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Need first DH/park bike

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Need first DH/park bike
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flag mattknowles
Posted: Feb 23, 2016 at 21:15 Quote
so I'm looking to buy my first DH/park bike but i think i want to stick to a single crown 180/190 bike. I have the opportunity to get a 2016 diamondback cooper for super cheap. I work at a shop so swapping parts is pretty easy for some of the lower end parts it comes with but how would this bike be to get me into the park bike world? I can't find any reviews of the bike yet, might be because its still so new...

http://www.diamondback.com/bikes-mountain-downhill-series-cooper

some of the other bikes i was looking at were the scott voltage and the NS snabb e frame (only 160mm)
flag Loki87
Posted: Feb 23, 2016 at 22:32 Quote
There are several things i don´t like about that thing.
The geometry seems funny at best and the suspension layout is rather simple. That might not be a bad thing, but imho, a bike like the Voltage is more evolved and a superior design.
That Diamondback just screams catalogue frame to me (implying there has not been done any real engineering and product development).
Imho there are a lots of well designed, reputable beginner bikes out there. I would not risk going with the Diamondback.

If you´re planning on swapping parts anyway, that´s all the more reason to go for a great frame as a base to upgrade and not compromise on the frame.
flag mattknowles
Posted: Feb 23, 2016 at 22:36 Quote
yeah thats somewhat how i felt, i just get a great price so i figured id ask some more experienced people what they thought.
flag patch92
Posted: Feb 24, 2016 at 7:03 Quote
id recommend a specialized status. they make single crown and dual crown models. you can get one used for pretty cheap. they are a great bike. i started DH on one and loved it.
flag Giladgu
Posted: Mar 9, 2016 at 12:37 Quote
I would recommend a banshee darkside, Scott voltage, or an knolly delirium I was lookin for a park bike. And if you don't mind 26" wheels, then a konA 167
flag PedalShopLLC
Posted: Apr 2, 2016 at 9:35 Quote
The Cooper is a lot like the Santa Cruz Bullit which was very popular in its hayday. .. somewhat old skool design but still nice even if it's been around for a while. For someone who can't spend $3,000, $4,000, $5,000+ it's a totally worthy start up.

Upgrade to nicer parts as things wear up.
flag BeaverCreaker
Posted: Apr 2, 2016 at 11:53 Quote
Get a 2015 commencal meta sx.. $1799 and much better than diamondback. Super burly and perfect for the bike park, yet can still pedal uphill if needed
http://www.commencalusa.com/meta-sx-origin-26-pink-2015-c2x14720077

However diamondback has been stepping it up, and I applaud their efforts. Their bikes are getting better every year.

If you need something more heavy-duty than the meta sx, go for the scott voltage.
flag Loki87
Posted: Apr 2, 2016 at 13:11 Quote
The question is, why would anyone be willing to buy a 10 year old bike just because it was state of the art back in the day? That´s like saying a modern car is the same as a 20 year old car, just without the safety features and gas-mileage, but who cares about those, right?
Like was said before, there are so many options out there, i´d strongly recommend any beginner to stay away from that Diamondback and get something that´s more in touch with modern geometry developments.
Can you ride and have fun on the Diamondback? Most likely you can. Can you have the same or more fun while having a better riding experience with various other offerings from other companies? Most definitely.

Please don´t mislead beginners just because you are a Diamondback dealer.
flag PedalShopLLC
Posted: Apr 2, 2016 at 16:14 Quote
any rookie rider would do just fine with the Cooper --- sure, the design is old skool but, so what... half the designs on the market today have very similar features to stuff that was on the market 15, 20 years ago. Take for example, Ellsworth Truth and the Ellsworth Dare, Kona Coiler series, even stuff that is no longer around like the K2 Lithium series, basic designs that are so called "cutting edge" today considered new now --- big difference is the 27.5 vs 26 and some nice improvements in how they hydroformed alloy tubing along with nicer bearings. I'd totally rock something like that Cooper in a heart beat if my spending limit was $2000 (or less).

Bikes that have designs like the Lapierre Spicy was also being used a really long time ago --- Titus for one had a bunch of designs that are similar. For me, having a nice bike is nice but a lot of having fun on a bike is just being a good rider and not getting all hung up with top notch bling.
flag Loki87
Posted: Apr 2, 2016 at 16:57 Quote
I wasn´t alking about bling or top notch parts or anything. It´s also not about the suspension design.
The problem with the Cooper is the geometry. Those chainstays are massively long. There´s a reason bikes pre 2010 mostly rode like shit. They had just terrible geometry. The Cooper only improves on that in headangle.
But a high single pivot bike, with long chainstays will ride like shit, cause those things keep getting even longer when the bike is going deeper into its travel.
Now, i´m also not one of those Demo guys crying for ultra short chainstays, quite the opposite in fact. My own bike is a testament to that.
Also what´s up with those reach measurements? Are they for real? Massive chainstays with a reach designed for a midget?

Again, i´m totally with you about having fun and riding performance being mostly about the rider.
That however doesn´t mean one should have to ride a shitty designed bike. A bike with well designed geometry is a tremendous help to a beginner getting more confidence and also makes for a safer ride.
For me geometry is the most important factor in a bicycle. I´d rather ride a bike with good geometry and bad parts (except brakes) than a bike with bad geo and bling parts.
And compared to most bikes in it´s price range, the coopers geometry looks like shit really.

Now, maybe the thing actually does ride great and i´m totally wrong on this, because honestly that would not be the first time a manufacturer just released a geometry chart with numbers waaaayyyyy off.
But the numbers as stated on Diamondbacks homepage are crap.

The thing can be ridden down a hill. Most likely it can be ridden fast by a competent rider.
But paying that amount of money for an outdated design and justifying it with "it was good ten years ago" is just unreasonable.
flag BeaverCreaker
Posted: Apr 2, 2016 at 22:40 Quote
i know for a fact that the $1700 commencal meta sx origin will out perform that $2000 diamondback, anywhere on the hill. up or down, in corners, in the air.
flag PedalShopLLC
Posted: Apr 3, 2016 at 7:58 Quote
BeaverCreaker wrote:
i know for a fact that the $1700 commencal meta sx origin will out perform that $2000 diamondback, anywhere on the hill. up or down, in corners, in the air.


riding rock garden gnar on a fully rigid, single speed, --- sometimes it ain't the bike but the skills and putting your mind to it.

https://www.pinkbike.com/video/441136/

I actually had to slow down doing the line cause my son, with the shakey-McShake camera hand couldn't walk the line fast enough. that bike I'm on, as I note in the video is a KHS Rigid One, stock kit is actually very different, intended to be an urban bike. still, it's a rigid 29er which as you can see, made it through the rocky gnar just fine*

** OLD SKOOL BABY!!!
flag PedalShopLLC
Posted: Apr 3, 2016 at 8:00 Quote
mattknowles wrote:
so I'm looking to buy my first DH/park bike but i think i want to stick to a single crown 180/190 bike. I have the opportunity to get a 2016 diamondback cooper for super cheap. I work at a shop so swapping parts is pretty easy for some of the lower end parts it comes with but how would this bike be to get me into the park bike world? I can't find any reviews of the bike yet, might be because its still so new...

http://www.diamondback.com/bikes-mountain-downhill-series-cooper

some of the other bikes i was looking at were the scott voltage and the NS snabb e frame (only 160mm)


Those NS Snabb's are sweet rides too.

https://www.pinkbike.com/photo/12933755/ (Snabb T)

https://www.pinkbike.com/photo/12593035/ (Snabb E) they can handle all the gnar and climbs like a goat on bad crack, I know this for a fact.
flag BeaverCreaker
Posted: Apr 3, 2016 at 13:00 Quote
PedalShopLLC wrote:
BeaverCreaker wrote:
i know for a fact that the $1700 commencal meta sx origin will out perform that $2000 diamondback, anywhere on the hill. up or down, in corners, in the air.


riding rock garden gnar on a fully rigid, single speed, --- sometimes it ain't the bike but the skills and putting your mind to it.

https://www.pinkbike.com/video/441136/

I actually had to slow down doing the line cause my son, with the shakey-McShake camera hand couldn't walk the line fast enough. that bike I'm on, as I note in the video is a KHS Rigid One, stock kit is actually very different, intended to be an urban bike. still, it's a rigid 29er which as you can see, made it through the rocky gnar just fine*

** OLD SKOOL BABY!!!

The commencal meta sx is 6 inch suspension front and rear... $1700
flag PedalShopLLC
Posted: Apr 3, 2016 at 13:05 Quote
mattknowles wrote:
so I'm looking to buy my first DH/park bike but i think i want to stick to a single crown 180/190 bike. I have the opportunity to get a 2016 diamondback cooper for super cheap. I work at a shop so swapping parts is pretty easy for some of the lower end parts it comes with but how would this bike be to get me into the park bike world? I can't find any reviews of the bike yet, might be because its still so new...

http://www.diamondback.com/bikes-mountain-downhill-series-cooper

some of the other bikes i was looking at were the scott voltage and the NS snabb e frame (only 160mm)

If you work at a shop, can you get your boss to order the DB? DB's are sold through SBS.... Snabb's you can get through BTI (but it's a frame only option, BTI doesn't sell a complete bike model)... no 2015 Snabb E's left, just some Snabb T's and the 2016's aren't yet.
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