Ph17ip

Boring stats on motorcycle crashes place chin bar area to 15-20% of all impacts: https://riders.drivemag.com/news/helmet-crash-statistics-why-an-open-face-can-be-fatal/ Had a chance to test this myself in a light, slowish otb: knockout, small chin laceration, ambulance called by bystanders. Not fun. Wearing light full face ever since. Henry's argument that slow steep tech does not call for a full face for him, reminds me of an opinion of drivers resisting seatbelts in slow speed city limits: "I'll just use my arms to push against the steering wheel".

Extra loud Cicadas go with the Metal nicely. Jack's riding - generation defining style. Can watch this on repeat.

@dinosaurmonkey: VPace.de mini flat pedals, light CF bar, light padded CF seat. CF pieces from EC90 on Aliexpress cost next to nothing with reasonable quality. I have shared our weight savings details in this thread. Have a look.

@dinosaurmonkey: Yes, I saw that SDG has a line of nice kids-sized components, however 300gm+ weight penalty on the pedals+seat+bar combo stopped me.

Great details. I think I just found a few likeminded people here. Manitou suspension and other grom components are amazing. We went with Vpace 135 cranks on Fluid 24 - amazing and huge weight saving along with BB (see my post above). Agree on drive train - we went with 28 ring and 11-42 cassette and even 7 y.o. can climb techie stuff. Number of gears not as important (10 is plenty), range is. They do not need 50 plate. Norco's trans-X light action dropper works well from 22-23kg. not sure if you can get it aftermarket, must be way cheaper than KS options. Agree on bars - went with the thinnest lock-ons for the 10 y.o. and 7 y.o. has a bar tape instead of grips on standard bar. Agree on brakes - we went with Deore on Fluid and Vpace comes with Maguras.

@bleedingroastie: We bought Fluid FS 2 24. Wheels+Tyres+Tubeless is a must change. I'd say the rest is optional. Shorter cranks were also important for us. 1. Wheelset - Stan's crest rims with Bitex hubs -700gm 2. Tubeless+DHF/DHR tyres (we had Veetyre stock) -400gm. Lighter Recon will save another 200gm if big knobs are not required yet. 3. Cranks+BB - 135mm cranks and BB from VPace.de -380gm 4. Brakes – swapped basic tektro to deore -100gm, rotors – swapped to Ashima -100gm (7y.o. can use single finger) 5. Derailleur – XT instead of deore – 50gm (smashed original deore) 6. Seat – swapped to small ec90 padded carbon (Aliexpress) -150gm 7. Handlebar – oclv carbon (Aliexpress) -140gm 8. Grips - Controltech Testy Lock-On Grips – no weight saving, but these are the thinnest lock-ons. 9. Pedals – Vpace.de -80gm 10. Fork upgrade (to Expert Air) -60gm. Over 2kg saved. Big difference for a 20-35kg person. Total budget close to Fluid FS 1 24 with better components and fit all around and 2kg lighter. Amazing bike, real enabler.

@fabwizard: We have VPace Max24 in the family for 2 years now. Couldn't order Moritz 2.0 despite begging - limited release, posting EU only etc. Norco Fluid's geo and suspension is unbeatable for 25 - 35kg person.

Not light, judging by the specs. Add a dropper (must) and you will be around 14kg tubeless. GX+NX in the drivetrain inc BB - there is extra 500-600gm hiding; Chromag 32 spoke Alu wheels with burly hubs - extra 600gm vs lighter Alu or carbon build. Handle bar - CF will save 150gm, lighter seat - another100gm, lighter rotors -150gm. This is from experience of getting Norco's Fluid 24 down to 11.5kg from 13.5kg.

How cool it would be to swap to "alloy dummy motor with a standard bottom bracket" and drop the battery to turn your e-bike to a lighter version when you want. Feel good on the day or going for a shuttle assisted / bike-park week-end - drop the weight. Adjust suspension a bit and you've got a second bike. Now, who do I lobby to produce this aftermarket? Let's start with Shimano e8000/ep8.