Review: 2020 Norco Sight C1 - Bigger, Burlier & Better
Norco shook up their catalog for 2020, and while the model names may be the same, the bikes themselves are significantly different. Take the Sight, for instance. It previously had 130mm of rear travel and fell squarely into the trail category, but the latest version now has 150mm of travel and a 160mm fork up front.
Norco call it an all-mountain bike, a term that I actually like, even though it's fallen out of fashion in favor due to the rise of enduro. Enduro turned into something of a catch-all term for all longer travel bikes, but now we're starting to see a split emerge – on one side you have bikes that fall into that all-rounder category, and on the other you have even longer travel bikes that can still be pedaled to the top but are more focused on the descending side of the equation.
Norco call it an all-mountain bike, a term that I actually like, even though it's fallen out of fashion in favor due to the rise of enduro. Enduro turned into something of a catch-all term for all longer travel bikes, but now we're starting to see a split emerge – on one side you have bikes that fall into that all-rounder category, and on the other you have even longer travel bikes that can still be pedaled to the top but are more focused on the descending side of the equation.
Norco Sight C1 Details
• Wheel size: 29" (27.5" options available)
• Carbon frame, aluminum chainstays
• Travel: 150mm rear / 160mm front
• 64-degree head angle
• 440mm chainstays (size L)
• 12 x 148mm rear axle spacing
• Price as shown: $6,697 USD
• Weight: 32 lb (size large, as shown)
• www.norco.com
• Wheel size: 29" (27.5" options available)
• Carbon frame, aluminum chainstays
• Travel: 150mm rear / 160mm front
• 64-degree head angle
• 440mm chainstays (size L)
• 12 x 148mm rear axle spacing
• Price as shown: $6,697 USD
• Weight: 32 lb (size large, as shown)
• www.norco.com
Carbon or aluminum, 29” or 27.5” wheels – the Sight is offered in multiple configurations, and Norco even has an online Build Your Ride program, where riders can select things like frame color, frame material, and select from a few different suspension and drivetrain packages.
The combo reviewed here goes for $6,697 USD, with spec highlights that include a SRAM X01 12-speed drivetrain, RockShox Lyrik Ultimate fork, Super Deluxe Select + shock, and Code RSC brakes. DT Swiss M1700 aluminum wheels are mounted with a Minion DHF / DHR II EXO+ combo.
 | The geometry numbers that make the Sight such a comfortable climber work even better on the descents, where the balanced positioning really comes into play. |
Construction and Features
The new Sight retains the Horst link suspension design and trunnion mounted shock as before, but it has a more refined look, and there have been improvements in a few key areas.
There's internal cable routing, with a port on the underside of the downtube that a zip-tie goes through to cinch everything down. The housing no longer goes under the bottom bracket, eliminating the chance of it getting pinched against a rock or root. A full-size water bottle easily fits inside the front triangle, and there are two bolts under the top tube that can be used to secure a tube or tools. A ribbed chainstay protector helps minimize chainslap, and two rubber pads protect the downtube from flying rocks and shuttle-related scratches.
Norco went with a 34.9mm seat tube diameter, a dimension that's becoming increasingly common as dropper post travel amounts increase and seat tubes shrink, a scenario that means the loads put on posts are larger than ever. On that note, the size medium and large frames come with a 175mm dropper, and the XL gets a post with 200mm of travel.
![Norco Sight 2020 review]()
![Norco Sight 2020 review]()
![Norco Sight 2020 review]()
The new Sight retains the Horst link suspension design and trunnion mounted shock as before, but it has a more refined look, and there have been improvements in a few key areas.
There's internal cable routing, with a port on the underside of the downtube that a zip-tie goes through to cinch everything down. The housing no longer goes under the bottom bracket, eliminating the chance of it getting pinched against a rock or root. A full-size water bottle easily fits inside the front triangle, and there are two bolts under the top tube that can be used to secure a tube or tools. A ribbed chainstay protector helps minimize chainslap, and two rubber pads protect the downtube from flying rocks and shuttle-related scratches.
Norco went with a 34.9mm seat tube diameter, a dimension that's becoming increasingly common as dropper post travel amounts increase and seat tubes shrink, a scenario that means the loads put on posts are larger than ever. On that note, the size medium and large frames come with a 175mm dropper, and the XL gets a post with 200mm of travel.
Geometry & Sizing
The Sight has a 64-degree head angle, and the size large has a 485mm reach and 440mm chainstays. That chainstay length changes depending on the frame size in order to maintain the same balanced ride no matter the size.
The seat tube angle is a relatively steep 77.7 degrees, and it actually gets steeper, rather than slacker as you go up the size range. That way, taller riders don't end up sitting over the rear axle when they have their dropper post fully extended.
The Sight has a 64-degree head angle, and the size large has a 485mm reach and 440mm chainstays. That chainstay length changes depending on the frame size in order to maintain the same balanced ride no matter the size.
The seat tube angle is a relatively steep 77.7 degrees, and it actually gets steeper, rather than slacker as you go up the size range. That way, taller riders don't end up sitting over the rear axle when they have their dropper post fully extended.
Suspension Design
The Sight's overall leverage rate has been increased compared to the previous model, which was done to improve the bike's small bump compliance and grip. The leverage rate goes from 3.2 to 2.6, a change of 18.75%. Norco's goal was to create a smooth ramp-up at the end of the stroke without going overboard on the amount of progression.
The Sight's anti-squat number is 126% off the top, and 110% at sag, numbers that were selected to give the bike a supportive platform while climbing no matter if the rider is seated or standing.
| Specifications | ||
| Price | $6697 | |
| Travel | 150mm | |
| Rear Shock | RockShox Super Deluxe Select+ | |
| Fork | RockShox Lyrik Ultimate Fork, 160mm | |
| Headset | FSA #57 E internal | |
| Cassette | SRAM Eagle XG1295 10-50T | |
| Crankarms | Truvativ Descendant 7K 32T, 170mm | |
| Chainguide | e*thirteen TRS Race, w/Direct Mount Bash | |
| Rear Derailleur | SRAM XO1 Eagle | |
| Chain | SRAM PC 12 | |
| Shifter Pods | SRAM X0 Eagle | |
| Handlebar | Deity Ridgeline 35, 800mm, 25mm rise | |
| Stem | Norco 40mm | |
| Grips | Ergon GE10 EVO lock on | |
| Brakes | SRAM Code RSC Hydraulic | |
| Wheelset | DT Swiss M1700 wheelset | |
| Hubs | DT Swiss 350 | |
| Tires | Maxxis Minion DHF 2.5" EXO+, Maxxis Minion DHR II 2.4" EXO+ | |
| Seatpost | RockShox Reverb Stealth Dropper 175mm | |
Test Bike Setup
Norco's online bike setup guide is about as detailed as it gets – you put in your height and weight, and then select from nine different skill levels ranging from beginner to professional. Be honest when choosing your ability level - you might have dreams of being a pro, but that doesn't mean you necessarily need to same suspension settings as one.
Once all that's done, the suggested settings are spit out, including tire pressure and bar width recommendations. There's even button you can select that changes the setup offset. Basically, some riders have their weight more forward, while others are more centered or slightly rearward, and that means different suspension settings are required.
For me, it turned out that the second offset position worked best. Remember, all of those numbers and click recommendations are meant to be a starting point; they're not written in stone. Experiment, and if you find something that feels better go with that. My final settings were 195 psi in the shock, which equated to a little less than 30% sag, with three volume spacers installed (one more than stock). In the Lyrik Ultimate fork, I ran 80psi with 1.5 tokens.
Norco's online bike setup guide is about as detailed as it gets – you put in your height and weight, and then select from nine different skill levels ranging from beginner to professional. Be honest when choosing your ability level - you might have dreams of being a pro, but that doesn't mean you necessarily need to same suspension settings as one.
Once all that's done, the suggested settings are spit out, including tire pressure and bar width recommendations. There's even button you can select that changes the setup offset. Basically, some riders have their weight more forward, while others are more centered or slightly rearward, and that means different suspension settings are required.
For me, it turned out that the second offset position worked best. Remember, all of those numbers and click recommendations are meant to be a starting point; they're not written in stone. Experiment, and if you find something that feels better go with that. My final settings were 195 psi in the shock, which equated to a little less than 30% sag, with three volume spacers installed (one more than stock). In the Lyrik Ultimate fork, I ran 80psi with 1.5 tokens.
Mike Kazimer
Location: Bellingham, WA, USA
Age: 37
Height: 5'11" / 180cm
Inseam: 33" / 84cm
Weight: 160 lbs / 72.6 kg
Industry affiliations / sponsors: None
Instagram: @mikekazimer
Location: Bellingham, WA, USA
Age: 37
Height: 5'11" / 180cm
Inseam: 33" / 84cm
Weight: 160 lbs / 72.6 kg
Industry affiliations / sponsors: None
Instagram: @mikekazimer
Climbing
The Sight's climbing position is excellent, and it felt just right for my 5'11” height. That 485mm reach number may seem quite long on paper, but don't forget about that 77.7-degree seat tube angle. That creates a modest 621mm top tube length, which meant that I never felt too stretched out while seated. It also creates a very central position over the pedals, and I was able to sit and spin my way up sections that I'd usually stand up to clean. Even on flatter trails or when pedaling out to the trailhead, the positioning was very comfortable.
The 64-degree head tube angle does mean that the front end doesn't feel quite as snappy as something with steeper angles, but for the most part I'm not usually faced with multiple fast uphill corners in a row, and the tradeoff is that the front wheel feels nicely stuck to the ground, without any unwanted lifting when things get steep. There's not much unwanted suspension movement either, with enough anti-squat to keep the shock from sinking too deep into its travel, and even out of the saddle efforts didn't upset the bike's calm pedaling manners.
I did find it kind of funny that the short-travel Optic gets the SuperDeluxe DH shock, which has adjustable low-speed compression and no lockout lever, while this bike has a lockout lever but no way to adjust the low-speed compression. I rarely used the lockout on the Sight, and personally, I would have rather had the ability to adjust the low-speed compression instead. According to Norco, they considered both the Ultimate and Select+ and chose the latter because it best met their damper demands for "square edge tracking and optimized wheel movement," not because it had a lockout lever.
![Norco Sight 2020 review]()
The Sight's climbing position is excellent, and it felt just right for my 5'11” height. That 485mm reach number may seem quite long on paper, but don't forget about that 77.7-degree seat tube angle. That creates a modest 621mm top tube length, which meant that I never felt too stretched out while seated. It also creates a very central position over the pedals, and I was able to sit and spin my way up sections that I'd usually stand up to clean. Even on flatter trails or when pedaling out to the trailhead, the positioning was very comfortable.
The 64-degree head tube angle does mean that the front end doesn't feel quite as snappy as something with steeper angles, but for the most part I'm not usually faced with multiple fast uphill corners in a row, and the tradeoff is that the front wheel feels nicely stuck to the ground, without any unwanted lifting when things get steep. There's not much unwanted suspension movement either, with enough anti-squat to keep the shock from sinking too deep into its travel, and even out of the saddle efforts didn't upset the bike's calm pedaling manners.
I did find it kind of funny that the short-travel Optic gets the SuperDeluxe DH shock, which has adjustable low-speed compression and no lockout lever, while this bike has a lockout lever but no way to adjust the low-speed compression. I rarely used the lockout on the Sight, and personally, I would have rather had the ability to adjust the low-speed compression instead. According to Norco, they considered both the Ultimate and Select+ and chose the latter because it best met their damper demands for "square edge tracking and optimized wheel movement," not because it had a lockout lever.
Descending
The geometry numbers that make the Sight a comfortable climber work even better on the descents, where the balanced positioning really comes into play. I didn't need to make any drastic weight shifts to stay in the sweet spot on sustained steep sections, and there was plenty of stability for opening it up on high-speed straightaways.
The overall feel is a little more planted than poppy, but there's enough zip to the Sight's handling that it didn't feel overly lethargic or dull on mellower trails. It's more versatile than the geometry numbers suggest, and while there are better options if all of your trails are on the flatter side of the spectrum, it never felt like it was a struggle to pilot the Sight through tighter, slower speed trails.
It did take a decent amount of experimentation before I settled on a shock setup that I was happy with. At first, I found myself bottoming out a little too often on larger drops with 30% sag, so I increased the air pressure and tried running 25% sag. That was all right, but I was missing the softer feeling off the top, and the bike felt a little rougher on chopped up sections of trail. I ended up adding an additional volume spacer and dropping back down to 27% sag, which did the trick, although I still wouldn't use the term 'bottomless' to describe the Sight's suspension feel.
In chunky terrain, there's plenty of mid-stroke support, but on bigger hits, typically with flatter landings, I'd still feel a 'thwunk' indicating that the end of the travel had been reached. I'm curious if the Fox Float X2, which has a larger bottom out bumper, could be the ticket here.
The geometry numbers that make the Sight a comfortable climber work even better on the descents, where the balanced positioning really comes into play. I didn't need to make any drastic weight shifts to stay in the sweet spot on sustained steep sections, and there was plenty of stability for opening it up on high-speed straightaways.
The overall feel is a little more planted than poppy, but there's enough zip to the Sight's handling that it didn't feel overly lethargic or dull on mellower trails. It's more versatile than the geometry numbers suggest, and while there are better options if all of your trails are on the flatter side of the spectrum, it never felt like it was a struggle to pilot the Sight through tighter, slower speed trails.
It did take a decent amount of experimentation before I settled on a shock setup that I was happy with. At first, I found myself bottoming out a little too often on larger drops with 30% sag, so I increased the air pressure and tried running 25% sag. That was all right, but I was missing the softer feeling off the top, and the bike felt a little rougher on chopped up sections of trail. I ended up adding an additional volume spacer and dropping back down to 27% sag, which did the trick, although I still wouldn't use the term 'bottomless' to describe the Sight's suspension feel.
In chunky terrain, there's plenty of mid-stroke support, but on bigger hits, typically with flatter landings, I'd still feel a 'thwunk' indicating that the end of the travel had been reached. I'm curious if the Fox Float X2, which has a larger bottom out bumper, could be the ticket here.
How does it compare?
I've received a number of messages from riders trying to decide which way to go - the shorter travel Optic, or the longer travel Sight. The Sight's extra travel, combined with its slacker head angle and slightly longer chainstays means that it doesn't have the same level of responsiveness when pedaling or in terrain that you really need to pump through compared to the Optic.
The geometry may not be dramatically different, but the Optic does feel more energetic, and if I was heading out for a big, more XC-oriented ride I'd rather be on the Optic. On the flip side, for rougher, steeper trails, the Sight is the way to go - that 160mm Lyrik can plow through obstacles that the 140mm Pike can't, and the longer wheelbase does make it easier to turn off your brain and let go of the brakes.
I've also been spending time on a new Banshee Titan lately, so let's throw that into the mix. The Titan has 155mm of rear travel and a 170mm fork, with a 64.5-degree head angle, a 470mm reach on a size large, and 452mm chainstays. While there are geometry differences in a few key areas, there's only a 3mm difference when it comes to the overall wheelbase. That doesn't mean they handle the same, though.
The Titan feels more like a freeride bike, an aluminum machine that's happiest plowing through obstacles rather than going over them, and it has an impressive ability to soak up hard landings without skipping a beat. It's not the quickest in tighter turns – those long chainstays are noticeable, and the Sight feels more manageable at slower speeds and on less steep terrain.
The Sight’s pedaling position is similar to the Titan’s, and they both pedal decently while seated, but when it comes to standing up and putting the power down, the Sight feels more efficient – the Titan cycles deeper into its travel during those hard efforts.
Technical Report
RockShox Lyrik Ultimate: The Lyrik was simple to set up and worked very well for the duration of the test period. The extra-supple off the top feel came in handy during wet, slimy rides, providing extra grip to keep the front wheel on line.
Ergon SM 10 seat: We don't focus on seats all that often since they're such a personal item, but the Ergon SM 10 deserves a shout out. It's super comfy, even if you're in the no-chamois club, and there aren't any sharp edges to be seen. Good work, Ergon.
SRAM X01 drivetrain: I didn't run into any issues with the X01 drivetrain, but I do think it'd be nice to see a GX option available in Norco's Build Your Ride program; I'd rather spend money on suspension and brakes and save a little on shifting. It's also worth noting that the cranks are aluminum, not carbon - in fact, considering the price, there's surprisingly little carbon to be found on this bike, other than the frame.
Cable rattle: There's a little port in the downtube that lets you zip-tie the housing to the inside of the frame, except that it's still free to rattle around inside near the head tube area. I put a little foam in there to quiet things down, but it'd be better if it was like that out of the box. The same goes for the chainslap protection – the shape of the chainstay protector seems right, but the rubber is a little too soft, and it doesn't deaden the noise as much as it could.
![Norco Sight 2020 review]()
RockShox Lyrik Ultimate: The Lyrik was simple to set up and worked very well for the duration of the test period. The extra-supple off the top feel came in handy during wet, slimy rides, providing extra grip to keep the front wheel on line.
Ergon SM 10 seat: We don't focus on seats all that often since they're such a personal item, but the Ergon SM 10 deserves a shout out. It's super comfy, even if you're in the no-chamois club, and there aren't any sharp edges to be seen. Good work, Ergon.
SRAM X01 drivetrain: I didn't run into any issues with the X01 drivetrain, but I do think it'd be nice to see a GX option available in Norco's Build Your Ride program; I'd rather spend money on suspension and brakes and save a little on shifting. It's also worth noting that the cranks are aluminum, not carbon - in fact, considering the price, there's surprisingly little carbon to be found on this bike, other than the frame.
Cable rattle: There's a little port in the downtube that lets you zip-tie the housing to the inside of the frame, except that it's still free to rattle around inside near the head tube area. I put a little foam in there to quiet things down, but it'd be better if it was like that out of the box. The same goes for the chainslap protection – the shape of the chainstay protector seems right, but the rubber is a little too soft, and it doesn't deaden the noise as much as it could.
Pros
+ Very versatile – not just focused on the steepest, roughest trails
+ Wide range of spec options allows for customization
+ The geometry – it has that 'just right' feeling that you want while climbing and descending
Cons
- Needs a little extra attention to quiet it down
- It can take time to dial in the rear suspension; hard-chargers might find themselves needing to run less sag than usual to avoid bottoming out.
Pinkbike's Take
| The Sight is for the rider that likes more technical trails and doesn't mind pedaling to get to them. That 150mm of travel provides a little more room for error than your typical mid-travel trail bike does, while still remaining manageable on slightly mellower terrain. It's certainly capable of being called into duty as an enduro race bike, but for riders looking for a plush, bottomless trail smasher this might not quite scratch that itch. For everyone else, the Sight's versatility and wide array of possible configurations make it a strong contender in this travel bracket. |
Author Info:
Member since Feb 1, 2009
Must Read This Week
edit: the one i rode was dead silent as far as cables and chain noise go, but that all depends on how you manage your cables I'd say
I think I'm in to try the XL Sight this season, my only complaint is I would have liked to see a longer eye-eye shock.
NS. TP
Reach 455 450
Stack. 594 605
HTA. 63.5 64
Fork os. 37 37
STL. 435 400
STA. 77.3 77.1
BBD. -15 -15
Chst L. 435 430
BB H. 342 340
TTL. 588 583
WB. 1220 1209
SO. 677 685
HT. 110 110
Hmoh...Nice Narco Cuz
The whole issue of how suspension setups work differently at different ends of the rider weight spectrum might deserve a bit more attention - seems like that's a pretty big issue especially for Horst link and Maestro bikes.
The 55mm X2 is spec'd because the bottom out bumper is firm enough that it actually reduces the stroke by 2-3mm at full bottom out.
That’s a negative been running that shock in that stroke for 2 years without issue, I don’t imagine it would be any issue on the new frame either.
Good choice on your setup Griz, you’re gonna like it, the extra dampening of the super deluxe is awesome.
There's less clearance at the lower shock mount on the new frame (www.pinkbike.com/photo/17918619) compared to the old one (www.pinkbike.com/photo/14581303).
Ultimately, I just wanted to note that the bike will feel "different" with a stroke that's shorter than intended. The only reviews I've seen that mention difficulty setting up the rear suspension have been on board the short-stroked Super Deluxe.
You’re statement alone says so much about the industry right now... we’re happy with SLX on a $5k+ bike lol full XT groups were on $3,500 bikes not too long ago
a.) Inflation is a thing.
b.) The aluminum A2, with a mix of GX/NX and same suspension as C2 is $3,599. Go knock yourself out!
Top-line, newly re-designed carbon bikes are expensive. You want one at a discount, buy used or last year's model. It's pretty straightforward.
You’re right lol wasn’t thinking. I guess it’s just crazy to think that slx at 5k is the new norm.
You’re right. That seems like a solid deal.
But don’t you think it’s a little strange that SLX is now acceptable on a $5k bike? Inflation doesn’t move that fast lol
All you whiners better put your money where your mouth is. Longer CS and steeper STA as you go up in size. Perfect combo.
Yep, so close but still not perfect. I definitely commend them for what they've done but one needs spacers and higher rise bars to get Norco bikes to fit in my case at least.
It's the choice which I find valuable. There's always going to be differing tastes so it's great the long and short CS crew get to decide rather than all bikes must be one or the other. :^)
Previously it felt like a race for the shortest rear across most bikes.
This bike is billed as an All-Mountain bike, not an Enduro race bike. A super long wheelbase is much more specialized to one type of riding, pure straight line speed, and not for varied trails/terrain.
Any chance for a comparison to the Raaw Madonna v2, since we know you have one in the stable atm? The geo numbers seem quite similar on paper. And I’d love to hear how they compare.
Maybe even a future article on the Raaw, titan, and privateer 161? All of those are super enticing frames, but will be hard for most of us to demo because they are smaller manufacturers. The Sight “seems” like about their equivalent, and something most people could find to demo, which is why I bring it up.
I am really glad you compared it to the optic and the titan though, both were useful comparisons.
Thanks for all the hard work!
Pet peeve alert: Bike manufacturers, stop putting a minus sign in front of the bottom bracket drop figure! It's wrong. A bottom bracket *drop* of -25 implies that the bottom bracket is 25 mm *above* the axle line (which of course it isn't). By calling it "drop" you've already communicated the correct direction (BB below axle); don't mess it up by adding the minus sign.
The location of the shock relative to the saddle has NOTHING to do with bob or "leverage". The saddle position relative to the suspension as a system has impact. If they changed the rocker and moved the shock mounting points forward so the shock is further forward relative to the saddle, that alone isn't going to change a thing with bob. It is possible that moving the shock means they wouldn't be able to achieve the same kinematics, but that's completely different that the shock's position relative to the saddle.
Still, rider's position fore and aft isn't really going to change the bob factor much. If it's further aft, it's just going to need more pressure to get the same sag, and less pressure for a forward bias.
Anti-squat counters the acceleration-driven rearward weight shift, but if the weight is already rearward, it's just going to counter a _further_ rearward shift due to acceleration, it's not going to counter that shift more or less.
Why is reach frequently discussed involving the seat tube angle? Isn't the whole point of the reach measurement to delineate how a bike would feel when you are standing, also commonly known as the position where you are NOT SEATED?
Just trying to make a point that reach should not be discussed together with seat tube angle. They measure two independent things and do not belong in the same equation.
This article goes into it a little more: www.pinkbike.com/u/mikekazimer/blog/opinion-why-is-everyone-talking-about-seat-tube-angles.html
I think that when terms get mixed up in sentences together, those who are still learning the ropes and unattenuated to the nuances can be further confused in this world where myths as speculation are abound. Everyone thinks of themselves as a discerning consumer; whether that is true or not. Let’s bolster them with accurate information.
If your new Tesla needed some rattles fixed after purchase, would you be impressed? Not me. Cheers.
About the warranty numbers - where are you getting those? I've only got anecdotes from a few friends on DVO, but they're overwhelmingly positive.
Correction: Sight=~$3400 (yes it comes with alloy chain stays, I thought it was priced closer to $3000 earlier)
And again, I'm seeing larger price differentials on fully built bikes.
I don't seem to be bottoming out my shock. I was just curious.
As this bike seems (at least on paper) to be replacing the 2018-current Norco Range, I was wondering if you'd be able to comment on how those bikes compare. Would a person who is currently happy with the Range be just as pleased with the new Sight? Or would they be better off waiting until the 'ext3me fr33r1de' new Range model is launched.
Thanks!
Just wish I could demo the mega... and I wish it would fit a water bottle. Small gripe though.
Which shock did you go with on the AF?
I'm split between the two as well for my next bike. I'm disappointed Norco doesn't have a dvo build option like they did on the 2019 (of course no alloy option last year for custom).
Also Norco has the 2020 Sight A1 in aluminum with a top-end build kit for $4600 or the C3 for $300 less. Hype can be a determining factor in what guides purchases and the Ripmo AF had/has a ton of hype surrounding it.
I'm lucky that at 5'10" I usually fit a medium or large, so chainstays and front center are usually well balanced for myself and other average build males. But it's pretty stupid that short folks get the balance shifted forward automatically because chainstays stay long while the front center gets shorts on smaller frames, and that tall folks automatically get sent to the back seat because XL and bigger frames have much longer front centers on the same relatively stubby chainstays.
Look at how many short guys felt more comfortable on 27.5 or mullet bikes (shorter chainstays) vs full 29ers (longer chainstays AND butt buzz), and how many tall guys are starting to extend chainstays (Minnaar's custom dropout extensions, for example) now that the front centers on XL and XXL frames are nice and long.
Therefor saying that the bike doesn't have a lot of pedal bounce just because you're sitting above the rear shock is wrong. It has not that much pedal bob simply because the rear kinematic has a low leverage ratio around the sag point (aka it has a high anti-squat value in the mid of the stroke).
My current bike I bought based on Reach, but lost 20mm of ETT from my last bike. I still sorta regret it. I can adapt to the new bike, but sometimes I wish I could have that longer ETT back to run a shorter stem and have more adjustment in the saddle fore/aft.
Kaz saying "the 485 reach seems long, but the steep seat tube keeps the ETT short" is only half the story. Sure, the relatively short ETT means seated climbing will be fine, but a monster reach (and the long front center that comes with it) can cause issues in weighting the front wheel when standing, regardless of what the ETT is.
I'd only get 485 reach on a race bike. And I'd still have to get my shoulders/arms wicked strong to maintain the forward weight shift I'd need to keep weight on the front wheel when ripping fun flat corners on loose shit. Finding the edge of that "in the bike" pocket takes more effort with a huge reach. Or I'd have to get a tiny stem and end up with crazy fast steering that nukes a bunch of the stability that comes from being long, low, and slack.
Kind of the opposite of the too small reach: no room to move "in the bike" means the weight transfer is exaggerated and you get outside the comfort zone much faster. Leads to riding off the back seat when descending and getting all scrunched up over the bar when pounding tech climbs.
I'm at the bottom of the Large range, and I went with that mainly because the reach is just what I wanted, and as a bonus the seat-tube is short enough and deep enough that I can fit a 170mm PNW dropper. With ~30% sag, I can sit on the saddle at full drop and have both feet flat on the ground! Though I'm maybe a tiny bit longer in the legs than arms than average.
On the medium, where I'm at the top of the chart, the reach would be a little short for my liking. I would probably only run it in the high setting and maybe even install a slightly longer stem, both to open up the cockpit a bit. But I could probably run a 200mm dropper if I wanted!
I would say that mostly only really short arms for your height really necessitates a downsize. Can't really shrink the reach or top tube without going with a shorter stem, and a large change there has the potential to change the steering dynamics in unwanted ways. Rather go with the smaller size and just run a long seat post (long dropper FTW!) to account for the (relatively) longer legs.
While short legs for your height just means you might not be able to fit a really long dropper, and maybe also check there is room to lower/slam the stem, to be sure your bars won't be too high relative to your seat. Though on some frames (much less so these past couple years), the seat-tube is so tall that someone 5'10" with short legs might only get away with a 100-125mm dropper, and that might mean a downsize is preferable.
It would be interesting to see manufacturers develop an ape-index recommendation for their bikes along with the usual height based ones. I think Norco is crawling towards this with that setup guide on their website. Getting people on bikes that fit them and are applicable to riding style is important to their having fun.
Did you run flats or clipped in when test riding?
And @mh731, black, obviously.
geometrygeeks.bike/bike/norco-sight-2020
Did you have to put any more volume spacers in the fork or shock of the Optic?
I’ve driven a 750kg car that has a ride/handling compromise on bumpy English B roads that larger cars can’t get close too.
What's mid range aluminium version supposed to weigh? 16-17kgs?
Inability of the company to make a properly engineered bike should be scrutinized.
Now, if this were a bottom of the barrel priced bike with great value for money, one could forgive slightly porky frame
Can you compare to the Bronson V3?.. yes, 29er blah blah but same front and rear travel so I'm curious.
If the frameset had at least the color of the C SE. Would look rad with a boxxer red Lyrik.
So, I have to look elsewhere
A race-proven Canyon Strive CF 9.0 with a full-carbon frame and better components can be had 4800€.