ALL DONE: Ask Us Anything with WTB -Tubeless Technology

Jan 19, 2015 at 19:14
by Wilderness Trail Bikes  
WTB

For this edition of Ask Us Anything, WTB’s experts and athletes will be answering all of your questions about tubeless. Few riders know that an international standard exists for tubeless. Even fewer realize what this means for tire and rim fit. WTB has spent an exhaustive amount of time honing in TCS, their Tubeless Compatible System. From Weir’s early Downieville tubeless frustrations to Moeschler’s global tubeless sales, it’s your chance to ask the pros. So go ahead, fire away.

Tie Rim Width Explained - WTB
WTB
WTB TCS


The Panel

JASON MOESCHLER – GLOBAL OEM SALES MANAGER / TEAM WTB


Jason began racing bikes at age 14 and over the course of his racing career has become a three-time Mountain Bike World Championship Competitor, ‘97 US Junior National Champion, as well as a three-time Downieville All Mountain Pro Champion. Now the 35-year-old races the clock for daylight to ride. It’s a constant battle to balance the demands of his full-time job as WTB’s OEM sales manager with traveling to races and trade shows, training, not to mention being a dad, husband, and all around good guy who’s always willing to help someone out.

From coaching mountain bike skills clinics for NorCal kids, wrenching on bikes for old friends, to giving away all of his firewood to the old lady next door—you get the picture. Yeah, he's a nice guy but rest assured—not all nice guys finish last—least of all Moeschler, who might possibly be the nicest guy who’ll ever pass you.Jason miraculously balances top-tier, professional XC and Enduro racing with meeting requests of global product managers, weaving the needs and trends of upcoming bicycles with the ruthless demands of Team WTB’s racers, making for constantly evolving product, punished to perfection.




MARK WEIR – TEAM WTB

Described as a well-rounded rider who specializes in suffering, Mark Weir, 41, has become a successful and dominant force in professional downhill endurance racing. The Novato, California native believes in hard work and fair play without compromise—values he will undoubtedly pass along to the kids he coaches on his backyard pump track, his son Gus included.

In terms of mountain biking, having these values means developing the skills, fitness, and technologies necessary to compete against the world’s best riders on any dirt, anywhere. And they don’t come easy, the skills and fitness that is… Mark explains, “I do the best I can with the skills I don’t have but the will that I do.” Not bad considering he’s “willed” himself to winning the Downieville Downhill eight times; climbed a million vertical feet in one year; and earned a top-10 spot in the NORBA National Series on a six-inch travel bike—all of which has helped to define the all mountain category of the sport.

As far as technology goes, Weir’s relationship with WTB’s R&D began with his namesake tire line, the WeirWolf, launched in the 1990s. Nearly a decade later, the tire tread pattern was updated and re-launched with the added feature of WTB’s new TCS (Tubeless Compatible System) technology that Mark also worked to advance with product developers. He devoted endless test ride hours specifically to rim/tire bead retention, resulting in a high-performance system with phenomenal flat resistance—something he’s been working towards since he stopped using tubes 10 years ago. Despite the suffer fests and challenges that come with pro racing, Weir continues to be inspired by the people he meets and competes against as well as the amazing places mountain biking takes him.



CHRIS FEUCHT – MANAGER OF NEW PRODUCT DEVELOPMENT


Chris started working in bike shops in 1980 when mountain bikes were merely concepts he and fellow East Coasters read about in magazines. In 1983 he bought a Fat Chance, and despite his roadie friends thinking he was crazy, he immediately fell in love with mountain biking. “Everything was open back then” Feucht reminisces, “I even used to ride nearby sections of the Appalachian Trail before it was ever banned to bikes”. Today he’s still the self-proclaimed fastidious mechanic he started out as, though most days you’ll find him walking WTB products from initial requests and concepts to finished, delivered goods. An avid, lifelong cyclist, you’d be hard-pressed to find a discipline Chris doesn’t put a pedal to, though he favors technical trails and constant challenge, powering his way relentlessly through the rugged Sierra Nevada foothills.

Chris is in constant communication with Team WTB. From perfecting casings to hand delivering samples, it’s a constant evolution of design and quest for perfection. Riding alongside Weir is no easy task, but he does his best to keep it respectable (for an old guy), not to mention balancing his other job, President of the Sierra Buttes Trail Stewardship, the non-profit entity responsible for the Downieville Classic, where Weir and Chris first became friends. It also helps that he’s been close friends with Jason Moeschler since the ride-a-work-a-good-guy-aholic was a mere 15 years old.

While you won’t find Chris on his first Fat Chance anymore, you will find a remarkably clean, meticulously cared for sibling bike hanging in Chris’ dining room. A theft 15 years ago separated Chris from his first Fat Chance but being a man of determination, he found an appropriately sized frame within three digits of his original serial number and built up a more than worthy age appropriate replacement. For people like Chris, mountain biking isn’t a pastime, it’s a way of life.


MARK SLATE – FOUNDER, DESIGNER

Slate found the peaceful Marin County public lands available for bicycle riding in the early 1970’s after years of making noise on motorcycles. Riding a woefully inadequate skinny tire bike allowed him to discover the many miles of fire protection roads and trails of Mt. Tamalpais. Experience with rebuilding, repairing and modifying motorcycles opened the door to piecing together a Klunker with guidance and help from Erik and the Koski family of the Cove Bike Shop dedicated to the development of off-road bicycles. Marin County had open land and various bands of bicycle enthusiasts. Mark Slate found Steve Potts at the start of his frame building career and helped to facilitate frame building. The parts needed to get these bikes rolling were Mark’s responsibility. At that early stage of off-road bicycle development parts needed were adapted from the world of bicycle road racing, BMX, utility bicycles and motorcycles. The need for better suited parts was obvious. Wilderness Trail Bikes as a parts provider came to life as a result of that need. Steve Potts and Mark Slate joined with Charlie Cunningham to provide parts for the use of early frame builders and adventurers needing stronger parts.

Fast forward from that 1982 start to today; years of off-road racing, friendships, designing for others and finding our way to the world of Asian production. WTB has produced and sold bicycle parts in many countries. Slate has traveled to most of these places, but counts his second home as Taiwan where his wife is from. The people of Taiwan make the bike industry as we know it today strong. But without that spirit of innovation that began on the slopes of Mt. Tamalpais and a group of like minded individuals Mark Slate would not have been able to enjoy a career designing bicycles, parts and enjoying the great outdoors as he does. Slate is grateful to the long standing group of people that keep WTB running and competing at a world class level.



How ‘Ask Us Anything' Works:

Starting at 10:00 AM PST/6:00 PM BST on Thursday, January 22nd you can type your questions into the comment box following this article and The WTB team will answer them. Sometimes your answer will pop up in a few seconds; others may take a while, as WTB will be busy responding to the flood of questions. Everyone who posts a question, large or small, will be taken seriously. To make the process as efficient as possible, try to follow these simple guidelines:

Keep your questions relative. While this is an 'Ask Us Anything' session, the concentration is on WTB's tubeless technology. Questions related to this are encouraged, but still feel free to ask whatever pressing queries you may have.

Stay focused. Try to keep your questions on one topic if possible. You can always ask about another item later.

• Try to keep your questions to about 100 words.

Ask Us Anything is a service to PB readers who are seeking helpful information, not a forum to broadcast opinions or grievances. If you do have a negative issue that you want to ask about, no worries, just keep your complaints relevant and in the context of a question so that it can be addressed in a productive manner.

Use propping to acknowledge good - or not so good - questions. Bump them up or down to where they belong.


Mark your calendars - the conversation starts at 10:00 AM Pacific Time / 6:00 PM British Time on Thursday, January 22nd.

Other time zones:
• 1:00 PM EST (New York)
• 6:00 PM BST (London)
• 7:00 PM CET (Paris)
• 8:00 PM SAST (Cape Town)
• 5:00 AM AEST (Sydney, Aus)


www.wtb.com

Must Read This Week

449 Comments

  • + 68
 When does WTH get his Vigilante commission check?
  • + 19
 Lord knows he's earned it.
  • + 8
 Vagi all the things.
  • + 1
 the Vigilante is a Bronson spin off, you need to fit one, unless you have a Death Wish.
  • + 10
 WTH for global rep! he has sold more just talking about them worldwide! also he is making a better job for me than my local WTB dealer WTH for president! @whattheheel
  • + 17
 You guys rule!!
  • + 1
 Good stuff! Take note other companies!
  • + 7
 so much neg prop Frown so nobody remembers the Charles Bronson film where he plays a Vigilante? or was it really that bad...

PS rumour has it that WTB are working on a new lightweight DH semi-slick called the DeathWish....
  • + 0
 @iffy most of them are too young to remember and yeah they where that bad!lol
  • + 4
 @iffy Charles Bronson was the Chuck Norris of his day, Death Wish and Once Upon a Time in The West are classics!!!!!
  • + 1
 I really am liking the Vigilante. Well done!
  • + 14
 mw Thanks for pushing WTB WTH, we should ride sometime and talk about this.
  • + 2
 @radioinactiv - I'm sorry, but Chuck Norris was still the Chuck Norris of Charles Bronson's day.
  • + 3
 @iffy, I + propped you! I used to use Velociraptors in the mid/late 90's, make a Jurassic Park pun up!
  • + 0
 VelocBraaapters! that do you?
  • + 6
 That's it? Cuz I make it to Cali on the regular...
  • + 1
 @Pigman lol I was looking at the Velociraptor today, so much mud here....same as in the 90's...
  • + 2
 I was lost with the mw in front of your comment, now I understand it. Thanks for taking the time to posse with my daughter at Interbike Mr. Weir!! www.pinkbike.com/photo/6104912
  • + 3
 MW Lydia and Gus should ride together, we can sick back and have a beer.
  • + 3
 Sounds like a date! Your place or mine? I have snow here so....
  • + 4
 mw Im a great host....
  • + 3
 I'll shoot you a PM next time I roll thru. May be a few years!!
  • + 3
 MW do it....
  • + 38
 What do you think of schwalbe procore. Any plans for a competing system, ideally cheaper Smile
  • - 5
flag bigburd (Jan 22, 2015 at 6:23) (Below Threshold)
 Pro core is soo good that no schwalbe riders use it , unless all these schwalbe riders on the WC getting flat tyres are just being let down by a poor product ?
  • + 5
 Only a few rider had it last year as far as I'm aware. Punctures are more a problem with the tyres than with Pro-Core I'd imagine.
  • + 9
 Well Sam hill won a WC last year on it , cant be to bad
  • + 10
 JM: The next step for tires and rims is a very big point of discussion within our product team. While I can't share any details of the concepts we are currently testing, I can say that we are looking for ways to improve tire and rim durability.
  • - 24
flag madmon (Jan 22, 2015 at 11:13) (Below Threshold)
 I only use Shwalbe tyres and mavic wheel sets. Both are true Universal Tubeless and need not too compromise or be compatible in order to work. There are NO holes in the inside rims as they are shiny and sealed.The only point it can leak is thru the rubber of the valve or tire. Personally I am sick and tired of companies that claim their wheels are UST ready when they are UST COMPATIBLE. Call them cinches not tubeless. You are not fooling the true UST supporters over the last 2 decades
  • + 6
 UST doesn't mean lack of spoke holes. A rim can have spoke holes and be UST.
  • - 16
flag madmon (Jan 22, 2015 at 12:26) (Below Threshold)
 spoke holes are not a seal
  • + 5
 JM: Our TCS rims, with spoke holes, and tape, used with sealant, have been made to pass ETRTO/UST tubeless standards.
  • - 13
flag madmon (Jan 22, 2015 at 12:45) (Below Threshold)
 I have had sealant end up in my nipples and spokes via under the sealing tape so that is why I only use true ust rims. It did not happen on a WTB wheel as I do not own any. I applaud WTB and I have some of your tires but I am not soon buying the wheels as I have a choice. Respect.
  • + 2
 madmon: correct, spoke holes are not a seal, but as I said, the UST specs do not call for no spoke holes: www.pinkbike.com/news/To-The-Point-UST-Rims-Tires-2013.html
  • - 12
flag madmon (Jan 22, 2015 at 13:18) (Below Threshold)
 I hear you loud and industrially clear. Sorry to speak the truth on your sponsored page I'll shut my cake hole now.
  • + 2
 lol @madmon "speak the truth" when it's obvious you don't know jackshit about the tubeless system
  • - 7
flag madmon (Jan 22, 2015 at 15:49) (Below Threshold)
 14 years ust with 2 ripped tyres as the only stopper....ya.....i know jack
  • + 9
 @madmon when you applied the tubeless tape to the rim you had an issue with, did you clean the interior of the rim with isopropyl alcohol to ensure good adhesion? Was the tubeless tape the correct width for your rim? Did you maintain good tension on the tape during application? Finally, did you wrap only once or did you apply two layers of tape?

Point is, there are so many factors concerning setup that it's not logical to accuse the system of being inherantly faulty. I have never had an issue with stick-on rim tape, or even with the non adhesive variety.

Lack of spoke holes just makes for a pain during wheel setup and truing.
  • + 2
 One thing I don't like about Procore is that it works in a downhill scenior but in normal riding conditions it would feel like your riding on a flat tire, and yes you would have TONS of grip but you would also be so tired that you turn around and go home.
  • + 14
 @bigburd - Only a few riders had their hands on Procore last season. We`ve had to keep the construction secret, that`s why we limited the amount of test-rider that rode Procore:

Sam Hill rode Procore from Fort William (2nd place) and won two WC`s
Emmeline Ragot won Fort William Worldcup on it while Rachel, Mannon and Tahneé (on Schwalbe but without Procore) flatted
Nico Lau won Tweedlove EWS on it. First time using it in a race. When he went to the US he used standard set-up as it makes a service on the trail easier and flatted in some gnarly rocks.
Markus Pekoll used the system all season long. He cut his tire in Meribel in quali and still got 26th. He finished the race on 8th position.
Brendan Fairclough rode the system all year long with no problems. He`s very impressed.

There are some other rider that wanted to stick with what they know. Unfortunately a lot of rider are not very open to new innovations till someone else rides it and proves that it works. Those rider are testing the system this off-season so they are confident to use it next year.
  • + 10
 Heck yea @schwalbe way to be willing to share info that other companies might have been reluctant to mention; laying out exactly who was running what, when they were running it, even to the point of talking about riders who flatted while riding your tires(which you rightly treat as not something to make a big deal about.)

Major Kudos.
  • + 3
 Hey @schwalbe - When will Procore be available in North America? I have a new DH build that I'm really hoping to try it out on.
  • - 8
flag madmon (Jan 23, 2015 at 17:49) (Below Threshold)
 thanx WTB for the customer service and welcome. I just ordered 2 sets of Shwalbes and took off the WTB's and cut them into un-usable bits. I am now happy.
  • + 6
 @madmon you seem angry.
  • - 7
flag madmon (Jan 24, 2015 at 5:52) (Below Threshold)
 think about it. I am a seasoned rider with an opinion. I am not a ham fist and was vilianized by the WTB mafia and it's followers. Way to spread the love. I expect it from the PB asshats but not a company like WTB. I have no respect for this company now and I'm not angry just disappointed.
  • + 4
 @madmon You attacked the company based on false information and you got called out. WTB's customer service had no interraction with you other than to mention the compatibility of thier rims. As you said yourself, you haven't had any issues with WTB's tires or rims.

I fail to see how any of those things contributes to a complete loss of respect for a company, especially one that just went the extra mile to host an ask us anything seminar.
  • - 7
flag madmon (Jan 24, 2015 at 11:11) (Below Threshold)
 FALSE info? there are holes in the inside rims. Just because it passes a RED TAPE issue does not make them TRUE UST. you are not fooling me. An addition of TAPE does not make a seal when it can fail. It has failed on many of Stans and other makes. It is a fact not an accepted use. You will never convince me of it. As well there is no HOOKLEESS bead on a carbon or any otherand ground breaking discovery or invention.. Tape is not. It is a band aid.
  • + 3
 There is no such thing as "True UST". UST is UST, spoke holes or not. Take a moment to read the article that @the-one1 posted above.
  • - 6
flag madmon (Jan 24, 2015 at 14:01) (Below Threshold)
 you keep talking and believe whatever you say.... I know what a seal is.
  • + 2
 @GoRideYoBike is obviously correct, there is no such thing as "real UST." you're just incompetent and don't know anything. The tubeless system is based entirely around the simple addition of tubeless tape and sealant to regular wheels (don't believe me? www.notubes.com/Stans-Tubeless-Kits-C12.aspx). Tape is not just "an accepted use," it is the only way to make the damn thing work! There is no way to seal any rim no matter what standards it passes if you don't have some sort of tape to seal it with. No rim is ever completely sealed without it, unless you plan on not using spokes.

Certifications just make the system easier to use and ensure customers that the product was developed around not using a tube. Tubeless obviously works and most riders use it, so companies want to be able to safely recommend their products to be used with it. That doesn't mean you can't make it work otherwise, because ANY rim or tire has the potential to be converted, but if you f*ck it up and crash because all of a sudden you have no air in your tires, the company that made the wheel or tire will be able to say "We did not intent for our product to be used like this" and thus unable to be sued by you for product failure.
  • - 2
 hahahaha...i do not use tape. Like stated above my crossmax sx's need nothing but a tire and some sealant and a floor pump.
  • + 1
 This internet fight could have been easily avoided. Madmon failed to see that WTB never said 'UST ready' (@madmon, the 'C' in TCS stands for 'compatible'). One of you could politely pointed that out to madmon two days ago instead of arguing about rim tape. Comprehension is one of the most important aspects of life: when you read something you have to understand it; your partner will tell you their problems; you listen to a customer and you help them. I recently got rid of an employee because, at the root of it all, their comprehension skills were terrible.
  • + 4
 Madmon wins, if he can't decipher what UST really means, then I give up.
  • + 1
 right @iamamodel WTB makes rims with a UST compatible BEAD, so that you can use UST tires, without having the extra weight of a solid rim bed like a Mavic rim(not to mention some actually wide rims, which Mavic doesn't make... because with a solid rim bed, they wouldn't be weight competitive.)

@mfbeast12 Mavic rims really don't have holes drilled in them, there is no tape required. they use a weird nut that goes over the spoke, that threads into the rim, which of course, adds more weight. Here's a pic www.mavic.us/wheel-tyre-system/zicral
  • - 6
flag madmon (Jan 25, 2015 at 10:26) (Below Threshold)
 every time you have to do any spoke work I guess you have to take off the tire, empty out the sealant, take off said tape, fix the brocken spoke, go to the bike store to buy specific tape and sealant .........it is an endless mess and time consuming drag for a normal rider to face. In 10 minutes without extracting my tire I can instal a brocken spoke. I would rather ride than fuk around with this product. Sorry I shit on your parade but it's old news already. You call this an International Tubeless Standard.
  • + 0
 what? no! if a spoke breaks, you take it out of the nipple threads and put a new one in! tubeless has NOTHING to do with removing/installing spokes. if you somehow break a nipple then yeah you take your tire off but how the f*ck do you break a nipple?
  • + 3
 If you break a spoke, on any wheel, & aren't taking off the tire to re-true it properly, then you're doing it wrong. You can't do a good job of vertically truing a wheel with the tire on.

@madmon What special tape? I use Gorilla tape.
  • - 1
 what? nipples are external... you true wheels via the nipples 3.bp.blogspot.com/_ONTR6CvMXF0/S80BlV7CMJI/AAAAAAAAAEI/mWWw2xnePk4/s1600/DSC03827.JPG (shitty picture but whatever)
  • + 3
 Yes, I know. I build wheels. But while you can remove side to side (horizontal) play easily with a tire on, you can't remove hops or dents (vertical play) properly without taking off the tire. You need to bring your gauge in so that it just touches the rim at the high spot, in order to determine which spokes to tighten, not to mention that it's almost impossible to see subtle dents with a tire on. Horizontal truing gets all the publicity, but vertical truing is the difference between a wheel that will withstand impacts, & a deathtrap.

breaking a spoke can have a profound effect on the balance of tension in a wheel, & you can't see, or fix that with the tire on.
  • + 1
 What's going on... I take it he's talking about rims that have a metal strip covering the rim bed that's not removable (fool-proof seal as far as sealing rim bed, surely?) I haven't tried either methods of sealing but tape seams to be fine for most people (I had a mavic ex823 ust rim. set up with a tube though. So heavy!) Why so many arguments on here?

@mfbeast12 These wheels he speaks of, you must take off spoke tension first then remove a hollow screw from the same side as nipple (external) This screw acts as the seat for the nipple as it cannot be put in through the top of the spoke hole. It is because of this that you have to remove the nipple, also. The hollow screw is slid onto spoke, then the nipple threaded on and then its screwed into the outside of the rim bed (tightening hollow screw with Mavic tool) before tensioning the spoke. Easy peasy Smile

See hollow screw where eyelets would be 102115d1126379805-mavic-xm819-aluminum-nipple-cups-pict0030
  • + 1
 Not sure if you're talking about me @ScottMoore94, But the 2 things I was talking about are: A: How gorilla tape works fine for me on conventional rims, & B: that Mavic uses a system that doesn't require drilling through the rim bed, & is therefore is airtight without tape... but that it's far heavier than a normal rim with tape, & that that weigh penalty increases with width, which is one reason why Mavic's top of the line UST wheelset is still only 21mm internal.
  • - 2
 My Mavic Crossmax sx's are 23mm internal not 21 and the weight is 1640grams for the set. They never need truing, all 3 sets.
  • + 1
 Nah man was referring to madmon's comment,he was a little mis-understood and subsequently ended up in firing line. He is right in saying that Mavic's system is fool-proof, but tape is just as good at sealing, only it aint as fool-proof (sorry madmon) Haha, I had a Mavic ex823 rim, heavy as shit but bombproof, even with under-tensioned spokes! Would definitely use tape for sealing, myself.
  • + 1
 Well, I'll say this: the only tubeless flats I've ever seen that couldn't be fixed(& I've seen UST as well as conversions flat,) were all because of lack of sealant. So if UST gives you a false sense of security that you don't need sealant, that's not an advantage in my eyes.

@madmon your 1640 gram wheels use aluminum spokes, that's what Zircal is. so your wheel weight doesn't directly compare to other wheel weights, when we're talking about rim weights. All the extra material required for a Mavic UST rims makes the rim heavier, they just make up for it with lighter spokes, but the spokes can't make up for the weight of a Mavic UST rim designed at say, 28mm internal, which is why they don't exist.
  • + 30
 If you were a hot dog, would you eat yourself?
  • + 34
 I know I would. First I'd smother myself in brown mustard and relish, I'd be so delicious.
  • - 5
flag WAKIdesigns (Jan 22, 2015 at 1:06) (Below Threshold)
 So would that be your way of killing yourself?
  • - 9
flag jaycubzz (Jan 22, 2015 at 9:52) (Below Threshold)
 no, id gas myself reading one of your awful blog posts, so that i understand exactly why im leaving this world
  • + 2
 i'd top if off with an ice cold budweisa
  • + 26
 MW, Am I a foot long? If so i would eat half and save half for later.
  • + 3
 Answer - No, because I'd be made of all the shite and sweepings off the floor and only be about 6% 'meat'
  • + 16
 LETS TALK BEAD LOCK...

Clearly the TCS system utilizes the "Bead Lock" and TCS Bead profile to achieve a snug-fit and proper retention.

Many carbon rim manufacturers opt for "hookless" technology owing to the additional strength thicker walls provide.

In order for tires to fit properly with hookless rims must the bead profile be made specifically for hookless rims?
  • + 2
 that's actually a pretty good question, at some point some of this stuff will have to be standardized. i wonder how those decisions get made.
  • + 14
 Hi this is Chris, Definitely a good question, that I have put a lot of thought towards. WTB lives by the ETRTO bible and as of the 2014 printing there is no designation for hookless, tubeless designs. That said, I think that the interface between tire and rim is absolutely critical for reliable tubeless performance, and if the hook is gone then the tire bead needs to be redesigned to maximize contact. The reality is that isn't going to happen, though some slight updates that might be something of compromise might come up in the future. Finally, there is no reason for the manufacturers of hookless rims to build in a bead hook into their rim designs and still provide extra thickness on the upper legs to provide additional strength. More often than not, the issue comes from a technical manufacturing limitation instead of a design advantage.
  • + 4
 @WTB-Bikes Cheers Chris.

To all of you @WTB-Bikes, I love your work!
  • + 4
 Thanks General
  • + 10
 Mark: More of a comment than a question I guess. In a sport full of athletes who tend to exhibit varying degrees of bullshit or follow the latest racing or technological trends, its good to know that there's also professional riders who exemplify honesty, hard work and a down to earth love of simply being on their bike, with zero f*cks given to what anyone else says. When I was a lot younger, I read an interview with you about Downieville, and the straight up drive, determination, and attitude you had about racing and riding in that article just really rang true with me, it basically got me into taking my riding seriously (never too seriously though) and pushing myself harder every day. Your interviews are relatable and very motivational, whether you know it or not. Thanks for that.
  • + 13
 MW Thanks for that, these are they type of things that keep me on path. So as i do for you, people like you do for me. And I hope the same goes when and if i get lost along the way. My bike is always dirty, that way i never feel bad for using it as the tool it is.
  • + 12
 Sorry, I have to ask:

Mr Weir, how long did it take to craft such a magnificent moustache?
  • + 38
 He was born with it.
  • + 0
 I was scrolling down to ask this very same question.
  • + 2
 Facial Hair - Optimized seasonally or make it a long term project?
  • + 28
 MW I grew this thing while i was sleeping, hair speed is reaching terminal velocity everywhere but on my head. Besides that, my place has no mirrors. ULGY!
  • + 9
 Mr. Weir: thank you for all the good work you have done in Marin promoting the expansion of MTB access, especially at Stafford Lake.
  • + 5
 MW Thanks but it was a joint effort of many starting with the cycling community and the Friends of Stafford Lake Bike Park. Together we can make a difference, together we can change it for the generation to come. Just cause we ride bikes does not mean we should be left behind.
  • + 7
 What's your take on where the industry, and you as a company, will go and eventually settle on in regards to wider rims? I'm thinking internal rim measurements of 28-40mm. Will we see from you tires that are better suited to a wider rim?
  • + 3
 CF: It's inevitable, the industry has caught a trend and we are right there. We have the 45mm (inner) Scraper rims available right now, with a couple other sizes in the works. The tough part is getting ETRTO to get on board with the trend.
  • + 5
 WTB KOM rims seem incredible in terms of width to weight ratio, I don't hide that I am considering buying them. KOM 25s are 70g lighter (claimed) than already svelte 490g ,excellent Frequency i-25 rims. How come is that so, and why they cost so much more than Frequencies? Is it in alloy or simply less material in the extrusion?
  • + 1
 I had a great season on my i23 29" KOMs. For XC/Trail stuff they seem like an amazing option, and are dirt cheap on CRC right now Wink
  • + 1
 They don't have the I-beam in the center is one of the weight savings. Aren't they both made of that same t69, something, metal?
  • + 5
 WAKI you should know by now that lighter always equals more expensive in the bike world.
  • + 13
 JM: The KOM uses a very thin wall of material. Extruding, rolling, and joining a rim with thin walls takes great care, and much more time in the production process. More time in production means more cost. We actually use the same material for both KOM and Frequency Team. We lose the weight by using less of the material. There is a rule with aluminum - less material equals less strength. Getting the balance of quality material and weight is a delicate process with aluminum rims. Frequency rims are really durable. KOM's have been durable enough for Weir and I to use for an entire season, at multiple Enduro events. While we did have some dents, the overall integrity of the rim was solid, and we made the KOM last an entire race season. Im a light guy, 145lbs, so I am not as hard on parts. When you consider Weirs weight on the other hand, a full race season on a rim, the weight of KOM, is very impressive. Yes, I just called Weir fat.
  • + 3
 Than you for the answer! I may buy i-25s soon Wink

Seraph - yes, but it was good to hear why is that in this case
  • + 4
 CF: Though the weight of a rim does have a direct effect on the base price of a rim, there are many other components that add to the cost of a rim. Finish, drilling, extrusion rate (speed and number of cavities in the die) and crazy stuff like decals.
  • + 5
 What internal width rim are your 2.3 (650b) tires designed around?

Also, from online cut away pictures your rim design seems to have a thicker wall located close to the nipple than in the rest of the rim. Can you explain the logic behind this and possibly how it is achieved?
  • + 3
 Thicker wall @ spokes is to accommodate higher spoke tension/prevent nipples from pulling through.
Aluminum rims are extruded then rolled to dimension before being pinned or welded. Wall thickness is easily optimized to meet strength/weigh needs.
  • + 3
 CF: Right mow most of our wider tires are designed around 23 or 25mm inner widths, though we're always thinking larger.
Part two of you question was already answered for our friend in Massachusetts.
  • + 5
 There is a big debate about what B+ actually is. Already we've got classifications of widths in Normal (1.6-2.5), Plus (2.5-3.0), Mid-Fat (3.0-4.0), and Fat (4" wide and up). WTB pioneered this B+ idea with the Trailblazer 2.8 and it was marketed as a tire that could fit in 29er frames and forks, but already some of WTB's competitors are producing tires that are too wide for most 29" specific frames and forks. Will WTB venture into these mid-fat tire sizes that require new frames and forks, or stay committed to the "Plus" philosophy of fitting the bike you already have?
  • + 1
 Secondary question: What's your "official" stance on running the Trailblazers on smaller rims than the i45s in order to get enough clearance in the rear? It seems to be working well for some testers, but it'd be nice to hear from the source.
  • + 1
 @groghunter if i can just comment real quick, if you have too narrow of a rim for these larger tires, then the tire will squirm on the rim during hard cornering and rub on the fork or chainstay yoke.
  • + 2
 I understand the physics at play here, but the real question is what is "too narrow." Some testers have run these on i25s in order to clear the stays on FS bikes, & didn't complain of problems. Remember that you're dealing with tires that deform quite a large amount at the contact patch: that can mitigate squirming, & maybe sideways deflection. Regardless, it'd be nice to hear if they have a recommended range of rim sizes besides the i45.
  • + 1
 @groghunter it would be nice to get that answer, definitely looking forward to their stance and plans for B+, on a sidenote, it'd be nice to see an offering in the 26+ segment
  • + 1
 B+, (Sub 3") Is it going to be the game changer for Enduro as some are saying?
  • + 3
 @jclnv Maybe! I think if anything is going to be a "game changer" for the enduro segment, it will be the 26+ concept. that's my opinion though and only time will tell. My reasoning is that it measures closer to 650b, just more rubber, also compatible with 26" frames and 650b frames. 650b+ like the Veetrax Fatty (3.25") are closer to the 29" diameter and will fit few 650b frames (that i know of) and 29" frames.
  • + 3
 What appeals to me about B+ is the ability to have the same bike with lighter 29" wheels for trail riding or B+ for Enduro whatever. Dropping 10-15mm off the diameter with B+ for more stability. I doubt the industry would been keen on that option though. Makes far too much sense.
  • + 2
 so excellent to have these options now, changes the personalty of a bike completely, in a good way
  • + 3
 @jcinv... depends on the tire... with the two options so far the trailblazer is reported to be 20mm smaller in diameter than a 29 x 2.3 but the problem there is what 2.3 are they comparing to? Conti's tend to have taller casing heights and less width for example for a given claimed size. The same source lists the Vee Trax Fatty as 745mm, which is 5mm more than the diameter tire that Salsa for example bases their current geometry around for their 29er models. Salsa also lists the diameter of a 26 x 3.8 as 742mm in their geometry numbers. And given that many Fat owners use second wheelsets with skinnier rubber for summer riding, especially on pavement, one might as well use a Trax Fatty 3.25 built to some 50mm rims. Surly btw lists 35mm as the minimum rim width for their plus tire offerings (either 26 x 2.75 or 29 x 3.0) and 50mm as the suggested rim width. Surly has a tire geometry chart on their website that shows how the rim width affects the tire dimensions and even for the same rim, they have four tires all listed as a 26 x 3.8 and the diameter varies from 726mm to 749mm. They even have two in their 26 plus category, the Dirt Wizard 2.75 width and a 3" wide version of the Knard and they vary by 15mm in diameter (from 697 to 712mm).
  • + 0
 I know what would change enduro... : D+E category - doped riders on e-bikes. Diameter is irrelevant.
  • + 1
 It's not about diameter, it's about grip. Back to school WAKI.
  • + 4
 It's ignorant! Allegedly!
  • + 5
 Slate here;
The B+ idea got started with fitting existing 29" tire bikes. Where it goes from here is anyone's guess. WTB may go beyond the 3" cross section but for now that is what we have targeted.Regarding rim inner width - the TRAILBLAZER is 67mm (variable depending on psi) when using an i35 rim. One a 25mm inner width rim the cross section (known as section width = SW) is 4mm less. On the i45 Scraper rim the SW is 4mm more. Wide rims certainly do support tires better especially at lower pressures. Inner width of 25mm is OK, even a 23 width works, but i35 or i45 will give you the greater benefit of running low pressure stabilized G-force. BTW, tread width does not vary much using different width rims. Neither does diameter. It is the casing SW that varies. Really fun tire size, not too heavy or slow for flat land riding. TRAILBLAZER fits most 29" bikes running at about 28.6" diameter.
  • + 0
 Oh man, cats out of the bag, i35 rims? wooo wooo wooo! (reflecting, that must be testing rim an industry guy mentioned to me today.) Speaking of things that aren't for sale yet, do you have a availability date for Trailblazers & 27.5 Scrapers? You're killing me with not being able to buy em yet.
  • + 3
 JM: Scraper rims are in stock now. The next shipment of Trail Blazer tires is scheduled to arrive mid March. However, port strikes have been delaying delivery.
  • + 2
 @WTB-Bikes Can we expect any 26" + offerings like the 26x2.75 dirt wizard or 26x3" knard?
  • + 2
 WAKI's idea has gone under everyones radar. I second the idea and LOL'd.
  • + 5
 In what direction do you believe mountain bikes, specifically trail/enduro bicycles are going to go in the future? Bikes like the Santa Cruz Nomad, Cannondale Jekyll and Yeti Sb6's are at the point to where they can pretty much go up or down anything and since geometry and wheelsizes are (finally) dialed in, do you believe the future of the bikes will be in electronic shifting/suspension? Or do you think the pricing of mountain bikes as a whole will start to decrease to where a capable, 160mm travel carbon fiber bike that weighs under 30 pounds with a proper 1x drivetrain, wheels and components will be available for under 4000 dollars, such as the YT Capra? By this I mean major American brands such as Gt, Specialized, Cannondale, etc.

Personally I think that if people are able to afford (susceptible enough to marketing) to buy a 3000 dollar wheelset that weighs 1500 grams when an wheelset such as WTB Stryker weighs 1750 grams but costs 400-500 dollars, companies such as Trek and Specialized and Cannondale will continue to make ten grand bikes until the end of time. But it'd be nice to see a insiders point of view.

Also, as racers (Mark/Jason) how do you believe the American "enduro" events, such as Downeville and the Santa Cruz Hell Ride compare to European enduro races, both technical downhill and uphill aspects as well as overall flow. Do you believe there is enough support to organize more enduro races in America similar to those held in France and Italy or does the type of terrain needed to create a proper enduro track primarily exist only in Europe?
fatwheels
  • + 2
 I think you do not ride enough .. Get off pink bike and Internet and go for the ride dude Smile
  • + 1
 Was that last question for real?
'Murica has way better and more terrain than europe for riding enduro.
  • + 2
 CF: I'll just address the comment on Downieville since I'm the President of SBTS, the group that organizes the race. Downieville has been around so much longer than Enduro and is a unique event that may have inspired Enduro at one point but we make no claim other than the unofficial All-Mountain World Championships.
  • + 6
 JM: I'll break my answer into three parts:

1. Working in the OEM side of the market, and being a ride tester for future products, I get to see concepts that are pretty far down the line. Unfortunately, I am swore to secrecy. We have had the privilege to work with Fabian Barel a few years back. I love his wishes - to have a bike that rides as good downhill as a current DH bike, but climbs as well as and XC bike. That is a tall order...one that I hope our industry will eventually achieve before I am too old and grey to appreciate such a machine. I am personally a HUGE fan of electronic shifting/suspension controls, and cannot wait for what electronics will do to future bikes. However, the electronics will continue to drive prices up. Fortunately, the mechanical systems are also making great improvements, which will be seen at lower price points. It's impossible for me to say if we will get under 30lbs 160mm bikes for under 4000 dollars.

2. I won't lie. I love $10,000 bikes. I would happily put my kid on a diet to afford such a work of art. I am an addict. The way I see it, the technology from $10,000 bikes helps to improve lower price bikes. The masses need the $10,000 bikes to keep improving, so that the lower price bikes will follow.

3. Downieville and Hell Ride are not technically "Enduro's". These days Enduro means not racing to the top, and only racing the downhill sections. Downieville is more of a trail race. Hell ride no longer exists, but that was more of an all day sufferfest. European Enduro races are on another level, when compared to American races. American race promotors will never be granted the land access permission to run a trail straight down the side of a mountain, where no trail currently exists. America has the terrain, we simply can't use it. Canada, on the other hand, continues to challenge me every time I race up there.
  • + 2
 MW American Enduro will never be like Europe or any other country. Mostly because of land issues. French enduros are much different with on-sighting and no practice. They also have lift access everywhere and right-of-away is more easily obtained with private land owners by promoters. The other difference is the age of the trail networks, there is trails stacked on trails in Europe. And it seems none of them follow the grade guide line most new public trails built in the USA have to follow. Our only hope here is private land, where we can interrupt the ride and trails as we feel.
  • + 5
 Can you talk about your approach to tread design? Specific theories you have about knob placement, use of transition knobs, sniping, shape etc. Frankly some of the WTB designs seem like someone took the Jackson Pollack approach and just sprayed knobs anywhere, or perhaps had some good ideas but didn't do enough testing/iterating to fine tune a design that could have been good with some updating (Dissent).
  • + 1
 CF: There has been some internal debate about this in the last couple years, and you may have noticed with more of our newer tread designs we have working within a set guideline of tread depth and spacing based on testing and industry research.
  • + 4
 For many years we loved the Laserdisc Superduty hubs the best. They were light, well-priced, durable, and extremely easy to service. When 15mm depnt and 12x142 standards took over they kind of disappeared. I would like to see the hubs return to prominence. I think tour 6-pawl mechanical engagement would aurvive the de rigeurs of 29ers with massive range cassettes better than many other leading hubs on the market. Please consider pushing back into the hub market. And make XD drivers obviously.
  • + 6
 CF: Do you have spies in my office? Have you hacked my webcam?

It's a priority, though slow going, we're getting closer all the time. Rest assured, XD is definitely on the list.
  • + 8
 Mr. Weir: Drinking pardner: Ratboy or Peaty?
  • + 18
 MW Start with Peaty finish with Ratboy. O man thats sound questionable...
  • + 5
 How much involvement in the actual rubber development do you have? Or do you just buy it from a supplier according to your requirements/specification.
Love WTB stuff, especially the saddles,
Cheers
  • + 2
 Sorry, I mean tyre rubber if that wasn't obvious. Thanks
  • + 16
 JM: We have 100% influence over our rubber. The compounds that you find on the tires today were developed in concept - we knew roughly want we wanted. From there, we did the following to test the rubber:

1. Ordered sample tires with what we thought was the ideal compounding.
2. Ordered sample tires with higher and lower durometer, with more and less rebound.
3. We altered the width of our center tread vs. shoulder tread width on each tire design, in each compound configuration.
4. All tires were ride tested, not machine tested. Our goal was to achieve maximum speed with maximum control. Testing was held at a track designed by Weir. It involved both climbing, flat, off camber, and descending, in a variety of terrain conditions.
5. The testing was performed in different seasons on the same track.
6. Each unique tire was used at multiple pressures.
7. Bikes and wheels were kept identical for all tests. We had XC bikes for XC tires, Trail Bikes for trail style tires, and Enduro bikes for the Enduro style tires.

As you can imagine, the testing took FOREVER. We are, however, very pleased with our results. Our compounds were literally hand selected by our riders.
  • + 1
 Great response. Thanks a lot WTB
  • + 4
 Hey guys, really enjoy your products. Currently running WTB saddle, i23, and Wierwolf's. Making the transition to 27.5 with my current frame buildup. I'm going with KOM i25's with Vigilante up front. Trying to decide on rear tyre. Probably going with Wolverine, but noticed two newer tread designs- Breakout and Trailboss. How do the two tyres differ as far as handling characteristics. Finally is the inner peace sidewall reinforcement available on both the TCS tough and Light casings?
  • + 2
 JM: We work really hard to make stuff that people want to ride. Glad to hear we are making it happen for you.

TrailBoss is designed to be faster rolling than Breakout. Both are fantastic front an rear tires, and both go great when paired with Vigilante front.

Breakout has more space between each lug - so technically speaking, it is a more "aggressive" tire than TrailBoss.

Inner Peace is only available on our Tough casing tires.
  • + 3
 What is the most important thing that you guys have learned about tread design? We know about your emphasis on a bead-rim interface that adheres to a standard for proper sealing, but what would you say makes your tread design better than the competition? I love the peace of mind that comes with UST when going tubeless, but I think one factor that keeps my customers from purchasing WTB is because the tread patterns can be a little different compared to the majority of the tires out there. Minions, Hans Dampfs, and Magic Mary's seem to be the most common up here in the Pacific Northwest. Thanks, WTB!
  • + 1
 to add to this. On your newer tires (Vigilantes etc) it seems your side knobs are "opened to the front". I understand that that is to scoop dirt as you lean the tire over and pull the tire into the turn. But I've generally found that this design pulls the tire a bit too much in really agressive leaning, and also tends to make the tire break loose when braking in a corner (I know you're not supposed to brake in a corner, but it happens). Wouldn't a more neutral side-knob angulation be more... neutral? or more predictable at least?
  • + 1
 CF: We've really been trying to get ourselves out of Norcal in our tread designs. I'm hoping that you've tried Vigilante and Breakout. Both tires are available with soft rubber for that you need for the slimy tracks you have up there.
  • + 3
 The diagram text indicates sealant should be used with a UST tire on a TCS rim. Is this recommended or necessary? Fully aware of the benefits of using sealant, I'd like the option of using UST tires without sealant but UST rim options are very limited apart from factory wheels. So far I've found no rim manufacturer who can confirm if UST tires will hold air on their (non UST) tubeless compatible rim without sealant. Thanks!
  • + 4
 CF: Yeah, the problem is that even with tape you will lose air through the seam of the rim unless the seam is welded, and then the tape seal won't hold air reliably for any period of time. Sorry, but it seems sealant tubeless is the way the industry has gone. The issue is keeping a solid inner rim well and still be able to build a wheel with traditional spokes and nipples. That is a tough problem that no one has been able to overcome yet. Let me know if you have any really cool and simple solutions.
  • + 1
 I take it that you're saying that on a welded rim, the not-perfectly-smooth welded surface doesn't allow tape to seal well without sealant. Does the Trek/Bonty system overcome this? The tape is a continuous loop that "snaps" over the rim. Or maybe you're saying that tape alone doesn't seal well enough to obviate sealant, in any case. I know the chat is over, but anyone know?
  • + 1
 how about heat-shrinkable rim tape?
  • + 1
 @ecologist What he's saying, is that with a sleeved/pinned rim, at the sleeve/pin, you will lose air, unless you use sealant, because a sleeved or pinned rim isn't airtight at the seam. Furthermore, even if your rim is welded, tape alone isn't enough to keep air from leaking out the spoke holes(as you said, tape alone doesn't seal well enough to obviate sealant.) Therefore, unless you use Mavic style UST with an undrilled, welded rim, sealant is required.

Considering the other bonuses of sealant, ie, actually sealing holes in the tire as well, along with the weight & complexity savings of a traditionally drilled rim, I'll take a sealant/tape solution over Mavic UST any day.
  • + 1
 Late response here, I know, but thanks for the clarification. How about those one-piece snap-on rim strips of the sort like Bontrager uses, or used to? They reduce the number of seams down to basically what would be present on a UST undrilled rim, so seemingly should seal up just the same. Last I looked into Bonty rims they didn't make them as wide as I'd like to try. Maybe I'll have to check again and see if that's changed. I actually think I remember seeing a comment that UST tires seat up dry on those, but I could be wrong on that. Anyway....thanks!
  • + 4
 In 5 ?’s Jason Moeschler says “ Current tire profiles aren't designed to be used on rims over 27mm wide”….Does that mean you are working on the vigilante wide? A tire designed for wider rims?
  • + 11
 CF: Short answer is yes. The longer answer would get me in trouble
  • + 2
 What about the R&D and/or production process keeps WTB from producing their newer tires in 26"? Or is it more of an 'industry direction' type of thing?

I love my Vigilantes but would love to try all of the cool new rubber you guys have rolling out as of late!
  • + 2
 JM: When we look at future tire development, we have to consider a few things, and one of the first considerations is: who is going to test the first samples, and what bike is he/she riding? Right now, most all of our first testers are using 27.5" or 29" bikes.

Just because we don't offer a tread in 26" now, does not mean that it won't come in the future. Our customers are very good at demanding what is needed. TrailBoss 2.25 is the next new tread that is close to being released in 26". The aftermarket consumer demand for this tread in 26" was overwhelming.
  • + 2
 Trail Boss? . . . you'll see it at Interbike
  • + 2
 Hello , I currently run 26" Vigilante team issue 2.35 tyres front and rear ,on 25mm internal width rims setup tubeless.

on a lot of reviews I read they say to use these as a front only but I ride a lot of wet and loose terrain in the UK and feel that anything
less aggressive on the rear would not be as controllable.was the Vigilante designed as a front and rear or just a front and if so which rear would suit it best?
Also currently using a pure V saddle which is excellent!
thanks
  • + 2
 CF: Hey Pedro, Don't let the reviewers determine what works for you. Vigilante works fine in the front and rear, it just depends on the track and your riding style. A slightly smaller tire with a slightly tighter tread will roll better, but it won't hook up as well. Thanks for the Pure comment, wider (142 and 150mm wide) Volts and Rockets are available now, if you're thinking looking for a new saddle.
  • + 2
 JM: Glad to hear the Pure is getting the job done!

Regarding Vigilante, it was designed to be used as a front or rear. Yes, we have tires that are a tighter packed tread, will be more efficient, and roll faster on the rear. When it comes to flat out needing bite on the trail going down hill, you won't find another tire in our line better than the Vigilante. Anything less aggressive will reduce control in wet/loose conditions.
  • + 1
 Hi there www.pinkbike.com/u/wtb-bikes did you miss my questin?
  • + 1
 sorry i was too hasty thanks for the reply!!
  • + 2
 I have a Salsa El Mariachi 29er and was interested in the Scraper / Trail blazer combo for a little more dampening with those darn wash boards on the Tour Divide. I know you guys were working on a list of compatible bike, does my El Mar fall on this list?
  • + 2
 Slate here:
Working in the other direction, I could provide a simple drawing to show diameters and widths, then you could know based on your measuring of your bike. Posting on the WTB site would be a good thing to go after.
  • + 2
 Hello Mark Weir, if you find time to answer - Lee McCormack wrote once on his blog about your solution to dropper seat posts long time before they got invented - riding all day standing with saddle slammed all the way down. Did you lift back then? Or did you just force your body to adapt Big Grin
  • + 10
 MW Yeah strong and stupid run close together. I have short legs and I hate looking like a high poster. I rode that way back then first cause it was the most fun and second cause my chainring was way to big to pedal seated. I still do this today. I like to keep my upper body engaged at all times. I don't lift weights only trail tools. I do ride with a 13lbs camelbak everyday and this time a year my winter gut.
  • + 2
 Hey WTB team, love your products, big fan of your tires. I run 29", typically Vigilante front and rear or Vig front Trail Boss rear. What I'd like to know is why you don't and if you will, make a 29er Vigilante with the High Grip compound... would love that option especially for the front Smile
  • + 5
 JM: You are speaking my language! There is a big push internally for this product. With support from guys like you, and our customers, hopefully we can prove that the tire will sell, and make it happen!
  • + 1
 Well, if you ever need a tester, I'm game! Love that tire, can only imagine it with grippier compound. The wear characteristics, especially on the front, are unreal. That tire lasts FOREVER. I'd be more than willing to give up a bit of that for more grip.
  • + 2
 I am currently running a ghetto tubeless setup in the rear. The tire is a WTB Vigilante Team TCS, and the rim is a non UST/ TCS Sun Ringle MTX at 29mm wide. I am using the splayed 20" tube method in combination with Stans yellow tape and Stans sealant. I have ridden XC on this setup and it is solid so far. Am I just lucky that this combo hasn't exploded on the trail, or is this a compatible setup that I can take to the lifts and shred with confidence? Thanks!
  • + 1
 CF: In our opinion you're taken chances with anything other than UST/ETRTO compliant tubeless solutions, and we've seen some pretty horrific results. That's why we have chosen to stay within recommended industry standards. It's all matter of riding style too, the guy sitting next to me (MW) would rip that tire off the rims in less than half a run at "the ranch"
  • + 1
 Thanks for the reply. That's too bad though. I suppose i'll throw in a tube and forget tubeless until I get UST rims. Damn pinch flats!
  • + 2
 If all MTB standards were wiped clean and you were tasked with the job of starting everything from scratch, what would you bring back, and what would you get rid of?
Specifically; Axles/hub spacing, Bottom brackets, Tire and rim interface/profile, Headtube/steerer.

I often think the consumer is its own worst enemy. We hate when standards change, and when they do we often see the potential gains as questionable, but this line of thinking hinders growth and improvement. We get so invested in one standard it makes it difficult to see our investments become obsolete.

Is the bike industry held back by forced conformance to existing standards, and the gradual changes are their way of marginally improving things without causing too much disruption in the market place and avoiding shooting themselves in the face. Or is it all a marketing scheme to get us to buy new stuff every year!!??
  • + 2
 Slate here:
Older, wiser, but still want to always do more. From the start the WTB drive was to make it better. Now there are some very good companies that provide products that would be hard to beat. Moving forward is never exactly linear. And we cannot go back. But we can regress. Given the ability to start fresh changing some standards would be good. We seem to continually evolve. Wheel (hub) flange spacing would be good to address. It keeps getting moved around. But maybe the latest is the greatest. Testing takes time and worldwide testing takes sale of product. I think we are on track. And if it worked for you before then why change? Unless you are convinced that new may be better. Standards take time and displacing standards is worth looking at always.
  • + 2
 Without knocking Stans, can you tell me the pros of your rims and sealant over Stans. Will your 2.1 fit on a Stans rim? Can your sealant with your rim and a 2.1 do that "tire ridding over a nail embedded board thing"? I rode with a guy on the Divide who had Stans rims and sealant and he got more flats than me running Conti. X-Kings and tubes. I only got a flat bombing down into El Rito, NM and it was a pinch flat from an under inflated tire. I guess I want to go tubeless but I'm concerned about exchanging the know quantity thing of using tubes and going to an unknown (to me) tubeless system over an extended multi week ride that would be combination of trail, double track, and road.
  • + 1
 CF: I keep getting these "it depends" questions. I think the big difference for you in you're friend was his choice of tire for the ride (and possibly some poor line choices). That said, we don't recommend using our TCS tire tubeless with any rim that falls outside of ETRTO recommendations. The EU agrees, and has announced that 2015 EN standards that tubeless MTB applications must comply to ETRTO recommendations. That might be a problem for manufactures that are making rims and wheels outside of those specifications.
  • + 2
 People have all sorts of issues when running Conti tyres other than proprietary UST labeled ones. That includes all standardized full on UST rims. I think it is kind of plastic like compound on sidewalls of Contis. Today I sealed Specialized Purgatory Control 2Bliss tyre on XT rim using compressor with no problem what so ever. Super clean job. I could not do it at all with a Conti XKing and even MKing in protection version.
  • + 1
 I've used a at least 5 different Race Kings and one X-King and never had any problems mounting them on Arch EX rim with a floor pump. The Conti's are a bit leaky and can sometimes take a while for them to fully seal. Orange Seal seems to work better for sealing them up than Stan's sealant, haven't tried WTB's. What annoys me most about the Contis is how the casing seems to get tweaked easily thus making them wobble.
  • + 1
 Yes zephxii - they seal well on ZTRs, as pretty much any tyre, but not on proprietary UST like Mavics or Shimanos.
  • + 1
 @waki ah, k.
  • + 2
 Not exactly a tubeless question, but a tire question. Can you guys provide some insight on choosing tires for specific conditions (traction/wear rate/weight, etc) like dry and loose (i.e. Colorado Front Range), stick and tacky (i.e. Colorado High Country) , rocky (Moab, Sedona).
  • + 2
 CF: In my opinion tire choice is not a geographical issue but a dirt issue. Hardpack with smooth rocks requires a different tread and compound design than greasy mud and roots. I live in the lower slopes of the Sierra and I'll change my tires by the season or by the ride. As a general guideline, the looser and wetter the bigger and wider paced the knobs gets. As it gets steeper the softer the rubber compound.
  • + 5
 Thanks for the great questions! Feel free to checkout wtb.com for more product and tech info. See ya on the trails! Cheers!
  • + 2
 Saddle related: I had a titanium SST in the late-ish 90s and absolutely loved it until I eventually bent the rails... By then I couldn't find a replacement.

Why didn't you produced the new SST in Ti or carbon, or even a "pro" level chromo? I've been waiting to buy a Ti one.
  • + 2
 Slate here:
Ti rails are flexy light which is nice, but easy to pop out or bend. I still like the SST, but we get a lot of pressure for "NEW" so being a modest sized company we cannot offer a huge variety. Sales guys often get the why this rather than that when it comes to products offered. With saddles trying everything you can get on is the best way to get an answer. Getting a NEW version SST with carbon rails would be cool. You that ride our products and give us direction are more important than you know.
  • + 0
 Well then I'll say the pure-v is the best saddle for my ass, period.
  • + 1
 Have you guys tried schwalbe procore inside a WTB TCS rim and some other UST tyre combination? What is your view about this combo?

For my next upgrade I plan on doing just that, as soon as the procore is available in my country. Or should I wait for alternative system maybe you have in the pipeline? Wink
  • + 5
 CF: We haven't been able to get our hands on ProCore her in the US yet. It looks like a pretty neat system, and I see no reason why it wouldn't work in a WTB rim, but I can't give you definitive answer before I get my hands on it and fully test it out.
  • + 6
 Thanks, WTB-Bikes! ;-) We should go for a beer and set you up at some point.
  • + 1
 Dear WTB I currently run KOK i23 on my 29er hardtail. I'm about 200lb before gear, and run them with a 2.35 Nobby Nic, tubeless. I don't do big drops or anything, but do case a jump here and there, so wondered if the i25 make much of a difference to me?
  • + 2
 CF: Hey Jesse, It really depends on your riding style. Your a pretty big guy, so something a little wider might flex a little less in hard turns. If you're not noticing any flex right now you're probably good.
  • + 1
 Thanks for the reply!
  • + 1
 My only tire failures since going tubeless (6 years now?) have been cuts in the casing, a mm or two above the rim interface. I'm not sure what the cause of this is, or how prevalent it is. It always feels like a snake bite (like when I case a gap into a square edge rock, or air into a rockgarden at speed), but a snake bite would happen on the crown of the tire wouldn't it?

It would seems to me that some sort of reinforcement at that tire/rim interface that goes up the sidewall a cm or two would be welcome and wouldn't add much weight. any thoughts?
  • + 1
 CF: The cut in the casing is coming from the proverbial rock and the hard place. The hard place being the rim as the tire was folded between it and the rock. The tire is usually much thinner at the bead, so that is usually the first place it will fail. WTB TCS Tough casings feature a bead protector that we call "Inner-Peace" that greatly reduces the occurrences of these types of cuts. There is a weight penalty though, lighter just tires won't hold up to casing gaps into square edged rocks. Sorry if I sounded like a marketing/sales guy there.
  • + 1
 Cool, thanks! Any chance you'll make the Trail Boss in a 26" (with Inner Peace?!)
  • + 1
 Hey guys!

I am a fairly experienced bicycle mechanic (I actually interned for WTB back in 2007 & 200Cool , but I do not work in a shop anymore, nor have easy access to an air compressor or advanced tool. My mountain bike is 29er tubeless. I have tried to install tubeless tires myself once, and failed miserably!
Now, I may just not be aware, but is there an easy method for at home tubeless tire installs? Or am I going to just have to keep bringing it into a shop every time I want to change tires? I am a little behind on the tubeless times possibly, but the only way I was told you can get the second bead to pop onto the rim is with a quick burst of pressurized air. Are there any other methods you would like all of the at home DIYers to know about to make having tubeless tires and changing them easier?

I have some Vigilates sitting on my dresser and I want to get them on the bike ASAP!

Also, bonus question: I have a new Specialized Stumpy Expert Carbon EVO 29er, and I am planning on competing in some of the CA enduro series races. Do you think that is enough bike? I think it’s going to be slightly on the light side and it should be fine. Any thoughts are welcome.

Thanks for your time guys!

- Grant
  • + 2
 Bontrager has your solution: www.pinkbike.com/news/bontrager-tlr-flash-charger-floor-pump-review-2014.html. Depending on your tire / rim combo, it's usually not that hard to get a tubeless system setup with a regular floor pump. A few quick pumps initially is often all it takes before the tire will start holding air.
  • + 1
 Yeah, that crux is where I was having issues, getting the first initial pumps to get the last part of the bead to pop in. That pump looks pretty nice though! That might be the ticket. Does WTB have any instructional videos or tutorials on an at-home tubeless install?
  • + 4
 JM: Our main goal with TCS was to make a tire and rim that:

1. Installed easy on the rim
2. Inflates easy on the rim
3. Fits secure to the rim, so that you won't burp.

We have accomplished our goals. Weir and I used to have to travel to races with an air compressor. If we didn't have an air compressor, we would leave the wrong tire on our bike, simply out of fear from not being able to get a new tire to seat. Those days are over. We can install our tires by hand, and inflate with a mini pump.

You will, however, need to make sure that you have an ETRTO/UST compatible rim when inflating the WTB tire. There are many different Tubeless Ready rims out there these days. You can check with the maker to see if it complies to ETRTO/UST (The international standard for tubeless).

vimeo.com/channels/wtbusa/14309115

Your Stumpy 29er will be plenty of bike for the CA enduro events.
  • + 1
 Thanks for the reply, Jason! Hope to see you at some of the races with my newly installed tires ;-)
  • + 1
 Im just going to say Ive been riding on a pair frequency Team i23's and have been blown away by their durability , stiffness and how easy they were to to set up tubeless for my first tubeless foray. They held air without sealent losing only a few psi or over a week.I had set them up and went away for a week for holidays..
  • + 1
 Do you find the increased weights of tires justified to the average rider? I am all for sidewalls that do not slice easy and beads that stay in the rim, but a 1000 gram tire is a hard sell to anyone who counts grams. Does the performance of the TCS technology make the increase in rotational weight worth it?
  • + 3
 CF: Once again it depends. I'm not riding on steep rocky tracks every day and I'm pretty light on the bike, so I run lighter tires. But gravity monsters like Ben Cruz and Marco Osborne destroy tires that I can ride for months. We have plenty of TCS Light offerings that are 800grams or under, those 1000+gram tires are all dual-ply TCS Tough casings.
  • + 2
 If wider rims are "inevitable," then are there plans to design the aggressive tires for those wider rim profiles specifically? Say a Vigilante/Trail Boss that was designed for a 28-30mm rim with a 2.4" tire section width?
  • + 2
 CF: I already answered question that touched on this so I'll keep it short. Yes, keep your eyes open. More than that will get me in trouble.
  • + 2
 if you make such a rim, please make a 26" version too please. and thanks for answering all these questions.
  • + 1
 Sweet! I'm pumped. Thanks @WTB-Bikes for being awesome.
  • + 1
 Seeing as though you pioneered wide hubs with your 140mm back in the day…how does the newer hub width “standard” factor in to your future tire designs..it seems like a wider hub would allow wider chain stays and hence a wider tire…thoughts?
  • + 2
 Slate here:
Wider flange spacing gives a greater bracing angle for spokes. Lately WTB has been doing a few asymmetric rims. With dished wheels the spoke tension needs to be higher to keep the wheels running true. Balanced tension is always key. Wider tires get wider still on wider rims. For front derailleurs standard 50mm chainline can be an issue with plus sized tires. Knobs hanging out there can grab your chain and pull it into tight and ugly crevices. More clearance everywhere, all things kept in balance...
  • + 1
 I noticed WTB has a released a Comp version of the Vigilante tire with a wire bead instead of folding Kevlar. I have been using the previous folding iteration of the Vigi on a tubeless setup. My question is, will the Vigilante Comp mount up tubeless? And what is the approximate weight on these (not listed on website)?
  • + 3
 JM: Tube type tires should never be used tubeless, no matter what rim you are using. Tube type tires must be used with tubes. Using a tube type tire tubeless puts you at GREAT risk for trouble with setup, the tire coming off the rim, or sudden air loss (burping).

Vigilante 2.3 26" Comp = 880g
Vigilante 2.3 27.5" Comp = 925g
Vigilante 2.3 29" Comp = 1040g
  • + 3
 How long will the sealant last inside a tire before it dries out. Does the sealant have to be replaced periodically? If it does, does the old sealant have to be removed.
  • + 1
 CF: Here's my oft retyped answer today, it depends.
Weather conditions, riding frequency all effect the longevity of your sealant. It's a good idea to check it every couple months, or sooner in hot-dry environments. While you don't really need to replace the sealant (I usually just add some fresh sealant to the old stuff), it's a good idea to check for "tire boogers" and make sure they are removed for the tire.
  • + 1
 Trek's 2015 EX 9 27.5 comes tubeless ready. Tubeless Rim tape is already on the bike when you buy it. According to Trek take the tubes out of the bike purchase tubeless valve stems. Pour Trek's sealant in pump up the tire. And your good to go. Wouldn't the rim tape be compromised by the valve stem from the tube? If you didn't decide to go tubeless right away and waited a few months after already riding the bike a lot.
  • + 2
 JM: The valve stem from the tube will not affect the rim tape. If anything, the pressure from the tube will help to ensure that your tape is super stuck to the rim.
  • + 1
 I'm having a hell of a time getting the rim tape to stay put on my I25 rim. The center rim bed is fairly deep, so it's hard to get the tape to properly conform into that deep channel. If I don't, then when the tire bead hits that raised section, it pulls the tape off and causes my tubeless set up to fail.

What tape do you recommend? I've tried Orange brand and Stans. Or maybe it's just operator error.

Thanks,

-Neil-
  • + 1
 JM: WTB Rims require that you use tape that is 5mm wider than our rims internal width. So, for the i25 rim, you have to use 30mm wide tape.

Laying tape into wider rims is more of a challenge, and it takes longer. Normally, you can stretch a large section of tape out from the roll, and lay it on the rim while keeping pull force on the roll. Wide rims require that you not stretch the tape as much and make sure that the tape is stuck in the bottom of the rim well before it is stuck to the tire bead seat shelf. It takes longer, and is a bit frustrating, however it is a necessary evil. The rim profile is exactly as it needs to be to get the tire to mount, and inflate properly.
  • + 2
 CF: It also helps to wiggle the roll side-to-side slightly, while you are stretching, to get it to nestle down into the rim well.
  • + 1
 I have just one thing to say and that is no matter how much time you put into developing new tires wheels what ever you only go as fast as you pedal and as far as tubless set up is concerned any tire that cost 100 plus dollars will work fine wether your rim is designed to be tubless or not now I don't pretend to know what I'm talking about I just know I have a mechanics ticket from ubi and I've been fixing bikes the last 8 year
  • + 1
 I saw an article on bike rumor the other day that and I learn something I never new about with WTB TCS rims and tyres. Also seeing you diagram above confirms what they were saying was right, that you shouldn't run a TCS tyre tubless on a non TCS rim and you shouldn't run a non TCS tyre tubless on a TCS rim. . I have had very good experience running WTB TCS tyres on Stans rims. They go up very easy with a track pump.
Then going the other way round, a lot of Santa Cruz bike come with TCS rims and Maxxis tubeless ready tyres and again they convert well.
Is this a big no no and should never be done?
Cheers
  • + 2
 CF: WTB needs to be very careful about our official compatibility recommendations. If a product falls out side of industry recommended standards (ETRTO) then we can't add it to our list. That is not to say that something might not work perfectly well for some people. In the case of the Maxxis tire the bead diameter is very close to what we specify for TCS so the fit is very good. That is one reason our friends at Santa Cruz chose that spec.
  • + 2
 I see, So if it works for you it's fine, but is not somthing you can stand by due to conflicting standers then. Cheers
  • + 2
 Maxxis TR tires are really perfect on WTB TCS, really easy to inflate, easy to mount/unmount by hand, no burps. Hold very well air and seal quickly. Top performers for me.
Schwable are second, easy to mount/unmount but more difficult to inflate and seal is mediocre at best.
Michelin mount/unmount ok are a nigthmare to inflate, even with compressor. They have too flimsy walls for that. I didn't have burps tough.
Never tried WTB, I never find good deal on them.
  • + 1
 am wondering if you are considering a 30mm internal rim width. I am a 200# single speeder and seem to ride 2.4 wide tires on everything to get the volume. I like the idea of a wider rim and narrower tire. However I am really liking my KOM 23mm on my ss and i25 Freqs. on my full suspension. I would also like to see some nice Black and white WTB jerseys available, Sup with that? Keep up the great customer support, WTB for life!
  • + 2
 Slate here:
WTB will have a few mid-range width rims available in the near future. Right now we have i25 and i45 rims. We will fill in the blanks soon. Jerseys? I am with you. We need more gear. I will see if I can have any effect in getting something I would wear.
  • + 2
 Now I'm counting on that jersey for the coming season Slate. So get on it and I'm sure your new KOM 35's are gonna be my next rim so I'll hold off this winter and wait for spring to get those ordered up. Thanks
  • + 1
 Right then, firstly thanks for taking a gamble in producing such a specific tyre that the Warden is, here in the UK on steep, loose and filthy tracks the Warden is my secret weapon up front, I'm still on 26 and notice that this tyre isn't available in 650 or 29 - has it not been a popular tyre? Also do you have any plans to produce a cut spike type of tyre such as the Maxxis shorty or specialized hillbilly?
  • + 3
 JM: We just took delivery of our Warden 27.5x2.3 tires. We don't currently have plans to develop this tire in a 29".

Right now, our riders are cutting the Warden tires, in an effort to show us the stubby spike tire they would like. We are looking at this category.
  • + 1
 Great to hear that the Warden lives on :-) thanks for the reply, I look forward to seeing if the cut warden works out and makes production, the warden front, shorty rear has been a killer combo for me during the filthiest conditions replacing a shorty front, vigilante rear before it. A tyre to bridge the gap between the vigilante and the warden would be great and would stop me having to mix my tyre brands!! Keep up the good work guys.
  • + 1
 27.5/650b is currently in stock. We just aren't getting the demand for 29". A tire like the Shorty is on the wish list, but there are a lot of tires higher on the list. So much to do so little time . . .
  • + 1
 29 tyres are of no concern to me although I noticed that most of the newer models were only being released in 650 or 29, I guess you've stopped kicking out new 26" tyres due to market demand and restrictions on manufacture? My next bike will be 650 no doubt but for now I'm still firmly on 26. Cheers again for your replies.
  • + 3
 JM: We haven't yet stopped development on 26" tires. You will see a new release very soon.
  • + 1
 Thanks Jason, that makes me happy :-)
  • + 1
 Hey WTB, what ever happened to your GMS? I don't see it online when looking at the current lineup of tires. It seemed like an idea that made good sense. Have you dropped the idea? If so, was it that the rest of the industry didn't join in or is there different reason?
  • + 2
 JM: You make a good point here. Our printed product guide still shows GMS measurements. But I see they are missing from the website. Hey website guy, you reading this?

We still use GMS internally when talking tire size, and mark all tires with GMS measurements.

I can't say why the rest of the industry didn't adopt GMS. I wish it could have got more support. WTB will continue forward on our own.
  • + 0
 You guys made some crazy stuff back in the day (roller cam brakes, the Bon Tempe URT bike, etc) - any chance of ever resurrecting any of those vintage products? There's plenty of retro-minded people out there. What other exploratory new stuff are you working on?
  • + 1
 Slate here:
Some of that stuff worked well, some not so well. WTB is forward focused. But learning from the past is part of that. One thing is clear to me, we have too much to do already, so we need to be careful what we commit to doing. Vintage stuff is whole separate category. Never say never.
  • + 4
 probably going to get neggy propped but any chance for race support?
  • + 3
 Question = valid.
  • + 2
 Do they make a DH tyre ?
  • + 2
 they used to anyways if im right, not sure bout now tho
  • + 1
 JM: WTB is not as big of a company as you might think. Having raced on the World Cup XC circuit, US National series, etc, I see the value. I hope that we can someday support more races.
  • + 2
 CF: I'll have to let the marketing folks field that one. Unfortunately, we're all product guys here today.
  • + 1
 Hi, Love your WTB frequency 25 rims... Any plans to go wider with those rims... If yes - How wide? would you say 40mm (derby style) rims will improve or hurt traction with 2.3-2.4 trail tires?
  • + 1
 JM: Oh, wide rims. If we maintain the current strength of Frequency i25, and go wider, it would be a real heavy rim. What would you say your maximum acceptable weight would be?

As you might be aware, we have just released our Scraper i45 rims. Now, we have to fill in the gaps between i25 and i45. We are working on it.
  • + 2
 Any lightweight gravel grinding tcs compatible tires coming in the near future? Why don't more companies embrace tubeless setups for the road side of things?
  • + 1
 TCS Nanon 40c. 530g. Not the lightest, but 40mm!

www.wtb.com/products/nano-40c
  • + 1
 CF: Nano 700 x 40 TCS and Cross Boss 700 x 35C TCS Light tires are available right now. Nano 40 swept the podium at Lost and Found last year.

I'm a big supporter of CX and gravel bikes here at WTB, and I've been pushing hard for tubeless CX tires for a while. We have an advantage that is pretty unique in the industry, we design the tires and the rims, so we can make sure that everything works properly together. We are also able to draw from our experience with TCS development to arrive upon a really reliable tubeless CX/Gravel tuneless system. Another issue is the high-end CX racers still ride tubulars so the demand of gravel isn't being heard yet.
  • + 1
 Friends have banged on me for years to go tubeless b/c they go faster. The best reason I've heard for the fast thing is less rotational weight plus there is no friction of a tube inside the tire casing.
  • + 2
 CF: Better control with lower tire pressures makes a huge difference when you're going downhill
  • + 1
 JM: What you have heard is correct. The friction of the tube and tire creates a "dead" feeling in the tire. Once you get used to the feel of a tubeless tire set up, you can never go back. We don't have actually wattage data to back up the claim that tubeless is faster. However, I imagine the data exists somewhere. All I have to do is look at the World Cup XC or Enduro World Series races. Everyone runs tubeless. Everyone.
  • + 1
 I really miss the Exiwolf tread. That was a great all around tread in my opinion. I use the Vigilante now but it's pretty sluggish on the back end. Which of your current tires would you compare to the ol Exiwolf?
  • + 1
 Slate here:
Nano and Trailblazer are the closest. Nineline and Beeline are pretty good rollers. It's that center block spacing that does it. Less of a square wheel. But that wide spaced center knobs have their place when digging in on deep terrain.
  • + 3
 When are the carbon rims you guys are working on going to become available?
  • + 1
 JM: I like your enthusiasm. IF we were to release carbon rims, you can rest assured that we’d have put them through a ridiculously thorough test life before considering releasing them. If we decide to, we’d want to ensure they’ve had proper testing, regardless of how long that takes.
  • + 1
 On dirt I am aware that wider tires and lower pressure actually decrease rolling resistance. On hard pack how low is too low and how wide is too wide? When do things really start to go the other way?
  • + 1
 In previous models, some incorporated the 'inner peace' design, which seemed like a precusor to schwalbe's super gravity casing. Are there any plans to reintroduce this to the aggressive tires?
  • + 1
 MW The TSC Tough casing has just this, 27.5 Vigilante comes in around 1100g's. They are strong and tough to flat.
  • + 1
 Is the Vigilante tire in Team Issue a viable tire for downhilling? I have one in the rear and would like to know how it handles the abuse a place like Northstar at Tahoe will dish out.
  • + 1
 JM: Marco Osborne, winner of the Mammoth Kamikaze, and the CA Northstar Enduro (with no practice) says "yes".
  • + 1
 Excellent. Thanks for the replies, this is such a great way to get feedback!
  • + 1
 WTB go back to the roots and build something as beautiful as it was Bon Tempe ... or that great hubs.. I loved you for that... Oh I see Alexin asked the same q... Good on you mate
  • + 1
 If you go super far back, you can even find Chris King stuff with the WTB name on it.
  • + 1
 Slate here:
Super far back - that would be me. Chris King did build some headsets for WTB way long ago. Nothing beyond 1" steer tube diameter. Bon Tempe frames - now there is a rare item. Still have some. Need pivots. Hubs we built were tandem tough. Only one screw on freewheel would stay together, that was the SunTour New Winner. Had only a two prong remover though, and with the standard thread pitch getting it off again required disassembly and clamping the guts in a smooth jaw vise. Otherwise the body would bust using the two prong tool - if the tool did not break.
  • + 1
 I'll take a Bon Tempe off your hands if you don't want it. I know more than a few guys who could manufacture pivots for them. I'll also take a ti Phoenix if you have one sitting around. Oh and some of those prototype platform pedals you produced a few years ago.
  • + 1
 Slate here:
No pedals or ti frames but we could work something out for BT frames.
  • + 1
 How to get in touch (and get in line Smile ) for that BT frames? Seraph, may I get in touch in case we're both lucky with the frames? I guess we could get the drawings for them....

My breezer twister bike would kill me if it hear what I am doing now Smile
  • + 1
 Slate here:
I will need to go see what exactly I can find. Call WTB to leave your email or phone number. I will contact you.
  • + 1
 I have a small burping problem with my sx23 rims that came stock on my kona process 134. What are the design differences between this rim and say i23 that would cause this rim to burp air more easily?
  • + 1
 JM: SX23 is a tube type rim. You should not use it tubeless. When you say "burping", I assume you mean you are burping air when running a tire tubeless.

SX23 is a rim with an inner rim width of 23.....Also what we call i23. Kona also spec's an STi23 and Frequency i23, both of which are TCS Tubeless rims, designed to be run tubeless with a tubeless type tire.
  • + 1
 CF: SX23 in not recommended for tubeless applications. SX23 is not designed around a tubeless specification. The inner rim profile is considerably different for tubeless than tube-type applications, most notably, the bead shelf that the tire bead mates to at the bead hook. The dimension of the diameter if the bead shelf is closely controlled to match the diameter of the TCS tire's bead. SX23s do not have that design feature.
  • + 1
 Carbon Rims, when you guys plan to enter the market with your version, what internal rim diameter are we looking at, and I assume it'll be a hookless version? Or is it still top secret.
  • + 1
 CF: Our carbon rims will utilize the the same diameter specifications as all of our other rims. ETRTO all the way, no hookless.
  • + 1
 Do you guys plan on further development of the current CX tires (Cross Boss specifically) and develop new TCS CX tires or are the CX tires token category fillers? Like a 35c Nano TCS Smile or a Viglante CX.....SNAP!
  • + 1
 I do run WTB on my MTB btw, would love the same experience with the CX bike...,
  • + 1
 JM: We have had a very positive response from our CX tires using the TCS system. Cross runs deep in the blood of some of us WTB employees, and the push for more CX tires continues.
  • + 0
 it is quite a turn off to most people that are curious to mtb when they find out a rear shock can cost more than they thought your whole bike would cost. its also hard for them to walk into a bike shop without getting sticker shock too. if we dont get more people involved, we will be stuck paying for the low volume prices we as dedicated riders are used to seeing. what would your approach as a company be to get more new people into riding?
  • + 6
 nevermind. nobody cares.
  • + 2
 We have been coaching NorCal Skills Clinic Camps since they started in roughly 2002, and internationally for the past two years, providing scholarships and product when we can to cover kids' race fees as well. Getting more of today’s youth on bikes in a positive manner makes for a better tomorrow. It also makes for more riders, buying more bikes, bringing down the cost of riding. It also helps cultivate future proponents of bike access and bike parks, a win for all.
  • + 1
 Weir, Lawrence here. Need some 26" i23 Frequency hoops. I can be over in 15 min to pick em up. Only got IPA in stock but can stop at the store on the way over.
  • + 2
 mw Sounds like a deal...
  • - 1
 another PINBIKE thread by sponsors who will not tolerate any negative talk. This is the shitiest crap PB does.......shove crap down our collective throats and if anyone disagrees you shit on them and kick em off the island. Just like a pack of wolves. shame on you children
  • + 1
 Are the TCS 40c Nanos compatible with my HED Belgium+ rims? And what is the max pressure I could expect on that setup given a tubeless configuration.

Thanks!
  • + 1
 CF: I'm sorry I haven't measured the Belgium+, so I can't give you a definitive official WTB answer, but I've seen it done.
  • + 1
 CF: Just measured a Belgium+. They fall outside of ETRTO and are not recommended for use with TCS tires. Use at you own risk.
  • + 1
 Are there any plans to release tire designs with shorter sidewalls, to help reduce a square tire profile while mounted on wider 30mm+ rims?
  • + 2
 CF: ETRTO provides recommendations for tire and rim combinations. It come back to an earlier question, whether we are planning on designing tires for wider rims, the answer is yes. Outer knobs further down the casing = less sidewall.
  • + 2
 JM: There are other ways to reduce square profile besides making the sidewall shorter, such as sliding shoulder tread down on the casing. We are looking at this closely as the wide rim phenomenon develops, and quite honestly, looking past it with the 27.5+
  • + 1
 Music to my ears: I've been waiting for tires to catch up to wide rims for at least the last 2 years.
  • + 1
 You guys really nailed it with this. Really appreciate the time you've invested today
  • + 2
 Can I let other people ask the questions in hope that they will ask and you will answer?
  • + 2
 JM: Good question. We are typing as fast as we can Buddy. I am a 100 word per minute guy. My colleagues are not so quick.
  • + 2
 CF: Sorry to all of you who asked questions that we didn't have time to answer for you. It's time to go ride. Cheers
  • + 2
 CF: And thanks to pinkbike for hosting this thing. Sorry about the typos
  • + 1
 Mark when are we gonna get you up to north Idaho to shred with the boys at terra sports, Matt Chynowith would love to see you!
  • + 1
 where can i buy your rims in south africa... and what do you guys think of having a I-25 KOM on the front and a I-25 frequency at the back?
  • + 2
 JM: Our South Africa Distributer is International Trade, intltrade.co.zap. Super rad guys, and we love working with them.

I love the light front rim, more durable rear rim combo. I take it one step further, and use a TCS Light Tire up front, and Tough in the back.
  • + 1
 Can you please tell me the benefits of asymmetric WTB rims over the standard I23's you produce, my new Bronson has the asymmetric set up. Thanks Mark
  • + 1
 Who do I have to show my tits to get some new WTB tires? What kind of product does Mr. Weir use on his facial hair? Any chance that we will see a Timberwolf 2?
  • + 1
 Why wouldn't that little french dude Jerome Clementz ride your tires and wheels? He does know that Michelin sucks now right? Weir, hopefully you informed of that.
  • + 3
 MW Hard to argue with the world champ. Jerome always knows how I feel. And also knows we will always be here for him. He is family.
  • + 1
 What does WTB look for when hiring for their product development and engineering areas? What degrees, experience, and qualifications make someone desirable for the company?
  • + 2
 CF: I think the biggest factor is you have to be a bike geek. Education helps, but this is the bike industry, so plan on being underpaid compared to other industries. Passion for the bike, and a deep understanding on how they work. A high level of mechanical skill really helps.
  • + 0
 Was the On-Ramp an accidental discovery from the tooling you use to extrude your rims? I ask because I have WTB rims from 2008, years before you released your TCS system that have the ramps.
  • + 1
 JM: No, this wasn't accidental. It was developed early on, and refined many times.
  • + 0
 This summer may be the Idaho Hot Springs loop then maybe on the road west to do the Cascade Ridge. Possibly from there down to southern Oregon on the PCH. Will the 2.1 work for all that?
  • + 1
 JM: Which 2.1 are you referring to? In general, I would say yes, any of our 2.1's will make it through.
  • + 1
 For someone fairly uneducated on the whole tubeless or not discussion what are the benefits of running tubeless and what are some of the cons
  • + 1
 Slate here:
Being gone for weeks or months at a time causes sealant to dry out. Keep those wheels turning.
  • + 1
 I've ridden the GDMBR on a 29" w tubes. If I want to go tubeless, how goat head proof are is the 2.1? Does your sealant provide puncture protection?
  • + 1
 CF: Lots of sealant. I rode through a field on Jason's bike a couple months ago and got about 50 goat heads in each tire with no pressure loss. They seal right up.
  • + 2
 Hey. Is the WTB Sealant the same formula as Stans No Tube Sealant?
  • + 0
 JM: No. Far from the same.
  • + 2
 Are you saying it's better or worse? Please explain.
  • + 1
 Is Vigilante on 27mm inner rim width good idea or is better to stay at 23mm. BTW, tnx for made Vigilante, the tire for me.
  • + 2
 Why do Vigilantes go off so quickly ?
Are the CRC ones a faulty batch ?
  • + 1
 Slate here:
The Team Issue compound is softer, more sticky, not going to last as long.
  • + 1
 Fair enough, thanks for answering.
  • + 1
 Can I have a job??? Haha, It has always been my dream to work for a company like this!
  • + 3
 mw Who does the hiring around here anyway....
  • + 2
 What is the net worth of Mark Weir's facial hair?
  • + 2
 MW I'm going to ask Hair Club for Men, I'm not just a member, i'm also a client.
  • + 1
 Mr. Weir: what brand of fertilizer do you use on that stache? It reminds me of my grandad's blackberry bush.
  • + 2
 MW Lots of fresh air and parts of breakfast lunch and dinner. Its like a filter thing those whales have, I always know what I had for breakfast. So does my wife.
  • + 2
 How many mini bottles of tequila can you store in there? (or should I say stash in that stache?)
  • + 3
 MW My wife said too many.
  • + 1
 Jason, how many carboard forts would you say are constructed monthly at the Nc location?
  • + 1
 Beside the UST standard that ETRTO published many years ago, what are the other standards you keep mentioning here?
  • + 1
 Do you all have plans for a dh tire line-up? also, who's your favorite world cup rider?
  • + 1
 @WTB-Bikes Do any of Schwalbe's tires match the spec that will work tubeless with your rims?
  • + 1
 I am assuming that their UST tires will work, but are their Tubeless Ready tires compatible?
  • + 1
 What are the intervals I should top up my tubeless tyres with sealant should be? Obviously these intervals on average.
  • + 1
 Dont know if this was answered yet, But can i run a 27.5 2.4 tire on your 27.5+ scraper rim?
  • + 1
 Do you think you could make a stretchable tire that would fit 26, 27 or 29?
  • + 1
 JM: I don't think so.
  • + 2
 Slate here:
This question makes me smile. A stretchable tire bead would not be a good thing. How about a fast rolling, super high traction compound that provides extra long wear?
  • + 2
 How long does it take to grow a moustache such as Mark Weir?
  • + 4
 MW I think I may start asking my stache to answer these, got to start pulling its weight. Besides it gets more press then I do. To answer the question, not long. Hair pushes out faster then I ride, but it also works as repellent. Keeping away the undesirables. So thats good.
  • + 2
 Any Chance of a Dual Ply DH tire down the road?
  • + 2
 Is wtb still going to keep making 26" tires?
  • + 0
 WTB, no questions about tubeless, just wanted to say hi. Proud owner of a KOM i23 and a Frequency i23 rim sets here. Keep up the good work guys.
  • + 0
 How do you compare them? I got the frequency i23's over the KOM's for the stiffness, but always wonder if I'm missing out on the lighter weight and adequate stiffness with the KOM's.
  • + 0
 Well, I'm not a product tester and it depends a lot on the type of bike you are riding and your style. My humble opinion is that Koms are lighter but still stiff for trail-ish riding, small jumps and flowy trails, not too rough, (I don't want to push it harder). If you ride aggressively, through rough stuff and jump a lot, there is also the Frequency i25 wich is maybe like stan's no tubes flow ex but lighter.
  • + 1
 How much stiffness does your I-Beam in the frequency series add? P.S I love my i19 rims
  • + 1
 Hi WTB , whats your 2015 season look like for race team support? We are a team of 6 based in western canada . Smile
  • + 1
 We are always on the hunt for new rising talent. While we've already gone through the budgeting process for 2015, that doesn't mean we won't look at your proposal if you send it to sponsorship@wtb.com. We also have varying levels of sponsorship including working with local bike shops so we encourage you to apply. Cheers!
  • + 1
 Are you planning to make a wider rim in order to compete with the new Ibis and Specialized?
  • + 1
 Slate here:
We hope to get to market sometime soon. Being as good as those guys or better is a worthy objective.
  • + 1
 I'd like to see a revamped WTB Phoenix with 27.5+ wheels and modern geometry...
  • + 2
 Slate here:
Me too. That would be awesome. Framebuilding has left the building at WTB though. What is modern geometry? (Ask different people that ride different terrain and get many conflicting answers.) What is your frame material of choice? How much should a frame cost?
  • + 1
 Modern geo: Long TT/Reach, short stem/wide bars, low bb height, short chainstays, reasonably slack(66-68*), low standover with dropper routing. Steel/chromoly, and cheaper alumminum version $600-$1000 for frame with options for WTB builds. That would be cool
  • + 1
 Can you expand on the strength differences and design tradeoffs between pinned, sleeved and welded rims?
  • + 1
 CF: Due to the design of the pin and the way the rim is joined, pinned extrusion require much more material and are heavier as a result. The same profile shape would be roughly 10-20% lighter. The strength of the joint is comparable. Welded is about the same weight as sleeved, but the joint will be airtight. In my opinion there are no real advantages to welded seams for tubeless rims that are designed to utilize tap and sealant. Just extra cost.
  • + 1
 What is wtb's take on axle standards moving forward? Ie boost 148; new front standard?; 650/29
  • + 2
 Will you guys start making carbon rims and wheelsets?
  • + 1
 JM: We aren’t currently offering wheels as we stopped making hubs over two years ago. However, that doesn’t mean we’re not planning to offer hubs or wheels in the future. Carbon rims are in the development phase, and it is hard to say when they will test out, and be approved for mass production.
  • + 2
 which tire sealant tastes the best? I know Weir loves to drink that stuff.
  • + 1
 MW Its an LCQ if i run out of the hard stuff. Less lumps in the wtb sauce.
  • + 1
 Mr. Weir - how's the recovery going? R U still pushing a 38t up all the local hills? Racing this year?
  • + 2
 MW I'm all good thanks for asking. I have been riding more then I have in years, but with the hills and new bikes a 38 would crack this old man. I will race some this year, also a bunch of other ride type events with Cannondale. Its real fun and for some reason beer taste better this way.
  • + 1
 "...beer taste better this way." Amen to that, beer after a hard ride or race is the bestest beer. I'm a fan of Mr. Pineaple when I can get it(specifically for after ride brew consumption.)
  • + 1
 mw

What is this Mr. Pineaple you speak of?
  • + 1
 www.santanbrewing.com/the-beer/mr-pineapple

Heff with pineapple. It rules, but sadly is a summer seasonal(though I was still finding it as recently as December locally.)
  • + 2
 Mw Its on my list, thanks
  • + 0
 Have you studied the engineering principles behind the proven fact that moustaches result in more cornering traction? (ie. Weir, Stevie Smith....)
  • - 1
 I have a laserdisc super duty 20mm hub. I want to get a 15mm fork. Are there any conversion kits that will work, or do i need a new hub too?
  • + 1
 You need a new hub I believe.
  • + 1
 JM: The Super Duty cannot be converted. Sorry Frown
  • + 0
 Will the sealant freeze? I live in the Midwest and it can get pretty cold both riding and for the bike in the garage.
  • + 1
 JM: Our sealant is recommended for use down to 20df. Anything below that might compromise the sealants ability to seal a flat.
  • + 1
 It will freeze...sounds like BB's in my tires below about 15F
  • + 1
 Can your 2.1 be run with tubes?
  • + 1
 JM: Our 2.1? We make many 2.1's, both tube type and tubeless. You an use any of our tires, tube type, or tubeless with tubes.
  • + 1
 To repair a flat with a tubeless 2.1, how does one do that?
  • + 1
 JM: Most of the time while on the trail, we simply install a tube. Once you get home, you can try to use an extra amount of sealant, to help permanently seal the puncture. Weir uses AKA RC car glue to fill larger holes in his tires while on the trail, which allows the sealant to seal something it might not otherwise be able to do.
  • + 1
 Please solve Stan's boogers. Thank you.
  • + 0
 Will you ever bring the Prowler tires back? I would love to see some 29" TCS Prowler XT and MX tires in the new lineup.
  • + 1
 JM: There are no plans to resurrect the Prowler line. Our test team is very focused on progressing tire design from the past, moving forward.
  • + 1
 Well that's a shame, because that was one of the best tread patterns ever created. Perfect for Tenderfoot.
  • + 1
 What is any of you guys favourite non WTB tyre for dry condition use?
  • + 1
 MW Thats a good question. So many to pick from so little time. Sorry i'm no help.
  • + 1
 Who needs an espresso right now?
  • + 1
 well we didn't until you said that... thanks Drew!
  • + 1
 You should come to the UK! Tons of tire testing to be done!!!!
  • + 1
 MW i will be there for the epic Cymru..Look out incoming...
  • + 1
 JM: Weir and I are coming, this year.
  • + 1
 Cool, ill try and make it! Some brilliant trails around north wales!!! Also, what tires are you most likely to be using for Epic Cymru?
  • + 1
 Would a frequency i23 still be quite a bit more robust than KOM i25?
  • + 1
 JM: Yes, absolutely.
  • + 1
 Are you guys planning on releasing wheelsets using KOM rims?
  • + 1
 Any idea on a list of tire manufactures that follow ETRTO/UST ?
  • + 1
 CF: I have done a lot of measurements, but we are the only company I know of that openly decries it.
  • + 1
 MW- is the Bidwell Bump race format unique?
  • + 2
 MW Yes for sure because its all done in one day. I love this cause then family and friends can go to the Sierra Nevada brewery for a dinner and party. Also the XC is a great length and super rough stuff. The Enduro track is also cool, Its a strong man race with a great family grassroots feel. But remember as i do, bring the biggest motor you got and be ready to live in the RED. Go till you see spots and the finish line will follow.
  • + 1
 What rim/tire setup do your team riders use?
  • + 1
 MW Depends on the Race, I like the i25 with vigilante Tough high grip in front and the Trail Boss 2.2 Tough Fast in the rear.
  • + 1
 What is up with the Novato Bike Park? Any ETA on it opening? Cheers
  • + 1
 mw We are hoping for July...
  • + 1
 Which is lighter Tubless or normal?
  • + 1
 JM: Tubeless with sealant usually works out to be the light weight leader.
  • + 1
 WHY do sealed drives not exist ?
  • + 1
 Slate here:
Rohloff makes one. Derailleurs are lighter, faster and more prone to damage.
  • + 1
 No a sealed drive is a low profile derailleur in a box !!!!!!!!!!!!!http://www.pinkbike.com/video/343829/
  • + 1
 Do any of you fancy a bum?
  • + 1
 JM: Please define "bum". I'm lost.
  • + 1
 Have I been replaced yet?
  • + 1
 too soon to tell... let's say there's a contender. You better visit on break so we know who owns the title.
  • + 1
 Could I get Marks autograph?
  • + 5
 MW

If you want it? for sure. Never did I think anyone in my life would ask. so its an honor. Thanks
  • + 1
 Will you guys be backing the mclaren bike park project in San Francisco?
  • + 1
 We have sponsored SF Urban Riders' McLaren Short Track two years in a row now, with the proceeds going towards the McLaren Bike Park.
  • + 1
 ask Jason how many cardboard forts they have built while working
  • + 1
 JM: None while I am in the office.
  • + 1
 can i have it 4 free?
  • + 1
 Why bike?
  • + 14
 Because bike.
  • - 1
 This made me happy. Bike gonna bike.
  • + 3
 Bike is greater than or equal to life.
  • + 2
 Bike is love
  • + 3
 let's make bike not war
  • + 1
 more bike is a subset of more bike
  • + 3
 MW Because every time you ride a bike it turns on the mind blender. Some of the most clear visions of life have been viewed on my bike. The gift that never stops giving. Thanks for asking.
  • + 0
 MOESCHLER Whats the strongest material layer in the wtb tire ?
  • + 2
 JM: Is this the Thunderbringer that recommends "kill trail and punch out yuppies?" I love you.

The materials we use in our tires are proprietary. I'm not allowed to answer. Sorry Buddy.
  • + 1
 Hows Marco doing?
  • + 2
 JM: He is on the road to recovery. Riding Road bikes and XC bikes. He still needs a bit more time to heal, but his spirits are good.
  • + 1
 What is "UST"?
  • + 2
 Slate here:
Universal System Tubeless is a MAVIC description of and inner rim profile - and the tire dimensions that are engineered to fit that profile. Well documented and tested by ETRTO which is European Tire Rim Technical Organization - a group of well respected and experienced companies and large corporations that covers bicycles is a small part of what they do. WTB has based our TCS (Tubeless Compatible System) on the UST profile. WTB uses tape to seal spoke holes. The thing that appeals most to me about the UST profile is extensive testing by various well equipped labs and the idea that as a standard tires are required to fit that profile.
  • - 1
 Will the sealant dry out in my tires over the winter if it doesn't get used every week?
  • + 1
 JM: Different climates affect the sealant in different ways. There is no magic formula to determine how long the sealant will last. I live in NorCal, and have had tires mounted to wheels, hanging in my garage for 6 months. When I pull them down, there is still sealant inside.

In general, to get the best performance from your sealant, you should change it out routinely. That being said, I personally change my sealant whenever I change my tire, and thats about it.
  • + 0
 Does one need a compressor or floor pump to re-inflate a tubeless tire?
  • + 1
 JM: It depends on the tire and rim combination.

Tires with ETRTO/UST compliant beads mounted to rims using ETRTO/UST compliant shapes will generally inflate very easy. Example, a WTB TCS Tire mounted to an e*Thirteen wheel. Both follow ETRTO/UST international standards.

Product that does not follow ETRTO/UST standards is where you will run into difficulty.
  • + 0
 Can I come ride at the Ranch?
  • + 1
 MW
where do you live? Norcal..
  • + 1
 Sign me up MW, I work in Novato and live in Marin Smile I know where the ranch is but would never poach it... its bad form for one, and there are lots of firearms there!
  • + 2
 MW

They do a ton of hunting and target shooting on the ranch, so we always have to ask the land owner first. Second question. Do you strava? We are trying to keep that away from all the trails we love. Im easy to find, have you been to the Brewstop bikes shop? maybe we need to talk over a beer first.
  • + 1
 I have been to Brustop several times. You and I met at the Marin County Supervisor Rtmp thing a while back with Ben and Marco. Went to Finnegans after. Strava on private/poach is a no go for me. Wouldn't do that at the ranch at all. marc.tempesta@gmail.com
  • + 1
 Yep, I live in Petaluma!
  • + 1
 MW over the hill, kind of like me....
  • + 1
 mill valley
  • + 0
 Thoughts on ghetto tubeless set ups?
  • + 4
 JM: ghetto tubeless setups are exactly that...ghetto. Do you really want to ride a tire/rim combo that could allow the tire to come off the rim? We don't.
  • - 1
 If I get a flat, how easy is it to remove and install your tubeless 2.1? Regular tire levers to reinstall?
  • + 0
 On a long multi day/week ride, would I have to carry extra sealant w me?
  • + 1
 JM: Sealant will generally last at least a few weeks, even in the hottest, most dry conditions. I did the Durango to Moab San Juan hut system ride on one dose of sealant, no problem. I didn't bring any extra sealant with me, as the bags were already too heavy.
  • - 1
 Why WTB aren´t making 28 hole rims?
  • + 1
 JM: We do make 28 hole rims for a variety of OEM's. Typical Aftermarket demand is for 32h. We have been discussing certain SKU's to offer in 28h.
  • - 3
 Do you still make those awesome rear hubs?
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