Pinkbike Poll: Are You Open To Electronics On Your Bike?

Mar 9, 2022 at 9:25
by Seb Stott  
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Do you want electronics replacing cables on your bike?

If the question of this week's poll sounds familiar to some of you with long memories, that could be because we asked a similar question back in 2013, and then again in 2017. Far from telling the same old story, what's striking about those two polls is how much attitudes changed.

In the first poll, only 11% said they wanted electronics on their bike; in the second, the number of electrophiles jumped up to 27%. The most popular answer in that 2017 poll was "Maybe. Ask me again in another four years." Well, we're a little late but here we go.

The most significant change since we last asked this question is the arrival of SRAM AXS in 2019. (More recently, SRAM also released Flight Attendant to control suspension electronically, but I think that's likely to remain more niche than electronic shifting.) Whereas Shimano's Di2 system made installation trickier, AXS introduced a huge advantage: it's wireless. That means you can say goodbye to coaxing derailleur/dropper cables through the frame; just bolt on the shifter and derailleur, set them up using an app and you're off. And according to Kazimer's review of the GX version of AXS, "the wireless components take the win [compared to mechanical GX] when it comes to the speed and ease with which the shifts occur." I haven't put a huge amount of time into any one AXS drivetrain, but I'm inclined to agree.

When it comes to wireless dropper posts (a concept we've seen before with Magura's Vyron), it became possible to share one dropper between multiple bikes or fit a dropper to a DH bike that lacks internal routing for a dropper.

SRAM GX AXS review
SRAM GX AXS

But on the other hand, you'll still have to recharge the batteries every few rides (an AXS drivetrain has a battery life of about twenty hours) and replace the coin cell battery in the shifter/remote once per year or so. Plus setup and adjustment require you to get your phone out, open an app and connect to your bike via Bluetooth. That isn't everyone's idea of a good time on the bike.

So, how keen are you on electronics now?

Do you want electronics on your bike?




329 Comments

  • 648 24
 Hear me out...subscription model shifting, only pay for what you shift! Be safe be well, Incognito Robin
  • 34 13
 You had me until the "be safe be well" part. I'm not so sure about that.
  • 24 0
 How much for autopilot?
  • 15 1
 @Mtmw: I reckon about $12,000 and you’ll get it at some point in the future for sure, definitely maybe.
  • 11 0
 Shhhh! Don't give 'em any ideas.
  • 119 0
 Geo fencing too!

Your brakes, shifting, and suspension cease to work if you're not on an IMBA approved trail (or if you're more than 5 days delinquent on your monthly subscription payment)
  • 118 6
 @hamncheez: Brilliant! If you're ever looking for new employment opportunities please DM me...these are the kind of 'Outside the box ideas' (see what I did there?!?) we need around here!

Be safe be well,
Incognito Robin
  • 7 0
 @hamncheez:

Quaking in my Sam Hill pro mode 5.10’s
  • 32 0
 Demo mode you have only access to 3 gears
  • 21 1
 Ride free, ride single speed..
  • 10 0
 @cyrways: I had beta on my Levo but then hucked to flat and tanked my safety score.
  • 4 1
 The only reason i would ever ride a single speed.
  • 77 0
 @notoutsideceo: Shifting as a Service - A revolutionary shifting platform that unlocks the untapped potential of drivetrains. 3 Pricing Tiers - 'Freemium' model where you only have access to the middle gears and has a cap of 10 shifts per ride but you have to watch an ad before each shift. The 'Basic' plan- All gears, 25 shifts per ride, No Ads. The 'Unlimited' plan- Proprietary AI driven shifting platform, no more need to press buttons, all shifting is done automatically by robots in the cloud.
  • 9 0
 Liberty Biberty
  • 12 0
 Brilliant: Shifting as a Service (SaaS)!
  • 3 4
 Introducing the new SAS-Compatible Process OPEX. Short term plans and long term discounts available.

***Terms and exclusions apply. Limited support contact options. The performance of any OPEX product is not directly related to its build quality or material makeup, but rather your inadequacy as a man. You bring shame to your family.***

Don’t be a Poor, Never CAPEX again.
  • 3 0
 @notoutsideceo: you missed an opportunity for brand building there: outside the Outside ideas!
  • 2 0
 @konamat: "one f*cking speed"
  • 5 0
 @Mlloyd550: Automatic Shifting Service access to Sram AXS (A.S.S AXS)
  • 4 0
 @Chuckolicious: I didn’t even realize the safety score thing until the other week. I don’t have a Tesla but I sure won’t be getting one if it thinks Me sliding the performance model is a reason I can’t have self driving.
  • 2 26
flag pinkerclone (Mar 18, 2022 at 17:11) (Below Threshold)
 stop being an attention seeker
  • 3 0
 @konamat: Cheers to that.
  • 11 0
 @pinkerclone: Welcome to the pinkbike comments section.
  • 5 2
 NOT even funny bro, they read these comments, SRAMs gonna try this now, they did freakin super boost
  • 2 0
 @rtclark: Platinum service gets you a fully qualified shifting engineer remotely shifting for you from a dedicated shift centre overseas
  • 1 0
 @rtclark: scrap that last comment from me, replied without fully reading yours
  • 1 0
 Strait Talk starts new division, Straight Shift.
  • 1 0
 @hamncheez: Geofencing exists for ebike fleets.
  • 2 0
 @CTDchris: Actually Pivot did Super Boost.
  • 2 0
 Liberty Liberty Liberty
  • 2 0
 Ya and if you miss an installment the derailer locks itself, then when you pay up to get going again theres an additional reactivation service charge. Sounds familiar not to mention Anonymous hacks it with denial of service attack worldwide.
  • 1 1
 oh....like "pay as you go" insurance!? lol
  • 104 1
 I think its pretty neat and I'm happy I have the option, but I'll never buy no mater how cheap/effective it is. I just personally like to be electronic free when I'm out on a ride. Phones with me, but always on airplane mode just incase shit hits the fan.
  • 22 7
 I get not wanting to interact with screens or people other than those around you, but I'm not sure I'd really notice the difference between pressing a button and it releasing some cable vs it telling a motor to move. Is it the noise? The need to add a soldering kit to your toolbox?
  • 35 2
 @L0rdTom: To me (as someone who has yet to ride with electronic parts) it feels like an added risk of part failure on the trail. Would hate to be stranded because I wrecked and it damaged Bluetooth receivers or tore a wire. or whatever may fail. At least with mechanical, I have a chance of pulling it together.
  • 8 2
 @L0rdTom: I suppose the only other concern is the right to repair and the availability and know how of the consumer. Obviously some people do not do their own maintenance now, but that proportion would surely grow if everything was electronic. I guess it is only an issue for those who cannot learn the new technology.
  • 38 1
 @adrennan: That's a valid concern, but in my experience, not really an issue. I now have 5,392 mtb miles on AXS drivetrains and haven't had as much as a hiccup. Granted, they are on different bikes, but the bike with the most miles right now has 2,492 miles on AXS, and I haven't had any issues.

I could even argue that it's more dependable - Just the other day, I crashed on the drive side of my bike. When I got back on, I realized that the AXS overload clutch had actually kicked in and upshifted by several gears, preventing the derailleur and hanger from receiving any damage.

I once even tagged a baby head rock hard enough to rip the derailleur straight out of the hanger, stripping the bolt threads. I just replaced the bolt, and the derailleur itself is still going strong as day one.
  • 12 1
 @L0rdTom: I feel the same as schulte1400. I used to enjoy strava, but I know ride with my phone in airplane mode, no gps or other data electronics either. No electronic drivetrain or suspension bits. Shimano 1x11 or a single speed with other reliable components. Go ride and get away from it all for a bit.
  • 25 1
 @L0rdTom: not having to charge your bike is a huge aspect. I want to get back from a ride, throw it in my garage and be able to race home after work and hop on it again. What if you get sauced from after ride beers?

If I had to miss a ride once because of charging, I would sell it. Keep it simple.
  • 17 1
 @L0rdTom: It's just another thing you constantly have to care about.

Yesterday I cleaned the brakes because they started to be noisy, lubed the chain and added a bit of air to the tyres.

Bike is ready to roll. Tomorrow or in 3 weeks. Checking the tyre pressure before the ride is much easier then checking all the batteries
  • 7 0
 @MegaMatt5000: how often do you have to change the battery? My biggest fear is not having any juice for my shifter/derailleur when I'm ready to go ride. Like finally getting off work, heading down to the garage and oh look dead battery... no ride.
  • 6 1
 @stiingya: it lasts a pretty long time. Like I have axs on two bikes and I ride multiple times a week. On average I charge the batteries once a month. You also would know since the indicator light goes red when the battery is low. You could probably get an hour ride out of it on red too. But if you checked it saw it was red, you could charge it in the time you are kitted up and be fine.
  • 5 2
 Its just seems to take less concentration as far as shifting goes or should I say less concentration off shifting and more focus on riding and everything else, pushing a light momentary electrical button/or rocker paddle just seems easier some how after a while you dont feel the mechanical aspect of it at all, it just does what you tell it to ,perfectly every time @L0rdTom:
  • 3 1
 @stiingya: I think I charge it about every two weeks or so - that's about when the light goes red. It takes 45 minutes for a full charge. I typically ride between 8-12 hours per week, so that's right in line with the 20 hours claimed by SRAM.

I have definitely shown up to the trail head once and realized I forgot my battery on the charger at home, when I took off and the bike wouldn't shift... Pro tip for anyone else with AXS - I now put a strip of tape on my grip when the battery is off to charge. That way, I'd notice when I grab it off the stand to load up on the car.

As far as being surprised by a dead battery, the light turns from green to red when you have ~5 hours of riding left. I clean my chain after every ride, so I've always caught the red light then.
  • 4 0
 @MegaMatt5000: More or less like I thought myself. Actually, if you ride regularly more times a week, you'll probably have less axs related headaches then someone who rides occasionally
  • 4 4
 @adrennan: in a year of axs, the reliability beats a cable. I've had to adjust or tweak it a couple of times, but i didnt need to stop riding and the adjustment only affects one gear. With cables, there's always a compromise between having perfect shifts up or down the cassette, with anything slightly worn, you can't have both. When its freezing cold and your hands are stiff, it takes no effort to shift. And ine time a friend broke his shifter off the bars. He just put it in his pocket and continued shifting by tapping the paddles.
  • 3 0
 @MegaMatt5000: good feedback, I haven't heard too many stories of people that have tagged or damaged them, but that is one of my bigger hesitancy... that and forgetting to charge the batteries
  • 2 0
 @BrianColes: I've had a battery run out and strand me in the middle of the woods (they originally advertised 60 h battery life but I get more like 20 and found that out the hard way).

I've also forgotten a battery in the charger and driven to ride.

It's hard to overstate how brutal it is to have a day of riding ruined by a battery.
  • 1 0
 @MegaMatt5000: Eventually the battery catches you out and it's brutal. I've had two rides ruined (once forgot the battery, once it ran out in the woods). That alone negates the very nebulous value of electronic shifting for me. The tape trick is smart, but the fact that you have to do that to have a a working bike does not speak well for the user experience. A removable battery is not a good idea for humans.
  • 2 0
 @nattyd: you're less likely to forget your battery as your shoes or helmet.
  • 1 0
 @jimbob79: Battery is a tiny fraction of the size of shoes and helmet; much easier to forget. Battery must be moved between charger, bike, and bag, presenting more potential instances to forget.

But the biggest reason this argument doesn’t hold up: a helmet and shoes serve critical functions that can’t be practically replaced. Electronic shifting is the exact opposite: it adds a requirement that replaces a perfectly functional system (which continues to win Olympic medals and World Cups). It’s strictly unnecessary.
  • 3 0
 @nattyd: I converted my mtb's to AXS in October 2020, and since then, I've had 376 rides. I've forgotten the battery literally just once out of those 376 rides, but I have definitely shown up to the trail without my helmet closer to 10 times in that time period. It's really not that big of a deal.

To each his own. I personally much prefer the feel of AXS, so that's what I run. Other guys prefer the simplicity of mechanical. Great. You'll find other guys on rigid single speeds who think both of us are crazy for riding bikes with gears and suspension.
  • 1 1
 @nattyd: again. To reiterate my first post. All the commentors against axs are those that don't have it.
I've left my battery at home, less times than I've had a broken cable
  • 2 0
 @jimbob79: I’ve been riding it for two years. So far three rides ruined: two for low/no battery, one forgotten at home. I’ve never snapped a cable on ride in 20 years.
  • 1 0
 Thanks for the responses. Hmmm seems like a mixed bag. Personally everything I need for a ride besides the bike is in the back of my SUV all the time, and spares, extra flat pedals, camping stuff. Its an hour min. drive to the trails i like to ride, nothing worse then getting up in the mountains and no go...

My other question. If get AXS on one bike will I hate that the rest of my bikes don't have it...?
  • 79 5
 I've quit everything, even strava. Couldn't be happier, and don't miss anything. Let the e-rant begin...
  • 181 5
 How did you post this comment? Stone tablet?
  • 11 2
 @AndrewFleming:
Im sure whatever he used it was running MS-dos
  • 22 0
 @AndrewFleming: carrier pigeon
  • 78 1
 I feel I need to be recording on Strava in order to justify yelling "STRAVA" as I plow through innocent hikers, dogs, children, and slower cyclists. Feels wrong otherwise.
  • 6 0
 On a couple of my rides recently i went out without a garmin (which i used to have all the time together with an HRM belt).. felt so good
  • 3 2
 @GZMS: been loving Relive. It isn't as competitive as Strava, and you get a nifty video with all your riding pics with it in the process.
  • 7 0
 I track my rides with my phone purely for my own edification. My phone is with me for rescue purposes - my wife can use find my phone to find me should I not show up. I dont particularly care about AXS or wireless anything but if I was buying a new bike and money wasnt an object its presence wouldnt put me off. I would gladly go full dentist, if I was a dentist.
  • 2 0
 It’s rainbow Jeremy
  • 5 8
 I love strava,it's a way to race people between races.keeps track of your kms. Beating your mates and other locals on the leaderboard is mad fun.
  • 1 0
 @WTF-IDK: c:\>format
  • 3 0
 Whats strava?
  • 1 0
 @AndrewFleming: the library? Lol
  • 58 3
 Maybe it’s just a stubborn romantic notion, but I think part of the magic of the bicycle is the fact that it’s a completely human-powered machine. From Rampage to Tour de France… if it doesn’t work when you don’t charge the battery, it’s just not the same.
  • 19 4
 I agree. It's a principle thing. The bicycle should be human powered, including any motion/action.
  • 7 0
 I’ve done far too much night riding to be able to make such a claim.
  • 9 0
 @AyJayDoubleyou: I do as well… but lights are a thing you strap to your bike when needed, rather than an essential component to make it function for every ride. Justification…? Absolutely.
  • 13 1
 Agreed. My opinion kind of changed on this. I was all for ebikes but I thought it would be the elderly or disabled using them which is awesome and I fully support. But then I started seeing people getting them just out of laziness and I'm kinda turning on them. I'm not going down the battery route.
  • 2 0
 @DylanH93: i see those same lazy people using their ebikes a few times then continuing to be lazy and just not riding anymore. A bunch of guys around here got ebikes the last couple years and i ride more in a week than they all did combined last year. And two of them got two ebikes each.
  • 55 7
 Took me a while to come around and accept electronics. Ended up getting AXS derailleur and dropper because of the wireless and easy install...two months later and the derailleur doesn't work and I had to send it in for warranty repair. They're telling me about 4-5week turn around for the electronics repair.

TL;DR = stick to mechanical.
  • 13 4
 The reviews say they work flawlessly, but I see my friends fidgeting with them all the time. Wonder why the gap?
  • 37 7
 Have been running it for 3 seasons without a single issue nor adjustment required. I think you're in the minority....
  • 10 23
flag REZEN (Mar 18, 2022 at 13:26) (Below Threshold)
 @MikeyMT: So not even a year? SoCal has 4 seasons in a year....
  • 12 2
 @MikeyMT: my AXS dropper does not clear my tire so that was great to find out lol. why tf did they not put the battery on the front or the top of the post?
  • 6 2
 Been running AXS for a year. Flawless. Not an issue. Apart from that one ride I forgot to charge the battery for. That climb was a doozy! ;-)
  • 5 2
 AXS GX works flawlessly on a Shimano 12-speed drivetrain for me. On 2 bikes... Bolted on without a single adjustment and away we go... I'll blame it on through the frame cable routing, but the real reason for upgrade was a thumb injury. XT shifter is amazing, but high effort to operate for a multi-hour ride.
  • 8 3
 @Dogl0rd: I dont want electronic shifting, but I have witnessed plenty of barrel nut and screw adjustments on cable shifters. Im pretty tired of a guy I ride with having to tinker with his GX 4 times a ride.
  • 12 0
 @RonSauce: Didn’t know we rode together.
  • 3 0
 I just put the Archer Components shifter kit on my bike (with the new paddle shifter)
It was easy to install, shifter ergonomics are convenient,
and has some cool features (e.g. programmable multishift up/down)
I like that if the shifter were to bust, I can just pop my mechanical shifter/housing back on.
  • 8 0
 @REZEN: SoCal most assuredly has only 1.5 seasons per year: hot and not so hot.
  • 12 1
 Had AXS for a few months, biggest change I noticed was the increased chain slap coming from a standard GX Eagle setup. Even started dropping chains on rough trails which was a rarity before swapping to AXS. Thought mine was a dud with a weak clutch, so I checked 10 other brand new AXS derailleurs we had at the shop and they all felt like they had the same level of clutch tension, noticeable less than the cable derailleurs. For me any minor advantages were outshined by the constant racket of chain slap on a previously silent bike. Then I had a pretty minor bail and laid the bike down which killed the derailleur and concluded my AXS experiment
  • 2 0
 @RonSauce: Sounds like he has a bent derailleur and he needs to just fix it the right way. I haven't touched my GX in ages and it's just now acting funky because the GX cassette is garbage. Sadly, the X01 cassette is absurdly expensive.
  • 14 5
 @gomeeker: XT shifter is amazing, but high effort to operate for a multi-hour ride

You and I have different definitions of the word effort....
  • 1 2
 @nickfranko: nah, its brand new, dude has less than 100 miles on the bike and has had it in the shop twice. Last ride the B screw backed all the way out and the derailleur was running against the cassette.
  • 8 0
 @skiandmtbdirtbag: I bet our definitions are the same, but when your thumb has to be put back together after getting mangled in a big crash, it changes the perspective...
  • 3 0
 That does suck. I've been running it for two years and never had a single issue. I bring a spare battery but have only needed it once, I keep the stuff charged constantly. Many (most?) of my riding buddies are running AXS and only one has wrecked his, in a massive crash that would have destroyed any derailleur. They gave him a crash replacement at half off. No one I know personally has had their AXS malfunction.

On the flip side, you never have to adjust it. It's set and forget. Shifts so smooth and quick. No cables to stretch......haven't even bent a hanger since I got it. I scoffed at it when it first came out because it's insanely expensive and a regular derailleur works just fine. Then I put some time in the saddle of a couple bikes that had it and there was no going back.
  • 2 0
 @gomeeker: well you buried the lead on this one based off your initial comment.
  • 1 1
 @nickfranko: are you saying your GX cassette is worn out or that they aren't very good? My GX cassette is unhappy in several gears, and I can see the next sprocket catches on the chain in places. No amount of alignment (new hanger and alignment tool) makes it any better. I've filed some teeth which improves it but not fixed
  • 1 0
 @skiandmtbdirtbag: his thumbs are very tired
  • 6 0
 @thegoodflow: PB comments section has taken me for a ride, with little effort required! Is this what it feels like to ride an e-bike?

E-bike to reduce pedaling effort, AXS to reduce thumb effort, now we just need an electronic water bladder to reduce sucking effort - you read it here first!
  • 2 0
 @blcpdx: Amen, brother. Same reason I love my Archer system.

p.s. I'm not some sort of brand ambassador for them. No intelligent company would want anything to do with my advocacy for their products. hehehe
  • 7 2
 I was all for electronics even a year ago. Ebikers have been annoying me on the trails more and more lately and I'm finding myself thinking "maybe there should be specific trails for ebikes to stick to". It's making me sour on electronic shifting as well lol.
  • 2 1
 @mountainsofsussex: I have the same issue with my GX cassette, one of the teeth is always catching on the chain. It's been this way since new. I haven't tried filing down the tooth that is misaligned yet but a friend who also had this problem did recommend this to me. Seems to be a fairly common problem.
  • 2 1
 @nickfranko: he won’t know how to set it up and messes with it before every ride hoping he fixes it but never does. There’s no forces going through the adjustment screws in a mech they’re just bump stops. They’re not going anywhere. I’ve never had an issue with any brand needing readjustment after being set up correctly in the first place.
  • 1 0
 Did you try the overshift function on the D1x seems like it made the shifts a bit faster when shifting into bigger cogs w/my setup kinda whips the chain over just a bit past the desired cog momentarily and then back over to where it’s supposed to be but very quickly
Also I found sum extra batteries on eBay for pretty cheap and they work just the same if your interested I can send u a link
I’m hoping Archer will swap my old remote for the paddle setup that’s available now
did u have the older 2 button deal to start with? @blcpdx:
  • 2 0
 @Dogl0rd: Bike reviews are universally complimentary of large companies because they are co-dependent. Reviewers need bikes and parts to test, companies need advertising. I remember an amazing comment on CyclingTips comparing the original review of eTap (road) to their accounting of it when AXS replaced it and they were finally willing to admit all the bugs and flaws.
  • 1 0
 @Crankhed: I bought the kit with the paddle remote included.
Seems like you can just buy the paddle lever on its own:
archercomponents.com/collections/shifters-and-remotes/products/paddle-remote-1
But probably worth emailing the to see if they have a discount for current D1x owners.

You might also try the sprint batteries too:
archercomponents.com/collections/batteries-and-chargers/products/beta-sprint-battery-set
Not sure if those are the same batteries you found on eBay?

I'm actually running the TRP TR12 derailleur,
and I wonder if it has a higher cable pull ratio (vs SRAM's 1:1),
becuase it seems to shift fast enough for me.
  • 51 9
 Meh...modern shimano drivetrains shift exceptionally well. What's the benefit of electronic shifting again? No for me, dog.
  • 17 21
flag nickfranko (Mar 18, 2022 at 16:50) (Below Threshold)
 No more cable maintenance. No more adjusting cable tension. Allows for micro adjustments for shifting. Programmable shifting behavior.
  • 12 7
 I have both. Shimano XTR 12 spd and GX AXS (running Shimano cassettes and chains). As good as XTR is, AXS is better.
  • 5 3
 @nickfranko: If cable maintenance is a problem for you,check Jagwire's fully sealed cables.
I run them on my main bike for about 3 years and they still deliver smooth and crisp shifting.
  • 8 8
 @nozes: it is still no comparison. Axs is almost instant and even fully sealed cabling suffers when it has to bend through a frame.
  • 10 1
 @nickfranko: So I safe like 5-10 min a Year in work for how much more money ?
  • 11 0
 @RockCrawler: both sides of this conversation are exaggerating the difficulty. Charging a battery and tuning with an app is easy and effective, changing shift cables is easy and adjusting them is simple. Its fine to have a preference, but thats all it is.
  • 4 0
 I can see the argument for electronic on road bikes where you can pre program the gear for front shifting and also the front half-shift as you go from one end of the cassette to the other. Plus fewer rocks to attack expensive mechs. A friend used the "bored of adjusting my cables" argument to justify splashing out on Di2. My gears are virtually set and forget - don't know why they need tinkering with
  • 3 8
flag JakeEPooh (Mar 19, 2022 at 10:26) (Below Threshold)
 @nickfranko: I can understand not agreeing with you, but why the downvotes? Hey, you know what! I think there needs to be another set of buttons in addition to up and down we should also have agree and disagree. I know when I hit a down arrow, a lot of the time I'm saying I disagree, not that I think the post should be hidden or suppressed. Given the choice, I would reserve the down arrow for stuff that's mean-spirited or whatever, not just wrong in my opinion.
  • 5 0
 @JakeEPooh: I reserve my downvotes for people who say "wHyThEdOwNvOtEs?!"
  • 2 2
 @JakeEPooh: I get what you are saying but, I'll respond with a comment if it's just a difference of opinion and save down votes for douches and angry clowns who yell at stuff.
  • 3 0
 @RonSauce: Yeah, but I have to change a cable like once every 3 years (mild California weather) and I have to charge my battery like 50 times a year. And I've never forgotten my cable in my garage.
  • 1 0
 @RonSauce: Damn it, I deserved that. sigh...
  • 28 1
 “There is a bloke from around my hood, Staines, called Rainbow Jeremy, who reject everything to do with science. He just chill at home, smoke his own home grown, and check this: he don’t have a tele. …you can check out his blog” - Ali G
  • 31 2
 I don't ever want to say, "I can't ride because I need to charge my bike."
  • 6 1
 just dont say it out loud then lol
  • 8 23
flag chicane32 (Mar 18, 2022 at 17:18) (Below Threshold)
 Owning a smart phone must give you some anxiety?
  • 8 0
 @chicane32: You know you can ride without a smartphone, but it would be quite difficult/annoying to ride without a working rear mech?

Also, it is quite hard to live without a smartphone nowadays, actually it makes life a bit easier. Adding another 1? 2? 3?! batteries to my bike would not make my life any easier or my bike any better. I have never had any issues with my cable dropper post or my XT mech. And I can jump on my bike and ride anytime I want, no need to think about charging any batteries.

I do not get this "you have got a smartphone so you can have a battery powered mech/dropper/anything as well" logic. It is completely dumb. If I could have a smartphone that does not need to be charged every day (or at all), I'd be all for it. I guess most people would.
  • 19 0
 As a technophile for the most part... nope. Not on my bike. A derailleur has a lifespan, I get that. And, no mechanical derailleur is going to suffer from the realities of the modern electronics world. Troubleshooting, keeping the app up to date, keeping the data secure, keeping the personally identifiable details private... Price isn't even in the top three of my concerns on this. Do I trust SRAM/Shimano to make relatively reliable kit? Yes. Do I trust them to support the software for a piece of hardware that may be ten years old by the time it's worn out? Nope. Show me their secure development lifecycle, planned support SLAs, guaranteed update/bug fix/patch road map and, privacy by design principles and measures, security by design principles and measures... still nope. It's one more IOT device with no guarantees for your security, safety, privacy, etc. Even the technology used (bluetooth) is at its core a security nightmare. To (mis)quote Amos in The Expanse, the bicycle is the ultimate doomsday vehicle. With electronic components that require smart devices to use/tune/etc. that capability goes bye bye.
  • 12 1
 Yep, that was my first thought too. How long will this keep working and be supported? I still ride 25 year old bikes all the time and just replaced my 11 year old bike. Will the cell phone connection keep working with a phone that comes out 10+ years from now? At some point it won't be supported anymore. For a lot of people that will be fine, but for others, it won't.

Curious to see what happens when someone hacks the wireless connection and starts controlling the shifting of people around them. Some not so ethical countries or racers could use that to help win Olympic races etc.
  • 7 1
 @doachs: not to mention the SRAM app may drop support for your phone if it’s old so then you need a new phone to ride
  • 3 0
 My wife had the Di2 on her road bike fail due to a firmware error. Unlike pretty much any mechanical drivetrain failure mode, it was not diagnosable on the roadside, and we had to take it to a shop to update it. Ultimately the motor ended up failing and Shimano warrantied it. But good warranty service != good reliability. I work in electronics reliability engineering, and I find it hilarious when people tell me with a straight face that "electronic shifting is maintenance-free". Yeah, give it a couple years.
  • 1 0
 @majunior: Completely wrong. You don't need the app to ride, nor even to adjust the drivetrain. You can happily ride with and adjust AXS components without a phone.
  • 21 0
 Yes, no, or... oddly specific middle ground?
  • 23 7
 So far the electronic AXS stuff on my bikes has actually simplified my bikes. Batteries last a LONG time and it's pretty hard to actually let them run out if you have even an ounce of responsibility. Less maintenance and have shown to be WAY more durable than my old mechanical stuff.
  • 15 5
 I don't get why a bunch of people who probably charge their phone once a day at least are mad about charging one battery every month (and that's if they ride a lot).
  • 14 6
 @alxrmrs: The phone does not run without battery, my shifters do.
  • 12 0
 @alxrmrs: If there was a phone that was almost as good as my current one but I didn’t have to charge it, I’d be all in!
  • 7 0
 @alxrmrs: When my phone dies, its a good thing. Not so much with the bike
  • 8 0
 @kylar: If only they made a phone that was somehow connected by some sort of cable…
  • 4 0
 @FrankS29: Shut up and take my money!
  • 2 0
 @FrankS29: Those ones only did that weird feature where they make a noise and you yell into it. I don't really use that feature, its mostly for pictures of bikes.
  • 3 5
 @alxrmrs: the same people who don't check tire pressure or lube their chain.
  • 5 2
 @alxrmrs: It is quite difficult to live without a cell phone nowadays and actually, my smartphone makes my life easier. Electronic derailleur? Not at all. You still need to do basically the same maintenance. Yes, you don't need to change the cables, but you have to remember to check your battery and charge it... and with a proper maintenance, cables can last a very long time.
  • 6 1
 @RonSauce: I check my tire pressures, lube my chain, service my own suspension and just yesterday I have changed all bearings in my DH frame... But why would I add more things to remember if they do not make my bike any better?
  • 4 3
 @kuejku: you are exaggerating how inconvenient it is. Im not even a big proponent of electronic shifting, im just sick of people acting like its a part time job to charge a battery once every couple months.
  • 5 2
 @RonSauce: Are you OK with people exaggerating how much better their lives are with electronic shifting?
  • 5 1
 @Rhymer: there is a difference between being happy with a purchase you made because it works as well as stated and complaining about how hard it is to use something you have never touched.

I dont complain about the inconvenience of owning a Ferrari, im also not mad if you love driving your Honda.
  • 11 0
 I had Ultegra DI2 on my cross bike. Mechanical Dura Ace on the road bike. Both worked just fine. The electric didn’t work any better really. I have a philosophical dislike of anything that starts making a bike more complex and expensive. Cars and trucks have gone way overboard with complex shit that’s just not needed. Like blind spot sensors, carpets on the floor, electronic doo dads up the ying yang that just add cost. Keep my cables mechanical and on the outside of the frame. No automatic shock and fork dampers. No electric tire valves. I will use a bike computer but the simplest functions are all that I need. //
  • 8 0
 Yeah carpets on the floor fuck that
  • 10 0
 Reducing failure points is critical. When I’m on the trail I don’t want to have to think about anything but the ride. And I often just get up and go, not all rides are planned out. K.I.S.S!
  • 7 0
 I would want to have a bike that in theory lasts 200 years. 30 years from now people are just gonna look at today’s electronic tech and laugh at how incompatible and obsolete it is and no one is going to spend the effort to keep them running. A good mechanical on the other hand appreciates over time and can be maintained indefinitely.
  • 3 3
 @blackthorne: indefinitely meaning a non definite amount of time. could be years, could be months.
  • 7 0
 @blackthorne: YES. I came here to make the same comment. Electronics are so much more likely to go obsolete compared to mechanical systems.
  • 7 0
 @ABhardtail: Especially if software setup is required, then boom, that's your red flag because the apps will no longer exist and the Androids and the IOSes of the future will not support them and you effectively have a shiny brick. Keep in mind that prior to the last 25ish years humans would hang on to things for generations. Where the idea of selling consumers planned obsolescence would have caused fury it is now the norm. This is completely understandable because computers and software is evolving exponentially and no one wants a 2005 Macbook. But these are bicycles not iPhones. I think the electrification of existing mechanical parts just shows that we've reached a ceiling where the mechanical tech is just so good that manufacturers are struggling to find something revolutionary to increase sales. You travel around the world and see how people ride the shit out of their bikes and then you wonder why we have been conditioned to lust after a $500 wireless dropper post or electronic lockout.
  • 6 1
 Electronic brakes scare me but... they've be doing it in cars for a long time. If I switched over to electronic brakes, Id have to keep the hoses on my bike just to see them there. At least for a while. Or just not talk about it.
  • 13 1
 Just to be clear, the brakes in your car are electronically assisted. No safety policy would allow for the elimination of a redundancy in safety equipment. I would assume bikes would be no different.
  • 5 15
flag GZMS (Mar 18, 2022 at 14:59) (Below Threshold)
 @jomacba: just to be clear, you are wrong. There are plenty of cars where brakes are electronic , e.g. pretty much all hybrid cars. Not assisted, but a full on brake by wire system. Thats why many of them are jerky at slow speeds, especially older ones.

Also, on those cars that have traditional hydraulic systems, none have electronic brake assist. Maybe there are super rare exceptions, but these are irrelevant to the point.

So basically you were wrong twice in you “clarification”, well done
  • 4 0
 @GZMS: Actually, given that any brake that runs off of electricity has a bypass valve that allows them to run as a full hydraulic in case of a system failure, this falls under electric assist. On that not, it's not actually as common as you say it is. Yes hybrids and electric vehicles utilize a electronics in their braking systems, but these are not the majority either. Abs systems use electronic sensors at each wheel to prevent wheels from locking up.... This is an example of an electronically assisted braking system.
So no I'm not wrong. As stated, no governing body would allow for the reliance (at least on north American roads) for any production vehicle to not have some failsafe involved.
On that note, I was more pointing to the fact that what @bmar was referring to was a wireless system, which indicates there is not possibility of a redundant system in place.
  • 2 0
 @jomacba: The first run of the toyota prius had a major defect with it's electronic brakes. Actually caused a significant number of fatalities. Go to minute 41 of the radiolab podcast if you're interested.

www.wnycstudios.org/podcasts/radiolab/articles/bit-flip

I'd need to see a long track record of safety before I put them on my bike.
  • 2 0
 @jaznomore: There's been a history of failed brakes in all departments. Nothing is fail proof, it's more of negating probability. All I'm saying is generally speaking any company especially in the automotive industry is responsible of practicing due diligence.
Any safety related product typically has some type of failsafe or redundancy in order to alleviate the majority of potential total malfunctions. Alot like a backup parachute. Not a guarantee, but definitely some type of peace of mind.

Personally I don't really see the benifit to electronic brakes on bikes, and again given that bikes will take an impact, the probability of a failure is too high to sell any peace of mind to me.
  • 6 0
 If It's not going to make me faster and it cost's more It's a definite no.cables last like 5000k and are cheap and easy to replace. I can bring a spare cable but can you bring a spare motor and battery?
  • 2 1
 I also used to carry a spare cable, but I never knew how I would cut it if I actually needed it, and I never needed it, so I stopped carrying it. Do you cut yours beforehand, or is there a cable cutter for ants that I don't know about?
  • 4 0
 @FatSanch: You don't need to cut it. Just loop the loose end in a circle and twist the tip through the circle a few times.
  • 2 0
 @FatSanch: I don't bring a cable on a ride. I meant bring a spare and leave it in the car when at a race or weekend away etc.
  • 2 0
 @darthsarge: yeah you can totally bring a spare battery. I normally carry a spare derailleur to a race weekend anyway, but the cost of doing so would certainly increase with wireless
  • 2 0
 @L0rdTom: yeah i usually bring a spare bike lol. I guess it comes down to money,charging, bad for environment.
  • 2 1
 @barp: dang, I was hoping there was a tiny cable cutter I didn't know about for my tool collection :-) TBH, I'm pretty sure I was running a FD at the time, but I guess with 1X it's not so much of a problem.
  • 10 1
 When the batteries are not so bad for the environment
  • 6 1
 Yessssss! Lithium is now being called 'white gold' because of the 'green' shift toward electric cars- this is just another place it and other REEs are needed. There is push in Nevada to open a 18k acre open-pit lithium mine (bigger than the indigenous reservation it's right beside), and that is just one example. I realize we can't eliminate batteries all together- bikes a place we just don't need them.
  • 5 0
 I really don't have that much trouble with my cable actuated 11speed stuff. I honestly feel like going to an AXS or similar would only introduce potential problems that I don't currently have.
I get the upside for some people (Kirt Vories throwing barspins for example) but I don't see the benefit for myself.
  • 5 0
 I've had enough electronic devices that randomly, inexplicably, and expensively shat the bed--usually very soon after their warranty expired--that I have no interest whatsoever in replacing the mechanical parts of my bike (which, might I add, work absolutely flawlessly and with hardly any maintenance, if you just install them properly in the first place).
  • 6 0
 I’m a geek, I work as an engineer in the tech industry - bikes are my escape, I like mine to stay free of electronics. Electronic shifting etc is another solution looking for a problem.
  • 4 0
 The price is a serious barrier for me, for sure. But past experience with electronic controlled components has taught me to remain analog. Every time I look at an AXS derailleur I just keep thinking how much that will cost to replace after the next rock hit. I'll save my money for a good, reliable, non-electronic component that finally eliminates the derailleur completely.
  • 5 1
 Leaving AXS behind after it took enough of a beating to stop working properly. It's larger than mechanical, it hits more stuff, and now it chooses when it wants to work well and when not to. That said, I'm running it until it completely fails - it costs too much not to.
  • 7 1
 The year is 2040, you woke up late and receive a notification through neural link that your self riding bicycle subscription expired.
  • 5 1
 If it was Di2 then yes - i'll happily charge one battery every couple of months for amazing shifting, but as far as I know there is no di2 12sp mtb groupset in the works, and I've no interest in charging Sram Axs batteries every few rides and messing around with bluetooth derailleurs that don't work properly.
  • 2 1
 every few rides? I ride 30-40 mile rides almost every day all summer and it only needs to be charged maybe every couple weeks. When ya do have to charge it, it only takes an hour or less.
  • 6 1
 Will they be harvesting data on what gear I use and selling it to China? I imagine the Chinese CEO saying something like ¨these Americans are such pussies, using their granny gear for even the slightest hill¨
  • 4 0
 All bikes already have electronics, the secret tracking devices put in by the government. They put extra devices on fixies and SS bikes as they know those folks are nuts. I read somewhere on the internet that ebikes running axs caused COVID.
  • 3 0
 The most expensive part of electronic drivetrains is the rear derailleur. Don't want to be in a position where tagging a rock costs me several hundred dollars when an SLX or XT cable actuated derailleur is a fraction of that price. If that price came down, I'd be down.
  • 3 5
 Archer Components D1x, FTW, Baby!
  • 4 0
 I wouldn't want electronics unless it enables the replacement of vulnerable rear derailleurs. In my view, they should be used for designs that are impossible with cables to see how far things can be advanced.
  • 1 1
 Archer Components Dx1, baby.
  • 2 0
 @JakeEPooh: that doesn't remove the rear derailleur so doesn't fit my requirements.
  • 8 5
 I was a skeptical when it first launched. Then I tried them, and I’m never going back.

Totally get it though, it’s crazy expensive and def not for every person/budget. But if you love new tech, being an early adopter, and having the cleanest/best shifting experience possible and don’t mind paying for it, it’s worth every penny.
  • 5 1
 Agreed. I mated a GX AXS derailleur to my Shimano HG+ drivetrain - shifts instantly and under load.

Do I love that a replacement derailleur will cost me 3x as much as an XT derailleur? No. But frankly, I have to imagine that electronic derailleurs will come down to match manual derailleurs cost as competition increases over time. After all, there is nothing about a blue tooth chip and small servo motor that justifies the huge cost of the derailleur. In the meantime, I chalk it up to the cost of having new tech early in the development cycle. Smile
  • 4 1
 You'll have to pry my AXS derailleur out of my cold dead fingers, everything else can be tossed in the bin.
  • 5 1
 buy two batteries and keep one in your pack/bag
  • 5 1
 @KJP1230: Same. I run two bikes with the GX /Shimano combo. Amazing how well it shifts.
  • 5 4
 @HeyItsCarter: Most on Pinkbike are CLEARLY too cheap to afford a second $55 battery, as you can tell by the comments.
  • 4 0
 @chicane32: And half of us ride Santa Cruz, according to last year's survey.
  • 3 0
 Standard mechanical SLX/Xt drivetrains shift amazingly well when set up right and are very reliable. Ok they occasionally skip gear after many hours of riding but they rarely fail so bad you can't ride home again.

On trail Mechanical issues can be generally be bodged back together but I don't know what I'd do if the electronics failed on an electronic derailleur miles from home. Especially if you live in a wet climate...

I say stay with mechanics while we still can!
  • 3 0
 IDK - put XT11 speed on my trail bike couple of years ago and after 5000km just don't think it's missed a shift - my first derailleur was 5 speed huret with friction shift so todays stuff is brilliant - electronic may be even better but I would be better off not working to earn the money to pay for it and riding more
  • 3 0
 Xt 11 spd was the best hey.12 spd isn't as reliable.
  • 7 0
 Increasingly, I find myself to be an analog man in a digital world
  • 2 0
 I’m just a Ludditeasaurus in the age of the Anthropocene.
  • 1 1
 @EricHarger: It is an age rife with fraught and upheaval.
  • 4 0
 My opinion is electronics are ok if I can still ride with a dead battery. So computer, power meter, air pressure gauge: all fine. Shifting, dropper, even flight attendant: not for me
  • 3 0
 Still think we need to 'keep it simple'. Electronics are just too finicky sometimes...then your stuck. At lease with mechanical stuff there is some 'way out' in most cases. Lose a connection on an uphill or down and...well...ugh!
  • 3 0
 I borrowed a high end bike with e-shifting and of course the battery died on a long ride far away from home. So I was swapping the seat post and derailleur battery depending on terrain. For what? The shifting isn't any better. It's complete marketing b.s. I just saw that shimano high end road groups are now all e-shift and I just pray these companies don't ram that crap down our throats as well.
  • 2 0
 Forth option, I have them but wish I could get an equivalent without them. More referring to Srams road lineup. Still all cable on the mountain bike but AXS seems to be the future for all Sram stuff. Works well but is a bit expensive.
  • 3 0
 Still not sold on them in the MTB market. As a snobby high end road tech, Di2/AXS all day especially on full integrated bikes like aero/tt/tri bikes. If you can't afford the electronic model of those, don't bother.
  • 2 0
 You’re 100% right about TT/Tri bikes, but we’re here to talk about mountain bikes not rolling exercise equipment Smile
  • 2 0
 I don't see me ever want any of this, but I can imagine the wireless stuff could be great for those who own several mid travel bikes. Just one shifter, dropper and rear mech to share between all the 12sp drivetrain bikes. Considering how expensive even the top level wired versions can be (especially the dropper posts) it may pay off eventually. If these units are as great as they claim to be, swapping them out should be done in a matter of minutes.

But yeah, that's for them. For me, having wireless communication between components that stay at a small and constant distance from each other seems pretty pointless. Wired electronic shifting (Di2 from Shimano) was pretty good supposedly so I did consider it at some point. The cables didn't bother me (I wouldn't run them internally anyway) but the cost is just too much for the marginally better performance over a mechanical system.
  • 3 0
 Depends on the bike. On the one hand I don't want anything electric on my steel hardtail, but would happily have it on my ebike if the price was right and it could all work off the ebike battery
  • 2 0
 Electronics are awesome when they add capability and/or reliability. Cables have drawbacks (setup) but after spending a season living with RED eTap AXS, I found that it required more attention than a cable drivetrain to remain functional, and it didn’t actually DO anything to justify the added upkeep. Note that cost isn’t a factor in that assessment. Unless that changes, it's cables for me.
  • 3 0
 I have to mess with all kinds of electronic crap all the time so I'd rather not have to deal with it on my bike, it's an escape. Also I prefer the mechanical feel and actuation when shifting, it's enjoyable to me.
  • 5 0
 I ride bikes to escape all the problems that inherently follow electronic things. Hard pass.
  • 2 0
 No! I’ve been riding long enough to know this, “thanks for reaching out to us about your electronic RD not charging properly, Due to an increase of calls and e-mails, we are experiencing slight delays”

1 week later - oh sorry that’s not covered under our warranty.

Love our sport but hate the lack of standards and support. Shit also goes obsolete way too fast already, throw in electronics and even the dentist won’t be able to keep up.

.
  • 2 0
 On my road bike I’ve got di2 and I like it. Doesn’t need charging often, no wireless pairing to mess about with, no firmware updates required plus I hated front mech mechanical shifting and Di2 makes that a dream.

On my mtb I don’t want anything electronic on it personally. AXS sounds easy to fit but you have separate batteries in each component to keep on top of battery life for.

Plus I don’t want a £300 12 speed mech - I snapped an XT one recently and £100 for a new one hurt enough.
  • 2 0
 I come from the age of Lucas electrics and when every battery leaked. My disdain was well founded. I look more at material research and the possibilities of every part of my bicycle becoming stronger and lighter….As commuter and cargo e bikes evolve they will have integrated and waterproof lights and gages which will trickle over to gravel road and touring. The stainless cable was an enormous advancement.
  • 2 0
 My trail bike was sitting in storage since late November. I did some standard maintenance before I put it there... and you know what? I took it for a ride today. First time since November. Didn't have to worry about any batteries. Just went for a ride. Everything worked fine... my dropper seatpost, rear derailleur... flawless. Never had any issues with it.

I also run a ~15 year old XT derailleur on my pump track/dj bike. It works fine, shifts smoothly and the only thing that I miss is a clutch... I am quite sure the current electronic stuff will not be supported anymore in 15 years time and will end up in a trash can.
  • 2 0
 The only way I'd be game for on-board electric shifting would be if it was integrated into an e-bike's electronics. I don't have an e-mtb yet, prolly not for hopefully a few more years, but that seems like a logical landing place for this tech. The roadies and dentists can meanwhile continue to email SRAM with their pairing issues....
  • 4 0
 Pass….charge phone, charge lights, charge bike computer, charge earbud, change batteries, eat. Spend an hour prepping for a 2 hour ride!
  • 2 0
 I finally bit the bullet and upgraded my enduro to an XT 1x12. All I have to say is holy crap it shifts a beauty. Maybe the battery powered stuff shifts better still, but for maybe the first time ever, I'm not wishing the shift performance or chain retention was better. I can't justify the huge cost of electronics, given how good the XT stuff is. Same with XTR, really.
  • 2 0
 Rode AXS shifting for a few months - zero trouble except for having to remember to charge the battery. But also zero advantage and slightly slower multi-up shifts. Swapped back to cable shifting, only downside was 30 mins or so to install and now I never have to remember to charge a battery again.
  • 2 0
 Owned eTap AXS for 1.5 years. It shifts great, but so did the mechanical Eagle I had for years beforehand. The battery life is poor (I get about 18 hours of riding), and remembering to charge it is a constant minor nuisance. Three times it's totally or partially ruined a day of riding: once with a dead battery deep in the woods, another with an unexpected low battery forcing me to shorten a ride, and the third time when I forgot the battery in the charger and drove to ride.

All-in-all, it's a technological marvel that is much more expensive, offers no tangible advantage, and occasionally ruins your day. It's been a net frustrating experience, and I wish I had had the option of a mechanical group on the high-end bike that I wanted.
  • 3 0
 there should have been an option like this - I’ve had electronics, i liked them, but opted not to use them on my next bike for simplicity reasons.
  • 1 0
 I would like Electronics, my wallet disagrees.
Maybe when they trickle down to the $4-500CAD (all in, battery, charger, derailleur) and $300 for a dropper I’ll bite.
If they came out with a ‘Ride more’ combo - Dropper, Derailleur, charger and 3 batteries (one for each, plus a spare) at $700 id make the jump.


I’m also super fearful that because my bike, that lives in a Storage room with no power, I will forever be forgetting to charge them post- ride and I’ll go down to a dead battery.
  • 1 0
 I don't want electronics that replace mechanical functions, like shifting or adjusting suspension or adding power (unless commuting), but I add sensors for speed, GPS, heart rate sensor (technically on my body) and would be somewhat interested in a power meter. If there were mechanical versions for something I prefer to use those, but I am willing to use electronics to add new functionality.
  • 2 1
 You don’t need to get your phone out to adjust axs.

I’ve been running the GX axs for a year now and it has been flawless. Flawless that is until I bent the derailleur… it’s going to be a much more costly replacement but I am not going back to cables. (Even though I’ve hoarded the cable set up it replaced!)
  • 3 0
 So heavier, more expensive, AND less convenient than the existing solution? A MTB golden trifecta! Shut up and take my money…
  • 2 1
 After a decade+ of riding nothing but singlespeeds, all those extra cables on my current bike look really ugly to me. I want AXS for purely aesthetic reasons.

Doesn't bother me enough to pay that much extra for the upgrade though. Maybe the next bike...
  • 2 1
 My friends whether you are for all the new e-tech bits for bikes or an old schooler who enjoys the mechanical mechanisms know one thing. " If it has TIT's or Wheels, you are going to have a problem!!!!" Just ride your bikes and who cares!
  • 4 0
 Just seems like a complicated and expensive solution for something that isn't really a problem
  • 2 1
 I’ve had an AXS mech for the last year, after managing to get one with a discount. I was a sceptic, but having tried the AXS dropper and realised how it good it really was, I wanted to try the mech. I’ve covered over 3,000 miles on it now and it’s delivered consistent shifting every time, no matter the weather, a level of consistency you just can’t get with mechanical gears as there’s no cable to stretch/corrode/fray. The batteries don’t need charging often and it’s quick and easy to charge. I totally get the beauty of not having to rely on electrics, but this is a genuine evolution of the bike drivetrain, that actually can make your ride more enjoyable. It’s future and I’m sure once Shimano enter the market it will drive the overall price down.
  • 2 1
 Option C: have them and happier with my electronic stuff
Have a full AXS setup with dropper on one of my bikes. It's great, but the next bike I'm building is all mechanical.
Mechanical setups are just simpler and easy to maintain so the upside of faster shifts and no cables yadda yadda just isn't really that much more compelling for me when mechanical systems are just so good at this point.
Would you rather:
- change a some cables once or twice a year
Or
- update the firmware in your derailleurs, dropper, and controls and maintain battery power on all of them. Yuck.
  • 1 0
 I dig the hell out of the SRAM AXS dropper on my Yeti SB165. It’s nice having the ability to do a quick swap to a standard post and gravity adjusted saddle for bike park days. Could see myself going in on the drivetrain too if a wireless short cage derailleur existed
  • 2 1
 Jokes aside if I never had to worry about charging and it was half of the current price I would probably get it! Maybe they should make an electronic drivetrain that charges while pedalling, that way you never have to charge it or worry about it!
  • 2 0
 I don't want it on my muscular bike, but I wouldn't mind on an e-bike (but if it's centralized, with all electronic devices plugged on the main battery, not with 5 different batteries).
  • 1 0
 I have both derailleur and seatpost and I really like it. Looking forward to a smaller battery, that's the only thing I dislike. And the shifters. They're ugly. I got rid of them and now I'm using the Zirbel shifters connected to a Blipbox. So far so good.
  • 4 0
 I still am sore about losing the 3.5mm earphone jack on iPhones......don't even get that electronic crap near my bike.
  • 3 0
 On the trails at a bike park Thursday, ebike rider in the group has 2 bars left by 11:30am, home buy 1:30pm.

Money well spent
  • 2 1
 All three of my mountain bikes are AXS and my road bike is Di2. Coming from a lifelong analogue snob, I tried AXS two years ago and never looked back. The single most impressive upgrade aside from carbon hoops. You don't realize how much work it is to push a cable actuated lever until you spend a few days on AXS. Keeps you from over working your hands, saving that energy for pumping and carving!
  • 4 0
 Thumb fatigue….. that’s a new argument
  • 2 1
 @kylar: Quite a few reviews mentioned it. Its something you don't actively think of until its significantly decreased or removed from the equation. Many muscles at play to just generate that motion of pushing a lever or pulling a trigger.
  • 3 1
 @Simann: Bro, do you even hand workout?
  • 3 1
 @Simann: must be something wrong with your hands dude it's really easy to change gears. I'd even say that it's the easiest part of mountainbiking.
  • 1 0
 I would only have non-essential parts be electric on my bike. I have a Shockwiz for my suspension, and if it runs out of battery or fails it's no big deal. Computers and power meters I'm also fine with for the same reason, but I don't really use either myself
  • 2 0
 I'd love to get an AXS drivetrain, but I don't want the huge eagle cassette. I'll keep crossing my fingers that Sram will make a 10-42 12 speed cassette. Doubt it'll happen though.
  • 2 1
 Have had Di2 for 8 years (road) and AXS for 2 (gravel) I would totally be on board for mtb if the rear derailleur weren't so expensive. I ride rocky tech stuff that eats derailleur and the prospect of replacing a $700.00 derailleur is not something im down with.
  • 1 0
 I wouldn't consider wireless until I'd tried it. Electronic shifting is great, so smooth, but you have the worry that a new derailier is going to cost you around 4-500 pound if you smash it. Not tried a wireless dropper but I don't see any problems with a cable.
  • 1 0
 Not against electronic, however technically it is limited to SRAM options, which I'm not fan of, so waiting for Shimano to release counterpart to use it;

I would say it all depends how many hours per week/month you are on the bike, in case 1 time for few hours - I doubt about any benefits;

riding 4 days per week - you will never forget charging, since you will do a lot of maintenance anyway (you can charge when u cleaning your chain/bike)
  • 1 0
 Its an aesthetic choice for me. Sure, I have a cellphone and love that mini computer, not least of all for rides because of the music and trail navigation. But I draw the line with electronics on a bike. I hear the reliability is not an issue, but I just have the personal preference to be able to largely fix almost anything that breaks on the trail. Also, I like to simplify my time with biking, so I don't want to add charging a battery to the list. I feel the preride list is big enough (tire pressure, chain clean/lube, stanchion wipe, plus whatever else needs to be maintained on a modern bike, which is a fair bit).

Of course, the preference for electronics is as personal as aluminum vs carbon, 29 vs 27, flats vs clips, and on and on.
  • 4 0
 mechanical, hydraulic or pneumatic... i don't care for electronic.
  • 5 5
 Shifting: Yes, I already have GX AXS on one bike and it’s honestly amazing. It’s the same shifting, but better.

EMTBs: Yes, I already have one in addition to my regular bike and there is room for both. Riding an ebike takes some different new skills.

Live Valve, Flight Attendant, ABS, etc etc: Nope. Ebikes might make things easier to climb, etc, but you are still in control. Anything that removes control, challenge and requires less actual skill from the rider is a no go for me.
  • 1 2
 E bikes definitely take less climbing skill on the same trails sooooooooo ya. I would say if it isnt fore me then that is all I can really say eh. Hydraulic brakes, droppers, better suspension all lower the barrier to entry but I doubt you are willing to give those up right?
  • 2 3
 @kokofosho: True to a point, but you can climb things on an ebike that you couldn’t on a regular bike. Not sure if you have ever ridden an ebike? It’s still mountain biking - they are not motorcycles - but they also ride quite differently and you can use quite a different skill set.

Hydro brakes, droppers, suspension… they don’t really take away the skill or control, though, do they? You could almost argue that they’re safety features. Nobody could argue that Live Valve makes you a safer rider.

Still, each to their own, right?
  • 2 0
 How good are thoose AXS deraileurs? My XT12s was ready for the parts bin after 2500km, but its ok with 80 bucks on a new deraileur a year. The AXS is like 400?!
  • 1 1
 My XT 12 speed rear mech was ready to toss shockingly fast. My X01 AXS replacement has been really solid, even after multiple rock hits and a few crashes. The overload protection is legit.
  • 3 1
 If you’re not prone to smashing them, which axs is better for that in some situations, it’s probably similar. I’m at ~1500km on my x01 axs, on two different long travel 29ers (including bike park days) and it’s still perfectly fine. Shift quality is the same even though I’ve bent and replaced two hangers. Battery life is also about the same. Bike is ridden year round from roughly -7C to 35C.
  • 2 2
 I had an XX1 AXS derailleur setup and seatpost the seat post was pretty awesome I really liked it effortless press of the button except I don't like the reverb post themselves and I don't like the huge seat collar and the lack of drop compared to a one up or the price. Now the derailleur I really didn't care for it didn't shift fast enough you can't grab a handful of shifts at once and also the paddle is too vague You don't get the click clunk and feel of knowing where you're at in the cassette range the electric I didn't tell how many times I pressed the button and it was shift too slow and I couldn't tell where I was at it was super vague I sold both of them for all the money
  • 4 1
 wut?
  • 6 1
 @jpat22: Public school education here. In just 2 sentences he said,"Like the dropper, hated the post and derailleur. Sold it and bought a Koi fish".
  • 4 1
 You can literally dump the entire cassette by holding down the shift button. Mechanical you are limited to 3 and that assumes your gears don’t get crunchy.
  • 4 0
 @oldschool43: lmao too funny. Nailed it. I used voice to text what a run on sentence lol but I love your tlrd version
  • 6 1
 Yes I stash a vape pen.
  • 5 1
 dude i dont even like charging my cell phone
  • 2 1
 dude, many times I forget to charge my phone
  • 4 0
 Where is the HAIL NAW
option?
  • 4 0
 My thumbs need the exercise, so no e shifting for me. Earn your shifts.
  • 3 1
 Returning to normal bikes after a year on a e-bike , I can say that i am a 100% sure i don't ever want range or any other anxiety again thanks.
  • 1 0
 Cost / benefit analysis. My pocket has already been significantly looted by bike MFG's, plus component an clothing suppliers. So adding electronics needs to be a GOOD value proposition and then I'll consider.
  • 1 1
 Oh sure this is how it starts but later comes the MTB riders are too stupid to shift their own gears we will decide when thier gears will be shifted. For there own good. Than a little bit later comes we disagree with your politics so we have cancelled your ability to shift gears.
  • 1 0
 I think they are a cool Idea but not needed. I was looking at the Archer components but the price tag. I am like my Box 9 shifts just fine and waterproof and cheaper to replace.
  • 5 2
 If it ain't broke, don't fix it. Gear shifting wasn't broke. Pinkbike wasn't broke. Redbull race coverage wasn't broke.
  • 3 0
 Can you help me if I am broke?
  • 2 0
 The initial cost of the GX conversion kit is reasonable. However I destroy at least one derailleur per year on average and the replacement costs would be too much.
  • 3 0
 I have no issue its out there, I just prefer mechanical feel.
  • 2 0
 In the words of 2Unlimited: "No, no. No, no, no, no. No, no, no, no. No, no, no, no..."
  • 2 6
flag noplacelikeloam (Mar 18, 2022 at 13:53) (Below Threshold)
 But they also said; "Techno, techno techno"

Let me hear you say yeah, yeah
Let me hear you say yeah, yeah
No no, no no no no, no no no no
No no there's no limit!
No no, no no no no, no no no no
No no there's no limit!
No no limits, we'll reach for the sky
No valley to deep, no mountain to high
No no limits, won't give up the fight
We do what we want and we do it with pride
Let me hear you say yeah
Hard to the core, I feel the floor
When I'm on stage, yo, ya answer more
I'm on the edge, I know the ledge
I work real hard to collect my cash
Tick tick ticka tick take your time
When I'm goin' I'm goin' for mine
Open your ears and you will hear it
I tell you this 'cause there's no limit
No no, no no no no, no no no no
No no there's no limit!
No no, no no no no, no no no no
No no there's no limit!
No no limits, we'll reach for the sky
No valley to deep, no mountain to high
No no limits, won't give up the fight
We do what we want and we do it with pride
Ow! hey yay yeah hey hey! Now, now
No no, hey yeah yeh hey hey! Now, now, hoo!
No limits allowed, 'cause there's much crowd
Microphone check as I choose my route
I'm playing on the road, I've got no fear
The south from my mouth is on record here
There never will be no mountain too high
Reach the top, touch the sky
They tried to diss me 'cause I sell out
I'm making techno and I am proud
No no limits, we'll reach for the sky
No valley to deep, no mountain to high
No no limits, won't give up the fight
We do what we want and we do it with pride
  • 3 1
 Current Ebikes are a joke with their multiple energy storages and i don't need that stuff on my unmotorized bike either.
  • 1 0
 it's just guaranteed I forget the battery or forget to charge it. something like flight attendant I could handle. if I forget it, so what? but nothing ride dependent.
  • 2 1
 Nope..I've let to many eat my dust and left stranded because there stupid battery died or there sensor fell off or the derailer stopped working.. hahaha see ya told you so
  • 1 1
 I’ve done some diy bike electronics like suspension travel analysis. It’s kinda fun and probably a lot cheaper and more accessible for diyers than welding your own frame or cncing your own crank.
  • 2 1
 Tbh I really like friction shifters. Index is convenient but with friction you'll never miss a shift. Bring back thumbshifters!
  • 1 1
 2 brake lines - simple, uncluttered, clean looking cockpit. The only real reason I ride AXS shifting and wireless seat post. Riding this set up for 2 years now, without any issues, and I'm a lazy battery charger.
  • 3 0
 I have a speedometer on my bike that tells me how fast I’m going.
  • 3 0
 I ride bikes, golf, fish, and run to get away from electronics. Wink
  • 1 0
 Let's just decide, with a straight face, to call any bike with a battery an 'electronically assisted bike'. Either that or go around knocking beers over in a biker bar...
  • 1 1
 Just ordered GX AXS for my e-bike. Charging batteries isn't hard. I already charge my riding light, my phone, my watch, my laptop, my power tools, my mower, my torch and hopefully one day soon my car.
  • 1 0
 id rather SRAM ditched the battery, and fixed the clutch. my GX AXS is so dam noisy compared to the XT i removed. very disappointed for £550
  • 1 0
 I thought I was especially when GX AXS came out but that want away and now I rarely think about it.
  • 2 0
 I want a 240mm wireless dropper. That's it.
  • 2 0
 Ya my dropper cable has broke twice at the shifter...not a great a great pull angle.
  • 2 0
 Again?!! Please stop asking
  • 2 0
 Nope, not wanting any witchcraft near my bike
  • 3 1
 don't trust the electronics
  • 1 1
 I want electronic brakes and I want it now…..to go with electronic everything….no cables or hoses…..infinite barspins y’all.
  • 2 0
 Wow, turns out I'm not the only Luddite.
  • 2 0
 Thats a no go for me boss
  • 2 0
 When the apocalypse comes, don't have to charge my analog drive-train
  • 1 0
 On it as soon as it trickles down to mid tier group sets... an then hits the sale rail
  • 2 0
 Screw that! I'm analog al the way on my E-bike!
  • 4 2
 I thought I'd blocked ebike content
  • 1 0
 JUST PUT A GEARBOX ON IT ALREADY, TIRED OF RIPPING DRIVE TRAINS OFF THE REAL WHEEL.
  • 2 4
 Shifting is perfect every time, derailleur can take a hit and bounce back, battery lasts nearly forever. If you can’t beat em join em. It’s a little sad that very pricey tech that not everyone can afford is making bikes so much better (ebikes, AXS) but it doesn’t change the fact that they are pretty rad. It also doesn’t change the fact that a battery-less bike is still just as fun as it was yesterday. Run what ya brung and be kind.
  • 1 0
 My eTap battery lasts about 18 hours, which is two good weeks of riding. But it's hard to keep track of when I last charged it and how much I've ridden since, so I have to charge it every couple of rides, which is a minor but significant hassle, especially because it's VERY easy to throw your bike on the car without the battery attached.
  • 1 0
 Running full axs on my enduro 29 it's awesome and/but I don't really need it!
  • 2 2
 It seems the only people who have problems with electronics are those who've never used them . But all those with axs are smitten and will never go back.
  • 1 1
 150+ riding days last year in the PNW with my XO1 AXS derailuer and it is still in the original adjustment. Shifts crisp and smooth as the day it was new. Love this stuff.
  • 1 0
 XTR RD-M952 says: „It's not important to do extraordinary things, but simple things to do extraordinarily well“
  • 1 0
 I like electronics that die in a second when it’s 4 degrees or colder out.... so absolutely no to electronics never
  • 3 1
 I just love Acoustics.
  • 4 1
 Muscle bikes 4eva
  • 1 0
 Those dynamo lights are getting pretty good.
  • 1 0
 only e brakes for me here!!
  • 1 0
 i have a ebike and won't run anymore electronics.
  • 3 2
 All my homies hate electronics on bikes.
  • 2 2
 Absolutely. After riding in the PNW for a week... They're the only way to go.
  • 2 0
 Can you expand on this?
  • 2 1
 @pmhobson: They're simple. The little motors in the derailleur are a lot stronger than the spring that derailleurs use, and don't care about how much mud/grime/dirt is on them. I've had my cable shifter crap out twice while riding there... They're not water/mud proof like the paddle is on the AXS stuff. So, 2 very annoying issues with my cable-pull system, zero issues with my AXS system. I have Shimano XT 12-speed on one bike and SRAM GX AXS on the other.
  • 2 0
 After riding in the PNW for years, my mechanical shifters still work flawlessly.
  • 3 0
 @barp: yeah. Same. A decade of wet weather riding and I guess I was doing it wrong. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
  • 1 0
 Elon Musk should make an Autopilot for bike haha
  • 1 0
 if its cheap then why not?
  • 2 5
 2 out 3 bikes are full AXS (drivetrain and post), and the 3rd (gravel) will be eventually. Never looking back.

Any battery excuse made in these comments is weak. Everyone here has a cell phone. Then again, judging by meme screenshots, anyone with an iphone should probably avoid AXS...
  • 5 1
 Cell phones can't function without electricity. Bikes can. Your argument is invalid.
  • 1 0
 I'll accept nothing less than electronic brakes
  • 1 0
 I'm open to a wireless dropper, but don't really care about drivetrain.
  • 2 1
 Fuck no!!!!
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