Review: Enve’s M735E Wheelset Fails Our Test

Feb 13, 2019 at 6:58
by Paul Aston  
Enve E Wheels


Enve started producing carbon rims back in 2009, and by 2010 had produced the first carbon wheelsets to be ridden to victory in a UCI World Cup DH race, under the Santa Cruz Syndicate. Since then, they have been continually improving their products while still manufacturing in the USA. These M735E wheels are their eMTB specific enduro wheels from the latest M-ranges that use the new patented and 'un-pinchable' Protective Rim Strip (PRS).

Like all Enve products, these wheels are about as far from cheap as you can get, but the Utah-based brand prides itself on in-house development and production from the start to finish of the product cycle. They are also proud of the fact that their wheelsets essentially cost the same as they did 10-years ago when they started. The 29" x 35mm internal rim-width wheelset isn't particularly light at 2087g (Enve's website quotes 2,218g) for the pair and the whopping price tag of $3,080 USD.

Enve M735E Wheel Details
• 27.5" or 29" (tested) options
• Carbon rims, 35mm internal width
• Protective Rim Strip
• 32 spokes / 2 cross lace pattern
• Chris King hubs
• Sapim CX-Ray bladed J-bend spokes
• Made in Utah, USA
• Weight: 966g front, 1121g rear, 2087g pair (29", Chris King hubs, Protective Rim Strip and valves, actual)
• MSRP: $3,080 USD
www.enve.com


Enve E Wheels
Enve E Wheels
The hookless carbon rims have an internal width of 35mm, and arrive with the protective rim strip and tubeless valve stems included.

Enve E Wheels
Enve E Wheels
Chris King's hubs give that distinctive buzz and use 72 points of engagement.


Performance

Judging the on-trail performance of these wheels was tough, as the following saga unfolded throughout the testing period. Initially, I started by using the front wheel on my hybrid setup on the Specialized Turbo Kenevo, I had great success and liked the more accurate feel of the stiffer front wheel and smaller volume tire combined with the softer rear wheel and fatter plus-tire, which gave great cornering characteristics.

I completed two runs of the classic Ingenere trail in Finale Ligure, which is about 6km in total, marked as a blue run on Trailforks, but still has a few brutal rock sections that can eat a wheel or shred a tire quickly – these rides that totalled about 30km with the climbing, and a couple of other short trail sections may have damaged the rim and I had not noticed. The third ride was under a secondary test pilot and local pinner, Federico Greppi, who hit a small fly off for a photo shoot, he was greeted upon landing with a complete front wheel failure: the rim snapped, the front tire lost all its air and he crashed before he could stop – thankfully he was OK.

Enve sent a new replacement rim from the US and it was built up by a local shop mechanic. I added the PRS to the wheel myself and was subsequently stabbed in the finger by a carbon fiber that was protruding from the outside edge of the rim. On closer inspection, there were a number of similar strands of fiber sticking out. I spoke to Jake Pantone, head of Enve's VP Product and Consumer Experience, who explained this could have been due to one of three reasons that are now impossible to point a finger at: this rim was either missed by quality control, damaged in the post or during building, or struck a hard surface without the PRS installed. The PRS also split when removing the valve stem from the original rim and had to be patched with tape for a reliable seal.

Enve E Wheels
Enve E Wheels
The rim on the left failed on the front wheel, and on the right was the rear failure after no more than 50kms on each wheel


With a new front wheel built, I fitted the wheelset to the Mondraker e-Level R (review coming soon) and managed 35kms of riding with no issue. The Mondraker had previously felt a little vague, and the stiffer Enve wheelset did sharpen up the handling and response, and during that ride the bike was plowed into plenty of rocks which don't make the nicest sound when they connected with the high-volume carbon rim. One of those rock strikes could have caused a crack, and on the following ride was the second catastrophic failure. This time was on another classic trail called Dolmen which is a rocky brute, but it's a trail I have done many runs on many variations of bike and wheel sans issue. Without warning, there was another huge crack which resulted in a near-instant loss of pressure in the rear tire which then also came off the rim with the PRS.

So this is starting to sound really, really, bad at this point, but we are not quite finished. Another replacement rim was sent from Enve, and it passed the 'are there any sharp, stabby bits of carbon fiber sticking out visual test' which gave me enough confidence to run my finger over it without any problems. But, there was one annoying piece of something rattling around the inside the rim which I couldn't get out. The spoke holes weren't drilled out centrally, and there were more loose fiber strands in each spoke hole - whether or not this would make any difference to the ride or not is hard to say, but at this point, I was done.

It might only be tiny but this damage on the new rim put a carbon splinter in my finger.
It might only be tiny, but this damage on the first replacement rim put a carbon splinter in my finger.
The rim in the bottom of the picture arrived with the spoke holes not perfectly aligned in the centre of the rim and had fibres sticking out.
The second replacement rim in the bottom of the picture arrived with the spoke holes not perfectly aligned in the center of the rim, and had fibers sticking out.


Thoughts

I have lots of opinion on carbon fiber parts, and I understand many people have absolutely no problems using Enve wheelsets and other carbon products. I rarely choose to use carbon wheels, but these two failures added to two other catastrophic failures I have had with carbon wheels in the past.

I understand the price can be justified by Enve and their US-manufacturing and testing methods, but at this price, I would expect every product to be perfect. These failures were dangerous and should never happen in such a short period of time. It could have been two instances of bad luck, but both times they were on trails I ride often, with similar bikes and pressures I was using in other test scenarios. I was also riding my usual speed and style, which rarely does a similar amount of damage.


Enve E Wheels


Enve's Response
bigquotesThank you Paul for giving us the opportunity to comment on this experience.

I believe in owning the mistakes that were made on ENVE’s end and would like to clarify or add a different point of view to some of the claims or statements that were made in this review.

First, there is this concept around perfection that consistently comes up whenever anything goes wrong with an ENVE product based on the price of our products. Let’s be clear, perfection is a myth. For ENVE, it’s certainly the goal, but we’ve never pinned a label on ourselves claiming we are perfect. Quite the contrary, we strive daily to be better in all aspects, but it’s a journey and we don’t mask the imperfections of our products behind a façade of filler and paint. That said, it puts that much more responsibility on our QC teams who are people and sometimes people make mistakes. Should Paul have received a rim with a fiber peel and imperfectly drilled spoke holes? Absolutely not. When we screw up, we own it and take care of the customer no questions asked. It is ENVE’s long-standing warranty and leading reputation for customer support that has forced the carbon wheel market to offer the aggressive lifetime warranties that they do today.

There is this idea that if a product is damaged or breaks within a certain distance, it is worse than a product that breaks or wears out eventually. Carbon doesn’t fatigue. If you break one product on your first ride, and another on its 10th or 100th ride it doesn’t always mean the product that broke earlier was inferior. You can drive a new car off a lot and wreck it the first time you pull out onto the street. What is in play here is that the testers for this E-MTB specific spec M735 have exceeded the abilities of the product, but this is not the experience that our customers are having. My next step for Paul would have been to upgrade him to an M9 Series wheel, which is what our World Cup DH teams race on. Do we have some additional work to do in terms of meeting the demands of rider’s like Paul on E-MTBs? Yes, and ENVE is committed to being the best. While this product didn’t pass his test, it is pushing the limits to improve performance and range for E-MTB riders. Regarding the non-E-MTB application of our M7 wheel family, our protective rim strip technology is amazing. If not careful when installing a strip, you can tear it, but it provides unprecedented protection and with its introduction warranty rates between our old M70 and the new M7 Series have been reduced from just over 3% to 1%.

Finally, price. The wheelset in question for this review is a specific build using Chris King hubs. The Chris King hub is spec’d for the E-MTB build because it passes all the durability/reliability requirements for use with E-MTB. These hubs are not inexpensive and drive the cost of the wheelset to where it is. We are looking for ways to make ENVE wheelsets more accessible to more people. As proof, you can see that with the launch of I9 hubs to our M Series offering, we’ve been able to lower the MSRP of an ENVE M Series wheelset to $2550 which is nearly a 10% reduction from what we’ve had to charge in the past.

Thanks again Paul and Pinkbike for letting us share our thoughts.
Jake Pantone, VP Product and Consumer Experience



Pinkbike's Take
bigquotesAt double the price of a high-end alloy wheelset, the Enve M735 wheelset did not deliver anything better. Due to the multiple breaks and other minor issues I'm unable to recommend this wheelset, especially if your local trails tend to be rough and rocky. Paul Aston







754 Comments

  • + 906
 Wow. Brutal.
  • + 691
 Right? Rare to find a review not praising every single product. Thanks for the honesty pb!
  • + 317
 Brilliant! Made me laugh! And Enve’s response for piss poor quality was... nothing! Plus the cost issue got passed to Chris King. Who do make decent products, passing the buck to the only people they can rely on! Well done Enve!!!!
  • + 28
 Well we have a list now! Look forward to a future reviews..
For now:
1. Bontrager
2. Enve
3. ______
  • + 130
 @cunning-linguist: Major dick move buck passing to Chris King.

Enve rims are routinely very premium prices and these are utter garbage.

Nothing but piss poor excuses totally undeserving of a brand that demands the price point they do.
  • + 233
 DT Swiss stocks just went up
  • + 31
 Weird that they would pass all their testing with the Syndicate boys. Although, they don't use them anymore either...
  • + 44
 Save your money, folks.
  • + 207
 This clearly shows how stupid is to think that US or EU made product is superior to one made in China/Taiwan. The same goes with alu welding.
  • + 23
 @pakleni: Why Bontrager? Those are maybe not the best wheels on the market, but they do the job and are quite affordable in comparison to other carbon wheels.
  • + 197
 @Otago: DT Swiss survived a race run from Aaron Gwin with no tire. *Enve cant survive the weekend warrior who hits the only rock on a flow trail.
*according to multiple sources on multiple forums in multiple countries.
  • + 11
 But honest which i greatly appreciate cause I know I don't want to spend the cost of a nice Hardtail on a wheelset that could help me rearrange my facial features...
  • + 0
 @Boardlife69: i can see your point but i am not sure if i would like to survive like that.
  • + 115
 ...............meanwhile gwin rode down leogang on a 80 euro ex471 rim without a tyre.
  • + 14
 @jurassicrider: I believe another MTB review site had an issue with the Line Pros. I've ran them on numerous bikes without issue, though and believe they're an excellent value.
  • + 125
 Not lighter than "regular" wheels
Way more expensive
Quality seems fishy
Breaks on first ride

What else could you ask for?
  • + 72
 @lkubica: looking at the photos they look like junk compared to my Chinese LB rims, which are still totally fine and I had more cases than a lawyer.
  • + 45
 I have a set of enve’s on my road bike. After aprox 2 years the rear developed a “blister” in the brake track. Enve replaced it and the front wheel (so that the’d match), to newest tech on the same rim size, no hassles. For me, they turned a bad situation into a positive one.
  • + 2
 @pakleni: Okay haha, maybe they don't do the job after all....
  • + 37
 "...M735E wheels are their eMTB specific enduro wheels" What the hell does that even mean? Enduro is a race format. Are they allowing e-bikes in enduro races now? Is there an e-bike enduro series I'm not aware of?
  • + 7
 @smithcreek: yes there is e enduro series for 2019
  • + 27
 @Mondbiker: Really? You learn something new every day. A format that already doesn't time the part where you go up the hill was still too much work for some people? Enduro is a great format because of the pedaling, not despite it.
  • + 12
 @smithcreek: Newsflash, the one where they time you on the up hills aswell is called xc.
  • + 15
 @smithcreek: it means they should be stonger than their Enduro rims, to compensate for the extra 15 lbs of an e-bike. The wheelset weighs more than a Stan's Flow wheelset, so theoretically the rims should be beefier.
  • + 19
 @lkubica: Plastic rims crack period. By all makers, it doesn't matter where they are made. The biggest difference is the very strict clean up procedures that the USA has for Carbon and the leftovers from making it. Not to mention pay and working conditions if that is your thing...
  • + 5
 @smithcreek: Enduro is also a category of bike roughly ranging from 150-180mm of travel so they probably designed these with a 150-180mm travel e-bike in mind
  • + 13
 @Thustlewhumber: would you be surprised to hear that the Syndicate weren't running stock wheels or that they were actually having breakages that were just never exposed to the public...

I'm pretty sure the final nail in the coffin of the 2017 season for Greg Minaaar was due to a wheel failure?
  • + 12
 @downhillnews: It does matter who makes them though. Look at this crap, they look like made by someone who really had not enough skills/tools to make one. Then it was examined by a qc technician with comparable "skillset". Pay and working conditions are relative. You don't think that carbon rims in Taiwan are made by poor children for a bowl of rice, do you? I bet someone who can make them gets enough money to live a good life in Taiwan.
  • + 13
 Like aluminum rims, not all carbon rims are equal.
  • + 130
 ***Runs into garage, hugs dented aluminum rims, goes back to bed, sleeps like a baby***
  • + 6
 @Boardlife69: This quote should be published in the history book of mountain biking. Shown right next to that censored pinkbike review photo.
  • + 85
 So Paul has destroyed a set of carbon rims and a series of shock bolts ranging from weenie to heavy duty steel, in his last couple of reviews. Hats off to you sir, you are a warranty departments nightmare.
  • + 6
 @kipvr: I had a set of m90s on my Wilson that had a quarter size rock jump up and pierce a hole in the sidewall on like my 2nd ride. The light bike wheels I had after that lasted perfectly until I sold the bike a year later.
  • + 8
 Now if only this was a review for non ebike part...
  • + 27
 Ridiculous. Priced at almost the cost of a whole entry level bike and it failed. They sent a replacement rim and that one had manufacturing and QC failures. Then a response is sent that didn’t really address the issues and, to be quite honest, sounded a bit dismissive.
  • + 8
 @jurassicrider: Reynolds are also just as affordable in some instances and are made in house in the US.
  • + 60
 @downhillnews: That's a Load of BS man! Hand laid CANADIAN hoops from We Are One composites Blows Enve quality, ride and PRICE out of the water!

ENVE.. YOUR DAYS ARE DWINDLING AS BENCHMARK AND PINNACLE OF CARBON.... Always over priced, sh!t ride and pricing thats is criminal! Move over there are new better cheaper nicer quality rims out there!
  • + 17
 @icdesign: and rumour has it that WR1 will be making bars and stems soon. As an owner of a set of Agents, I can only assume these parts will be an unbelievable value too.

Goodbye and good riddance, enve.
  • + 30
 @freerabbit: Paying almost 2,000 dollars just to show off huge logo stickers that comedically give away that the wheels are made to cater to a persons ego, not the quality of their ride?
  • + 1
 @pakleni: Bontrager??? which wheels?
  • + 21
 @kipvr: "I had more cases than a lawyer" This quote alone deserves more upvotes than just about everything here.
  • + 1
 @gfmullet80: i posted a link above
  • - 5
flag The-Wheel (Feb 28, 2019 at 7:25) (Below Threshold)
 Stop injuring my credibility
  • + 17
 @lkubica: What is also ridiculous is the justification for the high cost for '' Made in America'', when America isn't exactly known for it's staggeringly high wages. Those spoke holes look like they were drilled by a kid making $7.25. an hour who was in a hurry to get home so he would'nt miss the season finale of Survivor.
  • + 4
 @smithcreek: yeah sorry but you lost the "enduro is a format not a category of bike" argument about 2 years ago...
  • + 1
 @Thustlewhumber: I think the Syndicate was running on the older wheels. Maybe these weren't made by the same people that made theirs. I think ENVE was acquired by Amersports after Syndicate quit using them.
  • + 3
 @WayneParsons: you may be biased Wink
  • + 1
 @smithcreek: usually they add an uphill stage for the eMTB riders from what I've heard
  • + 22
 It's funny you know envy are reading this and don't have the balls to respond.
  • + 28
 Still no issues with my Stan's Flow MK3 rims on either of my bikes and I smash into rock gardens in Colorado constantly with no rim strips. I'm 5'11, 210 pounds. ENVE recommends M930 downhill rims at 629 grams per rim in 27.5 and 672 grams for 29 inch rims to avoid cracking rims... Stan's Flow MK3 are 480 grams for 27.5 and 527 grams for 29. Kyle Strait, Cam Zink, and Reed Boggs send them off massive cliffs in Red Bull Rampage without breaking. A fool and his money are soon parted.
  • + 8
 Also envy say they have a 1-3% failure rate which is B's.
I have read multiple reviews where they have failed.
I wonder what is the failure rate on the rims that are being ridden for intended purpose and not hanging on the wall of a four car garage.
  • + 24
 Santa Cruz Reserve carbon wheels FTW
  • + 3
 @hardtailsshred: I think they only make the RZR in US.
  • + 8
 @lkubica:

150+ rides on my "china-direct" $200 carbon rims and they are flipping rockstars! Even under my 200+ pound voluptuous arse and after tons of cased jumps/drops. I do run Huck Norris inserts however and ~1000g tires.

It's been good to watch a local company grow over the years but I just don't see any value whatsoever to the customer in their wheels over WAO or SC Reserve which have a $1500 pricepoint and lifetime warranty. Or those like me that build a carbon set around the $1000 mark and get to customize the sh*t out of them (rim weight, width, hole count, spokes, nips, hubs).
  • - 27
flag reed1 (Feb 28, 2019 at 8:44) (Below Threshold)
 Harsh review! Your E Bike weighs too much! The new M730 have been bomb proof for me. Best wheel I have owned!
  • + 17
 @PocoBoho: noticed a dent in my rim last weekend, took the tire off, bent it back into place with an adjustable crescent wrench, and mounted the tire back on with no issue. Expensive rims, though. Had to fork out $90 per!
  • + 1
 @DJ-24: For the win.
  • + 5
 @WasatchEnduro: I agree with you not all rims are made equal regardless of the material. It’s just that EX471 are almost as light as according carbon rims, just as tough if not tougher and cost almost half of cheapest carbon rim.
  • + 23
 One thing missing from this review... tire pressure... curious to know.
  • + 0
 @DaveT1974: ...at the expense of the environment.
  • + 1
 @WAKIdesigns: I've had very good experience with 2015 XM1501s, which use the XM401 rim. They came stock on Giant's Reign.

@lkubica: "This clearly shows how stupid is to think that US or EU made product is superior to one made in China/Taiwan. The same goes with alu welding."
It might not be superior. But it should be in this industry due to the price difference. There is no other factor, in my opinion, that could justify the price difference.
  • - 16
flag trails801 (Feb 28, 2019 at 9:27) (Below Threshold)
 Why are we even looking at Emtb wheels on ebikes? Everyone here is thinking mountain bike analog and pushing this hit piece on mountain bikers. "FAKE NEWS" I enjoy the reviews like everyone but your readers aren't making the differentiation and it's making this a mountain bike problem when it's an E-BIKE problem.
Face it if everyone took their setup as they normally ride it and added 30# to it and then hucked it. No one is doing the math an e-bike is approx. 30# heavier from 4 feet lands with an approximate force of 6,000 lbs. additional to your standard setup.

We are comparing apples and oranges.
  • + 20
 Perfection is a myth? ENVE, what are you charging for then?
  • + 23
 @trails801: Not at all. E-bike rims are supposed to be even MORE durable than mountain bike rims due to the increased weight and forces exerted. They are heavier than the standard rims. Also, ENVE themselves then recommended he run MTB DOWNHILL rims on his E-bike to avoid breaking them. It's far from FAKE NEWS and I wish people would remove those 2 words from their vocabulary. Something isn't fake just because you disagree with it. It happened, there are pictures. I bet he rides his normal mountain bike even harder, and on gnarlier trails. He specifically mentioned he was on blue trails. I commend Pinkbike for posting an informative, negative review, that doesn't sound like regurgitated marketing speak from a bike brand. It's refreshing in its honesty. Then people like you want to come in and bash it.
  • + 0
 @lkubica: Depends on who you've got welding bud. The US aluminum manufactures don't want to pay for quality welders. In China/Taiwan the labor is cheap and good welders are a dime a dozen. You get what you pay for.
  • + 7
 @icdesign:
Well said. Wr1 is the only set I would buy.
  • + 8
 I dont see any Enve ads on the side of PB
  • + 2
 @Primoz: I know good strong riders who are using DT EX471 and 511 rims, even XM841 for years, and they trash them into serious stuff from Malaga to Åre and everything in between.
  • + 0
 @trails801: except everything on an E-bije has to be stronger than “analog” Smile
  • + 2
 @WAKIdesigns: I love my 511s and they love me back. With Onyx USA hubs I never think about the wheels.
  • + 1
 @trails801: Pretty sure this aluminum rim was exposed to way more force than this E-bike was put through. Just saying.

www.notubes.com/wp/wp-content/uploads/2018/12/small-no-hands-jump-746x420.jpg

The Specialized Turbo Kenevo he was riding also has 180mm of travel to absorb impacts.
  • + 10
 @kipvr: Yeah, I am 260lbs and been running my LB rims laced to CK hubs for about 5 years now with no issues!
  • + 3
 Brings back the memory of the last time I read a bike mag very rare thing to do I know.
But anyway there was a full 2 page layout fear mongering open mold Chinese products.
I have had multiple frames bars seatposts and 2 wheelsets all perform well.

That being said my Intense and my Derby/King wheelset are built better.

Particularly the Derby rims seem to have a more durable plastic/rubber quality to the outside layer that will absorb blows and actually dent.
Whereas the chinese rims i had would chip and flake a little more.
I did crack the rear rim on both Chinese wheelsets both on curbs which is my fault.
  • + 8
 Yea, can only praise PB honesty,and shudder at Enves QC ...
  • + 3
 @hardtailsshred: Reynolds' carbon rims are made in China
  • + 4
 @pakleni: I'll put nox in front both of those!
  • + 16
 @jjhobbs: QC? It would be QC if one rim was crap. But most of them are. That's a general production problem. Considering they are some of the most expensive bike products out there, this is a joke. When Light Bicycle rim with Enve decal from Slik graphics is a better product than the original, you know you are fkd. This is not the first time Pinkbike journalist breaks an Enve rim, I know of at least 6 broken in my town, off the record stories of sponsored athletes asking for at least 2 rims per each replacement, just in case (after they went through 5...), Raoul Luescher cutting them through and finding voids. Enve is a scam. Their high price is a marketing strategy.
  • + 1
 @WAKIdesigns: your reply leaves me enve iuos...
  • + 4
 @jurassicrider: my carbon bontrager rim on my road bike delaminated from heat generated by brakes. Obvious manufacturing defect. They refused to replace and told me it was crash damage. Never buying from them again
  • + 8
 @kipvr: Totally agree. I've cased my LB wheel on 40+ foot gaps and thought for sure it was done, but nope. The only time I've broken one is when I backed up over it with my truck.
  • + 6
 I like that: Enve is a scam. Their higher price is a marketing strategy. @WAKIdesigns:
  • + 14
 @scoobydoo666: I am the Alex Jones of MTB World
  • + 1
 @pakleni: Yeah saw that. Thanks
  • + 1
 Remember Rudhy EWS run with his Bontragee Frankenstein wheel? That poor wheel set looked as if it was made from ceramic. racing.trekbikes.com/stories/tfr-enduro/keep-it-rolling-how-cunninghams-trashed-wheel-made-it-through-ews-ainsa @jurassicrider:
  • - 1
 @BaeckerX1: Second that! Also 6’ 215lbs on MK3 Flows built by Chris King. Not a single issue out of them in 2 years, not even re-tensioning. Carbon just can’t take the acute impacts that metal can.
  • + 4
 @trails801: uh. So how is a bike weighing 30 lbs more any different than a rider who weighs 30lbs more than you?

It's not apples to oranges at all. And please post the math where you came up with a "force of 6000 lbs"... Lol
  • + 7
 @kipvr Yep I’ve a pair of LB 728ENs Took them on a weeks downhilling in rocky Gran Canaria and they came back with some scratches but otherwise no damage, the year before riding the same trails I severely dented a WTB i25. I was a bit scared of killing an expensive pair of ($750) LB rims on DT350 hub wheels but the more you read about carbon rims the more you find the ones that break are Enve’s, other cheaper ones don’t seem so bad. Being honest though I also have a pair of DT EX471 on the same 350 hubs and the pair is only 120g heavier and they ride just as well, maybe a bit more forgiving, less harsh... they maybe better overall for longer days riding.
  • + 2
 Rumor has it that the author is going to work at WeAreOne in a couple of days... conspiracy?
  • + 1
 @Thustlewhumber: hope they not ruin the season of commencal team now
  • + 0
 @Boardlife69: once the tire went the speed went and the impacts where much lower than normal. I'd expect most rims to hold together enough to get to the bottom after that. No big deal
  • + 9
 @projectnortheast: Agreed on tire pressure. Paul is known to run pretty low pressures. In my experience, you need to be running close to downhill pressures on an e-bike because of the extra weight. Might not change anything, but would be relevant and interesting to know. @paulaston
  • + 3
 @pakleni: We already know that Santa Cruz rims past a torture test because they made a video Wink
  • + 1
 @Otago: yes! and MAVIC systems also!
  • + 3
 @freerabbit: A refund and medical bill coverage?
  • + 2
 @freerabbit: A refund, and medical bill coverage.
  • + 2
 wow now think of this kind of 'quality' in their handlebars.....
  • + 1
 @leviatanouroboro: what was the censored review? I'm intrigued!
  • + 6
 @Rance: m.pinkbike.com/news/Enve-Composites-DH-Wheels-Tested-2013.html

Scroll down to the first comments replys as the product tester responds about how he suffered serious injury after a catastrophic failure of the back wheel. He posted photos of the aftermath to be included in the review, but they were cut out by pinkbike/enve.
  • + 1
 @fpmd: I had a set of the LB carbon DH wheels (26). They lasted about half a year before one cracked. Luckily it did not catastrophically fail on me. They were stiff though and I liked the feel of them.

Having been through many injuries, I don't trust carbon wheels for DH application. Not one from any company. There is no yield with carbon. Is either they're ok or they've ultimately failed, and fast. That could be bad.

They may be suitable for XC, but personally I'll stick with Al. Would rather have it yield before failing so I can replace and avoid serious injury. Same reason I don't trust carbon bars (I've run those too)
  • + 3
 @gotohe11carolina: Yeah, god forbid we get reviews from people who can actually ride a bike fast.
  • + 2
 @uuuu: all we need is to put @paulaston on @mikelevy donut diet to increase the stress on tested components and we have the best test pilot in the industry.

Some say he can break the Mormon Carbon in half by just sitting down on it, or that his bike won’t fit in Mercedes Sprinter without removing passengers front seat. All we know is that his name is... The Stick!
  • + 0
 @seb-stott: I never had it at that price.
  • + 1
 @hardtailsshred: my Reynolds carbon rims are bomb proof Smile
  • + 0
 @SonofBovril: Minaar also seemed to get a LOT of punctures, despite using ENVE's anti puncture strip.
  • - 1
 @matwilliams: people with basic engineering sense should be able to realize that this strip does very little. Ehatever medium you have between the rim and the rock, it has to spread the load on widest possible surface of the tyre, and thickness as well as hardness of that medium determines the probability of the puncture. Their strip is thin. As simple as that.
  • - 2
 @bonkywonky: love the rims, they are really great
  • - 1
 @Squeakybb: 30 pounds more on the rider is more easily mitigated as it sits atop two legs that act as suspension. 30 pounds on the bike hits the ground a lot more directly and translates differently into the suspension, frame, wheels, tires, etc... Try putting a 30 pound weight on your bike and riding it off a 3 foot drop, then take the weight off put it in your backpack and tell me it feels the same.
  • + 2
 @krashDH85: I hear ya. I've had carbon bars break on me so I use alu bars now. Luckily didn't get impaled.
  • + 4
 The companies response was the worst of all. how refreshing would it have been to say something like this.. Yelp it looks like this product is not up to par and should not be used for e-mtb. Any rider who is using this for e-mtb contact us for a replacement to our DH specific rim. Companies can miss the mark think back on all major brands there filled with hits and misses. We will learn from this and work towards a more positive review for our upcome rim line.
  • + 0
 ENVE - "Should Paul have received a rim with a fiber peel and imperfectly drilled spoke holes? Absolutely not."

EVERY PERSON READING THIS ARTICLE - "Yes he/we should."

The holes are not a micron out but rather millimetres and stresses caused by this very poor QC can be damaging to the rider, his wallet, his bike and Enve of course. I personally think the chaps of ENVE should take a tour of the HOPE factory and take from that what they can and apply it to their factories.

Very disappointed by Enve's response but let us give them one more chance to rectify this issue.
  • + 2
 @SonofBovril: Yeah, and they were also running fresh wheels at every race. I get that they're pushing the technology, but they aren't anything special enough to justify their insane prices. We Are One would have my money over Enve and their product is so much better.
  • + 1
 @BaeckerX1: 630 grams for a carbon rim
Cmon
Im riding Sunringlé Inferno 31s aluminium which are about 570grams each and been smashing them with still no problems
  • + 0
 @lkubica: Hoping US manufacturing quality will enjoy a nice rise after we impeach the lying criminal at the helm and get someone in office who encourages ambitious entrepreneurial new businesses!
  • + 3
 @DirtbagMatt: Every thread here turns into a trump vs the world. give it a rest, take it back to facebook so your friends can like
  • + 1
 easton haven carbon wheelset was the dogs bollocks
  • + 4
 @Ktron: I also found it laughable that switching hub brands drops the price so little and we get,"that's 10% savings". Sorry, but if a wheelset is $2500 vs $2800, it doesn't matter to anyone. The people who couldn't afford them at 2800, still can't at 2500. And those that can afford 2800, don't care to try and try and save 300 bucks. Just my two cents.
  • + 1
 @freerabbit: Free Medical Insurance with every wheelset??
  • + 2
 @cunning-linguist: You of all folks, judging from your handle, should know that piss-poor should be hyphenated.
  • + 3
 @gotohe11carolina:
I once turned in a frame for warranty replacemt to our supplier.
7 frame breaks and stress fractures.
They still talk about that Norwegian idiot/maniac/warranty dep walking talking nightmare.
  • + 0
 @Tjomball: was it a Trek? Smile
  • + 2
 @lkubica: yeah it’s werid they charge a premium. My M6 bars just showed up with a “made in China” sticker on the box....hardly worth it
  • + 2
 @fpmd: no way that’s the only way I’ve broken one of mine too!
  • + 1
 @Mooka: want to upvote but it's already at 666!
  • + 1
 @Tjomball: too much energy drinks compared to smoked weed... as simple as that. Also I tend to understand Norwegian... not him
  • + 1
 @WAKIdesigns:
It was a 98 TY-glide.
Listing cracks and breaks from front to rear end.
Starting with cracked welds in headtube., cracked welds on both sides of the mainframe, chainstays on both sides, non drive cracked, left broken and finally the seatstays.
Both displaying cracks.
In TREK's defence, I abused that ride way beyond its intended purpose.
It caught more air than an SAS flight.
  • + 2
 To add to this just did a week in Mallorca, very rocky again and I missed a few lines and smashed into some square edged rocks, heard the rims contacting rock. I also let my heavier friend have a go on my bike and he also missed some lines smashed into rocks and punctured the SG Rockrazor on the rear. Result - not a mark on the LB EN728 rims.
  • + 1
 www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ehkn39xUeCE paul chats about what happened.....
  • + 198
 Cracking review!
  • + 62
 He spoke the truth.
  • + 13
 He broke with some expectations right there
  • + 4
 Nothing like a proper rim stinger in the morning.
  • + 9
 We can feel high tension through the review
  • + 58
 I don’t ENVE the person who has to clean up this PR mess
  • + 29
 Soon, when the bike industry will send some products to Pinkbike, it will be either S-M size frame, or a component accompanied with a note " dear Pinkbike, send these to one of your Mikes for testing, please do not send this to crazy Pole Aston destructor"
  • + 10
 Prospects for Enve looking increasingly rim.
  • + 3
 @zede: you have splintered off from the pun hub.
  • + 15
 Damn, that was a messy rim job.
  • + 3
 @Boardlife69: poor nutrition, not enough fiber
  • + 3
 This review will crack Enve in half
  • + 1
 @RollinFoSho: you mean like crack in half and send it to the bottom of the Ocean?
  • + 0
 @WAKIdesigns: I mean loose business
  • + 1
 @WAKIdesigns: I doubt that this would completely finish Enve.
  • + 13
 How freakin dumb could Enve be? To blame Quality Control is ridiculous. If I ran the company, I would personally triple inspect the rims I sent to Pinkbike for review. If there was an issue, I would personally hand make them to perfection the second time around if needed.
  • + 5
 @RollinFoSho: I meant carbon in the ocean, Pole virtue signalling, remember? BTW, here’s your crack
www.pinkbike.com/photo/16913179

And no, it won’t hurt them at all. I don’t think Enve clients read Pinkbike
  • + 0
 @WAKIdesigns: it sounds like Pole has the right idea. I bought a carbon bike and carbon wheels a few years back. I didn't understand the environmental impact of carbon fiber back then. Pole bikes definitely got my attention and I would likely buy aluminum (or maybe superagnesium) next time. Unless buying used and I found a deal on a carbon bike, that's good recycling too.
  • - 1
 @RollinFoSho: way to split hair. If Pole gave a sht, they would stock their bike with EU made products. But they don’t. And components, due to their complexity have way bigger impact than the frame. They were unable to make a carbon bike, weld anything themselves, so they decided to pay sht loads for easily accessible CNC and crap on every company in the business. If you want to eat their environmental BS be my guest. BTR, Sick, Murmur and a few more make bikes from more environmentally viable steel but they don’t write revolutionary exposes about it. Pole are compensating for their own incompetence.

“We used to look up at the sky and wonder at our place in the stars. Now we just look down, and worry about our place in the dirt”

So much for “environmentalists” like Pole
  • + 0
 @WAKIdesigns: Steel fs bikes are heavy.

Yes, I'll consider the environmental aspect, no problem with that. I really don't get your hate towards Pole, is it new ideas and approaches that bother you? I don't think they shit on all the other bike brands. They pointed out issues with carbon fiber and overseas production and found another way. I think it's cool.

Maybe you should look at yourself and wonder if you are looking up or down
  • - 1
 @RollinFoSho: up far and far away. Tired of people looking for splinters. Pole didn’t mention environmental issues, they completed overlooked the general provlem with waste management in overseas production. They focused solely on carbon. Ironically just after their BS was published, thousands of city bikes originally destinated as “eco rentals” have been wasted. Clients decided not to pick them up. Did they end up in the ocean? Possibly.

This kind of double standard ideological environmentalism is only causing problems. It puts people off, making them vote for morons like Trump, because they are tired of this BS. It is extremely damaging, it puts people away from root of the problems, making them dream about green life, and satisfying themselves with meaningless solutions. Clicking likes on environmental posts doesn’t save the world.

I’m out.
  • + 3
 @WAKIdesigns: you end on this? After posting the 666th comment? You couldn't make it up.
  • + 1
 I can't speak for China, but in Taiwan everything that can be recycled is recycled. I wish we could recycle plastic bags and chewed betel nut too because they are the only things you see kicking about everywhere. The government has banned free plastic bags with purchases and there is even a plastic drinking straw ban coming into effect this year that all the tea shops are crying about.
  • + 1
 @qreative-bicycle: Until - Oh, SNAP!
  • + 4
 @RollinFoSho: Pole talks about environmental impacts. They are milling the frame out of massive aluminium blocks. That's a huge waste of energy. And you tell me they are recycling the aluminium waste? I hope they do.
All they want is to show their different method to gain attention and separate them from all the others. But pole talking about environment is hilarious. Marketing. Just like @WAKIdesigns said, look for murmur or sick...
  • + 2
 @PhilBoss: of course they recycle, everybody doing a decent amount of milling recycles. And the people who explicitly said they recycle and that it's part of the reason to go this way.
  • + 0
 @RollinFoSho: Pole talks about environmental impacts. They are milling the frame out of massive aluminium blocks. That's a huge waste of energy. And you tell me they are recycling the aluminium waste? I hope they do.
All they want is to show their different method to gain attention and separate them from all the others. But pole talking about environment is hilarious. Marketing. Just like @WAKIdesigns said, look for murmur or sick...
  • + 1
 @PhilBoss: of course they recycle, everybody doing a decent amount of milling recycles. And the people who explicitly said they recycle and that it's part of the reason to go this way.
  • + 1
 @jaame: to say you recycle is really good for publicity. Meanwhile BTR or Swarf do frames from more environmentally viable materials using much more environmentally viable methods, they mile too and...



and what?



Exactly - Not a word. What Pole did and what many do is environmental publicity whoring, an entertainment for people who masturbate at the thought of climate catastrophe and can’t stop listening to this Swedish girl from Climate Summit in Katowice: “you ignored us in the past, you are stealing our future”. Oooh... I am so touched. What a wise person, and she is only 15... I will share it on Facebook to show my friends how much I care
  • + 1
 @WAKIdesigns: This will be unpopular, but personally I don't care about climate change. Humans don't have a right to eternal existence. I don't like living in shit, that's why I recycle.

I agree with you that pole is using it as an angle for marketing. I don't care, I would still like to try one because they are a unique design and pole actually make them themselves. I know some other companies do too, and good on them. Poles look rude compared to BTR though. Fully sick.
  • + 0
 @jaame: this will be unpopular but I don't care about climate change either. I also don't work out to be healthy and I don't cheat on my wife just because I have high morals. There are enough practical or fun reasons to do what some people call "the right thing". Preaching and shaming annoys me deeply... I had it for all my childhood in the church. No more, thank you. Exact same tone, exact same threatening of undefined punishment in undefined future. The tragedy of atheism without going through religious upbringing - relieving group shaming through virtue signalling typical for religious groups, without being conscious of it...
  • + 2
 @WAKIdesigns: Religious upbringing, ya that’s a tough start. Be mindful to find balance and not go to the opposite end. FYI, supporting “green initiatives “ is not the same as public shaming. I would argue that your reactions would be considered public shaming.
  • + 1
 @RollinFoSho: it's not as bad as one may think. If you are lucky and shake it off in a right way it will give you the ability to see through tons of BS because patterns of behavior, crowd mechanics are the same for all sorts of situations, only the subject changes. Supporting green initiatives is religion. You have all the best intentions and then it all goes to sht. Like with organic farming, eco meat, ethanol as fuel, diesel vs gasoline, and many, many more. Mountain biking is not green. It just isn't.
  • + 1
 @WAKIdesigns: f*cking hell, let's not get too optimistic eh? This is the dark matter countering "virtue signalling". Virtue de-signalling? Illusion antivirus? What's the end game? Quick and merciful self-assured annihilation?
Oh, and bikes. I like the Finnish guy, because he has the zeal to convince and he isn't even working for them (let's be kind), even if Pole are not actually the spark for the imminently necessary colonization of new non-Earth planets. It's virtuous BS against vicious BS, at worst. The gloves are off, the "libtards" are going to have to start telling massive fibs to stop things getting a little ugly, plain and simple. But slinging mud at both sides can possibly provide solace of sorts.
Yes, I am equating 3% faster times on a given run with saving humanity, so there's a wormhole in my argument.
  • + 0
 @BenPea: there was no point spreading BS in the first place. I’d rather have Bozo doing it quitely but effectively than Elo delivering a sex doll to ISS or worse, Veganita Gayana having the zeal to call it all a waste of resources that could be used for freeing cows and pigs from industrial farms.

All of it was “17 yr old bat sht crazy girl got dropped by an Asian dude” kind of enterprise. A kind of “An instagram gymstar discoveres how much sugar is in Pepsi, and now she tells the world calling the giant out on promotion of diabetes! She knew it’s been a lot, but not that lot! She feels cheated and produces her own sports drink based on natural sugars. 3% less but more natural. Namaste Namas!”

The moment I saw a 12yr old clearing a table top jump that I have trouble putting my front wheel over, I lost all hope in MTB technology... and when the father of Long Low and Slack, Cesar, called Jerrymetron a step too far I stopped believing in these folks completely. Riding a way too long (yet shorter than Pole) Big Honzo didn’t help either... i see how some may like it.
  • + 1
 WAKI-old-guard-troll
  • + 1
 @WAKIdesigns: I work out to look good, how about you.
Also I don't cheat on my wife out of respect for her. Well I guess that used to be the case ten years ago. Now I just don't want to cheat. My wife is hot anyway. Much hotter than any of my mates' wives. Cool too.
That said, my old bike was sexy AF and I still sold it just because I wanted a change.
I would buy a Pole if I could afford one!
  • + 2
 @RollinFoSho: No, this is radical catholicism gone rogue. What did the Church of Scranton do to you Waki, you crazy f*ck?
  • + 1
 @WAKIdesigns: But yes, ok.
  • + 162
 Light, cheap, and strong, pick none.
  • - 40
flag Almazing (Feb 28, 2019 at 4:42) (Below Threshold)
 Except this wheelset is none of the 3.
  • - 44
flag ibishreddin (Feb 28, 2019 at 6:35) (Below Threshold)
 @Almazing: I don't understand why you were downvoted. 2000g+ is not light, 3k, and strong...
  • + 60
 @ibishreddin @Almazing is this some high end irony I dont get?
  • - 9
flag Almazing (Feb 28, 2019 at 6:41) (Below Threshold)
 @ibishreddin: Fanatics with buyer's remorse.
  • + 12
 @Almazing: That was my point indeed :-)
  • + 116
 @ibishreddin @Almazing: ah, the very rare DOUBLE WOOSH
  • + 17
 @ibishreddin: re-read the last word on the OP.
  • + 7
 @arrowheadrush: aaaahahahhaha
  • + 13
 HHAHAHAHAHAHAHA I RATE THIS BEST JOKE 2019 LMAO
  • + 3
 Perfect. We can all stop any further comments.
  • + 1
 @JiminOz: might be for the best
  • + 147
 Karma for riding an E-bike.
  • + 131
 The response from the Enve guy is a joke. It doesn't matter if it breaks on the 1st or the 100th ride? I'd say if they fail at all for the kind of money they charge then it definitely matters. Especially when we see some of the "miracle" wheels that make it down world cup downhill tracks and the like intact. And Danny on that Santa Cruz wheel trying his hardest to break it....

The fact the tester had two shit wheels that failed almost instantly and a third that looked too dodgy to even put on the bike says everything we need to know about them.

Wheelworks in NZ make a better wheel, for less money and have warranty claims you can count on one hand.
  • + 24
 Yeah that guy's funny. They should have just just put M735E stickers on a M9 rim and called it a day.
  • + 46
 PB reviewer receives Enve rims that break and w sucks at quality.

"blah blah blah...our protective rim strip technology is amazing" - Enve
  • + 4
 I’m not sure about that warranty claim.
  • + 2
 @heinous: 5 or 6 years ago it's claimed Steve Peat rode an entire season on the same set of SC carbon wheels. It can be done.

Having said that, this review of Wheelworks ended with a busted wheel too! They claim a "handful" of issues, but didn't quibble about the way the wheel was being used at all. If it's on a bike, the scope of "intended use" would be massive. The hit it took did sound quite brutal - "5 foot drop, suspension bottomed out onto a square edged rock."
flowmountainbike.com/tests/tested-wheelworks-flite-wide-carbon
  • + 4
 @heinous: Just found the Steve Peat single wheel set article and it was actually a full season of "race runs". And they were made by....Enve.

They claim the entire Syndicate team only got through 11 wheels
in 2011.
Maybe they used to be better - if the claim is true. The wheels only came in 26" and 21mm internal width! Only 7 years ago!

www.bikeradar.com/au/news/article/enve-launch-dh-rims-and-wheels-33221
  • + 36
 That guy is VP of Product and Customer Experience for ENVE. Totally fails here on both counts. He spends more time blaming the customer (Paul) for riding the wrong rims than his QA department for their f*ck-up with the Product. Who put him in charge?
  • + 43
 "You can drive a new car off a lot and wreck it the first time you pull out onto the street." A car is not designed to withstand a crash, it is designed to collapse to protect the driver. What exactly is this guy saying about his rims?
  • + 53
 I came here to post exactly this.

'If you break one product on your first ride, and another on its 10th or 100th ride it doesn’t always mean the product that broke earlier was inferior'

Surely that is exactly what it means? I have some mid range Easton ARC27 rims that I have ridden hard over the last 2 and a half seasons; they aren't perfect but they were cheap, not too heavy, are easy enough to true, and still seal up well with my favourite tyres.
Now if I buy any other wheel and it fails catastrophically after 1 or 2 rides on the exact same trails? You're damn straight it is inferior. And if that other wheel happens to be 8 or 9 times the cost of the ARCs, well I'm going to vote with my feet and walk the f*ck away.
  • + 31
 I "like" how they blamed it on the rider being too good for the ebike wheels, implying that all ebike riders suck at biking Razz
  • + 12
 f*ckin' oath.

But hey, ENVE reduced the price of a wheelset to a mere $2550 USD, that has to count for something? Hahaha, omg the guys at ENVE are insane.
  • + 15
 @Franziskaner: "vote with my feet and walk the f*ck away" you sir, win the internet for the day, in my eyes at least.
  • + 3
 @Franziskaner: well it actually doesn't mean it's inferior. You can not compare two failures; even in a lab you need multiple replications of the exact same variables to make reliable comparisons. I can almost guarantee that for every single product ever made you can find someone for whom it broke on the first use. And you can also find someone else who lost it in the mud, ran over it with a tractor, found it three months later, and it's worked perfectly for ages. It's all meaningless. It's like saying if you win the lottery the first time you play, then you will win every single time.
  • + 11
 Agreed, that was a horrible response in pretty much every way. Would have been better had he just said "Sorry we f-ed up, we would happily warranty these in any circumstance."
  • + 4
 @ecologist: Okay, I take your point. But you CAN compare a non-failure with a failure. And surely being ridden on the same trails by the same rider on the same bike counts towards some controlled variables...?

There is no excuse for the mealy-mouthed response from Enve here, especially given their prices.
  • + 4
 @tgent: yeah, exactly. Instead he went about Enve's accomplishments. We're not talking about those, we're talking about THESE failures now.
  • + 19
 What struck me the most was the "people expect our product to be perfect" rebuttal. Of course perfection doesn't exist in anything (except maybe Randy's enduro skills) but at this price, people expect defects at a 1/1,000 rate or less. Now, having a total failure on one rim, a second rim with finish defects that could hurt you followed by another total failure and a third rim with finish defects... that's just too much circumstantial evidence of a defect rate that is much, much higher than 1/1000...

A better PR answer would have been along the lines of "we have investigated each rim failures attentively, this shouldn't have happened, as such, we have made changes in our QC personnel and procedures as well as corrective actions on the durability of said rims."
  • + 8
 @heinous: Hidden in that drivel about rim strips are two fairly disturbing numbers. First the warranty rate before the strips, at a bit over 3%, that's pretty horrendous. Second is the warranty rate with the strips at 1%, that's 3x less horrendous, but still horrendous. It also says nothing of denied warranty claims, who knows how many of those there may be.
  • + 7
 Came here to say "wheelworks!"

...also, expecting perfection? You market your product at a premium price bud, you're damn right I expect perfection.
  • + 19
 The VPs response tells me one of two things:

1. His email was approved by upper mgmt signaling that upper mgmt doesn’t understand their business and PR.

2. His email wasn’t seen by upper mgmt signaling that upper mgmt doesn’t know how to run their business and PR.
  • + 3
 Yeah the new parent company of Enve probably wanted to maximize their return on investment and immediately directed them to cut costs at every corner. This is what ya get...
  • + 31
 @maxyedor: As an industrial engineer with a background in supply chain, I can assure you there is absolutely zero excuses for these products ever making it to a reviewer. Any time a reviewed product left the manufacturer I used to work for, each piece was meticulously inspected by the engineering team to be the absolute best example of what we could produce so that reviews of our product were flawless.

This is not hard to do, especially for a company that boasts so much in-house work. Complete lazy failure.
  • + 1
 @surfhard987: your statement has no basis in reality whatsoever.
  • + 16
 @HurricaneCycles: As a consumer, This is exactly the crap I don't want to see/hear. I want companies to randomly select products off the production line to send out for review. Otherwise the reviews are completely meaningless (shill reviews, pretty damn common). Already the reviews I read are really difficult to believe. Kudos to pinkbike for posting this review. aVe would be proud.
  • + 5
 @HurricaneCycles: I mean, that's what you or I... and pretty much everyone on here would do, because non of us are that stupid.
  • + 5
 @JiminOz: ENVE did runs of custom lay up wheels for teams and athletes, I have a pair here. It’s likely Peat was on those.

The last person I ran in to riding Wheeworks cracked his on his second day riding. They’re nice enough wheels, but not much different to anything else in the price bracket.

There’s a number of reasons the vast majority of EWS riders are on alloy rims.
  • + 1
 @heinous: theyre on alu rims because they can fix a dent or bent rim. carbon rims either work or fail dramatically - there's no in between.
  • + 5
 @Schaefdog: Holy ol f*ck partner, if only we could get a BOLTR on this
  • + 7
 @Schaefdog: don’t misunderstand me to mean that we sold high and produced low. While that certainly happens a LOT out there, but our QC was rather stringent. And I don’t think Enve is doing that either. It was a lazy mistake that has caused a large viewership to see their products in a dramatically worse way than would be if they had never been reviewed in the first place.
  • + 5
 @HurricaneCycles: I can’t imagine morale being super great there, even before this. Disengagement occasionally might show up in finished goods.
  • + 0
 @HurricaneCycles: Remind me to not buy anything from your old company--- It's unethical to use special quality control processes for products sent to reviewers.
  • + 2
 @koncretekahuna: Hahaha, I wish there was a way to tag him. I know he has a rocky mountain......
  • + 3
 @Franziskaner: the scientist in me still says no you can't. But I will concede that in the real world we can still learn something from case studies, and the one you describe may have some merit for me depending on what else I knew, the conditions resulting in failure, etc. As to Paul's experience, it does raise some suspicions (two failures in a row, etc.) but to Envy's defense (I am not a customer, or even a potential customer, metal for me) he admitted the wheels are not up to the task:

"Do we have some additional work to do in terms of meeting the demands of rider’s like Paul on E-MTBs? Yes."

These are "enduro" wheels. Paul is reportedly a large and aggressive downhiller. He may have also had something to prove..."If I can't manage to break these wheels, I won't hear the end of it in the comments for riding e-bike. Must give them something else to complain about..."
  • - 1
 @maxyedor: three percent doesn't strike me as especially high. And one percent seems really low. In every context I know anything about, anyone who gets 99% right is doing awesome. True that warranty rate probably does not equal failure rate, so hard to say.

I'm starting to sound like Envy fanboy here. I'm certainly not, but I just think a bigger deal is being made over a couple broken rims than is appropriate.
  • + 7
 I guess for them is answer is quite logical. Translating this to human language: "we made those rims for dentists and they don't really ride bikes, so f** off Paul Aston. It was very unfair to give our rims to a real rider".
  • + 9
 That was a very defensive response. That guy doesnt understand that this is not the way to repair your reputation. These wheels are THREETHOUSAND DOLLARS. Thats more than ive payed for my ENTIRE kit. hydration pack included. If you pay that much for a wheelset (And mind you, Very good wheelsets can be had voor about 500 bucks) You expect them to last a lifetime. (by that i mean. These should last till they change the hub standards once more at the very least and still hold strong when you sell the bike theyre attached to at that point). My DT X1900 set (which isnt all that good and bloody cheap) lasted longer than these.

Instead he should have just have said something like: Look were sorry. But sometimes people make mistakes. If this happens we will ask no questions whatsoever and replace the wheelset for free. We will learn from this yadayada you get the point. Not this people expect too much from us bullcrap. DUDE youre selling 3K wheelsets so shut the f*ck up.
  • + 11
 @RecklessJack: Yeah, I don't get why he chose this opportunity to give PB a sales speech. "Yeah we messed up. But you know we make really nice products have you seen this one it is really great we really make great stuff and bladiblahblahblah..."

Sorry but this is an obvious design error. Not just a production error limited to these three rims PB got. It is a design error. See, you can't just cut/trim/drill a composite like that and leave the trimmed edges free. Free edges are going to delaminate when subjected to stress and the delamination will creep between the layers. Just like cutting your jeans. After a few wash cycles, the material will raffle. If you don't want that, you need to close the loop (like most clothes are finished). Look at carbon lever blades. I know they don't make sense but they're a good example. Until 2007 Magura just laminated the carbon lever blades, trimmed them to size and drilled the holes. If you crashed hard, they'd delaminate. From 2008 onwards, they used a braid so that there were no more free edges. It was a continuous fibre and for all the holes for pivots etc they shifted the fibres to the sides. Yes it is a more complex process but that's what it takes to do things properly. And indeed you can't do this if you are working with prepregs (which are fibres which arrive at the manufacturer already impregnated) as you can no longer shift the fibres. So the most ideal solution would have been for them to not drill the fibres at all. The challenge then of course is going to be, how are you ever going to attach spokes? Sprengle isn't so bad after all. The other solution is do as Magura does (probably other companies too, but I don't know) and redirect the fibres around the spoke holes. Next solution would be to actually drill the material (ouch) but fixate these edges using eyelets or something. But you'll have to clamp each laminate from both sides or it won't work. Think of the double shear lap joint Robotbike.co (now Atherton) uses to connect the carbon tubes to the lugs. Worst solution is to overdimension the laminate so much that stresses become so low that you won't get delamination. This is probably what most (or nearly all) of the manufacturers do to make a complex carbon product at a pricepoint that they can still sell to some. This is what Enve does too, apparently. Yes indeed I believe that the most expensive consumer grade wheels (which feature carbon rims these days) are actually the worst execution of using the material in a product. And no I can't be arsed to pay for what it would take to do it properly but I won't pay for a messed up product like they currently deliver. See, they're using a construction technique that's proven to work really well with an amorphous material like aluminium. And guess what, there are quite a few companies who are offering just that. In engineering we call the the way Enve produces rims "black metal design" (without any reference to music). Instead it is meant to say they use the black material (carbon) as if it were a metal. And it isn't good.

I guess they realize by now that they've messed up real bad. Sure a product can fail when tested by a major website like Pinkbike. And you can take the product back and say "Wow, this has never happened to us before. But we'll closely examine these samples and will do our best to reconstruct what happened. If it turns out to be a design flaw, our team will do our best to redimension the rim and make sure this won't happen anymore." You know, still blah but more honest and constructive. I wonder how many people will still buy their rims.

tl;dr: They messed up. In their design and in their reaction.
  • + 1
 @vinay: damn dawg you expect people to read that much lol Wink
  • + 2
 @cuban-b: Of course not! Just do as I do and scroll to the tl;dr section Smile .
  • + 3
 @vinay: I seem to recall one of the reasons they originally gave for the insane pricing was that the spoke holes were formed, not drilled. That increases costs by a fair bit but results in a much stronger wheel. Well I guess they stopped doing that part and went to drilling like everyone else, but just forgot to reduce the price accordingly.

What I think they should start doing is selling rims for a reasonable price and cut the BS about how they are better than anything else, which as we have seen in numerous articles, they are clearly not.

Lace up a set of rims with normal spokes and decent hubs and sell them for what We Are One sells them for. We understand that made in USA carries a price premium on labour. But that labour isn't adding $1000 onto a pair of rims. Probably closer to $100, that's my guess. How much do factory workers in the USA make? $100 a day? And how many rims do they lay up in a day? It must be more than one.
  • + 2
 @ecologist: it wouldn't be a big deal if you couldn't go on Instagram and search #insidecarbonbikes and find cut up enve rims filled with voids.
  • + 4
 @ecologist: I suspect you're not in the manufacturing field. Those are insane numbers, that's 1 in 50 customers having a warranty claim (assuming most people have 2 ENVE hoops on their bike). An acceptable number would be something like 1/10 of a percent warranty return rate, for any factor, and significantly less than that for catastrophic failures as seen in this review.

These are heavy rims being ridden as designed. They were on an enduro e-bike, that was presumably built with other parts designed for similar applications, the rims failed, the rest of the bike did not. The replacement rims failed, and the one that didn't fail should have been caught in QC and would have also been a warranty return due to being drilled by a blind gopher.

Also, as somebody else mentioned, wasn't most of the justification for price and argument of their merits on ENVE rims the molded spoke holes and the resulting uninterrupted fibers? I know at one point I asked i9 about building me a set of torch hubs with alloy spokes on ENVE rims and was told they're not compatible because of the molded spoke holes. When did they switch to drilling?
  • + 2
 @jaame: Ah, so they used to have formed spoke holes. That would have been much better though I can imagine it would be difficult to make them like that. Of course at the air chamber side, they don't necessarily have to be round. They could be oval if that's easier for the fibres to follow. Obviously the spoke-end has to be round for the nipple to twist smoothly, but that would be inside an insert. The insert only has to be round on the inside where the nipple goes, the outside could be the shape the insert would be willing to follow. Heck for all the effort that would take to do it properly, they'd best extrude an aluminium strip, make it a hoop, drill the spoke holes and use that in the mold as an insert.

I guess by now they must have realized their reputation is completely destroyed. No one wants to be seen riding those. "Oh, you've got Enve rims? What a waste of those beautiful Chris King hubs that is!"
  • + 2
 @vinay: I have never wanted them. Since the start they have always been unreasonably priced, in my opinion. I am the kind of guy who would buy a Nissan GT-R over a Ferrari, and I guess in the case of wheels, a GR-R is a high quality alloy rim.
  • + 1
 @jaame: Just looked up that Nissan, looks like quite a beast too Wink ! I'm just happy that I got my bike for getting my kicks so that I'm completely mellowed out when driving the car. But yeah, I get your point. I'm willing to spend more on a component if I feel it gets me what I want. My hardtail frame wasn't cheap by any means, but they could get me exactly what I want. They actually had what I've been thinking about since I first saw an On-One 456 Summer Season. Why can I only get that geometry when I install a long travel fork? Couldn't they just get me that with the short fork already? BTR delivered something I've been wanting for years. Ever since, I've never looked at another bike and thought "oh, I would have liked that one instead". So that brings me peace, which is well worth it. Setting goals at the extreme end (wanting the lightest, latest, flashiest, strongest, most pickup point-est freewheel...) is going to be recipe for frustration. Don't ever dive into that trap. Decide what you want to do, identify what it takes. When that's available, get it, shut up and ride the hell out of it. Actually the same goes for athletic goals which may be even harder because the audience looks at it differently. Set absolute goals, not relative to someone else. Gee Atherton is a great example being happy with a top twenty finish in a season plagued with injury, even though the keyboard experts here were claiming he wasn't any good anymore. Steve Peat, with all respect, set himself up with so much frustration before he won the Worlds. Take 2008. He had a great run and was in the hot seat. Sam Hill went down while in the green so he was still excited. Then Gee Atherton won the race and Steve was hugely bummed. Sure I get it as he's been wanting the rainbow for that long. But he needs to realize that if he's had a great run, it was still a great run even though Gee did a better one. Back in the days a coach once told me "If you had a great race and lost, you still had a great race. If you messed up your race and won, you still messed up your race." That stuck with me ever since. Though it also meant I never cared about results anymore. I care about great performances, not the results.

Sorry for going a bit off topic. Pulling it back to the main topic. If you're a competitive cyclist and think you need carbon rims to get good results, what do you think you're trying to prove?

tl;dr: Yeah sorry...
  • + 1
 @maxyedor: I most certainly do not. However, I am certain that some one at Envy does work in manufacturing and it appears as though they don't find 1% to be especially alarming. Room for improvement? Probably. But they know the non-aerospace carbon manufacturing industry better than I, and I know that acceptable failure rates depend a whole lot on industry and product type. So your experience may not apply.

But if what you say is true for carbon bicycle wheels, maybe that explains why Envy's versions cost so much!
  • + 103
 I honestly don't understand WHY almost every company right now has carbon wheels for trail, enduro and DH. I get it in XC. I understand that it's beneficial in road cycling. But why on earth do they push this technology to be used in a place it doesn't belong. People. Stop buying this crap. Enve or not. It doesn't matter. You ride XC or a road bike. Buy it. You ride anything harder. Just use metal. Jesus Christ. Vote with your wallets.
  • + 32
 Having moved to a Light Bicycle rim I can report that the reduction in weight does make my bike feel faster to accelerate.
For me the cost of rims was about £120 each, so about 50% more than a high end Alu rim, and I could justify it. I think the wheels on my bike cost about (£800 all in, with hope hubs and mid level dt swiss spokes...?). I've found them very reliable so far, with only a broken spoke in 3 years.
I've a buddy that has toasted 2/3 carbon e13 rims though...
I couldn't justify Enve prices. Research what you buy folks!
  • + 6
 The amount of people (mostly German) with iced Out Yetis/ Santas and matching Enve decals is mindblowing.
People like paying for stupid shit
  • + 5
 @slimboyjim: how much weight for that wheelset? I can not believe they are really lighter.

My 30 mm internal wide AL Newmen Evolution SL A.30 have 1580g. I used to smack a wheelset in two months that i could replace it. This is 1 year and I had one smaller dent. Still got it to sent to much but that is for 700€, rims are 80€...
  • - 8
flag Serpentras (Feb 28, 2019 at 3:11) (Below Threshold)
 Fucking auto correct, I managed to sent it even more that I had to replace it.
  • - 11
flag goroncy (Feb 28, 2019 at 4:12) (Below Threshold)
 @slimboyjim: I did my research. Carbon is a bad material for mountain biking. When it works it's great. But it may stop working COMPLETELY just by hitting the thing with a rock. I would summarize it like that in MTB world:

Carbon parts - pros and cons

Frame: rides awesome. worth it if you ride trail, XC, or if you ride gnar and have money for the next one. probability that it will break is greater than a frame from metal. period.
Bar: come on. take a nice ti bar and just forget about carbon. this is a thing you hold on to. don't be stupid.
Stem: makes no sense. using carbon here creates so called black aluminum. the term describes a situation when you need to put so much carbon that the weight becomes similar to the metal option.
Rims: just DON'T use them
Cranks: this is a connection of situation with stem and bar. they are not light enough to justify using them. want light? buy cane creek ti cranks. this is also a component that should NEVER fail you.
  • + 8
 @slimboyjim: Amen. LB DH rims on my machine for the last two years without issue. 900AUD built at LBS with Hopes...No lighter than a set of Oozys, but significantly changed the handling characteristics of the bike for the better. No question on durability-they have endured every shitty line choice I make over rocks, drops, casing jumps etc
  • + 10
 @NotNamed: I live here for 6 years now. Where did you see those people with Enves exactly? I mean it's not that I didn't see anybody with nice expensive bicycles, but vast majority of people here are completely utilitarian. They have money and ride nice machines, but most definitely not TOO fancy (unless we are talking about road cyclists Big Grin ). I ride a lot in Munich/Grünwald area so you simply cannot find richer Germans.
  • - 2
 @goroncy: I saw them last summer in Saalbach Wink
  • + 7
 @NotNamed: This is my go to place. You are gravely mistaken. 75% of people there just want to have fun going down. Carbon frame is a rarity let alone carbon rims.
  • + 5
 Well said! You don't see an abundance of carbon fiber in off road Motorsport in critical areas, to my understanding Ali is still King in this area.
  • + 11
 @slimboyjim:
Same hear.
I've actually saved money going to carbon rims.
My average life span of alloy rims was 6 months for a rear.
I got 2.5 years out of my last carbon LB rim, did the ard rock enduro, morzine and the lake district. It rides much better to me than any alloy and didn't need looking after or truing. Only problem I had was alloy nipples breaking but that was my own fault for being a weight weenie in the wrong place.
I'm 92kg and ride rocky terrain 90% of the time and love high speed trails I'm not input slow techy stuff.
  • + 4
 @Serpentras: Light bicycle seem to have moved on in their naming of the rims, but I think it was this one...

www.lightbicycle.com/AM724-asymmetric-rim-profile-carbon-650b-mountain-bike-rims.html

It lists it as 385 +/- 15g for a 30mm (external) wide rim (27.5").

As a comparison a quick search shows a Stans Flow EX at 480g, although the exact dimensions aren't exactly similar I accept - it was just the first rim I found. I'm sure someone with more time or inclination will find a better match!

For reference my previous (26") wheelsets I switched between a super light xc carbon set (something like 1.4kg for the set?) and some dt Swiss 5.1's on hope hubs (about 2kg). I think these are maybe around 1.6kg and I've not been a weight weenie? I could have saved weight with posher hubs/spokes/alloy nipples, or a lighter rim but I wanted it to be as trouble free as possible, with it being my only wheelset. So far it's been great. I use proper 2.5 tyres and ride a 160mm(f) 150mm(r) full suss bike. I ride Midlands in the uk so not particularly rocky, but I do some Dh (just the easier stuff rather than full on black runs and big jumps and drops) and uplift days every now and again, and I've taken them on trips to Scotland, Wales, Spain and Madeira... When I have hit rocks it makes a horrendous sound but nothing worse than minor surface scratches so far!
  • + 10
 Speak for yourself. love my LB rims!
  • + 4
 @goroncy: I used mtbr for my research if I recall correctly. At the time of buying there was over a 1000 pages in relation the Chinese carbon rims which were overwhelmingly positive so I took a risk.

However, each to their own and whilst my personal experiences have been very positive I understand they aren't for everyone dependant on numerous personal factors. I certainly couldn't justify the difference if my rims had been priced in line with Enve, but for what I paid for them I did and would again...
  • + 1
 @slimboyjim:
Use: Cross Country/ All Mountain , 24mm wide internal. You can not compare a rim I use with the LB you just posted.

My rim is classified for Enduro. I use them on the 180mm travel bike. I would not want fragile parts on it. I ripped multiple times carbon crank's out of the socket bonding AL for the pedals or the crank out of the axle. No thanks, a old Shimano XT crank can take much more.

I will try LB rims for the next bike but I am sceptical and the wheelset they have for my intended use are more heavy then AL rims. I want to feel the stiff wheel's...
  • - 3
 @slimboyjim: I don't mind buying something without a nice western sounding sticker on it. I am just saying that REGARDLESS of the price carbon composites are not the material for MTB rims. That's it. And if you don't dent your alloy rims from time to time it means that you don't shred hard enough Razz !
  • + 13
 I was going through 2 alloy rears a year. I just got done with 12 months on We Are Ones and I haven’t had to even true them. One more season and they will more than pay for themselves. Oh yeah, and if one breaks, I have a lifetime warranty. No alloy rim offers that...not all carbon is created equal.
  • + 0
 @ryan83: Hmmm. How could a product that is worth 450.00 $ USD PER freakin RIM payed off already? Could you please provide some calculations here? In my simple minded calculation 900 USD could buy you 6 pairs of best in class DT swiss rims.
  • + 0
 @goroncy: I guess if you can not replace the rim and buy instead a wheel
  • + 0
 @NotNamed: Carbonfan rims with ENVE stickers, best of all worlds.
  • + 2
 @goroncy: if he's replacing spokes as well as paying a shop to do the rebuild, I could see it adding up to $900+ in two years. $100/rim, 32 spokes at $2-3 each (assuming quality spokes), ~$50 for a wheel build, so you're looking at $200-$250 per busted wheel. 4 new wheels would cost him $800-$1000.
  • + 3
 @Serpentras: I'm not going to say anything about your choice of rim. It's your choice and you know better than me what suits you and what will make you happy - you certainly seem to be harder on components than me for whatever reason! I can only speak for myself and give my opinion...

I know I abused my old Dt Swiss alu rims for a good few years and they bore many dents/war scars. They were a well regarded rim, but perhaps a bit on the heavy side. I'm now on my LB rims which feel stiffer (subjective opinion!), are lighter, and have been subjected to broadly the same riding. They have come out with nothing worse than a broken spoke, and some surface scratches. I believe that they've coped better, and that they will outlast the dt swiss rims. Clearly this is an opinion. I could be wrong and time will tell, but I have a good degree of confidence from the very large relatively positive online comments I read. Yes, there are a few stories of rims breaking (etc) but similarly the accounts of those who have used the LB customer services to sort the issue have been generally positive. Also there will always be some naysayers.

I'm relation to cost I don't have much money so I try to be careful, although I do spend a bit more on my bike when I can. I couldn't justify $450/rim as above, but that could be value to someone with the lifetime warrantee. Plus people like to support local and will sometimes pay a little extra to do so. I think Sixth Element wheels here in the UK are similar in price and warrantee, although they weren't around at the time off my purchase...

Ps. Please don't read this as negative or condescensing as it's not meant in that way!
  • + 3
 Because they are stronger and lighter. I've destroyed every mid to high end aluminum wheelset I've ever owned in 1-2 seasons. I'm 2 seasons in on a set of We Are One Agents and they are perfectly straight and have never had a problem. If they last 1 more season, they will be similar in overall cost to any aluminum set. I would never buy Enve's because the price point is insane, but many carbon wheels these days are affordable and don't blow up immediately like a lot of people think.
  • + 1
 @Serpentras: Newmen's rims have a neat design and out performed all other German rims in the magazine testing.
  • + 5
 You just wait until GG gets their foot into carbon rim building! 300% stronger for 10 bucks!
  • + 3
 @goroncy: add the cost of a wheel build (+/- $70) and spokes, nipples, rim tape, sealant (not to mention inconvenience) and an $80 rim will cost you $200 to replace unless you're lacing them yourself. Don't nobobdy got time fo' dat!
  • + 3
 @slimboyjim: 100% with you on this one. Bought a set of LB 35mm inner width (pretty sure it's the thicker layup) wheels on Novatec hubs (not the best) second hand for $300. I'm not crazy fast, but I do ride agressively and am a 6'4" 270lbs rider who makes poor line choices practically every ride. Zero issues. No thanks Enve.
  • + 6
 There's a high number of very positive comments about some other manufacturers here too (LB and WeAreOne predominantly). Just like if an aluminium rim failed we wouldn't accuse all aluminium rims of not being for for purpose I think people are a bit quick to trash all carbon rims?
  • + 1
 @slimboyjim: It would be interesting to know the tyre pressure.
  • + 5
 I have 3 years on my LB rims doing enduro-style riding in rocky terrain with no issue. Before I had damaged alu rims from from various brands. Carbon rims well built is a winner, at least for me.
  • + 1
 @slimboyjim: running any rim protection?
  • + 2
 @tkdbboy: Not the 2 first years. I snakebited some tires, punching holes in the sidewalls when bottoming out hard against the rim. Now I run a Hucknorris in the rear. No more tire issues either.
  • + 1
 It seems to me that you don't get it. They sell carbon wheels for DH or enduro in order to profit more by pricing it sky high. It is that simple.
  • + 1
 @goroncy Cost of labor, I’m not as good at building wheels as I am at breaking them. So...$120 usd for DT Swiss ex 511 + $80 labor = $200 per broken wheel. This is assuming reusing spokes. Math starting to make sense?
  • + 1
 I have We Are One Agent wheels on both bikes and I’m never using anything else.
  • + 1
 @tkdbboy: I don't run any extra rim protection - just standard tubeless.
  • + 1
 @Serpentras: my aluminum XC rims are 460 and 470grams (x392 and arch EX) and the nextie rims I'm about to build up are 360(?)g..its a pretty significant weight savings.
  • + 1
 @clink83: Well at least I talk about rims who endure Enduro and DH . Xc is another lvl. I did break my hubs on xc bike's with good set of xc wheel's more then once. You can not throw them around like an enduro wheelset
  • + 1
 @Serpentras: you don't need 30mm wide heavy carbon rims, you can build up 25mm rims that are still strong and lighter than AL offerings.
  • + 76
 Never mind owned by dentists, you’ll need a dentist with these bad boys...
  • + 101
 95% of dentists recommend Enve haha
  • + 6
 @ctd07: dentists will most likely have no problems with them, if breaking your hand means financial desaster you probably end up not beeing a shredder. ( a friend of mine is dentist and i can relate to his explanation for beeing slow on the descents)
  • + 72
 In Enve's defense; those trails in Finale Ligure are detrimental.
In Enve's offense; when you advertise a rim for enduro, it better be able to do some enduro.
  • + 9
 But not full enduro!
  • + 4
 @karoliusz: never go full enduro!
  • + 4
 @karoliusz: Apparently not enduro enough for Paul Aston as per Enve. So they admit that these POS rims wouldn't last 5 mins on someone like Richie Rude.
  • + 56
 me: "ok, wow, that doesn't sound good"

Paul Aston: "So this is starting to sound really, really, bad at this point, but we are not quite finished."

me: www.youtube.com/watch?v=UcZzlPGnKdU
  • + 2
 Best comment
  • + 1
 Hahahaha, amazing.
  • + 51
 Good journalism.
  • + 43
 Ebikes batteries create a magnetic field that deteriorates the core structure of carbon. That's just plain science. Never ride a bike with a battery.
  • - 20
flag woofer2609 (Feb 28, 2019 at 9:25) (Below Threshold)
 How so (or are you being sarcastic)? I would think that the addition of a sacrificial anode (preferably zinc, as you don't want aluminum to weaken) would negate any deterioration.
Am I missing something?
  • + 21
 @woofer2609: Missing the joke
  • + 13
 @woofer2609: No, you are missing everything
  • + 7
 @woofer2609: He's missed it.
  • + 37
 In this weeks episode of ''Destroyed In Seconds'' a man eats dirt and the brand's reputation goes up in smoke
  • + 34
 "Carbon doesn’t fatigue." Carbon might not. Carbon fiber, or composites definitely do. Don't listen to anyone who tells you otherwise.
  • - 6
flag ryanbpoquette (Feb 28, 2019 at 2:26) (Below Threshold)
 check out the Youtube video where they try to break a santa cruz nomad carbon frame Vs. Aluminum and you can see what carbon is capable of. Enve just doesnt care and they are living off their brand name. Im starting a wheel company its called "a feeling of discontented or resentful longing aroused by someone else's possessions, qualities, or luck."...nah let's just call it envy
  • + 13
 @ryanbpoquette: you mean that commercial?

You don't get what the op said did you?
  • + 3
 @ryanbpoquette: The YT video is flawed. 1st carbon doesnt bend- if it breaks, it breaks hard and Instant.
The carbon layers cracked on the 1st impact- so it wont have original stability- good luck on an harder Impact, atleast Alu bends and youll See it before anything goes wrong (normally).

But people in the comments already figured it out- I can make a video too and make the test in favour of Alu, Just keep that in mind.
  • - 2
 @ryanbpoquette: also a buddy just destroyed his nomad V4 two days ago. He is a little bit faster then me but he don't destroy stuff. I do destroy anything after a few months. But so far my aluminium Spindrift frame with a weight w/o shock @ 3,3 kg did survive and i did rip 3 shocks and 6 derailleurs and one bar so far. He doesn't even had to replace his pedal's. Both frames are 14 months old.
  • - 9
flag ryanbpoquette (Feb 28, 2019 at 5:15) (Below Threshold)
 @Serpentras: not a commercial they were testing their own products aluminum vs. carbon in the same exact tests carbon was superior in every way. At least the way that santa cruz makes them. not all carbon bikes or components are the same obviously, just knock on a trek vs. a santa cruz or ibis and feel/hear the difference. One sounds like wood the others sound hollow.
  • + 18
 @NotNamed: Carbon does bend, and you can engineer it to be very flexy or virtually not at all.
  • + 7
 Actually no, the aerospace industry has done tons of R&D into this and it truly doesn't fatigue. Neither do many metals as long as you don't bend them very far, but that's normally not the case.
  • + 2
 @ryanbpoquette: if you listen to that video it sounds a lot like the carbon bike cracked but didn't completely fail aka the next time out better be ready for a broken frame.
  • + 2
 @ryanbpoquette: I believe a fellow named Greg Minnaar did some real world testing last season instead of dropping weights on a bike at the gym. Yeah, it didn't stand up to snuff.
  • + 11
 @NotNamed: The terms you're searching for are "Carbon doesn't yield". Yielding is a property of metals that gives the toughness you are talking up. Carbon of course does bend elastically and that property is an integral part of some frame and suspension designs. While it does lack toughness, the point at which carbon breaks is far above where aluminum of similar design would yield. Done right, it is an excellent material for rims in most applications.
  • + 2
 @tgent: this is also false. Metal can fatigue off vibrations and small flexions
  • + 22
 Let's play 'spot the second year engineering student'!
  • + 6
 @dkidd: I find the first year physics students more entertaining.
  • - 1
 @ryanbpoquette: That video was the biggest load of marketing bulls**t I've ever seen. If Santa Cruz marketing department said to their engineers "we need to sell alu frames, please do a video of the alu frames looking stronger than the carbon ones" they would do it no problem. Shame so many people fell for that chestnut.
  • + 1
 @ryanbpoquette: Carbon fiber can be assembled to be immensely strong, or extremely delicate. This is where you can tune the attributes of how a frame, wheels or component work together. The way the fibers are oriented, the layering and the resin all work together to produce the end unit. In the case of bike components, composites are subjected to so many different types of forces. Shearing, compression, expansion etc.. All of this eventually fatigues the composites and the laminates begin to separate. A sharp impact to a carbon rim will do the same thing. A rim might look ok, but its hard to see what is happening in the layers of CF. Consecutive impacts will further increase delamination til it eventually fails.

The goal of any composites manufacturer is to mitigate this as much as possible. Toying with resins, prepreg, molds, layups, temperature, pressure, profiles etc. allow the manufacturer alter the lifespan. It's an art and science that takes plenty of time, experimentation and QC.
  • + 0
 @superlightracer: So can metal be made to be very strong and extremely durable. Give me a high quality steel or aluminium frame over an over rated expensive carbon frame any time.
  • + 1
 @Matt76: Sure thing man. Im not saying you should go for one or the other. Just explaining that carbon does have a fatigue life. Different folks, different strokes...
  • + 1
 @NotNamed: I’m glad some people understand this. That video specifically has always bugged me
  • - 1
 @WayneParsons:fat fingered the dislike, Wayne is on point
  • + 24
 Whether these wheels are e-mtb specific or not, whether they were tested outside the design expectations of the wheels, in this case, is neither here nor there. It's a 2 kilo, 3000 usd wheelset that failed on two consecutive occasions. There are 2 kilo wheelsets for a third of that cost that would not fail so immediately.
  • + 7
 Exactly, you can build almost bullet proof wheelsets with alloy rims in that weigh range. I understand the reasoning to use carbon rims if they are somewhat lighter and still able to handle the abuse they were design for. With the weight of a full on DH wheelset, these should be able to survive some rocky trails.
  • + 2
 @FR33DOMdotCOM: * you can build a bulletproof alloy wheelset for 1/3 from true wheel specialist.
  • + 24
 This is full suspension mountainbike. It is literally designed to be smashed into roots and rocks. The rims specifically have technology developed to allow them to be smashed into roots and rocks. It seems like quite a cop out to say they were ridden beyond their intended use.
  • + 14
 No, it's not a mountain bike, it's an ebike.
  • + 23
 So basically any of the people you see with Enve's and thought look like posers, must be posers, because if they rode their bike properly, their wheels would have imploded lol
  • + 21
 Remember, this is a "premium" brand whose sophisticated testing process is literally dropping gym weights on a rim. This is proof that there are some companies out there who are experts in building hype and a brand who also happen to sell carbon rims. $3000 lol.
  • + 20
 If you want carbon, go for WeAreOne Composites agent rims, mine have taken a sh@t kicking and no issues, QC is next to none, hand made in Canada by Rocky and Bullwinkle, lifetime warranty, etc. etc.

They still aren't super cheap, but they aren't the silly money that Enve are asking for rims that are seemingly made out of glass and never get good reviews!

Original Enve's - too stiff, cracked on review - 'New' Enve's - 1. Broke, 2. Sent crap QC items for review (wonder who will get canned for that mistake) 3. Ah well, it was Friday and we got drunk at lunch so just sent something we found in the rejects pile - Response, our products are great, you broke them and its Chris Kings fault they cost so much!
  • + 12
 I've got WeAreOne composite Agent wheels on my Ti hardcore hardtail and there absolutely bombproof. WeAreOne are such a great company to deal with and with a no questions asked lifetime warranty, what's not to like.
  • + 9
 Came here to say the same thing. I weight 200lbs and have a full season of smashing rocks on mine and they are still rolling perfect. Paul Aston needs a pair of these on his moto bike.
  • + 4
 Agree 100%. I’m 230lb RTR and my Agent rims on both bikes are still perfect despite a good amount of abuse. Warranties are nice, but never needing them is even nicer.
  • + 22
 Just got my YT Capra for 2999€. Sorry but no, thank you, no.
  • + 18
 So ENVE is claiming to make the best carbon fibre wheels and blaming the test rider and hub manufacturer in one sentence . . . truly hilarious, they should be a little bit more concerned about this.
I'm using a now 3 year old Hope wheelset, did 2 Megavalanche, a few lokal enduro races, 10 days riding and crashing in Madeira . . .haven´t even had to straiten them once, could be good luck - or just a good product.
  • + 4
 They are only blaming the high price, not the rim failures, on the hubs.
  • + 15
 I wish I read this review before I bought my m730s. Rear lasted 2 months with a double down maxxis before breaking and this was using an enduro wheel on a trail bike! Wasn't concerned due to enve's so called excellent fast turn around on warranty but it took a whole month for a replacement. I can confirm that enve did replace the rim and spokes as promised and the rim strip did its job but a month for a replacement when you spend that much and miss 2 races in your season is very disappointing
  • + 3
 I too have destroyed two ENVE wheels. Once catastrophically, once by delamination. I've ridden alu for probably 20 times the amount of time I was on ENVE's and the worst I've had is broken spokes or a dented rim. Always been able to at least pedal my bike home before ordering a $100 replacement rim.
  • + 16
 Wheels built for the $8000 dollar carbon bike that sits in the garage next to the $67,000 dollar Jeep that's never been off road either. While the owner spins away on a Zwift machine.
  • + 4
 That actually sounds really nice..
  • + 15
 Wow. Came for the comments, but everyone was too stunned to "crack" jokes, so I decided to check the source of the commotion. For once the article was actually more entertaining. Razz
  • + 17
 Throwing the blame at Chris King is a low move. Did your hub fail? Nope. Did your rim explode? Yep.
  • + 1
 Just to be fair he was blaming pricing on the King hubs, not the rim failure
  • + 5
 @bman33: I'm with you! King hubs aren't cheap, but they also stand the test of time!
  • + 4
 @bman33: ENVE M730 wheelset, CK hubs: $4055.30 Canadian
We Are One Agent wheelset, CK hubs: $2297.00 Canadian

No excuses, options can be had at nearly half the price, with lifetime warranty, the same hubs, and better rim quality.
  • + 1
 @spaceofades: you missed my point. I wasn't saying they are better/cheaper. I was pointing out that the Enve guy wasn't blaming the failure on the King hubs, just pricing. I run alloy rims with i9...I am happy
  • + 16
 Enve is overpriced overhyped garbage not worth more than 500 dollars for the wheelset. End of story.
  • + 13
 I'm sure this has been said by somebody already, but I have to say that if you are a premium carbon wheel manufacturer and the reviewer experiences one major failure during the review, wouldn't you go out of your way to make sure that the next rim you sent out was one that passed QC, was packed properly, and represented the brand's mission statement to fullest extent possible. I mean that's what I would do... But, I guess when you have the high-end market cornered and your profit margins are more important than quality, you can exercise poor judgement and then pass the blame to a reputable partner company.
  • + 13
 I've always been disgusted by the Brand name and the implication it puts fourth. I've always been disgusted by the insane price of enve components. I would never buy them for those two reasons. I'm glad to see this article because it actually proves what i always assumed "envy is overpriced shit, and it nowhere near the best"
  • + 12
 Its funny how Enve justify's the cost of there product due to being "built in the USA" and "unparalleled testing and product development" while companies like Guerrilla Gravity are able to do the same things as Enve with a superior carbon product and deliver it at 20% savings to their customers. Enve's excuses as to why their product is more expensive where just blown out of the water by Guerrilla Gravity. You know why Enve hasn't raised their prices in 10 years? Because they over charged when they released the product and are now trying to let the market self correct their greed. Enve is a ripoff.
  • + 11
 This stuff is junk. I have broken two sets of Enve's and will never again buy their wheels for mtb. Sure, they warranty them but it takes 3+ weeks..... They should stick to road and CX bikes. I am curious as to how the Commencal team will fair with them on DH bikes this season?
  • + 28
 they have an unlimited supply courtesy of all the people like you who they tricked into paying $3000
  • - 1
 @ryanbpoquette: Thanks bud, very helpful....
  • + 9
 @mgs781HD: To be fair, he is just pointing out how the insane purchase price allows them to replace all of their failures hassle-free.
  • + 9
 @Rubberelli: Point taken but he is implying that I was tricked and/or taken. I wanted to believe in the made in the USA company and product but it was not money well spent. I would not do it again and feel stupid for giving them a second chance based on my first experience. I am happy that Pink Bike reported their findings so honestly here. I guess my Enve wound is still a little sore!
  • + 2
 @mgs781HD: Maybe not helpful but accurate. What did you need help with?
  • + 6
 @mgs781HD: We still have Guerrilla Gravity frames to be proud of here in the states. No idea where Santa Cruz manufactures the reserve wheels but all hope is not lost. And at more than $2,000 dollars how could one NOT assume that ENVE made good wheels? Especially if you're an honest person, it would never occur to you that ENVE could be full of shit. I'm glad I saw this before I bought anything with ENVE on it, like the Sender CF 9.0 I wanted so bad. I'll gladly take the version with DT Swiss wheels now, thank you very much.
  • - 1
 @patrickbatemanworldtour89: Bonty carbon rims are made in waterloo, usa so we have them too.
  • + 13
 I have to admit, being a hater of the plastic revolution, this article was delicious...... GET OFF MY LAWN!
  • + 12
 Jake needs to go on a few public relations masterclasses after that terrible response.
  • + 3
 Dont worry, its enve they will sell on thier flash looking stickers and wank appeal
  • + 1
 I've thought that with more than a few times I've seen him involved.
  • + 11
 It’s nice to finally see a review acknowledge what people have been seeing happen in the real world with Enve product for years now.
  • + 9
 One rim failure on reasonably brutal trails? That could be an actual, legitimate warranty issue. Manufacturing issues happen.

Two rims, same trails, each lasting roughly the same amount of time under the same riders? Oooookkkkk, could be a weird coincidence or a bad production run, maybe an issue with Enve’s processes.

THREE rims? Sorry, no. That’s a total failure. Enve failed at design, materials sourcing, manufacturing, and QC.

Let’s just call it what it is. These rim failures were a total, catastrophic failure that could have killed someone.

Bigger picture, this points to one of the cycling industry’s biggest problems: the seemingly complete lack of quality control and a total lack of understanding as to how materials, carbon in particular, actually behave.

I don’t think it’s unreasonable for anyone who rides any cycling component made of carbon to now question if it’s safe. Aluminum? Probably just as bad.
  • + 13
 PB should review other carbon wheels the cheaper ones like LB wheels.
  • + 11
 LB FTW.
  • + 5
 @GDPipsqueak: I've had a pair of 29" LB 38mm with DH layup on my e29 for the last 3 years and they are ridiculously good. As a 100kg rider, I was wary of 'cheap chinese carbon' but all chinese carbon is not created equal. Pretty sure my set are only about the same weight as these. I've never had to look at a spoke wrench in 3 years & and I session DH tracks/uplift on it 2-3 times a week. Just because it's Chinese doesn't mean it's c**p. Just like 'made in the USA' doesn't mean it's good.
  • + 5
 I got LB wheels laced to i9 hubs for less than 1200, with 32mm internal width, that I raged all through Pisgah. I broke a front wheel on a black (Bennet Gap), but rather than a catastrophic failure, the tire lost air slowly and I was actually able to blast a co2 in there to get down the rest of the trail. LB warrantied my rim and had the new one to me in just a few days. No issues since then - even running down the notorious Farlow and the wheels are just on a 120mm "low country" bike at that.
I too would like to see a review of the Light Bikes brand. Couldn't be worse than this Enve review!
  • - 4
flag zede (Feb 28, 2019 at 6:59) (Below Threshold)
 @GDPipsqueak: paul Aston destroys pretty much any poor quality components. I doubt it would be different for cheap Chinese wheels.
  • + 5
 You want LB pinkbike review? Look no further

www.pinkbike.com/news/nobl-tr33-wheels-review-2016.html
  • - 1
 @velocitajano: Those aren't LB wheels?
  • + 2
 There was a rumor that Nobl use light bicycle to produce their rims. I'm not sure if it is true though...
  • + 2
 Pinkbike definitely will only test things if they have been handed on silver platter than them. Basically give us free shit and we'll make reviews. LB doesn't need these lousy reviews to make their product better.
  • + 1
 @foggeloggliod: lol how do you think products reviews should work ? Consumer review are worth nothing because since you're paying for the product, you will no be able to test 20 different brands and compare them. Also consumer review turn in fanboy advertisement 95% of the time.
  • + 1
 @zede: you lost me at your rhetorical question...
  • + 1
 I had two LB wheels splinter and crack on me. They were built with 32 spokes and the extra carbon layer for reinforcement. Every option they had to improve durability I selected. I weigh 170 pounds and ride pretty smooth. I'm done with carbon wheels.
  • + 1
 @Nikusmi: what model rim?
  • + 12
 Quality made in the US...what a joke!
  • + 7
 For anyone having a crack at Paul Aston (for actually being able to ride a bike, unlike plenty of other "reviewers"), all this already unfolded once before in 2013 when PB first tested Enve rims. PB must have been asked to remove the photos from the review, but the truth is below: for anyone riding a bike hard in rough stuff - Enve rims have ALWAYS sucked.

www.pinkbike.com/news/Enve-Composites-DH-Wheels-Tested-2013.html
And the photos that were removed:
www.pinkbike.com/photo/8921632
lp1.pinkbike.org/p5pb8921632/p5pb8921632.jpg
lp1.pinkbike.org/p5pb8921708/p5pb8921708.jpg

Nice to see an honest review for once. The truth is, for anyone smacking still smacking a DH bike around hard, the kind of journalism Mike Levy throws around on here is mostly inapplicable. The number of crappy products he raves about that I've destroyed in short order has made me ignore PB's "journalism" for the most part - I think Aston is a refreshing change, and though sometimes a bit quirky, a more realistic source of information. I'm not saying there's no place for average punters reviewing products for average punters, but there's always been a lot of quick young kids on PB and I think it's nice to get the facts out there so they don't waste money on junk. When you don't get gear for free, it needs to last!
  • + 6
 Thanks for the honesty Paul. Being straight forward and honest, isn't being brutal.

Personally, I'm going to scratch Enve rims off my list for future usage (I've ran them in the past) as they seem to be no better than wheels that cost 1/2 as much. I have had good luck with my NOBLs even though I did break 1 rear rim in 18 months and upgraded to the XD version and a Pepi's noodle and have had no more problems since.
  • + 6
 This just confirms my theory that carbon wheels are a poor choice for mountain biking, and envee's response is shocking. For 3 rims to be supplied and all to have an issue I think they really need to look at their quality control
  • + 3
 i still have light bicycle rims (from 2014) on my 29er, raced enduro rode it in the bikepark etc. -best rims i ve ever owned, to date there was not a single problem with them. my new flow mk 3 are also really nice but i also owned countless poor alloy rims (yes i am talking to you Hope), so i guess it always depends.
  • + 2
 Dont hate carbon...I'm still riding 2012 carbon dt swiss xcr 1.2's... broken over 30 spokes on the set but the rims are still 100% perfectly true.
Also have haven carbons and roam 60 carbon wheels.. all awesome and all bought super cheap 2nd hand.
The best upgrade one can make
  • + 2
 Carbon done right is bombproof. These are not done right.
  • + 7
 Hey Envy, let me know if you need a customer service rep who can handle an uncomfortable situation without making everything worse.
  • + 5
 I'm not even going to bother reading ENVE's reply.
This is beyond a failure. I no longer have any enve for the ENVE brand..

I imagine they send out a lot of replacements and that is where the extra MSRP comes from.

I also imagine that those replacements being sent out are likely the "seconds" that dont pass quality control...
  • + 9
 Ex471 FTW Carbon is a backwards step with wheels in Dh and enduro
  • + 3
 Very few people seem to have worked this out yet.
  • + 1
 @panaphonic: took me $1200 and two destroyed wheels. Expensive lesson but now I know.
  • + 5
 Pretty spectacular levels of fail there. Mimics my own experience of running carbon wheels by various brands (including Enve).

I have a set of great aluminium rims which have cumulatively been on the bike longer than all the carbon wheelsets I ran (and subsequently broke) put together.
  • + 5
 ok so while this is probably very frustrating for everyone owning or otherwise involved with Enve, this actually had me thinking: we're so used to having stuff to ride that A) lasts really well and B) costs a fraction of this (heck, my whole bike cost less than this set of wheels)

We are utterly spoilt by a wide range of very good products for competitive prices. I got myself some XM481 rims laced to a stock DT Swiss M1900 wheelset (stock spokes were a plug and play fit too) which run almost perfectly true 2 years later. I'm not the heaviest, nor the most aggressive rider but I don't carry my bike down the trails either so I for one am deeply impressed by what can be had for very little money.

As for Enve: Products fail every now and again and it's ok to a point (depending on how well the company deals with failure). This however looks like major f*ckuppery and I guess there have to be some sort of consequences. I'm sure that this is beyond uncomfortable for them and they will be under pressure to make up for it, especially considering that there's competition out there that is cheaper or more reliable or with better warranty (or maybe even all three). Wish them the best nonetheless.
  • + 8
 Am I reading the transcript from the Jody Wilson-Raybould testimony and Trudeau’s response?
  • + 9
 3k wheels for pottering about forest roads then.
  • + 4
 If Pinkbike wants to write about e-bikes, and e-bike stuff, fine. But could you please label it clearly? or better yet, have a separate front page, or even website for it? While I'm not a hater of e-bikes, I honestly feel it's a different sport. I don't come here to read about world cup downhill ski racing, or sailboat racing, or even motocross racing. e-biking is a different sport from mountainbiking. please, please, please keep em separated. please.
  • + 11
 Its about a wheelset, these wheels don't necessarily have to be fitted to an ebike. I know many folks running guide re brakes on their every day pedal bikes.
  • + 2
 I'm with you. If PB starts putting up Ebike shit I'm out. I'll take trailforks with me but I'll stop coming here. And I've been coming here since you guys were dropping DH bikes to flat off skinnies in Calgary urban.
  • + 1
 Saying that you don’t hate emtb, then hating is incoherent. Grow up and educate yourself, it’s not a different sport, it’s a nuance of the same sport. Personally I ride both, and love them both equally. Granted they are not for everyone, but this type of hate speech is everything wrong with mtb’ing. Thankfully though, you are in the minority now.
Also, this is a review of a wheelset, triggered much?
  • - 2
 @kylemciver: Yep. Ebikes are motor bikes by definition, and have no place on a bicycle forum or trail. Unless the rider has medical problems preventing them from riding a reg bike.
  • + 0
 @RandallFlagg: Where do you see hate? I just said it's a different sport. If you ride both, then you know. Dirt did the right thing by dedicating a separate space for e-bikes. And it goes both ways, e-bike riders probably don't want to read about all the wimpy stuff not suited for their purpose. so it makes sense to have a separate space dedicated to their needs.
  • + 1
 @RandallFlagg:

I’m not hating, and if people have fun that’s great. But it’s fundamentally different, and I come to PB for mountain biking, not E biking.

PB can make the editorial (and financial) decision about where they want to go, but I may choose to no longer support them and visit the site click on their ads.
  • + 4
 Dear Enve or PR guy of Enve,
If you charge me this kind of money, I demand perfection, even if it is a myth. If a rim is missed by QC I would definitely take a look at your QC process or team because this is not acceptable if you charge this kind of money. And if you sell it as a enduro/gravity wheelset(based on the product on your website), don't whine about it that the reviewer should use a DH wheelset when he is putting it to the limit, that's what a review is for. And 3 rim failures for a $3000 wheelset is just not acceptable, even for a $2550 with an in-house developed hub.
Thanks PB for the honest opinion.
  • + 4
 There's clearly a gap between lab testing and reality for carbon. These parts can withstand crazy lab tests, but then fail easily in the real world. I saw 3 exploded Santa Cruz Reserve wheels under pro riders at an international enduro race last year, even though Santa Cruz claims they are nearly unbreakable and can withstand being thrashed with a gajillion lbs of force in the lab.
  • + 2
 agreed, I broke three Reserves in a month on regular after work rides...all side impact damage...that being said the Santa Cruz warranty is quick and easy and replacements show up at no cost to me so I can't complain all that much. It's worth noting that the SC warranty guy I talked to actually asked me if I had a backup wheelset.....pretty funny question considering how those wheels are marketed. The lab is the lab and marketing is marketing.
  • + 4
 Props to Paul and PB for posting an honest but damning review. That VP from Enve should be termed. Did he know his response was going to be public? Yikes. All he had to say was “Sorry, Paul. There’s absolutely no excuse for these quality failures. We’ll do thorough investigation to identify and mitigate the root causes. We’ll send you a new set to test when we are confident the issues have been resolved. In the meantime, try this set of M90s. I hope you’ll find them better suited for your riding.”
  • + 7
 “Sorry we’re not perfect. But Chris King is so that will be $2500.00”
  • + 7
 Pro4 hubs on EX471 rims is all anybody needs, reliable, easy to service and bulletproof.
  • + 3
 I'd go DT 350s to EX511s but I generally agree with you entirely. No need to go carbon when DT alloy exists
  • + 5
 >> but we’ve never pinned a label on ourselves claiming we are perfect.

A price tag north of three grand for a wheel set is pretty much the definition of a label claiming perfection.
  • + 5
 Enve basically claiming Aston is too hard a rider for these rims, or are they saying all ebikers are riding (have to ride) softly exclusively?

Either way, this is really really poor on their side.
  • + 2
 You are correct, they are saying theses rims are strong enough for the average rider and that Paul is beyond that and thus, should have used DH rims on the e-bikes he was testing.
  • + 3
 Just because paul is good doesn't mean he's "harder" on rims than your average park rat. Good riders are smoother and pick better lines, so even though they are faster a worse rider could potentially be harder on rims. Also paul is not a very heavy guy. @Rubberelli:
  • + 2
 @gjedijoe: whatever excuse they can throw out there that sticks is what they are hoping for.
  • + 4
 Finally a honest review I was never planning to buy these over priced wheels in the first place, but now it clarifies to think twice before you do and 5 year warranty on something that is known to break is not better as well. There are so many lifetime warranty wheels in the market does this mean Enve doesn’t have ???? confidence in their product
  • + 7
 All I can say is I love my We Are One rims. Join the movement, join the Revolution, people
  • + 1
 Dont you mean, join the Movement?
  • + 1
 Love mine too. They’ve laughed at everything I’ve thrown at them, and I’m not a small rider.
  • + 5
 I broke two enve wheels, I’m done.
Santa Cruz Reserve is stronger , ride better and are way cheaper.
Enve bars and stems are great but f*ck the wheels!
  • + 3
 Enve is now part of Mavic. My opinion is that is not the best move they made. I own a pair of enve carbon wheels. I must say I don't have issue's so far. But I got them for a really good price. I never pay the full price for these. With the prices for mtb's going up every year, I think in the future enve has no place anymore in mtb scene. That's my opinion.
  • + 2
 You are probably lucky.
  • + 5
 @IntoTheEverflow: well I bet his hometrails are flaaaaat. Look at t that flag Wink
  • + 10
 @Serpentras: No that's not it.
Look right next to that flag, he is lucky.
  • + 1
 Enve and Mavic are two different companies, owned by the same parent company. Mavic was part of the Salomon acquisition; Enve was acquired several years later. Supply chains for the most part are separate.
  • + 3
 Just picked up my hope hoops pro 4 on their 35mm enduro rim, 600 CAD, for the pair, shipped to my door. Thanks, but no thanks, ENVE.... ever. Also, this is an E-MTB wheel, which should never have been here in the first place, so thats karma for ya!
  • + 3
 Failures happen. Nothing is indestructible even @ 3k a wheel. What is unforgivable is fit and finish. You can justify selling these wheels for that price and not make sure every surface and drilled hole is smooth and sanded down. That's just atrocious QC.
  • + 4
 Lmao omg this is hilarious lol why would anyone buy these wheels. There is no way the Syndicate team or danny macaskill could ride these rims for a whole season. They would break within the first 10 min of a ride Eek
  • + 3
 im sure someone has pointed this out already but i haven't ready every comment so... why on earth would they over quote the weight of there wheels? and not even by a small margin the difference was 131 grams! that shows how crazy people are who buy enve wheels. some of the point of carbon is the weight difference so why not advertise that? there whole wheel set line is preposterous to me.
  • + 1
 I've wondered this about other current products too - there's a lot of carbon frames which are ridiculously heavy, for example Transition's carbon frames are as heavy as Giant's older competing alloy frames, and the Transitions break far more often. Canyon is another example (probably worse) - producing some of the heaviest carbon frames in existence. The market base for high end product used to be more critical, checking verified weights at the very least - nowadays I think enduro has drawn in a large market percentage of people with more money and more interest in bragging rights than actual performance. If it's carbon it must be good and light, right?
  • + 4
 Driving a new car off the lot and crashing is usually not due to production issues but operator error. That was a silly example. I don't know how many car wheels or rims fail the first 100 miles of driving it off the lot.
  • + 3
 It is a silly comparison. Just guessing but I think the “operator error” is what they were trying to insinuate.
  • + 6
 I will never buy an ENVE rim again!!! That's what I would say if I could afford to own one in the first place lol!
  • + 2
 Lol
  • + 1
 Gave up on them, when the rest of their parts where made over seas
  • + 5
 I'll just be over here on my Spank Spike wheels that are lighter and 1/5th the cost ... (And don't disintegrate when I ride on them)
  • + 3
 I’ve dented tons of aluminum rims, all of them were rideable with a little hammer a plier work, but never have I suffered a catastrophic failure that made me crash.

So let me get this right: Enve wheels are really expensive, easily broken, and the only response from the manufacturer was to get their heavy duty rim next time?

I think Enve stock just took a dump.

If I was in the market for carbon rims, I’d buy the ones that wee ridden hard by some trials rider, sans tires, for hours and just kept on ticking... Santa Cruz I believe.
  • + 3
 id like to know what tires he ran he did say he downsized the front. well on a wide rim thats asking for a disaster.. not to mention the casings hes running. but given the price of the rims they should be near perfect.. i work at a shop and we got an enve rim display and they claim to be perfect molds with no imperfections then you see this review and they look like shit.. then passing the buck off to chris king was pretty low too. explain why your own manufacturing is so expensive and maybe i would have sympathy for a mistake happening.
  • + 11
 I used Minion DHF 2.5" with a DH Casing, 24/26psi, and Schwalbe Eddy Current 2.4" with Super Gravity casing at 24/26psi.
  • + 4
 I thought the protective rim strip was supposed to keep the tires inflated even in case of rim breakage. Obviously that hasn’t worked well either.

Seriously damning review this one.
  • + 3
 Woah. Did Enve not pay their advertising dues to get hammered this badly? It's tough making things in the US with a less skilled and less diligent workforce that gets paid 4-6X as much as overseas. Hope they can fix these issues and get back on track.
  • + 3
 2,000g wheelset too, woof.

I had like 7,000 miles on a Light Bicycle wheelset on my CX bike and never had issues. Rigid frame, tiny 35-40mm tires, riding mtb trails at times (nothing black diamond of course but still).
  • + 2
 From a point of view,the Enve's response is wrong. Now I prefer another brand but I used to love Envy so much. Considering the lifetime warranty system, it is not bad to use a carbon wheel. Even now, I am still using carbon wheels well. enve,weareone,china..
  • + 2
 I will still continue to run Enve products. I have broken EVERY brand of Carbon wheel I have tried. Enve is still the only company that replaced my product 100% free of charge. It is also that ONLY company that didn't blame me for the damage to the wheel.
  • + 3
 I have heard of many many Enve rims cracking, several world cup mechanics have said teams crack rims on every single run. Reynolds or Santa Cruz rims if you want a carbon wheelset to last!
  • + 2
 Pretty much sums up the experience one of my good friends (who is a sponsored Cannondale factory Enduro racer btw) has had. He would go through 3-5 sets of ENVE wheels every single season, and I've witnessed it first hand on his bike while riding with him!! He's a small dude too... MAYBE 140lbs soaking wet with a backpack on.

He swapped over to i9 wheels a few seasons ago, and has literally only broken 2 spokes in 2 seasons. I'll stick with i9 myself.

Never been a fan of carbon wheels for offroad use. The types of side-loading, and impacts an MTB wheel takes just isn't the best environment for them. Cool looking, stickered up, whatever... they just freakin FAIL.
  • + 4
 Enve? I thought they were decal manufacturer. They built tall rim to fit those big beautiful sticker, so your fellow biker can see ur 3k decals from mile away.
  • + 4
 The ENVE warranty doesn't compete with the likes of We Are One, Raceface or e13 even. Didn't like them before, definitely don't like them now.
  • + 6
 Heavy, weak, expensive - Choose 3
  • + 2
 "First, there is this concept around perfection that consistently comes up whenever anything goes wrong with an ENVE product based on the price of our products. Let’s be clear, perfection is a myth. For ENVE, it’s certainly the goal, but we’ve never pinned a label on ourselves claiming we are perfect. Quite the contrary, we strive daily to be better in all aspects, but it’s a journey and we don’t mask the imperfections of our products behind a façade of filler and paint. That said, it puts that much more responsibility on our QC teams who are people and sometimes people make mistakes. Should Paul have received a rim with a fiber peel and imperfectly drilled spoke holes? Absolutely not. When we screw up, we own it and take care of the customer no questions asked. It is ENVE’s long-standing warranty and leading reputation for customer support that has forced the carbon wheel market to offer the aggressive lifetime warranties that they do today."

Except that 'mistake' at QC costs the $3K wheelset buyer another 2-3 weeks missed riding time, which ight be critical if they are a professional biker (guide, reviewer, racer) unless they also have the money to own a back up set of wheels (which I used to have when I was riding ENVE). I have been riding on another brand's wheels for two hard years now and I no longer feel the need to keep a 'back up' set of alloy wheels to cover me for warranty repairs.
  • + 2
 Definitely a bummer to hear these wheels faired so poorly and that the replacements that were sent out were in that kind of condition. I have ridden ENVE's for over 5 years through the different rim designs, have had multiple sets with only 1 cracked rim during that entire time. When it happened I realized I would have destroyed ANY carbon or alloy rim due to the large sharp rock I hit at speed coming off of the spine on the Crest Trail in Park City with WAY too low of air pressure. Totally my own fault. I contacted ENVE that day and they were awesome about getting my rim replaced quickly and even gave me a loaner rear wheel to use being I was not far from their headquarters in Ogden. I can't think of many companies that would have offered that up?

The other thing that's funny about this reviewers feedback is he tested the new GT Fury a few weeks back and broke the main pivot on that bike twice. I have been riding a pre production Fury (the same one he was testing) through several days (6) in the Whistler Bike Park last season with no issues. In fact looking at Paul Astons stats I weigh WAY more than him and still have a perfectly in tact Fury. Sure it can be argued "I may not ride as fast" or "go as big" as him but I highly doubt it? Sounds to me like this reviewer likes to ride off the bike of the bike and just plow through stuff? Maybe? Maybe not? Just an opinion but if you try.....no matter how expensive or cheap a part or bike is you can break anything.
  • + 6
 Why is Pinkbike reviewing ebike parts in the first place?
  • + 2
 We will be force fed this eBike crap. All the publications are doing it too. Which especially hurts when you pay for the magazine. Its like getting articles on yachts in your fishing mag. No one cares. There is a prime market for a pure MTB outlet. I just checked and www.puremtb.com is available. Anyone? Anyone?
  • + 1
 I can't tell if you're serious with the question about reviewing ebike parts, or troll.
  • + 4
 @Leppah: Serious. If I wanted to read about ebike stuff I'd go to a site devoted to ebiking, like MTBR. We come to Pinkbike to read about mountain biking. Mixing the two may be what the ebike sellers want, but it's not what PB readers want.
  • + 2
 how can enve say he should run the dh wheels instead when he is riding an ebike not a dh bike! Especially when he is riding a blue trail. Absolute joke and then to say they own there mistakes and continue on to say a car can be crashed straight out of the showroom, what's that about if I bought a car and the wheels fell apart driving on normal roads as it was intended I'm pretty sure there would be a massive recall from the supplier not turn round and say you should of bought are 4x4 wheels so to speak! And last but not least let's blame Chris king for the prices lol please Chris king stop dealing with these idiots! Ps I have run light bicycle rims with no problems whatsoever and guess what I even managed to ride dh on you guessed it enduro rims and they didn't eat themselves for breakfast Enves response should of been we are removing this line up until we have got all problems dealt with and we will be supplying all rims purchased with a brand new set of m9 wheels and we will pay all postage and packing Shocking to say the least!
  • + 3
 He is saying " you should have used our other, non-Ebike wheels on those e-bikes you were testing."
  • + 2
 I know a DH racer who's team smashed 10 x m9 rims at fort William the other year. It's all kept quiet. I've had a go of the m9 wheels and they are way too stiff, there are lots of alternative wheels out there. Give me a quality aluminum rim any day.
  • + 2
 You cannot charge a premium price on the basis that a wheel is entirely made in America, implying it is better made than one made in the far east, when it is not. These are the sort of issues you'd expect to see on a cheap ebay special.
  • + 5
 for that price, someone could really check them before sending out of the company
  • + 4
 my new bike came with flow mk3 rims - tubeless conversion was done in 20 min for both wheels, got plenty of rockstrikes -no problem -end of story
  • + 2
 Wow what a few days it's been! Between being able to pay more for less reliable wheels to paying more for TLD pants that make it look like youre only wearing Adidas, to seeing Pirelli enter the mtb tire market... id say the industry has figured out that we are really no better than roadies afterall!
  • + 2
 The M60 HV have worked well for me in rocky Arizona for years. I ride then as anyone else would and had only one random crack in the rim. I seriously looked back at a non rocky area where it happened and still cannot figure out what punctured the tire/cracked the rim. I dropped it at the local shop they were purchased from and about two weeks later I had a new rim on my hub. My total was $20 for shipping.

And yeah, the difference in the ride quality between a carbon rim and an aluminium rim is extremely different.

And yeah, I don't believe the random defense/finger pointing the Enve guy went on spoke to the issues of the test. I don't believe the it was the right response or time to grand stand about a rim strip. I paid a lot for my wheels, you can afford a better PR person at Enve.
  • + 4
 After years of wanting a set, i broke down and bought some 70/30HV 29s on sale for over 40% off. The first thing i noticed was how harsh the ride was compared to the stan's flows they replaced. Harsh to the point that no amount of suspension tuning or tire combos would fully alleviate it. I haven't had any rim failures/warranty issues as they are on an XC/Trail bike in central texas but can say their finish quality leaves a lot to be desired. The hoops have a large patch to cover the hole from where ENVE removes the bladder that makes sealing the rim for tubeless with anything other than their overpriced duct tape next to impossible. There was also some debris that rattles around in one of the hoops and the carbon seems to hold some sort of release agent that wont allow the gorilla tape to stick to it like normal rims. No matter what i prepped the hoops with, it took TWO full wraps of enve (gorilla) gaffer tape and inflating a tire/tube combo for 24 HRS to get the tape to stick. God help you if you get a flat on the trail or on a trip where you peel the tape back upon removal of the tire, which is almost guaranteed because its so thick from TWO f@cking wraps of tape. I contacted ENVE and they were little help and just recommended watching their installation videos but also mentioned they would offer a retrofit rim strip for older hoops in the coming months. A year later, there was no strip and they said one wouldn't be offered. I ended up using a Effetto Caffelatex rimstrip and it has solved the sealing issues for almost the same price as the gaffer tape and a lot less weight, bulk and leftover residue. Upon seeing the newer M series i was considering trading mine in or selling but this article has sealed the deal. At this point, I totally regret spending the money on these wheels and will be buying DT Swiss aluminum moving forward.

Sorry for the long winded post

rant/off
  • + 2
 @ATXZJ:

Sincerely that experience does sound awesome at all. Mine has been very different. I shared mine as a perspective as many seem to go to the negative on these posts. I wanted to point out that my experience has been very good.

When it comes to products that we all pay for, it helps to get the feedback from others. I am honest in my assessments to help others. With my 27 years of mountain biking pretty aggressively I think at times it has helped others when I have provided feedback. Just don' get me started on the garbage they call SRAM Guide Brakes. Still figuring out how to make jewelry or something out of those since they are useless two months into using them when the levels seize. LOL
  • + 1
 @vjunior21: No worries man, we all have our likes and dislikes about products. I replied to your post only because like me, you had the older HVs. Check out those caffelatex strips the next time you have to service your tape/sealant. Totally worth the money.
  • + 2
 @ATXZJ:

Sounds good. Thanks for the tip. And if you are ever in the market to buy your lady some Sram Guide brake lever earrings...you let me know. I can offer the brake calipers, affixed to the top of rings to wear on her fingers, free with purchase of the earrings. LOL
  • + 1
 @vjunior21: Hah! Ill keep that in mind....
  • + 2
 I'm not sure why, but this kinda makes me happy. I've felt ever since Jason Schiers left ENVE the product quality has slipped, and the pricing hasn't reflected the quality. I hope this helps put the Reserve wheels at the top of the high end wheel market.
  • + 2
 "What is in play here is that the testers for this E-MTB specific spec M735 have exceeded the abilities of the product, but this is not the experience that our customers are having." ENVE, expert E-Bike trolls, Circa 2019
  • + 4
 Newest ENVE promotion: Free carbon full face helmet included with each M735E wheelset.
  • + 1
 If you're not PERFECT stop pricing your PRODUCTS as if though they are PERFECT. Simple as that. This is what happens when Amer sports, who also owns Mavic, buys out a once excellent product...turning it to SHIT. Just look at the brands under the Amer sports umbrella, none are leaders in their segments.
  • + 1
 LOL. Salomon is the #1 alpine boot manufacturer by a long shot, Atomic is the #2 alpine boot manufacturer AND #1 alpine ski manufacturer. Armada has sick skis, Arc'teryx makes legit awesome outerwear, and so does Peak Performance. Say what you want about Enve, but other brands within Amer Sports are legit solid.
  • + 1
 Meanwhile... I'm still rocking an 8 year old set of AtomLabs, that are dirt jumped, ridden hard, and for the last 5 years have been missing a spoke from picking up a branch on a DH course.... on a hardtail. Still straight, true, and center.
  • + 5
 Lesson: don't ride e-bikes
  • + 1
 I have some carbon on my bike but will never spend £2k on rims! Especially, when you can get excellent and more reliable Stan Flows for a fraction of the price...arguably better performance too.
That reply from Envy rep is a sort of reply that will sit well with the Envy core customer base...people who have more money than sense...and like to brag about components rather than just go out and enjoy riding.
  • + 1
 I'm sorry but at that price point I do expect perfection, I appreciate that some products may fail to achieve this but carbon splinters and miss aligned spoke holes should of 100% been picked up in QC.

I have carbon frames and bars but wheels are where I draw the line. One of my riding buddies went through 3 Enve am rims in a season and two DH rims (separate bikes). Enve were brilliant and replaced no quibble but that doesn't make up for lost riding time and being stranded half way around a 40km loop. I'd rather take the negligible hit on weight and use an rim that will accept the treatment dealt out by an aggressive rider.
  • + 1
 If it breaks on the first ride, that doesn't mean that the product is inferior to the one breaking on the 100th ride...what a joke!
But then Paul says this, "I understand the price can be justified by Enve and their US-manufacturing and testing methods, but at this price, I would expect every product to be perfect. These failures were dangerous and should never happen in such a short period of time." How can that ridiculous price be justified when it puts riders in danger? It really is time to put away the notion that carbon is better than aluminum for MTB rims. They simply can't hold up. I have SPANK Vibrocores and they have far superior feel to them in corners and in the rough stuff. I don't get the obsession with carbon rims.
  • + 1
 Metal for things that get bashed with rocks, carbon for things that don't. That's my rule. I pretty much only run carbon bars, cause they genuinely feel nice, but most other applications outside of a front triangle seem unnecessary and over priced.
  • + 1
 I'd like to see the same testing of these rims on a normal MTB not a couple of massive E-bikes, maybe you need 2600g of carbon material to take the pounding those lead sleds give to wheelsets when they land on any kind of rock. Perhaps in theory normal MTB parts are ok on E-bikes but Reality requires something quite different, I haven't heard of Enve products failing like this before, maybe this was a bad batch.
  • + 4
 I get that e-bikes are heavier but riders vary quite a bit in weight. Paul isn't exactly a heavy guy. If a 200lb rider was on a normal enduro bike would you expect them to fail?
  • - 3
 @mtmc99: Rider weight doesn't matter as much. A heavy rider can "ride light" but a heavy bike is a heavy bike.
  • + 3
 I'm quite happy with my fully alloy shred sled, and I didn't have to sell my testicles to a Russian science lab to afford it.
  • + 2
 Enve should send a pair of these wheels to Danny Macaskill so he can test them like he tested the Reserves, then the real truth will come out. But if Macaskill isn't comfortable with that I could understand why.
  • + 1
 I have to admit that when I got my M70's I was disappointed in the finish to the point where I took pictures and emailed Enve to ensure they weren't defects got an email back confirming this was part of the layup process and was perfectly normal. These were a huge treat to myself and was a touch disappointed!! I ran them for 2 seasons racing SCOTTISH enduro series and the Megavalanche without any issues!!! Would I buy another pair?? No chance, they look sick but to stiff and way to expensive!
  • + 1
 Will I buy another pair of Enve's. No, nowhere close to being a good value. Went full blown retail therapy after a breakup. Engagement ring money goes far. But, my M630s have been rock solid on some incredibly tough trails. Not as light as the Traverse Fattie SL wheels I've had before but the Enves ride better and are still stiffer.
  • + 2
 BwaaaHaaHaa! Betting there were some folks at Enve having one hell of day yesterday... Their response was absolutely deplorable and that alone would be cause for some folks getting their walking papers
  • + 1
 a lot of how long your wheel set will last in conditions they was testing has gotta be down to tyre choice and pressures also, I think tyre choice on ebikes for aggressive riding is critical, more so than on normal bikes. Your going to crack carbon rims with piss poor tyres or too low pressures on super rocky technical high speed terrain, like your gonna bend alloys ones.

only tyres I have found that arnt to flexi and can handle the Rocky Peaks etc. and extra weight and speed that the ebike can maintain/carry over rough terrain are Schwalbe super gravity/DH tyres, everything else will just flex and cause huge impacts and bend my rims, unless I run crazy pressures.
  • + 1
 I own 3 sets of Enves, M60, M70 and M90.... ive cracked 1 M70 rim, which was replaced within a week, so not too bad, but since then all have been perfect, other than changing tyres on the 70's and 90's which is a pain in the arse!
  • + 1
 A lot of comments in here suggest people don't understand WHY Enve wheels are so much more expensive. Many of you are correct in saying Enve may not be much higher quality than other, cheaper manufacturers. But what you're missing is that Enve is know for very comprehensive warranty coverage, which is why their wheels are more expensive. Would you rather pay $2,000 for a set of wheels that you know you can get replaced in the case of defects, or would you rather pay $1,200 for a pair with only a 50% chance of getting warranty coverage? With Enve, the premium you're paying is basically an insurance policy on your wheels.
  • + 1
 cool, do they also have an insurance policy on your broken ass neck from their failed ass wheel too?
  • + 2
 @zephxiii: It's callds GFYS insurance. Wink
  • + 1
 ENVE sucks and are greedy. When they got interviewed by bike mag at the factory, they all seemed like corporate types instead of bike people. This doesnt mean much since the bigger brands would look the same in any interview, but just something about them. Greedy, greedy, greedy. Youre wheels are not worth this much money.
  • + 1
 Came across this article due to searching for information about carbon wheels. I’ve been rocking a set of Ibis 938 AL wheels for about 2k miles (without issues) and was looking to upgrade to carbon; however, I’m a little deterred at this point because of this article. Not sure if Carbon wheels are in my future now. Thanks PB for the honesty.
  • + 1
 I think this dude needs to chill out a bit, mistakes happen and its possible that he received a defective rim, with that said you would not expect spending that much money on a wheel set to have to deal with any problems. but I am sure if you called them up, they would give you a new set with out questions. also carbon when it brakes is vary sharp, not sure if any one has broke or seen broken carbon but its like fiber glass so, one would expect when broke that it would be sharp. the writer should have know this and maybe wore gloves or something. he is acting like they should give him something because he got cut lol. I think this is a little bit unfair to the envy in a way, but thats a lot of money for a wheel set I would expect perfection. but the heated article and blown out of proportion injury is a bit extreme, acting a bit dramatic as if he exposed some kind of scandal, and looking for some kind of shady lawyer. not sure about you all but I have had expensive defected parts before and some stuff under perform, its not the end of the world call them up and get it fixed. you don't have to sink then company over one rim, you probably just got some poor dude fired from a job he enjoys in the bike industry.... BTW I don't ride envy I9 is my brand!
  • + 1
 "ENVE goes into receivership post an honest review"

I also know 4 riders who've bought ENVE road rims and have had cracks / bubbles warrantied.... but at the cost of other potential failure have sold on and bought another brand....
  • + 1
 So crazy how one review on Pinkbike has really sullied the Enve name. You would think they made sure they sent the most indestructible wheel they had to Pinkbike for a wheel. I am curious to know if they are going to take a significant hit in sales loss.
  • + 1
 I know your right but its a mistake i bet that 99% of there wheels are good to go
  • + 1
 In 2012--
"ENVE Composites is using Zyvex Technologies' nano-enhanced carbon fiber technology in a new line of wheel rims for downhill mountain bike racing. The rims are said to out-perform and out-last traditional alloy rims."
www.compositesworld.com/news/enve-bike-rim-integrates-zyvex-technologies-nanocomposites

Are they using this tech in the tested wheelset? Or any current wheelsets? Since the acquisition by Amer Sports? A S also bought Mavic, a brand that appears from their offering to know little about mtbiking.
  • + 1
 Have M70hv and Nextie Premium xm36 and what i can say.... the 5-6 times cheeper Nexties are absolutely the same quality and specification as my M70. Nextie have also QC e t c. So there are no GODS produce the carbon rims , it have nothing magical in Enve producs except good(stupid) marketing which i ate (yes) and mindless prices. The warranty service are the same at Nexties so where is the wite rabbit guys?
  • + 3
 Santa Cruz Reserve Carbon with I9 hubs for 1,800 USD with lifetime warranty. Why would anyone pay this kind of money for wheels? My Reserves have been flawless.
  • + 1
 Chris King hubs drive price to where it is? I am picking up my wheelset today with new I9 Hydra's laced to NOX Kitsuma's for $1200 less than these and will have no worries on those rims as NOX Farlow's have been stellar. Will definitely not use ENVE carbon bar...
  • + 1
 Might be worth the chance to buy 3-4 pairs of knock off hoops for the same price of one Enve's and see who is the winner at the end of the season...BTW, gotta love that last sentence from Enve ""We are looking for ways to make ENVE wheelsets more accessible to more people. As proof, you can see that with the launch of I9 hubs to our M Series offering, we’ve been able to lower the MSRP of an ENVE M Series wheelset to $2550 which is nearly a 10% reduction from what we’ve had to charge in the past.""

Looks like they really redeemed themselves at being soo cheap to buy now.... Smile
  • + 1
 Its an extremely simple solution to this. Dont waste your money on overpriced carbon products and buy metal ones! Ive never trusted carbon on bike and i never ever will. Stick with metal, at least you know where you stand and you can always ride without the little niggle in your mind whether it will fail or not.
  • + 1
 Race Face makes a very nice Carbon wheelset(Next R) and cost $1500usd I've been riding them for an entire season now without any issues, plus they have a 2 Year No Fault Guarantee. To me reading this article all I can think about is how unsafe riding a set of Enves would be. Seems like they really need to focus more on their R&D and QC before releasing new wheels. Seems like their quality has only gone down since Amer Sports bought them.
  • + 3
 "Nobody is perfect" *send out a $3000 wheel with carbon flaking so badly it spears the reviewer's finger and almost ends a cyclist's season*
  • + 2
 Only wheelset I have ever broken in 50+ years of riding: Enve. Carbon MTB all-mountain 27.5 and it was broken within the first year. I now spend less and get better products. Oh, well.
  • + 1
 I broke a rear mt70 Enve rather easily on a small.drop.to roller at Whistler. Took me almost 2 months to get a warantee replacemwnt! Sold the set as soon as I got it. To be fair I have broken several carbon rims from different manufacturers except my we are 1 outlier rims which i have heard so horrible bottom out noises from but have never cracked yet Smile
  • + 1
 So they're just as heavy-if not heavier than their WAY cheaper aluminum counterparts- and have a tendency to EXPLODE while being ridden-something I've never experienced nor even heard of with an aluminum rim- instantly putting the rider in an out-of-control situation, and cost THREE TIMES as much as a top of the line aluminum wheelset. Oh yeah, Enve's NUMBER ONE!
  • + 2
 Good honest reporting PB. Finally confirmation that premium prices don’t always equal a premium product. I don’t ride Chris king stuff but there legit, should dump enve.
  • + 1
 First a $3K wheel set should not be failing on a basic rocky trail. I have trashed a few alloy wheel sets from doing dumb stuff but I should have to worry about imminent failure in the first couple of miles on a trail, warranty or not that's asking for increased injury to riders.
Second it was not the Chris King hubs that were this issue it was the carbon rims snapping and bring them up as a negative was poor form.
Third for 3,000 frikn' dollars I would expect a PERFECT wheelset in every way, if it comes with sharp fibers all over it its dumpster material.
I got my first set of Nobles last fall and was hesitant to try carbon hoops but i have been very happy. they are extremely durable and for half the cost of Enve what a load of BS.
  • + 1
 you make a good point
  • + 1
 I guess enve didn't want to pay for their review as an add... Brutal PB. Also Jake's response is garbage, "with its introduction warranty rates between our old M70 and the new M7 Series have been reduced from just over 3% to 1%" Its easy to have a reduction if people stop buying your product. One ruined weekend due to poor QC and I wouldn't buy or recommend it.
  • + 1
 I built a sketchy home made ebike that hits 60kmh. I probably spent about $130 on the wheels not including the massive hub motor. I wish i could show you a video of how hard I monster truck my cheap ass ebike to show how bitch these enve wheels are. All this carbon and light weight expensive shit makes no sense to me especially on a motorcycle. Just get a bigger motor it's not a bicycle.
  • + 1
 i can understand carbon rims for People on a well funded race team, Journalists who get given them to play on, millionaire posers. It makes no sense at all otherwise. pretty much how i feel about carbon anywhere on a bike. Use Halo rims and they might outlast you.
  • + 4
 I just wish I could afford a whole bike that cost as much as those wheels...
  • + 1
 So with enve you are buying in to some sort of replacement program where you get an average set of wheels with flash stickers on them and they send out a new set when you eventually snap them? I wonder how many wheels they budget in for the purchase price?
  • + 4
 I know a bunch of guys who buy Enve's and/or carbon bikes, cracking them fairly regularly and send them off to be replaced several times. They think the quick, hassle-free replacement is worthy of brand loyalty.
  • + 4
 That's what happens when companies sell out....just try to maximize profits instead of performance.....RIP Enve
  • + 2
 I have ENVE m90 which came on the bike, and I love them... The ENVE QC dude needs to be fired. 2 (at least)below par rims passed inspection and the rims where for a PB review? Seriously, someones ass needs booting.
  • + 4
 Maybe the guy is the first whistle blower of MTB history. Letting everyone know how absurd it is to pay so much for such ENVE crap.
  • + 2
 I think its fair to say carbon rims are a fad that has come and is now on its way to being gone, save for xc trail bikes. For anyone who rides hard it is just a waste of time, il stick to ally.
  • + 1
 Like the fact they mention using I9 hubs as an improvement... My mate rides I9 wheel sets and gives them as much punishment as any rider could (such as darkfest!) and they take it in their stride. They look sick, sound good run fast, are really light and strong as an Ox. I certainly wouldn't chose carbon given this review!
  • + 4
 I have a set of M735 for sale right now in the Buysell. Guess I better lower my price...takers?
  • + 1
 It looks like carbon rims are kind of the worst idea for an MTB upgrade. They are perfect for road bikes, still getting damaged more often than alloy wheels and breaking in a way alloys don't. It's hard to justify the price, I hope guys at Enve will sort this out and at least pretend more to be perfect. For 3K bucks for a wheelset, they better be.
  • + 2
 Every owner(who can ride properly) of Enve carbon wheels I've ever met has had to send them back for breakages. They're heavy, expensive and weak. If you want carbon you're better off going cheap and Chinese.
  • + 2
 Buy these wheels and a Trust fork you are out 6000$ and you are no where close to having a complete bike. Throw in a plastic frame your up to 9000$ . Do you have a full bike now? Nope not even close! Holy f.ck!
  • + 3
 Remember when everyone rode aluminum trims and there was no concern for any kind of lifetime warranty because a 2000g wheelset was bomb proof? I do.
  • + 5
 Stans mk3, hope hubs, j bend spokes 32 at each end. job done, easy.
  • + 1
 If they were on a regular bike instead of a moped they would have been fine....

Seriously though, what’s going to happen when all these “new riders” that we are depending on to “grow the sport” start having problems like this. It will be more demoralizing that having to pedal up hill. Could you imagine if this was the generic “old guy with a heart problem who wouldn’t be riding if. It for an ebike”? He would have been killed by these wheels!
  • - 3
 Not sure if this is trolling or retardation?
Some points
1, ‘new riders’ are not going to be riding enve rims and even if they were you really think they could snap them?
2, Same applies for old guy on an e bike
3, Its YOUR job to grow the sport, not the new people coming in to it.
  • + 0
 @zyoungson: wait, when did this become MY job???
  • + 1
 Enve you done messed up! And even worse with the response! Kind of sad, but also kind of don't care for enve products anymore since they sold out....would rather support a smaller American company who hasn't sold out.
  • + 1
 "The Chris King hub is spec’d for the E-MTB build because it passes all the durability/reliability requirements for use with E-MTB."

Shame the rim doesn't pass all the durability/reliability requirements.
  • + 4
 Damn. Wasn't sure what to expect but I didn't expect that.
  • + 2
 I work in aerospace making layup and routing tooling. Bicycle industry carbon fibre is fucking garbage compared to aerospace.
  • + 1
 I wish someone could do a review of the Mavic XA Elite wheelset. Hub design for the straight pull spokes is just terrible. In one year, i broke at least 3 spokes and changed the wheel twice.
  • + 3
 I’ll stick with AL rims and lose a pound by drinking less. Its way cheaper and you don’t look like a poser that way.
  • + 2
 Thank you Paul for being HONEST, I really appreciate that. That is how every review should be, no matter what the brand is. Thanks again.
  • + 3
 Santa Cruz Reserves ftw! 1,000+ fast miles in the past six months - still as true as the day I bought them
  • + 4
 Wow, @paulaston -- you managed to break the rims *and* the Internet!
  • + 1
 This is great. Reminds me of the video where Singletrack Sampler's carbon Spot bike broke and a Spot spokesman came in the comment section making matters worse.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=cw5QQyJSyso
  • + 1
 The only carbon parts I like, would be the handlebars and seatpost, they seem to slightly dampen the vibrations (I ride a hardtail). As for rims, I'd stick to quality aluminum;!
  • + 1
 This confirms my decision to not ride carbon wheel sets for sure! Besides, given the high prices and the fact that they are barely any lighter than alloy, why would I take the risk?
  • + 1
 Saw & heard a rear rim fail catastrophically last weekend. I have carbon wheels (bontrager) and all these failures make me want to go build up a set of alloys, at least if i blow up an alloy rim its $100 not $500+
  • + 0
 This is an insane review. need more popcorn. It is interesting to see many of the people behind Enve have left recently, and then to see this.


Also, I have a pair of LB downhill rims on my SB66. Cracked the front pretty bad somehow after two seasons, not a a catostrophic failure but I am done with carbon anything on my bike. I think it worked great as a rim, and I must say LB was great to deal with, but the big issue in my opinion is carbons poor performance near the spoke holes. I believe what happened with my rim is a spoke was over tensions and popped through the laminate allowing further cracking. Aluminum is just so much tougher in this critical area that while a carbon rim might be stiffer and "better" while perfectly set up they are much more prone to failure from slight maladjustment.

Also, my LB rims could not keep a tire on at higher pressures. I usually like to pump my tires up a bit higher for the road ride to the trailhead, and multiple times the rear exploded off the wheel blowing sealant everywhere. Never any higher than 40psi mind you. under 30psi and they seemed fine but still was quite the day wrecker to have your tire explode before even hitting dirt.

I also have carbon Easton DH bars (havocs or something I forget, 35mm clamp) and they are junk. They are light sure, but the amount of creaking and upward flex they have when pulling up on the bars is not cool. backsweep is also strange too. Have a pair of Renthalls sitting and waiting to be put on and will be building up some new aluminum wheels as well (anyone have some good 26" wheels with strong high engagement hubs they are trying to sell?

For real people, stop buying carbon! When your aluminum bike parts finally expire they get turned into beer cans and if you dont want to deal with disposing of them your local scrappers will pick that stuff up from the curb in minutes. That really should be the end all arguement for us! At most you can save 2 lbs from your bike, just take a dump and get a little stronger!
  • + 2
 An honest review from Pink Bike.. Thats good new for us.. and to me its another upvote for WEAREONE composites.. Love my Agent 29s.. going on 2 years of perfection..
  • + 2
 So you can build 4 sets of DT Swiss wheels (ex511 or ex471 rims on DT350 hubs) @$750 each before you hit $3085 Enve pricey point? Really????
  • + 3
 That was...brutally honest. Hats off to Paul! For that price tag wheels should be "landmine-proof".
  • + 1
 Good job PinkBike! At that price, which is considerably higher than equivalent technology, a buyer will really expect perfection. You might not say or claim to be perfect, but the price somehow implies it.
  • + 4
 Expensive, weak, heavy, choose all
  • + 2
 Perfection is a myth? That’s because you don’t know me! ????
Kudos to PB for the first ever honest review in the history of the bike review crap.
  • + 0
 Collabs holes after connecting spokes and hubes in M90 - the were new! Than, 10 month later of guaranty I was riding the new M930 rims. I was ridden 3 times DH and the rim in the rearwheel was broken. Tire was a DHR II and 2.2 bar. It takes 8 weeks of guaranty...not bad i guess, lol. Enve is only a myth. If you have to much money spend it in holiday Wink .
  • + 0
 Wow. Being proud of 10,000ppm. Well done you. In every other industry this would cause a fookin recall. Is there actually one rim, that survived a pb review? Please stop making carbon and endangering our health, enve. Thank you.
  • + 4
 SC Reserve seems to be the way to go for carbon wheels.
  • + 3
 Yes would like to see these tested in the same way as these enve one were. Especially as I have just purchased a set!
  • + 2
 Reserves have issues of their own as well, they are not as flawless as the marketing suggests (I broke three rims in a month during the fall). That being said they cost more than $1000 less than the Enves and SC replaces broken rims for free so they are certainly a better deal
  • + 5
 WE ARE ONE...that is all
  • + 1
 Truth.
  • + 3
 How to ruin your brand image in one e-mail? Good job Enve for exposing yourself, like seriously bravo.
  • + 2
 This made me laugh Smile )
  • + 2
 wow, this is just wow, price, material aside this is really frustrating that equipment failed under designed purpose which could lead to the ride injuries.
  • + 4
 Emtb wheels, stopped reading
  • + 4
 lol
  • + 1
 Exact same #f*ckebikes
  • + 0
 @excavator666: Wow, i'm just not riding an ebike, it would have been the same if it was about gravel or fatbike wheels. I still don't like moped whit pedals, that new Lapierre with a little electric assist is not so bad.
  • + 1
 I have 5 seasons on a v1 set of Industry Nine Torch Enduro (aluminum) wheels working as a mtn bike photographer shooting for Big Mtn Enduro and various other races with ZERO failures.
  • + 1
 Wanted carbon rims. Will wait til they cost half the price. Not the first time I've heard stories and seen pics. If price is an issue getting meh parts on bikes, maybe the business model is wrong.
  • + 0
 I don't mind about this review anyway... I would never ever buy a 3K wheelset... even if they were the best of the best sir... specially having on the market so many options for a decent weight-price-durability-resistance balance.

Beer
  • + 3
 This is fantastic. Their response is also fantastic. But for different reasons.
  • + 3
 nuclear... i doubt the mortgage on that facility in UT will be as easy for them to pay moving forward!
  • + 0
 I always felt carbon rims were built and sold for dentists. There's a reason nobody runs carbon rims on dirt bikes,this is it. Atleast make the outer layer Kevlar for some kind of impact resistance(tho I'm sure that would throw any weight savings out the window putting you at square one).
  • + 4
 Trying work ebikes into PB! Why would you put carbon rims on an ebike?
  • + 1
 I thought that too. But then again, I thought that about normal mountain bikes back in the day.
  • + 1
 Wow an actual honest review in the mountain bike media world. Never thought I would read such a thing! Not a fan of carbon fibre either, don't understand the need for it
  • + 1
 Running 29" LG1R Carbon rims on 240S, Competition spokes & Prolock Squorx AL at 1950g
They are bombproof, lighter & cheaper.
DH use...
  • + 1
 I like where they’re going with this honesty.
Although we’ve yet to see them hit any of their advertising buddies with anything.
  • + 1
 Yikes. Definitely going to look at ENVE products differently now. As a US company, I hope they can come back from this but it's going to take a lot.
  • + 1
 Wow, rare to read about MTB products that break repeatedly while on test. Be great to have had these as part of a group test. Same bike, same riders, various carbon wheels.
  • + 2
 Not surprised to see spoke holes misaligned...

www.instagram.com/p/BtVcf4XFkNG/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link
  • + 2
 And just like that, anybody that owns ENVE wheels and wants to sell them has to drop them to $300.
  • + 2
 Why does an e bike require carbon wheels? If someone says performance I am going to scream
  • + 3
 yeah right its like lets save weight on this 20plus moter bike. the "e" product line people are creating blows me away at how far marking bs really goes
  • + 1
 That's ok, dentist and Yeti owners, at least for most of them, spend more time taking pictures of their bikes than riding it...
  • + 2
 We already know this about ENVE, nothing new about these issues! Not worth it!
  • + 4
 $3000 wheels.... lol
  • + 1
 "Waou!! This protective rim strip technology is amazing" even if your rim is fully destroy and you're in the middle of f*cking nowhere.
  • + 1
 @paulaston - Thank you for this brutally honest review. Your reviews and maybe Mike Levy's reviews are the ones I always look out for.
  • - 1
 Why is it when a carbon product breaks there is always and excuse or the blame is laid elsewhere. They cannot admit that its broke because its made of overrated expensive carbon crap and not dependable metal. This has been going on for decades in this sport. Metal metal metal metal! Thats the future of modern biking and all its components!!
  • + 3
 i had similar experience with Enve plus bad customer care
  • + 3
 Pinkbike; thanks for the honest review. Enve; thanks for comin' out.
  • + 3
 Damnnnnnn. Don't enve that company.
  • + 0
 I had a set of the first ENVE DH 26's that broke on a flat section of a blue at Winter Park. Meanwhile my backup set of Mavic 729s have withstood about 10,000 cases/bad line choices and lived to tell the tale.
  • + 3
 we are one.

thats it, 50% cheaper and 200% better.
  • + 3
 only 200%? - thats still shit.
  • + 2
 This is what reviewing should be. An honest review with a response from the manufacturer. Amazing work!
  • + 3
 MSRP: $3,080 USD - Lolz ????
  • + 2
 There's only one reason for me to not owning an ENVE CF rims , PRICE!!!!, Now this is the 2nd.
  • + 1
 Over priced, boutique carbon rims are garbage? No way! The owners response is a very poor example of damage control. It's just more marketing.

Alu rims for life.
  • + 1
 I have recently had a m730 crack and splinter on me... rough trails seems to wreak havoc on these things. Still sorting out replacement options.
  • + 2
 You would think....if you're sending something to PB to test.... you'd make sure it's perfect!
  • + 2
 right? and expecially after hearing the word that they have already gone through a rim
  • - 1
 I have 26" wheels I bought in 1994 for £154 which are Mavic 521 rims on XTR hubs, and they're still true. I've never done anything to them - I don't think I've even cleaned them more than 10 times and they're still great. Granted, that bike doesn't get out much, but before that, I was folding wheels regularly.
  • + 3
 Ouch! - Poorly handled, fire/demote the internal PR guy (or manager).
  • + 2
 I think this is just ENVE's way of making sure everyone knows E-bikes are just a bad idea... Smile
  • + 2
 Dear ENVE please send me a set to test and review, I can be bought with a free set of wheels for a good review lol
  • + 2
 Yep drink the Kool-Aid, u can buy the same rim all day long for $300 to $500 that do the same thing.
  • + 2
 300? you're joking? Alloy rims are under $100 - you're still wasting cash.
  • + 2
 @rippersub: Lite Bicycle under $300 for carbon
  • + 0
 @thoe: the problem here is carbon is the WRONG MATERIAL!
  • + 1
 @thoe: Yeah, and alloy rims are $100 - Therefore you're wasting $200
  • + 1
 I’d spend my money on Nobls or we are one before enve. Even Bontrager are a better option. Enve needs to go beach to the research table
  • + 3
 looks like ENVE is on it's way back to being xc only......
  • + 1
 Everyone why in the world are you spending your lifesaving to buy enve rims when you can buy spank or other rims that are stronger and 100.00 per rim.
  • + 1
 I picked up a set of Specialized Carbon Traverse Rovals/DT 350's about 5 months ago. Been ridin the shit out of em with ZERO issues. $1600 MSRP

...'jus sayin
  • + 1
 Maybe stop running stupid low air pressure in rocky terrain? Although the rims look shoty as hell, almost like they sent Paul rejects instead of the good ones!?
  • + 2
 That terrain is not that rocky. The first trail (Ingeniere) is actually mostly smooth flowy hardpack.
  • + 0
 The pinkbike audience, for the most part, believes there is a giant conspiracy in the cycling industry to fleece unsuspecting people of their hard earned money, and Paul Aston is their Messiah. 
  • + 1
 Every review he writes just reeks of this as well.
  • + 1
 Last week I picked up a brand new OE 27.5, DT Swiss M1700 40mm, XD driver, 36T ratchet, Boost wheelset for $450 to my door..... Winning.
  • + 1
 where from? that's about what it costs me to build up a set on my own
  • + 1
 @xeren: Check PM
  • + 2
 So ENVE's recommendation was to upgrade to a better wheelset? Which would cost how much more? Ridiculous.
  • + 1
 Enve seem to be the bottom of the food chain when it comes to carbon wheels. If your into carbon wheels seems you would be mad to pick them over the rest
  • + 3
 cough STANS ahem cough FLOW ...
  • + 2
 Best bang for the buck!!
  • + 1
 Makes you wonder why Amer Sports { MAVIC } even bought ENVE, on the basis of the above review it surely can't be for their rim technology?
  • + 1
 so they can pair their crap Mavic hubs with crap Enve rims Smile
  • + 1
 I have a normally strict policy of not clicking on any article referencing e-bikes, but for some reason I had a feeling it might be worth it this one time and I was right !
  • + 1
 Ok.. makes sense.. tested on an e-bike. I don't think plastic wheels belong on a moped bombing down a rocky dh trail. I don't think e-bikes belong on our trails.
  • + 4
 I no longer envy ENVE.
  • + 1
 Don't enve me, but I bash the hell out of my $500 Stan's wheelset with hope hubs and the worst that happens is some loose spokes over time.
  • + 1
 I got a two pairs of Superstar rims on their own Switch hubs, brand new with a warranty, for £200. Who the hell pays $3000 for some wheels?
  • + 0
 I would hate to have been the wordsmith that Jake Pantone, VP Product and Consumer Experience had to be on this one. He was in a corner with no way for any kind of correct answer given Enve's QC, or repeated lack of,
  • + 2
 I remember a carbon fiber M16, same results.
  • + 3
 Overpriced junk!
  • + 1
 From now on full body storm trooper bike park noob style protection to anyone who reviews enve wheels.
  • + 1
 No more freebies from enve Paul! Better get used to aluminum wheels from now....
  • + 1
 Does everyone remember when carbon fiber was new, and they were like, "weighs nothing, a hundred times stronger than steel"
  • + 1
 Any carbon rims can compete with Bouwmeester Tammar V4.8, they are indestrutible even if you ride them at less than 20 psi.
  • + 2
 Jake Pantone response was ridiculous and childish.
  • + 1
 I like how every below threshold comment is coming from an ENVE owner trying to defend their purchase lol
  • + 2
 LOL - Did anyone read Enve's response...? Nah, thought not.

No need to
  • + 14
 I did, and let me tell you, it doesn't actually say anything. Saved you some time.
  • + 4
 Youre actually assuming that. I reasd their BS and i srill feel like they suck. What they are trying to argue is that just because hes riding a 50lb bike versus a 30lb one that the wheels failed. That is a tiny margin of 20lbs that could easily vary from rider to rider on a normal bike and wouldn't matter if it's electric or not. Then the replacements that were sent were clearly less than perfect possibly trying to save money by sending out factory defects. Also they are PROUD of bringing the price down to $2500?!?!? Wow such a fair price thanks enve but no thanks you will never get a dollar from me
  • + 1
 No way! I thought the left was ENVE...
  • + 2
 $3080 - $700 king hubs - $200 aeeerospoks = a very expensive double rimjob
  • + 1
 I'm looking forward to all the people dumping their Enve wheels in the buy-sell section. $500 or trade for Xbox 360.
  • + 1
 ooo poor response from Emvy....poor show on the wheels failing. I'll save my money.
  • + 3
 Bookyaka!
  • + 1
 Big FU to Envy for $3k wheels. Bigger FU to all the schmucks who actually buy them.
  • + 1
 ‘Stop asking yourself questions you know the answer to so you can make yourself look smart.’

The Office
  • + 1
 The only carbon that should be allowed on a mountain bike is a steerer tube spacer
  • - 1
 Interesting contrast with sweeping the issues with YETI's new frames under the rug, and actually deleting one of my comments about it. The Yeti frames are as big of a POS as these wheels imo.
  • + 1
 the issue with the frames is the rear triangle flex right? i have only heard about that in the PB comments so im not sure how true it is but yeah not being covered very much if that is the case.
  • + 0
 So true, let's not forget how yeti frames are PO. Just look nice, but lack good engineering!!
  • + 0
 *POS
  • + 1
 I have zero issues with my SB100
  • + 2
 I feel as though Paul deserves some sort of pinkbike honesty award...
  • + 2
 My Santa Cruz wheels are looking better and better.
  • + 2
 Who needs Enve, when you can have Spongle?
  • + 0
 Seems the buyout has not been kind to Enve. Just disastrous for a company that prides itself on being the top of the top end.
  • + 1
 Sometimes you have to ask. It's it the right material for the job? No. Not in this case
  • + 1
 The @paulaston review I've been waiting for. Brutal honesty and the pictures to back it up. Cheers!
  • + 2
 hahaha gotta say thats pretty poor when they cost more than most bikes
  • + 1
 We Are One Composites ???? less expensive, lifetime warranty and made in Kamloops.
  • + 3
 O shit! Big Grin
  • + 1
 By no means is this directed at ENVE but, f some carbon rims. they don't make sense for 99.9% of us...
  • + 1
 Would say more too do with running low tyre pressure than any load forces?
  • + 1
 Can you imagine being in their company for a few minutes? Lying creeps man.
  • + 2
 Brad Walton is holding on Line 2....
  • + 2
 Nicely played, sir....
  • + 2
 Yikes, I hope Jake Pantone has an updated resume ready to hand out...
  • + 1
 the first time that saw an enve rim I thought that it was a fake because it was so badly made but it wasn't!
  • + 1
 Carbon wheels ride well but never again for me, my next bike will have flow rims the same as my current one.
  • + 2
 This is what tests are for!! Thanks PB, Thanks Paul
  • + 0
 Your face when, your LB rims lasted longer than someone M60 and replacement m70s both together and still lasting
isnt Amer planing sell envy to china??
  • + 1
 Good review. Some things are just not meant to be made with carbon....this is one of those things..
  • + 3
 Didn't see that coming.
  • + 3
 Trump wheels, that's it.
  • + 2
 Exactly why I ride industry nine A premium wheel that actually ladtv
  • + 1
 Carbon fibre for rims just isn’t right,sort your shit out enve,3 k for a set of wheels ur having a larff!
  • + 1
 The 'spare-no-expense' folks who ride their blinged-out, match-matchy bikes once a fortnight will still buy them though.
  • + 2
 I done seen’t my buddy crack his Enve rim on Gooseberry Mesa.
  • + 3
 Best review ever.
  • + 1
 Wow - this is a topic that strikes a nerve.
  • + 1
 Sounds like rider error. Set up and line choose!
  • + 1
 Honest and Brutal review! Thanks pinkbikeSmile
  • + 1
 Maybe this will help to deflate their prices.
  • + 2
 EX471
  • + 2
 DAYUM!
  • + 1
 Enve reputation is falling down. Hard to justify such pricey wheels
  • + 0
 ENVE = Pond scum. People who fork out for their products are f*cking idiots with more money than sense.
  • + 1
 Spank Spike rims laced up to Hope hubs FTW! Bullet proof value.
  • + 1
 Thanks PB, love the honest review!
  • + 1
 Industry nine grade 300... problem solved
  • + 1
 I don't Enve their business model going forward.
  • + 1
 Enve - strike 1 E mtb- strikes 2 and 3
  • + 2
 What a joke!