Unno's Slack XC Bike Might be the Future of XC

 And the people shopping for this frame wonder why anyone would waste there time with generic Chinese carbon. To each their own man, accept it and move on.

 And I bet you buy one-ply toilet paper.

 @VwHarman: at the end of the day if you think a carbon fiber bike missing a brand label is any better than the one labeled please share some of that stuff you are smoking with the rest of us.

 @stinkbikelies: better? nah about the same yes with an added headache if you need parts and no ablity to resale.

 China bikes are rad af! People who dont know are missing out

 @panzer103: you mean like santa cruz bikes?

 @panzer103: I'm with you I can break 10-15 Chinese frames for what one name brand frame cost me. As long as I don't get broke I'm all good. Save the fancy labels and brands for the knobs and the specialized boys. Everytime I try to deal with a warranty on a name brand item companies always find a way to backdoor you and get out of it anyways. Or you sit around 4 months and months while someone makes a decision if they will warranty it and then when they do your stuck with the color or something that you never even wanted in the first place. Like a 27-5 frame to replace a 26er. Suck a dirty dick greedy cycling industry.

 @Gregorysmithj1: vice versa Versa Visa same thing

 @Tr011: you mean Boutique bikes

 @stinkbikelies: santa cruz bikes are made in china

 @Tr011: isn't like 99% of all carbon products for the cycling industry made there with child labor shoveling the scraps into the ocean. Or did stinkbike tell us another lie?

 @stinkbikelies: I don’t give two shits, good bike is a good bike. Reread what I said. To each their own. I don’t even care about trends in bikes. If a bike makes the person who rides it happy, that’s a pretty decent bike.

Also, regarding what I’m smoking, I’m from BC, you don’t want to just dive into the shit we have up here rookie.

 @stinkbikelies: seriously, 10-15 broken bikes? What about the broken bones that come with all those failing frames while you ride???

I also would really like to know what name brands you are dealing with, pretty much any brand has a no question asked policy around these days...

 @michibretz: Have you ever seen or ridden a chinese open mould frame? Seriously, they ride great.

 @panzer103: No, I preferer products which have been thoroughly developed, tested in a lab and ridden on a trail before being put into production. Products that have quality control at the end of the production line.
You might think the generic frame is soo much cheaper because European and American companies like to rip of their customers however the truth it is its because they skip all the above, use the cheapest materials available and take every other shortcut they can find.

And No, the Chinese factories do not do that by themselves. They roll differently...
I work for almost 20 years as a developer for different companies in this industry and I can ensure you that barley any of these Chinese generic products fulfill western quality or safety standards.
Even the factories that produce for Western companies often do not use the same quality on their own house brand or unbranded products.
I have seen anything from died black glass fiber being sold as carbon to toxic resins and other chemicals being used because they are cheaper.

A lot of times these factories have multiped production lines, one that goes by the standards required by international customers. Environmental, Workplace safety and so on, as they get audited. And than another facility around the corner where they do all their dirty work for cheap.

A US company cant just import anything and sell it here. Products have to be tested for chemicals for example and that isn't cheap. Every product needs to be tested for its safety or the first person that crashes will sue them out of business.
On the other hand a Chinese e-bay, Alibaba or Amazon component has to do nothing as they are just sending over a single item...

Sure, not all of them are outright dangerous but the point is you never know.
You might not believe me which is also OK but I would personally never take the chances.

 @michibretz: You are ignorant of the industry would the largest distributor in the USA QBP be selling open mold carbon framesets under HELLER if they were not of good construction and quality? Chinese factories do not sell directly they have middlemen buy products for resale. Those middlemen are not going to sell you bad product. You seem to think the cycling industry is the airplane industry I assure you there is not some magical processes to ensure quality.

 @Gregorysmithj1:

QBP/Heller is a US company. Product they sell is not the same as generic China frames you can get for 300 bucks anywhere on eBay Alibaba or amazon.
Like any US Company they have to do their due diligence. They have people working with the factories, people like myself, that make sure what you get is not total crap and fulfils every standard to be imported to the US or the European Union.

Yes their frames/bikes are priced lower than other brands stuff but that's because their overhead is still lower. Its nowhere near the Generic China frame discussed here.
Stuff like this:

www.amazon.com/27-5er-Mountain-Bicycle-Compatible-14212mm/dp/B07JZZHPT9/ref=asc_df_B07JZZHPT9/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=312125954623&hvpos=1o1&hvnetw=g&hvrand=16211929717628444941&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9032090&hvtargid=pla-574552903892&psc=1&tag=&ref=&adgrpid=63589537658&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvadid=312125954623&hvpos=1o1&hvnetw=g&hvrand=16211929717628444941&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9032090&hvtargid=pla-574552903892

The reason their prices are better is they do not do Marketing and have race teams with sponsored athletes. And most of all they don't do extensive development work neither are they are they trying to innovate. Another way to offer cheaper product but still do marketing and development is to cut out the Shops. You know the guys that you expect to fix it for you if broke it...

Anyway, For an established Brand that's different. Take Specialized for example. For starters there is a team of engineers, about 10 of them who only work on mountain bikes and mountain bike specific components. There is an even bigger team for road including folks taht runs a wind tunnel some of them aerospace engineers that happen to be cycling enthusiasts and chose to work in this industry because its their passion even though the make less money than the would in aerospace.
Then there a group of people who build test mules for technology and geometry updates. They test every prototype that comes in from Asia and test them in the laboratory on machines they developed just to figure out if the product is any good. they test the first couple of frames out of every production run just to make sure they are on spec. They have a whole group of employees worldwide working on Compliance, meaning making sure everything is up to standards (anything from safety to environmental to Production Quality) They work with and at factories around the globe. There is outside labs that test every material that comes in contact with a human for chemicals known to be harmful to humans. You have to do that if you want to import and resell in the US and that isn't cheap.
Back in the day when I worked with them there was a good dozen or more graphic and industrial designers working at the big evil S and than you have product mangers, demand planning, sales, marketing, logistics, team managers and riders... all in all a couple of hundred of people working to ensure the customer get good stuff.
Yes its not aero industries, but why do you think so may people want specialized (or any other brand for that matter?
Because the brands build a reputation, they invest into marketing and development in the US or in Europe. All these people need to be payed and that's what you pay for with a brand frame.

You are right its not a magical process, its a process that requires hard work by skilled and educated employees and entrepreneurs who want to earn a good living like everyone else and that's what you pay for... I am not ignorant, I am one of them...

 @michibretz: yes those frames are open molds. They are readily available on eBay. Less talk more education.

 @michibretz: can is not did. Maybe have a comprehension reread.

 @michibretz: if you broken carbon Parts in the past you know that they usually is crack and fracture. I have cracked or fractured multiple carbon hoops. Cracked and fractured multiple crack and fail Cannondale frames. Fractured and cracked multiple carbon handlebars. To this day I have never had a carbon fiber part break into two pieces with the exception of a seatpost. Which at the end of the day actually folded over against the rear tire and when was lifted back up ended into pieces. Rider error overextended post.

 @Gregorysmithj1: which one are you talking about?
the 1250 Dollar Qbp or the 250 Dollar amazon version?

I simply tried to explain where the difference in price between China Generic (amazon/Alibaba/ebay), Imported and distributed (QBP/Heller) and US developed frames made in far east (Spesch, Trek, Yeti, YT and almost any other company) comes from but if that's too much talk for you that's a bummer.

 @michibretz: heller is open mold. I have the same frame heller sells off eBay. You really could figure this stuff out with a 5 minute google search but I guess it's finest to treat everyone stupid.

 @Gregorysmithj1: How exactly I did treat everyone as stupid by trying to shed light on why a Company has cost related to importing a product to the US or Europe and therefore has to charge more for the same product?