You can test in private all you want, but nothing simulates racing like, er, racing. Past years have seen the New Zealand National series be the ideal place for racers to test their fresh bikes against the clock before the World Cup season kicks off later in the year, and 2018 is no different. In fact, last time this year, Pinkbike photographer
Cameron Mackenzie spotted a revised version of the Fury that used an altered shock angle to add in more progression. This was so Wyn and Brook could use a coil-sprung Fox shock on more courses.
'Eagle Eye Cam' is at it again, it seems, as he's sniped photos of yet another GT prototype under Wyn Masters. This one, however, is an entirely new beast compared to the Fury - everything is different. We have precisely zero information about the unnamed carbon fiber bike, and Wyn was understandably doing his best to avoid Cam's questions, but the upside is that leaves us to speculate. My favorite hobby.
GT's I-Drive system is nowhere to be seen, with a more conventional four-bar layout (plus an idler pulley) used instead.
Wyn's old ride, pictured to the right, is a single-pivot, 210mm-travel machine that employed GT's floating bottom bracket and dog bone link I-Drive system. GT has used different versions of their I-Drive design on all of their high-end full-suspension mountain bikes over the years... until now.
Best I can tell, Wyn's new bike ditches I-Drive for a more conventional four-bar, Horst Link system with the twist of an idler pulley at the main pivot.
Why an idler? Well, the main pivot is quite high and, without an idler to route the chain up and over it, the suspension would firm up considerably under drivetrain loads.
Many shorter travel bikes use this to their advantage to feel efficient under power (otherwise known as anti-squat), but downhill bikes live in a very different world where traction and suspension action trumps everything else.
Routing the chain up and around the main pivot allows the suspension action to be largely isolated from pedaling forces.
Also notable is the frame material - the stout looking front is a carbon job, while the rear end is aluminum. You might remember that the first generation Fury was carbon front to back, while the second gen was aluminum. It looks like GT is going back to carbon for their downhill bike, however.
The rear-end could also only be aluminum on Wyn's bike while they tinker with different suspension geometries, with the production version possibly being a full-carbon frame. That's just a guess, though.
We're debating whether or not it's rolling on 29'' wheels; it's hard to tell in these photos. The larger wheel size would, in itself, makes sense, but the tall lower headset cup hints that the bike might be able to run more than one wheel size, so we might see GT's racers on both options in 2018. That doesn't mean the production version will sport the same feature, of course.
There's no word on suspension travel, but I wouldn't be surprised to learn that it's somewhere between 180mm and 200mm when on big wheels.
What else can you make out from the photos of Wyn's prototype DH bike?
just sayin...
static.evanscycles.com/production/bikes/mountain-bikes/product-image/969-638/ghost-dh-9000-2012-mountain-bike-EV158747-9999-1.jpg
Surly pull shocks and the tech we have these days are due for a comeback ? And open up another realm of suspension designs
All MX are pretty much the same because thats where evolution have led them.
Makers are starting to get geo really sorted and at this point you are asking them to be different just because.
To my eye theres not much difference between a Honda and a Kawasaki
Am i wrong?
But yeah it looks horrible its a Norco, Rocky Mountain, Trek everything hybrid with a front triangle that looks as if it was picked from one of those catalogues you at a bike trade show in Asia.
forums.mtbr.com/attachments/downhill-freeride/555085d1278725875-2000-kona-stab-primo-worth-buying-stabprimo.jpg
@Smallbright:
I-Drive came out in 1999, it wasn’t that good back then!
To do so would effect the small bump. There is no free lunch. The best option is to learn how to pedal.
You do know the VPP patent has expired don't you? Just look at how many manufacturers are rushing to use it... In fact SC has been jumping through hoops for years to try and get close to overall Horst-linked 4-bar kinematic characteristics.
Spend some time on linkage and learn what fundamentals are intrinsic to designs.
As I said, do you deal with that or or you learn how to pedal a bike with a more independent suspension kinematic?
BTW, current EWS men's champ, Men's DH World Cup and World Champ all use Horst-Linked 4-bars. What design did Canyon and YT choose? When the FSR patent expired why did Scott and Norco start using it?
Again, spend some time looking into the kinematics of various designs and you'll see why.
Pretty convieniend that you completely ignore the hordes of vpp clones out there @jclnv:
www.bikeradar.com/gear/article/buyers-guide-to-mountain-bike-suspension-part-2-28438
them@jclnv:
Here's a little project for you. Find a picture of a dual link frame like a DW, now imagine the rearward pivot of the lower link was near the dropout. Tell me what design you see.
Hopefully now you'll understand how different designs can have very similar kinematics.
Peace out@jclnv:
Seriously, avoid the marketing and do some reading.
"We're debating whether or not it's rolling on 29'' wheels; it's hard to tell in these photos. The larger wheel size would, in itself, makes sense, but the tall lower headset cup hints that the bike might be able to run more than one wheel size, so we might see GT's racers on both options in 2018."
How often do you see professional riders wrenching?
Unfortunately in my inebriated state I didn't spell check myself and could not edit after I posted....now, having to explain, all humour is lost, and my reputation is in tatters.
Utterly unintentional as it was, I admit it did look in pretty bad taste. All apologies
I liked the one they did for Rachel in the turquoise flake paint job. Love a metallic flake.
I do know who designed it, but I've been sworn to secrecy.
And it wasn't Austin Powers!
Toobad the information you have is useless, unless it really is Austin Powers!
Except... that's not actually the point the wheel is pivoting around. This is a 4-bar horst link... thus...it has a virtual pivot point at the point in space that the lower and upper link pivot paths... come together.
I like how they state that this will mean the design doesn't have decent anti squat too, in actual fact it could have over 100% throughout the travel (changing obviously throughout) - the difference here is you won't get huge pedal kickback as a result.
It's a similar system to the antidote dark matter if you ignore the shock linkage.
Funny how bikes are getting better at dealing with properly rough stuff just as tracks are getting less rough though.....
Higher pivots 'naturally' have high levels of anti squat too - I imagine at least comparable to any other 'good' bike.
I think the reason more manufacturers don't employ designs like this is fear of alienating the target market but as DH becomes more niche and specialist I think its allowing more design freedom, especially with Norco, Commencal and Antidote having similar designs (at least visually).
But yes - I do think we're seeing a reemergence of idler systems as consumers' expectations of a downhill bike become more realistic. I also wonder if frame designers were influenced in Aaron Gwin's winning chinless run; realizing that a win isn't dependent on your ability to pedal.
Its anti squat.. just done without the need for chain tension.
Make it under $4K. Spec it well, make a full alloy frame, put some threads in the B.B.
Take my money.
www.vitalmtb.com/photos/features/2017-Fort-William-World-Cup-Pit-Bits,11068/Prototype-GT-Fury-for-Wyn-Masters,115611/iceman2058,94
#Sessionception
Gt proto (duh)
commencal
Norco proto
Who am I missing here?
Wonder if they are onto something?
in the side on view BB definitelly looks to be above the wheel axle height.
Assuming 27.5 wheels and 2.5" tyres that puts the wheel axles at at least 350mm or 13.8"
Not what i'd call insanely low. infact. fairly average for a WC DH bike
The bb is about 1.5 inches below the axle line...
BBs getting super low again would be a welcome respite from wheelbase/reach willy waving.
Also after years of trying to tell us idrive was superior.
Anyone who rode a Lobo/STS DS back to back with the idrive that replaced them could tell you the old horst link was superior.
Now nearly 20 years later we're back where we started, and all the while people go on and on about how suspension design gas come on such a long way over the last few years.
... not saying it hasn't, santa cruz,yeti and the pivot/ibis implementation of dw link are all progress, but I still don't think they're revolutionary.
So gearboxes, right? Why isn't that the case?
^^*)
Eat my roost PB haters!
It's bound to look like a bike, it is one
If you want to look at something pretty and rideable look at Robyn Lawley
Shit people get over with the looks, it won't get you any faster down the track
Ahh my eyes feel hurt..
Looks like an Aborted Session.
The question is, will this 29er wheelie wednesday ?