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Euro BB- I'm confused

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Euro BB- I'm confused
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flag riggadon
Posted: Feb 15, 2010 at 19:53 Quote
So ive been looking at some DJ frames, and quite a few of them have euro BB's. If i were to buy a new frame, i would need a new BB and cranks as well. This is what ive gathered by reading a bunch of threads and still not finding a clear answer:

1. Euro BB's have small bearings and brake easily
2. You can also use an x- type BB
3. You can use either BMX cranks or MTB cranks depending on your BB
4. Euro BB's are on road bikes
5. There are different sized Euro BB's- 19mm and 22mm

So basically, id just like to understand better what my options are, what is and isnt compatible, and what a good strong BB is. Thanks
flag photoguy9
Posted: Feb 15, 2010 at 19:59 Quote
Redline BB's suck, straight up.

The 19/22mm relates to the spindle size of the cranks.

I wouldn't cheap out on a BB, it's one of those things you'll just regret Razz
flag riggadon
Posted: Feb 15, 2010 at 20:46 Quote
that answered one of my questions, but i need to know what is compatible with what ie. can i use x- type BB's, and if so what are they compatible with
flag therider07
Posted: Feb 15, 2010 at 20:55 Quote
fall0ut wrote:
that answered one of my questions, but i need to know what is compatible with what ie. can i use x- type BB's, and if so what are they compatible with

basically every mtb bottom bracket is euro, the only exception is on some dj bikes, but then you would use bmx cranks with like a profile bb.

does that help?
flag riggadon
Posted: Feb 15, 2010 at 20:57 Quote
therider07 wrote:
fall0ut wrote:
that answered one of my questions, but i need to know what is compatible with what ie. can i use x- type BB's, and if so what are they compatible with

basically every mtb bottom bracket is euro, the only exception is on some dj bikes, but then you would use bmx cranks with like a profile bb.

does that help?

if thats true then that means i could put the BB on my bighit on the DJ frame and it would fit? because im sure the spindle length is different
flag therider07
Posted: Feb 15, 2010 at 20:58 Quote
fall0ut wrote:
therider07 wrote:
fall0ut wrote:
that answered one of my questions, but i need to know what is compatible with what ie. can i use x- type BB's, and if so what are they compatible with

basically every mtb bottom bracket is euro, the only exception is on some dj bikes, but then you would use bmx cranks with like a profile bb.

does that help?

if thats true then that means i could put the BB on my bighit on the DJ frame and it would fit? because im sure the spindle length is different

well there are different bb shell lengths, what dj frame?
flag riggadon
Posted: Feb 15, 2010 at 21:02 Quote
therider07 wrote:
fall0ut wrote:
therider07 wrote:


basically every mtb bottom bracket is euro, the only exception is on some dj bikes, but then you would use bmx cranks with like a profile bb.

does that help?

if thats true then that means i could put the BB on my bighit on the DJ frame and it would fit? because im sure the spindle length is different

well there are different bb shell lengths, what dj frame?

ns traffic. it doesnt say on the website wether its 19 or 22, i dont even know what that means anyway
flag therider07
Posted: Feb 15, 2010 at 21:14 Quote
[Quote] ns traffic. it doesnt say on the website wether its 19 or 22, i dont even know what that means anyway[/Quote]

19 or 22 has to do with your cranks and what size spindle they have, you probably have a 73mm shell which doesnt really matter for anything besides the spacers that are in the bb. the cranks should be a direct swap over. If you dont know this you should probably just take it to your lbs and have them swap it over but they can do it.

It should work though
flag
Posted: Feb 15, 2010 at 21:20 Quote
The 19 and 22mm measurements you keep referring to are diameters, not lengths (a 22mm wide bottom bracket would be absolutely tiny! about the width of one of your crank arms!).

Euro BB's have their own fun standard as far as sizing goes, and most will follow the typical 68/73mm shell size (read: they'll fit either 68 or 73mm wide bottom bracket shells), and be between 108mm and 133mm in spindle width (113mm is the most common size used in the industry). If I'm not mistaken, your NS uses a 68mm shell, which means you'll be able to use either a 68mm specific BB, or a 73mm BB (and just use five mm worth of spacers, as instructed by the BB's manual).

As far as spindle length (that pesky second number) goes, it will depend upon your frame, rear hub, and crankset. If you go with a crankset that uses an external bearing BB (like a shimano, or Race Face), then you don't have to worry about it, as it's sort of one-size-fits-all. However, anything that uses an internal-bearing BB (any ISIS, square-taper, Octa-Link, or BMX style cranksets) will require you to pay attention to the spindle length. I'm assuming you're planning on single speeding your Traffic? Just grab a 113mm BB and be done with it.

To summarize: just about any crankset will work on your frame, provided you don't cock the numbers up too badly (by getting, say, an 83x122.5mm Square-taper BB for a set of Shimano Dura-Ace cranks - though if you do manage to do that, I have a cookie reserved for that level of stupidity)
flag riggadon
Posted: Feb 15, 2010 at 21:59 Quote
CheesyBurrito wrote:
The 19 and 22mm measurements you keep referring to are diameters, not lengths (a 22mm wide bottom bracket would be absolutely tiny! about the width of one of your crank arms!).

Euro BB's have their own fun standard as far as sizing goes, and most will follow the typical 68/73mm shell size (read: they'll fit either 68 or 73mm wide bottom bracket shells), and be between 108mm and 133mm in spindle width (113mm is the most common size used in the industry). If I'm not mistaken, your NS uses a 68mm shell, which means you'll be able to use either a 68mm specific BB, or a 73mm BB (and just use five mm worth of spacers, as instructed by the BB's manual).

As far as spindle length (that pesky second number) goes, it will depend upon your frame, rear hub, and crankset. If you go with a crankset that uses an external bearing BB (like a shimano, or Race Face), then you don't have to worry about it, as it's sort of one-size-fits-all. However, anything that uses an internal-bearing BB (any ISIS, square-taper, Octa-Link, or BMX style cranksets) will require you to pay attention to the spindle length. I'm assuming you're planning on single speeding your Traffic? Just grab a 113mm BB and be done with it.

To summarize: just about any crankset will work on your frame, provided you don't cock the numbers up too badly (by getting, say, an 83x122.5mm Square-taper BB for a set of Shimano Dura-Ace cranks - though if you do manage to do that, I have a cookie reserved for that level of stupidity)

thanks a lot, that clears things up!
flag hampsteadbandit
Posted: Feb 16, 2010 at 4:17 Quote
euro shell?

avoid "internal" bearing bottom bracket / crank systems (i.e. bmx crank with euro b/b)

bmx frames for hard abuse don't use euro shells any more because they do not withstand the abuse - bmx use larger Mid Size or Spanish press-fit bottom brackets which offer MUCH better bearing durability when running the 19mm or 22mm bmx crank axle diameters

its only the racing frames that use euro b/b, many of these bmx race frames are aluminiumm alloy and racers often run the Shimano DXR HT2 crankset which has external bearings


for a euro shell, I'd look at Shimano's Saint HT2 crankset which has massive external bearings, and will fit 68/73mm b/b shells with the same crank, using spacers provided with the kit

be aware though, that the smallest chainring you can run on the spider is 32T, if you are running singlespeed and want a particular setup
flag chunkiemonkie
Posted: Mar 27, 2010 at 11:45 Quote
ok sorry to gravedig, but just to clear things up, would i be able to take my stock hussefelt cranks from my 08 stp 2 and put them on an ns suburban?
flag cruelty-and-the-beast
Posted: Mar 27, 2010 at 12:01 Quote
chunkiemonkie wrote:
ok sorry to gravedig, but just to clear things up, would i be able to take my stock hussefelt cranks from my 08 stp 2 and put them on an ns suburban?

Yes, IF, the sindle of the BB is the same as the spindle they came from.
flag
Posted: Mar 27, 2010 at 12:14 Quote
i cant see how having internal bearings is any weaker than having external bearings??

and if you buy a dj frame with a euro bb i recommend buying DMR cults.
flag hampsteadbandit
Posted: Mar 27, 2010 at 12:37 Quote
i cant see how having internal bearings is any weaker than having external bearings??

its very simple to understand

the problem with the Euro shell is the limited diameter, it was never designed for aggressive riding on mountain bikes, its a leftover from the world of road bikes!


ideally you want the largest possible diameter crank axle on a crankset for strength and rigidity - ideally around 19-22mm

when you try and manufacture a bottom bracket to fit inside the Euro shell, and support the 19mm-22mm axle, you simply don't have enough space left for cartridge bearings of sufficient depth to withstand the high stresses, strains and impact loads of aggressive riding

thin bearings = frequent replacement


manufacturers tried to offer "double row" bearing systems (i.e. 2 bearings side by side, on either side of the cup) during the era of ISIS cranksets, but it made no difference to durability as each individual bearing would still fail due to being too thin


with external bearing cranksets like Shimano HT2 and Race Face X-Type, you are not constrained by the limited diameter of the Euro shell, as the bearing package sits outside of the bottom bracket shell

with the external systems, all that the Euro shell is doing is providing a threaded interface for the bearing cup to screw into!

this means you can still have a large 19mm-22mm crank axle for strength and rigidity, and also large diameter bearings (sitting outside of the Euro bottom bracket shell) for massively increased long-term durability and resistance to high impacts

hope that makes sense Wink
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