Cotic Launches the RocketMAX Gen3

Apr 30, 2020 at 22:55
by cotic-bikes  
Cotic RocketMAX Gen3 160mm 29er Enduro Bikes UK Made Reynolds 853 radical Longshot geometry

PRESS RELEASE: Cotic Bikes

Today marks the launch of the 3rd generation Cotic RocketMAX, our radical, UK Made 29er enduro bike.

Cotic RocketMAX Gen3 160mm 29er Enduro Bikes UK Made Reynolds 853 radical Longshot geometry

The new RocketMAX Gen3 is a solid evolution of our standard shredding Gen2 RocketMAX, the first RocketMAX to feature Longshot geometry. It's the longest travel 29er we have ever made, now with 160mm at the rear to balance out the 160mm of front suspension. We have tweaked the progression rate, reduced the leverage ratio, and broadened the window of performance. The frame design is dedicated to big can, metric-sized air shocks for a smoother feel and more capable performance. For tunability, they can't be beat.

The extra travel and new kinematics bring an even more composed, plush feel to the suspension, making it feel more planted when you're flying down those rock-strewn sections. The confidence-inspiring support and shape-maintaining working edge is still right there, so it still has your back in the steep and deep.

The RocketMAX Gen3 accounts for its extra travel to retain the incredible dynamic geometry of the Gen2 bike. This means the handling is still that fantastic combination of precision, stability and responsiveness. It was so far ahead of the game that we haven't found a way to improve it! The seat angle is 1 degree steeper for more poise on steep climbs and to work hand-in-hand with the new frame rate.

The tubeset is subtly evolved with our new HD down tube which is tougher and stiffer than the original version, but no heavier. Developed by Cotic with Reynolds for our exclusive use. All 853 frames are not created equal.

Cotic RocketMAX Gen3 160mm 29er Enduro Bikes UK Made Reynolds 853 radical Longshot geometry
Cotic RocketMAX Gen3 160mm 29er Enduro Bikes UK Made Reynolds 853 radical Longshot geometry
Cotic RocketMAX Gen3 160mm 29er Enduro Bikes UK Made Reynolds 853 radical Longshot geometry
Cotic RocketMAX Gen3 160mm 29er Enduro Bikes UK Made Reynolds 853 radical Longshot geometry
Cotic RocketMAX Gen3 160mm 29er Enduro Bikes UK Made Reynolds 853 radical Longshot geometry

New colours are deep gloss Navy Blue with silver graphics, and in a nod to the original Longshot prototype, Army Green Matte, all hand finished right here in the UK. If you're interested in the origins of the Longshot project, has a read of this: Project Longshot - Status Experimental

The RocketMAX is the bike of choice for me, Sam the Demo Man and Chief Mechanic Will, so it's got a lot of fans here! Here's Sam's take on Violet, his work vehicle for the past year and a bit:

bigquotesMy RocketMAX has got my back, everywhere. It's incredibly capable in the gnarliest terrain, and still fun to throw around twisty singletrack. From fully committed chutes on the Golfie to skipping over roots in the Surrey Hills, I'm always on the right bike. The grip and stability the RocketMAX has are like a safety net in all situations; whether I'm on a national level downhill race track or a smooth flow trail, on my A game or a tired last lap of the weekend, pushing on or cruising.

It will get down anything, whether I think I can or not, and it also cleans technical climbs with ease. The longer travel brings a more useable mid-stroke with tonnes of corner traction, but you can still pick the bike up and put it where you like with a massive grin on your face, and a sense you got away with a line you shouldn't have. Fast isn't dull, the RocketMAX opens up a trail in a way lesser bikes can't. You will find gaps you've never noticed, rail loose turns faster than you thought you could, and hold that high line you didn't even see last time.

I've done big mountain rides, trail centres, enduro races, quick blasts from the door, uplift days, Peak District epics and every demo ride on the RocketMAX. It's never let me down, and always makes me grin like an idiot."

One thing that we have got asked a fair bit over the last year is what fork offset our bikes are 'optimised' around. For me, it's not the big deal a lot of people are making it out to be. I have run 42mm, 44m, 46mm and 51mm offset forks on my RocketMAX and although I can tell the difference between 51mm and 44mm, I certainly can't tell the difference between 42 and 44mm offsets! Even between the extremes it's subtle and doesn't make the bike 'bad' or 'good', it's just a bit different. The bikes from now on will be spec'd with short offset forks from Rock Shox, Cane Creek and X Fusion, but if someone has a 51mm offset fork to fit to their frame, that's fine too. I wrote a blog post helping our customers understand the choices here: https://www.cotic.co.uk/news/2019/forkoffset

Here's the all important geometry:

photo

The frames and bikes will only be available with the Cane Creek DB Air CS big can, piggyback air shock, which will come with the Cotic base tune already installed.

Frames pricing is £2,399 / approx EUR 2,750 / approx US$2,499 with shock, and delivery is included within the UK, Europe, USA and Canada. We ship anywhere in the world at an additional cost.

Bikes pricing is:

£3,649 / approx EUR 4,160 / approx US$3,770 for the SLX based Silver build

£4,699 / approx EUR 5,360 / approx US$4,850 for the Gold Eagle GX bike

£4,749 / approx EUR 5,420 / approx US$4,920 for the Gold XT bike

£6,549 / approx EUR 7,470 / approx US$6,780 for the dream build eeWings/X01 equipped Platinum bike

Cotic RocketMAX Gen3 160mm 29er Enduro Bikes UK Made Reynolds 853 radical Longshot geometry
Cotic RocketMAX Gen3 160mm 29er Enduro Bikes UK Made Reynolds 853 radical Longshot geometry
Cotic RocketMAX Gen3 160mm 29er Enduro Bikes UK Made Reynolds 853 radical Longshot geometry

The main changes for the Gen3 bike specs are the addition of the Rock Shox Lyric Ultimate as a fork option, and we now have a selection of Shimano XT and SRAM Guide RSC G2 4 Pot brakes for those wanting a bump in stopping power, but have particular lever feel preferences. You can play with our configurator here: https://www.cotic.co.uk/order/framebuilder/rocketMAX/

We have some availability of frames and bikes right now and are in rolling production with our friends at Five Land Bikes up in Scotland, so you're never more than a few weeks away from your bike being delivered if we don't have stock right now. Both Cotic and Five Land are operating with all current safe distancing guidance. We are small, flexible businesses able to adapt to the circumstances surrounding the Covid19 lockdown pretty well, thankfully.

The full product page and information for the new bike is here: http://www.cotic.co.uk/product/rocketMAX

I'll be chatting about the new bike and all things Cotic on Downtime Live on Youtube at 8pm BST, Wednesday 6th May 2020: https://www.youtube.com/downtimemountainbikepodcast

I hope you're all well and staying safe in these strange days. I'll be around in the comments over the next few days, so any questions, please ask away.



Author Info:
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Member since Dec 12, 2017
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191 Comments
  • 78 7
 But it’s handmade in the uk (well the front is anyway) i personally now look at bikes as an investment, not something I’m going to thrash for 2 years and chop in. If I bought one of these, which I plan to; then I’d take pride in the ownership of it and be proud that I’d bought the more considered handmade artisan option.
Looks sick guys!
  • 20 0
 Thanks!
  • 18 0
 @cotic-bikes: The blue looks amazing.
  • 5 0
 @fartymarty: Thanks!
  • 6 1
 Yeah! Good spirit man Wink
  • 25 0
 @cotic-bikes: 853 tubing, 160mm of travel, legit modern geometry with slack HT, Long reach, and steep ST... This bike speaks volumes to me! f*ck carbon, cheers!
  • 4 0
 i'm thinking exactly the same, only bikes i've been lusting after for a while. plus i grew up 15 minutes from where they're made too so it would be extra nice. Anyone wanna buy a strive?
  • 21 1
 I definitely wouldn't call a bike an investment. An investment is "the action or process of investing money for profit or material result." Bikes depreciate significantly in value in just a year's time. While it makes me happy to own my bike that I paid a pretty penny for, I realize that it's more of a money pit. But it's a fun money pit and it gives me a woody, so worth it.
  • 15 2
 @stumphumper92:

Invest in yourself and buy the thing that feels best for you... if buying a cheap aluminium frame or complete bike gets you out into the woods and makes you happy then do that, but if the idea of supporting local trades and the people encompassed within it and enjoying their vision and pursuit of quality makes you happy then do that.
You’re right, they’re definitely not a financial investment, but personally it feels good for the soul knowing I’ve bought the best option for what my values are. Have fun whatever you do, just don’t buy an ebike.
  • 5 0
 @cotic-bikes:love the new head badge as well!
  • 6 6
 @josh250: I agree with all that except the part about an ebike. Idk why they get so much hate? I think if all the haters actually rode an ebike they'd love it. A lot of people just bandwagon on the hate train. If they make my climbs easier and quicker to the descent, sign me up! Don't hate me for this controversial comment!
  • 2 0
 Supporting local industry is an investment in your direct economy. If I still lived in Sheffield I'd own a Cotic. Live in Colorado now so I own a Guerilla Gravity
  • 5 1
 @stumphumper92:

Haha, sorry man! No, i Totally see a place for them but for me it’s just the fact that we have an incredible sport that is so good for us mentally and physically but to then go and make a load more bikes that have batteries strapped to them seems a bit sad as it just makes the footprint of our sport a whole load bigger, that’s all. Have a good weekend bud
  • 1 0
 @stumphumper92: Not a monetary investment but an emotional investment sounds more accurate.
  • 4 2
 @stumphumper92: I like climbs because they're challenging,not easy.
  • 2 1
 @stumphumper92: Here-Here!
  • 2 1
 @stumphumper92: "an investment of health" the more you ride the more fit you become. The more you invest, potentially the more you reap
  • 4 0
 If i ever seen a bike, and especially a steel mtb, speak to me, it tis this un' right here (especially in that "army green" SICK!!).
Prices for quality/build spec/slickness are all there, and the geo is outstanding.
I'm sitting here scratching my head, wondering how they were able to pull out, such a well fitted machine for so little $. I mean, your getting a boutique British steel frame, and top spec parts for only around 7 grand Canadian. And the silver build (the one i would go for, and most mere mortals too), for less then 4 grand, and you get slx and x-fusion! Can't believe it! And not to mention all the other goodies you get... I thought the GT force was the best buy in mtb, well, i was wrong, Cotic takes the top spot on my list. She just shot to the top of drool factor, too bad i don't have the dough, or she would be heading my way right this minute! Good on ya
Cotic, she's me dream bike now Smile .
  • 2 0
 @lenniDK: About sums it up for me...
  • 1 0
 @IamtheNIGHTRIDER: Thank you. It's been an emotional few weeks with that, as obivously such a big change for such a long standing brand is a shock for some of our longer term fans, but we love the new badge (obviously) and it was the result of months of collective work here at Cotic. We knew how important it was. It's us.
  • 4 0
 @stumphumper92: E-bikes are great. Couldn't agree more. There's definitely some management and access issues on them to consider, but the vast majority of cases I see it's people getting out more on their (e)bikes than they would otherwise, or in some cases they wouldn't be riding at all. That's brilliant.
  • 4 1
 @josh250: Agreed, there's definitely some environmental issues surrounding batteries and recylcing/disposal that needs to be considered and addressed, but mostly I see people on ebikes who might not be physically able to get out as far, or at all, were it not for the assistance, and as a result they are getting all that wellbeing and endorphin buzz. Spreading the love in a lot of ways. My Dad (in his early 70s) has just got one, and he's gone from riding to the shops to riding for hours. Loving it. You can't argue that this isn't great?
  • 2 0
 @wcr: Thanks so much. Means a lot when we put this much effort in. Thank you.
  • 3 0
 @lenniDK: So do I, so keep riding a conventional bike. No one's making you get batteries ;-) But when you're 70 and still like climbs, but your legs aren't what they were, you'll be able to get an ebike and still challenge yourself.
  • 5 1
 @cotic-bikes:

Yeah, my statement was a little ham fisted for sure!
Basically where I live in Surrey they’re booming which was inevitable as they do allow people that have a finite amount of time to ride to get more runs in but it’s just a little sad to see guys in their teens up to their thirties buying them to go and razz around the trails on, and not respecting the hard work trail builders put in. I can’t help but feel it de-values the experience of getting out into the woods, the purity of it is somewhat taken away when the analogue is swapped for digital.
But 100% if it enables someone who physically wouldn’t be able to be out enjoying themselves then it’s a great think in my opinion. Who cares what I think though, I just want to have fun in the outdoors away from the buzz. Love what you’re doing, you’ll be getting an order from me later in the year, cheers.
  • 1 0
 @josh250: If you are Surrey Hills way i am not surprised you have a slightly negative view. Its a busy, sensitive area for access with a lot of inexperienced ebikers coming in thinking this is how it's always been. Not sure how best to overcome that communication issue. Up here we have a bit more space to ride and rockier trails which stand up to heavy use better. Makes that less of an issue. That said, i can see why they're popular down there. The short, punchy hills means lots of laps. I love riding down thete, but man am I tired when i am finished!

Looking forward to hearing from you later in the year.
  • 5 0
 @stumphumper92:

Please listen to the Richard Cunningham downtime Podcast at the part just before the end. He is analyzing the situation of MTB, E-Bike, Hikers and access very neutral but completely honest.

Then you ll see where the haters come from. Heck, listen to the entire Podcast,it is one of the best ever from Downtime and that means a lot since he very rarely has a boring episode...
  • 2 0
 Yeah same. How I viewed bikes had gone from, anything I can get my hands on, to eventually being able to have some component preferences, to now fully investing in local manufacturing and local commerce and choosing parts with lifetime warranty or modular design platforms so I can keep repairing and maintaining my parts for a long time.
  • 3 0
 @catweasel: Support local indeed! Just picked up a shred dogg and elevensix, bought the test of stuff through my LBS, had them build the wheels etc.
  • 2 0
 @IntrospectiveSteel: Wicked, good stuff!! Im currently waiting for a custom handmade Curtis AM9 frame to be made which I'm buying as many locally made parts as possible, mainly hope and burgtec...tyres and suspension however are a different story...theyre going to have to have travelled from another continent haha....ive tried though! Enjoy your new stuff bro!
  • 2 0
 I remember saying to Cy that I liked the swirly graphics when he was 'prototyping' them back in the day. Not long after then I started thinking 'God I wish they'd change those swirly graphics!'. Great to see if finally happen ha ha. Bike looks sick too.
  • 59 2
 I mean, the bike is lovely, but you deserve a frickin' Nobel prize just for publishing the actual seat angle at various heights
  • 47 0
 [takes a little bow]
  • 10 0
 @cotic-bikes: Everyone should be doing it.
  • 4 2
 @cotic-bikes: Although is anyone riding a small wanting to know the seat angle at an 815mm seat height? #imashortarse
  • 2 0
 @cotic-bikes:
Does .3 of difference reeeeally make a difference? Asking for a friend. ????
Nice bike though. ????
  • 1 0
 Emojis didn’t work Wink
  • 6 0
 @MonkeyPuzzle: Probably not, but given my (Cy) saddle height is 815mm, I'm not all that interested in the seat angle at 700mm, except in a bike designery way ;-)
  • 7 0
 @Mooweeman: To some people it's really important. The main thing it shows really is that the seat angle doesn't do anything weird when the saddle gets higher, like it can on some bikes with really steep effective seat angles, but really laid back kinked seat tubes.
  • 5 1
 Don’t you mean a Noble Prize?
  • 1 0
 @cotic-bikes: Fairplay ????
  • 1 0
 @islandforlife: the nobles
  • 2 0
 @cotic-bikes: I'm looking at you Santa Cruz (also lovely bikes before anyone gets their knickers in a twist)
  • 5 0
 @Mooweeman: 0.3 doesn’t make a difference, which is exactly the point. For many brands with bends in the seat tube the difference would be more like 1-2 degrees, so this highlights the fact that this bike doesn’t have that problem.
  • 34 0
 Right, I'm done. Thanks for all the comments. Been up since 6 prepping all this stuff. I'm going to go and ride a bike. It's been grand.
  • 2 0
 Any chance at a new version of the Escapade with 853 tubing and 12x142 rear? Also, a hole for a dropper in the seat tube would be cool too.
  • 2 0
 @gus6464: Oh man, an updated escapade would be amazing. Im considering the escapade since ages now...
  • 2 0
 @gus6464: Glad you like the Escapade. We won't be doing one in 853 because for the strength/stiffness compromise we want for that bike, heat treated cromoly to our specifications does the job easily as well at a better price point. 853 would just be stronger than it needs to be and no lighter. We use 853 in the mountain bike frames because it's strength over other steels means we can make the frames lighter than we could in other lower strength steels, with that lovely ride feel. That doesn't apply to the Escapade. However, the new batch due in about 5 weeks will have a 142x12 rear axle. No dropper post though. We looked at it, but it's not really that 'gnar' a gravel bike. It started out as a tough disc round bike with big clearances and gravel kinda came to it over the years (we've been doing the Escapade in various guises since 2013). It sits at a really lovely compromise between road and off road at the moment, and we don't want to spoil that. Hope you understand where I'm coming from with that.
  • 23 0
 Cotic don't get the credit they deserve. I bought a bfe frame this year and built up with a 150 fork. I haven't ridden my carbon 150 full suss 29er since. Truly a brand that values its customers and is trying hard to bring manufacturing back to the UK. ????????????
  • 9 0
 Thanks for the kind words. So glad you're stoked on your BFe.
  • 2 0
 @cotic-bikes: I do hope more orange BFes are on the way. Look great!
  • 13 0
 The Matt green oozes sex, we re talking Marilyn Monroe singing happy birthday to JFK levels of raunchiness
  • 5 1
 Your description is absolutely perfect. I can`t walk for about 2 hrs since I saw that dirty forbidden thing. Boner, stiffy, hard-on... call it as you like, I have the 3 of them at the same time. These steel bikes are worse than Viagra. They should be called Pryapism rather than Rocketmax Wink
  • 16 0
 @softsteel: Steady on chaps! We're British!
  • 7 0
 I have a cotic Solaris max hardtail, the amazing finish and quality of ride a good steel frame like this gives is amazing and I have definitely thought about this one for my Enduro bike, especially now the rear travel has been bumped up. I don't think it should be compared to the alloy privateer as it a completely different bike, steel is real good work guys.
  • 8 0
 @cotic-bikes , can you explain why you've stuck with a linkage actuated single pivot rather than Horst link, given that the patent has expired, and manufacturing is almost identical? Not trolling, just wondering.
  • 12 0
 We use this design because it's stiff, reliable and it achieves everything we want it to. Just putting a pivot on the chainstay doesn't suddenly make a bike great. Our first FS bike back in 2007 used horst link, so it's a conscious choice. That bike had some characteristics which weren't that great compared to what we have with droplink suspension. For me, the biggest factor influencing how a big feels or performs is the frame progression rate, and the anti-squat. I can easily achieve the anti-squat I want with the swingarm pivot location, and the frame progression rate is controlled by the droplink and the position of the shock on the down tube. I would be willing to guess that most of the feedback riders give in terms of one bike being lively, one bike being plush, one bike being a bit dull is all to do with shock rate. That's the main thing you 'feel' when moving a bike around.
  • 4 0
 @cotic-bikes: thanks for the quick response! My current and previous bikes are Horst, and before that I had a Commencal with single pivot, and I never noticed brake jack (though I had terrible Avid Juicys so perhaps that's why), and the Commy probably climbed better, so I'm certainly not saying Horst good, single pivot bad.
  • 2 0
 I have to say from personal experience of having several Horst link bikes and single pivots, I’ve always appreciated the stiffness and reliability of the single pivot despite all the old magazines that always praised a Horst link. Although, I am a fan of mini links now that I have a DW link bike, I would get a single pivot bike again without hesitation. I can’t say the same about a Horst link Bike.

Also, I have to admit I am a huge fan of the British handmade steel frames. These look beautiful. I’d love to figure out an excuse of a place in my garage for one.
  • 6 0
 Phew my gen 2 still looks awesome, I just have to slide my seat forward a touch, although that blue is lovely. Queue lots of comparisons to the privateer but I think there is room for both and I can see what you are paying for.
  • 3 0
 Agreed.
  • 6 0
 Dream bike right there. Full of character, undoubtedly rides incredible and looks amazing. Awesome job Cotic and even better to see the use of homegrown frame builders...Five Land are gonna be busy!
  • 4 0
 Good work guys !

I have to kill my gen1 rockermax before buying a new one. Not so easy... These are hardcore bikes.

And you have put two bottle holders... :-0 I know people who will be more than happy...
  • 4 0
 I’d love to demo one, I’ve always loved English brands and especially steel, I just don’t know if the long shot geo would work for me before handing over lumps of dollar
  • 4 0
 When the lockdown lifts, we'll be back on the road in the UK with the Demo Tour. It's free to use, and we go all over the country.
  • 2 0
 @cotic-bikes: I’d love that thanks, I’m so contemplating pulling the trigger on your ex demo flaremax at £2499 just unsure how I’d get on with it. I’m on south coast and there’s some great trails in Puddletown forest
  • 3 0
 @sewer-rat: Indeed there are! I can't advise very closely without knowing a lot more about your riding style and body shape. Would definitely be worth dropping info@cotic.co.uk a line or giving us a ring on 07970853531 to have a proper chat about it.
  • 2 0
 @cotic-bikes: will do thanks
  • 5 0
 @cotic-bikes: loving that phone number!!! Awesome looking bikes too
  • 2 0
 @dhdogred: Cheers. Number was a total fluke, simply the number I was allocated when I started the business.
  • 2 0
 @sewer-rat: any demos coming to Canada?
  • 1 0
 @cotic-bikes:
  • 1 0
 @MOFRR: No plans at the moment i am afraid. We are a small company, and supporting a demo tour is a BIG chunk of our marketing budget. Setting up elsewhere needs very careful consideration, and we can't make the number stick on that right now.
  • 3 0
 Stunning in the blue, that colour has unreal depth... the whole bike looks purposeful yet understated as a great bike should.. For a long time i have not been tempted away from my Dune XR, this could be the first... Will be waiting for the full on tests to seal it... Well done Cotic, this looks the real steel deal...
  • 3 0
 Beautifully clean and I love the proportions and visual weight of the steel tubing; size-wise I feel like I'd be somewhere between the L & XL.

I've been so curious about riding a steel FS bike, but right now the $CAD is garbage, which unfortunately puts this frame out of my price range ($1 USD = $1.41 CAD).
  • 3 0
 Such a clean looking bike. I absolutely love my BFe and am pretty certain my next full suss will be a Cotic. Looking forward to being able to demo one soon as I'm only down the road in Derby.
  • 4 0
 No comments here on why single pivot is “no good”? I’m a fan of simplicity and reliability myself. Looks like a gorgeous bike guys.
  • 4 0
 There's definitely more than one pivot, so it must be brilliant, right? ;-)
  • 2 0
 Orange seems to do just fine with one pivot.
  • 2 0
 God bless you Cotic for making sick steel duallies that shred with bad intentions... great to see stunning steel designs that stand apart from the carbon/alu masses. I’m loyal to my SolarisMAX, but the RocketMAX G3 is next on my list once I manage to kill my Ripmo GX.
  • 2 0
 I Picked up a Gen2 Flaremax a couple months back and couldnt be happier with the ride quality, And Looks?! I cant stop staring at this thing!!! Need to figure out a bracket for upright water bottle. I tried mounting WB cage upside down, but it just flips the bottle out,haha, maybe a better bottle cage is needed! Upgrading the hose guides is good also, the plastic ones are pretty weak and come open quite easily, The old & new colors available are gorgeous, wish I could have one of each model. Cotic deserves more recognition and credit. This is actually one of the reasons I like them so much! not a common ___________'whatever', yet blows them away! cheers!
  • 1 0
 Glad you like it so much. That's awesome to hear. We have had good performance out of the Lezyne side loading bottle cages.
  • 20 16
 Nice bike but if you look just at the Cotic frame price for £600 more you can get full Privateer 161 bike .
  • 42 3
 Ok? You can get a full build cotic for the same price as a Yeti SB165 frame?
  • 11 0
 Ha I was too slow with my post. Valid point, but if you care about supporting small factories/sheds in Scotland and want the lighter steel frame you'll have to find the extra!
  • 82 1
 True, and that Privateer is incredible value, but we don't pick these prices out of thin air. This is how much it costs to make most of a frame in the UK, finish it to an amazing standard out of (relative to the Privateer) very expensive material. First rule of business is that there's always someone cheaper than you. We thinks it's good value. It's not like we all drive McLaren's ;-)
  • 26 1
 I don't get why now every new bike being released has to be compared with the Privateer.
The Privateer was released with a very specific purpose: to be the cheapest possible high performance dedicated enduro Race bike available, and it seems to be great at it.
But there are plenty of bikes with a broader intended use and not as focused on absolute affordability.
This Cotic is a prime example of that, seems to be trying to be a little more versatile, is a different material and is built in the UK. Those are all selling points in my view, at least for a good slice of the market.
  • 12 1
 As much as the Privateer is awesome it just looks like a kinda bodged version of the Raaw Madonna, this Cotic is a thing of beauty!
  • 4 0
 @ctd07: Not to mention the Cotic and Raaw have geo numbers that are a bit more rational.
  • 4 0
 @cotic-bikes: The finish on you bikes is incredible inside and out! I have thousands of km on my 2017 Flare, the paint has no chips in it at all and no rust on the inside.
  • 5 0
 @bent6543: That's great to hear. E-coat inside and out then some top quality paint, it's a good combination.
  • 1 0
 @cotic-bikes: except for Rob Roskopp eh? ;-)
  • 2 0
 @alexhyland: Well, yes, but Rob has built a 'slightly' bigger bike company than I have. Hats off to the guy.
  • 1 0
 @cotic-bikes: How long do you expect the E-coat to last internally? I'm interested in a steel hardtail but living in the Pacific Northwest I'm hesitant to go that route over aluminum/carbon due to rust concerns. My riding is wet and muddy for ~8 months a year.
  • 6 0
 @bikingrolo: E coat lasts indefinitely. It's a phosphate dip that completely encloses the frame. Also, we're based in the North of England. If steel bikes dissolved in wet and mud, we definitely wouldn't use it!
  • 1 0
 @cotic-bikes: is that the same treatment as Pipedream Cycles use? ED (Electrophoretic deposition ) i think? If so, i can confirm it works a treat.
  • 4 4
 @ctd07: as much as people love to say these steel-frame full suspension bikes are things of beauty, they all actually look like farm gates.

Opinions are like...
  • 4 0
 @bikingrolo: We'll see your eight months and raise you two (at least). It's very damp here in Northern England a lot of the time and steel hardtails are very popular. Rust is just not an issue... as long as you're not keeping your bike in the garden.
  • 1 0
 @bikingrolo: buy an Orange stage 5 or 6.
  • 4 1
 @cotic-bikes: last year, the cost went up about $250GBP to make the front triangle at Fiveland, and now, it seems to be that the only shock available is a +$250 Cane Creek option (which has to be mailed in for service) AND there seems to be an additional $400GBP price hike ON TOP OF THAT. So, +$650GBP for a frame over two models? This is no longer a 'I did my homework and chose Cotic' and now a 'My steel frame cost more than your whole build' kind of bike. But WHY? I liked the competitive price. If you demonstrate getting almost $3kUS for a steel frame I am sure the big brands will be rolling out Reynolds 853 ASAP. I miss the old days. Why not just keep last year's price, make them in Thailand again and mail FiveLand a $250GBP 'donation' for each frame you sell. Sorry man, +$900 over two years is a but much for a frame that has a different downtube and a different seat angle. Maybe you can explain why this makes sense for the consumer.
  • 1 1
 @Ramenazi: Replied to your comment below.
  • 2 0
 @tremeer023: Yes it is. It's pretty industry standard for high end steel frames.
  • 3 0
 I bought a Rocket Max after a test ride. I was dubious how long and slack it was. But it's a blast to ride...built to last and great fun.
  • 4 0
 I think the price is very worthy of a brand built in the uk and the build quality is amazing
  • 3 0
 I have now 1000km on my FlareMAX and can say it is a great bike! climbs solid, but descends wow!
That RocketMax should do the same, with more wow downwards Smile
  • 3 0
 This bike speaks to me so much, I’m in love. British steel 29er, full boing no less. Guess I’ll start saving them pennies up.
  • 1 0
 I can't seem to see the Bfe26 on your websight anymore. Please don't tell me I waited too long. I have a whole bunch of premium components I just pulled off my old frame to build one up to play on. Yeah I am just now going to 27.5, so what!
  • 3 0
 Sorry, BFe26 went out of production over a year ago. We kept at it as long as we could, but the last batch sold so slowly we couldn't make the numbers stqck up for another.
  • 2 0
 In a previous chat with Cy here (about the regular Flare) I recall he said that a modern 26" wheeled setup (say 26x2.35" on 30mm inner width rims) your wheels are about the same as smaller 27.5 wheels. I'm running 26x2.35" (Schwalbe) and 26x2.35 (Conti) on 29mm inner width rims and I noticed that my wheel diameter (so including tire) was pretty much the same as what the man on a Giant Anthem 27.5 wheeled bike had. These must have been 2.2" wide or so. So on the regular BFe Silver build you have pretty much the same geometry as what you'd have with 26x2.4". If you insist going down that route that is. You'll need to build wheels with boost hubs anyway so there probably aren't your "old" wheels, unless you're going to use adaptors. I'm going to stick with the hardtail I have so if I'm getting a fully on the side (that is, if I'm getting a fully then it is most likely going to be the Flare), it is nice to have one wheelsize so that I can swap tires, tire inserts etc. So yeah from that point of view if you're going to build new wheels for your new bike anyway, you could opt for 26". But if you're going for a complete bike and it is either going to be your only bike or your other bike already runs 27.5 or 29", there may not be much reason to go for 26".

I realize Cy must have seen me drop by since forever talking about their amazing Flare bikes yet never buy one...
  • 2 0
 Good stuff Cotic, I have had a few over the years and even though I don't have a Cotic now I still feel like a part of the family and will always keep an eye on things, this new one looks rad.
  • 2 0
 As a blacksmith/farrier, I have a special affinity for steel. This is an absolutely beautiful bike. Now, what can I sell to get myself one.
  • 4 0
 Cotic, Banshee, and Canfield.....schwing schwing!!
  • 1 0
 Oh man! This or a Phantom V3 are both calling me.
  • 3 0
 There are American bikes, European bikes, and... English bikes.
  • 4 7
 All made in China anyway Wink
  • 13 0
 @allbiker: Apart from this one, which is made mostly in Scotland ;-)
  • 3 0
 @cotic-bikes: When you said mostly, which part you meant ? ;D
Joke aside , you got some lovely machine there, I would love to ride it just sadly can't afford at this shit time. Just searching new job
  • 5 0
 @allbiker: Thanks. Sorry to hear about your job. Hope you get something else lined up soon.
  • 5 0
 @allbiker: The front triangle is made in Scotland, I think the chainstays are made in Taiwan, not sure about the seatstays. So no mainland China thus far. With a Cane Creek fork and shock then they’re both USA made. Hope BB, headset, brakes, stem, hubs; all made in the UK. If you went with a full custom build you could have a German BikeYoke dropper, British Hope pedals and carbon bars, German Continental tyres, Canadian WeAreOne carbon rims, American ODI grips, Japanese Shimano drivetrain. How’s that?
  • 3 1
 These porn bikes should be hidden from sensitive eyes such as mine. I`m gonna have wet dreams again because of you Wink
  • 2 1
 @cotic-bikes: These new bikes look great but I’ve always been a short chainstay guy. Any chance of throwing a leg over one of these in the US?
  • 2 0
 I'm in the states and had the last version of the FlareMax. Size Large. Ask me what you want to know.
  • 4 0
 Thanks Zerort. We have a few lovely customers in the US willing to let you have a go. We are working on a demo tour option for some of our bikes with a partner company, but the Covid19 situation has put the brakes on that for now. We will announce when we can. We do have our current Love It Or Your Money Back guarantee in place worldwide now. If you don't like the bike after 30 days, send it back, no quibbles.

Also, particularly when you're talking about longer bikes, it's important not to focus on a single number. The geometry works as a whole, and shorter chainstays wouldn't be as balanced. I have written a piece on this over on the Cotic website if you would be willing to spend 5 minutes have a read:

www.cotic.co.uk/longshot
  • 2 0
 @cotic-bikes: I hear what you're saying about longer bikes, but not everyone is your height. How do you know that making the chainstays proportionally longer (by leaving them around 450mm) on the small and medium sized frames is the right thing to do? Especially since you write the geometry works as a whole?

I'd tend to classify the RocketMax along with the Banshee Titan, a great option for taller riders.
  • 2 0
 @dave-f: I don't "know" because I can never be of a different body shape, but it's not just me who does the testing. As it mentions in the press release, Sam our Demo Captain has run a RocketMAX in small for over a year, and has been involved in the feedback process, as are a few of the others here at Cotic who run medium and large frames too. I have a process of checking these things. Sure the weight balance will be slightly different on a small vs an XL, but in reality the different in weight distribution between these two sizes is 2%. It's in the noise compared to all the other things going on with the bikes.
  • 4 1
 Jeebus. Not more STA comments. Cotic - sick looking bike. Congrats.
  • 2 0
 How much for one of these to be shipped to Oz? Any discounts for your convict cousins Smile
Brilliant jobs lads!!
  • 1 0
 For a frame, for current pricing divide uk price by 1.2 (deducting uk VAT) then add £130 for shipping. We can do bikes too, but we do that on a order by order basis because unfortunately the shipping is very high for a bike box so we discuss it with the customer each time.
  • 2 0
 Wonder if the Frame is lighter than a Alloy Hightower
  • 14 0
 Don't know, but it's definitely lighter than a carbon Megatower. We have a weighed weight for one of those.
  • 3 0
 Aluminium Hightower weights 4.4kg...
  • 2 0
 @Paco77: Large RocketMAX Gen3 weighs 3.7kg without shock.
  • 1 0
 @Paco77: So that would be 4.2kg ish with DB Air CS according to claimed weights for the shock.
  • 1 0
 @Paco77: I hope with a Shock
  • 5 0
 @cotic-bikes: and for the what seem inevitable comparisons, that's exactly the same as the claimed for the privateer. Seems steel ain't so heavy...
  • 2 0
 The steel triangle is made in Scotland, the rear comes from Taiwan.
  • 2 0
 Review please. This, or the Titan?
  • 1 1
 Last year the frame went up 250gbp because no longer made in Taiwan and this year up another 400gbp on top of 250gbp shock upgrade. Why another $400?
  • 4 0
 The actualy frame price increase is just 10%, or £200. The total increase of £400 is because we no longer offer the DB Air IL shock on this bike, partly because it's not metric 230mm sized, and partly because we designed this bike to make use of the bigger volume shock. The Air CS shock was always a £200 upcharge on the Gen2 model, so like-for-like the cost increase is from £2,199 to £2,399.

The frame cost increase is simply that costs excalated last year because as Five Land learned more through the year about the process (remember, they were only founded 2 years ago from scratch) they found that they couldn't quite reach their theoretical capacity, so had to put their prices up a bit to account for this. It was all done in a totally transparent and collaborative way, but we sucked up the reduced margin on the previous frames because we had only just released the Flare when this happened. However, it unfortunately wasn't a sustainable position, hence the price rise now. To be honest, we're getting upward pressure on the Taiwan built frames, due to supply chain price increases and exchange rates. I wouldn't expect the current Taiwan pricing to last until the end of the year to be honest, and we've held those prices for the last 5 years.
  • 1 0
 How much percent progessivity did the gen2 have and what is it now?
Asking for a coil friend....
  • 1 0
 New frame is designed for big can air shock… and specifically not for coil use.
  • 1 0
 @Spittingcat: i noticed, still would like to know the percentages (hence the specific question).
Progressive Spring and hydraulic bottom out (EXT) could make it work.
  • 1 0
 @Spittingcat: isn't the point of the large air can to make the shock more linear (coil-like)? So, if the frame was designed for a hv air can, isn't it likely to be progressive enough to also run a coil?
  • 3 0
 @Ben-P: We aren't supporting the EXT. We have had people trying to put them on the previous bike (which was more progressive and therefore should have theoretically suited the coil) and they were getting suggestions of very soft springs, which resulted in a frame failure. Once we insisted on the spring rate that we recommended according to our design for 30% sag, apparently the ride wasn't as good. We simply don't have the time as a small company to test all the shocks out there, but we are confident that the big can air shocks out there that work fairly conventionally (like the Cane Creek and Fox for example) will work great. Once this lockdown stuff is finished I am going to get down to see Chris Porter and figure out a setup with the EXT, but until then, we don't support it. We have a duty to our customers to supply them with a safe bike and sound advice based on experience and knowledge.
  • 2 0
 @cotic-bikes: ok, so again what are the progessivity values on gen2/3?
That would help me to compare the gen3 to frames that i have been riding including my current gen2 with progressive spring on a cc db il coil which i enjoy (i tend to run less than 30% of sag).
I'm thinking about to go up a size but definitely want to stick with a coil shock because i'm tired of servicing air shocks every ~second month to keep it running smoothly.
  • 2 0
 @Ben-P: The Gen2 bike had a 28% progression rate. The new bike is 21%.
  • 2 0
 @cotic-bikes: interesting... why did you decide to make the gen 3 more linear?
  • 1 0
 @thegoodflow: To open up the tuning range on the shock for more people. We found through customer feedback and experience with the previous generation bikes that people at the lighter end of the scale sometimes found the bike a little harsh, and at the other end of the scale, heavier guys would have so much pressure in the shock to get sag that they would never bottom it out. This was because the progression rate demanded a shock tune with very option compression damping and no volume spacers. We sorted out those riders with different shocks, (both benefitted from going from the DB Air IL to the DB Air CS because the big can shock doesn't ramp up as much and runs at about 60% the pressure), but we realised that if we backed off the progression a little, those riders could get what they needed from the base tune, and people wanting the punchier feel of the previous bikes could add volume spacers to get that. The previous generation didn't give us that option. It was mainly a philosophy developed for the Gen3 FlareMAX released a few months ago, but it worked so well that we applied it to the enduro bikes to see how it worked, and it worked well, so here we are.
  • 1 0
 Need one with a shimano gearbox in it. No rush, i won't finish paying for my last bike for another 2 years.
  • 2 0
 Not heard anything since the patent thing blew up a few months ago, but certainly keeping our ear to the ground on that one.
  • 2 0
 @cotic-bikes: I promise I'll buy on if you make it! Pinkie promise.
  • 2 0
 " Launches the Rocket " boom.
  • 2 0
 Good mullet option?
  • 1 0
 Black out the drivetrain on the blue one and boom. Nice.
  • 2 0
 Job Smile
  • 1 0
 Weight?
  • 5 0
 Platinum build in the photos on the blue bike is 14-14.5kg depending on wheel/tyre spec eg, 14kg with HUNT TrailWide and Light Slashguard WTB tyres, 14.5 with EnduroWide and Tough casing tyres. Gold builds with XT or Eagle GX around 15.1kg.
  • 10 4
 Who cares. It weighs what it weighs.
  • 1 0
 @cotic-bikes: what frame would that be? I'm interested in an xt build with lyriks trail wide wheels and ight slash guard tyres. What would the approx weight be?
  • 1 0
 @cotic-bikes: in large sorry
  • 2 0
 @ALSORAN: The medium Gen2 bike built almost to that spec with Tough rear tyre was weight by MBUK Magazine at 15.1kg, so you're looking at a little under 15kg for that build.
  • 11 0
 @fartymarty: is this also a dating policy?
  • 3 0
 @cotic-bikes: Having recently weighed a few long-travel 29ers with comparable builds in real life, that is a fair weight - just over 34lbs with pedals for the XT.
  • 2 2
 If you're really asking this about a steel framed bike, you shouldn't be buying it.
  • 1 0
 I wouldn’t get bogged down in weight personally, its how the bike rides which is more important. its there or thereabouts weight wise due to great design. Going on past experience ride quality will be exceptional.
  • 4 0
 @Ajorda: It's a legitimate question, especially at the price being asked. You can get cheaper steel FS bikes, but they won't be comaprable in weight to alu or carbon-framed ones.
Some steel framebuilders will say weight doesn't matter, but they probably don't do big days in the mountains themselves, or spend much time riding flatter trails.
Cotic tend to make FS bikes which are not riduculously heavy and pedal reasonably well - at least the few I've ridden.
  • 2 0
 @Ajorda: Quite the opposite. Steel can be in the ballpark with other materials, but it's easier to blow past the benchmark with a few bad choices.
  • 2 0
 Don't get so hung up on weight. I bought a Gen3 Nomad in weight-weenie guise, and it was 28lbswith no pedals. As I've broken things (forks 3x, handlebar, multiple saddles, cranks 2x, shock, pedals, etc), it's crept up to 32lbs, and now spends more time on the trail than in the repair stand.
  • 1 0
 idk why hes being coy in this thread, but just above he says its 3.7kg for size large. Which is exactly the same as the Privateer, and less than the alloy and carbon megatower.
  • 1 0
 Can I get one in Red?
  • 1 0
 Sorry, we don't do custom paint colours. We do the FlareMAX Gen3 in a lovely neon red called Red Dwarf.
  • 1 2
 Opportunity missed to bump an ESTA to 77°.
  • 17 0
 We don't see it that way. Everything in the geometry is carefully considered, and like all the other parts of that system, STA is a compromise of competing requirements. We have tried even steeper seat angles, but we don't like them for longer rides. Sure they are great when winching up something super steep and tech, but most climbs are steady gradient spins for a decent length of time, and we choose a seat angle that allows you to "sit back" off your shoulders and wrists a bit. Otherwise it feels like you spend the whole ride in a semi-pressup position which is tiring. You can always scooch forward a little on the super steep stuff, but if the seat angle is too steep you can't sit back to spin for a bit. Funny how a nearly 76 deg seat angle is "conservative" already ????
  • 4 0
 Cotic publish seat angle at different saddle heights, it stays pretty good with the seat up unlike some other brands.
  • 2 1
 @cotic-bikes: Fair comment. Personally, I feel that 76° at full ride height is as an optimum.
  • 2 0
 @woots: Missed that detail in the chart. My bad.
  • 5 0
 @jollyXroger: Just checked on the CAD. Sliding your saddle forward 13mm gives you the same effect as a 76deg seat angle on this bike.
  • 4 0
 @cotic-bikes: Which also shortens an ETT a bit, making that XL perfect for my 191cm size. Smile
  • 3 0
 @jollyXroger: I'm 189cm and ride an XL. It's a good size for guys our height, in my opinion ;-)
  • 5 0
 The actual seat angle is very steep, one has to see the whole picture.

Many brands quote a on-trend 77° or whatever seat angle measured at relatively low seat heights, and then have a super slack 60-something° actual seat angle. By the time your saddle is at your pedaling height, the virtual seat angle is slacker than Cotic's
  • 2 0
 I’m tired of everyone having to be “on trend” in regards to geometry. There’s more to a good bike than having vanguard measurements.
  • 1 0
 longer chainstays don't require as steep of HTA, IMHO
  • 1 3
 Core sample risk? May want to introduce some adapted bar ends for the seat stay.
  • 4 0
 Not sure where from? We've had the same basic design seatstay since 2012 and never had an issue.
  • 2 0
 You could loose a finger in those disc brakes! ..a limb could get between the spokes!! Oh my gosh those rocks on the side of the trail need foam padding installed pronto! Mountain biking is virtually suicide.
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