First Look: SRAM Releases GX Eagle AXS Wireless Electronic Drivetrain

Mar 23, 2021 at 12:25
by Mike Kazimer  


Two years ago, SRAM made waves with the release of their X01 and XX1 AXS wireless electronic drivetrains. The concept of instant shifting, and the extra-clean look that results from ditching cables and housing was intriguing to many riders, but the $800 - $1000 price of admission was a substantial stumbling block. The height of that financial hurdle has now been lowered with the introduction of GX Eagle AXS, and it's likely that AXS drivetrains will become a much more common sight out in the wild.

$600 will get you a derailleur, shifter, battery, and a charger, everything that's needed to make the switch to the world of wireless shifting. Granted, that doesn't exactly qualify as a value-oriented option, since the price is still three times that of a regular GX derailleur and shifter, but it's a step in the right direction. The derailleur alone is priced at $370, without the $55 battery, and the shifter is $150 USD.
GX Eagle AXS Details

• Compatible with all Eagle drivetrains, 10-52 tooth cassette compatible
• Overload clutch system
• IPX7 waterproof
• Derailleur weight: 454 grams (w/ battery)
• Shifter weight: 68 grams
• Price: $600 USD (shifter, derailleur, battery, charger)
sram.com


SRAM GX AXS

What differentiates the GX group from the X01 and XX1 AXS groups? In one word, weight. The GX AXS derailleur weighs in at 454 grams with the battery, compared to 390 grams for the X01 derailleur and battery. The main reason for that 64-gram difference is the material used for the pulley wheel cage – it's aluminum on X01, and steel on GX.

Otherwise the features of the two derailleurs are identical. They'll both accommodate up to a 10-52-tooth cassette, and they have SRAM's Overload Clutch mechanism that disengages the motor gearbox in the event of an impact, which allows the derailleur to swing inboard and then move back into place. It's a handy feature, and one that can help extend the lifespan of your shiny new robot derailleur.

SRAM GX AXS
The app makes it possible to change the shifter paddle functions in a matter of seconds.

The shifter paddle shape is identical to what's used on the X01 and XX1 groups, and SRAM also offer a different paddle shape that's closer to a traditional shifter for $20. It's possible to change the shifter paddle assignments via SRAM's AXS app in a matter of seconds. I prefer to have the derailleur move the chain up the cassette when I push upwards, and down the cassette when I push downwards, while I know some riders prefer the opposite orientation.

One final feature of the GX AXS derailleur that's worth mentioning is the new battery cover that's designed to ensure the battery doesn't get knocked off mid-ride, or to prevent sneaky riding buddies from stealing and hiding it when you're not looking. The cover is available separately for $20, and will also work with X01 and XX1 AXS derailleurs.

Stay tuned for a long term review later this year once I put a whole bunch of miles in on these parts.


SRAM GX AXS


SRAM GX AXS



577 Comments

  • 836 8
 Scrolls to see price. Acceptable.... Starts from the top again.
  • 21 1
 hahaha read my dam mind
  • 57 4
 I’ve never been a “shut up and take my money” guy........ Until now
  • 141 4
 I am throwing my wallet at my screen, but nothing is happening.
  • 114 16
 I can get an analogue GX shifter and mech for under £150. I can think of quite a few things on my upgrades list before this...
  • 91 26
 Define "acceptable". A full set of Shimano XT components costs 40% less (street prices) than the upgrade kit for GX AXS alone.
  • 20 2
 @moefosho: Try throwing it harder!!! LOL
  • 45 5
 @BenTheSwabian: I would say it is acceptable in the fact that it uses wireless technology to perfectly shift through gears using a little motor. Compare that to using a cable to push through the clicks. Yes the both do the same thing extremely well, but from a tech standpoint, the cost makes sense.
  • 4 0
 This is the first thing that I will maybe buy in a long shot. The prices have skyrocketed for everything.
  • 24 2
 @BenTheSwabian: Yeah. And a roll of toilet paper is even cheaper!
  • 16 1
 I will say - every single person I know that runs wireless (all 3 of them) say it is the best thing ever. My current XO though has never had an issue for me and shifts perfectly.........
  • 22 3
 @Meettaco: AXS is the way to go. Its so good and worth every penny IMO. Have 1200 miles on my XO1 without a single adjustment to date...
  • 60 28
 @moefosho: So, tech for the sake of tech? If they both already work extremely well then adding the wireless adds cost and complexity.

These electric drivetrains are equivalent to putting an electric throttle on a carburetor. It's tech, but it's not addressing the underlying problem that needs to be fixed.
  • 2 3
 LOL FACTS!
  • 4 2
 @Meettaco: Yes, my new bike is coming with XO1 shifters and derailleur. I don't think I can justify changing them out for this unless I smash my derailleur on a rock or something and need to buy a new one anyways.
  • 4 3
 @BenTheSwabian: and it shifts (does its job) better.
  • 40 6
 @HB208: YOu'd be surprised how well that clutch thing works at reducing / preventing damage.

I love all the haters here who have not even tried it saying it sucks.
  • 16 0
 @moefosho: gimme your wallet, I got an arm like a cannon XD
  • 3 0
 @MikeyMT: I know, I am saying that if I already have a nice derailleur, I can't justify changing it out
  • 23 5
 @BenTheSwabian: this is mtn biking! A sport that is non-essential by it's very nature. People drop thousands of dollars to ride the same trails we rode 35 years ago on bikes that cost 100s. So what if people want to spend their money on stuff? The only people that need to approve of "acceptable" are the ones dropping the cash and their significant other. I'd bet you run gear on your bike that people do without all the time...(says the guy who rides a SS hardtail)...
  • 23 0
 @DizzyNinja: Is that you Uncle Rico?
  • 6 4
 @BenTheSwabian:
It's acceptable compared to the cost of existing AXS parts, but then they're not reasonably priced....
  • 8 2
 @SprSonik: Those bikes that cost "hundreds" of dollars 35 years ago would be like $1500 to $2500 with inflation. Those bikes still exist (hardtails) and are a lot better than they were back then. Did no bike really cost $2k in 1985 numbers? I doubt it.
  • 11 6
 @BenTheSwabian: show me a link to a full 12 speed xt kit for $240. Im calling bullshit on your numbers.
  • 5 0
 @HB208: you can probably recoup a nice chunk of the $600 selling a new, take-off X01...it is a sellers market now.
  • 3 1
 @BenTheSwabian: alter Schwabe...
  • 9 1
 @BenTheSwabian: I totally get where you're coming from, but that does seem like an "apples to oranges" comparison to me. Mechanical vs wireless electronic. In my mind, I don't see the GX AXS to XT comparison to be a fair comparison.

Now if shimano had a electronic 12spd XT, I'd say that would be a more fair comparison.
  • 6 0
 @MikeyMT: This is why I the want is so bad. I love my XO1 cable shifter and derailleur, but I want that thoughtless reliability. Like if Toyota made a JDM wireless shifter and derailleur. Threw my money at world wide cyclery and while I loaded my info, they sold out. :-(
  • 6 3
 @Explodo: roadie friend of mine (am I allowed to admit that on here?) just fitted di2 to his bike at significant expense. He's delighted. I rode with him and saw no benefit apart from his front shifter making an amusing dog-toy squeak every shift. Apparently he doesn't like adjusting cables, so this is a time saver. I barely have to touch the gears on my bikes...
  • 11 0
 @mountainsofsussex: I put it on my bike and got faster than all my friends. Now I ride alone.
  • 9 2
 @Explodo: It does add cost, I'll give you that. But can you explain how you think it adds complexity? I'd say from the user point of view an electronic drivetrain is actually much simpler than a cable-operated one.
  • 20 2
 @bananowy: In this case, the mechanical system is simple. You can look at it and determine what's wrong, and fix it. Electric systems aren't quite so simple to work on, at least not at this time. While the electric systems drop the mechanical cable, they add a battery, wireless connection, and various electrical contact points. From the single standpoint of not running a cable, the electrical systems are less complex, but otherwise there are more failure points.
  • 3 0
 @MikeyMT: I can say the same about my XT 10 speed...
  • 1 2
 @Texicans: Get the XO1...a bunch of new ones in the buy sell...the mini kit is 850 I think...
  • 5 6
 @c-radicallis: 1200 miles without a single adjustment, or new cable. Sorry... I dont buy it.
  • 11 0
 @lognar: I said 40% less, not 40% of the price. Relatively, that equals to roughly 400€, not 240.

Also that may not be true it the US. In Germany anyways, there's several online retailers that regularly carry full XT group sets for about 380-400€. Not even any special deals going on. I take it you know how to use google, so you can see for yourself.
  • 8 2
 @neologisticzand: Right, but I honestly don't think its an "apples to oranges" comparison. Both systems fill the same roll after all and are marketed to the same target group. Is the wireless technology truly a factor worth considering when it means no practical advantage? IMO it's just complexity for the the sake of complexity.
  • 12 0
 @Meettaco: was thinking exactly the same,my last ride on X01 was like ‘it works so perfect,shall I pay that much money for an upgrade I do not really need?’

first ride on AXS two days after ‘never going back!!’ havent found a single disadvantage yet.. except my wife cannot EVER find how much did I pay for it
  • 26 1
 @Meettaco: I've owned X01/XX1 mechanical Eagle and now own XX1 AXS. I bought the AXS group because that was the only build option for the bike I wanted. It's... fine. Best thing ever? Nah. It basically works exactly like mechanical, with one small added feature, which is that you can reverse the shifter buttons. Both groups shift fine, but to me, the AXS group seems to suffer from slightly more slow shifts in gritty conditions, regardless of how I fine tune the indexing. But if there's a difference, it's small.

The tradeoffs? Have to monitor two batteries, significantly more expensive, and the potential for new/complex electronic/RF failure modes down the line (mechanical was incredibly reliable for me).

In my view, a group that basically accomplishes the same thing with massively more engineering complexity is not a clear win. I think a lot of AXS owners are suffering from a little bit of confirmation bias.
  • 6 2
 My 3ish year old, 3,600 mile GX derailleur and shifter are becoming due for replacement and this will be at the top of the list.
  • 1 0
 @ReformedRoadie: If I could get my hands on this haha
  • 1 0
 You ans a LOT of people
  • 4 0
 @BenTheSwabian: It's not going to take long and these will unavailable at shops
  • 5 0
 @MikeyMT: Found the GX AXS upgrade kit on Backcountry about 30min after I posted. Delivers tomorrow! Was giving that XO1 some hard rationalization though.
  • 1 2
 @Explodo: adds cost and reduces complexity.
  • 3 3
 it works way way way faster than mechanical, can be adjusted on the fly, and is more reliable. @nattyd:
  • 1 0
 so funny, so true. props.
  • 3 0
 @Texicans: backordered on Backcountry.com already
  • 1 0
 @nattyd: this. Seems to me that AXS is cut by Occam's razor..
  • 7 11
flag blowmyfuse (Mar 25, 2021 at 13:08) (Below Threshold)
 bluetooth headphones mess up all the damn time. Always having to charge them. Hunt an outlet, a port or hope someone isn't using the only cable in the car to charge the crap.

Now...you want me to have 2 bluetooth battery operated devices on the only thing I use to get away from all the batteries and motors and glitches and screens and outlets and "is 60% charge actually 60% or will I go 10 feet and it drop to 20% out of the blue?"

Will this phone or that phone pair with it? Will it be in that one random place where something or someone else's glitchy overpriced tech will interrupt?
  • 9 0
 @cuban-b-can-blow-me: Except that X01 and XX1 AXS have been out for a bit and no one has had these issues. GX is the same tech.
  • 3 0
 @moefosho: maybe its coin op.

Try throwing your change jar at it next.
  • 3 0
 @MikeyMT: I don't understand your recommendation. If the only difference is the cage and 100g of weight, why would you pay $200-250 more for X01?
  • 1 2
 PB comment of the year. Well done, sir.
  • 1 2
 @HB208: Last time I checked, dentists don't complain. They just buy new stuff.
  • 1 0
 @cuban-b-can-blow-me: Ok?
  • 1 0
 @Baller7756: cause its available....
  • 6 1
 @MikeyMT: I've done ~4300km (~2700mi) without a new cable and adjustment with my 11s XT since November. Now that I've counted them I can't believe it myself because it's actually a lot more since I had a new one (after XC nationals in July). My experience is that Shimano is much better than Sram at this after the cables have bed in. I'm known though to make things last longer than average. A side effect of being a very light and smooth XCO/XCM racer.
  • 1 0
 @Docht: Bare hand free!! Or nearest pet....
  • 3 0
 @HB208: I've seen a couple of posts on local MTB FB groups from people asking if they can borrow an AXS charger so they can go on the after-work ride because they got to work and found their derailleur battery was flat.

It's one reason I'll never put AXS on any bike my wife rides, she never remembers to charge anything pre-emptively...doesn't mater if the batteries last a year, they won't get charged until after they have gone flat mid-ride.
  • 3 1
 Stop complaining first world whiners. Down here our special introductory price is $830 which is R12 500.00 in our rubbish currency.
  • 4 0
 @nattyd: I am a long term X01 mechanical owner. Having never touched an electronic shifter before, I tend to suffer from a lot of confirmation bias on the superiority of my setup for the exact above reasons. Thank you for confirming my bias Smile
  • 1 0
 @DBone95: My 3000km SX is feeling bad no matter what I do to fix it so this is also at the top of my list
  • 2 0
 @moefosho: no it doesn't. They should cost like 50-100€ more than a mech group max.
  • 1 0
 @dsut4392: That's fair. I'd probably buy an extra battery and have it charging besides my power tool batteries.
  • 2 2
 @SprSonik: riding a 25yr old mtb downvthe same trail will beat you to death by today's standards, using a cable actuated shifter will do what exactly? Give you a sore thumb? Ffs get real
  • 1 0
 this is literally the first time I feel like someone else has typed my brain out
  • 1 0
 @PeterT: Which comment?
  • 2 2
 @Explodo: Exactly. "It does the same thing but it got more complex" is usually the opposite of good engineering. And it's certainly a bad justification for increased price.
  • 1 1
 @neologisticzand: It's not Apples to Oranges. It's two products that serve the exact same function. Why should a customer care that SRAM is achieving a negligible functional advantage with 1000x the complexity?
  • 3 1
 @Texicans: Still not sure why people think complex electronic devices are more reliable than simple mechanisms. I work in electronics reliability for a living. It pays very well. That's because there are thousands of things that can go wrong when your device contains a billion transistors, a lithium cobalt oxide battery, power electronics, motors, and a bunch of antennas.

Talk to me about reliability when that drivetrain has been in the field for 5 years.

And "thoughtless" ain't gonna work when you have to charge a battery every month or so for your bike to perform basic functions.
  • 2 2
 @nattyd: "Talk to me about reliability when that drivetrain has been in the field for 5 years"

See, that sentence right there is what you and I "think" would be logical. But bikes aren't logical. They've become one more Ultimate Compulsion Item. No one that buys that group will keep it more than maybe a year.
Anyone who does will just dump it in the garbage when it glitches and buy the next one.

We think in terms of 3 basic premises for use: reliability, cost effectiveness, durability. But the Ultimate Compulsion Item people reading about this drivetrain consider 1 year of "beep boop beep boop" battery pushing glee to meet all 3 premises cause they're so wet in the crotch over NO WIRES they can justify all the rest of the obsoleteness, inconvenience and disposable aspects of it.
  • 2 1
 @cuban-b-can-blow-me: More or less agree with the premise that people are buying into the technological dazzle and not any kind of practical advantage. I just wish that people would be honest about that instead of making tortured/nonsense arguments like "it shifts faster" or "zero maintenance".

The only other thing I'll say is that I think most people, even rich people, hold on to their bikes longer than you'd think. I'd conjecture that the median time of original ownership is 3 years or more, with a long right skew. I don't want to hear people talk about "reliability" of a product that's been in the field less than three years in any form.
  • 2 0
 @nattyd: Well... the electronic shift is more precise and its completely repeatable. This is what leads people to say the shift quality is better. The cable system is always in some level of degradation that ultimately requires some intervention to compensate for (barrel adjustment, derailleur tension, cable friction, cable replacement, etc.). The electronic shift is the exact same every time... from ride to ride, from season to season... plus 1 less cable cluttering the cockpit!

I have had XX1 AXS for 2 years and it was closer to $1000. At $600 the GX upgrade kit is well worth the experience.
  • 1 0
 @nattyd: there is no part of my drivetrain, except the crank arms, that I expect to last 5 years if I’m actually riding the bike. Any mechanical derailleur I’ve ever used either Shimano or SRAM is clapped out after 5 years of mountain biking.
  • 3 1
 @Baller7756: I also own both. I haven't noticed any improvements in shift quality. In fact, I would say AXS is a bit more finicky, especially in wet weather. People said the same thing about original road eTap, which was super dependent on perfecting indexing and alignment.

Your statements about mechanical shifting are completely at odds with my experience. I rode SRAM mechanical 1x systems for the better part of a decade before switching to AXS, and my bikes required pretty much no maintenance that was specific to the shift mechanism. Perfect shifts every time. I think I replaced a cable twice in 6 years? Took a lot less time in total than all the charging.
  • 1 0
 @whambat: Hmm, yeah, I can see the competing failure modes for derailleurs killing them faster than five years for a lot of the population. I've had two bikes that survived ~5 years with the original derailleur, but I'm not doing crazy riding. Now that finally have some pocket change, my upgrades are usually more like 3 years.
  • 4 0
 @nattyd: oh, I could limp a derailleur longer than 5 years, but all bearings and bushings are shot by then, let alone a few dings to the cage, and shift quality goes to pot. I’ve been waiting for AXS to come down to XO1 mechanical prices for the derailleur, and this pretty much does that. I had the first order into my local shop by texting their head mechanic before the doors opened, expecting delivery by a June. My trails get so dusty by mid summer, my cables need to be replaced monthly. Looking forward to dropping all shift cables from my rig.
  • 1 0
 @whambat: You're either the worst mechanic in the world, have absolutely terrible bike maintenance routines, or are full of shit. Dusty CO conditions don't require monthly cable replacements.
  • 1 0
 @Explodo: Yeah, I have no idea what this is about. I live in dusty California and have changed a cable maybe twice in 6 years of mechanical SRAM 1x MTB drivetrains. And not because I had to, just because it felt like it was time.
  • 2 0
 @nattyd: is have thought wet muddy British conditions (yes I know other places get wet) are pretty tough for anything, cables included. Pre covid I road commuted in all weathers, lots of salt on the roads, 20km every single day. Even had exposed cable runs. Maybe changed a cable every 3-5 years, barely ever touched the adjusters. Sadly, less miles on the mountain bike, but still muddy gritty etc. Honestly can't remember changing a cable. I always make sure there's plenty of chain lube dripped in with the cable when I do change it, so perhaps that's key. Always ride with a spare cable. Never needed it (cursed myself now, haven't I?)
  • 2 0
 @Explodo: have you ridden in Eagle moon dust when it’s hub deep? Eagle is not like the rest of Colorado, I could go full seasons on a cable when I live on the front range or Summit. And my problem is I don’t change them monthly, so it just becomes crappy shifting.
  • 2 0
 @mountainsofsussex: This is also my experience riding in rainy/snowy New England. Worth nothing that wet conditions and temperature fluctuations are really hard on electronics too!
  • 1 0
 @HB208: I guarantee you, the spare would be flat too Smile
  • 2 1
 @Baller7756: It sounds like you're trying to say that an electronic shifting system is completely frictionless and immune from wear and contamination of the actuator mechanism. Is that because of the superior lubricating qualities of snake oil?
  • 2 0
 @dynamatt: yeah I put a deposit down on 2 kits once my LBS said they had some on order... Delivery not until July, though!
  • 1 0
 @HB208: I just ordered a new bike and they let me swap to AXS for a small upcharge. It was from a bike shop, so they'll just use those parts on repair jobs.
  • 1 0
 @Ajbeverage: I just spoke to my shop and they said they would give me a $50 credit for the X01 parts, which is BS. I think I could get close to $300 for the X01 parts on Pinkbike though, so I might just have them immediately install the GX AXS and sell off the parts.
  • 2 0
 @Ajbeverage: Just got my name on a GX AXS kit. f*cking excited.
  • 1 0
 @MikeyMT: Amen to that brother!
  • 1 0
 @HB208: flog off the new wired X01, it’ll cover a lot of the costs of the AXS kit!
  • 1 0
 @Mattymoocow: It won't cover all of it. I think I can get like $260 for the X01 derailleur and trigger on Pinkbike. $340 ain't bad for a wireless upgrade though.
  • 224 2
 While the overall function of a wireless shifter makes more sense, I just really want a cheaper wireless dropper post. Dropper cables are an absolute nightmare.
  • 64 3
 This. I've no interest in wireless shifting (atleast until Shimano releases deore/slx/xt-level stuff), but I'd be super happy to never have to deal with a dropper cable ever again.
  • 62 2
 Dude I was feeling frisky the other day and went to buy an AXS post. I thought they were like 500 bucks or something like that. I saw 800 and instantly said fuck that. Absolutely no reason they should cost that much lol.
  • 4 3
 @Rusettipasta: just like the xt or slx di2? It wont happen, roadies have been waiting for cheap electronic shifting for a while
  • 34 0
 I am really surprised we haven't seen more with the wireless dropper... Install takes what, 3-5 minutes? Probably takes longer getting it out of the packaging than putting it on the bike.
  • 4 0
 100% behind this.
  • 49 0
 @nskerb: IF you have multiple bikes (at least 3) that run the same size post (or can with a shim), you can actually save money running an AXS post, since it is one post and one saddle vs 3x the cost, so just get more bikes and then your purchase is justified. Just hope you never have a friend who wants to borrow one and ride with you.
  • 5 0
 magura already did that
  • 2 0
 no bigger truth has ever been spoken!!!
  • 2 0
 @nskerb: what about magura post?
  • 2 0
 Agreed. I'd be quicker to convert to wireless with a dropper than with shifting, wish an affordable wireless dropper was a bigger priority.
  • 1 0
 agree with this
  • 11 0
 I'm now sitting here wondering how hard it would be to fit a wireless converter onto the bottom of a lot of cable droppers... Might not work on all frames due to the added length, but still... and you would probably have to pull the post out to recharge the solenoid battery, but it shouldn't cost that much... or at least a lot less than a Reverb AXS...
  • 22 0
 How about a wireless actuator that just clips onto an existing post?
  • 3 0
 @nskerb: Isn't the Magura Vyron around $500?
  • 4 0
 @Assclapp: a thousand times this!
  • 2 0
 @Tamerw: with several seconds of lag in response
  • 2 0
 @Assclapp: that would be sick... I have a fair bit of space below the actuator on my one up dropper and would pay a good amount of money for the option of wireless actuation!
  • 6 0
 @SprSonik: That assumes you run the same saddle position relative to the post on each bike. Different actual seatpost angles would dictate moving the saddle....every...bike....switch.
  • 1 0
 @SprSonik: Except my saddle position is different between my HT, XC & AM bikes
  • 4 3
 External cable routing - 100x cheaper and you know it's gonna work 100% of the time. Internal cabling looks stealthy but what a PITA when you have to pull everything apart for maintenance!
  • 5 0
 And since we're talking electronic droppers, go ahead and make them go down with a push of the button too.
  • 2 1
 @Joecx: Im not trying to sell you on an AXS dropper, buuuuut saddle adjustments are super simple on the AXS. One bolt to break loose the rails for fore-aft and then a screw in the front that adjusts tilt. It is really well thought out.
  • 1 0
 @gtill9000: Right? Why is this one so hard to figure out?
  • 2 0
 @ReformedRoadie: because the motor would have to overcome the air spring? Or you’d have to remove the air spring and have the motor actively drive the post both ways. And then it’d be really slow.
  • 2 0
 Best about wireless is the clean cockpit. I'd buy a reverb axs as soon as it comes as 200mm.
  • 1 0
 @Assclapp: That's what I said. Most cable posts work by pulling on a lever on the bottom of the post. Replace the cable with a solenoid fitted to the bottom of the post pulling on that lever.
  • 1 0
 @IanJF: I was actually trying to come up with a design for that. Carbon bikes can use wireless charging (much like you fancy new phone). Metal bikes could use an umbilical routed through the existing dropper cable port along with the antenna. The problem is how to install an antenna on bikes with no external dropper cable hole at all.
  • 1 0
 @IanJF: A solenoid with reasonable power consumption isn’t powerful enough. I was envisioning using a worm gear instead.
  • 3 0
 Totally agree. I'm patiently waiting for a 200mm wireless Reverb AXS or competitor for under 500 bucks. Wireless shifting may be cool but the one cable I'd love to get rid of is the dropper cable.
  • 1 0
 I needed a new dropper and picked up a 2020 AXS reverb for 45% off, It's not any better than a normal reverb but I love the clean look, the battery lasts about 6 weeks riding 4-5 days per week.
  • 1 0
 @calebshin: I bought my Vyron v2.0 from Merlyn Cycles for $319 delivered in Oct 2020. Now they are $445 delivered which is a butt ton of $, but still far cheaper than SRAM. I love my Vyron and will never have another cable actuated dropper.
  • 1 0
 @DBone95: Sweet. Seriously considering buying a wireless dropper, internal cable routing is an absolute nightmare for my dropper post. I'll stick with my SDG Tellis for now because it's a great post but I'd definitely drop a cable and add a battery.
  • 1 0
 heard apparently there's one on the way from a budget brand, but take that with a pinch of salt as its only a kid going on a shop rumour
  • 1 0
 @azureblue: I'm not an engineer, but i would think it would have some sort of "negative" spring working opposite it and any sort of motor regulating the pressures between the two.

I'm making shit up here...I just really think it would be fantastic if there was a tidy solution.
  • 2 0
 @Tr011: Shimano has been pretty reactive of late. The existence of GX AXS might just give it a kick up the arse.
  • 1 0
 @calebshin: Look on European websites. Can get the Vyron for as little as $270 euros.
  • 1 0
 @MaplePanda: Interesting. Yeah... You're probably right about the solenoid power. I wonder how the AXS actuator works - and how much of that is patented.

I was figuring on just pulling the post out of the bike to charge/swap the battery.

Good point about the receiver getting a signal through carbon vs. metal, although most (all?) metal frames do have cable ports at the bottom of the seat tube where an antennae could exit, although I'm not sure how to deal with the distance variable between the bottom of the post and where that port may be.

Of course, all of these challenges is probably why this hasn't been done yet.
  • 1 0
 @ReformedRoadie: What does the spring in a dropper actuator do? Is it an integral part of the calving assembly that keeps the valve firmly sealed closed? Or is it merely a return spring for the cable + remote? Adding a return spring in the first case wouldn’t be good for longevity, while it would be a fantastic solution in the second.
  • 1 1
 Its not like you are routing the cable every week? I would find having and or forgetting to charge batteries more of a pain in the azz then routing a dropper cable.
  • 182 32
 Just set my phone alarm to March 2023 for the much better Shimano Deore wireless
  • 41 7
 for half the price
  • 137 5
 And due to factory issues it wont truly be available to the masses until 2026
  • 34 0
 @mtmc99: should be when sram super eagle with a 60t cassette is available
  • 26 0
 fat chance. if shimano comes out with anything wireless by 2023 I'll buy it for you
  • 9 0
 @chiefsasquatch: can i get in on this deal?
  • 3 1
 @p1nkbike: do we need Super Eagle since everything will be electric by then?
  • 1 0
 @chiefsasquatch: aren’t the new Pivot bikes shipping with provisions for XT/XTR Di2 internals built into the frame for MY2021? Might want to be careful about that lol
  • 12 71
flag thenotoriousmic (Mar 25, 2021 at 8:23) (Below Threshold)
 I swear to god you delusional shimano fanboys are hilarious. Deore is absolute shit that falls apart after a few months and is a complete waste of money. Most things made by shimano is cheap and poorly built but honestly shimano should have some kind of criminal conviction for fraud after the amount of money they’ve conned out of people for the new 12 speed groupsets especially slx and deore.
  • 3 0
 @p1nkbike: Good timing. That's about the same time my 11spd stuff should all be worn out.
  • 18 1
 @thenotoriousmic: I’ve had my SLX derailleur since august, smashed it through rocks, mud, snow, dust, leaves, and haven’t had any issues so far
  • 11 1
 @thenotoriousmic: i sense some bitterness here. did you buy a deore groupset and expect xt/xtr level performance? there are plenty of well documented long term reviews of shimano's 12 speed groupset. personally i've had my xt 12 speed for 2 years now and aside from a couple of cable adjustments here and there, i have no issues. bash it against all of the rocks where i live in arizona and it just keeps on going... i'll report back to you in another couple of years.
  • 1 2
 @sjma: pivot has been shipping their bikes with di2 compatibility since like 2017 at least. it's coming, and pivot is well ready for it Big Grin
  • 9 0
 @sjma: thats not wireless
  • 19 4
 @peterfoley5: I've had my GX drailleur since august, smashed it through rocks, mud, snow, dust, leaves, and now I can't shift and everything is broken.
  • 4 37
flag thenotoriousmic (Mar 25, 2021 at 8:57) (Below Threshold)
 @novajustin: deore does perform just as poorly as XTR / XT it’s exactly the same crap just with different paint though it is built from slightly better materials and does seem to last longer. My mates just got into mountain biking bought a bike with a deore build and out of the box it felt almost identical to my XT stuff just over a month later it’s all falling to bits and feels like crap. It’s actually embarrassing that they think it’s acceptable to sell that shit to people.
  • 8 0
 @thenotoriousmic: weird as my wife has been using the new Deore for a few months now and it’s been nothing short of awesome.
  • 5 3
 @thenotoriousmic: yeah, I've a mate who also bought a brand new bike less than a year ago. He is on his third cassette and I think his fourth mech. Sram GX.
  • 2 0
 @Assclapp: sorry, should have clarified “wireless Di2”. PB’s review from February made mention that there is a provision for a Di2 battery in the frame of the new 429, but no routing hole to run the wires

m.pinkbike.com/news/first-ride-2021-pivot-trail-429.html
  • 1 0
 @mtmc99: By then we'll be back to 10 speed cassettes with %12000 range.
  • 10 0
 @Darragh-McD: he should probably start looking after his shit a little better then... I’ve been on GX since I built my patrol in like August/July and have had zero issues.
  • 42 0
 The whole shimano vs sram love/hate is silly. I'm so glad we have both. Without sram, we'd still all be using the same terrible 9 speed xt derailleurs that we used 20 years ago. Without shimano, we'd probably all be broke because we'd be using and breaking $500 sx derailleurs. Either one having a monopoly would be bad for us all.
  • 5 10
flag thenotoriousmic (Mar 25, 2021 at 9:31) (Below Threshold)
 @kev-jones: yep, I’ve got a five year old gx mech that looks like I’ve been doing feeble grinds on it. Still absolutely solid. Same with my other GX mech and my XO1 mech. Everything sram I own works better and lasts. Everything shimano works poorly and falls apart but it’s cheap hence why I buy it for my other bikes. You get what you pay for at the end of the day. There’s a reason why shimano usually in the bargain bucket on chain reaction.
  • 7 0
 @thenotoriousmic: my seven year old XT derailleur disagrees with you...
  • 8 0
 @Darragh-McD: how the heck is he doing that......i have an xo1 mech from 5 years ago still working like new and a gx eagle and nx eagle with lots of miles on them and absoloutely zero issues. What are people doing to ruin so many mechs. If your playing pinball with mechs and rocks so often you really should focus on better line choices and not blaming mechs.
  • 1 0
 @p1nkbike: pretty soon your cassette will just be your rear wheel
  • 1 0
 @mtmc99: We ordered them for our shop today with a July 19th or so eta.
  • 1 0
 @rabidmonkfish: I've got no idea what he is doing with it to go through so many. I ride the same stuff as him, it isn't the tracks that are destroying the mechs. His maintenance is fairly good. Where he damages them, I've got no idea. My only thought is that he has been unlucky enough to get that many dodgy units.
  • 3 0
 @SimbaandHiggins: I'm running a 21 year old Deore front derailleur on my commuter bike! Shifts flawlessly (for a front derailleur...)
  • 4 0
 @rabidmonkfish: i have friends who wreck sram and i have friends who wreck shimano and i remind myself to never let them borrow my bike!

How are people actually wrecking this stuff? Ive not broken either. I prefer sram shifting but thats the only difference for me
  • 1 0
 @Mattcon20: hub gears are a thing of the past, 30 years ago maybe
  • 1 0
 @SimbaandHiggins: my 20 year old xt 9 speed also disagrees with him as it's still perfect. I even broke the hanger off and got it wedged in a wheel and it's fine
  • 2 0
 @novajustin: I believe the offer was to me. @chiefsasquatch I'll pm you the deets
  • 1 0
 @CircusMaximus: less than a month it took for my mates deore groupset to fall apart. It’s a complete waste of money even by shimano standards. Less than a month to go through a mech, a calliper and a brake lever and he’s only just started riding.
  • 1 0
 @thenotoriousmic: no offence but maybe it has something to do with being a new rider? What can I say, my wife loves her Deore.
  • 1 2
 @CircusMaximus: no it’s because it’s poorly designed made as cheaply as possible out of low quality materials. The rear mech has just fallen apart it’s gone at the pivots in less than a month no obvious damage. It’s absolute crap and a complete waste of money.
  • 97 4
 Acceptable price for everyone looking for electronic shifting. I'll keep my bike free from electronics though
  • 16 3
 yeah, ive an xx1 eagle bike since eagle release - but not axs. its pricey but my issue isnt the price. eagle is very reliable, doesnt need adjustements over time and no need to care about batteries and stuff. cables dont get "gritty" overnight. i swapped em once, its been 4 or 5 years now?

i dont even know how they can improve eagle mechanica significantly. its just really good.

id get axs on the roadbike though, where shifting needs regular adjustements with cables.
  • 26 0
 i only want wireless for the clean cockpit
  • 5 5
 The amount of shifter cables that have broken on me in the bike parks are too damn high!
  • 9 1
 @p1nkbike: You mention roadbike shifting needing regular adjustments. I have Ultegra 11 speed on my cyclocross bike and it hasn't had any adjustments since I bought it in December 2017. Flawless shifting every time.
  • 10 20
flag adrennan (Mar 25, 2021 at 8:15) (Below Threshold)
 @makripper: At least you can carry a spare shifter cable and it takes like 5 minutes to put in. If your battery dies, you are out of luck. I appreciate that sram made this more accessible but it still creates a weak link in my view.
  • 39 0
 @adrennan: Nah you're right. Extra batteries are impossible to carry.
  • 20 0
 @adrennan: A extra battery is faster to change then a cable...
  • 21 0
 @adrennan: it's a real shame it's literally impossible to carry a spare battery, and even if you could it looks like it takes entire seconds to swap.
  • 14 0
 @blensen: I mean, the sort of rider that forgets to charge their derailleur battery, is the sort of rider who also probably forgets to keep their spare battery charged. Just saying. I'm that type of rider, I don't have axs tho.
  • 7 5
 @kcy4130: exactly. my spare cable at the bottom of my bag hasnt ran out of battery in years.
  • 11 0
 @p1nkbike: As an owner of both mechanical and AXS Eagle, I can pretty much confirm your assessment. Copied from above:

"I bought the AXS group because that was the only build option for the bike I wanted. It's... fine. Best thing ever? Nah. It basically works exactly like mechanical, with one small added feature, which is that you can reverse the shifter buttons. Both groups shift fine, but to me, the AXS group seems to suffer from slightly more slow shifts in gritty conditions, regardless of how I fine tune the indexing. But if there's a difference, it's small.

The tradeoffs? Have to monitor two batteries, significantly more expensive, and the potential for new/complex electronic/RF failure modes down the line (mechanical was incredibly reliable for me).

In my view, a group that basically accomplishes the same thing with massively more engineering complexity is not a clear win. I think a lot of AXS owners are suffering from a little bit of confirmation bias."
  • 5 1
 @nsmithbmx: and you’ll never go back because of the shifting. Jumped on my backup bike yesterday and spent the whole ride annoyed at all the little finicky the shifter lever adjustments you have to make to keep the shifts crisp. Woke up this AM and ordered GX AXS for it. I was ripe for the picking LOL
  • 3 1
 bingo. Don't want to charge my bike. I already have to worry about tire pressure (every ride), shock pressure (depending on the trails i'm hitting), water, food, tools, spares, clothes/gear, lights (if chasing sunset which I often do).

Having my derailleur die because I forgot to charge it would just be too much ahha.

I also am not convinced the performance benefits are worth it... since eagle came out I haven't had a single issue with any of my GX and above drivetrains.
  • 5 1
 @bonkmasterflex: Agree... Whenever people are like "electronic is ZERO maintenance", I'm like "How come charging doesn't count as maintenance?"

Not only is it clearly maintenance, it has one of the most frequent service intervals of any component on a bike. And if you fail to do it, you get a total functional loss, potentially stranding you.
  • 1 0
 @whitebirdfeathers: I replace a right side shift cable about every three months (3000 miles?) on my Dura Ace bike. Shreds them inside the shift lever. I know it's a normal thing.
  • 55 6
 This looks pretty AXSible Wink
  • 6 13
flag TrekXCFactoryRacing (Mar 25, 2021 at 7:35) (Below Threshold)
 @AlexTokmakoff you creatively punderful monster!
  • 14 1
 Should really shift the market
  • 36 2
 As a bike shop employee, I see something like this as a great leap in the right direction for the industry. Maybe we will start seeing AXS on bikes that are not upwards of seven to ten thousand dollars. That price point is unattainable for many riders, and I am curious to see what this does to the industry. However, I think that there is something to be said by the fact that you can get a full deore groupset with a wide range drivetrain and nice brakes for the same price. And the fact that deore has the same hyperglide technology as XTR is insane. I have ridden both AXS and XTR on demo bikes, and I honestly prefer the shifts of XTR. There is something to be said about how great wireless shifting works, but even the deore drivetrain ,in my opinion, feels better. Now, I know that for races the weight advantage is great and the quick shifts are amazing with AXS. I just personally feel like a similarly priced mechanical drivetrain is the far better drivetrain for the everyday rider.
  • 4 15
flag makripper (Mar 25, 2021 at 8:07) (Below Threshold)
 yeah see yah later broken shifter cables! nice knowing you!
  • 32 4
 @makripper: Been riding and building bikes since '89. Literally never broke a cable, nor had anyone I was riding with break one. Freyed/kinked housings maybe 2-3 times, but fine enough to ride it out. And I'm totally going AXS on my next bike. But seriously, this broken cable thing is mystery to me.
  • 11 0
 @Chuckolicious: I got your share of cable failures. Let me know if you want it back.
  • 4 0
 @BenPea: LOL! Always down to help a brother out. ;-]
  • 4 2
 Highly, highly, highly skeptical that every group being electronic will lead to a *decrease* in bike prices. If I'm calling it like I see it, the main point of electronic shifting (which I own and use) was for the bike industry to charge more for a shiny new thing with a serious dazzle factor, but which solves no problem.

The prices of bikes have drastically outpaced inflation. When I started racing in 2008, flagship bikes were $5000-$6000. Now we're past double that.
  • 6 0
 Nothing beats brand new Hyperglide shifting but it degrades SO fast and by month 3 of daily-ish rides it’s worse than Eagle, which doesn’t really degrade. Shimano hyperglide is so nuanced that any wear at all to chain/cassette pretty much cancels the effects. I’m a larger rider, so I might be seeing more wear faster than most, but for me I’ll stick with Eagle.
  • 1 7
flag JSTootell (Mar 25, 2021 at 11:03) (Below Threshold)
 @Chuckolicious: You must not ride much. I go through a cable every three months on my road bike (I try to change it before failure, but usually miss it). I have had a dropper cable fail totally, two I caught just before failure. And I was lucky enough to break a shifter cable near the end of a big MTB ride (50 miles). I always carry a spare cable on my trail bike. Though I change them annually no matter what condition they are in, and inspect regularly for wear.

I do ride about 12000 miles a year though.
  • 3 0
 @JSTootell: Err, if you knew me you wouldn't have said that. Basically ride every other day, conditions permitting. And do regular MTB trips out west until the snow flies. Honestly, I must be an outlier, as are my buddies, if what you say is true. Not saying it isn't, not at all. Even have a 2004 S Works Enduro that still has the stock cables and saw a ton of riding back in its time, and still sees a ride or two each season just for the fun of it.
  • 1 0
 @nattyd: I was not predicting lower prices, but rather more bikes with electronic shifting. It is quite nice, and I can see why many people like it so much more. Something to consider about bicycle costs nowadays versus in 2008 is that while the top of the line bikes may cost two to three times as much as they did then, the models at the 5000-6000 dollar range now are better than the top of the line models then. They are lighter, faster, and more capable. There is so much new tech, so the top of the line bikes are multiplying by both the cost of new technology along with the cost of inflation. There is perceived necessity for the best bike out there, but the reality is that most people are going to be just as happy on a 6000 dollar bike as on a 13000 dollar bike.
  • 5 0
 @WillieJ10: It's true that mountain bikes have gotten much better, but mostly that has to do with things that are unrelated to electronic shifting: better geometry, wide-range 1x, dropper posts, better tires, etc.

Road bikes, on the other hand, not so much. High-end road bikes have also doubled in price, but for all of the incremental changes, my 2011 Tarmac could still be raced in the Tour de France with little to no disadvantage. After all, last year's tour was won on a round-tube/rim brake bike.

When I'm over on CyclingTips reading reviews of new road bikes, I'm often left wondering "is this really a better experience than the CAAD10 you could have bought a decade ago for half the price?"
  • 4 0
 @nattyd: road bike design peaked in the 70's
  • 2 1
 @Chuckolicious: breaking cables imo is down to the type of riding you do. XC your cables will likely be fine for years, Enduro/DH much less. I'll get through at least 2 cables over a ten day riding span riding DH, its pretty common.
  • 2 0
 @Freakyjon: just had a thought. It could be down to overtightening the bolt the fixes the cable to the mech. I may have been guilty of that in the past.
  • 6 0
 @Freakyjon: wait you're getting through 2 shifter cables in 10 days?! I'd say that's pretty uncommon - is DH really that much harder on a shifter cable than other disciplines? If anything I'd have thought it was seeing less intense use than XC. Not calling you out here just keen to know how you're managing that!
  • 1 1
 @Chuckolicious: ever ride a bike park? Definitely had weekends of going through them.
  • 1 1
 @patsharp: dh destroys everything! I can't name one part I haven't broken on my dh bikes. Yes I've bent stems and bars. Cracked cranks etc.
  • 1 2
 @makripper: Uh huh. Even got a season pass and go several times a week as it’s just 30 min from my house.
  • 2 0
 @patsharp: Just not adding up. Shifting under load during trail rides would put the most strain on a cable. I spend a ton of time at my local park and not seeing this happening to anyone.
  • 1 0
 @BenPea: Good point but it's not related to that, it normally snaps well away from the fixing bolt.
  • 2 0
 @patsharp: I don't know the actual reason why it happens, I imagine it's to do the the banging around and the amount of work the mech does through the travel etc. FYI before anyone asks, I've been using Shimano Saint mechs for years and change it a least once a year if not more to ensure everything is still tight. And it's not frame related, as it's always been an issue since I first started riding. But cable cost barely anything, so never been much of an issue to me.
  • 29 1
 Well, $600 is lower than I expected... may give this one a shot once we figure out if the cage is butter or not, haha
  • 14 0
 I bashed my xo1 AXS hard on a rock on my second ride with it. There is a pretty good scratch on the cage, but it still shifts flawlessly and my hanger wasn't bent at all. Gave me a lot of confidence in my $1000 dangly bit. Hopefully the GX version is just as strong if not a little burlier. I'd like to see a review to know if it shifts as quickly as the xo1 version, which is by far the nicest drivetrain I've ever ridden.
  • 7 2
 The cage on the GX is steel vs aluminum on XO so it should be much stronger
  • 7 0
 In mechanical derailleurs, I found there was a notable jump in durability between GX Eagle and X01 Eagle. It will be interesting to see if the same is true for AXS. I’m lucky enough to have XX1 AXS and the derailleur has had quite a few hits and works perfectly. Seems like a solid hunk of material.
  • 4 0
 @DMal: I agree - I had 2 GX 12 speed derailleurs that were garbage. I tried and tried but it was never as smooth or durable as my XO 11 speed. I ended up getting an XO 12 speed and it has been flawless.
  • 2 0
 @DMal: I think this too. I had X1 11 speed in the past which was in between X01 and GX. I feel there’s a group set missing in the Eagle line
  • 8 4
 @cosbot: But but but... it is not the American Steel, it is the Chinese steel.... so weak ~
  • 3 0
 it will be available on pink bike for sale as new take off for $400 once they come on bikes...
  • 1 1
 @Lokirides: It helps that the cage can move when smashed and then come back perfectly in position. On a mechanical version the cable and spring are putting opposing forces on the cage trying to keep it perfectly in place, and knock will likely mess that up slightly and f*ck with your shifting. So with the cage made from steel, and the ability to move out of the way when hit, I think it will be pretty good.
  • 2 0
 @deonvg I'm with you. Steel can be stronger than aluminum, but in my experience brands use a mild steel in cheap derailleurs that bends and doesn't spring back when abused. We'll see if they used a decent steel alloy in this. I'm hoping they did...
  • 1 0
 The hanger's been straightened a few times, but my 2018 vintage Eagle GX derailleur looks like it's been through a war and still runs pretty much flawlessly.
  • 19 0
 Hey remember that big Shimano 100th anniversary? Me neither.

I've run both SRAM and Shimano over the last 15 or so years, but I generally favor Shimano... this is the first time my eyes are lighting up and I'm thinking about a SRAM upgrade in a long time.

What would REALLY push me over the side is the integration opportunities. I love the idea of a wireless dropper... even if I've had bad luck with Reverbs. The often rumored electronic suspension controls are the game changer. Being able to use a few simple cockpit buttons to manage your suspension is really appealing - I think I'd get a hell of a lot more miles out of climb switches if they were easier to use. Imagine if you automatically when to climb mode if you hit your last cog? that'd be cool, but the opportunity to program that in or out would be great. Or a single click to toggle both ends from climb to open, or to cycle through climb, trail, open or whatever your suspension options are... nerdy fun that could actually be pretty useful on the trail.
  • 5 0
 Did you read that article about shimano's patent application (for a bunch of wireless stuff) on vital a week or two ago? Interesting stuff, it seems mostly aimed at commuter ebikes, but still intriguing.
  • 2 1
 You can use this with shimano 12 speed cassette and chain to get the shifting benefits.
  • 19 0
 Since no one asked me, I figured I would Let everyone know that this works perfectly with a Shimano 12 Speed Chain and cassette. It works better than the SRAM chain and cassette in my experience. This is awesome news, now we just need a GX dropper post for about $400.
  • 2 0
 Don't SRAM Eagle chains have larger roller diameters than Shimano? If so, seems like that would cause premature wear of the derailleur pulleys and chainring, since those teeth are spaced for Eagle chains.
  • 1 0
 @nattyd: Possibly. All I know is I’ve been running mine for a year with 2000 miles on an E bike and it works like a charm.
  • 21 0
 600USD is about 440GBP. So this will retail in the UK for about 600GBP then.
  • 1 0
 £554
  • 4 1
 Nope: The pricing is:
$600 USD
$904 AUD
€620 EUR
£554 GBP

Add to that salestaxes in the US.
  • 17 0
 Wait, the price difference is approx $200, and the only difference is the cage material? It costs $200 additional dollars to make an alu cage instead of steel? Am I missing something?
  • 8 1
 Welcome to the bike industry, out of the factory things can cost $100, $110 and $120, by the time they arrive on shop shelves with all the branding you are paying $600, $800 and $1000.
  • 4 0
 the motor
  • 6 1
 The $200 dollars was to fund the development of AXS several years ago. NX AXS will cost $100 for a derailleur and be 50 grams heavier.
  • 7 0
 @Mugen: Do you think engineering is free? Large factories with assembly lines of workers don't need to be paid? Power bills don't have to be paid? Chemicals don't have to be paid to dispose of? International tax calculations don't have to paid for? Things are carried across oceans for free? etc. Companies are making the margins they need to operate and be a functional business.
  • 4 0
 @yoloboi96: you misunderstand my point, the margins are one thing, the question is specifically why 2 nearly identical products can be hundreds of euros apart, and that is pure marketing.
  • 3 0
 To me it seems like they purposely used a steel cage to not canibalize their own higher end products, since the normal gx derailieur comes with an aluminium cage.

You could just buy a new cage and jockey wheels for 30€, bolt it onto your gx axs derailieur and you have whats essentially an XO1 Axs derailieur.
  • 1 0
 Good point, I feel like the answer is a blend of gafoto and endoplasmicreticulum. I guess that is the interesting part of starting a fresh product line with the top component. You then need to 'dumb it down' purposely to offer a wider range of product. Without deliberately sabotaging design, it seems like material replacement is a good choice. However, it feels so stark when it is just material substitution being the difference. Usually there is a loss of features, etc.
  • 2 0
 @coast2coast-4:
A lot of those lost features are hilariously forced too. One of the differences in XT vs SLX derailleurs is the externally adjustable clutch. The only change is the XT clutch cover has a hole with a rubber grommet on it. Difference in cost literally has to be pennies for Shimano but it lets them sell more a more featured XT...
  • 16 0
 Sram is really funny about the shape of their actuation paddles on their products.

The introduce the reverb, hydraulically actuated (fine) but then they use a button. Years of bitching goes on about that stupid button until the rest of the industry is starting to catch them and then "we have this all new actuation paddle that is like a shifter paddle" available separate for $$$

Now years later they have done the same f*cking thing with axs - initially a completely different ergonomic that most people dislike, and now for only $20 extra we have a paddle (that we should have f*cking included at the beginning) it can be yours.
  • 1 0
 I have the rocker paddle on my AXS setup, and whilst it is a better shape than the original paddle, the whole setup is not as ergonomic as SRAM cable shifters. The tactile feedback is poor and it can be difficult to feel any kind of click or feedback on a downshift, meaning you can end up in the wrong gear at the wrong time. At the point your brain starts focusing on how to press your shift level you are going to miss lines then crash. I think SRAM have created half a brilliant product. Brilliant shift, lousy levers. Maybe SRAM will produce a 2nd generation lever with a sensible feel. GX Eagle might be much less expensive, but until the ergonomics is fixed, spend your money elsewhere.
  • 18 2
 Pinion riders: “dErAiLeUrS” *wheezing laughing emoji*
  • 3 1
 I just want a gearbox that only loses a watt or two of efficiency over a derailleur. Weight is probably less important. But its not going to happen.....
  • 11 0
 Yea but WIRELESS Pinion instead of the grip shift thing.
  • 2 0
 Think of the R&D that went into wireless shifting. Could that have somehow found a way to overcome the efficiency hurdle?
  • 2 0
 @dhracer71: agreed. When they bring that in, I’ll be willing to try pinion. I just can’t deal with grip shift these days.
  • 1 0
 @hamncheez: that was farmed out and packaged by a tech company most likely.
  • 1 0
 I know another company used IBM or CSC to develop their ANT+ integration for another sporting discipline. Well designed and defined protocols are really easy to integrate.
  • 2 0
 @Afterschoolsports: no hate and maybe you have tried them but the amount of people from where I live that day the same thing because they associate grip shift with Kmart bikes is unreal. It’s always their biggest concern when they ride my bike. I find it that good that I wouldn’t go trigger shift even if it was an option. They’re nice defined clicks between the gears and it’s genuinely nice to be able to just roll my wrist a bit to change a gear coming into a tight corner and not having to take any fingers off to do it.
  • 1 0
 @vandenr2: Ya, grip shift isn't my first choice, but by no means is it bad.
  • 1 0
 @hamncheez: The design and technology behind geared power transmission is very mature at this point and therefore pretty well optimised. Well into the region of diminishing returns, I would expect.
  • 12 0
 Question is: Can one fit a short cage from a DH-derailleur and limit it to 7 speed to use on a DH bike?
  • 3 0
 Check bastienranger on Instagram. I think he modified an XO1 AXS and put on a XO1 dh cage.
Trying to post link to his post: www.instagram.com/p/CHDsN1anfjM/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link
  • 6 0
 @Aledh04: Sweet! Thanks! Now I know what I'm gonna do! I've got a couple of X01 DH cages laying about. It's been a bit pricey to put AXS on a DH bike up until now, but this makes it very feasable. Mod some triggers to downshift on the right thumb and upshift on the left and we're golden!
  • 13 2
 Friend, "Let's go for a bike ride"!
Me, "Oh man, I'd love to but I forgot to recharge my bike".

Just kidding, I don't have any friends.
  • 12 4
 Getting this to work reliably is truly an engineering marvel. I work with Bluetooth day to day in an engineering capacity and can tell you that Bluetooth in basically a raging tire fire. The spec is massive, around 2300 pages. SRAM has an advantage here in that they control the entire system instead of having to make a device that works with any other BT device that a customer might have, but this is still impressive.

I'd like to pick this thing apart more, but no one seems to have publish any technical details. e.g. I assume it's BLE between the shifter and the derailleur?

I will never buy one of these and I hope my riding friends don't either, but hats off to you SRAM engineers.
  • 11 0
 AXS uses BLE for communication with the smartphone app. Actual shifting commands are sent through Airea (proprietary protocol). ANT+ is used to communicate with head units.
  • 2 0
 @islandlife98: Thanks, you are clearly more informed than me. That makes way more sense than how I thought it worked. Good info here:

bikerumor.com/2019/02/06/sram-axs-wireless-control-system-is-the-all-access-pass-to-future-components
  • 1 0
 i also hate bluetooth. alot of my test equipment is being upgraded with bluetooth connectivity and it takes longer to connect to the equipment then do the tests! same laptop, same equipment, have to update driver or uninstall driver every damn time and after a few tries it still doesn't work.
  • 3 0
 Yea, why the hell is BT still utterly unreliable and frustrating? It's like, what, 20 years old now? Just boggles my mind that it's still literally voodoo when it comes to reliably connecting things.
  • 2 0
 @makripper: thank the bt chipset makers. Their drivers are trash. It’s a constant source of frustration for me at work too.
  • 12 2
 I don't see the appeal of electronic shifting, but to each their own. However, still way more respect for this than someone with electronic pedaling.
  • 6 0
 When I was younger and Di2 was introduced I said no way, not worth it. Now that I am in my 40s, have kids, a career, and some disposable income, I have Di2 being installed on my gravel bike and am thinking this GX AXS will be on my mtn bike by the end of summer. This is a hobby, and like every hobby people throw money at it just for the sake of throwing money at it. Trying different things equipment is the fun part of this sport and waiting for the trickle down is how us people with smaller amounts of disposable income can enjoy these things. I will never be a first adopter on anything, but I think Di2 and AXS have proven themselves to be worthy of my money.
  • 11 2
 What a shifting AXSperience.
  • 8 0
 Time is money! This is going to save me $$$ not having to touch my barrel adjuster every couple hundred miles!
  • 9 1
 in a couple months I will glom one of these off buy and sell for $290
  • 16 8
 I do love spending XTR money on a heavy, low-quality drivetrain.
  • 11 9
 Have you actually tried AXS?
The latest 12 speed Shimano stuff has had mediocre reliability. I know a lot of people that have issues with the clutch on XTR/XT derailleurs. The wandering bite-point is also an issue. I've seen both of these issues occur on my teammate's bike (her bikes are well maintained, by team mechanics mind you!)
I don't know what's up with them, but they really dropped the ball lately.
  • 9 6
 @islandlife98: nobody was talking about brakes
  • 7 1
 @islandlife98: I've experienced the exact same thing. Also, exploded XTR derailleurs, inop XTR shifters. Even then the clutches are working they develop slop before the clutch engages allowing the chains to bounce. I've seen many people post about crankarms falling off a year after installation.
  • 4 0
 @ols532704: Sure, but I was just pointing out the problems Shimano has been having lately.
  • 1 1
 @xlcheese: Oh man, that is very concerning. Exploding derailleurs???
  • 2 0
 @islandlife98: The carbon cages tend to go boom when bumping things. They don't take a hit very well as compared to XT, etc... I've had a few XTR derailleurs to repair.
  • 3 0
 @xlcheese: Just buy the XT Cage plates.
  • 1 0
 @xlcheese: Road or MTB crank arms?
  • 1 0
 @ols532704: Sure, but this shouldn't be happening in the first place. Especially on something as expensive as XTR.
  • 1 0
 @islandlife98: There is a reason its called XT Race, its lightweight for racing, lightweight and durability dont really go together.
  • 8 0
 Bring me a GX Level Dropper Post and I'll be happy, hate dropper cables
  • 6 2
 There's 2 very important factors of AXS for me that i'm surprised nobody ever seems to talk about, 1. the only reason it needs that overload bash feature is because it's so massive you cant not hit it, even standard mechs stick out way to far these days, remember shimano shadow derailleurs, i never hit one of them, what happened to them? 2. the weight penalty might not be much but it 'shifts' alot of the weight from the cable and shifter to the rear mech which is unsprung mass so one of the worst places you can add weight.
  • 8 0
 Looks like an AXS
  • 7 1
 did they do anything to fix how sloppy the GX derailleurs get after a couple months?
  • 3 0
 What I want is 2 preset buttons where you can put it into a chosen gear with the press of 1 button. Being able to hit one button and go from 12 to 1 instantly would be great for some of the flowy desert trails with steep slickrock climbs.
  • 3 0
 Don’t be fooled y’all. SRAM is still making a hefty margin on this “inexpensive” AXS. I picked up a XX1 Eagle AXS upgrade kit last year when MSRP was still a G for only $700 from a SRAM authorized dealer with full warranty...
  • 3 0
 for me the main selling point is you almost never have to re adjust it, maybe im ass at setting my derailleur but if every 3-4 weeks I have to redo my shit shifting, than im happy to spend more money to only have to go trough that once or twice a year instead.
  • 4 1
 Is it just me, or are other people getting fed-up with scheduled predictable product releases?
When something comes out, all at once across all the feeds and tubes there's this double up of info in the scramble. Its getting too obviously orchestrated now?
The gx axs, the new levo, the maxxis shorty, the mega. On and on, in twenty different places simultaneously, athletes insta.
Is there another way?
  • 2 0
 The instant shifting is a weird feeling. Going back and forth on two bikes between XX1 AXS and X01 standard shifter have to reset my expectations of the feedback loop to my brain about a successful shift. Some kind of haptic feedback would be awesome. I also want to know about the inter-compatibility with road AXS groupsets i.e. can I use this with eTap AXS?
  • 2 29
flag mnorris122 (Mar 25, 2021 at 7:34) (Below Threshold)
 Uhhhh cable shifting is more instant than wireless shifting. The time is takes the cable to move at the derailleur once it moves at the shifter is less than the time it takes the electrons to travel from the shifter to derailleur.
  • 5 0
 BikeRumor said in their YouTube video that this was compatible with eTap AXS.
  • 5 0
 @mnorris122: Yes, it definitely is, but when I shift two gears I get two clicks on an analog shifter. If it just had some feedback through the shifter about how many shifts I was getting it would be great.
  • 2 0
 @mnorris122: Umn...what?
  • 1 6
flag mnorris122 (Mar 25, 2021 at 9:23) (Below Threshold)
 When you push a mechanical shifter, the cable moves instantly. No delay whatsoever. When you push an electronic shifter, electrons and radio signals have to move through the air. Some delay.
  • 1 0
 @mnorris122: I think the sensation of quickness might have to do with the cable throw? Maybe the motors move faster than your thumb so a quick button push feels faster than mechanical? I've never ridden it though so I'm talking out of my butt.
  • 7 0
 @mnorris122: bro what?
Let's say the distance between the shifter and derailleur is 1.5 meters (It's most likely less IRL). Speed of light is approximately 299 792 458 meters per second. Are you telling me you can feel a delay of 0.000000005003 seconds? Even when adding the delays of processing, we're talking about hundreds/thousands of a second.
  • 5 1
 I also own both and do not find the AXS shifting to be faster. I'm not sure where the idea comes from. The movement of a derailleur being pulled by a cable is also instantaneous. Besides, isn't the speed of the shift mostly determined by the chain traversing between cogs after the movement of the derailleur? Why would that be any different regardless of the actuation?

This is one of those electronic shifting talking points that just feels like rationalization/confirmation bias to me.
  • 3 0
 @nattyd: This is an interesting question, though my guess is AXS is faster. Consider that all things are equal between your brain deciding to shift and your thumb contacting the shifting mechanism (paddle, button, whatever). Then, for a cable system, your thumb has to complete the throw of the mechanism, which in turn pulls the cable, which has some stretch (minimal but still there), to move the derailler to the desired position.

For AXS, thumb pushes button with minimal throw. System sends signal at speed of light. Derailler receives signal and moves to desired position.

I think AXS wins. Maybe not perceptibly, and I'd probably bet that the difference between the two is actually imperceptible to the human brain. So maybe moot?
  • 3 0
 @Chuckolicious: The critical question is the scale of each step. The transmission of load through a cable vs an electronic signal might be 1 ms vs .00001 ms, but the difference will likely be a rounding error on the chain traversing the cassette (maybe .5 seconds).
  • 1 0
 @nattyd: Pinkbike seems to have a dearth of content at the moment. Might be a good subject for them to explore.
  • 2 0
 @Chuckolicious: I've never tried AXS, but I thought that when eTap came out it was maddeningly slow (compared to other high end road groups). I was working in the industry at the time so I'd tried Di2 and EPS and they did not feel sluggish. At the time, SRAM said that they had adjusted the motor speed to achieve the smoothest shift, so perhaps they've reworked that balance.
I was rooting for eTap too, so I don't suspect confirmation bias on my part. We sponsored a 'cross team, and I was really tired of fishing busted cables out of brifters. The most common spot where road cables broke was where the cable bends at the bar or coming out of the shifter and into the housing. I haven't seen nearly as many mtb cables break, likely because they don't make as many thought radius bends as the roadie stuff.
  • 6 1
 no thanks, i will stay with my mechanical 11 speed xt which works great after 4 years.
  • 5 1
 Sram is the king of shade. Releasing budget wireless before Shimano even releases their own wireless version and during their centennial celebrations
  • 4 0
 If the only differencebetwwen X01 and GX is the cage being made from Aluminium, could one by the GX AXS and take the cage from their old XO1 and save both money and weight?
  • 1 0
 That's what they can tell from the first look. I'd guess it's similar to the differences between GX and X0 standard drivetrains where at first it seems like the only difference is weight and some materials, until you use both long term (year+) and realize that X0 works much better for a much longer term and requires much less adjusting over it's life and has a much longer lifespan. Durability and long term shift quality will be different I would guess
  • 2 0
 My XX1 AXS is my favorite thing on my 5010(highest tier build you can find), and I would be hyped to see more people having the ability to run wireless shifting because it is a game changer. I hope to hear more crispy shifting sounds from the whirrrr of that lil motor out on the trails.
  • 3 0
 if it was the same price as a traditional shifter I would consider it but only as an option. I would never build up a gravel/adventure/bikepacking bike with electronic stuff . . .
  • 2 0
 I am struck by a misappropriation of resources here. Cables and housing aren’t making my drivetrain suck. Wireless shifting fixes a problem that doesn’t exist. I would rather have a higher quality derailleur & shifter that doesn’t develop slop, or is rebuildable with universal parts that can be found without much trouble... with metal internals, and parts that don’t explode. I don’t need increasingly heavy and complex innovations it they don’t actually confer measurable benefit.
Tl;dr: this is shite.
  • 2 0
 @erikkellison: I think that electronic shifting will open up possibilities in bike design that have not existed, much as 1x drivetrains opened up the possibility of wider tires, wider axles, and suspension layouts that would not have been possible. We couldn't see that when 1x was first introduced, but now it has become obvious.
  • 4 0
 The difference between the $800 to $1000 price and the $600 is 64 grams? If you make one 192 grams heavier it should cost $200? I'll take that one!!
  • 2 1
 I am tempted to try ditching shifting cables, but I wish the battery lasted a lot more than 20 hours. I guess they figure not many people are doing a lot of week long bikepacking trips with 16 hour days. But, for those of us who do that sort of thing, having to charge something on your bike in order to ride it kinda sucks. I wonder if these could be charged with a mini solar panel strapped to top of pack bag?
  • 10 0
 Carry a 2nd battery for $55. Or carry the charger and charge it via USB (power pack, solar panel, etc.). You cannot charge the battery while in the derailleur.
  • 8 0
 @neons97: I was assuming I'd have 2 so that I can charge one while riding with the other. I suppose at the point I'm bringing all of that extra stuff, would be best to just stick with cable shifting.
  • 5 0
 @wheel-addict: you might also get a lot more time out of it if you're on flatter journeys with fewer shifts. My rides are all up-down-up-down so I shift a lot and I think the last time I checked, I got about 30 hours of ride time out of the battery. I carry a second one in my tool pouch for a quick swap. It is less of an issue than it might seem.
  • 2 1
 Isn't that 20h of continous shifting? I hope you do a lot more not shifting on a ride, than shifitng.
  • 5 0
 I mean, Lael ran AXS last year on the Tour Divide, with two extra batteries for a 2700 mile trip. Bikepacking.com review of previous AXS, and this new one indicates that the 20-hour battery life is very conservative and lots of folks are getting more time out of them.
  • 22 0
 I did a 4 days self supported trip in the Chilcotins last summer with a group of crazy French men, 12 hours/day, I took an Extra battery just in case, didn't need it. Right now I don't even pay attention when I charge it, even when the battery blinks red you can still ride quite a bit, and charging the battery takes 20 minutes or so. Plus the whole thing can take a beating and never stops working.
  • 2 0
 @wheel-addict: thank you for coming to that conclusion. Being self sufficient means keeping it simple IMO.
  • 1 0
 carry a small power pack and charge it. Says in the article that it charges quickly, so a small pack would probably get you anywhere your legs could.
  • 1 0
 im curious as to why they state hours when it should state how many shifts. I'm assuming the battery would last much longer than 20 hours. im guessing they meant 20 hours of constant shifting.
  • 1 0
 @makripper: i think they're just providing a conservative estimate for riding time based on some average number of shifts per hour. it is definitely not 20 hours of constant shifting but probably more than 20 hours of riding time - at least in my experience.
  • 3 2
 Don't think I would trust an electronic shifting drivetrain on a bike packing trip. "Hmm, it's stopped working... I guess I'll walk the rest of the way."

At least with an analog version, you can usually diagnose and fix it or at the very least Macgyver it together to keep you moving.
  • 1 2
 If you're doing a long pack, don't you ride with a foldable or rollup solar charger anyway?
  • 2 0
 @Chuckolicious: Solar doesn't scale down well. Maybe if you're riding in high desert you'd be able to charge devices from a few small panels.

I don't know the Milliamp hours these AXS batteries, but phones batteries have been growing very quickly recently. Gone are the days of the Nokia bricks lasting for a week on a few hundred mAh. Now a phone charge is 3-5 Ah, that would take almost a day of direct sunlight from a lot of the solar panels I've seen.

I'm open to be proved wrong, but from when I last researched, Solar panel charging is nice in theory, but the quality of the cells for Packable situations just doesn't make it viable. And again... you need intense direct sunlight for the optimal charging numbers they sell you. Which doesn't exist so much if you're riding in forest, or in camp at the beginning and end of day.

For MTBickepacking the OTT, all the riders pretty much gave up on Dynamos or any method of charging outside of battery packs, and charging when in town.
  • 3 0
 @joshroppo: AXS battery is 300 mAh @ 7.4V (2.2Wh) as seen here: www.bike-discount.de/en/buy/sram-etap-axs-battery-615391
  • 1 0
 @joshroppo: Ok, fair enough. Somehow I thought the roll up ones were reasonable for phones and stuff. Though I totally get that if you’re in the woods, they’re useless.
  • 1 0
 is there some way of seeing percentage charge remaining?
  • 3 0
 @AyJayDoubleyou: in the app or in your headunit.
  • 1 0
 Also don't forget the button cell battery in the shifter. It lasts over a year but dies suddenly with no notice. My friend had this happen in a the middle of a ride. Luckily his AXS seat dropper had the same battery so he swapped them and was able to finish.
  • 1 0
 @yoannbarelli: crazy French men, coming from Yoann...
  • 1 0
 @naseath: @naseath: Is the AXS shifter different than the Etap stuff that has a LED on the shifters to indicate battery life? If it does have the light, the occasional glance at that light might end up saving oneself from being in the position your buddy was in, as I imagine even when the shifter light goes red, the coin cell still has quite a bit of charge.
  • 1 0
 @joshroppo: why'd they move away from dynamos?
  • 1 0
 @hmstuna: RPMs. On a road bike duma,p you spend enough time at speed to generate power. When most of your time is spent riding slowly up hills, with short durations riding fast downhill. Very few moments of actual power generation, so effectively no ability to charge phones, lights, etc.
  • 1 0
 @joshroppo: ahh that makes sense. I knew there was something obvious I was missing.
  • 1 0
 It's good to see the price come down, but I couldn't justify it for mountain. My last road bike had DI2, and the only thing I miss is tapping a button to shift the front derailleur. Big throw on the big rings is sweet with a motor.
  • 1 0
 I'm surprised people are breaking cables. Never been an issue for me. Stretched cables and housing issues yes. I think i'd take an xx1 or xtr mechanical over this, but that does not mean it would be better. Stick me in the mechanical camp. Although i am a convert to electronic fuel injection over a carb, so maybe not forever...
  • 1 0
 When AdventX came out I thought it was the perfect drivetrain. I hate having to adjust my derailleur as much as I was with GX and I really didn't care about losing a bit of range and steps in between. Since then I've pretty much come to the conclusion I'd only go back to 12 speed if it was electric so i didn't have to adjust my derailleur all the time. Question is whether I wanna deal with charging a battery?
  • 1 0
 Will def wait a year or two til the tech gets better & less exps've, but I'm suprised to hear all the dropper (and shifter) cable gripes. I ride only DH & replace mine about every 6-8 mos, no problem. About 5 mins total for SDG tellis dropper & 15 for rear X01 derail. Easy. Waiting til they fray & get wrecked may make it worse (?)
  • 1 0
 I will offer that many shifting issues with both sram eagle and shimano 12 speed come down to corroded cables and suboptimal cable routing. I have a Ripmo v1. Started with GX. It eventually felt like crap so I upgraded to XT. It was great and then became crap as well. I finally tried the optislick shifter cable from shimano and it was a full night/day improvement for my XT. I suggest trying this $28 fix before jettisoning cables altogether.
  • 1 0
 The only way that electronic shifting and droppers would make even a tiny bit of sense are on an ebike and the shifters and dropper could be tied into power from the ebike battery. Having separate batteries per component is not only incredibly wasteful, but just unnecessary.
  • 3 0
 Sitting here having shifting issues from bike cabling that has to make a too tight turn into the derailleur leading to poor upshifting.....aaaand I ordered it
  • 1 0
 Been riding AXS for about a year here. My only nitpick w/ it is that it's so easy to hit a quick shift by accident when loading my bike onto a car/lift etc...Then it's in the wrong gear when I jump on. Small thing but it does happen.
  • 1 0
 Me and NX eagle over here like.....hmmmmmmmmm.

My frame has really shitty routing through the chainstay for cables and loose internal routing. Going to this makes me almost want to cut off my housings at the entry and exit points of the frame so if I destroy a $370 derailleur, I can just use the old housing to fish new into the frame and be back riding in a few minutes vs f*cking around with internal routing all night.

This is super super cool, but I'm trying to come up with all the reasons I can to say no. I've got one set of wheels with a shimano driver running NX and another set of wheels with the xd driver running GX. I just use GX chains so no gains from a chain and no point on moving up to an x01 or xx1 xassette since I'm straight for like the next 4000 miles.
  • 1 0
 Archer wireless shifting is what I did. It can make any cheap derailer feel amazing and gives you the other benefits of wireless shifting for like $380 plus shipping. If you destroy a derailer you just put whatever's cheapest you can find and you're golden in a few minutes.
  • 1 0
 How this bring you home when you lose your shifter after crash ? You can shift from mobile phone ? I don`t think so.
When the cable breaks you can still adjust the cable in variant positions and you can ride up or downhill. Smile
  • 1 0
 AXS adds at least 100g at the rear axle, 154g at the GX level. That’s bigger than the weight savings going from a GX to an XO1 cassette, which will cost you about $150 extra, which was previously the easiest/cost effective way to reduce unsprung mass at the wheel. Is electronic shifting really worth the reduction in suspension performance?
  • 1 0
 Just got back from my 2nd ride using GX AXS. It's great, really like it. Been itching for AXS for a while but couldn't stomach the price - although this is still USD 850 in South Africa, it's more acceptable than XO1 and XX1 (around USD 1450).

I love living in a 3rd world country.
  • 1 0
 I too tend to think that reliable bikes should remain fully mechanical.
However. there is so much potential for electric devices on a high-end bike.
To name the few that immediately come to mind:

Propulsion
Servo Shifting
Power braking
Seatpost actuation
Adaptive Suspension
GPS tracker + navigation + auto rescue
Digital bike ID and service interval reminder
Anti-theft system (with GPS)

Now all of these could work in conjunction and use the same power source, comm protocol and display.
Of course wiring and battery would be neatly integrated in the frame.
Imagine one day someone makes a BB with small integrated dynamo that will keep the battery topped off during rides.
And if not, you can still charge it with your ebike or phone charger.

We are getting there. Just very, very slowly.
  • 1 0
 Part of why I love biking is how far into nature it can take you. At this point people who don’t believe in the effects of wireless radiation are denying science (multiple peer reviewed scientific articles on EMF effects). I personally will never upgrade to AXS because of EMFs released by Bluetooth technology. Sure, long term effects may not be major however, I choose to bike over ebikes/dirt bikes because I love the fact that my bike is powered by me. Adding extra tech like this is something I think is mainly targeting the E-bike market. I’ll stick to my cables vs. a wireless system to stay disconnected
  • 1 0
 Am I the only one who finds the type 3 roller bearing clutch weak? As much maintenance as the XT clutch needs, at least it actually works. Don't know how everyone rides the newer sram stuff with all that slapping in the back.
  • 5 1
 Shouldt have read that. Now i want one. It isnt even that expensive.
  • 3 0
 Wonder if it will have the same slop in the pivots and mounting bolt as the standard gx?
  • 1 0
 Oh it definitely will.
  • 2 0
 Kaz, if you were wearing that Bluegrass back protector and knee high boots while you were telling me about this, then and only then, would I be prepared to listen
  • 5 1
 Happy 100th anniversary shimano. Love from sram
  • 5 1
 Anyone know if you can program AXS stuff for 11sp?
  • 1 3
 Theoretically all you would have to is move the limit screws and b screw according to your 11 speed cassette and it should work.
  • 1 0
 @ols532704: Isn't the spacing between 11 and 12 different? Does it auto adjust its indexing?
  • 2 2
 @scvkurt03: The spacing is so close from 11 to 12 speed I believe it would work. Don't know if you have ever heard of Worldwide Cyclery. The owner ( Jeff ) took a mechanical xx1 derailleur, put a previous generation xx1 cage ( shorter ) and used it on a xx1 12spd cassette he cut the biggest cog off (50t). I know this dosnt help with spacing, because the cassette still has 12spd spacing but he was able to run a 12 speed derailleur on effectively an 11 speed cassette. Also on the mechanical side the pull ratio of Sram 11 speed and 12 speed is the same so I dont think it would be different with AXS. Sry for the long response.
  • 1 0
 @ols532704: No apologies needed. Thanks for the response.
  • 1 0
 @ols532704:
If he cut the biggest cog off, how does the cassette stay on? Or did he just grind the teeth off?
  • 1 0
 @pyromaniac:https://www.worldwidecyclery.com/blogs/worldwide-cyclery-blog/revel-ranger-bike-check-w-worldwide-cyclerys-jeff-cayley-video
  • 3 0
 I'd probably go the Ryan Palmer route. 12spd XT bike w/ AXS GX Derailleur. Hyperglide+ and gizmo shifting in one.
  • 4 4
 That's cool, but i got a shimano slx 11 speed groupset for £190 with a bit of googling for the best price, for a custom build... that included derailleur, shifter, cassette, chain, cranks and chainring. Don't think i could justify paying almost 3 times that for shifting on a similar scale... GX vs SLX

i think i'll wait for NX Eagle AXS
  • 2 1
 I dont think AXS will come to NX.
  • 1 0
 @ols532704: It might. Or GX will go down in price eventually.
  • 1 0
 @HB208: GX price coming down in price is much more likely
  • 1 0
 @ols532704: i know it ain't gonna happen any time soon... but just think of how the features from a Shimano XTR groupset have trickled down to Deore.... thats on a much smaller scale, but something could happen with nx in 2040
  • 1 0
 @ols532704: It probably will. Give it five years and I bet wireless shifting is extremely common.
  • 1 0
 @HB208: I definately agree that it will be much more common, especially with Shimanos wireless coming out soon, but I cant see them bringing the price down that much in the next 5 years. Maybe 10.
  • 2 0
 The only question I have is when will Pinkbike realise that people who live in Canada and Europe would like to see the prices in there respective currency, NOT JUST USD.
  • 1 1
 WTF would I do in Jamaica during my seasonal tours when the current shuts off for days at a time sometimes a week. I guess I could cancel the rides because of a dead battery. Keep your virtual insanity for the dentists and lawyers.
  • 1 0
 I don't know my mechanical mech (pardon the pun) works pretty good. And personally I don't like to have a lot of electronic things on my bike. For me it doesn't matter how cheap AXS is. I'm not buying it.
  • 5 3
 Looking forward to busting out my oscilloscope and spectrum analyzer when this thing stops working!
  • 4 3
 Does the clutch actually work on the AXS version though? Will it wear out to half its initial resistance after 2 days at the bike park?
  • 2 0
 Looks good but three times the cost of GX conventional? I’ll stick with good old cables for now.
  • 12 9
 junkyards are filled with failed electronics, we don't need that crap.
  • 2 1
 Exactly.. "safe the planet" "save the planet" Lets make our bikes and other outdoor gear use more and more batteries!
  • 3 0
 Cool, can’t wait to read the full long-term review in a couple hours.
  • 2 0
 Ignoring the cassette, should an AXS GX setup cost more or less than a "analogue" XX1?
  • 4 1
 I really don't want to charge my bike though...
  • 2 0
 This is firmly in "not upgrading but if I ever smash my current derailleur this will be the replacement" territory.
  • 2 0
 is anyone else excited to upgrade from 11s to eagle 12s GX mechanical for real cheap on buy/sell??
  • 1 0
 I’ve had AXS for 6 months now and just learned you can change shifter paddle orientations, this is dope. I’m always shifting the wrong way
  • 1 0
 I love my Archer D1X. $400 and I never have to worry about derailer/ cassette/shifter compatibility. Bullet proof shifting and no crazy expensive derailer exposed to harm.
  • 1 0
 Add the costs of GX cable derailleur to Archer, and you are about the same price as the GX AXS. I don't think I'll get AXS, because I've bent 3 hangers and destroyed my cage - and probably time for new derailleur anyways as I'm still getting some bad shifts even with a new cage in the middle gears. Just saying the Archer price point the ROI doesn't make sense for something that looks like clunky add-on. When it was $299 it was more worth it.
  • 1 0
 @smoothmoose: you're not crazy, but don't forget, with Archer you don't need to buy a new derailer or any other parts.
  • 1 0
 I wonder if the main bolt that holds it on the hanger is the same as mechanical GX, if so that's a bummer. The mechanical XO1 b bolt kit is much more sophisticated.
  • 1 0
 It seems to match the ones on x01/xx1 axs. But at least that bolt is something that can be removed and replaced with a different one if you ever wanted to.
  • 1 0
 I want to know if there is as much slop in the GX AXS as there is in standard GX. This is the main difference between levels on Sram, pivot tolerances.
  • 1 1
 Still funny how we like to be over charged for stuff... seriously, the electronic components are only a few quid. Infact i probably have the same components in my breadboard kit.
  • 1 0
 This is inexpensive enough for me to try it: Shimano XT chain, cassette (love that Hyperglide+!) with an AXS shifter/derailluer. Can't wait!
  • 2 0
 My 27+13th birthday this year will be battery powered and remote operated.
SRAM, take my money, please.
  • 1 0
 I already have to charge my phone, bike, headphones, GoPro and Garmin before a ride Smile

I don't yearn to charge my shifting and dropper too.
  • 1 0
 Alright. Still going to stick with what I have, though. Which works out well because let's be honest, this won't actually be available until 2023.
  • 2 0
 only if they make it in grip shift, I am one of the few die hard grip shift guys left....
  • 1 0
 Should I pull the trigger on this?? I have a new frame with XT 12 speed rear mech and trigger shifter. Could sell both to offset the cost and maybe get in line now!
  • 1 0
 I'd rather buy an Archer D1X and strap it to the toptube area near the seatpost. More options for derailleur brands, models, and speeds.
  • 1 0
 This would be cool if it could charge itself from the hangar gears. Maybe when battery gets to a certain percentage it pulls a few watts from the chain to get more charge.
  • 5 2
 *Acts surprised*
  • 1 0
 I saw the sram video pop up first but no other sources had anything...checked to see if it was April 1st
  • 1 0
 The weight of the AXS system VS the cabled GX will be nearly equal once you consider the removal of housing and cable.
  • 2 8
flag Mattysville (Mar 25, 2021 at 7:33) (Below Threshold)
 Weight was done with cable and housing. Weight and price penalty. Buy a full GX “acoustic” drivetrain including crank and chainring for less. Spare shift cable - $15, spare battery $55. Seems like maybe a few more years AXS could be viable as more than a gimmick for the techie crowd to drool over.
  • 6 1
 @Mattysville: Shifting reliability is why most people will want this.
  • 1 0
 Hmm this seems pretty reasonable compared to cable X01. Could be worth the switch.
  • 10 10
 Remind me again why I would want this, when I could alternatively just buy a full set of Shimano XT components for considerably less money.
  • 18 1
 You don't want this, you want a full set of XT components for considerably less money. However, other people want this.
  • 2 0
 Will still be closer to $1000 CDN, no thanks
  • 2 0
 Is the only difference between XX1 axs and gx axs weight?
  • 2 4
 Will this last longer than regular cable driven system? Is it modular or am I forking over $370 every time I need a new d'rlr? I suspect I'm in the minority, but I'd rather see SRAM/Shimano spending research $$'s on light reliable IGH tech or gearboxes. What do you think?
  • 1 0
 That's why I like my Archer wireless shifting. Works with whatever derailer I happen to have lying around.
  • 3 0
 Your move Shimano...
  • 1 0
 Shimano looks back at you blankly with "glazed" over eyes
  • 4 1
 Shimano is too busy trying to keep up with warranty requests.
  • 1 0
 Shimano is going to go to fully wireless 2x10 with something like a 20T-53T cassette. The 2 front chain rings will be 40T and 28T. There will be only 1 shifter that will control/compensate for chain line and cadence going between the 2 front chain rings as you move up and down the cassette.

Or, it will be a bicycle cvt. No more shifting.
  • 1 0
 The only difference appears to be the Steel cage on the GX compared to the carbon on the XX1.
  • 2 0
 Now you won't cry as much if you kill your derailleur on a rock
  • 3 0
 No gripshift no deal Smile
  • 1 0
 Shimno.bike website is currently down for maintenance..... Just saying. A fightback from Shimano imminent.?
  • 1 0
 It would make a lot of sense if they released wireless shifting and wireless 12 speed road, because its their 100th anniversary. Also there have been spy shots of Saint, so that might be coming as well
  • 2 2
 Nice, I've been waiting for a better price to be able to put one more radiation-emitting piece of electronics next to my body.
  • 1 0
 Let me know when they've released the SX version, that'll be a little more up my alley price-wise
  • 2 0
 Is it still the GX wave washer setup on the pivot bolt?
  • 2 0
 Will this work with my burner flip phone?
  • 1 1
 Does anyone know if this has to be 12 speed? Could it be put onto an existing 11 speed cassette so I wouldn't need a new freehub body + cassette?
  • 1 1
 It should work with 11 speed.
  • 2 0
 Who was the tool that weighed it without the battery?
  • 1 0
 This is blasphemy! An e-drivetrain that you have to charge? What's next e-bikes?!
  • 1 0
 People dont actually ride with the shifter overlapping the grip THAT much do they? 2:13 in the video.
  • 1 0
 I think you kinda end up doing that if you want to use the matchmaker clamp on your brakes. I used the one on the left side for my dropper and it put it super far over. So far in fact that I had to move my brake lever further inwards. If you use the separate clamp you should be fine.
  • 1 0
 @zstover: I use the brake clamp mounts on both sides. I think some people try to get too many fingers on the brakes & end up with their controls messing with their grip.

www.pinkbike.com/photo/20343164
  • 1 0
 @rewob: copy that. I can use the mmx for my dropper lever and love that, but I've got the poverty nx eagle with it's own clamp. I'd have to buy a new top cover to get mmx compatibility with that.

In a year or 2 when I trash the rest of the drivetrain and decide it's time to splurge on this upgrade kit, it's good to know I can set it up correctly for 1 finger braking.
  • 1 0
 The same weight as having TWO derailleurs and with the hassle of charging batteries.... yeh seems like a good buy lol
  • 2 0
 C’mon Shimano...blow our minds...we are waiting!
  • 2 0
 Will the clutch last longer then 6 months?
  • 1 0
 Straight out of the box they're bent, now a battery charged bent derailleur. Nice one.
  • 1 0
 Thank ill just buy a titanium shift cable for my XO1. Seem like the rite fit for me. But hey to each there own
  • 1 0
 honestly though, i'd be more than stoked if sram had a "wired" version for half the price.
  • 1 0
 I don't actually need it but I definitely want it, given I need to spend more to upgrade to 12 speed...
  • 1 0
 Stick'n with DIY. No money and I have a shit load of gear cables thanks to F'ing Ebay.
  • 1 0
 I guess I'm one of the few who thinks that one of the greatest aspects of a bicycle is that it never needs to be charged.
  • 1 0
 Not ever going to pay $600 for a Derailleur & Shifter, I'll keep my well managed cables and save a ton of $$
  • 1 0
 Man, we are spoiled for options. I want a Xbox Series 1, a Playstation 5, as well as this. What a time to be alive.
  • 2 0
 I think I'll enjoy XT and save the upgrade $ for beer.
  • 2 0
 Big ol pass. Shimano XT is the sweet spot for me.
  • 1 0
 flawless for 20+ years why would I change to Scam?
  • 1 0
 Engineers- Let's make it heavier, and more expensive! president- You son of a bitch, I'm in!
  • 1 0
 Moral of the story: The prices are going down. Just wait +/- 5 year for real bargains.
  • 1 0
 Can't wait to roll up to the start line in 2030 with an e.m.p. generator and win all my races
  • 1 0
 Forget the derailleur, how bout that jacket. Hey man, I really like your jacket. Can I try on your jacket?
  • 1 0
 wow really thought pinkbike was full of it with that prediction. Insane.
  • 1 0
 I'd consider this now when it comes to replace my drivetrain.
  • 2 1
 looks like a session. someone had to say it.
  • 1 0
 Flawless robot impression
  • 1 1
 Probably a stupid idea but would a solar powered deurailler and shifter be possible?
  • 1 0
 My OCD really kicks in when I see all those empty cable guides/ports...
  • 1 0
 I’ll return when comments hit 1,000
  • 1 0
 Rock slaps are now worth $370!
  • 1 0
 So far for "this shit is expensive because of the cost of the battery"
  • 1 0
 It's cute, built good - and I want it.
  • 1 0
 Love the AXS, I have it on everything but my park bike.
  • 1 0
 sounds like they're shifting there price point to a minimum
  • 1 0
 Best thing is not having to worry about carrying a spare cable Smile
  • 2 5
 WE WANT UNIVERSAL GEARBOX, NOT THIS f*ckING DUMB WIRELESS CRAP!

Ok, I get it, its pretty cool and Im all for R&D but this is not the right direction and we all know it.Sooner or later, derailleurs are going to be a thing of the past and this is clearly a last attempt to make more money.Its weakest link on a bike, enough with that bullshit...Bike industry, stop doing this dumb shit
  • 1 2
 Does it also get stuck in the biggest cog and not shift down unless you go over a bump? Took my GX into a shop and they told me this is normal behaviour....
  • 1 1
 This is also just another example of why BMX dudes always get more chicks than modern mountain bikers.
  • 1 0
 It doesn't include cables? You've got to be kidding me...
  • 1 0
 Almost worth 600 notes to dump internal cable routing shudder>
  • 1 0
 $600 USD = $1000+ Cdn.....pass
  • 1 0
 @calicartel actually its $754 CAD today...
  • 1 0
 Seems like a great price point. Highly doubt I will ever run however.
  • 1 0
 Can't wait until they figure out how to block third party components
  • 1 0
 That's pretty freaking sweet. I feel like I would actually try AXS now.
  • 1 0
 What's the white bhing in the last picture?
  • 1 1
 Lets hang another pound of weight to the rear axle, just in case the pound GX cassette wasn´t enough.
  • 1 0
 it is heavy! I'll keep my xx1 cable which is half the weight and works perfect.
  • 1 0
 @sram: I'm ready for AXS DH please. Thank you, that is all!
  • 1 0
 Where’s SX i cants afford GX
  • 1 1
 Ah yes when its wet on a ride my biggest complaint isn't the cold or damp shoes but 'contaminated cable and housing'
  • 3 1
 So you’re only capable of addressing one complaint at at a time?

If you’re hungry and thirsty, do you insist on finishing lunch before you get a glass of water?And while eating your sandwich, do you mock the drink machine as useless until the moment you get up to get a drink?
  • 1 0
 @Blackhat: yeah if the drink machine doesn't have sprite
  • 1 0
 hopefully will be on 2021 bikes, also they need to release gx dropper
  • 1 0
 Do my 10-50t won’t accept this? Dang
  • 1 0
 How does AXS do shifting under load vs new Shimano 12spd?
  • 1 0
 Scrolled straight to the specs to look for its pronouns.
  • 2 2
 Saw this one coming from awhile
  • 4 0
 Yeah, who didn't?
  • 4 4
 I think it's going to sell really well...good job SRAM!
  • 10 12
 Ever ride with someone who forgot to charge their AXS dropper? Now imagine the buzz kill of someone who's derailleur is dead.
  • 3 0
 I just keep pedaling, “buh bye”
  • 1 0
 when they become super common, people will have spare batteries in their bag to lend out
  • 1 0
 It's here!
  • 10 11
 Never before in the biking sphere has so much money bought so little performance...
  • 5 1
 You're forgetting XX1 AXS.
  • 3 2
 With 90% of MTB/Gravel/Road frame internally routed these days its more about convenience to me. Wireless 4 Lyfe.
  • 10 0
 Oh man, you must be new to biking. Ceramic pulleys, $150 chain lube.... so many other things to list!
  • 7 0
 Kashima coat is another quality contender for poor value.
  • 4 0
 @Afterschoolsports: But how can you ride fast if your bike doesn't have gold all over it?
  • 1 0
 @Afterschoolsports: It dosn't cost that much more.
  • 1 0
 @Afterschoolsports: most people buy it for the looks anyway
  • 3 3
 Today : First look!
Tomorrow : Full review!
  • 8 10
 So it’s almost 4 times the price of a GX derailleur and shifter and it’s heavier. So the price premium is for cleaning up the cockpit?
  • 15 3
 You haven't tried AXS have you?
It's like knocking full suspension bikes while only having ridden hardtails.
  • 5 1
 Far more durable derailleur (if it’s like x01/xx1), shifting that doesn’t degrade as shift cables or housing degrades, no more loop of cable housing to snag on stuff at the derailleur end, one less cable under your bb if that’s what your frame does, one less cable to rattle, 5-10 minutes you can move shifter and derailleur to a different bike if you’d like. It’s very nice but definitely not necessary.
  • 6 2
 @megatryn: suspension has very factual arguments in it's favor in terms of comfort and grip there is no discussion. At best e-Trans solves some non-issues that have been solved by cable trans a while ago now. At what cost ? Even at identical price I would take cable simply because I manage to ride with a dead gps a few times a year. Now factor price, weight, ecological impact (battery, electronics, electricity) and aside from it being a geeky toy what is the actual added value of the e-Trans ?
  • 6 1
 @Balgaroth: single largest point of failure on cable shifting is the cable itself. Number two is the housing. AXS eliminates both.
  • 3 0
 @Balgaroth: "...Now factor price, weight, ecological impact (battery, electronics, electricity) and aside from it being a geeky toy what is the actual added value of the e-Trans ?"

If I only made purchases for my mountain bike using a carefully crafted value added excel spreadsheet, then what's the point of mountain biking. I might as well just start trail running and save thousands. The heart wants what the heart wants.
  • 2 0
 @DHhack: but neither of them fail enough to be considered a problem. I run a demo fleet of 15+ bikes that are used for around 400-500 rider days a year, and I can count on one hand the number of times we had to replace a cable or housing. And most of those instances were because the shifter or derailleur were broken in a crash... which would still happen with AXS.
  • 2 0
 @megatryn: Exactly. I thought it was a bit gimmicky until I bought a setup last summer and I would never go back to a cable derailleur, I've had to adjust it exactly 0 times and it shifts perfect, every single time.
  • 2 0
 @stevemokan: I fixed two other peoples shift cables last year at the bike park in the parking lot. One hit a rock and frayed the end so bad it snapped during a shift and the other probably just neglect. It happens a lot around here, but we have lots of rocky trails and riding in the mud is a thing.

Not to mention bikes that have terrible internal cable routing, my Ripmo AF being one. That rear triangle setup is just garbage for the shifter cable housing. My other bike is a singlespeed, so yeah... not a fan of shifter cables lol
  • 1 0
 @megatryn: I own AXS. It's fine. But it's not significantly better than the delightful mechanical X01/XX1 that I rode for the prior three years. That group was pretty much perfect. My new AXS group is also pretty much perfect, but I have to charge it.
  • 2 0
 @DHhack: I just wrote something similar. I have Ripmo v1. Cable routing is terrible. Try the shimano optislick cable. It fixed the poor shifting issues immediately and has continued to function well after several months.

Just make sure to get a mountain cable set. The road version cable housing is too short for modern long-wheelbase bikes. The mountain set comes with two cables and two housing pieces so you can use the second for your dropper.
  • 1 0
 @50105010: I bought axs a while ago for my af. I’ve already decided that when things calm down a bit I’ll buy a new frame and transfer parts over and sell the af frame, it’s just not for me.
  • 1 0
 @Balgaroth: Tell that to the 90's
  • 1 0
 EXX1LLENT!!!!
  • 1 1
 One terrible chain suck and bye bye $370 shifter.
  • 1 0
 Dropper?
  • 1 1
 So do you throw this in the plastic or electronics recycling bin?
  • 2 2
 Waiting for wireless NX!
  • 2 0
 What about SX wireless?
  • 9 0
 100% would come with disposable AA BATERIES.
  • 4 7
 This only highlights how much Sram is ripping people off. If it's $400 less just for a steel instead of alloy derailleur cage and everytging else is 'apparently' identical?
  • 12 0
 Gotta pay for the R&D for the early stuff. X01 has already been dropped to 800$ USD
  • 1 1
 @MillerReid: So $200 for alloy instead of steel cage then....
  • 3 0
 That's what they can tell from the first look. I'd guess it's similar to the differences between GX and X0 standard drivetrains where at first it seems like the only difference is weight and some materials, until you use both long term (year+) and realize that X0 works much better for a much longer term and requires much less adjusting over it's life and has a much longer lifespan. Durability and long term shift quality will be different I would guess
  • 1 0
 @islandforlife: My experience has been the opposite. Got XO1 on a '17 Enduro, and GX on a '18 Release 3. Both ridden hard and long. Both seem to shift just the same. I'm pretty anal about cleaning and lubing my drivetrain, though, and did replace the chains and pullies on both bikes last year.
  • 1 0
 @Chuckolicious: There will always be outliers and I used GX for over a year without much issue (except for a bent tooth (twice))... but it did need more adjustment vs X01. Anyway, the general consensus is pretty clear that the quality and durability of X01 exceeds GX.

Now I got my X01 for a significant discount... and after using both heavily, do I think the price difference is justifiable? Absolutely not. If I'm paying full pop, it's GX all day. X01 should really only be a few hundred bucks more than GX in my opinion.
  • 1 0
 I don’t understand. Do you (or anyone) think they make these products out of the goodness of their hearts so they could sell them at cost?

So they make money off XO1. We knew that. Now they make less money off GX. And this is somehow a bad thing?
  • 1 0
 @Blackhat: but why don't they just price them at their comparative worth. Price GX higher and XX1 lower. What incentive is there to buy XX1 AXS now if the only difference is a flimsier alloy cage and everything else is the same, to pay 200-400 dollars to save 50g and have identical performance. As I said in my initial comment this shows how they are ripping people off. If they are happy to profit from GX at 600 why charge an extra 200 for an alloy carrier. R&D cost doesn't come into this anymore as both products are now out, if R&D cost was still relevant then it should apply to GX also.
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