Video: 8 Enduro Field Test Bikes Hucked to Flat
PINKBIKE FIELD TEST
An Eclectic Collection of 8 Enduro Bikes Hucked to Flat
Whiplash has been know to occur
An Eclectic Collection of 8 Enduro Bikes Hucked to Flat
Whiplash has been know to occur
We’re back with another fan-favorite to wrap up another glorious Field Test. This round of the Huck to Flat is more exciting than the last, thanks to our friends at MTB Hopper. That gave us plenty of hang time and whiplash. Chains were dropped and heads were slapped. I think my feet even hit the ground a few times!
I think it’s fair to say that half of the bikes walked away without too much criticism, but the other half wasn’t so lucky.
We noted a few creaks from the Commencal’s linkage during the test, but there was a loud cry when it was sent off the ramp. Word on the street is that there are updated spacers to alleviate that issue. That ultra-progressive linkage on the Unno Burn couldn’t save it from bottoming out. The Pole Onni also emitted a solid clunk, although not as severe as what we felt on the trail.
And of course, there is the elephant in the room; Trek’s Slash and the chain-dropping issue. This wasn’t something I experienced with all the laps I put it through down the Whistler mountainside, but when we brought it to a parking lot with a wooden kicker, it became the start of the show, right in front of the slow-motion camera.
Dario worked his mechanic magic and hasn’t experienced any dropped chains since realigning the lower pulley wheel. You wouldn’t believe it, but a whole 2mm seems to make all of the difference.
Luckily, that’s all for this round of the Huck to Flat!
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Are you asking for a one footed landing HTF?
Sounds like something they may need an intern for.
should I pay $12,000 for the top level bike from the box and then fix the manufacturer's 2mm. issue on my own?
Can you clarify if you guys have you hucked it to flat numerous times since this adjustment to see if it would happen again?
That fix is spacing the guide out 7mm from the ISCG tabs and rotating it a bit clockwise to increase chainwrap and mitigate chain growth. It varies a bit depending on frame size and drivetrain, but clocking the guide and positioning the roller so it's 10-24mm from the bottom of the chainstay seems to be the sweetspot.
This bike rips, so if it tickles your fancy, I wouldn't rule it out because of this fixable issue.
I don't expect anything to be bolt and go out the box, there's always a shake down run..first year stuff can has some minor issues in any field...
Bike rips love mone I adjusted my chainline cause I didn't get a 55mm set up..zero stack ring got me 54 so I adjusted lower cog and have ZERO chain issues...
Attitudes like this, or @braydenkromis12 and @Amstafff are part of the reasons why prices go up, items get proprietary parts, and things get more difficult to fix.
Its a pretty self indulgent point of view that everything is perfect for you, at all times. Things arent always perfect, and rather than moaning about how inconvenient it would be for you (to think that youre whinging about something that hasnt actually happened to you...) think of it as an opportunity for you to problem solve an issue. Whether thats walking back into the bike shop, doing some online research, or, and heaven forbid, get your hands a bit dirty and sort it out on your own.
Appreciate @mikekazimer for providing some background, well done all around PB
People getting up in arms about expensive toys for the forest, that they havent actually experienced.
Imagine being a 15 yr old bike shop employee, and someone with the attitude of @stravaismyracecourse brings in a Slash to complain about the major design flaw of 2mm of added spacing!
Man I remember the days of endless chain drops, shimming Mr Dirt guides, hand bending der hangers, constantly tightening headsets, all the Mega9 missed shifts, and toeing canti and V-brake pads.
That said, it seems like the problem has been remedied, and it’s simple enough.
Ah Mr Dirt chain guides...
But if buying a defective product is acceptable with you, then I think you’re a sucker and a chump. If the solution is simple, then great. It will be simple for them to fix. That’s what a good company does — own their mistakes and make it right. I don’t know why that’s too much to ask.
The baffling thing to me is people acting like it’s a bridge too far for a customer to expect the company or their representative dealers to take care of their customers when there’s an issue with a faulty product.
A company has to be giving a little time the bikes tested by reviewers didn't seem to have any issues if they did none reported it...possibly the bikes were checked out and sent with proper spacing , the production set up I'm sure is a different section then marketing and loaners...
I've been in business my whole life so when this happens even to fellow competitors in my industry I will sort it out for them.
Fox stuff is having issues and I don't see a massive witch hunt over the float X2, or grip dampers I've pulled apart with no oil, or the ones that have separated like I repaired today...I won't start crap cause stuff happens and some stuff takes a moment to get ironed out
I have never once in my adult life bought a bike and expected perfection out of the box. Everything gets checked, adjusted, lubed and torqued. Tyres get swapped, cockpit swapped and adjusted, seat height and angles set. If checking my chain guide angle is the price of owning a bike that absolutely slaps and suits me perfectly then I’m not about to complain.
So if this is the reason and it's a spacer for chainline, it's a simple remedy and doesn't warrant the backlash and most of all 90% don't even have the bike or even seen it..
So I'd choose those who remedy and overcome to ride with me versus those who lay down and act like they are dying cause a tire went flat and it's the end of the world .just saying..
So if it turns out the 7mm spacer remedies chainline then that's what I consider a simple fix and oversight...it happens..the bike rides great I'm not a trek fanboy, been on about everything and canfields for a majority of my years..loved rocky mountain RM series aside of breaking them in half...that's a design flaw and yet was still a blast to ride..had 3 lol .
Stop making things sound like there these detrimental design flaws, its spacing an idler wheel by 2mm, and clocking the guide.
To have the audacity to think that you should be able to go about life without experiencing inconvenience is pretty wild.
"After seeing it happen in slow motion, I'm staggered that Trek released that bike into the wild. I would be so angry if I had spent thousands of my hard-earned dollars on a bike with a massive, massive design flaw like that."
Considering the solution is spacing the idler by 2mm, and clocking the chainguide (which, if youre unaware, is 3 screws, on adjustable slots) I think referring to it as a massive design flaw, is very dramatic.
Now, if a person isnt mechanically inclined or has no idea about what is being stated, maybe this seems like a daunting task, but its still not a "massive design flaw". Can we agree on that?
As far as being a Trek shill, I've never actually owned a Trek, ridden a demo Liquid 30 a bunch, didnt love it, had issues with the wheel/frame flex in the rear, rubbing on the chainstay. I would consider that a design flaw, but it was really only an issue for heavier riders, that lacked skill.
I will say, theres opportunity in situations, and all of us are better off to search for the positive ones, rather than the opposite.
As a note, I dont think I said problem solvers were an eve shinking group, nor did I suggest anyone buy anything
I appreciate that Trek is what they are, just like I appreciate Forbidden, Knolly, Transition, etc
You have yourself a good day man, hope it picks up for you
Does it suck your new $$$ bike drops chains? Yes. Is it the end of the world? Not by a long shot, and Trek will make it right if the end user is not capable.
I bought a new bike from a reputable manufacturer recently. It shipped with a chainring with the wrong offset, resulting in, you guessed it, persistent dropped chains. I identified the problem, took it to the LBS where I bought it, and the manufacturer warrantied it without incident. Got my new chainring installed a few days later and we're good.
Kind of a pain in the ass but not a big deal in the grand scheme. Go look at any vehicle forum and you'll see the much worse. It happens.
For the record, I think what you did was completely reasonable and well within your rights as a consumer.
I will break it down for you slowly, since I am either not communicating clearly enough, or you are a complete midwit.
1. I am completely ambivalent about the Trek. That means I do not care. I have absolutely nothing invested in it, neither love for Trek nor hate. Sounds like they came up with a solution to the problem. Great.
2. So put the Trek out of your head for a second. My main point is that if there is a problem with a new product, and I did not cause the problem and it came straight from the factory or a showroom floor, it is not unreasonable for me to expect the manufacturer or the distributor help me fix said problem. That fix can come in the form or communication (hey, try a 2mm spacer), repair (hey, let us install this 2mm spacer for you), replacement, or whatever. Why is that a bridge too far? The problem originated with the manufacturer or dealer — why should they not be held accountable?
If anyone wants to take the time, go to the MRP website, they have installation instructions for all the "high pivot" bike manufactures that use their chain tensioners. And yes, the spacers make a big difference due to the different drivelines (e.g. 52mm vs 55mm, etc.). And the chain tensioner bracket has a specific callout where it needs to be positioned. So the real issue is that the folks overseas to to assemble them correctly.
Would it be fair to say that the wrong part installed, might be slightly different than the correct spacing of a guide wheel?
One would require the replacement of the incorrect part, one would require spacing a guide wheel (adding a washer or two)
I take exception to your comment "inherent design/mechanical flaw as seems to be the case here"
Thats not what it is, can we agree on that?
Im gonna overlook your other comment about being a complete midwit (?) and say this.
We dont see eye to eye on this, I appreciate anyone who is willing to diagnose and rectify an issue, especially when its this small on their own. I think theres merit in that, and I think it should be celebrated to some degree. I am wiling to cut some slack to the manufacturer, assembler, bike shop, etc for things like this, it happens.
What bothers me, is a host of people who havent actually experienceed the problem, throwing around "design flaw", etc for something fairly insignificant.
Now, its fine that we disagree on this, but theres prolly no need for either of us to try and belittle each other over it. Seem fair?
I'll try and do better myself
And honestly feel free to rep the bike brand and shop for helping out with that
Also, did I miss a reply where @Amstafff noted that I "attacked" them
Can you provide an example of a small brand that was “savaged”?
Couldn't be bothered to run recommended settings and gave the fork slack for not working correctly.
In the videos, there is exactly 1 mention of price for both bikes, one.
In the written portion, price is not noted, or even mentioned as a con for the Nicolai, but it is mentioned for the Ibis.
The Inis comes with carbon rims, and Hydra hubs, and a full SRAM XX transmission, with AXS dropper.
You’re talking absolute nonsense.
I’m far more interested in the Nicolai bikes than the Ibis, but I’m willing to bet, pretty well everything they thought about both bikes being spot on.
There’s a 7lb difference in those two bikes, and the Ibis prolly feels like a rocket ship compared to the Nicolai on anything other than janky fall line descents.
PB tried 3 different dampers in this fork, all in an effort to try and get the best out of it.
Maybe ai missed where they didn’t run the recommended settings, could you point that out?
And to say they “savaged” them, again with the flair for the dramatic. Are you trying to drum up YouTube views with your silly overstated language?
Now, I know a little bit about suspension, and there are very few instances where running zero sag in off-road applications is the solution. The fast guys run stuff suspension, there no doubt, but that’s because they hit stuff much harder and faster than you or I, if your building a fork to sell to the masses, that’s not gonna win you any prizes
remember that my job is to male a suspension go fast(!)... if I have feedbacks clear a d expert, I have the cure.
this on the system must work at 0-5 mm STATIC sag and then everything is done by the SL valve that manages the DYNAMICAL SAG.
So 5mm sag 3% instead of 20% not surprised the damper didn't work well. Double the air pressure in your forks and see how harsh they feel.
But let's get back to the field test the session drops chains easy fix granted but an absolute pain in the arse shouldn't leave the shop like that as it is priced as a premium product also sounds like a bag of bolts, has a silly one-piece bar and stem which they pulled off, while also having huge adjustments they are aftermarket purchases which is a break from industry norms and its also only 300 euros cheaper than the Nicolai without a drivetrain. The Comencal either has terrible bearings or really poor frame alignment and the bottle contacts the shock which is frankly pisspoor design and manufacture. These are all brushed over in the reviews of the big brands. I get they didn't like the Nicolai for a host of reasons but the weighting of the reasons doesn't add up to me. The Trek in particular is bloody expensive and seems quite compromised in a number of areas. In short for me when I buy a bike I research the longevity of frames, how easy bikes are to maintain, warranties and how those manufacturers apply them
Where exactly did you pull this direct quote from the Bright designer, and have you given any thought to the sequence of events, or the timeline of the response?
Seems strange that they would provide 3 different damper cartridges, but not provide that info while doing the testing?
Some people dont seem to understand that not all quirks on bikes can be sorted prior to the bike leaving the store. You can understand that a bike might go out that hasnt been ridden down a couple DH trails, so the shop would have no idea that there was an issue? Not to mention, this bike was likely shipped to PB to be assembled, so didnt get run through a shop....
Youre trying to make up issues, where there isnt any, the one piece bar and stem, might be great for some people, maybe not for others, why on earth does that even matter?
I'm confused but your issues, and I think you are as well
1) Ibis got robbed
2) No matter which bike it is, it's wild to see how much the wheelbase contracts if you just pay attention to that area alone. Wildly wild.
What that says to me, is that the bikes progressiveness or resistance to bottom out could be affected far, far more by rider technique, weight, strength, flexibiltiy etc, than the minutae of suspension kinematics or throwing your 2023 shock on the bin as the 2024 version is clearly so much better.
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Tires are mostly springs without damping: They bounce up and down multiple times during one landing in those HTFs. Every time they get compressed, they immediately want to expand again. They move faster than the damped suspension, so that is why they can expand while the center of gravity of bike+rider is still moving towards the ground. Some time during expansion, the compressive force is stronger again and the tire starts compressing *again*, and during that time the lower part of the fork moves down, "escaping" the stanchions. You see that as "stopping to move", but in reality all the force is still being taken up by the whole system of tires, forks, flex, rider.
#trekgate
So do I get or not the slash ?!