comes to the future attractiveness of the company comes with the inherent inflexibility in design.
We all know, the biggest part of the mtb customer base is lusting for constant updates and improvements. This has taken rather ridiculous forms in recent years, where companies switch designs on a perceived weekly basis.
While companies like Nicolai, Last, UNNO, Orange and various others have found their firm niche in the market, they´re nowhere near ever expanding into relevancy outside of a very dedicated core customer base, like for example YT-Industries or Canyon did.
So while their product in itself seems awesome and in many ways beneficial for the intended target audience, these customers are not easy to cater to and the fact that upon release their bike designs are now already dated, without any obvious option of drastically altering appearances every three years (they´re bonded carbon tubes held together by lugs after all) is kinda concerning to me. I´m not sure how many people will actually chose the old trusty Atherton bike over whatever new fancy carbon spaceship Yeti releases in the same year. Periodically changing the whole bike´s layout (linkage design or massive geo changes) seems like the only way of staying relevant in the mass market for them and with the geometry option we have arguably already reached the peak of what is reasonable.
I get they are basically a non existant company at this point and therefore i´m assuming a lot about what their plans for the future are, but with public outside investment and what is basically an already established brand name with a tangible value to it, simply catering to a few enthusiasts doesn´t seem to be what they should be after. They could probably make more money from simply selling their naming rights to Wal-Mart or whatever brand needs a face for their new line of recreational sports bikes.
I have absolutely no clue on the intricacies of financing or maybe even building a brand to sell off at some point (if that´s what they´re trying to do), so maybe someone else has an idea. I can only contrast this to companies like YT which have built themselves from budget to low level prestige brand in record time, yet Atherton bikes seems to do exactly the opposite of what they have been doing. It seems to me they will be a lot like UNNO. Strong ethics (production "at home"), quality, flexibility etc., but i cannot see them growing beyond a certain point with that approach (which isn´t inherently wrong!), yet their business approach tells a whole different story, because with their name´s potential selling power they have to make a big splash in the market upon arrival.
It´s just something that always kinda confused me about the potential longevity issues of their design approach and what i should be expecting from this company in the future. Right now i just feel like they´re in a very weird spot going by what they offer, who they cater to and how they present their business.

Whatever, I really hope they do succeed though. They seem like a deserving bunch of people very invested in the sport and the bike has a lot of potential i wanna see come to market.

 Why does everyone want to knock something new it’s a whole new way of making a bike and a new way of funding it seeing too many “something for nothing” comments your putting in funding in exchange for shares.

 would make sense for the Atherton's to start riding "enduro" bikes. If you want to shift 7,500 frames, best cater for the mass market that is trail & enduro rather than DH.

 I would rather invest in a Trump run company !!! more chance of a 6% return and if you believe that you think Trumps not a Racist Bigot !!

 I wonder how much of the company I would own for dropping $800k USD ~ 600k BP? Like enough to be a member of the board? This is all hypothetical of course...

These super niche companies do end up surviving, but my only issue is the market is so saturated with companies right now. You got the big names of specialized, giant, trek, etc. and high end boutique such as UNNO, antidote, hope, etc that have 1 or 2 solid investors.

So I’m wondering what is Atherton’s actual goal?

 Not sure how what they're doing jibes with U.S. law.

Usually in 'Murica, shares in non-publicly traded companies can only be sold to accredited investors, who have to satisfy certain requirements, such as making $200k+ a year. I want the Athertons to succeed, but this seems like a dicey approach with a meaningful risk of a lawsuit attached.

 I wish them all the best but don't they have any of their own money, sponsors and backers willing to invest? Its knocking the 'brand' going this route. What happened to the first phase? The issue with the crowd funding route is if it crashes and burns you've burnt and created ill will for any 'phase 3'. Start with and develop a clothing line. Then add in batches from the likes of Marino frames- "A line" ..

 This is so frustrating. If they think they can sell bikes then take pre-orders for actual bikes to cover the cost of manufacturing, some money upfront to cover the risk and get an idea of where the market really is.

This £600k will inevitably go in to ‘marketing’ which just means paying the wages of the Atherton’s and for them to travel to amazing places for a photoshoot. Amazing family and have done a lot within the sport, but this seems very underhand.

 Someone put in a huge wedge of cash within the first 10 mins. It went from 0 to 70 investors funding 500k + in that time. Good luck to em I say if they can raise the money. They build a 170mm enduro bike that gets good reviews then Im in!

 I cant see this company succeeding at all. It worries me further than they want crowd funding money. I mean I thought they had money themselves and Dragons Den millionaires. Surely the Dragons Den peeps could invest if they thought it was profitable. But given the cost of these bikes, I cant see them expanding beyond being a boutique custom brand for a very few select customers. Plus the Atherton's are not exactly as big as they used to be. Call me a sceptic but I think this is a bad investment.

 Perhaps they have more details somewhere about this, but I would need a hell of a lot more to go off than a single sentence that says they expect to sell 7500 bikes in the next 5 years. That’s 1500 frames a years, or what, roughly 5 frames a day? What are current sales figures at? And is 7500 just a 6.1% increase on current sales, or are they estimating some wonderful bike sales gypsy to bless them with some crazy exponential growth in sales? I’m not hating on Athertons specifically, but this seems to be missing some important-and basic- details.

 Local laws prohibit residents of US, Canada and Japan from investing through Crowdcube's platform. If you reside in any of these countries, then you will not be able to invest on the Crowdcube platform unless you are an accredited investor.

 Wtf

 bigoof.gif Bummer. Maybe they could have set their sights a touch lower and offered a standard model that people could actually buy to help generate cash flow.

 to be fair, those super mario pipes they use on their bikes do look kinda sweet

 I'm out!

 Here in NZ I've been waiting 6 weeks for a shimano 11 speed chain; not a lot of confidence in the bike industry at the moment

 6.1 vs inflation, risk . . . hmm.

 Interesting how many people think Crowdcube and Kickstarter are the same thing...

 Wow 50 frames sold. So seeing one in real is like spotting a UFO. Naaaa more people have seen UFO,s

 "Our initial Angel investment round was so successful that we had to close it early to save enough shares for the mountain bike community"...….. I'd get back on the phone to them Dan!

 Email received 10 minutes ago and target has been all but hit.

www.crowdcube.com/companies/atherton-bikes/pitches/bj9Q5Z

 All I have to look at is Super Troopers vs Super Troopers 2. Super Troopers is a classic and was funding through normal methods, while Super Troopers 2 went the crowd funding route and look at the end product .

 I notice there have been changes at board level in the company including the ending of 1 or more directors involvement according to their companies house regulatory submissions

 Wow, never seen so many Warren Buffetts in one comments thread.

 how much does their am/enduro frame cost?

 Bad timing to ask me to buy into a company who's investment decisions will be handled by a reality tv personality....

 Sounds like people can't read or think critically. So far, in my opinion... Atherton has done everything right. They've sold everything they've made... took it very slow and have obviously been very careful with the way they're doing things and have created an enormous amount of built up pressure for people to buy these bikes. They haven't even marketed them of offered them up for mass sales... yet look at how many people are tripping over themselves to comment on this article!! Once they feel comfortable being able to offer web sales.. shits going through the roof. A British designed and manufactured bike designed and tested by some of the best British racers... half the population of British mtb'rs will be creaming their pants to get one of these once they're easy to buy.

Also, people seem to have missed this line - "Our initial Angel investment round was so successful that we had to close it early to save enough shares for the mountain bike community, something we were all unanimous on..." Ok, so they do have access to a shitload of capital should they want or need it. For angel investors to be tripping over themselves to give you money after they've fully vetted the company, and it's financial and business plan, means Atherton is doing things right and are so far very successful at it... despite what a bunch of armchair pinkbike commenters might think.

Ha, if I wasn't Canadian I'd get in on this... this company has nothing but success written all over it. Good on you Atherton, take your time, do it right and do it well.

 I don't know much about the bike industry. What is the normal life cycle of a bike start up? Are they likely to get acquired or go public?

 Should have named it AFTERDAWN bikes...no?

 I love watching the Atherton's ride and have REALLY loved Gee's World Cup course previews. That said, you'd probably be better off giving your money to Bernie Madoff

 I could have sworn the way this is suppose to work is if you have a really good idea that looks like it will make money, you get a business loan.

 According to the stats on Crowdcube, the largest investment is £104,584. Nice!

 Shark Tank? That would be so cool!

 Bummer. Was hoping this would actually work.

 No... especially after how seeing they perform at a world Cup level

 Think I'll stick with Canfield for now thank you

 They could hire a designer for way less. With bikes not looking like balls, they might be able to start selling some.

 Go through extra steps to get an IPO in the works. Will make everyone feel better abkut it.

 Sounds to me like they want funding for a few new diggers for Dyfi bike park

 All they need to do is stfu and start producing frames

 Crowdcube...a nebulous idea, lol, the fact is this is a better business tactic than a rip off bank loan.

 Maybe they should have just done a clothing line...

 atleast get a good brand name first, atherton bikes sounds arcane, outside of DH racing circles no one heard of them

 Chances are they will very well exceed their funding goal by a huge margin.

 How to turn a dream of a lifetime into a monkey for your back instead of money for your bike

 Sounds like they are fizzling out if they have to ask for money from the end user

 The first thing they need to do is change the name of the bike. It’s so f****ing cringe “Atherton bikes”. The bike looks sick and I would have one if it wasn’t plastered in Atherton Bike stickers ????

 Can somebody remind me what's different/better about their bikes again?

 O.P.M. other peoples money,

 So lf i give you $100 of my hard earned money what will l get?