Orbea Loki 27+ H-LTD - Review
Loki, if you’re not down with the whole mead-drinking, 12-sided-dice-tossing Norse mythology set, was the Norse god of general douchebaggery; as such, Loki was keen on deceiving others by changing his shape whilst bringing the chaos, which, in a roundabout fashion, brings us to Orbea’s new line of Loki 27+ bikes—bikes that shape-shift a bit themselves by virtue of being compatible with both 29er and 27+ wheel and tire combos. All of the Loki models follow the same basic blueprint—slack head angle, long-ish top tube, low bottom bracket, 120-millimeter travel fork. As far as hardtails go, the Loki 27+ appears to be a hard-charging brute.
Loki 27+ H-LTD Details
• Intended use: trail
• Wheel size: 27+ and 29"
• Head angle: 67°
• Hydro-formed, triple-butted aluminum frame
• 73mm threaded bottom bracket
• Sizes: S, M, L, XL
• Weight (as shown, size L w/o pedals): 30.6 pounds (13.87 kg)
• MSRP: $2,999 USD
• www.orbea.com / @orbea
• Intended use: trail
• Wheel size: 27+ and 29"
• Head angle: 67°
• Hydro-formed, triple-butted aluminum frame
• 73mm threaded bottom bracket
• Sizes: S, M, L, XL
• Weight (as shown, size L w/o pedals): 30.6 pounds (13.87 kg)
• MSRP: $2,999 USD
• www.orbea.com / @orbea
There are three Loki 27+ models in the 2016 Orbea line-up, ranging in price from $1,499 to $2,999 USD. We tested the top-shelf Loki 27+ H-LTD version, which sports the same aluminum frame, decked out in a fairly pimped-out parts kit that includes a (largely) Shimano XT 1x11 drivetrain, Fox 34 Float Factory fork, RockShox Reverb Stealth dropper post and Orbea’s own Ready 27+ 40c wheelset.
ISCG05 tabs allow you to run a chain guide and/or taco bash.
Every time I see a threaded bottom bracket, my faith in mankind is restored. At the very least, the bike won't creak.
Frame Details
The Loki 27+ features an all-aluminum frame that gets a whole lot of hydroforming love. The only tube that gets the old-school, round-profile treatment, really, is the seat tube, and even that tube bends as it nears the bottom bracket shell in order to help improve tire clearance. The Loki 27+ is, to put it simply, a pretty thing. Not digging the baby blue color? You can also get this thing in Darth Vader-y black or a fetching bumble-bee paint scheme.
But there’s more than swoopy and fluted tubes at play here. The Loki sports ISCG 05 tabs, for everyone who wants to run a chain guide or, at the very least, a taco bash guard. The frame also features plenty of ports to cleanly route shifter cables and rear brake line, though there is a bit of external routing here and there. The dropper post line, for instance, routes its way along the top of the downtube before diving into the seat tube. Similarly, the last foot or so of rear brake line rolls along the non-drive side chainstay on its way to the brake caliper. All in all, however, it’s a fairly clean and hassle-free setup. No birds’ nests under the bottom bracket on this one.
Can't get enough front derailleur in your life? The Loki's removable front-derailleur mount allows you to go either 1x or 2x.
While I didn't run into tire clearance issues with the stock Maxxis Chronicle 3.0 tires, a more aggressively-lugged 3.0 tire might prove a tight squeeze between those seatstays
Here’s where some people begin gnashing their teeth over backwards compatibility (or lack thereof)—Orbea gave the Loki 27+ Boost 148 rear spacing, ostensibly to keep the rear end reasonably tidy (16.9 inches/430 millimeters) while still providing clearance for 27x3.0 or 29x2.4 tires—even when you’re running a front derailleur. And, yes, the Loki does front derailleurs as well. While our model is running a 1x11 set up, Loki 27+ frames also sport removable front derailleur mounts, so you can get all 2x on this thing, if that’s how you roll.
Geometry
The Loki 27+ is no crusty throwback. The Spaniards aimed to make a completely up-to-date rig, as evidenced by the relatively slack head-tube angle (67 degrees), low bottom bracket (12 inches/307 millimeters), long top tube (24.4 inches/621 millimeters) and tidy chain stays (16.9-inches/430-millimeters). What does all this geo wankery actually add up to on the trail? A bike that doesn't feel nervous in the least when the descents grow steep and tight.
Specifications
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12x148mm rear spacing helps keep the chainstay length to a reasonable 430mm and still allow for a front derailleur.
Setup
Dialing in a hardtail ain’t exactly rocket science. Generally, it’s simply a matter of getting the sag right on your fork and riding off into the sunset. To that end, the Fox 34 Float Factory is dead simple to set up. I set my sag at 25 percent, adjusted the compression damping a bit and was good to go. Tire pressure, though, whew…it’s absolutely make or break on a plus-size bike like this one. Sure, tire pressure is always key on any bike, but there’s no point at all of even mucking about with these balloon tires if you’re not getting just the right amount of compliance from the tire. Doing so without also getting an unnerving amount of tire roll in the corners takes a bit of trial and error.
I wound up settling on 12 psi up front and 13 psi out back. Unlike a “normal” 2.3 or 2.4-inch tire, being off by just two or three psi in either tire results in an absolutely horrid experience on the trail. A little too high and you’re getting your fillings rattled out of your head. A little too low and your sphincter gets a workout every time you come off a jump or hit a corner hot and your tires suddenly feel like they want to travel in a direction you’re not actually pointing the bike at. Get tire pressure just right, however, and it’s a whole ‘nother story.
No surprise - you put a lightweight tire with a massive footprint on a bike and the climbing traction is unreal. The Loki 27+ scales the steeps with ease.
Climbing
The Loki 27+ is no cross-country racer. With a weight creeping towards 31 pounds, it’s downright “big boned” by hardtail standards and, let’s be blunt, even heavier than some of the 150-millimeter travel super bikes out there. And yet despite all that, this thing absolutely rips up climbs. Sitting down. Standing. Moshing about like some kind of drunken fool—the bike really doesn’t care what you are doing up there in the cockpit. If your heart is beating and you can turn the pedals, the Loki 27+ just heads up the hill with you aboard it.
Those three-inch Maxxis Chronicle tires simply hook up. There are more aggressively-lugged plus-tires out there, but the Chronicle’s big footprint negates the need for massive tractor-style crown blocks. I routinely cleaned stretches of trail that normally leave me cursing. At least, that’s true in conditions ranging from dry to sorta-wet. In absolute downpours, the Chronicle is less effective at getting you up and over techy bits of climbs, but that’s generally true of just about any tire during monsoon season.
Don’t get me wrong—billy-goat XC racer types, hell bent on destroying Strava KOMs, should opt for a different rig entirely, but if your goal is simply to get to the top, the Loki 27+ gets you to the summit with far more grace than its weight might suggest.
Plus-size hardtails aren't going to magically make rear suspension obsolete - at high speeds, the limits of an undamped air spring make themselves known, but descending on the Loki 27+ is still a lot of fun.
Descending
When the plus-size hardtails began rolling out at Sea Otter 2015, there was some fairly giddy talk from certain quarters about how strapping those big tires to hard tails might make them so capable that they'd one day replace shorter-travel full-suspension trail bikes altogether. Well, look, I think we all knew that was a bit of bullshit. Put a massive tire on a hardtail and it’s still a friggin’ hardtail. It doesn’t become some kind of magical unicorn that eats rear shocks for breakfast. To that end, if you’re going mach-chicken into a boulder field on the Loki, the rad factor diminishes quickly. As with any hardtail, you’re going to find that the rear wheel is off dancing to its own evil tune when you’d like it to be placidly sticking to the ground beneath you.
Adding a bigger tire to the mix does add a surprising amount of control and stability—and I’ll beat that drum a bit more in a second or two—but an undamped air spring quickly shows its limitations on successive big hits. The Loki is better than most hardtails when you're blazing along at eye-watering speeds down uber-technical terrain, but it’s not some new, magic-carpet ride. There are definite limits to what a mid-fat tire can do. So, now that we’ve dispensed with that, let’s talk about where the bike shines.
 | Adding a bigger tire to the mix adds a surprising amount of control and stability, but an undamped air spring quickly shows its limitations on successive big hits. |
The Loki 27+ truly comes into its own on rolling, technical trail. To put it plainly, it’s a hell of a lot more fun than you might expect. Orbea nailed the geometry on this thing. The roomy cockpit imparts a confident, centered feel to the ride. The bottom bracket is nice and low (and it’s lower than the spec sheet suggests, since the tires sag significantly once you’re astride the bike). The 67-degree head angle sounds a bit slack, but never led to excessive wheel flopping on steep climbs and, more to the point, gave the bike a very neutral feel on steep, techy descents. There are bikes with shorter chainstays, but Orbea’s done a bang up job here as well. The end result is a bike that can be easily threaded through tight and chunky sections of trails. There isn’t a crappy, blown-out downhill switchback that this bike hasn’t met and loved.
So, yeah, it’s a nimble little number, but those big tires add an interesting twist to the Loki’s ride since they also allow you to ignore the smart line entirely and plow, instead, into and over all manner of things on the trail that you'd normally avoid like the plague. “Forgiving” sorta sums things up, but still doesn’t do the Loki justice. Is this a good thing or bad thing?
Doubtless, there will be people who argue that plus-size tires merely dumb down the ride and allow for people with shit skills to do things they shouldn’t do. I'm familiar with that argument, but having once made the same pitch against both suspension forks and rear suspension (two things you'd now have to pry from my cold, dead fingers), I’m loathe to dismiss an emerging breed of bikes just because we haven’t used them before or, moreover, because they haven’t fully come into their own yet. Plus-size tires make this Orbea hardtail a lot more fun to ride on a lot more trails....and I am completely copacetic with that.
Shimano has earned a reputation for reliable brakes, but I was expecting, at a minimum, SLX spec at this price.
The Kashima-coated Fox 34 Float Factory 120 fork, on the other hand, is a nice, stout bit of spec.
Component Check
• Wheels and Tires: Orbea equips the Loki 27+ with an in-house wheelset. Both the hubs and wide, shallow rims are of Orbea’s own design. No complaints there—they stayed true and got the job done. The Maxxis Chronicle tires are outstanding in dry conditions, okay in mild rain and a bit freaky in truly sloppy mud. There were a few sobering, hydroplaning moments when I hit peanut-butter consistency mud at high speeds. Since nobody’s 3.0 tire seems to actually be the same size, choose carefully when it's time to retread this bike—tire clearance will be scarce with some of the meatier models out there.
• RockShox Reverb Dropper Post: I’ve long been a fan of the Reverb’s infinite travel and consistency, but was surprised and a bit frustrated by a leak in the remote assembly on this particular post. It was easily remedied when I returned to my work bench, but it rendered the post inoperable mid ride when the thing started dribbling 2.5wt suspension fluid.
• Shimano XT / Race Face Aeffect 1x11 drivetrain: Shimano’s XT rear shifter and Direct Mount rear derailleur bang out precise and consistent shifts. There’s also plenty of granny gear to go around, given the 28-tooth ring that graces the Race Face Aeffect crankset.
Pinkbike's Take:
| The Loki 27+ is a little ripper of a hardtail, capable of being ridden hard over terrain normally reserved for all-mountain bikes. That says a lot. Personally speaking, the Loki wouldn't ever replace my favorite full-suspension bike, but I'm a squishy-bike kind of guy. If you, on the other hand, favor the simplicity of a hardtail and are looking for a bike that offers a bit more versatility and capability, the Loki delivers with good spec, dialed frame geometry and an ability to play nice with both 29er and 27+ wheels and tires. - Vernon Felton |
Visit the high-res gallery for more images from this review
About the Reviewer
Stats: Age: 44 • Height: 5'11” • Inseam: 32" • Weight: 175lb • Industry affiliations / sponsors: None In 1988 Vernon started riding mountain bikes—mainly to avoid the people throwing cans of Budweiser at him during his road rides. At some point, roughly when Ronald Reagan was president and Hüsker Dü was still a band, he began loving mountain bikes on their own terms. Vernon Felton spends most of his time riding bikes, thinking about bikes, thinking about riding bikes and then riding some more on the wet and filthy trails of Bellingham, Washington. If it has a greasy chain and two wheels on it, he’s cool with it. Except for recumbents. Well, okay, maybe those too. Nah, forget it. No recumbents.
Stats: Age: 44 • Height: 5'11” • Inseam: 32" • Weight: 175lb • Industry affiliations / sponsors: None In 1988 Vernon started riding mountain bikes—mainly to avoid the people throwing cans of Budweiser at him during his road rides. At some point, roughly when Ronald Reagan was president and Hüsker Dü was still a band, he began loving mountain bikes on their own terms. Vernon Felton spends most of his time riding bikes, thinking about bikes, thinking about riding bikes and then riding some more on the wet and filthy trails of Bellingham, Washington. If it has a greasy chain and two wheels on it, he’s cool with it. Except for recumbents. Well, okay, maybe those too. Nah, forget it. No recumbents.
Author Info:
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Dope rhymes
Now I actually have an accurate meter on my pump that always works well
canfieldbrothers.com/canfield-brothers-nimble-9-wtb-trail-blazer-28-275-wheels
That being said, I think hardtails are an excellent place for plus tires. Like you said, they're still no going to charge as hard as a FS rig, but those big tires can add a ton to the fun factor when you want to get nasty. Thanks for the write-up. Definitely a bike to consider.
www.pinkbike.com/news/scott-genius-lt-700-tuned-plus-review-2016.html
Here's another:
www.singletracks.com/blog/mtb-reviews/plus-size-wheels-vs-standard-wheels-the-real-scoop-on-the-future-of-mountain-bikes
And half of this one:
nsmb.com/specialized-6fattie-fsr-comp-carbon-dual-tester-review
Maybe I'm reading too much into it, but every experience I've had on full-sus plus bikes has been the latter part of that last NSMB review. Great low speed traction, but wallowy and awkward at speed and in aggressive corners.
You got one "Yay" who also points out that if the whole thing fails than he'll still have a good 29er. You got one tester who flat out says NO. You got a "plus size tire introduction", and not a bike review that specifically points out the disadvantages and advantages. And then you got RC saying, "Capable, easy to ride, and confidence inspiring".
Seems like a mostly positive mixed bag of opinions. Like this review here...
A good tire review will tell you how a tire differs from it's competitors in very specific ways. What is the impact of nob spacing on cornering, braking, etc? Weight? Sidewall stiffness? How does it match up with the suspension? These are all question that need to be answered for a tire review to be good. Now companies are building up entirely new bikes using a whole new size of tire, and all we get is a few lines about how "its pretty good"? Even this review could have added a lot of details, but at least it's recognizing there are tradeoffs.
Maybe generic platitudes are good enough for you. They aren't for me.
You haven't tried one of these tires yet to create an opinion of your own, yet you are putting down the more informed opinions of those that have? Come on Gerry. Their descriptions were fine. If they felt vague, maybe its because they dont really feel all That radically different from a "normal" sized tire, and when the conditions permit they actually feel more normal than a conventional size, as loose dusty sometimes crappy conditions become predictable and enjoyable again.
Also, these tires and wheels do not Require a new or specific bike. My preferred local shop has had a wide 27.5 wheelset set up with both 2.8's and 3.0's that people can take out and demo, or at least use to determine if there is clearance, and guess what... They fit a Lot of normal 29'ers with clearance to spare in many instances. You don't Need boost to run them either. 27+ Diameter is slightly smaller than 29 as well, so thats also not a concern. People have tried them, liked them, bought them, passed on them, loved them, but each was able to at least form a real experience based opinion. Maybe you could do this too if you can talk your local shop into it?
The only real offender here is Boost. No great way to get around that. Boost was not needed to accomplish fitting a bigger tire between forks and stays, and its going to be a boundary for a lot of people that might like to try.
Maybe we should start a new club??
I'm claiming it now... 100/142 For Life! ;-)
Also, Boost, per Trek, had nothing to do with plus sizes. It was originally about making mid and low level 29er wheels stiffer and stronger. They just discovered it worked well with plus sizes. And in a vacuum, it is a better spacing since you can get better clearance, stiffer wheels, and shorter chainstays (in theory). The problem is everyone and their dog already owns 12x142 wheels, and it reeks of planned obsolescence.
All the other points you've brought up in the meantime, some I agree with, some I don't, are just cover for the original bullshit. But just because, I'd like to point out the largest piece of bullshit as related to the topic at hand.
"Even this review could have added a lot of details, but at least it's recognizing there are tradeoffs."
Now that is complete and utter bullshit... cause I've never heard anyone anywhere at any time not be fully aware of tradeoffs to plus. EVERY aspect of mountainbiking has tradeoff's... plus size bikes/tires/etc. are no different.
Course, all of us are full of shit sometimes. So no biggie.
Now I'm genuinely curious, what details would you like to see added here and feel has been missing from other reviews? I guess I've always been able to extrapolate what I want from reviews and take them for what they are... to Me. Someone can rave about something, but if there is remotely something to baseline against you should be able to tell fairly easily if you will share their opinion when weighing your own personal considerations. Or do people really take everything they read and hear at face value??
Did you read Uncle Dave's review/experience with them? I thought that was a great example of where the platform can shine and make a huge immediate difference. Like everything, there is going to be two sides to the coin. Uncle Dave is the best. Vernon's not bad ;-D
nsmb.com/uncle-dave-eats-27-5-crow
I also own a DH bike, but I'm curious and conflicted about other DH bikes. In addition, I own an AM and an XC bike, and am curious and conflicted about other AM and XC bikes as well. Are you surprised by this too? Does the color of your oatmeal in the morning surprise you? How about the smoothness of the pavement on the drive to work? Oh, and my stache is running 2.8" 650b nobby nics, so it's about the barest minimum "plus" you can get. Which is why I like to use that tire for, say, the procore example, because I happen to have direct experience with it. I can't tell though, are you insinuating something? If so, cut the passive aggressive crap and state it (but no, you don't get pictures, had a bike stolen that way).
What is the review missing? Well, it did an okay job of discussing tradeoffs, and at least recognized that some of the issues with plus size are inherent to bigger tires. For example, it at least recognized that putting a big balloon tire is basically like putting an undamped air spring on your bike. Sure it may suck up small chatter, but if you hit a rock or root garden at speed, things are going to go sideways in a hurry. Which, as Felton notes, makes all the talk about replacing shorter FS bikes complete BS. I would like to see a bit more talk about cornering, which I've felt is the single biggest area plus tires fall short in. Maybe there's a trick to it? Maybe not?
As for the uncle dave review, I too love uncle dave but that is the perfect example of everything wrong with plus reviews. Pros: EVERYTHING. Cons: tire selection sucks right now. He states he ate shit in a berm, but there's not any connection that maybe, just maybe, the tires had something to do with it. Also "made the non-plus genius seem silly and archaic". That's quite the statement- maybe some non-plus genius owners would take issue? I was able to demo the genius LT + for an afternoon, and frankly I cannot disagree more with dave. It was the least versatile non-DH bike I've ridden. It had great low speed traction, but still was a 160mm AM bike. Which means it still gets spanked on the climbs by any trail/XC bike. On the descents, again, great low speed traction, but plus size tires roll like a dog in corners, and as mentioned earlier are terrible at hitting rock gardens. So it was neither a better AM bike than existing AM bikes, nor a better trail bike than existing trail bikes. Ironically, it might be good on uncle dave's home trails on the north shore, where speeds are low, drops are big, and traction is at a premium, but Deer Valley? The list of bikes I would find more appropriate for that terrain is quite long.
Now its great to hear more about your opinions, experiences and comparisons. Maybe Vernon couldn't elaborate more on the tires themselves specifically because he didn't already have a baseline +tire to judge against and draw a comparison from?
One thing. I´ve got a decent set of scales and my bike is coming in at 27lbs plus or minus a little bit. Is the weight you quote with the standard build? Are you sure about it? If so I´m going to replace my scales! I thought that the scales weight I had matched up with the hand held test.
Sorry about getting you out in your underwear!
With this kind of money,and if you want a hardtail,you can pick a very nice cromoly frame,some very good wheels and components and build a way better bike.
- frame?
- fork?
- wheels?
- tires?
31lbs seems like a lot. What does it weight setup as a 29er with light wheels and tires?
One guy even said "are you fcking kidding me?!"
I take it to the jump lines, too. It's just a hardtail with big tires.
Rider and setup are still like 80% of the equation
Just my .02. Perhaps you can offer a retort to my comments. Oh, and regardless of what anyone thinks about fat bikes, I'm still stoked to see people out riding all year. We've got a local pro who can be found at 5:30am, in a blizzard, riding up the interstate towards the national forest, where he will proceed to ride for hours before heading back to town.
enough rambling for me in the PB comments for today...
Fact of the matter is that when snowboarding is good, I go do that. Riding pow on a bike sucks, so does hiking in balls deep powder.
When the biking is good, the snowboarding sucks. It's usually super icy and cold, and I hate snowboarding on ice.
I can't ski anymore due to some knee injuries, so xc skiing is out but it's pretty similar to fatbiking conditions wise and energy output.
Also, unless your riding groomed snow or really wet, frozen snow. 5" tires are the way to go. I only ride 4" tires in the spring/fall when it's sloppy and i dont feel like getting my nice bike all dirty.
One picture shows the rider taking a rooty left-hand corner. That looks like recipe for washout. Break it down - how exactly did this bike track over the roots? How did your normal bike manage the corner? Swap the wheels (29") or tires on the Loki and ride the same corner.
I'm just challenging you to elevate. What is the purpose of this review to the reader?
Sure, $3k is a fair amount for a hardtail, but it's dressed out with some pretty nice parts.
Plus-sized hardtails with decent spec are mostly around this price range. If (leaning towards when...) I buy a 27+, the Loki is near the top of my list.
Nicely written overview, @vernonfelton !
"isn't there a bike already named that?"