Need major help

PB Forum :: Dirt Jumping & Street
Need major help
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flag Jakespade
Posted: Jan 14, 2017 at 19:57 Quote
I apologize in advance... I'm coming back into riding after taking some years off. When I rode before I was a BMX guy and coming back into it, I am looking for something more forgiving. I dig street, park, smooth trails and dirt jumps so I figured I'm gonna try a 26" dirt jump style. I am waiting for the frame I bought (used) to show up (08 Eastern DJ-4 from the classifieds). I have a mountain bike I plan on scavenging parts from until I can get all the parts to tear apart an powdercoat and build it up right.

So my first question... what kind of hubs should I get?

(I plan on lacing and building everything up myself to cut down on cost) I want to run a disc brake in the back and no brake up front. I have looked at some BMX and some mountain bike ones, but haven't settled on one yet.

I have a Manitou Six Deluxe front end I plan on rebuilding but when I rode it on the donor bike, it felt super soft. How is one of these front ends supposed to feel? (I'm coming from BMX and really not used to suspension, but I'm trying to learn!!)

Also, can anybody suggest an online store to look/but parts for these bikes?? BMX has specific stores, DH, all mountain, fixies and the rest have a store specific to them, does DJ/Urban/Street??

Thanks for any help!
flag Aaronz25RS
Posted: Jan 15, 2017 at 10:25 Quote
There aren't and DJ specific online shops, you have to sort through everything else...

That Manitou fork is going to hurt you, do not use, its from 2002 and probably has 25mm stanchions and a steering tube made of balsa wood.. Consider a new(er) Manitou Circus Expert (best cheapest option)

A lot of people start with Azonic Outlaws (wheels) and keep using them cause they're decent for the money.. many DJ bikes are single speed, the outlaws aren't SS they have to be converted (simple).. you basically need hubs to fit the frame and for, QR axles will hurt you...

AFA hubs most older frames rear are 10 or 12mm axle and 135-145mm width..
Most forks are 15/20mm (axle) 110mm width, Hope, Profile, NS, Dartmoor are just a few names to look at..

Budget builds are great, but certain things shouldn't be skimped on for safety, that fork being one of those things..

Be safe, enjoy
flag cmc4130
Posted: Jan 15, 2017 at 12:09 Quote
I agree with Aaron.

What bike are you scavenging off of? A lot of casual mountain bikes, you basically wouldn't want to use any of the parts except like a seat post or something!

If you spend money buying new parts, your build will end up costing way more than if you just found a quality used DJ complete.

A lot of the higher end complete dirt jumpers were around $800-$1200 new. And they can be found for half that or even less than half.

Custom DJ builds can end up being very expensive--$400 wheelset, $400 fork, $550 frame, etc.

2010 Black Market Malice Dirt Jumper - $500 (Centennial)
http://denver.craigslist.org/bik/5960228342.html

2011 Scott Voltage YZ 0.2 Dirt Jumper Bike - $299 (Provo)
http://provo.craigslist.org/bid/5870208408.html

2012 Specialized P2 Dirt Jumper - $500 (Newington, CT
http://hartford.craigslist.org/bik/5959449558.html
flag Jakespade
Posted: Jan 15, 2017 at 14:18 Quote
The mountain bike is a Jamis so I was hoping some parts could transfer over.

The frame I picked up was cheap so I thought building one would be fun. I'm trying to find everything second hand I have blown up Craigslist in Arizona looking for parts.

I have found a few shops I can scavenge some parts from but from the sound of it, i at least need to spring for a new fork.

Thanks guys!
flag cmc4130
Posted: Jan 15, 2017 at 16:47 Quote
Jakespade wrote:
The mountain bike is a Jamis so I was hoping some parts could transfer over.

The frame I picked up was cheap so I thought building one would be fun. I'm trying to find everything second hand I have blown up Craigslist in Arizona looking for parts.

I have found a few shops I can scavenge some parts from but from the sound of it, i at least need to spring for a new fork.

Thanks guys!


which Jamis? do you have a photo?
flag Ajarm19
Posted: Jan 15, 2017 at 18:33 Quote
go to jensonusa.com or chainreactioncycles.com they are the best online retailers for bike parts
flag Jakespade
Posted: Jan 16, 2017 at 17:44 Quote
cmc4130 wrote:
which Jamis? do you have a photo?

It's an older one. Hardtail with high seat tube converted to single speed, On One bars and stem, Truvative cranks (still has 2 sprockets on it) and has a sketchy chain tensioner that looks like a rear derailleur. I was gonna swap the wheels over and the V-Brakes (I'm old and like to stop) and use the cranks, shock, bars and all that but the more I think about it, the more I wanna build a bad ass bike.

I keep looking at all these custom DJ/Urban bikes and my mind starts going. I was building custom motorcycles before the economy crashed in 09 so I have a pretty firm grasp on mechanics and how to make a run of the mill bike (Harley) look pretty sick without much effort. There is so much potential this style of bikes has that has yet to be tapped into visually.

I might not be able to ride as hard or do as many tricks as I used to, but I'm sure I can put my stamp on a bike that will be remembered ????
flag cmc4130
Posted: Jan 17, 2017 at 9:54 Quote
Jakespade wrote:
. . .

I have a Manitou Six Deluxe front end I plan on rebuilding but when I rode it on the donor bike, it felt super soft. How is one of these front ends supposed to feel? (I'm coming from BMX and really not used to suspension, but I'm trying to learn!!)
. . .

I also switched to DJ-MTB from BMX (about 11 years ago). At first any suspension fork will feel a little strange. However, after that, it's worth noting that there can be big differences between suspension forks and how they're tuned.

In general, DJ riders tend to want a shorter travel fork, like 80mm or 100mm, with stiff coil spring, or with air at a higher pressure; you also want rebound settings set for a firm pushback. The goal of typical XC fork is to smooth out bumps, while being very light (but not necessarily strong enough for jumping). But, for jumping, you don't want a fork that has that "slow mush" feel. You want something that is responsive but takes big hits. That said, people do ride their suspension differently, and it becomes a personal preference.
flag cmc4130
Posted: Jan 17, 2017 at 9:59 Quote
Jakespade wrote:

Also, can anybody suggest an online store to look/but parts for these bikes?? BMX has specific stores, DH, all mountain, fixies and the rest have a store specific to them, does DJ/Urban/Street??

I think there have been a few over the years, with some shutting down. Maybe this one:http://26bikes.com/.

I find it helpful to look up parts on BTI-USA.com, then get my local bike shop to order them.
flag cmc4130
Posted: Jan 17, 2017 at 10:05 Quote
Jakespade wrote:
cmc4130 wrote:
which Jamis? do you have a photo?

It's an older one. Hardtail with high seat tube converted to single speed, On One bars and stem, Truvative cranks (still has 2 sprockets on it) and has a sketchy chain tensioner that looks like a rear derailleur. I was gonna swap the wheels over and the V-Brakes (I'm old and like to stop) and use the cranks, shock, bars and all that but the more I think about it, the more I wanna build a bad ass bike.

Geared mountain bikes have vertical dropouts and typically use a quick-release rear wheel. When a geared MTB is converted to single speed, you need that tensioner arm to create the chain tension.

If you're putting that wheel on an Atomlab DJ frame with horizontal dropouts, the quick-release is not going to cut it (although for whatever reason, that debate never dies, and some people say their quick release works fine--but a lot of other people say that it won't hold a wheel straight in horizontal dropouts). So, you may be able to get a solid bolt-on axle for that hub, depending on the hub.

Truvativ cranks are good. A little heavy/burly, but strong.

Disc brakes are more common than running v-brakes. (Mechanical disc are plenty good for a DJ; hydraulic are overkill--but a lot of people still run them, because they're cool).
flag Jakespade
Posted: Jan 17, 2017 at 11:21 Quote
Right on, I appreciate it! I have found some more tid bits so I think I'm gonna cannibalize the Jamis for as much as I can (I am on the hunt for a better fork set up) and have a set of wheels in target as long as they don't sell before Friday (payday) lol
flag cmc4130
Posted: Jan 17, 2017 at 12:08 Quote
Jakespade wrote:
Right on, I appreciate it! I have found some more tid bits so I think I'm gonna cannibalize the Jamis for as much as I can (I am on the hunt for a better fork set up) and have a set of wheels in target as long as they don't sell before Friday (payday) lol

Are you going with a singlespeed wheelset?

MTB-DJ singlespeed are either converted, using a single cog and spacers, or they are the BMX style which is a non-dished wheel like the NS Rotary SS complete wheel.

http://www.ns-bikes.com/parts,10,pl.html

http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/us/en/ns-bikes-fundamental-rear-mtb-wheel-singlespeed-2016/rp-prod148634
flag cmc4130
Posted: Jan 17, 2017 at 15:54 Quote
The only thing that's a little odd about the NS Rotary SS cassette is the 10t driver. They really should have gone with 11t.

For a normal gear ratio, you'd need 22t / 10t for 26" wheels. (That's 57.2 gear inches).

24t / 10t X 26 = 62.4 gear inches--would be okay also (a little stouter, but still very rideable for DJ, street, and park).

For 22t and 24t sprockets, a good place to check is flatlandfuel, because flatland BMX tends to have those tiny sprockets. http://flatlandfuel.com/sprockets.aspx If you're doing 22t, I think you have to use a 48-spline style crankset where you can do spline drive.

This guy has 22/9:
photo
https://www.pinkbike.com/forum/listcomments/?threadid=3934&pagenum=140#commentid5489826
photo
flag cmc4130
Posted: Jan 17, 2017 at 16:27 Quote
By the way, if the bottom bracket shell has threads in it, that means it's "Euro." Since the spacing is listed as 68mm, the tube spacer that comes with the Odyssey Euro bb will work:

https://www.amazon.com/Odyssey-Euro-Bottom-Bracket-Bearing/dp/B000VT2GD4

You're also going to use any typical "integrated" BMX headset. http://www.empirebmx.com/catalog/headset-stuff



http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/us/en/eastern-dj4-frame/rp-prod89597
DJ-4 26” Dirt Jump/Skatepark Frame.

Features:
Reynolds 520 Heat-Treated Chromoly tubing
Accepts 26” Wheel
Designed for 3-4” travel fork
IS Disc Brake Mounts and V-Brake Mounts
Powder Coat Paint
Horizontal Dropouts, 6mm Heat Treated Chromoly
Specifications:
Top Tube Length: 22.5”
Chain Stay: 16.3”
Head Tube: 72º
Seat Tube: 71º
Headset Size/Type: 1 1/8" Integrated Campag Type
BB Shell: 68mm
Seatpost Size: 25.4mm
Seat Clamp Size: 30.0mm

Any Eastern26 riders out there?
https://www.pinkbike.com/forum/listcomments/?threadid=18135&pagenum=1

Odyssey Euro bottom bracket:
Unsecure image, only https images allowed: http://www.odysseybmx.com/dailyword/archivesV2/2011/02/euro-bb_6814.jpg

This is what I have on my Black Market Mob 26" DJ, with BMX Profile cranks. I'm also using a BMX "half-link" chain as you can see in the photo. These are good for getting your rear wheel placement optimal. Not necessary, just if you're picky about having your wheel more forward in the dropouts.

Unsecure image, only https images allowed: http://i255.photobucket.com/albums/hh138/upsetbmx/Odyssey-BMX-euro-bb-on-Black-Market-Mob_zps0hlop0zx.jpg
flag Bradwashere
Posted: Jan 20, 2017 at 16:55 Quote
I see your looking for a rear brake I would recommend a SRAM level I only just bought one a bout a month ago
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