Fox's Coil Sprung Electronic Suspension - Crankworx Whistler 2023

 Shit up, that’s top secret fox technology for cooling the oil down and keep the performances! Duh

 @nicoenduro: is it code name shit up or will that be the official branding?

 @therealnobody: Suspension Harmonic Integrated Technology

 Can confirm. My X2 suffered the death-squelch on 4 occasions within 2 years. And of course you can't take it apart at home without lots of very expensive tools. Will never buy again.

 @therealnobody: apparently even my phone dislikes fox shocks and helped me out

 @TommyNunchuck: You've hit the nail on the head for the most annoying thing about Fox. All the wildly overpriced (and often completely unnecessary) tools they try and sell you in order to work on them.

 @lightone: neither

 @TommyNunchuck: is that the new revised x2? I heard the older one prior to 2021 revision had major issues but the new one I heard was a lot better. Anecdotally my buddies has been rock solid but it's the new one 2022

 @Muggsly: Mine was 2018 but I know someone who has already blown up a new 'improved' one.

 @TommyNunchuck: Just orderd a bike with one installed so I guess I will find out soon. My previous bike was running ohlins TTX air and was rock solid. Hopefully it lasts if not back to ohlins I go

 It’s bad when you can say without any exaggeration that your 2016 Reverb was 4x more reliable than your 2022 Float X.

 @Muggsly: I'm on an Ohlins coil now and it's mint. Works perfectly, no breakdowns

 @gabiusmaximus: Park Tools loves that "feature".

 I have a 2021 float x2 that goes squishy after 3-4 rides. Supposedly there is some eyelet replacement warranty fix that sorts it.

 @bigtim: Super High Inertia Transfer

 @Muggsly: I had 2 bikes shop up in boxes at the shop I work at with 2023 shocks that were already blown when they were built and far more that were in after a double rides.

 @Muggsly: My 2022 went squishy very quickly and was serviced under warranty. It then blew all its oil and was replaced under warranty with a 2024. Evidently much improved. Time will tell!

 @diggery: yeah I was reading the thread here on the forums and apparently the 2024s are solid. Not sure what this bike will ship with but I can run the serial and find out. I am hoping new bike new shock but who knows what they had lying around to slap on these bikes. I have a Ohlins TTX air on my Evil and I love it so I am not afraid to go back if that is the case.

 @diggery: I had 2 fail within a year, fox warrantied both and eventually sent me the updated 2024 model which has been flawless. Seems like they finally solved their issues. But it’s pretty absurd that they’ve had such a high failure rate lately

 “ bru!” LOL!

 @kungfupanda: "bru" is VERY South African... 100%

 @repsacklime: go back and watch a interview with the GOAT

 @repsacklime: It’s “bru” dude…
Take it from a South African… you are wrong… FFS…
Haibo wena…

 Last week I had my teeth cleaned and the hygienist handed me a little goodbye bag. It had a toothbrush, toothpaste, and a 34” wide Fox decal for my Sprinter conversion. Didn’t have floss in the bag, so I used the paper backing off the decal. I cut all of my gums really bad and called for an ambulance. They drove me home from the dentist office and gave me another goodbye bag. It had a 35” wide Fox decal! Double win! Total bill; $69,420.01

 @kungfupanda: winner.

 I think this current design is revolting.

 I couldn’t even follow watt the article was saying.

 I will withhold my opinion until the publish the battery of tests.

 And that $50000 dollar bike will be flying so that justifies the cost

 It’s more of a question of what adjustments are potentially beneficial given the response time. With vehicles they do things like stiffen the shocks when they go to full droop so that, assuming the vehicle is in the air, it doesn’t bottom as hard. I’d imagine for bike shocks they’d do something like set damping based off the previous however many seconds of riding and then look for signs like going to full droop or the shock packing up to make adjustments from there.

 @taquitos: i still think a speed sensitive HBO is the way to go, instead of all this electronic crap, this shock is gonna cost like a push 11.6 while still having the performances of a fox.

 Electronics are certainly able to keep up with the shaft speeds of the shock. I use sensors and electronics capable of that at work. Such sensors, amplifiers and controllers arent even particularly specialized equipment. The issue is, that the whole measuring, computing and recording setup costs about as much as 20 of these shocks and even if you were to integrate everything into one device you would still look at a Volume of about 2 litres.
I.e. Fox wont overcome this in the near future.

"[...]to adjust the feel of the shock in one of the positions that are activated by the handlebar mounted remote."
"Small sensors on the brake caliper suggest that there is an automatic mode, where the suspension is adjusted without rider input, and the remote is used to toggle through different settings."

From these quotes, the price of "proper" measuring equipment and how crude previous iterations of electronic valves on shocks were I would guess that its just another glorified lockout with a few valve position presets added on.

 Marketing till they get it working. There will be plenty of early adopters to fund the R and D. Although I have no doubt electronics will be used more and more, I just wish products were sorted before they hit the shelves.

 Probably with smarter electrical engineers than vorsprung has....

 @endoplasmicreticulum: the real problem is the algorithm is only as good as the train driver who writes it. they are using the adaptive live technology in dezert racing and the rumors i hear is that the drivers dont like it. IMHO the parameters vary too much in an offroad shituation for the calculation to be effective if its going to be truly self tuning and automated.

 They also have the sensor on the front brake that will sense the bump and relay that to the shock, and the fork doesn’t get controlled so that won’t be inconsistent

 @mobil1syn: Then you're hearing the wrong rumors.... Or just talking out of your ass.

EVERY driver will tell you they love it.... even after a few beers in the pits. Without question... every driver.

It's literally tuned for the vehicle, for the driver... with the driver...

Rob Mac.... many consider this the goat. Spin through about 2/3rds of the video if you want to skip right to his thoughts on live valve. stories.ridefox.com/2023/01/new-desert-test-facility-honors-john-marking

Or ask Scherer what he thought of it when he sent his 4400 truck off a cliff at KOH.
www.instagram.com/p/CZf2TbBKXie/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link&igshid=MzRlODBiNWFlZA=

 @onemanarmy: that would be loren, not jason and i dont believe he had the live valve up at running at that point, just in cab adjustment of bypass tubes to presets just like the sxs stuff. soft, med, firm.

 @mobil1syn: Correct... nice catch. I was actually just reading the article on the KOH bronco before I posted. Did the little mental swap.

 @endoplasmicreticulum: basically agreed with what you've said - measuring stuff at high velocity is easy, you can do it with a $15 arduino (and we have - scroll back to 2014 on our Instagram page if you want pics). However, opening or partially closing valves under pressure, with limited power available, fast enough that the bike hasn't traveled a significant forward distance (ie over a bump/edge) in that time is the hard part, especially if you want it to be able to move to or hold any intermediate position indefinitely without burning through your battery. Cannondale did it 10+ years ago with the Simon fork, but it only had a 2hr battery life because the proportional solenoid is constantly consuming power. Big enough battery, big enough proportional valves etc and you "can" do it, but like you say, it's a lot of cost, power, weight and size. The power part might be somewhat solvable with e-bikes now, if the main battery can be used to power the fork/shock as well as the motor, but that'll require a level of integration that the industry isn't really approaching just yet.

@onemanarmy: we have no electrical engineers, but I have personally spent time working in a test lab for a very large automotive brake manufacturer, testing and developing control algorithms for high frequency response solenoids in ABS/ESC systems among other things. Not going to claim that makes me the world's foremost expert on electronically controlled suspension, but I am very familiar with each individual element of the tech behind ECVs, and the characteristics, demands and limitations of the valves themselves. As a result, I'm interested in what developments are made, but while it could be a step forward in some regards, I don't think it's reached anything like "game changer" status yet. It may turn out to be a really useful (if niche) tool for pro-level enduro racing, for example, where the weight gain is not that critical and having automatic (or semi-automated) mode selection is handy for those 20 second sprint climbs. And I'd be stoked if Fox prove me wrong and it actually does turn out to be a really big improvement, because that would mean there really is a whole other world of previously untapped performance that's now accessible.

 @VorsprungSuspension: That was essentially my point... in less words. Usually it's me that's long winded...

 But you’re not who the product is for then, it’s for the riders that want to make the most of active electronic suspension and are comfortable with the increased labor to going along that

 I think there could be some pretty cool applications for a coil and gravity use, like predictive bottom out. Imagine running full open by default for small bump compliance, then when you take a medium-to-big hit the shock predicts bottom out force due to high shaft speed and automatically increases damping. Assuming it can adjust fast enough you could do this for the full range of shaft speeds and end up with a shock that’s more compliant and plush than a shock with settings fixed to work with the biggest couple of hits on the run.

 There are enough cashed up punters and e-bikers that will buy. So they make.

 None of these things are mutually exclusive.

 That’s a shocker

 zinger

 Just sprung out of my seat.

 But allowing advances in mechanical technologies is ok for you in a "human powered sport"?

 Wheels are unnatural and should be banned from human powered gravity sports.

 @righto-bucko: Mechanical advantage has been used since before we were even human, electronics are an entirely different thing.

 It's only an advantage to the other person if you are choosing not to use it... or it doesn't work. So far it's been pretty successful in race usage... so I'd say it probably at least doesn't suck. That's like saying why can one cross country use a dropper.... it gives them an advantage... well the guy not using one would disagree.... You still have to pedal. You still have to descend.

 @L0rdTom: Only wheels of cheese shall be accepted.

 I honestly have no idea what you just said.

 Yeah because 25 years ago you could put the same level of intelligence into the system.... this comment is played out and boring.