The Frace F160 is Milled From a 70kg Slab of Aluminum

Jun 23, 2020 at 8:26
by James Smurthwaite  

Germany really has been busy this lockdown and we've already seen the raw and wonderful FCKW and the additive manufactured Moorhuhn grace the front page in recent weeks.

The latest project we've spotted from the Germans is this stunning Frace F160, a bike that's been milled entirely from a block of aluminum. The technique isn't new, after all who can forget Cannondale's wild Pong V4000 prototype that graced the cover of pretty much every mag going in 1994, or Pole's construction technique, which uses two separate milled sections glued together.


Bernd Iwanow, the engineer behind this bike, does things a bit differently though. Unlike Pole's design, this is one solid construction, and there's no mistaking this bike for anything other than a completely milled frame thanks to the latticework of holes on every tube.

This was Bernd's first bike project but he has been milling CNC parts for the automotive industry since 2006 though his company CNC Future Technic. He was approached by a local bike manufacturer 2 years ago for a small project and enjoyed it so much that he decided to go all in and build his own bike. As he already had the machines, it seemed like the obvious choice to go with that technique for this project.


The bike starts life as a 70kg slab of 7075 aluminum that quickly gets turned into the mainframe. It may sound like this leaves a lot of waste but the off cut material then gets used for other parts. In total, 8 individual segments are machined and then connected using titanium screws to form the final bike. 7075 aluminum is not weldable so it's not a material we often see on bikes, but Bernd says it is incredibly stiff, which allows him to take so much material out of the frame. Despite this, it's not super light and the pictured build apparently tips the scales at 16.3kg (37lb).
Details
Frame Material 7075 aluminium
Wheel size 27.5"
Travel front: 160mm
Travel rear: 160mm
Head angle: 65.5 degrees
Seat angle: 76 degrees
Reach: 455 mm
Chainstay: 440 mm
Weight: 16.8kg (37lb)

The first step of production sees the front triangle milled from this slab of 7075.

The front triangle becoming more refined.
The machining grooves get smoothed out further down the production line.

The stays are machined from the offcuts from the front triangle.

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Torture testing is the final step

This is Bernd's first bike project and it has taken two years to come to completion. As he isn't himself a mountain biker and doesn't come from a bike design background he found the geometry and kinematics the most difficult parts to work out, especially of the chainstay Horst Pivot. He began working it out in CAD and it took him several weeks of working with his test pilot, Frederik Tobiasch, and five versions of the bike to get to the current configuration but says it is now the part of the bike he is most happy with.

A four-bar linkage drives the bike's 160mm of travel.

Test rider, Frederik Tobiasch, helped provide invaluable feedback to dial in the Horst Link system

Frace will be initially limiting production to 30 per year with a frame costing €5,000, the bike will be available from August 1. Keep an eye out for more from Frace in the future with an eFrace already being planned and developed.


More info.


225 Comments

  • 574 3
 This is the most enduro bike ever, imagine how many tools, tubes, bananas, pizza and beer you can fit in the holes of the frame.
  • 92 1
 Finally I don't have to ride with a backpack anymore when going on a one year enduro ride!
  • 12 3
 You win today.
  • 60 2
 But no Water bottle mount
  • 15 28
flag Ajorda (Jul 7, 2020 at 9:11) (Below Threshold)
 @dark-o: Looking at this bike, it seems like such a petty thing to b*tch about water bottle mounts.
  • 11 1
 the entire frame is a SWAT box. ah crap, the mr smith matrix lawsuit bot has been initiated
  • 18 32
flag DaFreerider44 (Jul 7, 2020 at 9:48) (Below Threshold)
 Looks like a session
  • 4 0
 @dark-o: I guess you could stick little tubes/shots of water all over the bike?
  • 84 0
 It would look nice with some stained glass inserts.
  • 15 0
 @shawnca7: Like a Aquarium with some nice Fish in?
  • 3 0
 @dark-o: but I see 11 places you can stuff a water balloon into.
  • 5 5
 @dark-o: @dark-o: Fish would be dead from shaking by the time you're at the bottom of a run.
  • 2 0
 @dark-o: Yeah, you know what? He could have designed one into it somewhere. A glaring oversight, IMO.
Or maybe he's saving that for v2.0.
  • 2 0
 * a water bottle cage, that is. Not an aquarium.
  • 16 0
 I’d hate to clean that frame
  • 6 0
 @Ajorda: Ever heard of sushi?
  • 1 0
 @DaFreerider44: have been thinking the same thing
  • 6 0
 A sticker-whore’s nightmare.....what am I gonna do with all these monster & redbull decals now?
  • 1 0
 You made my morning with that comment.
  • 1 0
 @Ben-76: I was going to say put them on a yeti cup, but then I realized, it’s probably already full.
  • 196 1
 One run in the mud and it's 10 kilograms heavier
  • 58 0
 Just fill the holes with spare tubes and mud won't ever be a problem again, nor will flat tires.
  • 24 1
 @MindPatterns: Filled holes with spare tubes. 20 kilograms heavier now.
  • 34 1
 Cover holes with duct tape, problem solved
  • 14 0
 @nurseben: Don't you dare!
  • 31 0
 If ever a bike needed an Invisiwrap kit...
  • 14 0
 Cover it in lightweight carbon composite tubing to keep the mud out.
  • 4 0
 @slovenian6474: Inflate the tubes! Then you only need 2-3 kg of tubes. And it'll look like an old titus.
  • 11 1
 @robokfc: Or perhaps the whole frame could be built out of some kind of alloy or composite tubing so there weren't holes to catch mud? Hmm, nah - probably can't be done.
  • 11 0
 Saran wrap the whole thing.
  • 3 0
 @nurseben: or pallet wrap
  • 1 0
 @mikelevy I would like to see how you would use the holes to store your tools, spares and essentials. like on the old brodie Wink
  • 141 22
 Just because you can doesn’t mean you should
  • 91 23
 Quite. It takes a lot to beat tubes. It seems like this isn't lighter, it doesn't claim to be stiffer, there's no performance advantage, it's incredibly wasteful, and looks like it has a huge machining time and production energy overhead. Not what the world needs, unfortunately.
  • 20 42
flag scotttherider (Jul 7, 2020 at 6:42) (Below Threshold)
 @dominic54: not wasteful. Aluminum is highly recyclable. It takes quite a bit of energy to recycle aluminum but that’s why you see most American aluminum production plants close to Hydroelectric dams.
  • 42 8
 @scotttherider: but there is clearly a lot of waste. This will probably be recycled but that will still require energy - even if it is green. there is also the presumably non-trivial amount of energy used in running a CNC milling machine, cleaning up the swarf, moving 70kg slabs of aluminium etc...

as @dominic54 said - there is no value add here - its not better. its just interesting.
  • 34 62
flag fielonator (Jul 7, 2020 at 6:59) (Below Threshold)
 @dominic54: People being prepared to make crazy stuff is exactly what the world needs. Another eco buzz-killer we can all do without.
  • 23 2
 @fielonator: odd that you've focussed on the eco bit - i thought that the primary point @dominic54 was making was that it doesn't offer a better solution...

not lighter.
not stiffer.
not cheaper

the 'not good for the environment' is trivial (if annoying to some) - the scale of manufacture is tiny.

so the only real thing it has going for it is that it looks unique - lets hope he can sell a few as he's doubtless put the hours in on it but suspect it won't change the game....
  • 32 10
 @fielonator: You've missed the point.

It's not innovative at all. Innovation is what the world needs, not people making crazy stuff for the hell of it. innovation is driven by doing a same/similar thing better. Efficiency, cost, materials, weight, strength all are at play - and while cool and interesting, this is an incredibly wasteful product that delivers little or no gains on the classic design.
  • 34 4
 @jonnyfox: It doesn't have to be better to look cool. Most of us will never see one apart from on a screen so what difference does performance make? Guy makes crazy looking bike frame using techniques and equipment he knows a lot about, then pinkbike shows it to us. I doubt he was trying to improve on anything, just to create something he was proud of. People should build stuff if they know how to, the stuff doesn't need to be any good to be worth the effort of building it. Especially when it looks cool.
  • 7 3
 @alex-smith: If this was a new method of manufacture that would replace all others I'd agree, it's not though is it. It's a freaky looking thing made by a guy that probably enjoys making stuff, probably just because he could. What else was he going to do with all that 7075?
  • 8 0
 @dominic54: it is pretty though
  • 8 0
 Kinda like commenting on the internet?
  • 2 2
 @jonnyfox: just putting it out there that yeah this is a wasteful manufacturing process but it could be far worse as far as materials used. I didnt pay attention excactly where these are produced but who knows where his power grid is supplied and what sources produce the power. If he's manufacturing for the auto industry primarily at least these may offset some of those emmissions of the cars he's manufacturing parts for. They also mentioned that they use some of the drop from manufacturing these frames to make other parts. So who knows exactly how much actual waste is produced per frame.
  • 8 1
 @dominic54: you could say the same about mechanical watches, sculptures or paintings.
  • 6 2
 @Mac1987: are you sure about that? All of the things you mention have a ‘useful’ life expectancy measured in decades; in the case of artworks, perhaps centuries. They aren’t judged in the same utilitarian way that machines and vehicles are. Their ‘utility’ is in their beauty. This on the other hand is a bike, in a technologically driven market. Bikes are always going to get better, making old ones less attractive, until nobody wants them at all. That’s more like a 10 year cycle. Quite aside from which - I think it’s pretty widely accepted that you can’t judge the arts by the same criteria you judge manufacturing.
  • 5 1
 @dominic54: personally I'd keep this bike and hang it on the wall of my garage if and when bike design has improved so much that I wouldn't ride it anymore.
  • 5 0
 But do you also criticize every single carbon frame posted on PB? Because unless you're directly handing your old carbon frames to a recycling specialist, this is no less eco-friendly than carbon, and definitely superior to carbon in long-term waste/recyclability. At the end of the day, it's just a rolled and milled aluminum slab.
  • 19 1
 @dominic54: This frame IS an art project. The builder/artist built it because he could, it looks cool, and it's thought-provoking, which is what art is all about. It's clearly not about 'utility', as clearly as it is about the frame's uniqueness and beauty. And it will indeed last for centuries, unless somebody hucks it to flat from 10 feet and smashes it. And even if it doesn't last for centuries, most art doesn't either. Most art is of the moment and it if survives, that's a bonus.
  • 19 4
 You f*cking nerds realize that this is art and not an attempt at innovative design, right?
  • 5 0
 I bet it looks even better in person.
  • 3 0
 @onlyDH: Yeah that's what I was thinking too. Probably really just a marketing stunt to show off his machining work on something that can be put through the wringer, without having to build an entire car. And if some fools wanna pay €6000 euros for one too, then hahaha all the way to the bank.
  • 2 13
flag mgolder (Jul 7, 2020 at 15:15) (Below Threshold)
 @fielonator: The world absolutely doesn't 'need' people making crazy things just because they can. The world needs people to innovate, to create new solutions to problems.

Your ''duhhhh pretty bike look nice'' outlook is staggeringly stupid, frankly. And is the kind of thinking that has lead to the 'eco buzz-killers' you seem to hate so much.

Ironic really.
  • 14 2
 Oh no a guy built his own bike and now there's some bits of aluminium lying around in his garage! how can the world possibly recover from this tyranny??!?
@mgolder yes Ikr, how dare this man defy humanity and build a bike while the rest of us struggle to save the human race from our own problems

Just chill guys, it's a nice bike
...i might go for a ride this afternoon
  • 2 2
 @Marquis: "Art" lol. "beauty" lol. C.O.P.E.
  • 7 1
 If he would have known a lot about production and construction, he would have left at least a thin piece of shear web inside those cavities. A shear web with a hole in it (like a rib in an aircraft wing) or even taper those cavities towards the inside. Might add a tiny amount of weight, increases stiffness and strength massively (so that he could then take more material off the rest of the frame and actually make it lighter again). He must have been too eager to highlight that the frame is cored out. British brand Empire Cycles did it first (and better, because they left the shear web in place). So if there is any brand that's been innovative, it must have been them. Heck, even Hope used to bring a machined out frame to the bike expositions to decorate with their parts. Must have been well over fifteen years ago since they started doing that.

As for "beautiful", I think it can be quite hard for us "consumers fo the product" to distinguish the "design" and the application. I recall when someone first pointed me at the citrus juicer from Philip Stark. Apparently it was innovative and in a way it probably was. But it gave me itches and goosebumps (in a bad way) just looking at it. Imagining how it must scratch over your tabletop and the high pitch noises that must make, amplified by those long legs. I thought sure, loads of designers must have come up with this concept in a brainstorm, to then reject it just because it is pretty horrible to look at, let alone work with. Same goes for a cored out frame. Of course loads of people must have thought about this. Just the mere thought of how heavy this would become to make it strong and stiff enough, how it would hurt if you bang in it or even how it wears your clothes and kneepads, how much of a bitch it must be to clean this thing... Maybe it takes someone who doesn't have the faintest idea of what mountainbiking is, to then appreciate it as an art piece.
  • 1 0
 @fielonator: I'm with you man even if this bike doesn't add value the engineer who designed and built it is better for the experience and who knows what he'll make next, or who will be inspired from this project... maybe it planted a seed of inspiration for someone who will improve metal recycling process or to manufacture other things with lots of holes in them
  • 1 0
 @mrgonzo: "engineer" who can't differentiate between strength and stiffness (to be fair that could be pink bike editorial bozo). But according to you no one has ever thought to use computers to control machines or recycle the swarf from a machine shop. lol
  • 1 0
 @dominic54: too right
  • 84 1
 So much for internal routing.
  • 20 0
 @neimbc it's as if it was designed by a pissed off bike mechanic sick of fishing for cable. And then he did drink and laugh...and laugh....Beer
  • 7 0
 @blowmyfuse: You could still zig-zag the brakehose, dropper and shifter wires through each hole. Just to piss him off again Smile
  • 2 0
 @mlangestrom: So then the next gen design would be to make all of the holes large enough to slide any brands caliper through. Basically any space 1/2mm wider than the distance between a DH fork and the headtube I'm assuming is that space.
  • 49 1
 Very cool, ignore the haters! It takes guts to stand out. Keep innovating!
  • 28 7
 It takes guts to sell a 37lbs enduro bike in 2020
  • 50 0
 @radrider: I’m just pointing out the fact that most people never make anything of their own and it sucks how the comments section is so keen to drag any flaw through the mud.

Anyone who makes their own stuff is already acutely aware of the flaws, and could probably point out many things they’d change on the next version. Product development is a process.

The world has too few makers and too many critics IMO.
  • 1 0
 @peterdavidhaile: I love the artistic aspect of bike design and especially the balance of aesthetic with functionality. But as beautiful as this frame and as intricate as the manufacturing process may be, I think leaving the weight variable unaddressed makes this feel like an unfinished idea or just a prototype to draw attention or be pretty. If there was a benefit that was responsible for the extra weight I'd be interested about that.
  • 1 0
 Especially when they’re asking 5000 euros for a frame @radrider:
  • 39 1
 This is an exercise in how good we have it and yet constantly complain. This thing is amazing looking at looks like it would be light as a feather and still weighs 37 pounds! 33lb aluminum bikes that will put up with our constant crashing and poor line choices are engineering marvels.
  • 3 0
 I mean yeah, although to put it more simply, "closed profile" shapes (like tubes) might not be that much better than this in bending, but they are WAY better in torsion. Take a pvc pipe, and cut a slit in it, see how stiff it is torsionally. That said, if that bike rides well, who cares! Nowdays most ppl buy not what is better, but what they like the look of.
  • 23 1
 This is extremely cool. I love seeing some out of the box thinking, especially in manufacturing and materials. I particularly like the look of the CS and SS!
  • 8 0
 This design is pretty unique. Knowing very little about structural strength of various alloys, I wonder if it’s possibly to refine it down to “normal” or so bike weight and maintain the overall look.
  • 12 0
 That is where It’s going to become hard to beat a tube structure.
  • 1 0
 @hllclmbr: Completely agree. I may be nuts, but would machining the two left and right halves, then welding them together, be something worth exploring? I know with this particular type of alloy, 7075, cannot be welded. Just curious if a different approach combining machining and welding could yield some positive results.
  • 5 0
 @pcledrew: That’s exactly how Pole build their bikes, and except for their bonding issues it seems to work well for them. Reeb does it with some of their pieces to assemble an otherwise traditional frame, and I believe GG did too before they went carbon. Foes also pioneered hydroformed monocoque construction back in the 90s that uses two flat sheets, formed under pressure into halves and welded together down the center. Before carbon everybody was doing it, and it’s a great solution to making complex shapes cheaply and with minimal waste. CNC machining is cool, and billet parts have their application in cycling, but hydroforming just can’t be beat for this type of thing
  • 2 0
 @pcledrew: You literally just described Pole's manufacturing technique for their machine bike. It's still pretty heavy but ~32 lbs instead of 37.
  • 3 0
 Precisely. This was a engineering failure. He had this special metal that's stronger and requires this time-consuming method of construction, but while submitting to the disadvantages, he was unable to use the advantages to his benefit. There's still many hundreds of grams of unnecessary metal in there that he was unable to identify and eliminate. He used a method of construction that allowed great freedom in the form, but was unable to take advantage of that.
  • 5 0
 @pcledrew: Waiting for the industry to jump on this train...7075 CAN be welded.
newatlas.com/welding-aa7075-aluminum-alloy/58449
That article came out last year and really could be a game changer in the bike industry but I haven't heard much about it since...hopefully companies are exploring.
  • 1 0
 @krashDH85: Thats pretty interesting. welds that are at least 2x as strong, possibly stronger. I'm assuming that means that, with the stronger lighter alloy, an alloy bike welded with this method could potentially narrow the gap between alloy / carbon frame weights?
  • 2 0
 @tgent: I want my patent money, or whatever.
  • 2 0
 @pcledrew: Yes. The densities of the 2 are almost equal, yet the yield strength of 7075 is almost double. That can also increase with post weld processes. I think it could easily close the gap, most carbon frames already aren't that much lighter than their aluminum counterparts. I think tube design would come into play much more in this scenario, especially formed tubes. Thickness variations in the same tube, shape changes, etc. It could all be fine tuned in using FEA to really keep the weight down. Would you be removing "half" the material...likely not. Personally, I'm a fan of 7000-series aluminum. As well as threaded bottom brackets.
  • 1 0
 @krashDH85: man it really sounds like you’ve thought this out. I hope it happens for real. I’ve been eyeing a few different alloy frames for a build, but next year most likely.

Maybe by then we’ll start seeing some alloy frames available in this 7075? Hopefully. Likely not. But I’m hoping still.
  • 2 0
 @krashDH85: this is awesome info! I would jump on this asap if I made bike frames.

(For the rest of the day I will regret my choice of careers and wish I built bikes for a living...or boats, or cars, or surf boards, or skate boards)
  • 7 0
 It think looks cool. Especially the side profile view. Can they melt the shavings and recast new aluminium slabs from the waste of cutting all the smaller pockets and features?
  • 4 0
 Aluminum is infinitely recyclable, so in a roundabout way, yeah.
  • 4 0
 @clintdricklamar: recycling aluminum uses only 5% of the energy it would take to mine raw ore.
  • 10 16
flag LeDuke (Jul 7, 2020 at 6:36) (Below Threshold)
 @clintdricklamar: A good portion of the waste will oxidize and be unrecoverable. Upwards of 50%. Something Pole and others don’t want to tell you.
  • 24 0
 @LeDuke: Your wrong, aluminum readily forms an oxide that forms a protective surface. This protective surface protects the bulk of the aluminum from oxidizing further. This results in most of the aluminum being recovered every time it goes to the recycling phase, in contrast to iron.

In the case of iron, oxidation, i.e., rust, does not protect iron from oxygen and water, and significant amounts of iron are not recyclable because the iron has been converted to rust.

source: www.e-education.psu.edu/matse81/node/2087 - PennState - college of earth and mineral sciences.
  • 3 0
 Yes, this is done most metal working industries that involve the removal of material. But, not matter how much material you recycle, it tends to involve higher costs and higher energy demands
  • 2 2
 @LeDuke: No reason for anyone to downvote you. Must have been a bitter Pole fan. Beer
  • 1 0
 @blowmyfuse: Follow the pole FB group, you will see so many issues in QC and poor PR you will never ever even think of buying one again.
  • 1 0
 @BoneDog: There have been 3 Pole frames I've seen on North Carolina soil. Each frame eventually touched that soil even though the wheels were upright. Big Grin
  • 4 0
 It's remarkable that people have the imagination for these things, but surely the percentage of wasted billet makes the manufacturing of this cost prohibitive? Either way, impressive. Visually it reminds me a bit of the Kirk Revolution from the early 90s.
  • 4 0
 Had a Kirk in the 90’s was a noodle, failed at the rear drop outs!
This did remind me of it but that was a zinc die cast material totally different to this!
  • 4 0
 @tokyo-bakka: Magnesium. Yes, totally different properties.
  • 4 0
 @Vindiu: I really should have put "visually" in bold Wink
  • 1 0
 That's why it's 5k euro a frame.
  • 8 0
 This design concept is full of holes.
  • 8 0
 Art on wheels!
  • 5 0
 That head tube and seat tube look pretty solid. They should mill some holes through those too.
  • 3 0
 "It may sound like this leaves a lot of waste but the off cut material then gets used for other parts."

They start with a 70 kg piece of metal and end up with an 16.8 kg bike. it's still pretty f*cking wasteful.
  • 2 0
 Wouldn't the remaining bits just get recycled though?
  • 4 0
 @fullendurbro: In theory, yes. But I'm not sure it can easily be reforged back into pieces of 7075, more likely it will get recycled down to a lesser grade for beer cans or something because that's a lot easier. Not saying that's a bad thing, it just is what it is. Regardless of how it's recycled, removing over 70% of your starting material is a horrifically inefficient machining process.
  • 2 0
 @CUwallaby: Ah good call, you're probably right.
  • 3 1
 @CUwallaby: Way over 70%. More like 92% of material removed.
  • 1 0
 A huge chunk (middle of front triangle) is still left as a whole piece other items can be milled out of. The brace in front of the seat tube is bolted on, so the hole in the front triangle is pretty big. Make a lot of pedals or small car parts etc out of that chunk.
  • 2 0
 Pretty cool concept and the look is awesome, but it doesn’t appear to be very stiff. The cutouts basically crest two very small beams a fair distance apart, which will work independently and not together as one beam. All that shear load is going through a pretty small area so I’m sceptical as to how it will hold up, especially those seat stays...
  • 3 0
 This is perfect! I've always loved the weight, the cost, and the funny looks of ebikes but I hate that they provide assistance. Now I can have all the things I love without that pesky motor.
  • 3 0
 why is the weight so high, is it the 7075 that is inherently more heavy than other aluminium alloys or is it just the design?
  • 4 1
 All alloys weight nearly the same. 7075 has one of the highest strength to weight ratios . So it must be the design
  • 10 0
 While it is frankly artwork, the design is definitely not weight optimized. Hollow tubes are unbeatable in the stiffness to weight ratio department, going with the trestle design as shown here is going to result in significantly more weight to get the same stiffness.
  • 2 0
 It’s mainly because it’s not made from a tube structure, which it’s hard to beat in both strength and stiffness to weight. He could probably do a some refinement and destructive testing and pull a pound or two off of there, but I think that’s probably a 13 or14 pound frame, for 5K.
  • 1 0
 I think it looks really cool. I've seen video on optimizing 3D printing where material is stripped away where it's not needed according to stresses etc. It would be interesting to see how a bike frame designed like that would look.
  • 3 0
 7075 is no stiffer (modulus of elasticity) than any other aluminum alloy. It is one of the strongest (tensile strength) aluminum alloy. Stiffness is not strength.
  • 2 0
 Tough crowd here. People expect perfection on round 1. I'm all for people exploring new technologies and methods. We can't expect v1 to beat tecchnilogy that's been slowly refined for 100 years.
  • 1 2
 This isn't a new technology or method. NC machining has been around for decades. The material was developed in the 1940s. Its just, like most of these german bike makers, they like to think that people will be amazed by using impractical techniques at hugely inflated costs. And this isn't version 1 - its number 5.
  • 1 0
 Wow, with that kind of weight on the frame itself, why not mill out the BB section to accept a pedal assist motor to make it into an e-mtb? No wonder all the other companies use aluminum tubings rather than just one hunk of aluminum block for strength and weight savings, including costs.
  • 1 0
 I'm curious where these quite unique bike companies get all the money to fund startup costs. It takes a lot of risk, money, testing, engineering, etc to even get to a stage where a production model can be made. They must be sole proprietor machine shops with engineers that have side businesses as well.
  • 1 0
 crystal bezels in a hole or two to blind any challengers on a sunny day"

lava lamp in some holes if you live in oregon"

plumb-bob in one to see your ascent angle?

For PNW's....hang salmon and park near a smokey fire...yum!
  • 5 1
 It will never sell.. No bottle cage mounts
  • 7 1
 I’m sure they can find 30 people a year with “F*** off” money that also own hydration packs.
  • 4 0
 I want to say why, but instead I say wow.
  • 3 0
 They'd better have the quality sorted or the English speaking world will instantly move a couple of those letter around.
  • 5 1
 I’ll just be milling around the comments section.
  • 1 0
 I appreciate you, sir.
  • 3 0
 I kinda like it. Someone's thinking outside the box. In fact, it looks like they're looking through it.
  • 1 0
 Tired of getting sticks and twigs stuck in your spokes. How bout you try getting trail debris caught in your entire bike. For a slight upcharge, we'll even stick some bar ends on there for ya.
  • 1 0
 a step backwards cnc machines are not new, building heavy metal bikes in 2020 without a gearbox or any evolution to the sport... is a waste of machine energy to produce the bikes
  • 1 1
 f*ck, are you guys all new? Kirk precision did this style in the 80s. It was magnesium and a complete fail. In the case of this thing its funny how different mass production and the mass market are compared to a couple of prototypes in lab and a few test riders.

Snap, krackle pop are the sounds this thing will make. And yes, wasteful manufacturing is a big deal, the practicality of this ridiculous looking think in the real world without even being a better mouse trap. Guess they had to do something to keep busy during lock up. Probably takes about 2 weeks to machine this fiasco. Should put a cermic speed drive train on it because trade show booth eye candy are all they are good for.
  • 3 0
 The Kirk was cast magnesium (and terrible). This is milled aluminium. Only comparable visually, really.
  • 1 1
 @tobiusmaximum: as I noted. It was a design and material failure just like this frame. Sharp corners, stress risers every where, this frame will fail in the real world out side the lab if it ever gets there.
  • 1 1
 What a piece of crap.

This is no more innovative or clever than those dudes who make frames out of bamboo. Why does a bike deserve props just because it looks different than the norm? If Trek had come out with a nearly 40lb enduro bike that didn't ride any better (maybe even worse) than what was already available then we'd all be slagging it off.

Hope could have built this (and they sort of did but only as a show bike) in the mid 90's but probably didn't because it isn't very good. In the UK in the late 80's early 90's we had Kirk Precision making frames with a similar aesthetic but from cast magnesium which is far more innovative than this. Empire bikes also had a similar aesthetic (I know it was welded cast and drawn pieces but it had the same look) but they are no more as it didn't offer any advantages over what was already available.

If the bike was just an experiment to see if a frame can be produced with just a CNC machine and no welding then it was a success. This though is a product for sale that apparently offers no advantages over what is already available and is really heavy and expensive and thus should be treated with disdain like all other rubbish 'innovations'.
  • 1 0
 It's a work or art. International Space Station truss segments were fabricated in the same way. It sounded wasteful to me when I first got there on that project, but then I learned that it was better in many ways.
  • 3 0
 at least you got about a million storage spaces
  • 9 1
 But no water bottle holder Frown
  • 4 0
 @vp27: Sponge holders.
  • 2 0
 Looks super cool, but sure must be a better way?
How much does a 70kg bit of 7075 cost to start with?
  • 2 0
 Based on pricing online I would think around 300 euros.
  • 1 0
 This isn't a matter of cost-effectiveness, as the frames are selling for $5000 each. This is a matter of whether it can be done, and whether it is ridable. You can get 7075 for around $50 per 20 lbs (~9.07 kg) block. Though I could imagine you could keep the millings, melt them down into another block, and use them for something else.
  • 3 0
 Jonathan Davis wants his mic stand back.
  • 1 0
 hahahaha! Omg this!
  • 2 0
 Seems like a missed opportunity to design something that looks as good as the engineering behind it.
  • 3 1
 Gets bike, rides bike, starts trying to figure out where the creaking noise is coming from...
  • 2 3
 Ought to be the stupidest bike I have ever seen: 70 Kg of aluminum to build a MTB that weights half of that and as much as an e-bike. kind of ridiculous ...

... and I love the usual deference of Pinkbike to the products they advertise. Commenting on the 70 kg: "It may sound like this leaves a lot of waste but the off cut material then gets used for other parts". Really? What other parts exactly?
  • 2 0
 So tactical looking. I feel as though it should have some guns mounted to it.
  • 1 0
 I had made the crank a truss structure, more vulnerable to torsion than the hollow structure, and less nasal strength............but try
  • 1 0
 WHOA --- don't know how well it'll hold but, damn --- that's one of the coolest looking frames I have ever seen--- swwwwwweeeeeeeT!!!
  • 1 0
 Well it's not the Grim Doughnut but I'll let you off this time. Just image that thing on a wet day. Triple its weight by the end of it.
  • 2 0
 Kinda hard to believe it’s 37lbs. It looks like at least 4lbs....
  • 5 0
 Correct! It is exactly at least 4lbs!
  • 2 0
 That internal cable routing is clean.
  • 2 0
 Where do the stickers go?
  • 1 0
 I see... that was a very big problem...hahaha
  • 1 0
 I feel like the only people who would like the looks of this bike enough to buy one have their own CNC mill.
  • 3 0
 Huck to flat
  • 1 0
 All that machine work to still be heavier than a carbon bike doesn’t seem to make much sense to me
  • 2 0
 How many weight weenies just suffered cardiac arrest?
  • 2 0
 This would be the hardest bike to wash after a muddy ride.
  • 2 4
 Dig stuff out the ground, ship it across the world, process it into metal, ship it across the world, cut it into a 70kg chunk, mill more than 90% of it away and chuck it in the bin, use your 10% to go and have a look at nature....
  • 1 0
 Maybe this what bikes will be looking like when 3D printing gets more developped..........
  • 2 0
 Good luck cleaning this bike. Wink
  • 1 0
 While I truly appreciate the level of machining greatness going on here... I just can't get with this thing.
  • 1 0
 I like it. But if you tied a string on it, it could pass for a compound bow from like 2002
  • 2 0
 Looking forward to the Invisi-frame kit for this one
  • 1 0
 Wrong wheelsize, super heavy, extremely expensive, conservative geometry.

But at least it looks cool I guess?
  • 1 0
 I would love to own this frame. If I had the spare cash I'd rock it for sure!
  • 1 0
 Gives a new meaning to the stealth look... Ladies and gentlemen, the world's first invisible bike!
  • 1 0
 If this was made by Guerrilla Gravity, it would definitely be called Black Hole Sun......
  • 1 0
 It's a nice art project but who on God's green earth would buy one of these?!
  • 1 0
 This is so awesome. I wish I had a 5 axis mill I could use to profile out a bike frame!
  • 1 1
 i actually think this looks really cool, but the seat tube looks like it came off a walmart bike with the cable sticking out
  • 1 0
 I very much like seeing the rear tire through the chainstay.
  • 1 0
 Need to see the bottom out test
  • 1 2
 Ask my latest chick. She'll tell you I passed.
  • 1 0
 Badass! I wish I had that kind of time on my hands.
  • 3 2
 still looks like a session
  • 1 0
 Good for windy situations...
  • 1 0
 Nobody's complaining about the pics taken on railroad tracks?
  • 2 0
 That looks beautiful
  • 2 0
 That thing is Sick!
  • 3 1
 looks shit
  • 4 3
 Im all for new ideas and all. But its 37lbs. Thats just purely rediculous.
  • 1 0
 Weight: 16.8kg (37lb)

it's enogh to know for me.
heavier than my DH bike
  • 2 0
 Your move, Pole.
  • 1 0
 Iwanow how this thing rides.
  • 1 0
 Seems a very wasteful way to make a frame...
  • 2 1
 Frace.....more like FARCE, amirite ladies?!
  • 1 0
 Doesn't look anything like a Session.
  • 1 0
 That won't accumulate any mud at all.
  • 1 0
 Looks like a "gruyère" (French and Swiss cheese with holes).
  • 1 0
 Removed that much material and still weighs 37 pound. Ick
  • 2 0
 NOPE!
  • 1 0
 It's the bike I doodled in the margins of my grade 6 math book!
  • 1 0
 Practical? Not even a little bit. Awesome? Yes.
  • 2 1
 I'd rather have the 70kg slab of aluminum.
  • 1 0
 All other parts look gross now!
  • 1 0
 I predict a cracked frame
  • 1 0
 I dunno, I think its rad.
  • 1 0
 Why didn't he Kashima coat the frame?
  • 1 0
 Great use us negative space. Speedholes for 2022
  • 1 0
 Traditional head and seat tube. I do not agree to such compromises Razz
  • 1 0
 Magic Mary too heavy for the front?
  • 1 0
 It'd be an absolute pig to clean but looks awesome
  • 1 0
 36 miniature custom frame bags on order.
  • 1 0
 I think it looks AWESOME! Sadly just too heavy...
  • 1 0
 Hasn't this been done in some way before? Someone edjumcait me.
  • 1 0
 That frame scares me. Looks kinda flexy.
  • 1 0
 37lbs!!! where is the motor hidden?
  • 1 0
 Looks like Knee and shin pads would be compulsory riding this thing
  • 1 0
 This exist already from a Swiss guy called Ribisu
www.ribisu.ch
  • 1 0
 I have feelings about the suspension design.
  • 1 0
 If the terminator was a mountain bike, this would be it.
  • 3 2
 yyyyyyyy tho
  • 1 0
 Invisi-bike!
  • 1 0
 That is cool.
  • 1 0
 :-)
  • 1 0
 but why
  • 1 0
 Sick machining!
  • 4 4
 Looks like a Session
  • 1 1
 I like it
  • 1 1
 What’s a grim donut?

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