Enduro/AM - The Weight Game

PB Forum :: Pinkbike Groups
Enduro/AM - The Weight Game
Author Message
Posted: Mar 18, 2020 at 12:25 Quote
DD maybe not so slash resistant. I slashed 2 DD DHR IIs in the same week last season trying to get ready for a DH race.

It prompted me to switch to the Michelin Wild Enduros, which are a little lighter but don't seem half as likely to tear*.

* Also switched rims at this time. It's possible that my old rim may have been the culprit (Mavic EN 827) it had very thin sidewalls. I still say DD is just a heavier EXO tire.

Anyone tried just running DH tires with no inserts and comparing that to like a DD or EXO with an insert? My money is on DH tires still, but I bought a cushcore last winter so might as well try it.

Posted: Mar 18, 2020 at 12:37 Quote
skerby wrote:
I still say DD is just a heavier EXO tire.

Anyone tried just running DH tires with no inserts and comparing that to like a DD or EXO with an insert? My money is on DH tires still

Nothing in invincible, but Double Down is a lot more than EXO - it's the same as the DH casing with finer fabric. DH is still their toughest.

I'm unsure how tough the EXO and SilkShield fabrics are. Hopefully tougher than a single layer of casing fabric ... ?

EXO:
• 60 or 120 TPI
• 2 casing layers under the sidewalls
• 3 casing layers under the tread
• 1 extra layer of fabric (of unknown toughness) under the sidewalls

EXO+:
• 120 TPI
• 2 casing layers under the sidewalls
• 3 casing layers under the tread
• 1 extra layer of fabric (of unknown toughness) under the sidewalls
• 1 extra layer of fabric (of unknown toughness) under the entire surface

Double Down
• 120 TPI
• 4 casing layers under the sidewalls
• 6 casing layers under the tread
• 1 rubber bead bumper at the bead/rim interface

DH
• 60 TPI
• 4 casing layers under the sidewalls
• 6 casing layers under the tread
• 1 rubber bead bumper at the bead/rim interface

Posted: Mar 18, 2020 at 13:25 Quote
Circe wrote:
How are We Are One rims so cheap!

Also, is it just me or does this thread feel extra active?

Well the CAD plummeting recently is only making them more competitive to USD buyers.

Made in Canada, so they don't need to pad their retail with their shipping costs across the ocean (and also less carbon footprint).

They make all their own moulds as they have CNC's, so not having to amortize TW mould costs across COGs.

They're their own vendor, so there's one less channel where someone is taking a cut like you'd typically get out of TW.

Certainly way more initial capital investment and labour overhead to go the route they've gone, but it's hugely beneficial as they can make make rapid changes to their moulds and diversify their offering with a CNC on hand. It's also really f'n cool that the product they make is essentially 100% sourced from North America (raw materials to finished goods).

Posted: Mar 18, 2020 at 13:54 Quote
All true points. One other detail: We Are One has nearly eliminated finishing work: pull the rims out of the molds, drill the holes, apply a decal, and they're good to go. Carbon products in low labour cost markets usually involve a lot of finishing work, which would be uneconomical here - and it's not a negligible cost elsewhere.

Posted: Mar 18, 2020 at 14:31 Quote
skerby wrote:
DD maybe not so slash resistant. I slashed 2 DD DHR IIs in the same week last season trying to get ready for a DH race.

It prompted me to switch to the Michelin Wild Enduros, which are a little lighter but don't seem half as likely to tear*.

* Also switched rims at this time. It's possible that my old rim may have been the culprit (Mavic EN 827) it had very thin sidewalls. I still say DD is just a heavier EXO tire.

Anyone tried just running DH tires with no inserts and comparing that to like a DD or EXO with an insert? My money is on DH tires still, but I bought a cushcore last winter so might as well try it.

I've run DH casings back to back with an DD tyre, I can't really notice a difference in feel. Neither tyre was new, and width/tread pattern differed also, so hard to pinpoint one variable among those others.

the e13 DH tyre continues to exceed expectations however, I love that thing. It's seen clay, mud, loose rocks and moon dust in the last two weeks, yet to have it do anything weird.

Posted: Mar 18, 2020 at 16:21 Quote
R-M-R wrote:
All true points. One other detail: We Are One has nearly eliminated finishing work: pull the rims out of the molds, drill the holes, apply a decal, and they're good to go. Carbon products in low labour cost markets usually involve a lot of finishing work, which would be uneconomical here - and it's not a negligible cost elsewhere.

Relevantly, this is also why they're one of very few companies that will offer custom spoke hole counts. CRS-One here got a set in 36h. They'll drill what you want!

Posted: Mar 18, 2020 at 16:28 Quote
We are one it is.

After I get back to work that is. Currently I'm on unpaid vacation.

Posted: Mar 18, 2020 at 17:13 Quote
Does anyone else have issues wearing out certain cassette cogs much quicker than others?

The 11-13-15t cogs on my cassettes (10spd) seem to be worn out and done way before the rest of the cassette. I think I'm pretty good with shifting cleanly and change chains when they reach the 0.75 mark on my tool, yet I usually end up replacing those small cogs halfway through the life of the whole cassette.

Posted: Mar 18, 2020 at 17:48 Quote
riish wrote:
Does anyone else have issues wearing out certain cassette cogs much quicker than others?

The 11-13-15t cogs on my cassettes (10spd) seem to be worn out and done way before the rest of the cassette. I think I'm pretty good with shifting cleanly and change chains when they reach the 0.75 mark on my tool, yet I usually end up replacing those small cogs halfway through the life of the whole cassette.
Are you spending equal or greater time in those cogs as compared to the others? Off hand, there's fewer teeth to spread the load over so if you spend relatively similar amount of time in each cog, I'd expect those with the fewest teeth to wear the most. Could also be that when you're in those cogs you're applying more power and pedaling harder putting more load onto those teeth. I tend to wear out like the lower middle 25% of cassettes first along with the granny gear, the smallest two or three will be ok, then the next two or three will be most worn, then the four or five are about on par with the smallest two or three and the granny gear will be worn. Always chalked it up to the gears I use most and then just dumping through the cassette to the granny when I have to climb.

Posted: Mar 18, 2020 at 17:49 Quote
sherbet wrote:
R-M-R wrote:
All true points. One other detail: We Are One has nearly eliminated finishing work: pull the rims out of the molds, drill the holes, apply a decal, and they're good to go. Carbon products in low labour cost markets usually involve a lot of finishing work, which would be uneconomical here - and it's not a negligible cost elsewhere.

Relevantly, this is also why they're one of very few companies that will offer custom spoke hole counts. CRS-One here got a set in 36h. They'll drill what you want!

Even more ridiculous, I only got a single 36h since my front hub is 32. I had to wait an extra week or so for them to make the jig but no extra charge, no minimums, no convincing required.

Beyond that I'm really impressed with the quality of the rims, how little attention (none) they've required since initial build, and how stiff the whole wheel/tire system feels. It's a strange thought having a 670g wheel be the most reliable part of a dirt jump bike, but that's how it is now.

Posted: Mar 18, 2020 at 17:52 Quote
My coworker had a set laced last year and it's been very good to him. They're not the lightest out there, but they're super competitive and I honestly think they're about as strong as anything in that weight range gets. Honestly wish we stocked them.

Posted: Mar 18, 2020 at 18:33 Quote
sherbet wrote:
Relevantly, this is also why they're one of very few companies that will offer custom spoke hole counts. CRS-One here got a set in 36h. They'll drill what you want!

Yeah, they're good dudes. I had a set a couple of years ago and they were happy to order some different spokes with an upcoming Sapim order and build to my specs. Real pleasure working with them.

Posted: Mar 18, 2020 at 19:04 Quote
badbadleroybrown wrote:
riish wrote:
Does anyone else have issues wearing out certain cassette cogs much quicker than others?

The 11-13-15t cogs on my cassettes (10spd) seem to be worn out and done way before the rest of the cassette. I think I'm pretty good with shifting cleanly and change chains when they reach the 0.75 mark on my tool, yet I usually end up replacing those small cogs halfway through the life of the whole cassette.
Are you spending equal or greater time in those cogs as compared to the others? Off hand, there's fewer teeth to spread the load over so if you spend relatively similar amount of time in each cog, I'd expect those with the fewest teeth to wear the most. Could also be that when you're in those cogs you're applying more power and pedaling harder putting more load onto those teeth. I tend to wear out like the lower middle 25% of cassettes first along with the granny gear, the smallest two or three will be ok, then the next two or three will be most worn, then the four or five are about on par with the smallest two or three and the granny gear will be worn. Always chalked it up to the gears I use most and then just dumping through the cassette to the granny when I have to climb.

In terms of ride time, I probably spend the most in the 28-36 and then use those smaller gears when riding back down, or sprinting. Definitely more load per pedal stroke going into those cogs.

Posted: Mar 18, 2020 at 19:18 Quote
crs-one wrote:
sherbet wrote:
R-M-R wrote:
All true points. One other detail: We Are One has nearly eliminated finishing work: pull the rims out of the molds, drill the holes, apply a decal, and they're good to go. Carbon products in low labour cost markets usually involve a lot of finishing work, which would be uneconomical here - and it's not a negligible cost elsewhere.

Relevantly, this is also why they're one of very few companies that will offer custom spoke hole counts. CRS-One here got a set in 36h. They'll drill what you want!

Even more ridiculous, I only got a single 36h since my front hub is 32. I had to wait an extra week or so for them to make the jig but no extra charge, no minimums, no convincing required.

Beyond that I'm really impressed with the quality of the rims, how little attention (none) they've required since initial build, and how stiff the whole wheel/tire system feels. It's a strange thought having a 670g wheel be the most reliable part of a dirt jump bike, but that's how it is now.

26” wheel?

Posted: Mar 18, 2020 at 19:38 Quote
R-M-R wrote:
iggzdaloc wrote:
A $1700 wheelset that lasts two rides is a joke.

Very disappointing, I agree, and it's not like other wheels haven't solved this issue. Still, maybe it's not fair dismiss the entire wheelset when it's just the - admittedly frustrating and unnecessary - issue of nipples backing off.

If you end up having to solve this yourself, which I acknowledge you shouldn't have to do, here are some steps:

1. Thin spokes
2. High tension
3. Grease between the nipples and rim
4. Locking nipples
5. Threadlocker (ex. Loctite)

Re: #4: I've seen some loosening problems, lately, with DT's ProLock nipples. Try Pillar's TG (Taper Grip) nipples.

This. It's also really worth building with a spoke holder to minimise wind up. Roval do a nice one for round spokes, although by the time you buy the tool you might be able to justify a bladed spoke upgrade and use any of the commonly available holders for those.


 
Copyright © 2000 - 2020. Pinkbike.com. All rights reserved.
dv65 0.019156
Mobile Version of Website