First Look: Giant Reign and Glory 27.5

Aug 3, 2014 at 10:43
by Mike Kazimer  


Located just north of Whistler, British Columbia, the small town of Pemberton sits underneath the watchful gaze of Mount Currie, which towers 7800 vertical feet above the valley floor. While Whistler may garner the lion's share of the media spotlight due to its world renowned bike park, Pemberton's trails are world class in their own right, an easily accessed network of well built, technical singletrack that can test even the most seasoned rider. Giant Bicycles chose this location to launch the latest additions to their mountain bike lineup, the Reign 27.5 and the Glory 27.5, and invited us to spend two days familiarizing ourselves with the new rides. The first day was spent putting in shuttle laps on two different trails close to town, and the second day was the grand finale, involving a helicopter ride to the top of a nearby peak followed by a 6,500 foot descent back down to the valley floor.



Giant Reign in Pemberton BC July 2014

Giant Reign Advanced 27.5

In 2014, Giant announced that they were "fully committed to the 27.5” wheel size," eliminating a number of their 29” models and introducing nearly 40 bikes with the middle wheel size, everything from hardtails designed for the recreational rider all the way to their 140mm Trance trail bike. The Reign was the notable exception, and remained relatively unchanged from the previous model year. That's no longer the case, and the new Reign is now rolling on 27.5” wheels, and is also available with a carbon fiber front triangle. The use of a carbon front triangle on the Reign Advanced has allowed Giant to drop the weight to a claimed 2260 grams (without shock), the lightest Reign the company has ever produced.

Giant Reign 27.5
  The Reign Advanced 27.5 is a thoroughly modern looking bike, and with a carbon front triangle, internal cable routing, and a 12x142 rear it checks all the boxes of what a top end all-mountain bike should have.

The updated model is meant to be able to charge down the roughest enduro race courses while at the same time being able to hold its own on the climbs, a balance that Silas Hesterberg, the product developer in charge of the Reign, stressed was an important factor during the bike's design. Feedback from the Giant Factory Off-Road enduro race squad was also taken into consideration, and the bike is now longer, slacker, and lower than previous models, with 160mm of rear travel, a 65° head angle, and 17.1” chain stays. In order to preserve the bike's handling characteristics while also slackening the head angle, Giant chose to go with a RockShox Pike with 46mm of offset, an increase of 4mm over the 'standard' Pike. Like the previous version, the new Reign uses Giant's Maestro dual link suspension layout, which uses a rocker link mounted on the seat tube and another link that curves over the bottom bracket to join the rear swingarm to the front triangle.

All of the models in the Reign line come equipped with an air sprung rear shock, but there is enough room to fit a coil shock if riders choose to go that route, and the 200 x 57mm eye-to-eye and stroke measurements means that there are a number of options that will easily fit. Giant has also gone away from their Overdrive 2 headset standard, reverting to the more common 1 ½ x 1 1/8” tapered standard, a welcome change that greatly opens up the number of available stem and fork options.

Giant Reign 27.5
Giant Reign 27.5 geometry

There are four models in the Reign 27.5 line, two with carbon front triangles and two full aluminum models. The top of the line Reign Advanced Team ($8250) has race-ready build kit, with a dual position, 160mm RockShox Pike up front, a Monarch Plus Debonair rear shock, Avid Guide brakes, SRAM XX1 drivetrain and Schwalbe's Magic Mary front tire paired with a Hans Dampf in the rear. The aluminum version is spec'd similarly, with only a few slight model differences in the brake and drivetrain area, and retails for $5975. The second tier carbon and aluminum Reigns both have 2x10 drivetrains with a chainguide, and there are a few more house brand components than what's found at the upper level, although the Monarch Plus Debonair rear shock is in place on every bike in the line. The Rein Advanced 1 retails for $4750, while the aluminum version is $3400 USD. The full specs for all four bikes can be viewed here.



Giant Reign 27.5
Ride Impressions
bigquotesWith wide bars, a short stem, a dropper post, and 160mm of travel, the Reign is ready to rally right from the start. It's good to see that Giant has gone away from their inconvenient Overdrive 2 headset standard, and also that most of the bikes in the line have a 125mm RockShox Reverb post instead of Giant's own house brand dropper, which only has 100mm of travel.The bike's rear suspension is incredibly supple, so much so that I ended up checking the sag a few times to be sure I had set up the Monarch Plus correctly due to the fact that it took so little effort to initiate the rear suspension's movement. On the trail this suppleness helped the bike roll over all of the loose rocks that filled the rutted sections of the trail during the long descent from the summit of Mount Barbour, and kept the bike glued to the ground while pushing it through loose, dusty corners.

It's hard to say for certain whether it's due to the custom offset fork, or some other geometry number, but at slow speeds the Reign had better handling than you'd expect from a 160mm bike with a 65 degree head angle, and still maintained excellent stability on the wide open straightaways. This is a bike that likes to go fast, with more of a ground hugging, planted feel as opposed to poppy and playful manners.

It takes more than a day and a half of riding to thoroughly assess a bike, no matter how spectacular the trails, but it certainly looks like the new Reign was worth the wait, with modern geometry and a well thought out build kit that should make it a common sight at the starting line. The number of bikes in the 160mm category that pedal and descend well continues to grow - with so many capable choices hitting the market, there hasn't been a better time to be a mountain biker.





Giant Glory in Pemberton BC July 2014

Giant Glory 27.5

When Giant first started working on the Glory 27.5 project, their biggest limitation was the lack of components, particularly suspension forks, that were available for 27.5” wheels. Initial testing of the bike took place in San Romolo, Italy, a location commonly used for suspension testing due to the rough nature of the tracks, as well as the typically favorable weather. For those very first sessions, Giant only had one custom made fork on hand that they swapped between their team riders' bikes. Luckily, it didn't take long for suspension and other component manufacturers to catch up, and now there's a full range of DH worthy products available for 27.5” wheeled bikes.

Giant Glory 27.5
  With integrated fork bump stops that double as cable guides, a longer stroke shock that rotates on cartridge bearings, and a clean rear axle system, it's the small details on the Glory 27.5 that show Giant was paying attention to feedback from racers and riders when developing the new version.

The new bike has 203mm of travel, a 5mm shorter rear end than the 26” version, and the front center has been increased by 30mm. In addition to this revised geometry, the Glory 27.5 uses a longer rear shock and now has cartridge bearings in the linkage, a change that Giant claims results in a 10% drop in the force needed to activate the rear shock. Another small change, but one that many riders had been asking for, is the routing of the brake and rear derailleur housing along the top, rather than the underside, of the downtube. Of course, the question that will inevitably arise is “Where's the carbon version?” Giant wouldn't comment, but it does seem that that would be the next logical step, and they certainly have the manufacturing facilities to make it happen.


Giant Glory 27.5
glory 27.5 geometry

There will be three different Glory 27.5 models, beginning with the Glory 27.5 0. Spec'd with SRAM's X01 DH 7 speed drivetrain, a RockShox Boxxer Team and a DT Swiss EX471 wheelset, the Glory 0 checks in at $6600 USD. The least expensive model, the Glory 27.5 2, will retail for $3000, and gets a more wallet friendly mix of parts, including RockShox Domain and Kage suspension, and a SRAM X5 9 speed drivetrain. It still has the same frame as the higher end versions, making this a good candidate for the rider who wants a bike that they can upgrade as their budget allows. The full specs for the three models can be viewed here.



Giant in Pemberton British Columbia July 2014.

Ride Impressions
bigquotesI was able to take a handful of laps on the Glory 27.5, just enough to start to get a feel for the bike. The Glory has the type of planted, stable manners you'd want from a downhill bike, while at the same time requiring little effort to manual or push hard into corners. One of the test trails had a 100 yard section that was filled with roots and rocks, but it was nearly perfectly straight, with good sight lines. This was where the speed that's possible on the Glory became apparent. Grabbing or not grabbing the brakes was a mental game - the bike was taking everything in stride, and it was just a matter of whether or not my brain could come to terms with how fast the terrain was flying by. Of course, wheelsize is still a contentious topic, especially when it comes to DH bikes, but during my time on the Glory I never felt like I was missing out by not having 26" wheels. Blasting into berms or doubling up sections of trail was just as fun, and made it easy to see how this bike could excel everywhere from the World Cup circuit to the bike park.


www.giant-bicycles.com


191 Comments

  • 122 3
 SOLD OUT!!, the whistler bikepark bought them all !
  • 45 4
 The Glorys have the reign at WBP, but damn that Reign is glorious!!
  • 39 3
 Indeed! These are some of the best looking bikes from GIANT in years!
  • 20 3
 Love the black and blue colour scheme. Most likely to represent the black and blue bruises the riders will have due to the overwhelming temptation to ride this bike to the limit.
  • 7 3
 Thats Glory looks.. Glorious , well more bad assed acually. Interesting that this 27.5 version is 5mm shorter than the 26.
  • 7 3
 Nailed the graphics and colors on the Reign!
  • 45 3
 Sorry to reign on your parade, but these bikes will be a giant success.
  • 1 0
 that's the same colours of the 2015 Megas, and the cube is that colour too.....definitely all the rage!
  • 2 0
 Giant will only send a handful to the states, shit happens every year.
  • 5 10
flag yeti951SD (Aug 4, 2014 at 7:41) (Below Threshold)
 You finally routed the cables correctly giant! Now just go back to Fox and Shimano and all will be well with the world!
  • 1 0
 I haven't said this about Giant before... these bikes both look FOOKIN AWESOME! Here in Taiwan, Giant bikes can be had at great prices. This is the first year since I moved here that I've considered getting one. Most guys here pay a premium to get a foreign brand. I'm glad they sacked the stylist of the old bikes and got someone in to make them look cool as all hell.
  • 68 2
 About time they ditched the overdrive 2 nonsense.
  • 9 0
 if only they got rid of it 2 years earlier, I wouldn't be stuck with that crap
  • 1 0
 \o/
  • 5 4
 Best looking new dh yet
  • 1 0
 Agreed, it was the main thing I had against the 2013 Reign at the time (Fox CTD damper issue wasn't well known until later), didn't stop me from buying one though, still no regrets, love my ride, and when the time comes I can get a new headset and stem, then turn my OD2 fork into a bar stool ;-)
www.pinterest.com/pin/460211655641965028

They've gone back to press-fit bb again, which makes sense on carbon frames but prefer threaded on AL, and getting a little fussy, I'd go the 150mm reverb over 125mm. Downtube guard and 12x142 both welcome additions, but haven't noticed that much flex or tyre rub against the seat stay. Reign paint job also looks the business!
  • 2 0
 i thought only the faith had overdrive 2, that 1 and 1/4 taper. besides the road bikes and such. the normal overdrive is just a normal taper no?
  • 1 0
 My 2013 Reign X0 came with it, but I only bought the frame. I was able to use the headset provided and run a standard taper fork (RS Totem). I was a little paranoid because I bought the fork first. I did plenty of research and determined it would all work out.
  • 2 0
 they have headsets for everything
  • 57 4
 The comment in the report "wheres the carbon version " really annoys me. You dont need carbon fibre to make a bloody good bike. Look at Sam Hill this weekend and the Athertons. Keep making ali frames please...it keeps the price down and it will still be bloody good.
  • 17 25
flag jrocksdh (Aug 3, 2014 at 15:31) (Below Threshold)
 Also its funny how many left winger enviro types run carbon! Same folks that run e cars I guess; which take way more fossil fuels to produce and hard to dispose of.
  • 21 11
 ^ Enviro type here, (and you should be too if you like spending time outside on your bike) I don't have a carbon bike and I drive a gas guzzeling suburu.
I don't know where these bogus generalizations are coming from, I've never even met a mountain biker that can afford an E car, but you should lay off the Fox news for a bit. Ya sound like that kook Bill O'reily.
  • 4 10
flag jrocksdh (Aug 3, 2014 at 20:40) (Below Threshold)
 Ha, I worked at fisker for a bit. Pretty interesting to learn about the "green movement".
A used/new prius can be pretty affordable. Used nissan hybrid, ..etc
Bill O'Reilly/Fox news,..no thanks most of those guys are hanging with k street and the chamber of commerce crooks.
Sierra club, epa...some bad dudes right there.
  • 3 7
flag WAKIdesigns (Aug 4, 2014 at 6:32) (Below Threshold)
 Enviro... it is easy to criticize someone for being an hipocrite when he claims to be an "enviro". It is quite easy to not be a hipcorite in the way of not giving a F hahahah Big Grin I thought a Prius has more horse power / engine discplacement than an average V12 wanker truck or V12 prick saloon, so which car is freaking stupid? Shall we compare how much BHP do you squeeze from an average Euro engine like the one from Audi, to a an average Ford, buahahah Big Grin Sure at this state hybrids are far from perfect, but they will get better in the future, look at MClaren P1 (oh those Enviro Euros ohhh...) Personal car is the problem not it's propulsion. Already now the start&stop and hybrid trucks are more enviro than any "normal" truck but most importantly they are CHEAPER in exploatation - having a company needing to move stocks and not using one is just plain stupid. Enviro - ahahahaha good one Big Grin

Cheers!
  • 11 1
 What's wrong with being an Enviromentalist? What would mtn biking be if we had to ride through miles of strip malls or oil fields. If science denying idiots ruled the world, the forest would have been torn down to make place for a desolate fracking wasteland, not the kind of epic trails I'm looking for.
  • 4 3
 empmw, nothing wrong with environmentalists. Every yin needs a yang. Environmentalists as you stated balance the world by slowing down the industrial push. However, I subscribe to realism. It's sad to me that people use the word 'fracking', as in hydraulic well fracturing, with negative connotations. The US has become the #1 producer of hydrocarbons, thanks to the advancements in new drilling and fracturing techniques. My background, personal interests and professional career have lead me to be an environmentalist as well, but I don't do so as an uniformed hypocrite either.
  • 1 3
 Empmw...the issue is when unelected bureaucrats can legislate. Science?
Maybe al gore can chime in here or his scientist emailing buddies.
Own any land? Got water/mineral rights? Ever tried to build on land you owned in tahoe, ca? The sierra club/epa lunatics are not friendly to mountain bikers.
Anyways, og point being that's its histarical how many enviros buy items bad for the enviro ie., carbon, lithium; have huge thirsty lawns...
Aka, limousine liberals/al gore and his mansions, jets...
  • 17 1
 i can't believe they are stranding the last 2-3 years of buyers with overdrive 2. poor bastards.
  • 12 0
 There is no alternative stems to begin with. So really makes no difference for the od2'ers. The question is why did they even start the OD2 if no stem company was going to back them up. Giant themselves did not even make any alternative short OD2 stems. So the OD2 buyers were stranded as soon as they bought there new bikes 2-3 years ago. Way to go Giant. At least they fixed there mistake.
  • 1 0
 Was that only on the reign or was it on the glory to?
  • 13 2
 I guess giant can't win here, people have been asking them to go back to a standard tapered steerer for years and then when they do, they get blasted for 'stranding' people who have bought their bikes...
  • 16 2
 And now they're inflicting custom-offset forks onto buyers? Won't they ever learn?
  • 1 0
 Speaking as an overdrive 2 customer... Good. I'm glad they went back to normal overdrive. OD2 wasn't what I was hoping for and the inconvience isn't worth any of the calculated (yet not perceivable) stiffness it was suppose to offer.
  • 2 0
 Funny you say that I have a 50mm od2 Giant stem on my Reign...
  • 6 0
 Only aftermarket OD2 stem I know of is the Chromag Ranger 50mm black stem.

These bikes still use an OD2 headtube, just goes to a standard tapered steer tube on forks again, which is a really smart move!

The marketing is strong with Giant though. If the OD2 is so much stronger than a standard tapered headtube, why not go to the extreme and offer a 1.5" headtube with a tapered fork allowing an even bigger bearing to be used in the top cup?
  • 1 0
 The headtube hasn't changed since the original OD, they just squeezed a 1 1/4 bearing into the headtube.
  • 2 0
 Syntace did an OD2 stem as well as Chromag
  • 1 0
 Chunked an Australian company is the only one I know that sells short OD2 stems as per their web page. www.chunked.com.au/Products-STEMS.html. I can't find any OD2 support with Chromag from their web site. I even tried to contact them and their dealers. Maybe the 50mm OD2 Ranger is a item of the past? Either way, I heard the reason Giant went 1.25 is because they believed that it does increase stiffness without adding much extra size or weight vs. the 1.5. Sounds a lot like a wheel size debate which 650b won. The OD2 should have won too IMO, there was a reason Giant started it. It's just that no one else supported it like they expected, and they did a bad job providing stem options too.
  • 1 0
 I've a chromag OD2 stem on a buddy's bike, so they do exist... giant still has a bunch of stems for fairly cheap actually- just looked on the off chance anyone is looking: www.giant-bicycles.com/en-us/gear/product/connect.sl.od2.stem/551/52923
  • 1 0
 Do you know of any 35mm OD2?
  • 2 1
 i don't, but there's another forum on here asking that same question. chromag's a cool bunch of guys - maybe ask them what minimum order is... or if you run fox, you might be able to go through them and buy a discounted steerer with kashima lowers... i dunno. what a PITA.
  • 23 8
 Oh yet anothercompany shortening the rear end... so many online debattles after the val-di-sole Gwin Demo chainstay-gate Can I already say: I freaking told you?
  • 6 0
 Please explain? You have my attention.
  • 9 1
 Gwin switched to spesh after 2 nearly flawless seasons... and started losing. Everybody went crazy and blamed it on the demo's short chainstays for some reason but a lot of manufacturers have been and still are trying to get the shortest chainstays possible so the whole "chainstay-gate" thing was baseless (I'll stay polite).

Honestly, I'm very far from being a pro but I've reached speedtrap-like speeds before on a demo (and other bikes with similar chainstay lengths) and never felt like I would benefit from a longer, more stable bike so I'm not too sure why people were so quick to blame it all on chainstay length.
  • 5 1
 A longer rear centre (or overall wheelbase) isn't the only reason stability is effected.

Talk to the Moto guys who have been doing this for decades longer than mountain bikers and see why they don't stand on the rear axle...
  • 10 5
 I was just saying.back then, that short rear end of a demo has next to nothing to do with Gwins performance. I was also saying that short rear ends are more fun to ride and you win more than you loose. As PLC07 says there is more to stability than cs length like handlebar width, stem length, head angle, bb drop, bb height, wheel size, fork trail, wheel base, suspension setup can of worms. Finaly any rider able to qualify to WC finals is so skilled and can adapt to bike and terrain so well that the whole cs-gate is a one big mental wank, thank you
  • 10 0
 444,5 - 439,0 = 5,5 mm shorter CS. This is the difference you are talking about. Even if it still was 26" wheel platform difference, it would not mean that much of a significant change. Actually I had three frames called giant glory measured with a precise tool (approximation 0,01mm). This tool exposed something to me, that I could not believe, but it is true. Even two frames of the same year and model, of the same size differ in dimensions. The differences can be measured larger than we think. I noticed several cases of differences up to 5mm and many of 2mm. I suppose these are due to welding or other manufacturing processes and do not belong to Giant alone. Geo chart is something that can be read and compared, but reality is something else. Each frame has own individual "soul". It may sound funny, but we all agree that there is no way of having two frames welded identically. Just look at the TIG pattern, and their tiny differences. Even if a robot welds them, the material in its internal, even molecular structure (maybe temperature changes) speaks for the differences that just cannot be done elseway. So this is not about making something in untidy way. Having in mind your 5,5mm point. Yes, you have compared geo charts and this fact cannot be denied, but this is a whole new 650b platform and I don't think we can compare it this way, as far as what shorter cs would result in a 26"bike. Larger wheel and shorter chainstay are difficult to combine in one swingarm, but even if it is really so, a frame offered to a customer may not have even that small difference there. In my opinion it starts from more around 10mm and 0,5 degree that we can feel any difference in handling.
  • 4 1
 you are correct but ths bike industry does not want to admit that quality controll is lacking. i have had some bad frames in my life time. forks. have the same isues. take the same fork. some work better than others.
  • 5 1
 @jclnv I don't see the point of your comparison. I don't know much about moto so correct me if I'm wrong but they can go much faster than we can and they don't seem to need much handling precision in the vast majority of their disciplines. Yeah, long chainstays make sense for them but when you navigate very technical terrain at low speeds, I noticed that even a difference of a few millimetres in chainstay length makes a significant positive difference to the handling.
  • 1 1
 I am not sure it is "quality". Can we say "quality" about differences between human bodies? Things just differ and that is the way it all exists in this world. We are familiar with nature being always slighlty individual in each case, but it is just the same with machines. There was a lot of thinking in my head after the measuring and I came to such a conclusion. If I don't cannot really feel any change in handling which results in a 2mm difference in some frame dimensions and I tend to do all that I can to have a unique bike, I should even like the fact that each single frame and part is a bit individual even bought new. So this "lack of quality control", as you name it, does not bother me untill it all fits together, works fine and is strong and safe. Afterall the surfaces we ride on are not that straight and precise too.
  • 8 1
 @PLC07 Motorcycles don't have to bother about pedalling (their engine strokes are faster), so their suspension design is generally simplier. If you watch MX riders they don't have to move their bodies so much to control the bike or to move it at all, e.g. jumping technique. This is why even if they go faster, designers don't have to think that much over geometry (or rather at so many aspects of it), becasue engine torque control is a vast part of riding. A performance bicycle is generally very hard to design and create, because there is only human power and weight that moves it around. As for chainstay, the shorter it is, the easier to do a manual, or wheelie on a bicycle. Longer chainstay, would make it harder (just like riding the long tail of Knolly Podium). When you ride a chassis with an engine, short chainstay makes it even dangerous, because of the fact that it helps to lift the front wheel. A very long chainstay in a motorcycle does not mean a wheelie is impossible. They just have more torque than our legs. About 150 times more of it. This changes the game so much that comparing geometry is about pointless.
  • 4 0
 @jedrzeja Mx riders probably move their bodies just as much if not more.. Riding in two feet deep ruts is not effortless like it looks like on the tv.
  • 1 0
 @PLC I'm trying to follow along here, pardon my ignorance. So does "in theory" a shorter chainstay provide better quick technical maneuvering while a longer one provides better speed control? And what exactly was Qwin trying for when he switched bikes--"chainstay gate"?
  • 1 0
 Think where the mass (the rider) is located on the bike relative to the wheelbase. Think about the effect on weight distribution (grip), the effect on suspension, pitch stability etc.

A case can be made for a short rear centre on a DH bike and steep descents. For an AM/trail bike it makes little sense. Like head angle, BB height, trail etc there is an optimum measurement.
  • 5 5
 A case can be made that we have no bloody clue, and the length of online essays does not make it any better
  • 4 0
 Speak for yourself.
  • 3 6
 Then can you present your fallus and speak your experience in cooperation rider/ frame designer?
  • 2 1
 I´d like to clarify: we, humans, can produce more torque than a MX engine...do the math, your full weight on a pedal Wink
I haven´t measured any frames yet, but I find it very strange for welding tolerances to be that huge on frames, thought Taiwan would do better..On the other hand, you can have a very precise measuring device and ruin all the measurements up by not using it correct (no offence). Car factories produce over 1000 cars a day all within 0.1mm...so if the (not sure if you can even can call that) tolerance is so big on bicycles, they are definitely overcharging.
And trust me, geometry on a motorcycle is as important as on a bicycle!
  • 1 0
 It may be so that my measurement differences came from the fact that the frames were all used, and had some loads of experience in resisting heavy abuse. Even if there is a probability that I was using the tool incorrectly, or the tool was broken, the measurements were done all in the same way, by the same eye. You are right. Torque produced by human legs is greater than some mechanical one in a moto. I just used a wrong word. It should be power rather than torque, because it involves the huge difference in the number of revs per minute. Measureing car bodies after few years of usage gives differences like 20, 30mm. This is visible if you try to replace some welded in parts. I learned about it visiting car services. Car body changes its shape even under load of its engine, not mentioning about cornering, breaking etc. This way people use struts and tube reinforcements in sport. If you turn a bicycle tight on a tormac surface, you can hear rear tire gripping and loosing traction. This is because a small radius corner forces the rear wheel to turn like a pivot, around theoretically one point, or smaller and smaller patch, the smaller the radius is. If we have a 650b wheel now, its larger patch has been discussed to death, but apart from better traction, it also means it is harder to turn it. Slightly shorter chainstay could be applied to minimise the effect of a larger wheel, with a larger patch being harder to turn. Some riders like to slide the rear tire in corners so shorter chainstay can make it easier to slide a larger wheel into a gentle drift. This is not only money they are trying to make with their magical 650b. It's their first attempt, so the troubles and trials start here with more and more work to do.
  • 1 1
 @jedrzeja in two normal length sentences, what is your main point?
  • 2 0
 If I could write it in two sentences, there would be two sentences. If you cannot understand my point, just skip it.
  • 1 1
 If you can't make a point in two sentences... well never mind. Thanks for playing.
  • 3 0
 Read all the comments above. I answered some of them. There are three major points in my last comment. Why would I need to make it in two sentences? BTW I am sorry, but English is not my native, so I try my best. It all seems clear to me and you just seem lazy to me.
  • 3 0
 It's not really that hard to understand jedrjeza's points (there are like 4 of them), but it would help if he split them up by the comments he's responding to. Couple thoughts from me though...

(a) There can be no argument that short CSs make for a tighter turning radius and easier front end lifting, but like others have said, there are so many other factors that affect ride feel that it's ludicrous to point at CS length alone as the key handling trait. Comparing CSs between moto and mtb is silly though, because the power curves and levels of rider feedback are completely different. Put a moto engine on a DH bike and you'll spend your whole day laying on your back.

(b) Jedrjeza, I understand what you're saying but if anything shorter CSs would give you more rear traction (possibly harder to drift) by putting your COM closer to the rear contact patch. Plus, the rear wheel can only pivot the way you describe at very low speeds. As a counterexample, touring bikes (without loaded bags) are super easy to skid but impossible to wheelie. They have massive chainstays, which robs the back wheel of weight, and they steer like a limousine.

(c) Anyone who says they can feel the difference between 2-5 mm of chainstay length is likely nuts. On the other hand, 5mm would be f*cking atrocious quality control. I would be very surprised if it was that much. Not sure what tool was used, but a 5mm difference could be the result of a +/- 2.5 mm (~0.5%) uncertainty, which could easily come from lack of parallelism or similar during measuring. I can't think of any reason why a frame assembled on a jig would have half a centimeter of tolerance, unless the heat treatment warps it like crazy.

(d) @Reignonme Two sentences?? Come on... that's more of a marketing rule. Tons of scientific points are impossible to state in 2 sentences (unless it's a BS marketing pitch).
  • 1 2
 I used to rave on easyness of lifting the front wheel up, jumping bunny hopping, popping off roots on my 405mm hardtail, until I took away two clicks from forks return...
  • 2 0
 "Comparing CSs between moto and mtb is silly though, because the power curves and levels of rider feedback are completely different."

It has nothing to do with power. It has to do with front to rear grip differential. Weight distribution is critical regardless of the rider/vehicle combination weighs 100kg or 300kg.

It's exactly why Gwin was crashing on the stock Demo after coming from the Session. His body position (mass) was in the wrong place. If a guy with that much talent struggles to adapt then what chance do average riders have?

The myth of short rear centre length is used as a marketing tool by companies and a misunderstood public (half of who can't ride for shit) to improve low speed agility at the expense of high speed predictability, neutral front to rear grip and suspension spring rates.
  • 2 0
 @bkm303-- maybe I exaggerated the 2 sentences. Your post was very concise and easy to interpret. Just trying to learn here and I appreciate the informative dialogue. Nice break from PB trolls.
  • 1 0
 @bkm303 thank you. I always split seperate answers in one comment, but Pinkbike submiter puts it often together to shorten the text.

a) I agree about the weight bias, but out of my experince it is easier for me to drift rear end with a shorter cs. It seems illogical now after the COM argument, but this is how I feel it riding. Here @Waki may have a point in mentioning about the fork. Rebound adjustment, unless very radical one, does not affect any of my jumping. Thus it may all be a matter of different techniques we all own, to do a similar trick. I think I lean my body over back wheel and to the inside of a corner while trying to slide rear tire, so it is more about lateral momentum.

b) I meant low speeds because it is visible this way, but I don't believe the phenomenon does no occur while serious shredding. You also assume that your COM is always at some constant point set between axles. This is more likely to be stable in motorbikes since a moving rider does not stand for 90% of the whole vehicle. Motorbikes have always more centred mass, because, among others, heavy engine stays in the same place.

c) I know measurements should be done parallel, but it does not matter when I measure two identical frames and compare differences between them not with a geo chart that shows us real (parallel) measurements. All of the frames were used ones. After few years of riding. This way I think frames change their dimensions when ridden a lot, even if it does not really matter to what we can feel riding.

d) Immagine a listener standing up after an hour and a half of a lecture and saying: "in two normal length sentences, what is your main point?"

@jclnv You are right about different rider feedback, but if you sit on your bike and try to lift your front wheel with one pedal stroke only, a shorter CS will help, so the more power you have and the less you want to wheelie to longer the cs should be, right?
  • 1 0
 Concluding, I got convinced in my logic that its all about localisation of mass centre, but this never stays in the same point untill you sit down.
So where a mass centre should be localised then? ..and does it really matter that slacker head angle should result in longer cs and so on? I've heard from Intense that they pushed it forwards in the 951evo to improve front grip because of the larger wheels, whatever they mean by this. Especially when their headangle is 62.5.

When I compare 951evo to the giant glory above I can see 62.5 vs 63 degrees of HA, and 444.5mm vs 43.9mm of CS 64 vs 63.6 SA, almost similar wheelbases. The frames all almost the same! First attempt of the big producers and they all try to sell us the same geo. 650B magic narrows their geometry variations.
  • 1 2
 jclnv "It's exactly why Gwin was crashing on the stock Demo after coming from the Session. His body position (mass) was in the wrong place. If a guy with that much talent struggles to adapt then what chance do average riders have?"

I see you still are an idiot. You are a fkng idiot, yes I can tell it by reading what you wrote. Belief in CS-gate is characteristic to a mind believing in 9/11 or moon landing conspiracy. You know shit about riding a bike if you believe that a change from a Session to Demo changed anything for his results. Aaron had a lot of stuff on his head after move from Specialized and bike change was quite a small bit of the whole picture, messy change of sponsors, messy change of coach . He said it himself in a dozen of the interviews: it wasn't the bike, in the interview for Dirt he even laughed that not matter what he said, people still know better.

You are welcome Smile
  • 1 1
 How bout this. A skilled rider can win a race on a shit bike . The best riders win because of skill. The equipment just needs to work.
As consumers that cant ride any where close to the speeds and skill level of pros we like to discuss about the subtle differences in frames and parts so we can justify our purchase.
i have freinds with old crappy bikes that can ride any trail with skill and precision that 90% of you will never experience.
I get a big kick out of the ignorent comments from riders who think they understand what it takes to win a race but are average in skill. You have no f*cking clue what you are talking about. lol
Waki knows his shit when it comes to bike desighn but his sweet sarcasm went out the window. Missin the Waki sarc.
  • 1 0
 @WAKIdesigns

If you know what you're looking at you could see, especially in that early Redbull promo, that Gwin was a mess on the 420mm RC Demo compared to the Session. Those guys can ride around anything in time but it was obvious to some that he was having issues. Plus that is on a DH bike with specific use. Weight distribution is far more important on a Trail/AM bike.

Do you really think he would blame the bike? Really?

Moto GP riders spend seasons getting weight distribution down to the mm and they're riding 360lb motorbikes on predominantly flat circuits. Now think, a mountain bike rider weighs 150lbs+/- and a mountain bike weighs 30lbs+/-...

If you don't understand the implications of that fact you should buy some vehicle dynamics books and start reading.
  • 1 0
 Nobody should name anybody an idiot on Pinkbike. Professional is a rider who is sponsored and earns money riding. That would be racing or showing off in front of camera for commercials. All the people I know, or heard of, became professionals because of riding a lot and learning skills. This is acquired by years of practice. Practically if you ignore most of everyday duties, like school, household, job or anything, and you only ride, there is no choice but to become a professional. Off course there should be talent somewhere, but nobody knows how to do a backflip just because of probable talent. It is always tons of practice, blood, sweat and injuries. If you practice a lot, you use your bike a lot. Therefore you know it so well, that even a tiny change like replacing a worn rubber grip, changes the feel of the bike. Being so well skilled you still know how to backflip on your new bike, but it takes some time to learn your new equipment, so it becomes a body prolongation in saving seconds. Tiny change in geometry might mean losing or crashing, but only to professional, or a person who trains for couple hours every day and not for even an ambitious serious amateur. I've seen Filip Polc racing a bike that was just not so well maintained, gently saying. There were completely loose spokes, nuts and stuff like that, but I don't believe that winning the event was important to him. He finished teenth.
  • 18 2
 That Reign is freakn awesome!
  • 14 22
flag camhayes (Aug 3, 2014 at 10:50) (Below Threshold)
 ya but kinda looks like a new marin bike
  • 9 2
 I love giant bicycles and I think I just found my perfect enduro bike
  • 2 0
 Yes, they do look a lot alike. Both bikes look marvelous!
  • 18 2
 I miss the Faith.
  • 15 1
 I wish I could buy a new bike every 2 months.....
  • 10 0
 Nice job Mike and Sterling on this article... no B.S. just the drool inducing facts....Thanks guys!!
  • 12 2
 Actually the first year I like of Giants colour scemes.
  • 1 0
 yeah, very mellow.
  • 5 0
 A number of years ago, I attended the UBI bike school in Ashland, OR and one of the instructors was a former employee of Giant and was telling us that Giant (and most major brands) have a 3 year projection rate of bikes to be publicly released. Case in point, I'm more than willing to bet they have a developed carbon version ready for a 2016 rollout as we speak...
  • 1 0
 Nah I doubt it
  • 3 0
 So what does - "not poppy and more planted" mean? does the long TT mean its more of an Xc bike with long legs (like many other enduro bikes with similar geo) or still something that likes to be thrown around and jumped.

I am 6"3 and ride a large 2013 Reign with 785mm bars and a 50mm stem. Climbs superbly and is super easy to jump. I do sometimes wish for more space in the cockpit when standing - it feels as if I am using extra energy maintaining the correct position. Would the new frames geo solve that problem?

The rear suspension sounds a bit soft and too progressive- much like my bike was before I added the largest volume reducer Fox make. No bottoming on jumps and still getting max travel.

Good to see the Pike and RS shocks on all the bikes.
  • 3 0
 Helicopter mountain biking just made my bucket list. These are cool but I will keep my 26" Reign X with 180 Talus for all things rocky, rooty and big that I have to pedal to. Then in 5 years when they bring back 26" bikes I will pull it out and dust it off for another go-round of high fashion.
  • 5 0
 Damn that pricepoint on the glory 2 is right with kona's percept DH bike, cool to see things spec'd on a budget too
  • 3 0
 Nice catch! Very partial to konas personally, but if I had it to spend, I'm going for the glory.
  • 4 2
 Nice looking bikes and glad to see some major improvements like thru axle rear end, beefier shock and no OD2. Unfortunately it's too late for them with me after buying a '11 Reign that blew through rear travel like a sponge (bettered by Push for $250, Giant never returned my emails nor dealer helped), had a sloppy rear end and shitty screeching brakes out of the box. Again nice bikes now but I don't see how this is better than a Heckler or Stumpy (@ 4k), I've learned my lesson the hard way and will avoid these guys like the plague...
  • 3 2
 The poor performance of the sponge(fox) is hardly to blame on Giant.
  • 2 0
 That's what products are tested for. If it doesn't perform then go elsewhere.
  • 1 0
 I agree fox rear shock was shit, even more so the fork, I liked the frame tough. My conclusion is avoid fox like the plague, this time around Giant comes with RS and has addressed the issue of the rear axle. On the other hand it's pretty bad service not returning mail so I get why you wouldn't give it one another try.

I have RS PIKE now, and really it's just a fork doing what you expect it to do - all the excitement speaks more of the crap we have been fed before.

I always thought Giant been pretty good value for the money - and that's what I'm looking for - but with all the new mail order bikes(YT, Canyon, ROSE..) it will probably be a while before a regular company gets my money.
  • 1 0
 I'm also very interested in YT and Canyon. Awesome looking bikes that seem to perform incredibly well. I recently bought a Bronson C and am very happy with it. Spec'd a Pike on it and am loving it. The fox rear shox that came on the frame seems to also do a good job but of course that's largely in part due to SC taking great care of what goes onto their bikes (it's tuned to perform on it). I don't think fox is total dirt, the manufacturers are the ones that need to make sure it operates properly on their frames. Giant is a good value all in all, can't take that away from them and hopefully they'll come through from here on to be a brand that also holds that value.
  • 18 16
 Not read the Reign review or seen the specs, but can probably summarise: "650b, 160mm travel, slack head angle.....climbs well, rips on the downhill.....buy one now if you want an enduro machine"
  • 24 3
 You're close, but I'd still encourage you to read before commenting. You might learn something.
  • 4 2
 This wasn't really a criticism, because what else can you say to all of these cool bikes being released Smile . . . . .I read and it was an interesting read, thanks! Looks / acts quite like the Norco Range
  • 2 0
 When can we expect a full review on the Giant Reign?????
  • 3 0
 Finally they route the cables correctly on the inside of the downtube drop the worst idea ever on O2, not bad at all, Regin does look dialled and Glory will be popular.
  • 1 0
 I agree with the revised offset fork idea!
First thing I noticed w/trek slash via parking lot test (I rode it on trails too), was that the front end wanted to flop to the side, even just sitting still and taking hands off bars.

Why are the geo charts never readable (mobile v.)? Same article on vital is...
  • 2 1
 Why wont most companies stop playing games and give us the frame weight WITH the rear shock that comes stock with bike? A few companies actually have the honesty to do so, Transition for example gives frame weight and explains what shock gave it that weight. Yes, all shocks have different weights. However, the OEM spec does come with a specific shock. So Lame
  • 1 0
 WOW, that is a beautiful Reign Advanced. Just got a Trance Advanced SX and now sort of wish I could get this bike! I guess the price would likely have prevented me to purchase it anyway, just have to drool I guess. Work of art, love the pain job too. I hope they don't decide to slap a GIANT logo on the side of it and leave it as is!
  • 1 0
 WOW, that is a beautiful Reign Advanced. Just got a Trance Advanced SX and now sort of wish I could get this bike! I guess the price would have prevented me to purchase it anyway, just have to drool I guess. Work of art, love the paint job too. I hope they don't decide to slap a GIANT logo on the side of it and leave it as is!
  • 1 0
 Looks like a good bike for aggressive Enduro, however on everything else I just cant see it being that fun of an all rounder. My carbon Trance Advanced SX is simply the perfect bike for every trail. I am really disappointed Giant has dropped the carbon version of the Trance advanced SX. It is the perfect blend.
  • 1 0
 I am interested in the 1x aluminum Reign build for $4750 with the Orange color frame. Is that available in more colors? I am not a fan of the orange per say.
Your link to the Reign specs is down too BTW. Thanks.
  • 1 0
 The orange one is actually $6000. They screwed up on the artical. And no your stuck with that color. And they are not just selling the frame.
  • 1 0
 ok thanks for the reply bud.. I guess that settles it, I wont be getting that bike.

If they had a frame only option in aluminum for a fair price i would be interested in that but you say not happening, so...

I spec'd out a build kit for pimpin' stuff to fit my needs exactly @ $3495, if the framset was available like the older style reign x was @$1600 range you
could custom build your own bike nicer than the stock parts for $5100 before tax... But Giant wants to make this difficult to do custom builds I guess.
  • 2 0
 I already went to the bike shop today and ordered the carbon team reign. Planning on stripping a bunch of the parts and putting what I want on it. They think I am crazy.
  • 3 0
 Thats alot of bread man.. I am hoping you get bro deal through your shop, otherwise you could be 10k after tax with goodies if you pay full pop.
  • 1 0
 Dude they're right. Shelling out that kind of coin for a spec you don't like? Not saying I know what's best for your wallet but damn. There are so many great bikes out there, I'm sure you can find one that comes with a build you like. Even with a bro deal that's a lot of coin. Hope you get some great resale on those takeoffs.
  • 1 0
 Going to sell the parts that come off. Thanks guys but not worried about the money
  • 1 0
 Please list your build, curious to see what changes you'd make. I think the only thing that I would change is the brakes, Hope or Shimano, and slap on a nice wide carbon bar. Even the tires are perfect!
  • 1 0
 First thing is the brakes. Switching to XTR levers with saint calipers. the seat post will be switched to a KS lev 150mm. I was debating on switching the rims to the EX but after reading reviews on the XM rims I will give them a go. The bars will get switched out to some wider ones not sure witch ones yet. Going to get rid of the XX drive train and get the new XTR. The reason behind that is where I live we have very long steep climbs and equally long steep fast descents. the new XTR will be 2X11 which will give a better range in gears for where I live. I wish the XX came in a 2x as I prefer sram drivetrains over shimano
  • 1 0
 Very nice, will be an amazing bike I'm sure. Do you find the Lev 150mm better than a Reverb Stealth 150? Assumed they came with EX, didn't notice till you mentioned it. Maybe get the Pike Avalanched as well?
  • 1 0
 Well the reverb in the 30.9 does not come in a 150 mm only the 31.6 comes in the 150mm. To me they both felt the same except the trigger.
  • 2 0
 Nice rigs! But please, more info on "a helicopter ride to the top of a nearby peak followed by a 6,500 foot descent back down to the valley floor."
  • 1 0
 I'm excited for these to hit dealers! I'm in the market for a new bike and there are a lot of new options out there! I can't wait to start shopping I'm like a kid before Christmas!
  • 1 0
 Big question...
Will the reign be compatible with a 150 stealth reverb? Or does the reverb only come in in 125 in the st dia. that giant uses?
I hate double dropn...
Hope we can get a frame/shock only option!
  • 4 0
 ineedmoremoney
  • 3 0
 You and me both.
  • 3 1
 I've been thinking of downsizing to a long travel AM rig and that Reign is now on my radar.
  • 3 1
 Next years bike purchases already decided, Glory 1 and Reign 2. Sorry to all other manufacturers.
  • 1 0
 Was just going to say, the Glory 1 seems to be a solid kit. Looks like it's a pretty solid component spec.
  • 1 1
 Seems like the custom dh 27.5 fork is easy: throw pike lowers on a boxxer.
What I want to see is whether the rear end is stiffer on either hard charger. If so I'd consider on in a few years.
  • 1 0
 Too bad the bike specs don't match up with the actual bike you tested. I was looking forward to seeing the SRAM Guide Ultimate Carbon levers.
  • 1 0
 Unfortunately the Guide brakes weren't ready in time for the demo bikes - they'll be in place once the Reign arrives in bike shops.
  • 2 1
 A 65 headtube angle AM! I have a old school giant trance(200Cool for xc riding whose headtube angle is 73, a excellent climbing machine.
  • 3 1
 I hate press fit bottom brackets. Most people I know that have press fit has have creaks and problems.
  • 2 0
 No BB is perfect, that's for sure.
Try Loctite 609 retaining compound with a Loctite 7649 primer for the creaking. These are acceptable for composite & metal shells as well as the Delrin cups.
  • 1 0
 The PF30 in my CovertCF is actually the best and longest-lasting bottom bracket I've ever had. 1500km of hard Whistler riding and it's still box-fresh. I did have a creak develop which I assumed the BB because of everyone else's experiences, but swapped out, rebuild, all the same. It's actually the spider/crank interface on my XX1 that's the issue.
  • 2 0
 They all look great! After market OD2 stems are available from Chromag. Just need to see the new Trance SX now.....
  • 1 0
 There's no Trance SX for 2015 AFAIK. It was replaced with the Reign.
  • 1 0
 Trance SX for the U.S. Market so far. It's a blueish colour with the same graphics as '14. No Advanced SX on the U.S. website this year. Seems the Reign Advanced has taken that spot in the lineup.
  • 2 1
 You are right Fuzzy. I wonder why we don't get it? More Maestro bikes are sold in Australia than any other country - we should get the whole range.

That Trance SX is a great bike. So fast down a hill, and not too shabby at climbing considering that.
  • 2 1
 Well, I believe that the lineup for each country is decided by each countries head offices so to speak. Hence the reason for '14 the U.S. market only had the trance 1 and 3 while Canada had all 4 models. The U.S. Website is the only one thats updated to '15 so far. I'd guess you'll see the SX in Australia. Its a pretty popular model from what I understand. Also the'15 is a bit better spec'd overall compared to last years. Avid, RS and SRAM vs. fox and shimano.
  • 4 0
 I wanna f*ck that Reign
  • 4 0
 That would be a new definition of 'press fit'.
  • 5 1
 I'm gonna Glory hole it with my Giant ****.
  • 1 0
 Shiit now im not sure what im gonna do when I sell my bike, save a little bit more and get the glory 2 or just straight up buy a used specialized demo... GAHHHH!!
  • 1 0
 So is there still a reign x these days or is it just the one now? This new reign sounds more like the old x rather than the old standard reign.
  • 1 0
 Pretty laughable that a $3,000 bike can be offered with peasant grade X5 parts.

Its gotta cost them like $5 more to move up to at least X7.
  • 1 0
 why is there not a price por the 01 glory?..... I cant afford a 00 glory.... and I dont want the 02...... why can I get the 01 in the US? can some one help me?
  • 1 0
 Im just trying to find these bikes in Canada and cant find them at all! Im from the UK and can find them on almost every site for sale so how come Canada doesn't have them?
  • 2 0
 finally! the glory looks so stealthy now!
  • 3 0
 My wallet can't hang.
  • 2 0
 Sooo short time sooooo many new bikes
  • 2 1
 I always wanted the Glory 0 and with this color scheme i want it even more..
  • 2 0
 one of the best "price v.s. performance" choice on the market...
  • 1 0
 Ohh well be prepared for everyone to sell there old glories for this bad boy
  • 1 0
 Whas the seat tube dia?
That just sucks if the bike doesn't take a 150 reverb...
  • 4 4
 I'm so happy that I've bought my 26" summum last year. no need to buy dildo instead of seat for new 27.5 DH frame of any manufacturer being sold this year
  • 2 0
 they look sweet but $8250 for a reign
  • 2 0
 Finally learning not to put 32mm stanchions on 6inch bikes. Yay.
  • 2 0
 When can we expect a full review on the Giant Reign?????
  • 1 0
 Glory looks a bit crampled but the reign is gorgeus!
  • 1 0
 Thanks Mike, good write up
  • 1 0
 this is the first glory I actually like! good job giant!!!
  • 1 1
 I know its early but does anyone know if they are offering frames on the reign? I'd love to build one
  • 1 0
 No frames!
  • 1 0
 thank you for letting me know!
  • 2 0
 Holy slack!
  • 1 0
 How does the Reign climb with that 65 degree HA?
  • 1 0
 damn! bought the glory this year. shoudve waited I guess. looks awsome
  • 1 0
 hats off to giant this year, they nailed it.
  • 1 0
 Dammit...The top of the line Reign Advanced Team ($8250)....
  • 1 0
 Is there a 26 inch version still going to be available?
  • 1 0
 Nice, I looking to sell my 2011 Reign to get me either of these!
  • 1 0
 New giant glory = kona operator?
  • 1 0
 Now i can change my glory 2012...
  • 1 0
 Does anybody know whether the Reign will be available in the UK?
  • 1 0
 when can i buy this bike in the uk????????????????
  • 2 1
 Giant nailed it.
  • 1 1
 let's still wait for carbon...
  • 1 0
 Orgasm... O_O
  • 1 1
 Had a 2012 reign and it was light this new one looks and sounds awesome
  • 1 0
 MSRP on the Glory1?
  • 1 1
 let me have a wank on those 2 sexys first, then i will comment
  • 1 0
 what about the reign x?
  • 1 0
 I like them.
  • 8 9
 wheres the carbon glory
  • 9 1
 From the article: "Of course, the question that will inevitably arise is “Where's the carbon version?” Giant wouldn't comment, but it does seem that that would be the next logical step, and they certainly have the manufacturing facilities to make it happen."
  • 4 1
 It's like one of the easiest frames to make from carbon too! Nothing complicated like a split seat tube or anything!
  • 9 2
 Why is everyone hyped up on carbon DH bikes? I have Three friends on their second frames so far this year. And it is from two different manufactures. Two of the frames were warranty but one was not. After looking at them I would honestly say that the same in aluminum wouldn't have failed. Yes we do see failed aluminum frames but I my opinion for a park/DH bike I would not go carbon.
  • 4 5
 There is no doubt that Carbon is stronger and lighter. Just watch the Santa Cruz testing videos.
  • 9 7
 You believe a Santa Cruz testing video? Oh right if it is on the internet it is true. The internet people have police watching for un-truth's.
  • 2 3
 Giants are renowned for being overbuilt, you don't need carbon.
  • 2 1
 Aluxx SL is some pretty good stuff.... I could be wrong but I believe its 6013, a VERY ideal material, much more so than one would think.

www.alcoa.com/mill_products/catalog/pdf/alloy6013techsheet.pdf
  • 1 3
 First time Giants have actually had colors that aren't embarrassing.
  • 1 0
 I dunno, the 08 Glory is pretty sexy, IMO
  • 1 1
 Actually, I was talking about the Reign only, not the glory. The glory would still be better without massive Giant signs all over it.
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