Trek Remedy 9 29 - Review
TESTED
Trek
Remedy 9 29
Remedy 9 29
WORDS Mike Levy
PHOTOS Amy McDermid
Trek's Remedy lineup has long been one of our favourite do-it-all platforms, with the design seeing an evolutionary process over the years that saw things like ISCG tabs and the clever FOX DRCV Float shock added to keep the bike competitive throughout that time. The 2014 model year underwent a major shift in design, though, in the shape of 29'' wheels and an entirely new aluminum frame, changes that essentially created a completely new machine that only shares the original bike's name and, hopefully, its spirit. Sure, there is slightly less travel, with 140mm on offer (the 26'' versions have always run 150mm), but the suspension layout retains a very similar appearance, with Trek's ABP, Full Floater, and DRCV shock technology utilized. But does this new bike still preserve the 26'' version's versatile personality, or have the bigger wheels tamed some of zest that was easy to find aboard the previous iterations? We're in a somewhat unique position in that we have spent considerable amounts of time on every version of the Remedy before it, riding everything from lift accessed bike park trails to IMBA epics on a regular basis, allowing us to find out if the $4,729.99 USD Remedy 9 29 is a step in the right direction.
Remedy 9 29 Details
• Intended use: all-mountain/enduro
• Rear wheel travel: 140mm
• Wheel size: 29''
• Aluminum frame
• ABP and Full Floater suspension
• FOX DRCV CTD shock
• ISCG chain guide tabs
• Internal dropper post and derailleur routing
• E2 tapered head tube
• 'Mino Link' adjustable geometry
• Weight: 30.7LB
• MSRP: $4,729.99 USD
Frame Details
The Remedy 9 29 is assembled around the same aluminum frame that Trek uses for the other two 29"-wheeled Remedy models, and it is much curvier than what we've seen of previous versions of the bike. An "S" shaped down tube allows for both front wheel and suspension clearance, and it meets the top tube a good eight inches back from the bike's E2 tapered head tube. There is plenty of stand over clearance thanks to the downward slope of the top tube, and a short section supports the seat tube. The bike's seat tube curves at the rocker arm pivot, meaning that a standard seat post might not lower enough for some riders, although this isn't an issue with the Reverb Stealth seat post that the bike comes stock with (not many will use this bike without a dropper post anyways, will they?)
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 Trek uses their E2 tapered head tube up front (left), and the frame features internal cable routing for both the front and rear shift lines (middle). Although usually reserved for carbon frames, the Remedy sports some serious down tube protection to avoid dents caused by flying rocks |
Cable routing is a mix of internal and external, with the shift housing being run through both the down tube and the drive side chain stay for the rear derailleur, and within the top tube and out for the front. The rear brake line is external from front to back, which makes sense as not many riders actually enjoy removing a brake line and performing a bleed, and the Reverb Stealth's line is run along the top side of the down tube until it enters the frame just above the bottom bracket junction and ISCG chain guide tabs. The result isn't the absolute cleanest, but it is also far from looking cluttered.
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| The Remedy 29 platform sports 140mm of travel, 10mm less than the 26''-wheeled version, although the layout remains unchanged. |
The Tech
• ABP Convert: Trek has been using their Active Braking Pivot on the Remedy for many seasons now, and the 2014 Remedy 29 employs their latest ABP Convert system. The design allows the dropout pivot to rotate concentrically around the rear axle, limiting the amount of rotation between the caliper and rotor, which Trek says helps to keep the suspension working better regardless of if the rider is on the brakes. The 'Convert' signifies that the pivot hardware is easily interchangeable to allow for both 12 x 142mm axles and standard 135mm quick release rear wheels.
• Full Floater: Attaching the bike's FOX DRCV CTD shock to an extension off the front of the chain stays rather than a fixed position on the front triangle isn't a new concept, but it is one that Trek has employed for a number of years on everything from their Session downhill race machine to the shorter travel Fuel trail bike. Trek says that doing so allows the shock to ''better respond to bumps across a wide variety of terrain,'' which
is a simple way of saying that the arrangement gives them more opportunity to tune how the shock performs throughout its stroke by altering the leverage from both ends. They aren't the first to employ such a layout, but they have used it for a number of years on most of their high-end full suspension bikes, which should mean that they have been able to tune it exactly to their liking. • ABP Convert: Trek has been using their Active Braking Pivot on the Remedy for many seasons now, and the 2014 Remedy 29 employs their latest ABP Convert system. The design allows the dropout pivot to rotate concentrically around the rear axle, limiting the amount of rotation between the caliper and rotor, which Trek says helps to keep the suspension working better regardless of if the rider is on the brakes. The 'Convert' signifies that the pivot hardware is easily interchangeable to allow for both 12 x 142mm axles and standard 135mm quick release rear wheels.
• Full Floater: Attaching the bike's FOX DRCV CTD shock to an extension off the front of the chain stays rather than a fixed position on the front triangle isn't a new concept, but it is one that Trek has employed for a number of years on everything from their Session downhill race machine to the shorter travel Fuel trail bike. Trek says that doing so allows the shock to ''better respond to bumps across a wide variety of terrain,'' which
• DRCV: Trek's proprietary rear shock technology, developed with the help of FOX. The 'DR' stands for Dual Rate, with the shock's two different air chambers providing two different rates depending on where the shock is at in its stroke. Connecting the two chambers is a plunger, or valve, that opens the airway between the two at a predetermined point in the travel. The plunger is referred to as the control valve, or the 'CV' in DRCV. The goal is to be able to have your cake and eat it too, by having a lively but firm spring to push against that is provided by the main chamber while also benefiting from the secondary chamber's ability to add a more linear and forgiving end to the stroke.
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Riding the
Remedy
Remedy
 | More supple and active off the top than any air-sprung, 140mm travel bike has a right to be, the DRCV shock did a great job of both helping the rear tire dig for traction and muting a lot of the otherwise teeth rattling chatter. And although the bike has 10mm less travel, it actually felt more forgiving than the 150mm travel 26" version that came before it, proving that it isn't the amount, but both the quality of the travel and the overall package that counts. |
Climbing/acceleration: Ask the average mountain biker what his thoughts on 29ers are and most will likely mention something about them making tricky climbs easier, even if they are dead set against the idea of a big wheeler. This much is fact, especially when talking about the Remedy 9 29, although not in the way that 29ers usually excel on climbs. While the chrome bike can hold its own on slow, technical pitches (more on that later), it is how the bike can literally be thrown at the steepest of walls and manage to pull it off. There isn't much strategy required, and both bad form and bad lines couldn't keep the bike from cresting some rather sketchy bits of trail, the kind where you are just a little worried about falling backwards into the abyss if you were to stall out. Stretches of proper technical trail required a different approach, with the bike feeling a bit long when the speeds dropped and tight corners needed to be navigated, and although the Remedy 9 29 isn't a handful in such situations, it does take a committed rider to steer the bike up a climb that requires some real technical skill. Thankfully, while the bike's wheels felt quite far apart in these moments, its steering has enough sharpness to get it past most anything so long as you have the dedication to see it through, with dedication being the key word in that sentence. Get lazy and you could find yourself running out of real estate quicker than you expected, but steer with conviction, stay on the gas, and you'll move forward and upwards. This fact is aided by the bike's sticky Bontrager 29-4 Team Issue tires that, while not being a popular brand with riders who aren't in the know, do provide quite a bit of all-around traction. The bike's rear suspension proved to be quite active, cycling gently under load enough for us to flip the FOX shock's CTD lever to the 'Trail' setting anytime we felt like getting on the gas seriously, but there was still enough suspension action in this firmed up mode to provide plenty of comfort and traction when we could benefit from it.
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| While it can sometimes feel as if short, vertical walls aren't anything but a speed bump for the Remedy, carrying speed and planning key moves ahead of time is necessary in order to scale extended technical sections. |
The Remedy 9 29 rides heavier than its 30 pound weight would suggest, which is the bike's biggest drawback when talking about climbing, and extended climbs were just that much less exciting aboard the bike. That's not to say that it is a bad climber, as it has some serious "I can get up that!" gusto that honestly surprised both us and onlookers, but it also just didn't feel as spry as we would like to see. With this in mind, our first upgrade would likely be a set of lightweight tires - terrain permitting - and a set of über-light 29er wheels. Shaving some weight from both would go a long way to adding some vigor to its ride. Our other complaint centers on how we sometimes brushed our knee on the right side shift cable housing when out of the saddle. It looks like the entry port for its internal routing sits quite far back from the head tube, likely the cause of the issue - not deal breaking, but it could be annoying.
Downhill: The Remedy's suspension and calm handling make it one of the best descending 29ers that we've ridden to date, and although the 140mm travel bike is far from being a park machine, we happily spent a few days in the Whistler Bike Park on it instead of grabbing a true downhill rig. That lift accessed riding accelerated our appreciation for just how dialled the Remedy's rear suspension actually is, a fact that can sometimes get a bit lost in the acronyms and marketing-speak that goes along with the design. More supple and active off the top than any air-sprung, 140mm travel bike has a right to be, the DRCV shock did a great job of both helping the rear tire dig for traction and muting a lot of the otherwise teeth rattling chatter. And although the bike has 10mm less travel, it actually felt more forgiving than the 150mm travel 26" version that came before it, proving that it isn't the amount, but both the quality of the travel and the overall package that counts. Of course, the larger wheels also factor in with how the first third of the 9 29's travel is a bit more tolerant of the terrain under it than its predecessor. With 140mm of travel and such a relatively supple early stroke, it wouldn't be out of line to expect the bike to struggle at the opposite end of its travel. This wasn't the case, though, with enough ramp up to keep us from coming to the end of FOX shock's stroke too abruptly.
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| The Remedy loves to corner, and the bike will reward commitment with more and more traction thanks to its great Bontrager 29-4 Team Issue tires and compliant suspension. |
| Complementing the bike's suspension is its equally impressive handling, with a stable personality that feels as if it has your back when it comes to covering up your mistimed moves and bad form. |
Ramping up the speed and aggression does little to make the silver bike jittery, an uncommon trait among bikes in its wheel size/travel class, and we have to say that we don't remember really attacking a trail on a 29er like we found ourselves doing frequently on the Remedy. No, the bike is not as agile as a 26"-wheeled machine of equal travel, and it did take a bit more effort to throw around, but the tradeoff is awe-inspiring calmness in the heat of battle. That is often the compromise, though, and an expert level rider will likely be able to swing a leg over the Remedy and have no troubles snapping it sideways or pumping the ground for speed.
That lack of nimbleness is the bike's only true drawback when gravity takes over, making for a bit of a laboured ride on machine-made trails that seem to be replacing good old fashioned natural terrain these days. And without a knotted mess of roots or ledgey rocks that would allow the bike's terrific suspension do its job, the Remedy is left to make its way down the trail like a child forced to colour within the lines. That's a bit of a shame, because we all know that letting it hang out is much more fun than taking the route well traveled. Maybe the issue boils down to the trails, not the bike? A discussion for another time, perhaps. We also couldn't seem to eliminate a faint clunk that emanated from the back of the bike when the brakes were first applied after pedalling, presumable from the ABP pivot hardware, although removing and re-installing all four pieces didn't put an end to it.
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| Roll or huck to flat? It's your call when aboard the Remedy, not an overly common thing to say about a 140mm travel bike. |
Component Report
• Last season may have been an off-year for FOX, but they are back in 2014 with drastically improved suspension forks that both stay high in their travel and offer a good amount of small bump compliance. Gone is the wallowy and unsupportive feel of the '13 CTD FIT damper, and with it the excessively high air pressures that it required. The 34 Float CTD on the front of the Remedy 9 29 didn't give us a single reason to complain, with both enough ramp-up from the air spring and support from the revised damper to keep us happy regardless of how steep or hairy the terrain became. It is a bit of a shame that it took a year to get there but FOX listened and responded to rider feedback.
• The bike is spec'd with a RockShox Reverb Stealth dropper post and a set of Shimano's XT brakes, two of our favourite components. Unfortunately, the two in combination doesn't result in a user friendly setup, with the brake's reservoir preventing the Reverb's remote button from being positioned anywhere near where we'd like it - the angle is all wrong, making it difficult to depress the button, and no amount of fiddling resulted in a better setup.
• Yet again, Shimano's XT drivetrain was flawless and quiet throughout the test, not giving us a single reason to complain. And although a fit rider might prefer a single ring setup, the bike's 38/24 tooth chain ring combo makes a lot of sense for real-world riders who plan to put in some serious miles.
• The Bontrager name may not carry the same panache as Maxxis or Schwalbe, but the bottom line is that they make some damn good tires. Our bike came equipped with their new 29-4 Team Issue tubeless ready rubber, not the XR3 tires that come stock, and they performed consistently, with no hiccups that would have eroded our confidence, nor any flats during our time on the bike. They also seated quickly and easily (they came set up tubeless) on the Rhythm Elite tubeless ready wheelset, a good thing given both components' "tubeless ready" designation.
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| Some of the best brakes and a great dropper post, although they don't play nice together on the handlebar (left). Trek can sometimes take heat for spec'ing their in-house Bontrager brand, but there is no denying that their 29-4 Team Issue tires (center) work well regardless of the name on their sidewalls, and the same can be said of the bike's Bontrager Evoke 2 seat. |
Pinkbike's take:
| How does the 2014 Remedy 9 29 compare to the previous 26"-wheeled version? It's pretty simple: given the choice, we would reach for the bike with the bigger wheels for every occasion. And yes, that includes technical "am I going to ride this out?" sort of moves. The new bike is very clearly more forgiving, despite sporting 10mm less travel all around, and its bigger wheels offer more traction, a potent combination. Yes, it has lost some of its lively temperament with the wheel size switch, but the 650B version that was recently announced might just be the ticket in that regards.- Mike Levy |
www.trekbikes.com
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272 Comments
The most interesting thing about this entire ordeal is this:
Anyone notice who cares about wheel sizes and who doesn't? Those who ride 650b or 29" bikes don't care what wheel size you ride. They just want to ride what they want to ride and if you ride 26" wheels they say "come on, grab your bike, let's go ride!" Those who cling to their 26" wheels as if it's a life or death choice will tell you and your different wheel sizes to get the f*ck away from them and stay off their trails. They claim they just want to have fun, but all they do is bitch about what wheels someone is using. I don't see people who ride other wheel sizes acting like this (though on occasion some people do, let's be honest), and this whole thing is ridiculous.
The same thing happened when Carbon came out. People called it a scam, marketing hype, etc...etc...etc... Then people got over it. People will get over this too, because we all have to grow up some day.
I don't always comment on pinkbike posts.......
But when I do, I write a novel.
"Those who ride 650b or 29" bikes don't care what wheel size you ride" - what? Man you have some awesome peers then! You know how it looks like in most cases? "Owners of 650b and 29ers is like vegans or feminists - Wondering if it's one of them? - don't ask, they'll tell you!" Sure die hard 26ers it's the same, going with that "26 for life" or "MTB is only 26inch" bullshit. But the group truly not concerned about certain bike trends is very small. But again, maybe you live in some chilled-out heaven full of grown-ups. Or happy but poor people, who don't buy stuff too often, so they have nothing of new stuff to comment on. I am yet to find an individual who bought a recent bike and hasn't told about it to his friends. Or friends who haven't asked a lot about their buddys brand new bike. And guess what's really new on latest bikes? Make no mistake, I do like 29ers, and liked them before majority... grew up
In Evolution there are steps forward just like there are sidesteps which either grow or die, and it takes some years to say which ones are which. I see no unicorns around...
Yes, I do have awesome friends. Because I choose not to associate myself with childish jerks who think a wheel size defines your sexuality.
If WAKI for example, said instead of "Are you riding 26" bikes like those immigrants" ...which is already at -10 prop and dropping... said something like mel gibson's anti-semetic rant fest 9 years ago (its been that long and people still hate him for it), then I'm sure a mod would step in to delete the comments lest they offend people of that religious persuasion. People on the internet often forget, that free speech as afforded by some constitutions and charters, doesn't apply on privately owned web forums. You only have the rights given to you in user agreements when you post on sites like pinkbike, mtbr, retrobike, etc.
www.pinkbike.com/about/legal/#terms-of-use
www.pinkbike.com/about/faq
(note the bit below I put the stars before and after)
My account got suspended; why did this happen?
We try to keep Pinkbike.com a family friendly website. Any user that disobeys the guidelines will be warned, or suspended. At Pinkbike.com we don't believe in first time bans; we will, however, suspend users at our own discretion. Why do people get suspended? Suspensions happen if a user is uploading inappropriate photos or videos, directly attacking any user, or ***** directly attacking our website. ***** If a user has been suspended multiple times, we reserve the right to ban the user.
Big wheels are fun, really, to ride and to write about... uhh, such a shame because this Remedy looks like a really good bike and article is well written. Sorry Mike for screwing it up... in the beginning I tried everything possible to provide balanced point of view but how... what a mess
As to followers/following, I tend to hit ignore when I get new followers, and only follow site mods/editors/owners when they start following me and people I actually know locally.
here is my review from 3 bikes i rode this year.
terrian: double black AM with steep chutes - big rocks/roots - some tight corners
SC tallboy - Good on the rock chutes - shit on the corners. more rolls than jumps through the chutes. bike tended to take over and quick maneuvers not easy but a lot of time not necessary. When not in proper gear on climbing almost impossible to get it started again but once moving kept momentum. Also damaged a rim on the first time out but that maybe a fluke.
Rocky mountain Altitude: Not a lot of difference with the 26er. or maybe just a slight difference on the ground. noticed if you took off funny hard to correct in the air. not as responsive as i would like but not a horrible bike.
Yeti SB66 - this is one of the nicest bike i have ever been on. quick in the corners - climbed like a goat and so snappy. if you wanted to move the bike to avoid something on the trail like a sharp rock just a slight weight shift took care of it. Can pick the bike of the ground at a fraction of a seconds notice. responsive and feels like you and the bike are sharing a common goal. so well balanced you dont seem to be fighting the bike to pick a new line on the fly.
"It's pretty simple: Given the choice, we would reach for the big fat cheque Trek wrote us to say the 29er is better so they can start phasing out the 26er next year."
I didn't think I'd join the crowd of neophobes but I'm done with all this industry garbage.
More choice is always better. I would not be mountain biking today if 26" was all that existed.
I will tell you my friend, that two years ago it was hard enough to choose a bloody bike rim or tyre on CRC. Now it is double as bad. Go ahead and try to buy a quality second hand fork fitting your frame and wheelset. Ok, let's assume that a person having straight 1,1/8 tube and 20mm hub wants to buy such fork. He should but Hope hub, frame with tapered tube or go fk himself ins't it? Time is money is a great thought...
I ride 26 but have to admit this looks and sounds like a good bike, with the exception of the pivot clunk. No unreliable avid brakes and it looks to me like no BB30? If so good move by Trek. Not too heavy, not ridiculously expensive, and I really like the color and toned-down graphics.
I just hope hoops and good tires will be available aftermarket for 26"
@headshot yes. Had three 26" bikes, the only one I still ride was made in 1996 and I ride about once a month.
gurukalehuru.files.wordpress.com/2013/04/on-the-internet.jpg?w=500
Four or five years ago I talked plenty of shit about 29ers, but I'm now eating humble pie. A lot has changed in that time, and most of the current 29ers are legitimate contenders. There are some great 26" bikes out there right now, but limiting yourself to only those because of a conspiracy theory means that you're only missing out.
deeeight - what exactly makes you think that this pic you linked isn't about you? I think you post large enough volumes of negative stuff to qualify for the established member of the pack you frequently btch on...
if 26" is so crappy stop justifying your existence by it!.
I love Pinkbike.
marketing : we'll just say its better this way..
me : this is just an fuel ex9 now with 29"wheels..
@protour, the us government was behind 9/11
How can they not admire and love us?!
there were no terrorists.. even better there is NO ONE who can say they lost a relative on one of the planes.. the towers were rigged weeks before.. sorry but they were..
and building 7 was taken down by gnomes okay... even polls show that more than 50% of the US population doesnt believe this BS anymore and lets say 90% of europe..
waki .. you're losing it.. get a grip man..
but lets get back to the new fuel ex.. ow ehh remedy..
BUT... the towers were not rigged with explosives ahead of time, there were passengers on those four planes, and nearly 4000 people did die in the attacks, including 20 of 21 hijackers. That the towers fell the way they did was exactly to be expected given their construction method and the fact that there was a documentary done after the 1993 bombing that DETAILED all the previously not publically known features and flaws of the design. The documentary was basically a a tell all of why the truck bomb underneath wouldn't have worked even if it had been much much larger, and what would be needed to actually collapse the buildings.
strange thing is that in europe they said the passengers took over the supposed hijackers. (plane that crashed in the field) . but the crash site was clean of debris of a plane.,.. as well as the pentagon plane..
but to make one thing clear.. building 7 were the gnomes right ?
cause they also cut the support beams of the towers at a 45degree angle.. O_o
Quite often those who intensely seek truth and enlightement are more deluded than those who live in ignorance
there are no theories anymore.. its all been proven or admitted...
in a decade or 2 .. documents will be realesed with this info.. as always.. as so with previous events..
anyone remenber the acusation of chemical weapons used in Iraq ? by the us ... denied.. later on confirmed.. much later.. admitted..
it is sad that you sheeple just follow and swallow.. but we are having a good laugh here in europe.. well most of us peeps that is..
yeah.. the planes did hit the towers.. but they were not boarded by any terrorists..
drones dont need pilots do they ?? think about it.. and dont believe everything fox news tells you ,..
what happened.. happened to make you react like that.. go Iraq ! Go afganistan.. and now.. go syria ?
So, I assume that you were so close to these planes that you saw guys with turbans?
Or have you been looking through a telescope?
a jab to try to hurt me mentally > futile..
admitting how shallow you really are.. > never go full retard !
and i am shocked how bad your education is over there.. but not surprised..
Hurting you mentally > I'm not the first person to that party, conspiracy boy.
I'm not shallow, just smarter than you.
As for my education, I know more about your history than you do, apparently. And I must have done something right because I'm smart enough to have a job that allows me to afford any of the bikes reviewed here, without breaking a sweat (here I go being shallow again). Excuse me now while I go bathe in some of that foreign oil we're kicking ass for, and you're over-paying for.
You really don't believe that there were no plane parts in PA or at the Pentagon, right?
You also realize that the support beams that were cut tiwth torches during cleanup don't represent soemthing that happened during the collapse of the towers, right?
If you are going to use examples to support your theories, you should make sure that they aren't thoroughly debunked.
www.google.com/search?q=plane+parts+pentagon&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=CC0vUp3HOKacigLFooHwBg&ved=0CAkQ_AUoAQ&biw=1600&bih=732
www.google.com/search?q=wtc+beam+cut+thermic+lance&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=dC0vUpLCFumciALs2oCABQ&ved=0CAcQ_AUoAQ&biw=1600&bih=732
Lets all just calm down a little bit and eat something.
But if the Cheney thing did happen.. heard of it ... but still it weren't just the planes that did it. ..it's still another false flag operation..
And slowdown.. YOU really amazed me with that last comment..
I truly did not know
It could get so low.
. ...Lucky for the USA status.. i know some good ones are out there....
goddammit "boy"
i know you are too young now to take interest in the world or the news.. but if your parents will raise you right ,,. you will in a few years :salute;
www.youtube.com/watch?v=NX_UKdqoa_o
US tried to achieve domination in the Middle East in many ways, supporting Saddam, scaring Saddam, attacking Saddam with military,on few occasions. Yes 9/11 was an excuse to invade Iraq, but that's the end of story. How can you fabricate such thing and leave no obvious traces in the era of internet? How can absolute idiots like Bush administration fabricate anything more than that about weapons of mass destruction in Iraq which non-existence was later admitted by US government itself.
If you can't get that, then stop calling yourself smart, not delusional and educated, because you focus on stupid details from few loonie sites who live off such useless theories and would write about any other irrational crap if this didn't came along. And realize your Euro irrelevance, cuz of all "powers" we are the smallest, the most we can do is to be annoying to the big guns by barking "eco!" "eco!" Just stop thinking that you are any better than anyone. You make yourself a piece of sht by saying all that crap about others. Put yourself into a situation of a person living in almost any place in Africa and tell him that US are basterds and hipocrites... Which other group of countries if not Europe lives off from civil wars involving atrosities by which Nazi holocaust looks equal or smaller?
Now google for Carl Sagan - Pale Blue Dot...
I am out..
And now back to our regularly scheduled programming. DAE 29ers suck?
That said, geometries of 29rs have vastly improved over initial offerings. And i would encourage folks to really spend some dedicated 3-6months on a 29r or 27.5" before passing judgement. You may surprise yourself.
I am personally biased towards 27.5, being that i've been riding a Bronson C since May. I'm pretty sold, it retains that roll-y momentum feel of 29rs but feels like a 26" in the air or being thrown around. I am betting that SantaCruz will be offering a 27.5 V10C in 2014 or 2015, at which point I will be selling my current gen2 V10C
You can still buy 27" road wheels and tyres. Anyone who thinks 26" will disappear overnight if one or two brands phase them out is mad.
So yes, the industry is trying to stuff it down our throats, pb beeing part of the sales machinery tried to capitalize on it. Now the fun part - PB turns into a premier downhill oriented site with a very vocal majority of gravityriders. Are ML and RC up to it?
Bikebuying: Do you really want to try to outspend a swiss? Come on ;-)
As for underbuilt 29 and 650b - my riding profile is 1200km or more of really rough alpine downhill per year and some sweet west coast runs. I ride handmade US 26 big bikes with select standard parts, some cheap, some not so. Nothing else survives, chinese frames with cartwheels and puny bearings are doa.
Deeight you are not part of the debate, the industry is dictatorial - this is not a debate - and you already lost because you refuse to turn on your brain. As for the majority - millions of flys cant err..sh.t tastes. You are a shill and do me a favor, drink the coolaid.
@Sontator.... want to know something the industry follows more... how many posts people put up for either selling 650B stuff, or talking about actually BUYING 650B stuff. Right now there's some 650B stuff for sale on pinkbike... a year ago it was just people posting things for doing conversions (forks and frames that had the needed tire clearance, wheels, tires)... now its that plus some folks selling the parts that came OEM on 650B bikes...which means to have those things, they had to have bought them new...recently...and are already spending money on upgrades...which means aftermarket 650B sales.
Kirk Pacenti had this notion that the industry (and Kirk was a frame builder before he became the 650B godfather) as a whole (manufacturers and consumers) needed something IN BETWEEN 26ers and 29ers. While 26ers still appealed to the suspension travel and trick/stunt type riders (ie, more travel, bigger air, etc) and 29ers was on its way to cementing itself in XC riding and racing (which really is what the majority of riders do world wide, because most large population centers are not in places with mountains or chair lift accessed trails). So he spent his own money and time convincing Panaracer to modify one of their existing tire designs (the Rampage) and make new molds to produce tires which he paid for in a new (to modern MTBs) wheelsize that was actually an old wheel size, but one that was also seeing a resurgence in popularity in the USA in custom made touring bikes at the time. The existing bead size matched to a 2.3" width tire gave a nominal diameter of 27.5". So in between in WORDS anyway to what people thought of as the two wheel sizes of mountain bikes. Something that had some of the benefits of both but less of the drawbacks of either. Goldilocks and the three bears sorta stuff...and he was right.
And after he built a frame & rigid fork and got Velocity to provide him some rims he went to the north american hand built bike show and displayed his creation... and people paid attention.... magazine writers for Dirt Rag and Velo News and the bible of the industry, Bicycle Retailer magazine. Also other frame builders. And pretty soon people got talking on mtbr about the new alternative wheel size. That's where I learned about it in late 2007. At the time there was no suspension fork makers supporting it yet but White brothers were talking about making a fork, and no frame builders either yet, but we had tires we could order from Kirk Pacenti and Velocity USA offered rims, including making the then new model the Blunt, available in it. And that's how I, and thousands of others got started.... order rims, order tires, and then set about seeing what we could convert.
And conversions are what drove brands like KHS and Haro and Jamis to step up to offering production bikes and order suspension forks be made for them. If a thousand riders are talking about and posting up frames/forks they KNOW fit the tires... that means there's thousands who would likely buy a bike at a store that was complete and ready to go. And from those sales came more sales. And then other brands started experimenting. Scott USA had riders on them like Nino Schurter because they weren't of the stature to comfortably fit 29ers but yet fit 26ers great but wanted more roll-over ability like 29ers but still with good agility as a compromise. Nino was on one of those prototype carbon scale 650Bs when he won the first XC world cup in South Africa last year... 3 days later Kirk Pacenti received orders for 1500 rims. That means a WHOLE lot of racers and riders suddenlly were going to be converting and building prototypes to try out over the rest of the race season.
Look through your favourite brands 2014 catalogs... Rocky Mountain is MY favourite brand.... they have been for 21 years. And for 2014, the Element 26ers are GONE. Except for the flatline, slayer, flow, and ONE entry level hardtail, the entire lineup is 650B and 29ers. And I don't have any problems with that.
Racing results ? Ok 29ers were dominating XC racing until 650Bs came along. We have back to back world cup titles and world championshipsfor Nino Schurter for men's xc, and now for women's xc also (ok last year she was on a 26er at least until the Olympics but this year its been all 650B).
We have various big names in gravity using 650B for Enduro, and some wins here and there... former world champions developing bikes in the size for brands (Nico for Lapierre for example) and professing their love for it, which you can take with a grain of salt since they're being paid to do this work. We now have the US Pro Gravity tour 2013 title and the 3rd place in the series belonging to KHS-650B riders... at the worlds, until they crashed, Stevie Smith and Mitch (forget his last name right now) had posted the FASTEST times and speeds on 650B and 29ers in the downhill event.
When/what becomes enough proof for people ?
I enjoy reading these threads most of the times- but some of these responses are so long-winded. Geez.
FTR: I have owned 3 26" Remedies. Favorite bike ever. This year purchased a Remedy29- that is now for sale. I liked it waaaaaaay more than I thought I would. If I weren't in school, I would certainly keep it. Next year: 650b Remedy. I will be done and living in Durango, so I feel that bike will be the ONE, until the next one.
Bigger wheels will work better for some, but why would we want to try being unhappy on a bike when we are currently happy?
1. Yes, I voted with my wallet last year.
2. I live near the repack tail, I need a bike for mountains.
3. I don't care about fastest times, since I can't max out my current bike.
4. I want a bike that turns quickly and easily.
5. I don't feel that extra weight for the sake of bigger wheels is a huge advantage.
In all reality, bigger wheels would make me a worse rider. I approach corners too hot ( too fast) and need a bike that can help me work on this part of riding.
I've got nothing against 29ers or 650b... it's all horses for courses, and IMHO waaay more about the rider than wheel size. I'm sure the top Enduro guys will all gladly rip just as hard on their new 650b kit next year, but nothing at all has been proven yet in regard to the claimed inferiority of 26". No manufacturer wants to be perceived as being behind the curve, so we may never really know beyond what this season has already shown us: 26" is perfectly capable of hanging with, and more often than not, beating the larger wheels on true 'mountain bike' terrain.
meanwhile over at mtbr....
forums.mtbr.com/650b-27-5
I draw your attention to the top sticky topics... the "my list of 650B compatible" is for 26er frames that fit 650B tires... 392, 376 VIEWS and 1155 replies, in 5 1/2 years. At the time I checked, there was 246 users browsing that forum. The DH-Freeride forum had 321 at the same moment, and the 29er forums had 881 in 29er bikes and 196 in 29er components.
Take from that what you wish... but I take that 29ers are WAY more popular than either DH or 650B, but that 650B is closing in on DH in popularity.
If you mount the RS remote on the other side of the bar than it was intended for, it will be underneath the bar. This allows it to work fine with the XT stuff. It also makes it easier to reach the pushloc button and mounts it in a more protected spot.
You will have to buy a different 'side' remote if you want to keep it on the right. They are available and easy to install though.
here is a video
www.youtube.com/watch?v=1JtTSS5teRQ
I just flipped it upside down on my new bike with XT shifters and it fits fine on the right side of the bar, the left shifter isn't that much different from the right is it?
I also used to run one on the left side with my X9 shifter.
Plus the bike looks like it would be very very playful. I'm actually getting excited to get one.
After laying eyes on Mr Levy recently, he's nothing short of what I expected. A weedy, latte sipping, spandex-on-the-outside, shaved-legged hipster.
Mike you get criticised for writing things like you were paid to... can you offer some closure here for all the 'haters' on pinkbike. Are you, or are you not paid (outside of your presumed PB wage) for half the shit you publish?
And yes, I am obviously paid big money by companies for all the words that I put down... otherwise how would I afford my $2,000 van and all the cans of tuna that I eat for breakfast, lunch, and dinner?
Pink bike lacks the objective reviews of the product and the components that can only come about from riding and not having your wage depending on the words you write. Not a personal attack just a differing opinions.
And who's to say guys in spandex or hipsters can't shred. I personally know a few.
I always find it funny that it can't be accepted that maybe reviewers give good reviews because the bikes are actually good! A company like Trek, or any bike company for that matter, spends a lot of time and money trying to make the best bike possible. So it is likely that when they release it, it is going to be better than the ones that came before it. That isn't industry hype, or "paid-off reviewers"-- that is the result of stiff competition and the advance of technology.
Have you read the retro bike reviews in the 20th anniversary issue of Bike mag at the moment? Late nineties dual suspension bikes were TERRIBLE! I think the industry may just be producing a pretty good product now.
No one's making you buy it. It's not like someone is coming to your house, taking your bike and making you buy a new one.
For example, mere weeks after Santa Cruz revealed their Bronson and Solo 650B models this spring, sales of their existing 26ers TANKED. They've got factory clearouts on their website of 26ers for about 40% of retail price, on 2013 model year frames. That's below dealer wholesale btw. This for the factory to clear unsold 26er frames they had in stock still. How do you think dealers who have the models on their showroom floors already that they paid for already feel? They're now having to LOSE money just to move inventory that people don't actually want or need otherwise.
shop.santacruzbicycles.com/sale.html
Heckler $550 (regular MSRP was $1300) and the 2014 Heckler is a 650B.
Superlight $550 ($1100 MSRP) and the 2014 is a 29er.
The Blur LT Al and Carbon, and the Blur XC are all discontinued next year. The Julianna single frame model is being replaced by an entire new lineup that has 650B, 29er and 26er options depending on frame size mainly.
Thats one area you'll probably see 26ers stick around at some mid to higher end non-gravity levels, for short folks (ie the large womens market).
dee, you might be right, maybe people did suddenly think "d'ya know what? all those bikes I've ridden in the past, the wheels were all too small! I'm soooo glad that the manufacturers have come to my rescue with - finally - a bike with the right size wheels." If people really have been hanging out waiting for larger wheels, why did my local shop have a 29er Trek (or Gary Fisher, I forget) that they couldn't give away because no-one wanted it? It sat there like an unwanted Christmas jumper for bloody ages. No-one knew they wanted bigger wheels until the marketing and media told them they did. I'm not suprised SC struggled to sell existing models after introducing the Bronson, it is a gorgeous looking thing.
Willie, my bike has a 65.5 deg HA, it definitely does not flop from side to side.
You're welcome to your opinions chaps, same as I am mine. My opinion is that the 27.5 wheels are less of a change for riding reasons, and more of a change to give people a reason to buy a new bike.
here in canada's capitol, we're in a few weeks going to have two bike stores about 200 feet apart on the same street (opposing sides, you can see one from the other). One is Fresh Air Experience who are a Giant and Norco dealer. Both Giant and Norco are going HEAVILY into 650B for 2014, and having a lesser focus now on 29ers and 26ers (other than DH and Fat Bike models, and really entry level XC hardtails). The other is Tall Tree Cycles who are moving to a new larger location, and they are a Kona, Surly, 9zero7 and Specialized dealer. 9 zero 7 are a fat bike brand exclusively (there are easily a hundred fat bike owners in this area now, myself included), Surly has 26er, 29er, Fats, and more. Specialized is very heavily 29er KoolAid slanted. Kona is embracing all three wheel sizes for next year but again 26ers are falling to the entry level price points other than Gravity and Snow related bikes.
EDIT: was a bit trigger happy and did not take time to see which side you are on but now i realize there is no neutral in this war. either you are against them or against us. erm...choose!
1) the bike rides heavier than 30lbs because it. Add pedals and the weight is around 31-31 1/2 lbs.
The wheel and tire upgrades don't really make sense for an all mountain bike: über light?
Now Trek fixes those two issues and slaps some big wheels on it and it is now better than the old 26"?
I am not sure you would choose the new over the old if they had built it correctly the first time.
Question - In your opinion ("No, the bike is not as agile as a 26"-wheeled machine of equal travel, and it did take a bit more effort to throw around, but the tradeoff is awe-inspiring calmness in the heat of battle.")
Is is really not as agile.. or could it be with a little more time on the bike? Having spent most our lives on 26" and only through time on the saddle have we gotten to the level of agileness we enjoy today.... would we not get there in time on the 29er, or will they always hold us back? Is it only the elite level pro rider that will really notice this potential drawback? If true, I feel it would be worth mentioning that 80-90% of todays bike consumers would likely never notice less agility, and quite possibly notice the opposite.
This is my 4th year on a 29er (rumble fish for 3 and now Remedy) and I have surpassed any of my pre abilities in throwing around a bike since this Remedy came into my life. Me being part of the 80-90% lol
Thanks for your time. Great review!
I'd say that the Remedy is less agile than other similar travel 29ers, which in turn means that it is also less agile than most 26"-wheeled bikes. That whole "agile" wording is a funny thing because, as you point out, many riders will benefit from the bike's planted feel. I think that the larger wheels' inertia will always make for a slightly less playful bike when comparing travel and geometry straight across against a 26" bike.
I will put to anyone having trouble with 29ers that such bike is a great choice for those riding a lot in big mountains, where acceleration is not an issue unlike my trails, looking like those on NS but lying on max 200ft hills. 29ers suck in jumping and on acceleration. If you have lots of wide, smooth, loose trails, you aren't going to quit biking because they don't look like Northshore Vancouver isn't it? And for such trails where speed is king, where grip is short, air-time promising natural obstacles are rare, the 29ers are the best possible weapon. They will provide more stability at speed, more cornering and braking grip and climb the loosest gravel steeps.
Sure 29" Remedy will roll better than 26". But we do more on our bikes than rolling over obstacles... and to support 29" side of the argument, we do more than just jump around and whip. Pick your wea... no consider if you need a new weapon. Being curious of the new is 100% normal, thus should not be condemned. What should be condemned is bullshit and silently promising huge gains.
I would be hesitant to say things like that unless you have some evidence.
And compared to a baja truck, they're heavier, slower and need fire roads to drive on.
Perfectly understandable nr1: companies need cash flow
Perfectly understandable nr2: people are curious about the new stuff and are after the silver bullet, so they are willing to take risks
Perfectly understandable nr3: people are suspicious, don't like to be cheated so they express their concerns
kinda refreshing from trendy lime green/sky blue stuff..but man, I've already seen 4 bikes w/these colors.
Yt, saracen, trek, ...
More on this topic (also a video of the clunk sound):
forums.mtbr.com/trek/trek-fs-owners-rear-wheel-clanking-creak-noise-travel-shock-question-867717.html#post10663816
Remedy 29er + Jon Watt = fastest on every segment
A: He holds onto it and waits for the world to revolve around him.
Heavy, cumbersome at low and higher speeds, not enough travel, suspension already broken, esoteric Fox damper because T. Could not make it work properly, big wheels not enough to make it run properly uphills across roots.
Article fullfills needs of marketing simpletons and their cult- followers. All others rejoice.
Good writing R.C
What? LOL. Are you seriously threatening pinkbike with leaving? And cancel what membership? You don't pay for a thing. Go ahead. Leave. Good luck finding a new mtb site where they'll tolerate HALF the shit people like you and many others get away with here. There's a reason the community here is referred to as the cesspool of the mtb world. You're lucky they even put up with people like you here.
PS: They didn't blame whistlers trail systems for anything. They just implied niners are more suited for some trails than others. Which has been a logical fact since day one that most of us have understood. Way to go.
I read articles about new products that are supposed to be top notch, cutting edge, whatever and it makes me happy. Yes the costs are high, but they trickle down a couple of years, say 3 later. Our cheap bikes now are leaps and bounds better than our cheap bikes used to be. And the cheap bikes of the future will be even better. But most people just throw a fit about the price not taking that into consideration. Of course it's expensive, it's new. Is it good? I don't know, maybe, a lot of times probably not, these companies throw a lot of shit at the wall and only a little of it sticks. But it's innovation, it's expensive, and that's okay.
This bike is innovation. Not for all, but for many.
Matt Hunter said: "If you enjoy mountain biking, you can see the fun in every single one of the different ways of doing it." I can see the fun someone can have on this bike. I'll be right behind them having fun on my 26" bike.
And please, test second-hand, all-mountain and dh bikes with prices no higher than $1500 so i can make my mind!! Really apreciatte your input.
www.pinkbike.com/u/mikelevy/blog/Giants-OverDrive-2-Steerer-tube-sizing-Is-It-The-Future.html