Back in 2004, Iron Horse debuted the iconic Sunday downhill bike that used Dave Weagle's DW-Link suspension design, which was a departure from the previous Horst-Link SGS model. Made popular during Sam Hill's era of dominance,
Hill and the Sunday were an iconic duo with their flashes of magnificence on two wheels and metallic green paint.
Much like the Intense M1 before the turn of the century, the Sunday became a common sight among privateers World Cup racers due to its proven capabilities.
Iron Horse dissolved as a high-end mountain bike company in 2009, but the Sunday made such an impact on the downhill race scene around the world that privateers and bike park regulars quickly bought up spare parts stock. Pivot Cycles' original Phoenix downhill frame was chirped by riders for taking some inspiration from the Sunday and trying to reincarnate original Iron Horse fans. One composite company, Zelvy, even made plans to manufacture a carbon front triangle to mate with the hardware and rear triangle of the existing Sundays, but the product changed form to become an entirely new frame,
the Preston.
With all of the mystique surrounding downhill legend, Sam Hill, and the extinction of Iron Horse, it's no surprise that we still talk about those racing feats today or that riders wish for a Sunday with updated geometry.
Iron Horse Sunday Rebuild Details
Wheelsize: 29" front / 27.5" rear
Reach: 470 mm
Chainstay: 460 mm
Front Center: 840 mm
Wheelbase: 1300 mm
FC/RC Ratio: ~ 1.83
BB Height: 340 mm
Head angle: ~ 62.5 degrees
Fork Offset: 48 mm
Weight: 19 kg
Well, that's exactly the kind of project Austrian downhill racer and skilled machinist, Julian Neubauer, challenged himself to take on - an Iron Horse Sunday with modern angles and numbers. His goal was to arrive at a Sunday frame with his ideal geometry, but also meshed with a 29" front wheel and 27.5" rear. The process involved not only sourcing, chopping, and re-welding a frame more than a decade old, but also piecing together a suspension fork with equal complications. We got in touch with Julian to ask a few questions about what prompted him to try this, what challenges he ran into along the way, and what he plans to do with the revitalized bike.
Don't be being afraid to try.
Can you tell us a little about how you got into mountain bikes?
I started mountain biking around 2008, specifically downhill in 2009 after I was spectating at the World Cup final in Schladming. Little did I know I was going love it so much. Immediately after that race I got my first real mountain bike; a white Specialized Big Hit. A couple days after I got it I was riding in a bike park and had such a big crash. I wasn‘t allowed to ride for weeks after that, but things ramped up when I recovered. I was a pre-runner at the age of thirteen and raced my first Austrian National races in 2011.
What inspired you to buy an old frame, cut it up, and spend money on new tubing when there are plenty of great bikes out there these days?
I always loved the look of the Iron Horse Sunday. I love the look of straight tubes and sharp angles. And clearly because Sam Hill absolutely destroyed every track with those bikes. There is just something about railing an open turn, foot-out, flat-out. And since those bikes are not made anymore, I wanted to give an old bike a new life. Over the years of riding I noticed what characteristics I liked and I didn’t like.
Fast forward to 2020 and COVID... I was searching eBay when I stumbled upon an Iron Horse Sunday frame which had an "ok" price tag. I had some spare money and thought, why not? I realized you don’t have to have the newest parts and bikes to have fun. It’s about the feeling and passion. I started by buying this whole frame from someone in Germany. It had spare linkages, derailleur hangers and everything you need to build up a new Sunday. When I got it, I was super stoked and could not believe what I had.
During the pre-weld process I stumbled upon a single front triangle. It was quite cheap and I thought, before I cut the only frame I have into small pieces it would be smart to try some ideas first. This was our first try for me and also for my welder. And actually buying an old frame is like around €300-400 and the tubing wasn’t that expensive too so why not? I am really lucky to have friends that can weld aluminium and only want a pack of beer as payment haha. So I got a custom made frame for much less than a new frame from any bike company.
What parts did you need to modify for re-use from the original frame?
I took an old Iron Horse Sunday frame and cut out everything I needed. This included the head tube, seat tube, plus the CNC part connection to BB and the gusset from seat tube to top tube for the front triangle.
For the rear triangle I used the old dropouts and the bearing mounts. Then I ordered some tubes for the main frame and rear triangle to be able to accommodate a 27.5” rear wheel. This was the most difficult part for me. In Austria it is not common to use these alloys like 7020, 7005, 6061 or 6069. But I found a company in Germany who sold me a couple of tubes for both the front and rear triangle. I also changed the geometry of the front triangle while I was at it. It’s like a XL Sunday if you want.
Are you a welder or machinist by trade?
I completed a technical trade with all sorts of machining operations, but it’s not my profession. Maybe I should start thinking about becoming one! After that I studied sports equipment technology in Vienna. I think it’s quite fun to explore and tinker with geometry, materials, and so on. Some of my friends are welders and machinists, which I am super grateful for. They helped me create this piece of art into a reality.
Were there any issues with the triangles twisting in the jig?
I did not notice any distortion. We only spot welded the frame in the jig. The big welds were made with the frame not being in the jig. I think it’s similar to how frames are welded in factories. This was already the second prototype. The first one we kind of pushed it against the wall because we had no frame jig. The geo was really weird, but rode alright. The BB was too high and the head tube angle too steep. But we solved everything with the new frame.
Would have been easier to build something from scratch from steel or aluminum?
I would say no. The main reason for me to use a donor frame was because I wanted to create a “new/modern” Sunday. If I had to machine all of the parts myself then it would have been much more expensive. But there are some companies that already offer dropouts, tubes and what not if you want to build your own bike. However, those parts may not have been suitable for downhill use.
For the fork, you machined your own crowns and used Boxxer stanchions with 29" Lyrik lowers? What offset did that result in?
Yes. I stumbled upon a report about the “Rockshox Lyxxer”. There I read about the custom made Boxxer crowns. First, I thought I may be able to use the crowns from the new C1 Boxxer, but unfortunately, the spacing between the stanchions was too far apart. Then I started to measure all of the available RockShox stanchion spacings. They Lyrik spacing was in between the old and new Boxxer. I took all the necessary measurements and constructed them in Autodesk Inventor. A very good friend machined them for me out of 7075-T6 aluminium. The steerer tube is made from a different material, but I don’t remember exactly which one I ordered. I used the black stanchions from the B1-B2 Boxxer with 29 inch boost Lyrik/Yari lowers. I did not want anything crazy for the offset. I aimed for an offset of around 48 mm.
I take it you are a big Sam Hill fan then?
Big is an understatement hahaha. This dude is my biggest hero and I would love to have Sam Hill's and Brendan Fairclough's signature on this bike since they raced the silver green Monster Energy edition Sunday back in 2008.
Are you planning to ride this bike?
I am planning on doing everything I can with this bike. It is my absolute dream bike. I have a spare Kona Operator Carbon frame that I removed the paint from in my basement, but I am really excited to ride with this new Sunday until death sets us apart haha.
Where do you ride most of the time?
I try to ride many different downhill tracks, but I mostly ride in Schladming and Semmering. Semmering is around fifty minutes from where I currently live. Schladming one of my favorites, for obvious reasons. I would have done anything to race the Schladming 2007, 2008 or 2009 World Cups. That would have been my dream come true! Especially with my Sunday!
What races have you competed at in the past?
I mostly compete in Austrian National and European Cups. Occasionally, I try my luck at World Cups. My goal is to qualify for a World Cup with the Sunday I made.
You can tell that this shop has some stories to tell and is a fun place to hang out.
Julian would also like to add, "A big thank-you to my good friends, the welder and the machinist, who helped me create this wonderful machine. Also thanks to everyone involved in the process. This is a dream come true!“
thanks for all the love and feedback. recent years have been rough and these comments/bikes certainly brighten up my day. i can't wait to ride it.
thanks so much for this insanely awesome story article about the project
keep it up yall
pinkbike frontpage = one dream came true
Julian aka @westagil
May I ask why you didn’t use an off the shelf 29” boxxer?
i wanted to keep my tuned charger and the coil spring. the new boxxer does not come with coil springs (by now there is a coil conversion kit i believe). and after all it was cheaper to buy a lyrik lower leg and machine the crowns then to buy a new fork and coil kit and so on.
the process from cutting it up to finished frame only was a few weeks.
I appreciate your request but this is a one off project for myself. I also am not allowed to do things like this also because i don‘t own any rights for ironhorse or the dw-link patent.
At this point i still am waiting for Approval for the frame to be safe to ride. There won‘t be a kit for a diy or anything like it. Thanks for the interest tho
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That would be amazing to see the Sunday in a World Cup again, fantastic project that looks epic and up to date!
***Cackling intensifies*** Uses proceeds to build bike park with dedicated area suited to old skool geometry
I am the dude in the pics. thanks for all your responds!
i studied materials for about 8 years. i made one frame in beginning of 2021 which i rode over the course of 2021 and there were no issues in strength whatsoever. i even got more tired and felt more vibrations than when riding other bikes.
there is a artificial aging technique where you simply let it sit for 2-3 months in order for the material to rekristallize and get back to around 80% of its strength. since the old frame parts are made from a different alloy than the new tubes i got there is not a perfect solultion as for treatment. i talked to some people and some of them recommended a small heat treatment, but i am not 100% convinced. I am aware of what can happen and am really into servicing and maintaining a bike. i will check regularly for cracks or similar. i have trust in my welder.
cheers tho
well i did not say i was a expert. i am certainly noo expert but as i said i sudied material for some time now and have been in touch with some of austrias best material scientists, my welder also is one hell of a experienced guy. i wont say its not gonna break. but the frame we welded and rode last year held up very well.
i am already a reckless person so why not ride a reckless bike.
cheers
6061 should not have been difficult to find - it is a globally abundant aerospace aluminum - pretty much any other option (7000 series, 2000 series, or 6069) would be more exotic. Also, you should not be welding 7000 or 2000 series to the original 6000 series components, so I'm going to hope/assume that you used either 6061 or 6069. In that case, a T6 treatment is absolutely appropriate for both alloys, and necessary for this frame to function safely. Expect to have to do some cold re-alignment after the heat-treat, as it will warp. Good luck.
Good job on the welding fixtures though. that's cheap and functional!
i wanted to run the old boxxer things with a 29 inch front wheel. since there is a different thread in the new boxxer stanchions i couldn't you the coil kit and charger from the old boxxer in the new boxxer.
i tuned the charger with an andreani piston kit and was running a extra hard raceonly spring.
and since i wanted to recreate the old sam hill 2008 val di sole bike i wanted to give the forks a "blackbox" treatment
cheers
I remember really liking the wide-legged cowboy stance of the 100mm BB shell on the SGS. Having the derailleur way out there with the 165mm rear hub, on the other hand, was kind of a drag...
Shall we approach Dorel and see if we can go 50/50 on it?
m.pinkbike.com/u/Goose76/album/Mobile/?inList[]=21944686
Maybe you guys heat treated it and just didn't mention it? For something like this it is probably doable in a pizza oven since the bike breaks down into pretty small subassemblies
Gotta love these projects
www.mtb-news.de/news/bike-der-woche-ironhorse-sunday-275-replica-von-ibc-user-bigair92
Way more work went into this than my Resto-Mod 08 Turner DHR Mullet.
www.pinkbike.com/photo/21860165
thanks mate!
Now do a Giant ATX 1 DH, A GT Lobo and a Specialized Downhill Team!
(Even though metallurgically, this is a really bad idea and could produce a frame that's potentially unsafe to ride.)
I went to Leogang, Schladming and many other European places with my Sunday "Ultimate" 650B
I tried to destroy it but it is impossible
The frame after welding was heat treated(solution treatment and aging).
www.pinkbike.com/photo/21945695
Bike looks amazing, very impressed!
As for HA, some frames had 65 degrees, and i think there was a 2009 version that had a 65.5-66 degree HA, not sure why. Positive side of this is the headtube was 1.5 - ideal for extreme anglesets. I sold my Sunday with a -3 degrees custom angleset i rode for several years without issued and with great confidence and pleasure!
As an aside, I bet this will raise the value of my hardtail Iron Horse Warrior Comp I'm still riding from the $20 I bought the frame for to $30 or possibly even $35!
I wanted to add that this is a one off project for me and personal useage only. I am no expert on bike building, i simply want to try and create something unique. I don‘t know yet if i can ride this bike safely, i hope so but i am going to have another welded frame tested to be sure it holds up. I am not going to give out instructions on how to do it. And i am not going to build a bike for you. If u make your own you must be aware that it might not be safe to ride. It is your decision and your own responsibility. I do not take any credit for any crashes or technical failures whatsoever but i think this is clear.
Thanks again for all you support and feedback. It has been an unreal 24h.
yes, its me haha @westagil
just hit me up
www.vitalmtb.com/features/The-Sunday-Shreds-Again-A-Legend-Reborn,2240
A torch will just ruin it (more).
Was that what you wanted or just a design necessity to fit a 27.5" wheel into the rear triangle?
Be safe be well,
Incognito Robin
So about those concussion protocols
Nope.
IH went bankrupt and was bought by Dorel, i think it was called - who transformed it into a supermarket brand...
I did them myself
U need them?