It has been a quick seven months since DVO, short for Developed Suspension, was formed after Bryson Martin and engineer Josh Baltaxe departed from Marzocchi. Bryson, who has been in the suspension game for 23 years, quickly began outlining a plan to offer something different than what consumers may be used to, not just from a product standpoint, but from a company approach that contrasts with what many have come to expect.
''I really wanted to do it right, so we needed everything all under one roof and that’s what we have accomplished,'' declares Martin.
''Now that all the ideas, designing, and engineering all happen in one place, it’s a lot easier to set goals and execute on them.'' It wasn't long before both Tom Rogers (product development) and Ronnie Dilan (head technician) left Marzocchi to join Martin and Baltaxe and plans were laid for DVO's debut fork. Whereas the current major suspension players all offer a massive range of products to choose from, DVO plans on producing a limited selection of high-end products, beginning with the 203mm travel, inverted Emerald shown here on Pinkbike for the first time.
We know the benefits to an upside down fork and it's been a very long time since a company brought an inverted fork to market. We wanted to make a statement by executing it when other companies couldn't.
- Bryson Martin, DVO
While this is the very first complete Emerald to be assembled, each of the fork's different elements have been tested in some way during development. The Emerald's open bath twin tube damper system, for example, was surely put through real world testing while hidden within another fork maker's chassis, likely making its way down trails and past other riders without anyone taking notice. Martin is understandably coy about what fork the damper was trialled in, but he did reveal that early versions of the Emerald were coil sprung prior to the air spring system being developed. The fork shown here, as well the production model, will make use of an air spring, and DVO is also looking at including an adjustable volume feature that will allow riders to tailor the fork's ramp-up through its stroke. Interestingly, it will employ a coil negative spring that will have an adjustable preload component to let Emerald owners adjust the fork's initial stroke.
- Emerald Details
- Intended use: DH/FR
- Design: Inverted
- Travel: 203mm/8''
- Stanchions: 36mm w/ molybdenum disulphide
coating
- Upper tubes: 43 - 41mm tapered 7000 series
aluminum - Steerer tube: 1 1/8th straight or tapered
options - CTA: One-piece Carbon Torsion Arch acts as
stanchion guard/fender while increasing
torsional rigidity by a claimed 50% - Fork crowns: Forged and CNC machined.
Separate crowns for 26'' and 650B-sized
wheels to preserve trail geometry, direct mount
stem compatible - Spring: Air
- Damper: Twin-tube open bath design
- External damper adjustments: Separate low
and high-speed compression/rebound - Negative spring: Coil w/ adjustable preload
- Target weight: 2,900 - 3,000 grams/6.4 - 6.6lb
- Availability: June/July of 2013
- MSRP: To be announced
Inverted DesignThe DVO team knew they wanted to pursue an inverted layout for the Emerald due to the design's lighter un-sprung weight, consistent lubrication qualities, and ease of compatibility with non-26'' wheel sizes. And while those points are certainly all valid, there is a reason the large majority of suspension forks on the market employ a traditional right-side-up layout: torsional rigidity, or rather the inherent lack of it in an inverted design. Inverted forks are ubiquitous in the motorized off-road world, as proponents of the design are quick to point out, although it could just as easily be argued that weight is much less of a concern on a dirt bike, therefore allowing for massive tube diameters, thicker tube walls, and burly crown and axle clamps, all features that make for a much stiffer (and heavier) fork. But even when similar methods are applied to the front end of a mountain bike, the result can't approach the outright stiffer design of a right-side-up fork. Is that necessarily a bad thing, though? ''
Compliance on a mountain bike can be a great advantage but it must be in the right locations,'' says DVO's Bryson Martin. ''
As more DH and Enduro frames are made from carbon where stiffness is generally accepted, the suspension must become more compliant - structurally and hydraulically - to optimize the entire bike.''
We feel that the industry puts too much emphasis on stiffness in general. Stiffer doesn't always mean better.
- Bryson Martin, DVO
The general consensus for most mountain bikers, though, is that one's front-end can never be too torsionally rigid - it is a mantra that has been drilled home thanks in large part to manufacturers claiming massive gains in stiffness with every new product. But is stiffer actually better? There is certainly a point where too much torsional flex will begin to have a very negative effect on performance, making for vague and unsettling handling but, as Martin alludes to, just the right amount of torsional compliance can also allow the front wheel to track more smoothly on rough ground, something that designers at the top flight of MotoGP, among other sports, have known about for many years. It is a little known fact that, during testing, one downhilling’s most successful racers actually cut the arch off of his right-side-up fork in a search for more torsional compliance! So, if a given amount of torsional compliance can be an advantage, the question remains: how to tune-in the desired amount without creating an overweight fork? DVO's answer lies in their proprietary Carbon Torsion Arch, or CTA for short.
Carbon Torsion ArchLikely the biggest talking point of the Emerald will no doubt be the carbon fiber, bolt-on CTA unit that serves to not only protect the stanchions from damage and as a fender, but also to tie the lower legs together to increase torsional rigidity by a claimed 50% over the same Emerald fork without the CTA in place. The basic idea isn't new - riders who have been in the sport since the mid-90s will likely recall the inverted, elastomer-sprung and air-damped Halson fork that had its lowers joined together via a brace that traveled vertically by way of slots machined into the fork's uppers. The CTA's execution looks to be much more impressive, but we'll need some trail-time on the Emerald to see just how effective it actually is.
The unit features a unique core (Martin was reluctant to share certain details at this point in time) within its otherwise full carbon fiber construction, with the design said to resist torsional loads while still being light, strong, and durable. DVO isn't simply trying to add as much rigidity as possible by incorporating the CTA unit, though, with Martin stating that ''
This design will still offer some pliability, especially useful in rough, straight line sections, while providing stiffness in corners.'' A number of different CTA elements are in testing that use varying carbon layups with an eye toward a final design that offers the rigidity and balance DVO is looking for. The idea for the bolt-on carbon element came about well into the fork's development; DVO was investigating how axle size and shape factored in long before the Carbon Torsion Arch was added to the Emerald's spec sheet. Interestingly, the idea of a hex-shaped axle (much liked those utilized on Manitou forks) was nixed when DVO found that increasing the overall clamping surface area of the axle proved to be a more efficient way to control slipping and flex. No, you won't find some oddball-sized axle utilized on the Emerald, but rather a very stout looking 20mm setup.
Being competitive in weight is definitely high on the list, but performance, reliability, and strength was more important for us, especially for the kind of abuse a suspension fork endures. 2,900 - 3000 grams is our target and we hope we are close but, more importantly, we want people to be stoked on the performance, adjustability, and durability of the fork.
- Bryson Martin, DVO
There is no denying that the Carbon Torsion Arch concept is a clever way to go about increasing torsional rigidity without adding too much weight - DVO claims that it should only add about 200 grams to the package - but the question remains as to why such a design hasn't yet been put to use in the motocross or enduro realms. If the CTA unit is as effective as DVO asserts we may see it pop up in other places as well, including an inverted single crown fork further down the road, although that could be a ways out at this point. “
We always want to look at each project individually and design a product that is optimized for its specific use.'' Martin continues, ''
It follows our plan to stay focused and not just throw gizmos and features into a product that ultimately drives up cost and over complicates things for the end user.''
Twin Tube DamperThe two most common damper layouts currently being employed within forks are either a sealed cartridge layout (FOX with their FIT cartridges, and RockShox, who turn the stanchion tube into the cartridge body) or an open bath cartridge (ala Marzocchi), with advantages and disadvantages to both designs when it comes to performance and weight. The Emerald doesn't make use of either one, though, instead employing an open bath twin tube layout that DVO feels is much better suited to long travel applications. ''
A pure open bath system can have issues with aeration and cavitation, as well as having too much oil that adds unnecessary weight,'' Martin says. ''
Twin tubes solve those issues, keeping damping consistent and oil volume to a minimum.'' And while damper design is a topic that often results in endless arguments as to what actually does function best, the twin tube system is is found within some of the most acclaimed off-road moto suspension designs, especially those created by a certain highly rated Swedish company. A moto-inspired philosophy is one that rings true through much of DVO's thinking.
While DVO is adamant that the open design of their twin tube damper makes the most sense for a pure DH fork, we might see something entirely different utilized within any shorter travel forks they may or may not produce down the road. According to Bryson, “
There is more of an advantage to running a closed system on a fork with less than 160mm of travel compared to using the same system on a fork with 203mm of travel.." This train of thought is in contrast to some other suspension companies who employ the same basic damper philosophy throughout their high-end fork lineup, be it a cross-country or longer stroke downhill offering.
When it comes to damping, it isn't about reinventing what has been proven in other areas, but about delivering value and performance to the end user, without the gizmos and hard to service designs.
- Bryson Martin, DVO
The twin tube, open bath damper is exactly as its name would have you believe, with a secondary tube that sits within the fork. The damper piston travels up and down within this tube, but as opposed to it being sealed, oil ports on the wall of the tube allow damping oil to circulate between the inner and outer tubes, and through the valving. This layout should result in less cavitation (the formation of bubbles and foaming of oil under hard use), making for more consistent damping, and an optimized oil level that also acts as lubrication to keep the fork cycling smoothy through its stroke. Enclosed in the damper body is DVO's 'Emerald Valve', otherwise known as the piston. DVO has gone to great lengths to create a piston that permits a lot of oil flow via smooth, open porting. This lets them control the fork's damping characteristics with more shims than would otherwise be required of a lower-flow piston, the advantage of this being a large degree of tuning by way of using more and different shims. The fork also uses shimmed rebound damping as opposed to a ported system, which is what some other suspension companies employ. Ported damping refers to oil flow through small holes, known as ports. One potential issue with ported damping is that at times oil simply cannot flow fast enough through the ports when required, resulting in very inconsistent damping. Shimmed rebound, on the other hand, allows for the same dynamic damping (the shims flex more or less depending on the forces involved) as found on the high-speed compression side of the piston.
User Tuneable DamperThe moto-inspired approach continues with DVO's decision to not only allow Emerald owners access to the entire damper assembly, but actually encouraging them to try their hand at tuning it. This is the exact opposite strategy that most suspension companies within the mountain bike world have taken throughout the sport's history (Manitou is an exception, though, with their Absolute Plus Tuning kit), with many riders being downright scared of opening up their fork or shock as a result. Yes, a certain amount of knowledge and skill are required, not to mention the correct tools for the job, but it is far from being rocket science. DVO will offer not only tuning kits, complete with shim layout suggestions and the expected results, but also on-line videos that will guide owners through the process. Taking it a step further, they also plan to hold in-house tech seminars for those who really want to jump into the deep end of tuning.
Since we rely heavily on piston and shim stacks to handle our damping, we have designed our pistons to be easily accessed so individual shim stack tuning can happen. Once the rider becomes comfortable with working on the suspension, it is very interesting to test different settings tailored to specific riding areas and skill level. We are committed to teaching riders all about suspension and we will provide a lot of information on how to tune our products so you can become your own suspension tuning guru!
- Bryson Martin, DVO
Further helping matters is the Emerald's 'bottom loader' base valve that should allow owners to make changes to the damper without having to perform a full rebuild. Simply flip the fork (or bike) upside down, unscrew the compression base valve from the bottom of the fork leg, and pull it out. Minimal, if any, oil loss should occur. All dials are contained on the assembly, meaning that you won't have to fiddle with near-microscopic set screws or any tiny indexing ball bearings or springs. We've long said that most mountain bike suspension companies seem to go out of their way to make damper service and tuning a huge hassle, and it is a breath of fresh air to hear DVO's approach - garage tinkerers rejoice.
Titanium Collet Clamps
All current double crown forks in the MTB and the MX world utilize some sort of pinch-bolt system to hold the upper tubes in place, but DVO is considering a different method: collets. The collet system used on the Emerald consists of tube sections with vertical splines and an external wedge shape. Tightening a threaded ring (with the required spanner wrench) that is positioned above pulls the section upwards, locking the fork tube in place due to the wedge-shaped internal profile of the section. It is very similar to what is used to hold tool bits securely into high rpm machines (drills and CNC machines for example), although this would be the first time that a collet setup has been put to use to hold fork tubes in place. One upside of the collet design is the large and even clamping force it provides, but the system could also result in a lighter overall package compared to the more common pinch bolt arrangement. While all of the above sounds good on paper, and the design should present no technical issues due to the robust upper tubes of the Emerald fork, production costs may keep the collet clamping system from reaching production. If so, a standard pinch bolt design will likely be used on 2014 model year forks, with DVO hoping to put the collet system to use on 2015 products.
26'' and 650B-specific Crowns
While we're seeing 650B wheels infiltrate the mid-travel full suspension market at an alarming rate, the 26'' wheel is still firmly entrenched within the longer-travel downhill scene. That very well could change in the near future, though, and DVO plans to be ready for the shift. The Emerald's inverted design lends itself to being compatible across a number of wheel sizes by way of different fork crowns, with each setup optimized to preserve the same trail geometry, and therefore handling, across the board. Trail refers to the measurement aft of the steering axis that is created by the fork offset, head angle, and wheel size - a larger trail figure can improve high-speed stability, while less trail can create a more nimble handling bike. Messing with trail figures can have very adverse effects on how a bike handles, so it is vital
that the number remains largely unchanged, a trick that employing differently offset fork crowns on an inverted chassis can accomplish. The 650B fork crowns will be slightly taller to handle the larger diameter wheel, as will the Carbon Torsion Arch unit. DVO is undecided as to if they will offer 650B conversion crowns and the CTA as an aftermarket item for the Emerald, but we're betting that we'll see them at some point in the future as the 'tweener wheels make their way onto true downhill race bikes. There is no word as to if DVO will offer a set of crowns and CTA that would allow 29'' wheels to be fitted, although if that did happen we would also expect the fork's travel to be docked slightly.
Shots FiredWhile DVO is just now assembling their first complete Emerald forks, and production units aren't slated for release until Summer of 2013, we feel that there is a lot to look forward to from the newly formed company. Bryson Martin and his team are responsible for much of Marzocchi's most successful products, but moved on as the landscape of the Italian company began to shift.
''We spent decades at Marzocchi, and they were a major player for a long time,'' says Martin of the Italian company's glory days.
''Things started going sideways with Marzocchi many years ago, though. These were issues outside of our control and we just held in there until we couldn’t anymore.'' It is still very early days, but Martin's separation from Marzocchi may have spawned a new suspension authority, one that aims to respond to what many consumers have been requesting for years: reliable suspension that is not only easy to work on and understand, but that also looks to mimic much of the principles found in the moto domain. And yes, it will be available in colours other than green.
Carbon fiber upper tubes and crown? The clamps are currently not a one piece unit, but we are working on it for a future version. A one piece carbon assembly involves a lot of testing, and it is something that we don't want to rush into.
- Bryson Martin, DVO
Only time will tell if DVO's approach to high-end suspension will culminate in a winning product, but they certainly look to be on the right track. The Emerald may still be in the early stages of its evolution, but Martin is already talking up a version of the fork that will use a one piece carbon fiber upper assembly, not to mention the possibility of an inverted single crown fork added to the lineup. A rear shock is also being developed concurrently with the Emerald fork, and there is no doubt that it will carry the same moto-inspired DNA. No, DVO may not be looking to take a share of the large entry and mid-level suspension market, but it's fair to say that the reigning suspension powers are likely looking over their shoulder when it comes to their high-end offerings. We'd by lying if we said we aren't looking forward to seeing them rock the boat. Exciting times ahead.
www.dvosuspension.comFollow Mike Levy
@MikeLevyPB
the dorado has been around for years.
I think they are pointing their fingers at Rockshox, Fox & Marzocchi.
These do look badass. Hope they are gonna be good!
awesome news..and congrats on hiring Ronnie and Tom:- fantastic technical people with great customer service attitudes
I met Ronnie on the sea-to-sky highway bus to Whistler, and once in the resort, he was super helpful with some issues on my Marzocchi 888 RC fork.
Also got to meet Tom and found his knowledge second-to-none!
best of luck to all at DVO suspension and great to see a new player in the mountain bike suspension market
Please? Pretty please?
Don't think I have enough of a racing career to speak of, yet.
After some deliberation, I actually shot over an email. This should be funny
I know you mentioned some other brands and there existent / non existent inverted forks......
I am wondering if you have spent any time on the KOWA fork, or know anything about it's damping system.
I rode one living in BC and the fact that you can compress the fork to any length and lock it out to only have as much travel as compressed is pretty amazing.
Regards
Then I saw the philosophy about consumers working on the forks and thought "Hmm, that is an idea I want to support."
Finally I saw DVOsuspension reply to all comments on their article I'll be walking away from this article with a "I want to support this company" mentality.
It will depend on cost on weather or not I actually can support DVO - a student's salary doesn't really call for new, high end components - but I really hope your company finds success upon production.
For the record, the Dorado Carbon came out in 2009 (super small quantities available), then in 2010 the Dorado Pro came out (7050 aluminum), at a weight difference of .1 (point one) pounds, the Carbon was rendered obsolete with the aluminum version being almost $1000 less and much stiffer than the carbon. For 2013 there will be a less expensive version called the Dorado Expert (6000 series aluminum) which should compete on price with the Boxxer R2C2.
I hope this little bit of information about Manitou will help you guys at DVO understand what your competition is doing in the market.
so much complicated-pointless design,just take a hi end moto fork(like ohlins) and scale it down...
I know you going to say that Bicycles are different,bla bla bla...
Just to remind you that cane creek did that and came up with the best Rear shock on the market.-
"Better to appear an idiot, than to open your mouth an remove all doubt"
As was mentioned in the article, and in several other comments by DVO, the Dorado came out in 2000--manitou didn't make significant changes when they re-introduced it. Same deal. So their assertion that no other major companies (i.e. doesn't include white bros) have come out with an inverted fork is completely factual.
This is an incredibly refreshing article, and exactly what I want to see from the bike industry. Box one: PR/Marketing/Value prop = checked. Next box: reliability and user reviews. Pulling for these guys to hit that one too!
I love the look of my Rockshox Totem so much I would put one on any bike I owned between 150 and 250mm of travel. This is the first twin crown DH fork I've seen that I think I might buy when I put a proper DH bike together. I hate the look of RWU double crown forks. Compared to the world of motorbikes, they look so shit.
It's all about USD for me when I think about double crown forks.
DVO good luck with it. This product looks like it breaks the mold (something X-fusion have so far only threatened to do). Id like to see a coil sprung version, and coming from Marzocchi you must now a thing or two about titanium spring suppliers. Having said that, I am not likely to buy this fork in the next two years at least, if ever, so don't make any business decisions in light of any of my comments! If I were in the market for a twin crown DH fork, I would be choosing between this and the Dorado.
you do know its there for a reason, right? not just for aesthetics...
Same could also be said for Marzocchi who might change their mind about their comment at inter bike about their new fork not being a re-release of the shiver.
Finally a company who realizes that a little give (flex) in a fork is not the evil its made out to be. Hell, 99% of people couldn't detect the flex in shivers they were just jumping on the bandwagon with the few pro's who said they could feel it. And weight? I'd rather a slightly heavier fork that works well than a light one that asks questions when pushed hard... All my mates who have ridden my '03 Shivers down our local trails have commented they wish their forks felt as smooth and supple (and they are currently riding 888RC2X's, Fox 40RC2's, WC Boxxers to name but a few).
For the record, the Dorado Carbon came out in 2009 (super small quantities available), then in 2010 the Dorado Pro came out (7050 aluminum), at a weight difference of .1 (point one) pounds, the Carbon was rendered obsolete with the aluminum version being almost $1000 less and much stiffer than the carbon. For 2013 there will be a less expensive version called the Dorado Expert (6000 series aluminum) which should compete on price with the Boxxer R2C2.
I hope this little bit of information about Manitou will help you guys at DVO understand what your competition is doing in the market."
Reposted for truth and accuracy, something the marketing homers at "DVO" seem to be lacking.
www.pinkbike.com/u/baxterbike DVOSuspension, you could at least make your own arguments instead of creating alternate accounts.
Having said that, everyone with a brain knows 2 strokes are better than four strokes but they are still being snuffed out.
The powerbrokers of MTB are backing RWU like the power brokers of the automotive industry are backing the four stroke.
Even though USD is better, they will never take off until Rockshox or Fox get on it.
Right way up forks have the advantage of lateral stiffness, that lots prefer. They also can have less unsprung weight, but that is totally design dependent, not a general rule. and for single crowns, inverted is virtually impossible to match conventional forks for stiffness, and possibly longevity.
I don't think there's enough of a gap between performance for stiffness whatever way for 90% of riders, and manufacturers should just use whatever will work with their internal systems better.
The main benefit of inverted is for/aft stiffness, very important for motorbikes, not so for MTB. and the oil seals staying lubed easier, very important for MTB, hence all the fancy stanchion coatings we've seen over the years.
In short, I'd not get to hung up on inverted Vs Conventional, unless the DVOs turn out to be a flexy noodle, but it wouldn't appear they will be.
I'd like to see more details on seal and bushing types and any internal finishings being used on these forks e.g. full anodized internals or anything??... commonly these details go unmentioned in the marketing spiels as high quality seals and bushings up production unit costs and aren't included... instead attention is drawn towards non-definitive/unquantifiable and somewhat meaningless details like stanchion diameter, decals, fork 'hardware' and 'stiffness'... it would be good to see a change from that!
Have to say thoguh, i think the all green colour will serve to limit the amount of people willing to buy it. I know a tonne of people will immediately neg me, and say its all about function over form. Well thats great for them if they don't care what something looks like, and i'm almost envious, but those people have obviously never been in the marketing/design department of a product design company and don't understand the HUGE effect design has on buyer choice.
Look at the amount of people matching their kit these days, and the push in colour coded bikes. Its because people like their kit to look matching because it conveys a sense/feeling of consistency which subconciously links to the idea of consistent performance. Its why marketing / graphic design is such a huge business.
I think the brand design needs work personally, and whilst the green looks lovely, no matter how good it was i wouldn't buy it, and it would clash badly with eveythign else on my bike. Its clear (In the nicest way possible) that this is company started by engineers/product designers. Its how Hope started, and their brand / visual design sucked for years.
DVO, i love what your doing, and wish you the best of luck, but please offer a non-green version for folks like me! Anodised black/grey tubes would look sick.
Shim stacks, charts and easy replacement are what I want to hear more about.
and the neg spring preload, and air volume adjuster.
What size stanchions and legs?
Anyway - DVOSuspension, could you describe the testing methodology that you used? I just don't see how the fork guards can provide that much additional torsional rigidity while essentially being in the same region of force that the thru-axle deals with. Unless I'm missing something, the guard isn't attached to the stanchion as noted in the reference to the Halson Inversion. In other words, are you suggesting that in the case of the old Shiver, if you attached an arch that connected the dropouts together it would improve stiffness?
Further, I like the picture of the fork sitting on a pallet of 'pigs'. This leads me to believe that your either a) Do your own casting or b) Have a very good working relationship with your suppliers. I'll assume the latter. The spec of 7000 series uppers is proof enough that you are committed to quality, but having a supplier understand your needs is probably even more important. Hopefully they can help you keep the weight off at a reasonable price.
As far as the details you purposely kept secret, well fine. Sooner or later someone will break one, then we can cross-section it and see the details for ourselves!
We are working with a very sophisticated manufacturer who has most of their own processes under one roof and this is critical to controlling quality. Thanks for your insight!
We don't aim to keep any secrets from you guys but we just want to prove out some designs before we spill the beans on what exactly is in our designs. We will be as upfront and straight forward as possible.
Cheers, DVO
As stated above, I really think this whole controversy about rigidity / stiffness is gone into an excess. People always claim that stiffness is a good thing - but at this point I really think that stiffness is a marketing thing. I work in a big bike shop, hence I've ridden a couple of forks in the last few years. This includes the 40 - a fork everybody raved about for beeing stiff and having superior damping performance. Freshly serviced the damping was good, but you had to service it (and have to) too often. I also quickly discovered that the stiffness of the fork had certain disadvantages, especially on rocky and rooty trails, where the fork hadn't any forgiveness and you could really feel the head shake.
Same thing applies to the "new" 35mm Boxxer - I loved the old 32mm-one, but couldn't get along with the new one - but it was mostly because of the damping.
Since I've got my Dorado, - best production fork today, hands down - I think different. At first, I had complaints about "flex", but quickly discovered that the fork was forgiving, yet it turned precisely even in ruts and rocks. Since then lots of people asked me for a "flex-test", putting my front wheel between their legs and turning the handlebar. Of course, there is a lot of flex if you do this - but it's not an issue on the trail, where you can't feel it. People never believe that this flex is a good thing an rave about the fork being soft and unridable. I often offer a test drive, but people refuse it. If somebody rides, he agrees that there is no noticeable disadvantage with flex on the trail.
So, as long as the right-side-up guys don't believe in less rigidity, you guys at DVO have to build this torsion arch on your forks. It makes them look weird, and I personally don't believe in the necessity of it.
You see, I'm an USD-diehard.
At leat for me buying a better fork with more adjustments it is also a problem.
Having more things for tuning your fork its a good thing if you know how to use it; but if you dont it goes against your ring. So it would be good for your part to have a good way to explain what everhing does and what you should exepect by tuning it.
Im sure that all most everyone that have a high end fork (F40. mzc 888 rc3, boxxer wc) dont know how to tune it, and have it tuned in a worng way.
I ve asked a lot of guys allready, nobody that i asked seemed to know anything about adjusting fork or a damper. Now i seem to be the expert.. (LOL)
But ofcourse it also comes down to personal preferences. For instance, i like my suspension a lot harder than most of the riders. On my hardtailbike i have even pumped up my fork so hard, it's pretty much a solid fork.. :-)
products that are too 'stiff' (to use the layman's parlance) can often fail through cracking as those impact loads and structural loads have to go somewhere, and can provide an unnerving ride as the vehicle does not always respond in a predictable manner
can think of a well known Canadian freeride brand that used to produce one of the strongest / stiffest frames available, but they pretty much all cracked and their new engineer designed some flexure into the frame to prevent this re-occuring
in suspension systems on racing motor vehicles (whether Moto GP, Formula 1, SuperCross or Rallye) its not uncommon for suspension to have some flexure to allow the vehicle (and rider / driver) to maintain their chosen line rather than suffering sudden deflections
It does look a lot cooler with guards, rather than without - my Dorado is the nuts with them and i'm pretty sure i will hate it guard-less.
If
1. It costs more to produce such axle.
2. It cost a lot annually to maintain their patent.
I am not nitpicking with your product nor am I a Manitou guy, as I use Fox, but that is the only product that is similar to what you have, and I am only trying to understand your design.
I only run Fox or Rockshox because i know Mojo and Fishers will (most of the time) take care of anything quickly and hassle free for me. I want to try Marz and Bos allot but windwave are a joke for warranty and Bos you cant even get spares or servicing for without sending it back to France.
Madison would be the obvious home, with scope for a nice tie in with (limited edition) Saracen models?
Loving the look of this to DVO guys, keep up the good work i can wait to take a spin on a pair sometime. This is what the industry needs to give RS and fox a good kick up the arse and stop messing with remote levers and electronic nonsense. Finally a fork to match the CC db air
That's all I need to hear from a suspension company.
Fairplay for the design, and there is no doubt that the technology behind it all (something im much to stupid to know anything about) is stunning. But i just cant see it on my bike. The whole thing just looks TOO chunky, and its not just the green.
Neg prop away/niggas gonna hate, but its MY personal opinion!
It is about time.....
I cant wait for this fork!!!
Also very interested in the rear shock offerings as well as an enduro fork 160-170 mm of travel.
If you guys are able to deliver on your set goals, you should have no problem making a name for yourself among the other suspension giants in the industry.
(If not inverted, choice of black or white lowers. Don't force me into one color for this model and one color for that model like the other guys.)
And of course a matching shock as well.
Will be watching and waiting!
And im sure these forks will be frikkin' sick!!!
Absolutely Fantastic approach/Engineering to function and production...Thank You for This..now HURRY UP ALREADY..LOL!!!
The U-section-shaped bottom stiffeners should be replaced with a wraparound design with 2-4 guiding slots - much much stiffer - from the beginning.
4 bolt axle - me like - better than a oneside thread.
Steering tube is nice.
Crown clamps - very cool - but a nightmare once dirt gets in. Preferably Screw-Clamp.
by "The U-section-shaped bottom stiffeners should be replaced with a wraparound design with 2-4 guiding slots - much much stiffer - from the beginning." do you mean something like the halson fork
mombat.org/195Halson.jpg
What I really love about the design is the helper spring - this fork could have the spongy action of an nice Marzocchi and still have very proper highspeed action - where Marzocchis falls short.
But if there is a coil mod that can be fitted, I am 100% on board with it !! Really nice work on this !!
I am quite psyched about the look of this game changer and I really can't wait to get my hands on one.
Do you have a rough idea of cost ?? 1, 2, 3, grand ??
Great article and from reading the comments an the replies it seems like you guys have got the right concerns for customer care and feed back!
Im just hoping you got a long(ish) travel single crown in the works for us free riders who love to click a good 270 X'up
All the best for the future
p.s a team issue green Hope brake would look perfect on those emeralds
we speccing a DREAM bike!!
To clarify, these days, products and tuning advice for dh stuff seems to focus solely on pro level riders, at 16 stone when asking a reputable tuner in the uk what weight fork spring i needed for my boxxers, i was told an extra firm, on smoother flowier trails it seemed ok but i could barely get it to move up and down, now i'm using a firm spring and the bike feels far more controlled, the same on the rear end of my old summum, all the advice said to use spring weights that meant the suspension barely moved unless going at speeds bordering on out of my skill level.
i used to have a couple of sets of shivers and never had these iddues, they always felt soft enough to push thru most of the travel whilst bouncing on them, but never felt too soft on ther trail, they always tracked well and i never noticed the flex issues as i wasnt going as fast as a racer.
are these new forks going to be able to cater to all levels of skill? and feel confidence inspiring in doing so? i dont feel i should have to ride an AM bike because i'm not that fast but its nice when a fork can suit me, my 2010 boxxers have never impressed me and always felt kind of dead, i much preffered the plush bottomless travel feel of old shivvers and my mx6 stratos forks.
i think thats most the rubbish out of my head lol
By letting the user set his own shimstack, setup the fork like he thinks is right, don't you think you'll end up with LOADS of warranty returns because either they have completely f*cked their fork (badly disassembled or reassembled, damaged internals, ...), or they just can't seem to find the right tune ? And to be honest, who here has enough knowledge to know what shim stack is needed to attain a certain goal ? Less than 1%...
I'm super interested in all the suspension business, but I'm far from being capable of modifying the shim stack on my forks.
But good luck, hope you can reach the performance of BOS or CRConception dampings
And if my memory serves me right, we now have 3 companies using Kashima coating ? Kowa, DVO and Fox... Looks cool
Cheers
Didn't have time to read through all the responses, so sorry if I repeat:
1) Will you offer different levels of CTA's for people who like more or less flex (or based on rider weight)? Or just standard stanchion guards? I personally like my invert (05 Shiver) with it's amount of flex. It's saved my ass more times than I can count.
2) What are your thoughts on an air cartridge vs. the twin tube. I'm sure the twin tube is a lot smoother feeling, but there are the weight weenies out there, or those who like the responsiveness/ adjust-ability of an air cartridge (without having to change shim stacks or oil weights).
3) I do really like the idea of the collet design, but do you think that it might too much clamping force? Possibly crush/ fracture the the fork uppers at contact points?
Also.................. murdered out black w/ green decals FTW.
This is a brilliant philosophy. I wish more manufacturers would take this on board. Durability/longevity should be more important than weight IMO. Especially now that we have light enough components, and great technology.
Zerode and some other manufacturers have embraced this.
I know you guys come from a big company which made several faulty steps in the last 6 years, minding only to the budget and nothing to the quality of their products (exept very few products, you know what I mean). I hope you can rise between the three major brands, if your product will be good you certainly will.
I'd like to see your 160mm fork.
Cheers
Canadian Rep already lined up? We seeing a service center in Canada also?
Good work guys, I've wanted some USD forks for ages and you guys have definitely caught my eye and many others!
www.pinkbike.com/video/274851
www.pinkbike.com/video/159119
Those damn things are addictive but with more and more frames running integrated headsets it's getting more difficult to retrofit them, which makes my bikes that don't have a damper feel super-squirrely now. Perhaps approaching it from an integrated-with-suspension angle could yield a solution, although somehow you'd still have to anchor the damper to the frame... just a thought. They are a great way to make a quick-handling bike more stable, which is a lot easier than making a stable bike turn; and they make technical climbs so much easier on the trail & AM bikes.
Mirroring the overall stoke expressed here, I'm really looking forward to watching DVO take off. Congrats on coming out of the gate with such a killer attitude and approach to your customer base, and a dynamite-looking product - best of luck!
..but as a full time college student mountain biking is an expensive hobby, and the latest and greatest is only great if it's affordable haha.
On a side note, how do you think this fork will hold up to a heavier rider? I am 245# of man jello, and while stiffness for a 160# guy might not matter it does for Fatty McFatfat.
And are you going with a standard Boxxer crown?
eeerrr no wait, i misread summat! il go with DVO. massive collective knowledge from decades of experiance in BOTH MTB & MX, plus a strong link with a huge manufacturing facility. could you make them in red pleeease? im goin ridin
I just want to see a gold fork come out, for serious bling..
Keep up the good work and do not forget that brand loyalty starts from a young age, Build a good low-mid range fork for the youngsters and they will be hooked for life. I will have to be patient to get my hands on a enduro fork. Awesome looking forks guys.
In all fairness USD forks are the way for DH. So much better handling.
I can slide one of these toxic bad ass fork on my Yeti 303.
I have been riding since 1988 and have some experience with all the forks in the market, since the Tange Blades and the pink Rock Shox remember those?, I've used them all, and I like the techy aspect of the forks.
Congratulations and best wishes to your new born company.
Always keep an open channel for feedback as you have been doing it.
Don't let aside customer service, there is a big hole there, is where some of the big names fell short.
Again, congratulations.
Great work and i see a lot of commitment, I only see a bright future to DVO company.
Not so many companies can get all this attention and feedback.
Keep up!
Should run a logo/graphic competition on here and see what you get back. Maybe the winner would have a free set of forks with a few runners up with T-Shirts etc.
I am not too great at putting a graphics package together but I know people out there are. Might even be worth having them as part of the team as a contract designer then?
I'm sure you can make sure that a damaged stanchion isn't as expensive/unobtainable as certain competitors, and I'm sure their longevity of the coatings will be better
version too. I had 05 dorado sc, and put up with the mediocre damping set up (and rattling) because I liked the purity of design in the Dorado.
You can sign me up right now for an upside down 'totem'.
I have a shiver , and made a steel axle for it, it makes a noticable difference in torsinal rigidity, possibly more than the 50% the arch provides.
The fork is going to weigh the same as it is with the arch anyways.
The only famous company I can think of with a twin tube design (aka double barrel?) would be Öhlins. But they are Swedes, not Swiss. So? Öhlins or something else?
What does this mean? The Dorado costs the same as a 40/Boxxer/888...
Foes F1 XTD: £1849
Bos Idylle RaRe: £1589
Fox 40RC2 Fit : £1449
Marzocchi 888 RC3 Evo TI 2012: £1399
Bos Idylle: £1189
Manitou Dorado Pro: £1169
RockShox Boxxer WC Solo Air: £1099
Conspiracy DH Fork: £899
RockShox Boxxer R2C2: £850
Marzocchi 888CR: £699
You can shop around to get some discounted for instance the Marz. Forks but the others are 2013 lineup prices and I haven't got the price for Marz. 2013 products. Now if the Emerald came in around the Manitou Dorado Pro/Bos Idylle that would really give the product a chance in the UK. It is a hard market here.
I am sure there are other forks out there and I haven't listed all models from the same range but this at least gives a good idea.
The new concepts here really are the new materials used, the manufacturing process, the support, the collet design for the tube leg (although this has also been done with other applications in mind) so again not re-inventing the wheel or really dramatically changing to a new super damper or anything. Well branded, well packaged product with the support and aftermarket is what the aim seems to be here and so far they are delivering even without the products but with the website and communication.
Cost will come from the materials used and the support costs world wide for support and promotion. Development comments have also been kept to a minimum with DVO thanks to the 3D printer, previous experience with the technology etc. So I don't see why they could not price it to suit the Bos Idylle/Manitou area. It was also stated they are aiming for a $1500 price so that would equate to £950. Obviously we all know that by the time it hits UK shores the price inflates but I would be disappointed to see them market straight at the Bos Idylle RaRe & 40RC2 range.
The Bos are cheaper because there is no local support, no sponsorship's for them to cover etc, it just the product and warranty.
The Manitou's are cheaper because of the old reputation and stimga out there. Keeping prices down to dry and draw people to using their products again. Also Manitou are not sponsoring much overall.
I know a few people who can put it through a good work out.
Myself included.
As far as stanchion colors...DVO green, Black/Grey, Red and Blue.
Not sure how many color options are realistic to stock but at least DVO green and a black Black/Grey option.
Good luck and I can't wait to see your Endruo/AM fork!
Just high quality, long lasting, easily maintained and reasonably priced products pleased.
Products that keep me riding and not dealing with warranty issues.
What have you lot done to protect the stantions? The carbon front thingy will protect from the front but wont cover it entirely. How would your RMA or service team be with those kinds of returns?
Nonetheless, great stuff!
Finally someone is taking inverted forks to the next level. I purchased a set of atomlab inverted forks for my street bike, simple and cheap design. But I would to see some well built inverted forks for dj/street usage. I hope you guys come out with a solid product that can compete with the current market!
After i bought a 2008 boxxer team, becouse the 2002 was good overall, but this was my BIGGEST MISTAKE EVER MADE, the 2008 boxxer was the most unreliable fork that i have ever had, it was super flex with the 32mm stanchions for the 203mm travel, it leaked in the flood gate (another factory mistake it is not sealed properly) and the stock seals also leaked after 2,5 weeks!!! of use (all of the boxxers doing these fact :S - really annoying if you buy a not so cheap fork and you must go to SKF to put a proper seal whick will not leak right after 2,5 weeks)... Really disappointed in that fork. This fork managed to loose my motivation for full season... After i sold it and rode forums for half month and managed to take my vote for the best fork i ever seen so far:
As for the colors, it does look extremely good! If there is no possibility to go fully-red as you stated in the comments somewhere above and only going "murdered-out"black ( ), couldn't you atleast offer different-colored stickers?
And one last question, don't know if someone asked you in the comments cause they are already too much to cover them all (spent already around an hour reading them and only got to the half of them) - what's the coating of the stantions? Looks very Kashima-inspired from the photos, but i'm pretty sure you're more than capable of thinking about an alternative.
It seems every bike company has a neon or lime green frame that sells out. Why the hell did it take so long to replace indigo?
Anyway, it's great that you respond to pretty much all of the posts here, I think that shows that you care about people who probably are going to ride your fork in the future, not sure some big players would do that.
Really like your philosophy of letting & helping the user become an internal tuning guru, since I consider myself trainable and love to geek out.
From personal experience, the Dorado 2012 feels incredible but this is new tech which sounds super promising. Definitely an upgrade for my acid green Mondraker Summum haha. Can't wait to get DVO powered and shred like a wannabe factory supercross star that I am haha.
Would be really really interested in trying one and seeing what it's like under race conditions and general riding , what it's like to set up etc.
Probably never be able to get my hands on one anyway , money and even if someone decides to stock them here.
But serious props really love that its slightly different but still nice on the eyes.
Hope yous do well and keep producing stuff like this. Good luck!
All in all I'm really excited to see what you guys start putting out cause I have always been in love with Marzo's forks, just not their build quality over the last few years. They've always been in another league in terms of plushness and with you guys having been such a big part of that, moving to a new company (or STARTING a new company as it were) is just going to lead to a nice new option in the suspension market I hope. Best of luck to you guys, and beautiful fork you've made. Hope to see more beautiful things coming from you guys in the future, just please keep the FR/DH stuff coming. A 650b FR fork would be sweet too :wink:
Then there's the amount of wins Nicho V had on inverted forks.
Inverted won't suit everyone, as with most products, you need to pick the compromise that best suits you. Some might prefer the stiffness of a 40. I liked the compliance my Shivvers offered me.
Bushing placement will be important in these forks. If there is any twisting, good bushes will make a difference in plushness/performance, and twisting.
I can't wait to try a set. They tick all the right boxes for me so far.
Edit: missed the part where you had a Shivver, you know what I'm talking about with plushness.
There is no proof been mentioned that the lower moving unsprung parts on the DVOs and possibly any inverted fork are lighter than say a Boxxer, or 40s mag lowers and internals. You have magnesium lowers Vs CNCed ally drop outs and stanchions externally. And the internals can be set up to be unsprung weight or not in either type of fork.
Inverted single crowns will always be a no no I'd say, it's too hard to make them stiff enough without the extra crown. They still have to fit under the down tube, and I highly doubt you'll see even DVO releasing any. I'll bet they release a conventional(non inverted)single crown. They have stated they will make what's best, without any character marketing type crap overruling logic.
Cannondales fork gets more overlap having it inverted.
Yeah Shivver was plush as I'm guessing the DVO will be. I like inverted, but I can easily remember when the majority didn't when it was Shivver, White Bos, Mr Dirt and Dorrado Vs Boxxer, then 888, and 40s..
Wait a year until real world consumer testing is over.
Every Aussie knows to test the water before you dive in.
Titanium Collet Clamps
All current double crown forks in the MTB and the MX world utilize some sort of pinch-bolt system to hold the upper tubes in place, but DVO is considering a different method: collets. The collet system used on the Emerald consists of tube sections with vertical splines and an external wedge shape. Tightening a threaded ring (with the required spanner wrench) that is positioned above pulls the section upwards, locking the fork tube in place due to the wedge-shaped internal profile of the section. It is very similar to what is used to hold tool bits securely into high rpm machines (drills and CNC machines for example), although this would be the first time that a collet setup has been put to use to hold fork tubes in place. One upside of the collet design is the large and even clamping force it provides, but the system could also result in a lighter overall package compared to the more common pinch bolt arrangement. While all of the above sounds good on paper, and the design should present no technical issues due to the robust upper tubes of the Emerald fork, production costs may keep the collet clamping system from reaching production. If so, a standard pinch bolt design will likely be used on 2014 model year forks, with DVO hoping to put the collet system to use on 2015 products.
Even though I find the CTA very unattractive, this fork is a must have (depending on the german retail prices)
One thing I do not understand though:
How can 2 Aluminium tubes with dropouts be lighter than a MgAl Casting? Cannot really imagine that.
And one Question left to ask:
Does the fork have a hydraulik bottom out or top out circuit?
They look like they are going to be hellish expensive or can we expect "affordable luxury"?
I heard the rumors and talked with you all about this fork and thought it was going to have 40mm stanchions not the 36 ala Shiver (which was my favorite fork until my current 40) so I am very interested how it will ride. keep in touch with me, you know how to get hold of me.
cheers to you all at DVO!
I busted the arch off of my 66VF. One side cracked, so I broke it off completely. It has a 20 mm axle. It works just as good now as it did before. The only people that think they notice undetectable & irrelevant changes in torsional stiffness (& that sorta shit) are the people that spend too much time worrying about tech & too little time learning how to ride.
The DVO inverted flex(however much) might not suit everyone, but they're best figuring that out for themselves than guessing or going on hype. For most, I think the DVO will be brilliant, I'm basing this on my Shivver experience, and from what I've heard about new Dorradoes. As I haven't heard about flex being an issue with them yet. Would love for someone to do the totally misleading front wheel between the knees, twist the handle bar test on some Shivvers, then a new Dorrado just to see how much difference their is.
I'm not sure if a larger axle diameter would actually help as I'm not sure what loads would actually create a problem for flex. With the same axle lenght, clamping width, and bolt torque, I'm guessing the 20mm(narrower)might actually grip better in the clamps. Clamping force spread over less surface area creating more friction, but I might be totally wrong here. And more importantly the main resistance need is from legs wanting to go in different directions, not rotate on the axle, but try and twist off the axle side ways, and here a narrower axle will have better purchase by the clamps.
Thanks again for the insight and feedback, DVO is listening to everyone!
Great job DVOSuspension, I'm waiting for a single crown enduro/fr beast with a long plush travel
Will this be required on these forks? If so how will that work when its air sprung?
why steer tube is also tapered? because has a greater rigidity or because a greater compatibility for mounting on frames with tapered head tube?
thx
I sent an email to @ ronnied, my address is colombodhcycles@gmail.com, I await your response.
Greetings
If this is anything to go by, that was a good decision, 36mm 'not' Kashima coated DH fork? Colour me interested for the single crowns coming next year!
I love inverted forks. Back when I used to care about this kind of shit (bike tech) I shit all over Marzocchi for that 12" Monster T they built for Bender because it was a conventional fork with a "gull wing" lower crown. It was the stupidest thing ever & I'm not positive but it may very well have been Bryson Martin who asked me how many forks I had designed & then proceeded to tell me that his sons KX 60 had a conventional fork with a "gull wing" lower crown. I just said "when your son is jumping 200'+ & back flipping his MX, then take note of what kind of fork he uses & lemme know. Like I said, can't remember if it was Bryson, but if it was, I'm glad to see that you finally know what you're doing.
To say that weight is less of an issue on an MX is clueless. F1 race cars are painted with lightweight paint. Lowering unsprung weight in a suspension system matters on all high performance vehicles. Lowering overall weight matters on all high performance vehicles. If you wanna try using a little common sense for a change, think about where weight savings would be more beneficial, on a DH mountain bike that rolls down a hill, or on an MX bike that in a lot of cases weighs more than the rider on it flipping & spinning it through the air over 100'+ foot gaps. If you wanna argue weight is less of an issue on an MX then why not look at it the other way & see the fact that MXs are subjected to drastically larger forces in all directions as well. When you double the diameter of a tube, you quadruple its rigidity. The highest stress on a fork leg is right at the bottom of the lower crown. It's much better to have the larger tubes in the crowns than trying to oversize the smaller ones like on Fox's fork. More clamping surface on the axles is all that's really needed & honestly a bigger axle wouldn't be a bad idea. Inverts provide more bushing overlap too, which helps in the rigidity department as well as other departments.
If all the weight was at the mid/rear of the bike all riders would have to force themselves into the landing to get the front down and stop under rotation. The same could be said for a fork that weighed too much. You would constantly be trying to stop over rotation. With all that in mind the zone that best suites the weight of MX forks happens to mean you can use allot more material, larger diameter and more generic materials tubes etc to get the required strength/stiffness/weight that they require.
Further to this mountain bikes need a different design philosophy. When the bike weighs drastically less than the rider then the forces are less as you have stated above. DH forks on a mountain bike are much more critical in weight distribution compared to the MX bike as they are still a substantial part of the weight on the bike around 10%-15% of total mass hanging off the front. If you then added all the other components and compared the front/rear weight distribution you would see how front heavy a bike is and how the rider is left compromising between perfect posture for stability and weight distribution to keep the bike on track and fast.
Anyways, I am kind of rambling and someone else could probably explain what I have said better but you should at least see where DVO are coming from with the comment. It may not be 100% accurate but it is 99% and means that the average joe can also understand what is being said without making it complicated.
I think you'll find that unsprung weight for MTB inverted forks is probably heavier than most conventional MTB forks(not saying thats the case for the DVOs, but nobody but DVO knows this so it's irrelevant to the debate). MX forks need fore/aft stiffness and strength more, as they have more weight driving them into stuff, and landing on them.
I never minded the twisting "flex" of Shivvers, but I'm light, and not that powerful, I think it may have even helped me. The Kowa GFs I have had did flex too much, and the Kowa conventional forks are superior. I also thought the 888 chassis was better, but my perception might have been because of weight etc than stiffness. Not sure why they went to 38mm for the 888 stanchions. Maybe to suit internals. The Shivver never flexed noticeably like the Kowa GF. My Maverics would also flex a lot. I think my White Brothers where okay for not flexing too much, but that was years ago.
I think the DVOs will probably be brilliant, but I'm not going to bang any hype cans based on guessing. Same as I never banged on about inverted forks being to flexy back in the day, when all the fan boy band wagon was.
If there is a shitty inverted fork on the market then it is shit because it is shit, not because it's inverted. Whatever flaw you may find with an inverted fork, it exists because it wasn't designed properly. There are more advantages to inverted forks than there are disadvantages & more advantages over conventionals. If you steer with a throttle on an MX, I steer with a manual on a DH. There is more than one way to steer a bike & place the wheels where you want them. Maybe you should research how to ride & leave the technology alone. Inverted forks are superior & if you're the kind of rider that worries how much a fork is flexing, you're probably not a very good one.
You wanna know what the real difference is between MX & MB? Or for that matter MX riders & MB riders? In MX, the riders worry about riding the bikes. None of them give a flying f*ck about how stiff a handlebar, or a swing arm or a fork is. They care that the bike works. They care about power, they care about weight, they care about durability & that's about it, because that's about all that really matters. For a bicycle, the power components aren't an issue, so the industry tries to make big issues out of a whole lot of nothing, you know, so it seems like improvements are constantly being made. How many different contraptions are there out there now just to move a rear wheel up & down? It's more ridiculous than the exercise industry with ab machines.
Inverted forks don't flex too much, mountain bikers blame the wrong things for their lack of skills too much.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=cPecdZnWngg
ride it hard and wear it out in time for the launch of this mother !! :o)
P.s. What should I include in my resume? Would a six-pack help?
- Bryson Martin, DVO"
It has been a long time since a company brought an inverted fork to the market? Really? In what world have you guys been living in for the past years? You have, Manitou Dorado, probably one of the best "of the shelf" suspensions in the market, at least, way ahead of Marzocchis, that was re-introduced as a completely new fork in 2009 and keeps selling... and then you have the exotics like Kowa GF200, Avalanche DHF, etc... all of them inverted and all of them way better than Marzocchis ...
Anyway, thank you guys for getting us another option on inverted forks. I've been a huge fan of inverted suspensions since I began riding with my 2005 Shiver SC 100mm. After that was the DNM Vulcano, 2002 Shiver SC 120mm, 2004 Manitou Dorado DH and 2005 Manitou Dorado DH and am now considering the new Kowa GF, which is, apparently, one of the best forks available out there.
www.bikerumor.com/2012/06/23/2013-lefty-forks-stiffer-lighter-stronger-more-durable
www.youtube.com/watch?v=tDPDaphgR3k&feature=fvwp&NR=1
-CF-
what is the benefit of the molybdenum disulphide
coating in Stanchions?
what about dealers in europe, near balkan?
Does anyone know how much will it cost?
Greetings
Which brings me to my second point: Good on you guys for talking about the upper limit of stiffness. Motorcycles ran into that pre MotoGP days (500's). At the beginning of '93 it was a huge smack in the face for Yamaha. Tire sidewalls too stiff. Frames too stiff. Suspension settings could never cope on their own. On the small chatter, the rear ends would just skate. I'm pretty sure it was this issue that resulted in Freddy Spencer getting tossed into the dirt at turn 3 of Laguna.
Too true. You read a lot about how stiffer is better and rigidity enforcing designs etc etc but it is sometimes a wonder whether the opposite limit is considered.
Take Aerofoils for example. The wings on a plane are designed to bend. If they were rigid they'd fracture and then snap. I'm sure the same goes for far more components than we think that are used in planes/cars/motorbikes/mountain bikes.
Sexy looking forks. If I wasn't skint, i'd be all over them.
The forks look gorgeous, and it looks like you went around the drawbacks of inverted designs. I'd be very curious to try it. Well i'd be very curious to try all forks actually!
@ dvosuspension. i think to get the best knowledge and customer appreciation, you guys should send out some demo forks. to places like whistler , moab, and other big places, where they can be abbused and tested by riders like yourselves. also it would be great karma to let a few pairs go for free. thats what i would do anyway. just my 2 cents, nice forks boys
Anyone need a kidney?
loving the details!
and pleas show us the shock!
Currently I'm running Avalanche cartridge on 35 Marzocchi chassis never had any issues, stiff enough.
High Speed Comp is awesome (not spike) as well Low Speed Comp (absolute traction) and nice faster Rebound.
I can do shim upgrades trough mid valve shim stack as well comp and rebound shims.
My problem is my curiosity I wonder about the mid stroke on the Emerald because most of the commercial products, are not able to deliver
appropriate interactions in between the settings. Most of the time the rider have to do a compromise.
I also wonder if you are able to offer just a single cartridge to fit most of the available DH chassis? not bad approach as well
Also about the weight is Emerald weight is measured on dry 2,9-3 kg or wet?
Why after so many years behind suspension design none of the leading companies (Fox, Rock Shox, Marzocchi ) ware able to deliver
all that fork's accuracy you are trying to offer?
Is it a know-how and development or just good marketing strategy ?
I think now days all offers on the market are nothing new just a repackage and good advert
Cut the brace off if you doubt it's effectiveness and don't like the looks
Please, make a fork for normal people, not for racers, cause in the world there's some millions of riders, and a few hundred of racers...
@Octalex1
hey, cool down boy... i didn't mean, what you thought i did...
loooks bloody awesome and i want one