The Pinkbike Podcast: Episode 144 - Interview with an Illegal Trail Builder

Sep 16, 2022 at 11:00
by Mike Levy  
Pinkbike Podcast
Art by Taj Mihelich


Did you know that mountain biking would be way less fun if we didn't have singletrack? We spend a lot of time talking about different bikes and gear, but none of that would be of much use if all we had were gravel roads, which is why it's about time we discuss trail building and everything that comes along with it. Today's podcast sees me talk to a prolific trail builder who has been working in the woods for three decades, creating everything from chill climbing trails to killer descents to flowing blue trails and all that's in between. He's also built his fair share of unsanctioned singletrack, and while we don't condone skirting the rules - don't build illegal trails, please - we do talk about why he feels like he has to go down that road. That's also why we're disguising his voice and using an alias.

This is just the first podcast in a series that will bring you conversations with the people and organizations involved with building the trails we all love to ride. Stay tuned for more perspectives in the coming weeks, including chats with cycling organizations and other builders.





THE PINKBIKE PODCAST // EPISODE 144 - INTERVIEW WITH AN ILLEGAL TRAIL BUILDER
September 16th, 2022

Berms, bench cuts, and unsanctioned singletrack are all on the menu.


Featuring a rotating cast of the editorial team and other guests, the Pinkbike podcast is a weekly update on all the latest stories from around the world of mountain biking, as well as some frank discussion about tech, racing, and everything in between.


Subscribe to the podcast via your preferred service (Apple, Spotify, RSS, LibSyn, etc.), or visit the Pinkbike Podcast tag page for the complete list of episodes.


178 Comments

  • 201 1
 I used to build illegal trails. I still do, but I used to too.
  • 31 0
 Every picture is of you when you were younger.
  • 23 0
 RIP Mitch!
  • 13 0
 @nozes: I would lay in my twin-sized bed and wonder where my brother was.
  • 23 0
 "I can never imagine a scenario where I would need to prove that I bought a donut."
  • 1 0
 @angelfirebiker: Like his dating profile(s). Swipe right.
  • 12 0
 Yesterday I literally walked past an out of order escalator and mumbled aloud "Escalator temporarily stairs".
  • 21 0
 @sngltrkmnd: You're lucky you weren't on them when they broke down. I was once stuck for hours.
  • 1 0
 @preston67: Haha that’s hilarious
  • 8 0
 @MegaStoke
All Mitch Hedberg references are relevant and appreciated.
  • 5 0
 If a zombie apocalypse would happen in Vegas, would it stay in Vegas?
  • 7 0
 Rice is great if you're hungry and want to eat 2000 of something.
  • 3 0
 Is a hippopotamus a hippopotamus or just a really cool oppotomus?
  • 6 0
 Man, I had an ant farm. Them fellas didn’t grow sh*t!
  • 137 6
 Five years ago I thought there was no need for illegal trails. Now, it's clear to me that new "officials" trails in our area will ALWAYS follow the IMBA formula precisely--our local trail org thinks IMBA trail building rules are the gospel. So all new sanctioned trails will be homogenous and boring. Now I think illegal trail builders are absolute heroes.
  • 29 13
 Trail orgs follow IMBA because it's a nationally-recognised standard, and if they don't, they open themselves up to being sued. Our countries are bass-ackwards in terms of personal responsibility, and if removing the gap-jump from the trail reduces your chances of getting sued, you'll probably do it.

Don't blame IMBA, blame the lawyers (or both?)
  • 29 2
 I think a bigger issue that is rarely discussed when it comes to illegal trails is it is typically higher skilled riders that want to challenge their personal abilities beyond what is available from sanctioned trail networks and are willing to accept personal responsibility for the risks involved with crashing on a high risk move.
But even if a trail association or municipality was willing to higher a builder to create a proper built double black / “pro-line” jump trail or ultra steep tech trail. Neither would be willing to take on the liability of trails of that skill level for multiple reasons.
TL;DR : As long as our sport has highly skilled individuals who want to progress their own personal riding level there will be “illegal trails”
  • 43 0
 If you're an illegal builder and you want to limit trail access to reasonably skilled riders, build big scary features. Big gaps and drops keep people honest about gauging their own abilities and tolerance for risk. If you look at most bike parks, their emergency calls are coming from blue trails with tabletops, where people are most careless.
  • 8 0
 @brycepiwek: 100% spot on. That is what we did as teens/early 20's to progress in BMX and MTB, and to this day I 'support' certain well experienced and 'discreet' builders. I am in my late 40's so lot a ton of illegal building for me now, but it will ALWAYS be around
  • 14 0
 @brycepiwek: Good points, but to your "won't build double black take" I wanted to add a local anecdote in...

Over in the PNW a sanctioned rowdy system on USFS land(I think, it's gov land that has a logging and recreation easement) started building bike specific trail in 2019. To my knowledge, they didn't use IMBA guidelines, and used the forest services resources(aka, thousands of hours of CCC worker's time) to cut gnarly, hand-built, proper techy mountain bike trail that can hold up to erosion. I was blown away that this system was built so recently, sanctioned, and as fun as it was. I would love to see more gov't land go this route, as their trail builders honestly build better trails than any machine-built stuff I've ridden. To top it off, they even built a sanctioned double-black tech trail as recently as last summer!
  • 2 0
 @cgreaseman:
First off that place sounds awesome!

Totally agree that, thankfully there exceptions to this. Another great example being the KBR bike park in Kamloops. It is built on city/gov land and there is insurance taken on and paid for by a local trail association (someone please correct me on this if I’m wrong. But pretty sure that is how it’s managed). For the most part sadly the majority of trail networks probably won’t be willing to take on that sort of responsibility. There will also still be fringe trails that are absolutely never going to be sanctioned; a trail I know of has a final feature thats a 20’x35’ drop with multiple other hits that are not much smaller above it. Of course that is the 0.1% of trails. But especially in the PNW there are a good handful of riders wanting and willing to build and ride such trails.
  • 8 1
 @cgreaseman: For sure! Now my biggest concern at Galby is not running over people and their off leash dogs in the middle of black diamond trails. Ended up breaking my hand a few weeks ago avoiding a little dog on Oriental Express.
  • 1 0
 @cgreaseman: what's the name of this trail system? I'd love to check it out when I go there and next year!
  • 5 0
 @dualsuspensiondave: Definitely not galby. Down in Darrington. 2nded on the dogs though.... I ran into a lady walking her unleashed dog up Orient a month ago. Crazy entitled people live over there.
  • 5 0
 @dualsuspensiondave: if his name is Chaco, go ahead and run over the owner. Got bit by an off leash dog last time I was in Bellingham.
  • 1 0
 @brycepiwek: Ever been to Kamloops? (Never mind saw your comment) The bike ranch gets funny directly from the city to build proper double black/ "proline" trails.
  • 16 1
 This is an issue with your local organization. I recommend getting involved and pushing for expert stuff. A few years ago I'd have said the same thing (and did, I complained so much it's embarrassing, just check my previous comments lol.)

We just opened a sweet jump trail on BLM last year that's a solid black even by whistler standards, and this year a super steep tech trail that's a black, but could honestly be a double black, in a city park of all places. We adopted another route that's natural hand built blue tech as well, again in a city park, no machines used and it's got a real oldschool vibe. This just took some serious advocacy, which as I'm finding out now, will probably snowball into other opportunities.

The fact is most people who get involved in those organizations aren't super shredders and just don't know how to build advanced stuff, so when they get the opportunity, it resembles their version of "advanced", which often has an imba vibe. Your trails are shaped by who shows up.

I'm not saying don't build unsanctioned stuff because that's really the backbone of mtb, but also create a plan on how to push things in an advanced direction. It's definitely possible as long as you have the terrain and access.
  • 5 0
 @fentoncrackshell: dude I notice this so much, at Snowshoe they are closing Skyline their blue small tabletop jump trail atleast twice a day to get people out on a four wheeler. Most of the gnar tech is pretty much problem free.
  • 3 0
 Imagine getting new trails. You don't realize how lucky you are.
  • 2 0
 @cgreaseman: yup. that trail had fishing line with hooks strung across it a few years ago. probably same folks
  • 4 3
 IMBA crap gets you Bentonville. You want more excitement and variety then just Bentonville in your life.
  • 1 0
 @waffleeater: Damn for real? That trail is my go-to on my lunch lap… yikes. Scary.
  • 4 0
 @cgreaseman: the trails in darrington are on Washington dnr land not usfs
  • 1 0
 @bishopsmike: is that really it? Because I feel that’s not really the issue. It seems to me that governments like to see some sort of recognized standard to know that trails are “legitimate” and won’t be a wasted investment or an environmental liability. IMBA happens to have standards and is appealing to governments that don’t have much information to fall back on in terms of analysis of trail plans.
  • 2 0
 @mustbike: this is in Eugene? Mind telling me where to go? I grew up there but moved to CO 5 years ago. Will be back visiting some friends this Fall and want to know where the goods are
  • 3 0
 @sspiff: The Scrapers just built a section called "The Gift" out at a little place called Whypass. Its out south of Eugene. Its pretty well done. Not quite a destination spot. Now their illegal BLM trails, those are choice.
  • 9 0
 @bishopsmike:

New Zealand has the perfect laws to address this. My understanding is that if you are doing something inherently risky you assume the risk of that activity. Wish the US had something similar.
  • 2 0
 @sspiff: Thurston Hills Natural Area in Springfield has Chinquapin Chutes, the steep black tech trail, they also have a new Black Sage built trail called Super Maple that's a fun fast blue machine. Eugene has Pipedream in the south hills which is accessible from the Ridgeline hiking trail, and is shuttleable via the Fox Hollow parking lot. The BLM jump trail is called "The Gift" which is at Carpenters Bypass AKA Whypass. The last one is south of Eugene about 30 minutes. I'd recommend using a trail app to find these, particularly Chinquapin Chutes doesn't have great signage yet and that area can be confusing to new users. The Gift can be a little tricky as well since it's real short like all the trails at Whypass.
  • 1 0
 @konadan: I know whypass and at least some of the pirate trails very well. Eugene riding is great!!
  • 1 0
 @mustbike: awesome. Thanks! I'll check these places out!
  • 1 0
 I find the problem in places like Australia is there are plenty of pinners that have bmx legs and skills and plenty of joeys so the trails are either too easy or too hard. The jumps aren't necessarily too big you just need athletic sprint and bunnyhop skills to clear them. If I want a bunch of easy stepdowns and drops I am forced to build my own.
  • 3 0
 My local trails are built in a city park, and the trails are listed on the trail plan as "user generated trails". Basically they are hands off. City lets the bros build what they want, and leave them alone. Plenty of decent sized gas, drops, all kinds of stuff that can get you killed (friend of a friend is paralyzed from the neck down from an incident at the jump line).

I was passing though a town in Northern California and hit up a trail system I saw on the map as I was passing though. I had low expectations, ended up being surprised. Near the bottom of an already amazing jump line is a double with a 30' gap. That trail is on the cities website, and describes it accurately.

It is possible to have good official trails, just have to have the right people pushing for them. I will be honest, I am not one of them so I can't claim any credit for the work of others.
  • 59 0
 The first rule about illegal trails is that you don’t talk about illegal trails.
  • 50 0
 What illegal trails?
  • 3 0
 Scrolled to find this...
  • 5 0
 illegal trails are just a myth
  • 2 0
 Don't f%$&ing Jimmy me Jules.. Since we're on 90s movies..
  • 1 0
 And turn off your Trailforks, heat maps are a blessing or a curse.
  • 50 0
 This podcast is reminiscent of the early Vice documentaries on drugs and drug dealers. Black loam heroin
  • 8 0
 give it to me straight to the veeeiiinnnnssssss
  • 4 0
 What ever happened to Vice?
  • 24 34
flag wobblegoblin (Sep 16, 2022 at 14:12) (Below Threshold)
 @Adamrideshisbike: same as most good things; it was ruined by woke girls.
  • 10 23
flag HLEW (Sep 16, 2022 at 14:30) (Below Threshold)
 @wobblegoblin:
F yes!
  • 8 1
 Why is the sound quality so good on the voice disguiser thingy and so poor on Henry's mike? Anyway to disguise Henrys voice so I can understand him?
  • 40 0
 I would love if you could have an episode with Steve from Vorsprung.
  • 13 0
 And Paul Aston. Together.
  • 2 0
 Yes agreed!
  • 3 0
 @c-radicallis: I'm thinking bring Paul back on the same episode as the folks from Enve haha
  • 1 0
 @snl1200: Guess we'll have to have him on twice ahahha
  • 37 4
 #nonewblueflow
  • 15 2
 If only we could rid mtb of pit viper trash as well Frown I’ll take what we can get
  • 29 1
 Lawyer and frequent rider of questionable trails here. I actually wrote a paper on liability and illegal trails. There are all sorts of landowner protections in the form of recreational land use immunity in the states and similar laws in Canada. The law is actually quite favorable towards the landowner and most bikers who sue now a days lose, especially in western states where bikes and gnarly trails are common. It’s not an actual liability issue, it’s a perceived liability issue. The key is in good legal education and good landowner relationships. Every time anything with a legal question comes up on this site people have the weirdest and often quite incorrect views.
  • 7 0
 Agreed especially with respect to Canada
  • 2 0
 Is the paper publicly available / link please? I'd love to read it!
  • 1 0
 @SpongeMelon:

Haven’t published it yet but shoot me a dm with your contact info and I’ll send you a copy
  • 2 0
 You literally just passed the bar. Lawyer here…lol
  • 2 0
 totally get what you're saying, and you're largely correct.

That said, would you expect something like a summary judgment in every one of these cases?

Because i can with authority, say that my local trail org couldn't even afford to defend against a lawsuit like this.
  • 2 0
 @groghunter:

That’s a good point. Just because you have the law on your side doesn’t mean it’s free. It just hopefully means that PI lawyers won’t take those cases because they’re not worth anything. We live in a funky system.
  • 2 0
 @leelau:

I also cited your paper in my paper! Thanks for all the great info. Canadas legal framework is much better than ours for dealing with this stuff.
  • 26 1
 I am an illegal trail builder and maintainer. I just cut out fallen trees illegally without being "chainsaw certified" too.
  • 8 0
 "Strategic Firewood Cutting"
  • 12 0
 Thank you for your risky service, stay spicy
  • 23 0
 Say what you will, but mountain biking would suck without pirate trails. It’s the heartbeat of MTB, in my opinion. Just don’t build them (-;
  • 20 0
 90 percent of trails in Sea to sky corridor were built " illegally" so you can essentially interview every builder.
  • 16 3
 Trails are built by riders because that's what they want to ride. It's not for glory, to be cool, or even be called a builder. It's not even for anyone but them. Keep em secret keep them safe.
  • 10 0
 Nice, Gandalf
  • 13 0
 How do we know we’ve been listening to Levi’s real voice all this time…
  • 2 0
 Levy is clearly an alien in disguise...
  • 12 0
 Just make sure to dig a big pit after your trail work is done to put the bodies of lawyers and the people who can’t take personal responsibility and are litigious.
  • 2 30
flag TeamDGAF (Sep 16, 2022 at 13:53) (Below Threshold)
 If you ride shit you can't handle u deserve whatever happens good or bad. Legal trial or not where is all your liberalism now.
  • 2 0
 @TeamDGAF: is the liberalism directed at my comment? I’m confused and think we are saying the same thing.
  • 10 0
 I think this depends a lot on where you ride. I live in Barcelona and in the area i ride bikes are not allowed on any path narrower than 3 metres, and should not go faster than 20km/h or 10km/h if there are pedestrians nearby. Nobody pays any attention to these rules, in fact I'm not 100% if the forest authority even have the power to fine you in most places. They do shut down newly built trails if they notice them but a few still get snuck in from time to time.

When i lived in Ireland mountain biking was prohibited in a lot (though not all) of the places i used to ride. Again, little to no enforcement and nobody cared. It's a catch all to discourage people from suing them, or in case people are really taking the piss riding dangerously around pedestrians.

The sport simply would not exist in many places without "illegal" digging and riding. It's a relatively new sport with relatively small numbers of people doing it (compared to the numbers of people hiking, in most places) and it just hasn't been accepted by the various land authorities yet even if they tacitly tolerate it for the most part. I know in the US you probably get ejected from your illegal trail by a SWAT team backed up by an Abrams tank but that just isn't how it works in most of the world.
  • 17 5
 Interesting take on eBikes from a legend of a trail builder, maybe this will help put all the BS about ebikes to rest.
  • 8 2
 Yup, it's always been people with ego and their BS. Ride the trails rather than looking at the metrics on Strava!
  • 4 1
 I think the only place that e-bikes could be iffy on in terms of access will be backcountry/wilderness areas. I don’t say that to imply I don’t think e-bikes should have access to trails or some how cause more damage than regular mtbs.
But unfortunately the organizations and government bodies (especially in the US) who have yet to be convinced regular mountain bikes should be allowed in wilderness areas could, or likely will use the fact that bikes now come with *assisted* motors as a reason to remove all bikes from them. Hopefully I’m wrong.
  • 9 0
 @brycepiwek:

I will say though after having my ebikes for two years now that one argument that I would agree with is that they can definitely get some people in trouble that have no business being on some of the trails that are hard to get too. From a safety standpoint, people can get way in over their heads fast all the while being really far from help.
  • 16 13
 There no shame in enjoying an E bike. The problems start when you drink the kool-aid, and believe that your still mountain biking.
Have you seen the latest E-EWS footage from Crans Montana. Riders using two feet off the pedals, and the bikes keep accelerating up the hill thru the technical terrain, all UCi approved of course. There’s nothing wrong with enjoying a childs motor cycle, one day i might get one. But when i do, i wont pretend that im still a mountain biker.
  • 3 1
 Watched three people pull their bikes out of their truck Saturday to ride. Two Specialized eBikes, and a dirt bike. Yes, a dirt bike. They rode together on mountain bike trails. Trails that all the builders themselves put up signs saying "no eBikes" (all "illegal trails").
  • 4 0
 @JSTootell: well that’s simply someone just being an ass, and those other two guys that were with him are just as big of idiots as the guy on the dirt bike. You can’t fix stupid.
  • 8 1
 @mikelevy you guys should interview the hard working trail crew at the Duncan Trail Sewardship Society. They have somehow managed to raise the Swu'qus (Prevost) trail network to a sanctionable level without changing the vibe of the mountain, which is an absolute miracle and something many trail societies seem to be incapable of.
  • 7 1
 Rule 1 - no Strava
Rule 2 - squirrel catchers at beginning and end - no intersections
Rule 3 - dont ride it in winter/rain season and mid / end of summer= blow out
Rule 4 - leave many natural obstacles - a loamer shouldn't look like A Line. A speed check is not a bad thing.
  • 10 1
 Build it sick, build it high, build it skinny.
  • 10 2
 I've never seen the attraction of skinnies, although I'll be honest that they don't form a big part of riding near me. Genuinely, what is the attraction of them?
I've never felt that they were fun (to me) plus the risk is high for that limited reward?
Genuine question before you think I'm being a (insert swear word)...
  • 5 0
 @slimboyjim: I find a good skinny is a reality gauge on how well you can focus on the task at hand, and being super aware of body position on the bike. I see them as a fun way to push myself mentally because once you've learned how it feels like right before ya crash then it's fairly simple to hop off or stop and reset.
  • 7 0
 @KolaPanda: in a addition to what you said, skinnies are the great equalizer. All the kashima and modern geo and wireless shifting in the world won’t meaningful make a difference on them.
  • 1 0
 Cheers! We used to have a skinny bear me that terrified me. Wasn't high, but went over a mini swamp! Probably around 5" wide and 8m long?
I cleaned it a few times but it was weird - I felt good for doing it, but zero desire to do it again. Ha ha!

The idea of doing any of the old school north shore woodwork is next level... I respect the skill, but that's just nuts!
  • 2 0
 Near, not bear... A skinny bear would probably be hungry and much worse...
  • 7 0
 "Some people have no problem with braiding, and I have no problem with trying to mess them up."
LOL
  • 2 1
 I thought he said breeding pisses him off..
(Too many puppies)
  • 1 2
 @Chonky13: Me too, was a little shocking to hear "I hate breeders!" In a trail building conversation.
  • 4 0
 #mikelevy I'd love to hear both the legal and illegal guests speak to how many illegally built trails have become legal. Also, building unsanctioned trails doesn't seem to negatively affect our access like one would think. Another good topic
  • 8 0
 @mikelevy When can we have an interview with your buddy Wayne?
  • 6 0
 Yup, one day I’ll get him on.
  • 1 0
 @mikelevy: plot twist: Jimmy is actually Wayne. That's why his voice is distorted.
  • 2 0
 @elsorichard: I had this exact thought.
  • 4 0
 Health and safety is the problem. I've literally (on Wednesday) just been on a trail inspection course and told I'm off the hill while a lot changes on the h&s and design side of things are made, for a decade we've been more or less free forming it, to the councils guidelines but under a different organisation, that organisation has folded so we'd be under the council fully, there needs to be a plan, a specification, only approved alterations after risk assessments, inspections need scheduling and recording, repairs recording, welfare facilities provided for volunteers (yeah, hot running water and a toilet while out in the countryside...) it's an absolute logistical nightmare that may well see me saying sod it and disappearing back into the woods from whence I came 10 years ago when I got involved with the official trails and became the Head volunteer. I don't want to, I enjoy the security of official trails, but if I'm gonna have minimal powers to change and improve, along with a mountain of paper work and days and days of my life given up to training courses, I'll just go scratch some single track in and build some single rock/fallen tree kickers.
  • 4 0
 @mikelevy Your buddy Wayne sounds suspiciously like Kramers friend Bob Sacamano from Seinfeld
“ He is never seen in any of the episodes, but through Cosmo Kramer's accounts, he is the source of bizarre anecdotes, and is known to frequently give esoteric information and harebrained ideas”
  • 3 0
 @mikelevy A podcast episode centering on what different levels of riders do for aux & off season fitness would be awesome. Pedaling is arguably only half the body after all, navigating body weight fitness vs weights vs machines like the rip row seems like there could be a good amount to talk about to meet riding focused goals. PB racing PT as a guest perhaps?
  • 11 0
 There's an off season?
  • 4 0
 @slimboyjim: I always wonder when someone says that as well. I only thought it was a differing tire width season. Studded tires and ice runs are so fun and the illegal trail melts away every spring.
  • 1 0
 @tiffe: @slimboyjim: Some people don't ride through the snow season. I would argue that injury counts as off season.
  • 2 0
 @pockets-the-coyote: It's all good bud - just messing! I wish I was lucky enough to have mountains and snow to have an off season... Round here the trails just get muddier, and the weather more minging!
Worst must be living somewhere super hot - that's harder to ride than the cold/wet... I'm sure there's a few months a year in places like Utah where you can't ride, unless night riding is your thing?
  • 3 0
 Good stuff @mikelevy . I always wonder why there isn’t more about trail building and everything on that side of the sport. No media seems to cover it really. The plight of local cycling clubs, politics around trail building, etc. There’s so much interesting stuff out there.
  • 3 0
 Absolutely love these kinds of podcasts on Pinkbike. Please do more of these. As a trail builder and member of my city's Conservation Commission, I totally get the frustration for getting trail projects approved in a timely manner. It is an imperfect system that can be impacted by a variety of factors including overlapping land ownership, EPA, archeological, and other regulatory hurdles that sometimes require additional sign-off (and the public meeting laws that sometimes require a public comment period). It generally takes two years to get something approved in my neck of the woods which is a strong argument by local builders for illegal trails. Sometimes it looks glacially slow because it is (waiting on a hearing or review by a governing body that only reviews requests a few times a year can be taxing). That all said, there is a reason that some of these rules are put in place in order to protect and conserve what may not be obvious to a trail builder. It also to make sure those trails that do go in, are well made and sustainable.
  • 4 0
 During the first minute of the pod, "Jimmy's" voice disguise was driving me nuts... by the end, I felt like performing some illegal activity! Love it!
  • 2 0
 This is me being unaware of the trail building network, Jimmy talked about scouting trails paths and trails first. How does he get paid, if an organization, state or county are not looking to out up something. Does he pitch it to them and then they approve funds? I understand the permitting side to everything but did not understand how money flows in these types of builds. Assuming there is no way a person gets money for building unsanctioned trail system? Sorry for the dumb question, maybe this is all volunteer and I am assuming they make money off this.
  • 2 0
 Braiding!! Pisses me off too. In my area, I'm pointing the finger at e bikers rather than strava monkeys. Holy Pail climb at Smith Creek in West Kelowna was built with some twists and turns to keep the motorbikes off. Over the past few years, these twists and turns are being eliminated with straight lines. Because ebikers can climb at quite a fast pace on HP, my feeling is they would rather straightline these spots as opposed to slowing down and maneuvering through. As fast as I block them off, they get opened again. Wish Jimmy had shared his secrets to shutting braids down.
  • 6 0
 F*kng legend!!!
  • 5 0
 One of my favorite episodes, thanks dudes
  • 1 0
 This episode made me think of a funny, tangently related anecdote. When I lived in quebec, around 2018 this huge fella got an e-fatbike with a thumb or wrist throttle (no pedalling). He’d ride mostly sitting down in green/blue trails all over the province and you could tell where he’d been as he’d leave a giant f*cking trench everywhere.

Probably not the sort of trail user people think about with the new e-bikes of today.
  • 1 0
 Things look like they are changing, in BC at least, where govt is becoming more willing to take on greater levels of risk. What's going to allow this is quality building (yay), regular inspections to determine quality of structures and lastly but probably most importantly (imo) signage. Good signage allows a trail or feature to be labeled from easy to pro and takes liability of the land owners/managers and puts responsibility onto the rider - where it should be.
  • 1 0
 lol have you seen the proposed new building standards? 4 10cm features (roots) in a meter is a black trail. They have every detail mapped out. No wiggle room.
  • 1 0
 @BrianColes: Yes I have seen the proposed standards. I don't think it matters what a trail gets labeled as, the promising part is that with proper signage it will allow better things to be built as the signage mitigates liability. So who cares if we think a Black Trail is really only a Blue, or that a Red or Pro-Line is really only a Black, the classification and signage will allow more cool things to get built.
  • 1 0
 I mean it’s a shame that were I live, in Madrid, every single trail is seen as illegal as us bikers aren’t allowed to go out of the gravel roads. And we have to ride with the fear of getting caught and fined and getting treated like criminals by pedestrians.

But the worst part is that the argument against us is that we ‘destroy’ the trails, but in fact we’re the community which is most willing to take care of these trails and make them better for everyone.
  • 3 0
 “Go find me some rocks….” that stirred up a memory or two from when I lived near, rode the North Shore Trails.
  • 3 0
 Had no idea Jesse “the body” Ventura was a trail builder. Great listen.
  • 4 0
 Brad Walton still on hold...
  • 2 0
 Not withstanding well build trails, roughed in steep fall line loamers are also amazing and memorable up until the influencers and strava show up.
  • 3 0
 Funny thing is here in PA 90% of illegal trails eventually get sanctioned into legal trills. Your welcome tax payers.
  • 2 1
 illegal trails are transitory to become legal trails but if you use an illegal to build it then it’s legal but the person holding the shovel is irrelevant because it’s the shovel that’s illegal in that case
  • 2 0
 Been listening this podcast while I was working on a line I was scoping for over a year. After a few years break in trail building felt good.
  • 1 0
 @mikelevy

Why when talking about cold weather riding gear are pogies/bar-mitts/etc never mentioned on pinkbike?
Are you in the pocket of "Big glove?" /s
They let me keep my hands warm without having to wear bulky gloves
  • 1 0
 I’ve ridden a few secret, illegal loam trails, so much fun but feel guilty knowing they will soon become a rutted, washed out eroded mess.
  • 2 0
 The voice - freakin hilarious Big Grin
  • 1 0
 Find a piece of forest.... Il imagine the way you Can shred it.....take your tools...dig dig dig.....ride it!
  • 2 0
 Jimmy? Jimi? Jimmi? Jimy?
  • 6 5
 All the best trails are illegal.
legal trails are too safe,and that’s not why we ride bikes.
  • 2 0
 Cool, so the builder is Jon from that adult swim show Delocated.
  • 2 0
 Hi Jimmy!
  • 1 0
 Jimmy's a real cool guy! That was a really good podcast!
  • 2 0
 Cheers to the pirates.
  • 1 0
 Lostboys!
  • 3 1
 No dig, no ride.
  • 3 2
 SAY IT LOUDER!
  • 1 0
 This was an awesome podcast. Dig on
  • 2 0
 Great interview
  • 1 0
 Thank you Pink Bike. Thank you Sir Jimmy Shred-A-Lot!
  • 1 0
 An interesting listen, thanks for another good podcast!
  • 2 0
 Great episode levy
  • 1 0
 Notice how so many ski hills no longer have half pipes?
  • 1 0
 "This is Peter McCallister. The Faaaather. I'm building a loamer."
  • 1 0
 Sounds like Jimmy builds rape dungeons
  • 1 1
 Wait, are you telling us to build illegal trails?
  • 1 0
 Fair but still
  • 1 0
 Getting to know ?
  • 1 0
 What a bunch of clahns
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