Field Test: Transition Patrol Carbon - The Party Machine

Aug 31, 2022 at 14:24
by Matt Beer  


PINKBIKE FIELD TEST

Transition Patrol Carbon



Words by Matt Beer; photography by Dave Trumpore


When Transition dropped their 2021 Patrol, it only appeared in aluminum and sat in between two other carbon models - the boundary-pushing 170mm Spire and 150mm Sentinel. The alloy Patrol targeted riders who wanted a faster handling bike than the Spire, but more muscle than the Sentinel, however the frame weighed a beastly 4.63 kg (with a shock). That made me think there must be a carbon version on the way to trim some fat, at an added expense of course.

Retaining all of the same geometry and travel as the alloy Patrol, the carbon version drops 1.3 kg off of the frame weight and arrives in two new frame colors: a monochromatic “Moon Shadow” matte grey or red hot finish.

Patrol Carbon Details

• Travel: 160mm rear / 160mm fork
• Carbon frame
• Wheel size: Mixed
• 63.0º - 63.5º head angle
• 77.6º - 78.1º seat tube angle
• 442 / 440mm chainstays
• Sizes: S, M, L (tested), XL
• Weight: 15.2 kg / 33.6 lb
• Price: $6,699 as tested
transitionbikes.com
Like two other bikes in this Field Test, the Patrol is also dedicated to a 27.5” rear wheel, although the chainstays come in two lengths, depending on what half of the sizing chart you stand on. That slots the mid-travel enduro-ish model between two other popular bikes in Transition's line up; the 170mm Spire, which pushes the boundaries in terms of long and low, pedal-worthy geometry, and the more contemporary 140mm travel Sentinel.

Transition distinguishes their frame angles and lengths as Speed Balanced Geometry - they were one of the first to figure out that short offset forks work best with 29" wheels and slack head angles. The Patrol comes set up with 160mm of travel front and rear, but can be bumped up 10mm at either end by swapping suspension stroke lengths. Sliding a 170mm fork on there will rake out the already slack 63/63.5º head angle even further.

Transition Patrol Carbon - Bellingham Field Test Photo Dave Trumpore

When scoping out the sizing, you'll notice that the Patrol isn't available in the gargantuan XXL serving, like the other two previously mentioned bikes. That's because most riders above the 195cm range most likely want the extra stability that a 29" rear wheel offers and that's not something that the Patrol can accommodate anyways. Following a common and sensible trend, the chainstays do vary depending on the frame size; 434 for the small and medium, 440mm on the large and extra large.

External brake routing fans will be enthused to see that this line runs outside of the downtube while the rest of the lines are fully guided through the frame tubes. Other frame features include a Universal Derailleur Hanger and a top tube accessory mount, plus a straight 56mm head tube allows for all the geometry adjustments with reach adjusting headsets. I also appreciated that Transition spec'd a chainguide with a skid plate right from the get-go.

At the time of the test, Transition hadn't fully secured the component specifications but it turns out that the $6,699 USD GX build kit now listed is exactly what we rode, barring the OneUp carbon handlebar. Other than that, you'll have to decide between custom building a carbon frame, which starts at $3,699 and comes with a Fox Float X2, or resorting to the alloy options. The build was well chosen without going overboard on electronic components or exuberant amounts of carbon to satisfy our riding requirements. It turns out that high-performance brakes and suspension are the most important parts to bolt to your bike. TRP's DH-Evo brakes quickly became a group favorite and the Fox 38 Grip2/Float X combo, sans Kashima, worked flawlessly as we've come to expect.



Transition Patrol Carbon - Bellingham Field Test Photo Dave Trumpore
Transition Patrol Carbon - Bellingham Field Test Photo Dave Trumpore

Climbing

Only a 160mm fork sounds like we might spend too much time on long travel bikes, but in comparison to the other enduro bikes in the Field Test, the Patrol does get a leg up because there is less squish. However, the 63.5-degree head tube angle did have other things to say while getting up there.

Flop is a loose term that comes up when talking about how easily the front wheel tips side to side. That effect is pronounced when a slack bike is pointed uphill due to the increased sag on the rear shock. I wouldn’t call it a problem, but it climbed similarly to the Commencal Meta SX. Turning through switchbacks requires extra attention so the front wheel doesn’t climb the banks of 180-degree turns.

Like the Meta SX though, the slack head angle is rescued by a steep seat angle and fairly long chainstays that keep the rider’s center of gravity still and central on the bike. The focus while navigating lies more in steering rather than sliding around the saddle to find traction.

Even with the climb switch on, the Patrol didn’t have the firmest platform when stomping on the pedals and getting out of the saddle. Fox’s Float X is a superb shock and maybe the Patrol had less anti-squat than I anticipated, but the cheater switch, as Mike Levy calls it, had a softer threshold than usual. Over small bumps though, it was actually relieving and offered more traction. If the shock only has a two-position climb switch, I’d prefer that softer threshold rather than one that mimics a hardtail.

Transition Patrol Carbon - Bellingham Field Test Photo Dave Trumpore

Transition Patrol Carbon - Bellingham Field Test Photo Dave Trumpore
Transition Patrol Carbon - Bellingham Field Test Photo Dave Trumpore

Descending

Considering the trails around Bellingham are fast, steep, and filled with tons of jumps, I wanted to grab the Patrol every day. Why? Well, it’s a close contender for what I’d look for in a long travel enduro bike that doesn’t get pigeonholed into any extreme characteristics. Suspension, geometry, and weight equate to a package that is happier to play versus race.

Transition have fine tuned the tried and true Horst link suspension layout over time on their bikes using varying travel brackets. There’s no quirks with the Patrol’s suspension dynamics. There isn't the bump erasing quality of a high pivot machine, but getting acquainted with this bike took less time than the Contra or even the Megatower. Transition has built in a moderate amount of progression that can accept a coil or air shock, too, so the 160mm of travel handled a few hucks without touching the bottom of the pool.

Timed Testing


Our timed test track started off on a flatter grade with compressions to pump through and gain speed, but also some wet rocks and roots to keep you on your toes. Further down, the speed picked up with heavy, abrupt G-outs and high-speed, low-angle berms. Overall, this would be an excellent short, sprint-style enduro stage and would push the upper and lower limits of a long-travel race bike.

Putting some numbers on the board is one way to relate how fast you can comfortably ride with the same perceived effort.

Matt Beer: "The Patrol is one of those bikes that makes you think you're going faster than you are. Picking up speed comes quickly and naturally, but staying composed on rough, high speed straight aways and settling into choppy corners required more focus. In fact, the slack geometry can get you into trouble if you start to out run the 160 of travel. It's a blast to ride, but I wasn't surprised to see the Patrol rank with the slowest lap time - maybe I was just having too much fun though."

Geometry-wise, the head angle is aggressive, but not out in left field. The slacker 63-degree might let speeds run beyond what the 160mm fork can handle, although you can boost the fork and rear shock to provide 170mm of travel. I’d love to spend more time on the Patrol and tinker with these options because the blend between fun and fast is ever so close to being perfect.

The combo of a slim frame and small rear wheel let you toss the bike around with ease. Where other bikes, like the Contra or Commencal required more effort to get off the ground, the Patrol didn’t get bogged down while pumping trail features to pick up speed or sail over gaps. Although, there's a certain stature about the Patrol that reminds me of the Commencal Meta SX on the descents too, albeit, lighter and shorter. There’s plenty of front wheel ahead of you to push that front axle through braking bumps without feeling like it will tuck underneath you in corners.

Does that make it a suitable enduro race bike? Well, it does lose some muscle in rough, straight lines due to the decrease in travel and it’s not quite as stiff of a package as the Megatower, which could be a pro or con, depending on how “al dente” you like your ride. Where the Patrol Carbon really shines is in soft but steep terrain with plenty of berms to smash and jumps to blast - have you seen the product launch video? This bike has Bellingham written all over it.

Transition Patrol Carbon - Bellingham Field Test Photo Dave Trumpore


Pros

+ Slack head angle and mixed wheels let you dive into steep corners
+ The perfect Bellingham bike - light for pedaling long days filled with all the jumps and berms
+ Great value: the build kit delivers performance on critical components

Cons

- Geometry can outrun the capabilities of the 160mm fork
- Finding the balance on the rear shock between supple and supportive is a narrow window






The 2022 Enduro Bike Field Test is presented by Rapha, POC, and Continental. Thanks for keeping us dressed, safe, and rolling rubber side down.





341 Comments

  • 170 9
 So, reasonable price, reasonable weight, fun all around. I now call this the winner!
  • 72 2
 Also good-looking and accommodates a water bottle.
  • 53 8
 @Lanebobane: Needs a slacker shock.
  • 153 10
 How the hell did 6700 USD become reasonable for a bicycle?
  • 23 123
flag Muscovir (Sep 1, 2022 at 11:44) (Below Threshold)
 The Patrol is actually terrible value. A Canyon Torque Mullet CF 8 with better specs is almost 2.000€ less expensive (-$1.300 if you're in the US).

Also, any bike that is available as mullet-only should automatically be disqualified. There is literally no good reason to not let the riders choose the wheelsize they want. There's enough manufacturers that manage to make their bikes either compatible with both wheel sizes or have dedicated versions of the same model. And so should Transition. It's 2022, this should be a given.
  • 50 84
flag jrocksdh (Sep 1, 2022 at 12:26) (Below Threshold)
 @rideordie35: govts introduced trillions of $ into the economy...it hasnt been wiped off yet. Expect more pain.
  • 49 1
 @Muscovir: just buy your canyon torque and move on. Not everything has to suit everyone, and as such, not all bikes have to be the same.
  • 73 33
 @jrocksdh: Plz go find a suitable circle jerk on Reddit. Thank you

-Everyone
  • 42 43
 @bocomtb: What he said is simple fact. No need to get tribal
  • 14 3
 @Muscovir: local support of bike is a huge deal and from my experience Transition is really really good.....they even offer warranty for second buyer (or at least did)!
  • 8 0
 "Just invent a 28.25" tube in case of and you'll make this mullet a winner".
M. Beer
  • 18 9
 @Muscovir: that's because it's a canyon and you're gonna snap that twig in a couple months anyways. You get what you pay for...
  • 12 0
 @danstonQ: Specialized already did. Their "mtn mullet" tube is around 28" in order to fit either wheel size pretty good
  • 16 0
 Interesting that Transition claim the XT Alloy build to be 34.6 pounds. With the carbon frame claimed to be 2.8 lbs lighter than the alloy, that would put a carbon XT build around 31.8 lbs. That's either really impressive or something aint quite right
  • 12 2
 @Muscovir: Considering that this is what a lot of their customers were already doing to their own Patrols I consider this Transition being a good listener/observer and giving the folks what they want. As one who loved his Patrol then mulleted it and loved it more, for me this is spot on. So, yeah, go buy your Torgue, I'm sticking with the boys up in Bellingham.
  • 9 0
 @peterman1234: my carbon Spire GX build, medium, on the scale is 31.3 lbs.
With WAO wheels, and full fat CushCore, pedals, tool, pump, water bottle, 32.7 lbs, ready to ride
  • 4 1
 @peterman1234:

Seems high. I have a 2022 Sentinel carbon and it’s 31.5 with pedals. Just needs a slightly longer reach (size L)…
  • 7 1
 @rideordie35: It’s called inflation. And it’s actually pretty low for bikes, seeing that some rim-braked, welded hardtails 30 years ago could have catalog prices of 3.000 $.

I never get, how people can complain about the price of every single component or bike on here, while all the cars I see in the streets nowadays seem to be $60.000 SUVs. How is that normal, while one tenth of that for a bike is outrageous?
  • 1 0
 @onawalk: that’s impressive. I’d be interested in your full build list
  • 1 0
 @Woody25: pretty stock,
Except for the wheels, and tires
  • 2 3
 @Bobtheguy: The track record I've seen on Transition, in terms of cracked carbon frames, is far from perfect. Mine just cracked for the 2nd time in 6 months, once in the most nonsensical place. Bummer, its a fun bike.
  • 4 0
 @onawalk: man, either you or I (or both) have inaccurate scales, cause my XXL alloy GX spire is 38.5 lbs with tannus inserts from and rear WITHOUT tool, pump, and bottle (I hope you meant empty). Wr1 wheels, frame size, frame material definitely can't explain that discrepancy. Just looking at their listed weights without pedals or any of the extras you listed, I think your scale might be the erroneous one...
  • 3 0
 @Gristle: I’m with you man. No way that dudes bike is weighing in at 32 lbs. Especially if you have chunky Cush cores in there. I have a super light scout built up and it barely weighs in at 31
  • 1 0
 @Bm1117: basically what I get from it is Transition's claimed weight for the alloy XT build (on their website) is a bit off. Especially where the weight on this article (as tested) says 33.6
  • 1 0
 @Gristle: double checked it with 6 different dumbbell weights, all within .3 of claimed weight.
My V1 alloy Sentinel, with GX build, Lyrik, and all the above mentioned stuff, was 38.something lbs
I was shocked at the Spire weight, it’s surprisingly light.
  • 1 0
 @onawalk: f*ck man. That’s very impressive. I have a lyrik and all x01 drivetrain with nobls and no Cush cores and I’m at 31. These new bikes are crazy man…
  • 3 0
 “Reasonable”
  • 3 3
 @jrocksdh: they hated him because he told the truth...
  • 1 0
 @jeremy3220: I think the shock gives it a nice squared-off look
  • 1 0
 @peterman1234: 33.02lbs, weighed again last night, with full water bottle, and Switchgrade installed, wasn’t installed previously.
Not trying to flex about the weight, just stating what it is.
Never been concerned about weight, as my V1 Sentinel was 38 and change.
You’re welcome to believe or not, thankfully doesn’t really change the outcome
  • 1 0
 @onawalk: you should tell transition they're wrong about their own frame weights by about 2 pounds then.
I do believe you aren't lying about what your scale says. Just incredibly hard to believe it's accurate given all the weights that we know to be true and your detailed list of add-ons.
  • 2 0
 @Gristle: not sure what to tell you,
I went a weighed several dumbbells, are all were within ounces of correct.
The bike feels surprisingly light, much lighter than anticipated, in fact, I’d actually like another pound or two, so coil conversion on the fork is a go for sure.
  • 3 0
 @onawalk: whether or not it's accurate, it's probably best to remain convinced it is and be stoked about that. Get that coil gurl.
  • 117 0
 It'd be nice to see a top to bottom video of the entire test track. This will give us a visual idea of what the track is like. It doesn't have to be for all bikes, but at least one video at the beginning of these field tests. Just a thought...
  • 7 0
 I support this
  • 17 3
 Google "Oriental Express Galbraith" There are a number of YouTube POV videos out there.
  • 8 3
 @MarshallWillanholly: pretty sure most of this is video is on chuckanut.
  • 35 0
 @Bm1117, the timed testing took place on Oriental Express, filming took place in the Chuckanuts, and the actual riding / getting impressions of the bikes took place in a variety of locations around Bellingham.

Oriental's not the steepest trail, but it's pretty chunky this year, with plenty of turns and high speed sections that made it work well for lots of repeated timed runs.
  • 9 1
 @mikekazimer: can you compare climbing on the Patrol vs Sentinel v2 ? Also wondering if there are any comments on the 165mm cranks on this... ....seems short for a tall person.
  • 1 0
 @uberstein: Following....
  • 7 0
 @uberstein: I can't comment on the patrol vs sentinel, however i'm 6'4" and rocking 165 cranks. No issues at all, I love them. I've ran them for the last couple years.
  • 2 0
 @sudochuckwalla: thanks for that info. i'll wait for someone to comment on climbing of Patrol vs Sentinel v2 or Spire...
  • 1 0
 @mikekazimer: Chuckanuts, great name.
  • 2 0
 @mikekazimer: shuttling double down was maybe the highlight of our Bellingham trip after trying Galbraith in insane heatwave. Ending right at our camp and doing it over and over was awesome with some natural tech. P.S. I want a follow up of Patrol vs Nomad, I bought the Nomad since I didn’t want to wait and been using previous nomads but that Patrol was on my mind for quiet some time. Cool to see it’s an awesome bike.
  • 91 2
 I think most of us want to be the guy who turns up to an enduro race wearing a hawaiian shirt and ends up beating everybody while doing all the side hits.
  • 47 0
 Make it happen. I believe in you.
  • 47 0
 What was on Levy's computer screen at the beginning that had Alicia look so uncomfortable???
  • 11 0
 LOL!! She is looking all kinds of flushed and flustered. Smile We may need to call HR.
  • 14 0
 "Omg. OK breath. Hold it together Alicia. Wait did I really see that? OMG KEEP IT TOGETHER"

While Matt seems perfectly content with whatever is going on.

Lol good catch.
  • 34 0
 Pics of his mini I bet
  • 9 0
 It was him doing that eyebrow thing from the previous review intro at Sun peaks
  • 29 3
 @pdxjeremy: his "mini" Wink
  • 5 0
 Must be a picture of that Ford F-350 from a few weeks ago.
  • 1 0
 Could it be the sidewalls of the Conti tires?NC17 casing, do they make those in tanwall? FFS if mtb was not already saturated with metaphors
  • 11 0
 Pretty sure Levy is just looping the XC field test reviews of himself in spandex.
  • 22 0
 It's just a close up of Dangerholm's thighs
  • 11 0
 @schlockinz: isn't that everyone's screen saver?
Asking for a friend
  • 46 3
 Transition was smart to add a TRP/GX build option for some of their models. We had a lot of customers switching from the Code RSCs to the DHR Evos anyway.
  • 27 3
 trail evos or dhr evos > codes all day long!
  • 3 2
 @whiteranger3: ooh, happy to hear that. have a new bike order with trail evos, wondering if would regret not having DH-Rs. will be switching from Code RSCs. I'm pretty happy with the RSCs, but better is better!
  • 21 1
 Code RSCs are fine, it's the Code Rs on the usual GX build that is the poor performer...SRAM should definetely do something to improve their lower end brake line up.
  • 2 1
 @rick26: That's what I used to think before trying TRPs ha!
  • 14 0
 @rick26: agreed. Just switched from Code R’s to RSC’s w/HS2 rotors a few weeks ago. I always noticed RSC’s felt better just from an initial lever feel compared with R’s. But now after logging some riding in, I can confirm RSC’s are leaps and bounds better. The amount of power I can tap into and maintain control of on gnarly steep sections is insane. So much so I’d argue that R’s should go under a different model name.
  • 6 0
 @rick26: I’ve for a long time believed that sram drives rsc tier brake sales by making their r tier shittier than would make sense at the given price point. Fairly easily they could run longer levers on their cheaper stuff like shimano does to compensate for poor leverage without swinglink
  • 5 0
 @TheRamma: i went from RSCs to trail evos and didn't regret it. i'm 250lbs, RSCs would fade on our steep trails, trail evos no fade whatsoever and have plenty of power. they are almost identical to the DHR, only different is the piston in the lever pushes a bit less fluid
  • 5 0
 I've tried the Code RSC's, Code R's, Shimano XT, Shimano SLX, TRP DHR Evo's. Shimano XT's are my favorite. TRP DHR's worked great, but I didn't love the Lever shape, I do like the MTX gold label pads for the shimanos, Eliminates rattle and adds some stopping power Codes work well, unless it's a long descent, The fade was real. I found I had to bleed them often to keep the feel I liked
  • 1 0
 @Daray: combine the MTX pads with Magura storm HC rotors for the ultimate shimano brake upgrade
  • 2 1
 @whiteranger3: nice! been noticing a little fade in the RSCs in the bike park lately (200 lbs, ride in Colorado), although it's not too bad. Excited to try something else. Love that TRP is shaking up SRAM/Shimano in the brake game. It was a $50 upgrade to get Trail EVOs over MT5s with my bike, felt like a no brainer.
  • 3 0
 Where do the new hayes fit into this?
  • 2 0
 I rode code RSCs for three years until they masters died just out of warranty. I got the dhr evo to replace them and it's a huge improvement. I really want to get some big days on them and see how they are on longer descents. I think the thicker rotors will be great for that too Now I want to replace the code Rs on my other bike but have to let the credit card cool off first.
  • 4 0
 @mtb-thetown: TRP DHR evo are the way to go, I have done several 1000m descend and never been close to fade or heating up.
  • 4 1
 I'll take the CODE RSCs over the DH-R EVOs just based on the pad contact adjustment. Being able to adjust the lever and the pad contact perfectly is something I have to have now.
  • 4 5
 @tacklingdummy: but these adjustments are useless once you start going downhill for a long ride lol
  • 4 0
 @mtb-thetown: the new HSC rotors up the performance on the RSC’s by a long shot. Stronger bite with the same amount of modulation and way less fade.
  • 2 0
 @danielomeara: I was running 203 freeza rotors and mtx pads. Big improvement, but still doesn't come close to the trps. Trp stock pads feel and look like mtx, I wonder if that's their supplier.
  • 2 0
 @souknaysh: I ran that adjustment all the way in except I'd open it to bleed the brakes, then close again. The pads are supposed to self adjust so it seems like that shouldn't need to be a thing. Trps seem to have quicker bite, I hope they stay that way as the pads wear.
  • 4 0
 @mtb-thetown: TRPs are just better in every way to me, can't recommend enough !!
  • 4 3
 @tacklingdummy: But admitting that Code RSC's are really good breaks (esp with thicker rotors and MTX pads) with great ergonomics and serviceability isn't cool. You're supposed to act like some boutique brand has magically created a vastly superior product. Wink
  • 2 0
 @schlockinz: I’ve had all but the TRP DHR (had trail evo’s), and the Hayes blew me away. Only brake I want to run now. TRP would be second, then magura and sram, then shimano. The Hayes have a very defined bite point like Shimano, but fantastic modulation and all the power. They nailed it. Bleed really easily, too.
  • 1 0
 @brycepiwek: i swapped my guide r levers with rsc’s. The rsc levers are much nicer, but I don’t feel any more braking power. Maybe I have to pull a little harder, but it’s negligible. Regardless you have me debating swapping my code r levers with rsc’s on my other bike, lol!
  • 2 0
 @Daray: ya but have you tried Saints?
  • 3 0
 @danielomeara: ya I've found this to be the case. All these guys saying the RSC's are fading just hasn't been true in my experience. Although, I am running 220/200mm HS2 F/R and now that your saying this maybe those discs have something to do with. They felt f*cking brutal today on the ride!

Earlier this week I did two days of 1800m descents and had no fade.
  • 1 0
 @skiboot1: yeah, I wouldn't say the fade is really a big deal. I'm not using HS2's, just the standard centerlines, so that absolutely could be a cheaper way to remedy it.

I'm 200 lbs, and get minor fade when I'm doing back to back runs at a bike park. So over all, not a huge deal. Code RSCs are still really good brakes, and as pointed out, contact point adjustment is nice.
  • 1 0
 @zamanfu: I think the main advantage of the rsc levers is the bearing for the levers instead of a bushing. Makes the lever throw much smoother. The little contact dial adjuster doesn't make much difference once start riding since the pads self adjust contact point anyways with pad wear
  • 2 0
 @TheRamma: I'm 215lbs on a good day
  • 1 0
 @cuban-b: Im going to give that a try!
  • 1 0
 @skiboot1: i havent- but i want to- I’ve been expecting them to update them for a few years and keep waiting for the update before testing
  • 2 1
 @dancingwithmyself: I know right. SRAM can't possibly make a quality brake, right? Lol.
  • 1 0
 Mach schnell! Sram ist beste!
  • 3 0
 @dancingwithmyself: RSC’s with HS2 and MTX gold’s is really hard to beat.
  • 2 0
 @rick26: honestly shimano has 100% the best low end brakes I’ve tried, my mt201s have held up amazingly after a season and a half of hard park riding. smashed the left lever into a tree and several rocks and it’s scuffed but still has zero sponginess
  • 1 0
 @C4L3B: try MT5s. They're significantly better the MT-400s that they replaced.
  • 1 0
 @TheRamma: i’ve heard magura levers aren’t the best durability wise. My shimanos are hella durable which i love
  • 1 0
 @C4L3B: yeah, I've heard that too. But I'm careful about what I take seriously regarding internet advice, particularly about brakes.

Will let you know how it works out for me!
  • 1 1
 The external brake line mounts on the new Transitions make me go: “wow people hate SRAM brakes that much!” since Shimano, TRP, and Magura could all use the same brake hose.
  • 29 0
 Daily reminder on Santa Cruz's ridiculous pricing schema: You can purchase both the Carbon Patrol AND the the Commencal Meta SX (two bikes that beat the Santa Cruz in timed testing) for the same price as the Santa Cruz. Smile
  • 13 1
 Sweet. So if I buy the SC I'm basically riding two bikes at once. Now I get it
  • 6 0
 @DCF: riding two bikes more slowly

Fixed it for you Wink
  • 4 0
 While I agree completely... ...to be fair, you can get the "S build" GX build kit on the SC for about $100 more than the Transition. True it's their lower grade carbon and the build isn't quite as dialed as Transition, at least it's not 2x.
  • 31 1
 The nollie that Alicia did off the rock drop at 5:45 was so sick!!!
  • 9 3
 She's a baller rider! #goddess
  • 17 0
 Interesting that the article and video made a point that at was mid pack for Alicia and slow for Matt, but didn't mention that it was second fastest for Kazimer (according to Contra article). Seems like that kinda messes with the slow but fun narrative. I'd like to hear @mikekazimers thoughts on it.
  • 4 0
 I meant @mikekazimer thoughts since this was second fastest for him
  • 7 0
 @mtb-thetown, timed testing is just one metric, and while it's fun to discuss, it shouldn't be seen as the be-all-end-all. There are just too many factors at play to be able to definitively say "Bike X is faster than Bike Y in all conditions."

I've also learned via timed testing that I'm very good at going the exact same pace over and over again, no matter what bike I'm on.
  • 1 1
 I kind of think times testing shouldn’t have even be done for this bike, I’m actually a little surprised it’s in this test category and more like it was put in because it’s new. No where does Transition say or advertise this bike as a race bike and does more to say it’s not a race bike and is a fun focused bike. The Spire is their enduro race bike. With the enduro category becoming more and more race time focused I think we may need to bring back the free ride category in a more modern context where climbing is still necessary and important but the focus is on fun. Bikes like the Patrol, Nomad, Sb165, MX torque (or 27.5) etc…. Bikes you wanna ride anywhere having fun and not caring about your Strava.
  • 1 0
 @mikekazimer: thanks for the honest answer! It seems like getting meaningful results from timed testing is really hard, and I get more from hearing your more personal perspectives. But since the video and article made a point about the timing being slow, it seemed interesting it wasn't as slow for you.

Also, even if the results of the timed tests should be taken with a grain of salt, I like hearing the descriptions and comparisons of how the bikes feel when you all are trying to push them at race pace.
  • 13 0
 For what it’s worth. Have the alloy gx version. Climbing and descending characteristics described here are spot on. I will add, with saddle time its feel shifted from a miniDH to a lively all-rounder (it seemed to shrink in a great way). The weight is most noticeable climbing over deadfall or putting in truck. Always ridden in high position, don’t jerk around w suspension too much, 5’10” 160.
  • 12 0
 When the field test is done, it would be great to see an in-depth article on the latest crop of purpose built mullets. I've owned two dedicated mullets, and am currently back on a full 29 and a full 27.5 after running into some handling traits I didn't prefer, but I'm still interested in the concept and would like to know how geo/handling are progressing from some folks that have ridden a wider variety of these.
  • 4 0
 Alot of our best trails are primitive backcountry hiking/mule trails with tight steep switchbacks. I'm always so disappointed how bad I ride down. Would invest in a mullet if I thought it would help me ride 400 metres of switchbacks like a bad ass, don't care about the other 30km
  • 2 0
 @HughBonero: I found both mullet's I owned made it faster through switchbacks. Mostly due to how easy it is to unweight the rear tire to break traction.
  • 1 0
 @djjohnr: thanks for the info. Do longer ish chainstays affect this much? Comparing 435mm to 445 on a 490 reach bike for example
  • 3 0
 @HughBonero: I tried different chainstay lengths via the Cascade Components link for the Bronson MX (it adds 6mm of chainstay length). Making the stays longer/shorter works as you'd normally expect - shorter chainstays are easier to break loose. However, in general the chainstays on a mullet acted shorter to me than their length would otherwise suggest on a bike with equal size wheels.
  • 1 0
 @djjohnr: very much appreciated the info. Thanks again
  • 10 0
 My favorite !
Fell in love with my wife's Scout 6 months ago and nearly all attributes mentioned here apply to the Scout as well.
Would put a coil into the Patrol and try even less than 28% SAG for the fun.
Good stuff Transition, keep it coming !
  • 13 0
 Yea my 2020 scout is the most fun bike I have ever ridden. I guess I’ll be a 27.5 die hard shouting “27.5 for life” in a few years time.

I’d probably run this patrol with a 180mm fork and a 27.5 front wheel...
  • 6 0
 @rich-2000: Yeah, the only thing we don't need where I live is the slack head angle. 65° is perfect on the Scout (I"ve thrown a wolfTooth angle set in).
27.5 for life ! Smile
  • 3 0
 @rich-2000: exactly what I have done, and what was recommended to me by a couple of the pros who ride for transition.
  • 11 4
 I know, it's Transition's new bike which is why it's in the review but it's not really an enduro bike, that's the Spire. I really like the look of the new Patrol it's kind of like a modern day Trek Remedy looks like a lot of fun.
  • 8 0
 2022 Remedy cries in obsolescence.
  • 16 0
 160/160mm sounds like enduro to me. Especially with that slack of a head angle. Just a more playful package than the spire which is more of a race oriented machine
  • 1 1
 @ejopdahl: Depends on your interpretation, I see enduro as racing so the bike genre to cater for that racing should be race oriented i.e. planted, stable and designed to go as fast as possible. The Patrol is a fun bike to do fun stuff on. Unfortunately in the ever expanding world of bike genres there isn't a fun category.
  • 7 0
 I still have my 2020 Patrol Carbon, which is 27.5 front and rear. It remains hands down the best and most fun bike I’ve ridden and even though I bought an alloy Transition Scout in January this year, the Patrol is still my go to bike.
The guys at Transition know how to put the fun into biking.
  • 1 0
 Ill never understand why they took such a fun bike, lowered the travel and gave it a 29er in the front. I swapped all my Patrol parts over to my carbon Scout, kept the 170 fork and just downstroked the 165 rear to 150mm. All the fun of the Patrol in a pedally package.
  • 10 0
 @mattbeer sentinel is 150mm travel, not 140mm Wink
  • 1 2
 It can be either depending on your shock stroke
  • 5 0
 @Crazypirate22: true, but I have heard of very few people running 140 and it comes stock at 150
  • 7 0
 Any bike can have it's travel reduced by reducing the shock stroke... that's not really a feature!
  • 6 0
 Great to hear Matt and Alicia summarize my feelings for the Alloy Patrol.
I came off a 170/170 monster bike that was so plush it ate everything up but it was a tank to pedal and kind of encouraged me to straight line everything! So I was looking for something a bit more nimble but I also didn't want to knock my confidence for bigger features due to the bikes capabilities.
However I have had no problems in that regard with my patrol, I've ridden all the same features and ticked off some new ones without ever feeling under biked. And even though coming from a carbon bike, my patrol is heavy, that didn't seem to effect the climbing. It does climb really well for such a downhill capable bike. The weight only started to be a problem for me when I came to multiday backcountry stuff - and lets face it no enduro bike is going to do that well.
Anyways I think the carbon version will be my unicorn. More than capable enough for what I want to ride, agile, playful, fun, not such a downhill bike I'm exhausted getting up the hill and light enough for the odd backcountry mission.
I do really want to try a coil, to combat some off that rear end jar it can get at speed.
Oh also I can tell my friends my bike is made for a good time and not speed and that is why I'm slower than them!
  • 4 0
 @dennis72: I picked up the alloy version this year and you summarize my experience with it as well. I did add a coil to it already and I think it's great. Still a ton of fun but quiets it down as it gets faster and chunkier.
  • 8 0
 Running an alloy version at 170mm and am more than pleased with the results!
  • 5 1
 Hell ya. I've been thinking about bumping mine up too. Also I find it hilarious everyone gasping over the weight of the alloy. I pedal it 4k-5k feet of climbing all the time with zero complaints.
  • 4 0
 Did you bump fork travel up to 170mm to match? I've wondered if it could start to feel unbalanced without 170 up front, but don't want to slacken it out anymore haha she's maximum slack I would want in high setting.
  • 2 0
 Same experience here. My son rides the cheapest alu version and it's a real versatile bike. Bikepark, enduro trails, jumps well, corners great, super confidence inspiring! Only the wheels are rubbish but a new rear wheel after 50.000 mtrs of descending doesn't brake the bank.
  • 3 0
 @dennis72: that's how I'd describe it too! I built mine up from a frameset so I had my WAO carbon wheels for it so can't comment on the wheels.
  • 1 0
 @Nwilkes: Can the new WAO crinkle wheels come out already I want to try those as my first pair
  • 1 0
 @TeaPunk: I have no idea what a crinkle wheel is
  • 2 0
 @Nwilkes: Yeah front and rear. Its basically a mullet spire with a shorter wheelbase haha!
  • 2 0
 @Nwilkes: Its fine I have no issues climbing with it, in fact it climbs better than my trail bike does. :/
  • 1 0
 @ClimbNH: sold!!
  • 1 0
 @Nwilkes: In the "WAO Previews New Rim Shape - Sea Otter 2022" article they teased images of new wavy "crinkled" rims on the Arrival that supposed adds 30% impact resistance. Supposed to come out Summer
  • 9 2
 " It turns out that high-performance brakes and suspension are the most important parts to bolt to your bike.

Nah, you're just kidding Wink
  • 7 2
 i sort of get the sense that as most companies models move to 29 inch wheels, the mixed wheel option acts as a way to keep a model in the lineup a bit longer, even while its travel and geometry overlaps with some of the other full 29er bikes in the range
  • 2 1
 Just a way to sell people another bike. This particular model does make the most of the smaller rear wheel though-emphasis on fun and airtime, not speed.
  • 2 1
 @wyorider: i am thinking a bit more about not wanting to bin a long-standing model in the lineup.

for instance, the insurgent came out in 2015 but now, if you spec it with a 170mm fork, the only difference between it and a 170mm forked wreckoning is 2mm of rear travel, a 27.5 rear wheel and less than half a degree in head tube angle.

similarly, if you spec the megatower with the longer stroke shock, taking the rear travel to 170mm, you've essentially got a nomad but with a 29 rear wheel.
  • 5 0
 Mullet bikes are also pretty much the only way to have a long-travel bike in an XS (and arguably S) frame size in the lineup.
  • 1 0
 @Ttimer: that’s a good point. I am not a tall rider but there are definitely people who are significantly shorter than me, so maybe that fact alone provides enough incentive to the manufacturers
  • 9 4
 I still don't understand why transition (and other bike manufacturers) spec a shock like 205 x 60, and then tell customers they can run 205 x 65 and get 10mm more travel.

Just give customers the longer stroke shock, and let them decide the feeling of the bike based on sag. If they run a 65mm stroke shock and run 20mm of sag, it will feel exactly the same as if they ran a 60mm stroke shock with 20mm of sag, except the bike will have an extra 10mm of travel at bottom out.
  • 6 0
 Agreed, or potentially give the option when ordering. I wonder if the spire/patrol use the same front triangle, and they do the travel change to make them seem more different.
  • 14 1
 The difference between those two shocks is just a spacer than can be removed when getting a full service done, so it's not like they are making you buy a new shock if you want more travel. They are just saying if you take out the spacer there is clearance for the travel. Running less sag in a shorter shock also isn't the same as more sag in a longer shock either.
  • 3 0
 @mtb-thetown: On an x2 it's a pretty pain to change travel, on the flip side they have to get sent into for service fairly regularly.

Even so, what I'm saying is only the kinematics would differ when you bottomed out the bike if you tested 60mm vs 65mm with the same length of sag (not percentage). If you ran 20mm of sag in either bike, it would behave exactly the same except you'd have an extra 10mm of travel at bottom out.

Transition does the same thing with the scout, and they say you can short stroke the sentinel to have a 140mm trail bike, which makes the least amount of sense because you can just run the regular sentinel with less sag and get the same thing.

This is all probably based on marketing decisions and how best to manage customer's expectations for how each of their bikes should ride - the patrol is more of a 'fun' bike than the spire.
  • 2 0
 @sudochuckwalla: my understanding is the front triangle of the Spire and Patrol are the same. Rear triangle is what’s different.
  • 3 4
 @b3n Thank you!
Short stroking bikes is pretty much the stupidest trend in the industry just now.
"Hey guys, we made a great bike, but then we made it slightly worse for no reason before we sold it to you!"

There is literally no reason to limit the shock stroke if the frame can cope with more. Definitely some marketing bods idea. Any engineer who doesn't see why it's a stupid idea should be fired immediately
  • 6 1
 Would have been cool to digest all of these at once since I paid for a years Beta subscription upfront after you all pumped it up during the last field test. Still questions unanswered and long time PB community members feeling ripped off.
  • 1 0
 Is Beta still in business? Their website and IG haven’t been updated in a while. It’s a bit odd…
  • 1 0
 It's weird they had a podcast saying they weren't getting rid of the comment section, then an article pops up with no comment section and a big O on it... O dear.
  • 7 0
 + points for sick toboggan
  • 4 0
 @mikekazimer Wondering what geometry setting was everyone using for the test? Which was faster? Did they notice a discernible difference to the bike's characteristics? Why did each rider prefer one over the other?
Thanks!
  • 5 0
 I won’t speak for kaz, but I’ll throw my 2 cents in. I have the alloy of this bike, I have played with the flip chip as well as different sag, different fork and shock strokes, and also tried it at full 27.5. I often ride in Bellingham, as well as all over bc. I found The bb is already quite low and the head angle is plenty slack relative to the rest of the Geo, meaning this bike isn’t built as a plow machine, so to me the low setting was too low. Bb felt like it was dragging and the steering was sloppy. It took some really high speeds before the bike would come to life. My previous bike was a nicolai g1, so I’m no stranger to long and slack, but the patrol feels best in the high setting in order to keep the intended playfulness that tr designed it for. I feel that if you need this bike to be slacker, you might be better off with the spire. However, options are good to have, and other users may enjoy that slack setting.
  • 1 0
 @ivemadeahugemistake: what did you land on for travel out of the different supported options?
  • 2 0
 @bricollins: currently I am on a mixed wheel setup with 180f 170r in the high setting, I have a cascade link on the way which will bump the rear up to 180 (or 170 if I put the travel spacer back in). It’s a bit of a monster truck, which is great for bike park and virgin, but that extra fork length and subsequent head angle definitely takes the fun out of slower speed trails, if I did less bike park and more ‘trail’ riding I would definitely go back to less travel. Running the low setting with the 180 fork was ridiculous (bad). I predict an ideal setup would be 170/170 with the cascade link, (basically a mullet spire) but I won’t know until I try it. As it sits now it’s the best cornering bike I’ve ever ridden and I am fully on board with the mixed wheel trend. I’m 6ft tall on a Lg, and wheelbase right now is 1290. It was 1275mm with a 170 fork, which is probably ideal for my riding style.
  • 3 0
 TRP brakes FTW! Even though can be finicky at caliper at times (sticky, uneven pistons retraction), my favorite performing brakes at the lever witt excellent power to modulation. Brakes even out peforrm my beloved Saints and Zees on other bikes that consistently last forever. Very nice to see from Transition
  • 7 0
 The V2 Sentinel is 150mm
  • 6 0
 180 fork 27,5 front wheel also an option
  • 4 0
 Interesting that Mike Kazimer said his second fastest time was on the Patrol (0.9s behind the Contra). That’s quite some variation between the testers.
  • 2 0
 I was really interested in this bike when it came out in alloy last year. @mikekazimer 's initial review noted the really low bottom bracket and that it did result in more pedal strikes even with the stock 165 mm cranks. Has Transition raised the bb for the carbon version or was it just not an issue in the Bellingham terrain?
  • 7 0
 I'm almost 5' 8" with a short inseam and have the Alloy Patrol. I've been a lover of 165 cranks for a long time. I was smacking cranks ALL DAY LONG on this bike at first.

Picked up a pair of 155mm Canfields that feel absolutely perfect for my legs and pedal strikes went to zero. It's so sick now!
  • 2 0
 Unfortunately, I can't trust Transition's carbon anymore. Seen, and experienced first hands, too many cracked frames that we're clearly due to poor quality control.
In an age of limited stocks, being dependent on warranty or crash replacements is too much of a hassle (not to mention buying a used bike).
I totally dig the company- they make sick riding bikes that are right up my alley, and they got a great vibe. But, sadly, I'm done...
  • 2 0
 " Finding the balance on the rear shock between supple and supportive is a narrow window." You hit the nail right on the head! I had the V1 Sentinel, and with a lot of experimenting I finally settled at 205 psi, or 28% sag. I was going to try a Cascade Link before finally deciding to sell upon purchasing a Stump EVO Alloy frame. I may still go ahead and build it up again with the $315 hunk of aluminum if I continue to get lowball offers.
  • 5 0
 Does the invisible kick stand come standard?
  • 4 0
 Do you think running a coil shock would’ve helped to find the line between supple and supportive more easily?
  • 6 4
 Press release:. Transition names new VP sales after the scandal of getting tagged for "good value" in a recent review. Our new vp sales will focus on getting us back into the con: expensive category for 2023.
  • 2 1
 Come to NZ TR is considerd Bottique and you pay outrageous prices, similar to rocky... except rocky are OK as it comes with some quality.
  • 2 0
 @EvolutionMTBer: yeah I hate reading all these comments on pinkbike about Transition and the like being cheaper alternative. Pretty much anything with a recognisable name is pushing SC prices in NZ
  • 1 2
 @thisc*nt: 100%. a Carbon TR frame is basically inline with SC/Sworks stuff... crazy.
  • 1 0
 @EvolutionMTBer Carbon Spire frame only carbon $6090 NZD, Megatower frame only carbon $7950.... Carbon Sworks stumpy evo frame only NZD $6700 Transition also come with sram and shimano build kits...
  • 1 0
 @rcwellie: Really? I paid 6900 for my Megatower last year , the SC is worth the cost over the transition though.

FYI the Evo frame can be bought for 6000 at the moment.
  • 1 0
 @rcwellie: Just come to America and buy one. With the money you would save, your airfare and mtb vacation would be covered.
  • 4 0
 @levie125: Id rather pay more than come there for anything sorry lol.
  • 8 4
 This bike isn't going to win any races, quite clearly, so why would we not just give it a full 27.5 setup?
  • 4 0
 i messaged Transition and they know some of people who run the patrol with a longer fork an 27.5 front Smile that reverse angle spacer might come in handy, too
  • 5 1
 @Stokedonthis: Oh that's good to know, just a shame that we keep pushing for this never-ending "must go faster" attitude, when realistically, maybe 5% of Patrol's are going to be raced?
  • 2 0
 @Jaib06: Check out Hannah Bergemann's setup: www.instagram.com/p/CbGIAd-Pq4A/?hl=en
Wink
  • 2 0
 @O1D4: Bro a 190mm Zeb? Thats how this bike shouldve come from the factory
  • 1 0
 @thustlewhumber: absolutely, and honestly, if you look at the weight of the long travel zebs, vs the boxxers, just get the boxxers and be done with it.
  • 2 0
 If you want the bike and you have the money buy it. If you don’t want the bike and you have the money, don’t buy it. If you don’t have the money and want the bike, shiiiiddddd
  • 1 0
 transitions are cool but my spire was so god damn noisy, same with my brothers sentinel and my friends sentinel. also it does seem like the window to get the rear shock performing properly is very thin, tough to keep it supple while also being supportive
  • 1 0
 Does anyone know exactly how much the HA will change when bumping up to 170mm in front?

As impressive as the fox38 is, the 160 front end feels overwhelmed in really rough terrain, especially under braking. But I don't want to slacken the bike any more!

I believe the static nor functional geo will change when changing the rear to 170. Another thought that comes to mind is fork sag... increased travel usually comes with increased sag, which maybe counteracts the lowered (unweighted) HA a bit.
  • 1 0
 Every 10mm of travel you add to the fork will slacken the HTA by 0.5°.
  • 3 0
 So with one air shaft and a shock spacer removal this thing is golden Lovely.
  • 5 1
 TRP? DOMINION? or MAGURA? GO!!
  • 6 0
 I love my MT5s and had terrible trouble with the TRPs on my old Tues. That said I think we should all be happy that we have several really good, if not objectively better, alternatives to Sram and Shimano brakes.
  • 6 0
 I like MT5's, I've seen em as cheap as 65 USD per end, but they're more commonly found at like 100 USD. Their power doesn't reflect their price.
  • 1 0
 TRP.
  • 3 0
 How about "Braking"?
  • 4 0
 Hayes Dominion all day long for me
  • 2 0
 8 got nothing but troubles with magura on 3 different set, mt trail, mt5 and mt7. I'll never go back. Got dominion and cura 4 is coming soon.
  • 3 0
 Dominion only!
  • 1 2
 Mineral Oil. Albeit I would love to try Dominions A4 with all seals changed to mineral, just to feel the difference.
  • 1 0
 @Notmeatall: I'd love to hear more subjective analysis on non-stock oils, it seems like a great hack...
  • 1 0
 @sngltrkmnd: definitely, don't hear about these at all. Would love to see a review and/or opinions.
  • 1 0
 I've heard someone amped about their codes using Galfer discs and Trickstuff Power pads, I wonder if that completely alleviates their issues
  • 1 0
 TRP because it is easier to get pads
  • 3 0
 @ccrida-pnw: I'm using Motul 2,5w oil to great success for 2 years on my shimanos brakes. It was easy to spot a bad main piston seal that was going bad due to dust.

It's also very easy to bleed them, and no more wandering bite point too, on 2 and 4 pistons.

I've also rebuilt an old Avid, don't remember wich, with mineral oil compatible seals everywhere, and they worked smoothly. I'd say the were silky smooth, instead watery smooth. That's a feeling I really enjoiyed.

I'm now rebuilding a TRP slate4 caliper to work with shimano servowave lever. It'll have the same clamping power as a 2 piston xt, albeit with much larger pad area. I'm really intrigued to feel how it'll perform.
  • 1 0
 @Notmeatall: Shinano is a straight switchover though yes? Did you do anything to flush them first or am I overthinking it?
  • 2 0
 @mkpfaff: Just a normal full bleed on shimano.

I've heard Bernard Kerr talking on a vlog of his team using motorex oil on their shimano brakes because they couldn't get shimano stuff on time for the race, and also lots of forums where people swear by Putoline GPR6C 2.5w for rear shocks.
  • 1 0
 @Notmeatall: I use redline like water in my saints, as putoline is unavailable in USA. Brakes have never felt better!
  • 4 0
 Can you tell us the times for everyone and all bikes?
  • 10 10
 Pinbiker's are a sensitive crowd - I commented on yesterday's Contra MC review that it was a "hideous offering", and was downvoted to hades, never to be seen again.

In contrast, this Transition has clean lines and looks good.
  • 6 3
 Agreed. And also, agreed, that bike was ugly.
  • 6 1
 yeah, I too found it ugly. And I like steel bikes. I really thought all the fawning the reviewers did over the looks of the Contra was odd. It's obviously a pretty unusual, polarizing look.
  • 2 0
 @TheRamma: I mean to be fair, I should say it wasn't super ugly. It's just very "steam punk" looking and you have to be into that kind of thing...
  • 3 1
 @mybaben: right. it's going to spark opinions. it was just weird, felt the reviewers gushed over its looks with acknowledging that it is not a traditional looking bike, at all.
  • 3 0
 It think the Contra MC looks cool, but then again, I think Trust forks look cool!
  • 2 0
 @gomeeker: which is fine! there's nothing wrong with differing opinions. My complaint is that PB has become an echo chamber.
  • 3 1
 @TheRamma: It will be an echo chamber if dissent gets tucked under the comment threshold rug.

I'll still be here (at least for now) droning on about awful frame design, exorbitant MTB bike and accessory prices and how eMTB's are here to stay.
  • 2 2
 @njcbps: The comment threshold must go! Its blatant suppression... normalized.
  • 4 4
 Unfortunately I would disagree with almost every part of this review after owning the alloy one for a couple months. I disliked mine so much that I had to give it up after 15 or so rides that frustrated the hell out of me. That being said, the right size and right rider might have a ton of fun, maybe I just like my stuff smaller and snappier
  • 1 0
 nice bike, not sure about the Target audience, for the park I'd choose alu, for races choose S, for good allrounder when u live in the pedal-up trail - this, anyway last year we are the one beats all o those bikes
  • 2 0
 What I think about the Patrol is: @mattbeer looks like he could grow a sweet beard. That would make him, “Matt Beerd on a party Patrol” Big Grin
  • 1 0
 @mikekazimer
How much time do you spend with each bike before timed testing? Do you do all timed testing on the same day/conditions with all bikes or do you do each bike individually on separate days?
  • 2 0
 In this case we all did our timed testing on the same day. We've typically had at least four rides on each bike before getting out the stopwatch.
  • 1 0
 Hi @mattbeer , i am trying to decide between the spire and the patrol, could you describe in your opinion/preference what about the mullet set up that makes you prefer it over the spire? Thank you!
  • 1 0
 I wouldn't say that I prefer one over the other necessarily, but the Patrol is less work to throw into corners and off of jumps, whereas the Spire's wheelbase offers a secure and stable ride for high-speed trails. It all comes down to what types of trails you enjoy the most.
  • 2 0
 Based on the comments on that Pivot, I'm glad they at least got the shock angle right here...
  • 2 0
 Wondering what’s the trail with the rock drop at the start of rhe descending segment (3:52)?
  • 1 0
 @mikekazimer: thought I recognized that tree gap, just rode this trail on a trip and it was one of my faves
  • 3 0
 @mikekazimer: Bellingham sucks!
  • 4 1
 The objective commentary on this one was fantastic.
  • 4 1
 I'd put a 180mm fork on it and switch to 27.5 front wheel.
  • 1 0
 Do it!!!! It's so much more fun!!! I put 29 lowers on a 27.5, 37mm offset upper crown @180mm travel; it shortens the wheelbase to around 1250mm, dropped the BB from 440 to 438mm in the high setting. Turns it into a great freeride bike.
  • 1 0
 @vonroder77: I'm noob, what do you mean by putting on 29 lowers etc?
  • 1 0
 @TeaPunk: I Put 29er lower fork legs on a short offset (37mm) 27.5 upper fork crown. 29er fork legs are taller than 27.5 lowers, this combined with upping the fork travel to 180mm allows you to get the proper axle to crown height for the stock geo on the new Patrol when using the smaller 27.5 front wheel.

Nobody makes a 29er fork in a 37mm offset crown. 37mm(short offset crowns) are used for Transitions 27.5 model bikes. 29er crowns generally come in 51and 44mm offset.

feel free to D.M me if you have more questions.
Cheers.
  • 3 0
 “I could lose 1.3kg of fat and save my money”
*proceeds to the fridge*
  • 2 0
 Can we get a compare of the Patrol vs the Nomad V6 ? ...okay, okay, the SC will cost more... But beyond that?
  • 2 0
 Sounds to me like the Alloy Patrol is an excellent choice for those that one bike to everything decently
  • 2 0
 Aluminum, Cascade link, RS coil, Mezzer pro, 170x170, My Patrol rips. Giddy up MOFO's
  • 1 0
 I'm thinking about the Cascade on mine. Any specific reason or complaints you had before you switched? I have my X2 maxed out with spacers and still hitting bottom a bit much, but don't want to go up any more in Pressure or HSC. Wondering if the extra progression makes a big enough different in bottom out support.
  • 1 0
 @Nwilkes: I never ran mine with the stock linkage. Their website is well detailed and will give you the info you need. I wanted more travel with the stock shock length. I don't really pedal the bike. It's my shuttle/park ripper.
  • 2 1
 C’est just don’t get, why not giving the bike a 170mm shock from the start ? Looks to me like an upgrade that majority would want
  • 1 0
 Thanks for the review! This bike is definitely on my list of considerations. Those specs are so perfect for what I want, too.
  • 1 0
 I weighed a size L, alu, Deore build, stock tires / wheels, tubeless at 16,5 kg including pedals (Shimano flats). Removing the tubes saved 0,5 kg Smile . Frame 3,9 kg with axle.
  • 2 0
 Bruh that is not light for a 160 mm travel bike.
  • 2 0
 @mattbeer what pants are riding with?
  • 3 0
 @PandaTheBrave They are Rapha's Trail Lightweight Pant.
  • 2 0
 Well this review is making me question my Spire decision….
  • 2 0
 @mattbeer can you list your times for all the bikes?
  • 2 0
 @ModularSynth

Contra 2:10:70
Deviate 2:12:40
Commencal 2:13:20
Tracer 2:13:70
Megatower 2:14:10
Fezarri 2:14:25
Patrol 2:14:50
  • 2 0
 Partied harder when it came coiled from the factory, just sayin
  • 2 0
 I'm a big fan of the V2 Super Sentinel myself.
  • 1 0
 Does anybody know what's the real weight of the Alloy Patrol out of the box, GX and XT versions?
  • 2 0
 Party in the woods
  • 3 3
 "The Patrol is one of those bikes that makes you think you're going faster than you are." LMAO Stunning review.
  • 1 0
 @KolaPanda: Sounds like the effect of the 29er up front pulling you down the track - at least that's how I feel on my mullet...
  • 1 4
 Fun play bike? Yes. Enduro race bike? No. Seems like this should just be a "big bike" or travel bracket shootout.

That said, seems like this particular bike leverages the smaller wheel for maximum playfulness. I can see it appealing to a lot of riders.
  • 2 0
 I've had a Orbea Rallon and Giant Reign in full 29. The new Patrol is the fastest bike I've ever owned. My self vs self Strava DH times are almost 5% better at full gas.
  • 1 0
 Oh, and it's more fun too! But I have short leg syndrome...
  • 1 0
 @Nwilkes: for the shorter of leg, any bigger wheel advantage is offset by not buzzing your starfish and gentleman’s tackle on steep descents.

Sounds like the bike is really well suited to your physique and riding style.
  • 2 3
 So why release if I can't buy it..makes no sense at all..and every does it.. don't release the damn bikes until I can walk into the bike shop and buy it...to much to ask??
  • 1 0
 Love it! If only it was a Kona with Kona pricing...
  • 1 1
 Enduro bikes tested on a shuttle trail!!!
  • 22 23
 Cons:

- Trunnion mount blows up your shock after 2 rides
  • 12 6
 It's incredible how reviewers just keep ignoring the problems with trunnion shocks
  • 28 2
 you mean, poorly aligned frames*
  • 11 0
 @Hamburgi, what bikes have you had issues with trunnion shocks on? Like @NicolaZesty314 said, poor alignment combined with a trunnion mount can definitely cause issues.
  • 11 2
 @c-radicallis: I don't love trunnion mounts but we're not "ignoring" their problems. We've talked about this a lot of times—there are limitations to individual, short term reviews in general. We can only report on what we actually experience on the bikes we test. Some ramblings on the topic here: www.pinkbike.com/news/pinkbike-podcast-episode-5-can-you-trust-bike-reviews.html
  • 13 0
 2 of my most recent 3 bikes have used trunnion mount shocks, and I've noticed exactly zero issues or change in maintenance requirements.
  • 3 10
flag haen (Sep 1, 2022 at 9:35) (Below Threshold)
 Trunnion + horst link seems to be where you get into trouble.
  • 7 0
 I’ve beat the snot out of my last 2 bikes with trunion, a sentinel and now a patrol, and I’ve had zero problems. Poor frame alignment is the cause of shock failure, which unfortunately is all too common.
  • 9 1
 @haen: Transition isn’t know for making soft floppy bikes with rear ends flexing all over the place.
  • 2 4
 @mikekazimer:
Scott Ransom and Spesh enduro.

By the Scott was the bigger issue with the "bearings" at the trunnion mount. Worn out after 2months of riding...

Spesh is one of the problem with broken shafts etc... the list is long for the spesh enduro haha xD
  • 4 0
 @Hamburgi: Those lower plastic bushings on the Ransom seem to have a random life span. One set lasted 6 months before some rattling but I bought replacements directly from IGUS for like $3.50 and they have lasted a whole season and still going. Its really a non-issue at this point if you know to source them.

Certainly not on the level of a broken shock like some are talking about. This is the first I've heard of trunion mount problems though, I thought the only issue was with frames that use a yoke or side load the shaft (like Specialized). I would not expect issues with rocker activated trunion mounts on Horst link bikes.
  • 7 0
 @mikekazimer: Actually Transition had a run of Alloy Spires with misaligned frames that have been eating shocks left right and centre, especially the X2. They will warranty the frame if this is the case (and there have been a.bunch of claims). Needless to say, if you are running a Trunnion the frame alignment has to be perfect or you are going to cause undue wear on your shock. To test just attach the shock by the bottom eyelet only. Then rotate the shock into position. The 2 Trunnion mounts should sit perfectly central to the mounting faces. If not you will get problems down the track.
  • 4 0
 2.5 years of riding on a scout with a Trunnions. Zero issues
  • 3 0
 @NicolaZesty314: Doesn't matter how aligned your frame is out of the factory when there's also frame flex
  • 6 0
 @IMeasureStuff: Username checks out
  • 2 1
 @brianpark: agree that PB has discussed the trunion issue generally, but it wouldn’t hurt to mention it as a potential con in bike reviews. Like headset cable routing.
  • 1 0
 @preston67: Holy crap thank you!

I didn't even knew I could buy directly from IGUS, here!
  • 1 0
 @Notmeatall:

Yes Kudos to that! Didn't know that too.
  • 1 0
 @Notmeatall: The part # for the Scott Ransom is JFM-121418-10. You will need to cut the bushings down with some clippers or sand paper (I them with a flap disc) as they are a bit tall but otherwise good to go. And you may as well order a couple pairs as the shipping will be $15 Frown
  • 1 0
 @frorider2: Or internal routing in general, with the exception of the dropper post of course.
  • 2 0
 @Hamburgi: I think you're really referencing an old design when you're talking about issues from the Spesh Enduro. The old "X-Wing" style Enduros had both a trunnion mount to the main frame and a special yoke that eliminated the bushing connection to the linkage. I can see where rear flex or misalignment could have caused issues in that system.

That said, the design released in 2019 completely isolates the shock from chainstay, seatstay and main frame flex, as it is mounted to and driven by three small links (and a shared, concentric axle) that connect the shock to the main link and frame. Assuming good tolerances on these forged parts, there is no reason a trunnion isn't a terrific, space saving solution in the design.
  • 1 0
 @KJP1230: Still on a 2017 S-Works. All stock but have taken very good care, disassembling every pivot, purging every bearing, perfectly cleaning then assembling to torque. This year I finally replace a few of the bearings but most are still perfect with my regimen. I just love this bike, in all it's 27.5 glory. I did put a Zeb Ultimate on it end of last season. Lyric was still great.
  • 2 0
 @Chuckolicious: Yes, to be clear, I do not believe that the x-frame design Enduros are actually an issue. As I understand it, there were a limited number of issues with some shocks in those frames.

I actually had the 2014 model of that bike, just when they introduced the 155mm travel 29er. Love that bike.
  • 1 1
 @mikekazimer: Any of the Transitions that come stock with the X2 cause them to fail prematurely due to the design of the trunnion mount. Fox confirmed it.
  • 1 0
 @KJP1230: No i'm talking about the currently Enduro model, because i'm riding one of those.

I can't tell you more about the older one etc. just sharing my own experience with the one i'm acutally riding.
  • 1 0
 @Hamburgi: Could just be yours. I also have the new Enduro and my Fox X2 is working/holding up perfectly well across 3 seasons.
  • 1 0
 @KJP1230: What I did experience is that it first came with the Ohlins air shock. That lost integrity pretty fast, so they replaced with the Ohlins coil, free of charge. But that was an Ohlins thing I believe. Coil has been flawless for all these years since.
  • 6 0
 @seraph: What I've been hearing is that the last year or 2 of X2's have been failing all over the place. I know 3 people and have heard of all sorts of X2's blowing up (all of them purchased within the last 2 years). Its very common for mfg's having a product problem to tell their support people to tell customers stuff like "oh its the frame design" just so they have something to say.
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