Diamondback's Eric Porter has played a major role in testing the fork. A 160mm Travel Contender?
Although the Dorado is, at least in our opinion, one of the best downhill forks available, it has been a long time since Manitou has been a serious player in the mid-travel market. Things have progressed greatly since their Sherman fork was a viable option, with both RockShox (with their Pike) and FOX (with their revised '14 34 and 36 forks) putting forward 140 - 160mm travel forks that offer incredible performance, and it's fair to say that most people weren't sure when they'd see a 160mm travel option from Manitou. As it turns out, they are about to debut a brand new mid-travel fork aimed directly at the aforementioned competition and appearing to sport around 160mm of travel. Will this be the fork that puts Manitou back in the running with the other major manufacturers? That will depend on two factors: reliability and outright performance. While only time can be the judge of the former, we're expecting the latter to be taken care of by technology lifted from the proven Dorado. More specifically, an altered version of its phenomenal twin-tube open bath TPC damper.
Although Manitou weren't willing to discuss the prototype fork, there are plenty of details to take away from the photo shown at right. Firstly, it is a safe bet to assume that there is a variation of their TPC damper hidden within its right leg, with a closer look at the fork's dials backing that up. A single anodized blue dial can be seen at the bottom of the right leg, more than likely controlling low-speed rebound, while multiple dials can be seen atop the crown, which makes sense given the high-speed and TPC compression adjustments found on the Dorado. This also means that it probably incorporates the same hydraulic bottom-out and top-out design as well, negating the need to use a rubber bumper or top-out spring for those duties.
Zooming in on the crown-mounted dials reveals a small tab that would easily allow the rider to reach down and flick it in order to firm up the fork for climbing, but there is also what looks to be a channel machined into the side of the same dial that would serve as home to a cable for optional remote operation. The spring-side dial has that same channel, although we suspect that its purpose could be for a remote travel adjustment system, enabling the rider to lower the fork for technical climbing. The fork would also need to be air sprung in order to compete with the rest of the market weight-wise, with it needing to come in between 4.5 and 5.5lbs to be a player, although Manitou hasn't ever been known for chasing weight class wins.
Externally, the fork makes use of Manitou's long standing reverse arch, which isn't much of a surprise given that it has been a design feature found on all of their right side up forks for many years now, as well as their unique Hex Lock thru-axle system that forgoes a standard round axle for a six-sided unit that they say greatly increases torsional rigidity. It is difficult to tell from the photo whether it is a 15 or 20mm diameter axle, but we would assume that it is 15mm given that all of Manitou's existing QR Hex Lock axles are of that size. What isn't hard to see, though, is that the unnamed fork is has been designed for 26'' wheels, but it wouldn't be out of line to expect Manitou to produce a set of 650B-compatible lowers as well.
Although all of the above is pure speculation at this point, there is no doubt that this fork
needs to be a home run in order for Manitou to regain their footing in the high-end market. We'll have more from Eurobike where the fork will see its debut, including all of the official details.
www.manitoumtb.com
Not that it's a bad fork, but it's poor value to buy new off the shelf if you ask me.
Everything on this site lately gets bashed for being to expensive, it is getting pretty annoying. Instead of typing on PinkBike all day go get a second job or a third one, clearly some of you have enough free time.
I don't stand alone in being tired of the latest $7-10K trail bike being posted without any posts for the $3-5k DH rig for the weekend warrior. We're sick and tired of being ignored.
These are bikes ridden as a 1st world leisure activity that we're fortunate to have the time, money, and resources to participate in. I, for one, try and keep that perspective and I'm getting tired of all the all the people who do nothing but bash products for inane reasons, including price. Cost is what it is. Buy what you can afford and don't bash what you can't. As more people ride, costs will come down due to scales of economy and tech trickle down (today's SLX is WAY better than XTR and XTR from a few years ago). High end gear is asperational from a marketing perspective and is what pushes the tech envelope and gets us the good mid to low cost gear down the road. It's always more expensive, as companies need make up their capital costs for R&D etc.
Finally, one thing to keep in mind is that the cost of raw materials has gone up pretty dramatically the last 3 years, which is impaction cost of goods regardless of sector. Oh, and Asian wages have also gone up as well which is also an impact. What will help is competition, which will get better with the addition of good Manitou offerings (along with Marzo, DVO, XFusion, etc).
If Pike was in 170mm like my Lyrik, I would be tempted to upgrade for the weight alone. Even abandon coil. Coils are cool though.
@focofox37: Shop online, and you can build a mean bike in the $3k to $4k range, even with a full priced frame.
OH and BUYING what I could afford lead me to a $900 fork (about $550 total). After the crown was replaced 3 times and the manufacturer suggested I get a better fork. I don't jump or ride super hard, that's just what you get with "trickle down" today, imo... And something I've noticed, mtb pricing isn't inline with motorcycles and parts, that segment has gone up about 25%. And they've had just as much innovation, including air forks, new frame, electronics. If it followed mtb, a new showroom stock CRF450 would be $17000 compared to $6800 10 years ago... That's what "WE" are getting at.
As for moto, folks make that comparison on these forums and it's really a very poor comparison. All the big boys in moto (Honda, Suzuki, Yamaha, Kawi) are Japanese conglomerates that have HUGE and DEEP pockets, and are heavily subsidized by the Japanese government. They can keep costs down because of their tremendous buying power relative to all the other vehicles or industries they are part of. They also have less competition, so their volumes are higher and, as such, reap the benefits of economies of scale. They also tend to keep their base line models relatively the same for years, with only minor changes annually Take all that away, and off road motos would be more expensive. In fact, look at KTM, they don't have the same advantages and their bikes are more expensive.
40s, Boxxers and 888 all look spiritless next to a Dorado!
As for performance - yes, i have ridden a 40 and have liked it a lot (while not a huge fan of Fox Suspension). And no, i do not find it superior to my 2009 Dorado MRD!
Till now, DVO's words ahve been only this - words. The fork isn't out yet, so no reviews yet - an't confirm that at the moment.
I agree, inverted is the way to go. kinda wonder what would happen if a Dorado receives a CTA unit like the DVO.
Any haters out there ride a Manitou before you judge there super light, stiff, plush and the ABS damper makes CTD a laughing stock
Anyway, it was MADNESS!
Stout trunk, huge fork, heavy(-duty) frame, slack head-angle, roast squirrels... Yeah!
Owned a Fox 40 for 2.5 years (to be fair it was an '09) and it was a complete nightmare with blown bladders every 10 or so days, blown seals every 2-3 weeks, and a ton of bushing slop. Felt like I spent more time fixing it than riding. I hear the newer ones are better but I'm skeptical.
Switched to a 888 Evo last year which was better on maintenance but still had to service it more often than I was led to believe, bushings not as tight as I expected, divey even with a firmer spring than I should be on for my weight, and would occasionally spike on high speed hits.
Have not owned a Boxxer but rode a WC for a full day on my bike. Felt pretty nice, can't comment on reliability.
This Dorado is unreal. Top to bottom Garbo to valley laps 2-3 days a week with absolutely no issues. Always felt like past forks could not match the capabilities of the rear of my V10c but now with the Dorado I'm actually considering custom tuning my RC4 to better match the front- it performs THAT well. I have had more days on it so far without service/issues than any other fork I've owned, and the performance is superior.
This looks like a worthy replacement:
1. 35mm stanchions
2. Bulges like RS forks have
3. 20mm axle
4. Best damper ever
It is one of those "Silence thyself and accept my monies" moments
Don't get me wrong, none of these problems should have been delivered to customers, but the forks themselves were really good, once set up correctly. The Nixon and Dorado were the best forks I owned.
More oil = better performance. I don't like the trend of the last few years to make the damping oil the size of a brake reservoir. Risse Champs took 400ml in each leg! Mmm buttery...
I have a little over a year on my 130mm minute and I love it, i've taken hard hits and jumps, never bottoms out, plush, no leaks, no creaks, nothing. solid fork, im excited for this since i'm looking at a 6" bike here soon
hate on fox all you want, fine with me, more deals for me =)
Fox is overpriced though, no matter how you look at it, well 90% of mtb shit is.
I know quite a few riders who switched to RS after their Fox forks went down, they kept the Fox shock(rear) though, those seem to be more durable then their forks/seals/dampers (even though I read on mtbr about fox shocks taking dumps more then I hear about RS/Xfusion/Mani shocks)
I want a Fox fork, but I don't want to spend a shit ton on a fork when you can find one that does the same thing and possibly better for half the price. Have the money but don't want to waste it when it could be used better building my bike and building my car.
this is what i hear all day everyday from fox haters.. and thats what you were doing. hating on fox, maybe not very much, but you still is. and as already stated.. if you know what youre doing and head your head out of your a$$, you can usually find a deal on a fox fork for 40-50% MSRP. if thats too expensive for you, go buy some RSTs or suntours or some ish like that.
'gotta pay to play'
You sound like a typical "my bike costs more" douche.
And that's just great... [insert sarcasm emoticon here]
Pretty nice strategy, remind me never to invest in any future businesses you start!
Manitou has always been at the back of people's minds exactly because too many people whine about their previous products, before they were bought by Hayes.
I just bought a Marz 55 CR to run at 150mm. Seems like everyone has forgotten that Marz makes a great competitor in this area for a great price. It was less than $600 compared to $1k for a pike or34. It is a bit heavier than those forks, but it has a solid chassis and great damping.
Few cheeky questions if I may What did you have before the 55CR? How does it hold up in terms of stiffness?
They were nigh on impossible to buy for ages so there haven't really been any user reviews to decide on either so if you do answer, I'd be REALLY greatful!
The circus has Hex Lock 20mm...
Refer ot it as "he"!
Imagine chucking the bike down some rocky junk, without that coating? Ruin some stanchions in a hurry. With that coating? They survive and you can sell them on PB with the tag "scratch free stanchions" Most steel stanchions are chrome plated for the same reason. Wear and scratch resistance. They dont do it just for pretties. The coating is there to keep you, the end user, enjoying their product longer.
For example, I've never tried spring bearings in a fork but would love check out the feel. Yet that is an invisible feature to the customer. Or seal design, that has as much if not more to do with stiction and stanchion wear but is a non-obvious feature that is harder to get across in marketing. Or how about the reverse arch? That preserves stanchions by decreasing mud buildup on the seals. etc...
But yeah, the color of the stanchions is quite obvious to anyone at first glance.
performance of fork stanchion coating>color of stanchion coating..
@dfiler You know, I had never considered that. One thing I am ashamed to admit is that in five years of use, I have only changed the oil in the lowers and air cartridge 3 times. The bushings and stanchions still slide with no play or noticeable wear. The air spring has been trouble free.
Hehehe, seems like i laready have the option which to change my new Nixon 160 TPC+ with in the future!
given previous experience of just about every Manitou product, that should take about 5 minutes. But, they will probably feel amazing for those 5 minutes.