All Mountain and Enduro Fitness Thread

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All Mountain and Enduro Fitness Thread
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flag tom666
FL
Posted: Feb 2, 2018 at 7:39 Quote
For:
-People trying to improve or maintain riding fitness and conditioning for Enduro and All Mountain riding

Share:
- Your training format/split
- Your training techniques and exercise selection
- Any tools & apps you're using to aid your training
- Anything about what you're doing for diet
- Results

Ask:
- Questions about training formats/splits
- Questions about strength training
- Questions about tools & apps
- Questions about diet

Hopefully we can create a good thread here for sharing good information Salute
flag SileTzar
Posted: Feb 2, 2018 at 8:15 Quote
I don't have that much to share, I've started stronglifts 5x5 strength training and I'm hoping I'll have more power come spring.
Before that I tried following James Wilson's advice (bikejames.com) and although very helpful and mtb-oriented it wasn't for me - my kettlebell form or lack thereof was sure to get me injured.

Maybe it's placebo but I feel I'm more in control now that I have a bit more upper body strength coming from bench pressing, shoulder excersises and deadlifts. However, my conditioning over the winter has been terrible and I hate pedaling now more than ever. Squats don't really help when your typical climb is a 1hour+ grind.

My question is - do all you guys really eat that many bananas?
flag radatabs
FL
Posted: Feb 2, 2018 at 8:19 Quote
HIIT training for me as I would rather ride than train, I think a website ran this under the title the "Dirty 30"

Warm up for 10 minutes.
Perform an interval training set:
Push your effort as hard as you can go for 30 seconds.
Pedal easy for 60 seconds.
Repeat four times.
After the final interval, pedal easy for four minutes.
Repeat the entire sequence two more times for a total of three interval sets.
Cool down for five minutes.
flag tom666
FL
Posted: Feb 2, 2018 at 8:23 Quote
I'll talk a little bit about myself and my own training.

I study Sports Technology at Loughborough University in the UK. I take a lot of interest primarily in sports equipment but I'm also really interested in sports training and performance.

For a couple of years now I've been competing in powerlifting alongside riding. Between my course and a lot of my own research I'm pretty knowledgeable about strength training and should be able to answer most questions related to that.

I'm currently putting powerlifting on the back burner for a while and trying to improve my fitness and conditioning for riding. I'm currently in the process of ditching about 5kg of unwanted weight. I'm only eating about 3000 calories a day at the moment so the weight is coming off pretty fast (2kg in 3 weeks).

I'm structuring my training as follows for the next few weeks.

Monday: Strength day (squats, bench press, lat pull down)
Tuesday: Deadlifts, Watt Bike Sprints (HIIT), sled push
Wednesday: Upper body strength day + easy ride in the afternoon
Thursday: Squats, 20 minute watt bike ride
Friday: Rest
Weekend: At least one big day on the bike. Ideally two.

I appreciate that's far more strength training than most people will want to do or have need to do - but I'm trying to maintain some pretty decent strength.

I found my MMP (max minute power) and Peak Power recently using a Watt Bike. Having never really used a Watt Bike before I managed MMP 553W and PP 1304W. I'll be looking to retest those at the end of the training cycle and hoping to see some improvement.

When I'm at home over Easter I won't have access to the Watt Bike any more - but I will have access to loads more trails so I can ride my actual bike - which is better anyway. I think I'm going to experiment with strava during that time as I've never really used it.
flag cerebroside
O+
Posted: Feb 2, 2018 at 8:23 Quote
SileTzar wrote:
I don't have that much to share, I've started stronglifts 5x5 strength training and I'm hoping I'll have more power come spring.
Before that I tried following James Wilson's advice (bikejames.com) and although very helpful and mtb-oriented it wasn't for me - my kettlebell form or lack thereof was sure to get me injured.

Maybe it's placebo but I feel I'm more in control now that I have a bit more upper body strength coming from bench pressing, shoulder excersises and deadlifts. However, my conditioning over the winter has been terrible and I hate pedaling now more than ever. Squats don't really help when your typical climb is a 1hour+ grind.

My question is - do all you guys really eat that many bananas?

I did 5x5 and personally found it was too much to do at the same time as riding. Your legs are always going to feel dead the day after, which really impacted my riding. Got great strength gains though, really felt it when cranking up steep stuff.

That was a few years ago, doing the same sort of exercises but 3x10 now. Slower strength gain but better for my recovery. Probably not a technically perfect program, but IMHO the best program for you is the one that you actually do.
flag tom666
FL
Posted: Feb 2, 2018 at 8:26 Quote
SileTzar wrote:
I don't have that much to share, I've started stronglifts 5x5 strength training and I'm hoping I'll have more power come spring.
Before that I tried following James Wilson's advice (bikejames.com) and although very helpful and mtb-oriented it wasn't for me - my kettlebell form or lack thereof was sure to get me injured.

Maybe it's placebo but I feel I'm more in control now that I have a bit more upper body strength coming from bench pressing, shoulder excersises and deadlifts. However, my conditioning over the winter has been terrible and I hate pedaling now more than ever. Squats don't really help when your typical climb is a 1hour+ grind.

My question is - do all you guys really eat that many bananas?

Nice man. I think the 5x5 training will really pay off once you get back into riding again come spring. Once you have the lungs again to keep up with your legs the improvement should be clear - but there isn't enough similarity between a set of 5 squats a 1 hour climb for the improvement to be there right away.

radatabs wrote:
HIIT training for me as I would rather ride than train, I think a website ran this under the title the "Dirty 30"

Warm up for 10 minutes.
Perform an interval training set:
Push your effort as hard as you can go for 30 seconds.
Pedal easy for 60 seconds.
Repeat four times.
After the final interval, pedal easy for four minutes.
Repeat the entire sequence two more times for a total of three interval sets.
Cool down for five minutes.

That's really similar to what I do on Tuesdays. I don't go as long as 30 seconds yet because I'm not in that kind of shape lol I've been doing a 10 second effort every minute on the minute x6.

cerebroside wrote:

I did 5x5 and personally found it was too much to do at the same time as riding. Your legs are always going to feel dead the day after, which really impacted my riding. Got great strength gains though, really felt it when cranking up steep stuff.

That was a few years ago, doing the same sort of exercises but 3x10 now. Slower strength gain but better for my recovery. Probably not a technically perfect program, but IMHO the best program for you is the one that you actually do.

You will eventually adapt to the strength training and won't get the bad DOMS any more - but when you start it is really brutal and like you say - hard to balance with riding.

It's best for most people to have phases where they prioritise strength or riding fitness and put one on the backburner whilst they focus on the other. Strength training priority over winter, riding priority in summer is the most obvious one. Very, very hard to improve at both simultaneously long term.
flag cerebroside
O+
Posted: Feb 2, 2018 at 9:01 Quote
tom666 wrote:
You will eventually adapt to the strength training and won't get the bad DOMS any more - but when you start it is really brutal and like you say - hard to balance with riding.

It's best for most people to have phases where they prioritise strength or riding fitness and put one on the backburner whilst they focus on the other. Strength training priority over winter, riding priority in summer is the most obvious one. Very, very hard to improve at both simultaneously long term.

Yeah, that's the plan. When trying to gain weight during riding season I find it very difficult to eat enough (while maintaining macros). Strava seems to hugely underestimate calories burnt for mountain biking.

For cutting during riding, apparently pro athletes can maintain performance at a 100-200 cal deficit? Personally I don't have anywhere near that fine a control of my diet though.
flag tom666
FL
Posted: Feb 3, 2018 at 11:44 Quote
cerebroside wrote:

Yeah, that's the plan. When trying to gain weight during riding season I find it very difficult to eat enough (while maintaining macros). Strava seems to hugely underestimate calories burnt for mountain biking.

For cutting during riding, apparently pro athletes can maintain performance at a 100-200 cal deficit? Personally I don't have anywhere near that fine a control of my diet though.

I'm so beginner at cardio/watt bike atm I should be able to progress easily even though I'm in a calorie deficit and strength training too.

Tracking to within 100 or so calories is super hard to do. On a daily basis in fact it's nearly impossible. Your only hope is that over a long enough time the number of times you accidentally over vs under consume calories level out. It requires a tonne of consistency.
flag seppe80
Posted: Feb 3, 2018 at 12:09 Quote
I startet to do my strength and core training with a set of TRX straps.

Winter traning schedule:

Mon:
TRX program, quite hard, 35-40 minuts
Foam roll and stretch

Tue:
Home trainer (road bike, Zwift) - long ride with some climbs +50 km +500hm (last one was 900 hm) og a SST session (still +1,5h)
Light upper body trx

Wed:
TRX program, quite hard, 35-40 minuts
Foam roll and stretch

Thu:
Home trainer (road bike, Zwift) - Intervals. 4*5 / 3*10 / 2*15 ftp... differs, but mostly 4*5 min.
Light upper body trx

Fri:
rest day

Sat:
TRX program, quite hard, 35-40 minuts
Foam roll and stretch

Sun:
Trail ride or sometimes a DH session (enduro bike) but I always include som riding and climbing. Aim to get a 2-4 hour ride in. If the weather is to bad then I am on the home trainer.


I try to aim for these days, but sometimes move around to match reality.
When the days get longer I start to ride outside durring the week.

The TRX is very handy, easy to bring with you when you are not home.

For diet I always have som wieght to loose after christmas, I track with lifesum and it works ok... friday is cheat day Big Grin
In general protain heavy diet works well for me.
flag tom666
FL
Posted: Feb 3, 2018 at 12:19 Quote
I've only really used a TRX once or twice. Definitely good for hammering core and stabilising muscles which will have some good carryover to mtb.

And yeah, can't wait for it to be light later so I can ride my actual bike.
flag seppe80
Posted: Feb 3, 2018 at 12:36 Quote
tom666 wrote:
I've only really used a TRX once or twice. Definitely good for hammering core and stabilising muscles which will have some good carryover to mtb.

And yeah, can't wait for it to be light later so I can ride my actual bike.

Yeah I think it works very well, can feel the difference on the trails!
flag MattGreenwood
Posted: Feb 4, 2018 at 11:17 Quote
tom666 wrote:
I've only really used a TRX once or twice. Definitely good for hammering core and stabilising muscles which will have some good carryover to mtb.

And yeah, can't wait for it to be light later so I can ride my actual bike.
agreed. came back to uni and not managed to ride once. so sick of winter dude.
flag tom666
FL
Posted: Feb 4, 2018 at 11:31 Quote
MattGreenwood wrote:
tom666 wrote:
I've only really used a TRX once or twice. Definitely good for hammering core and stabilising muscles which will have some good carryover to mtb.

And yeah, can't wait for it to be light later so I can ride my actual bike.
agreed. came back to uni and not managed to ride once. so sick of winter dude.

I had 3 weeks with basically no riding Jail

Got a nice little run of weekends at the moment though. Cannock XC last week, Warncliffe Woods and Grenoside yesterday, Uplift at Revolution Bike Park this Saturday and Uplift at Bringewood Sunday. Then weekend after that I'm home so we'll either go Tidworth, Windhill or Peaslake.

So I'm pretty stoked on all of that - but it has been shit - and still no rides midweek because it's dark and there's no trails near here.
flag cerebroside
O+
Posted: Feb 4, 2018 at 12:08 Quote
Definitely buy a trainer or rollers if you don't have them, best thing I ever did for my biking fitness. Love my Elite Arione Mag over the winter. I use an old wheelset with slicks and have it set up with a monitor so I can just watch cycling videos. Makes it easy to do an hour whenever you want.
flag bdog325
Posted: Feb 4, 2018 at 18:42 Quote
For those wanting to add in a strength program I would recommend Wendlers 5/3/1 and do minimal assistance exercises and use biking as the assistance exercise. The reason for this program is that the idea is to progress slowly in order to prevent injury and to focus on long term goals rather than short term goals. I find you can double up on exercises such as squats and bench one day and deadlifts and ohp the next day then doing conditioning or going biking the other days.

I would recommend one or two sets of overhead walking lunges every day/session. Great for balance, strength, and stability.
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