What 5 Things Would Make Red Bull Rampage Even Better?

Oct 27, 2018
by Pinkbike Staff  



We asked insiders, athletes, and spectators what would make Red Bull Rampage even better. This is what they said:

1. More Money for the Athletes
bigquotesFrom the athletes' perspective, obviously the prize money for first place is pretty good, but I think, really when you look at what this event is and the media behind it and the non-endemic stuff, a bigger prize purse all the way down [would be good]. If you look at one golf tournament, one of the majors - these athletes, in my opinion, aren't getting paid enough. I think it's gotten better, but I think it still has a little further to go.Andrew Shandro


bigquotesHonestly, with the risk we are taking and everything, for sure, there is a lot of money involved and they could give more reward to the riders for what they do. That's the first obvious thing I want to say about the whole thing. Antoine Bizet


bigquotesThere was more money in the sport back when we raced then there is now. It's crazy. The amount of money that the guys earn for what they are doing, it doesn't compute to me. They put their lives on the line, literally. Brian Patterson


bigquotesI was number one pro [in BMX racing] in the nation in 1980 and Brian was number one pro in the nation as brothers in 82 and 83. They gave away cars at that point. We won three Trans Ams. I was number one cruiser - the 24" bike, three years in a row. I actually rode for Nike. I signed a contract with Phil Knight and rode Nike shoes for two years. Brent Patterson



2. A Different Judging System

bigquotesI've heard some good ideas for different kinds of judging, like not showing the scores for the first run until the end. It should all be relative anyway and it makes it easier on the judges, maybe it's not as exciting for the viewers, but then the second run is more exciting. For me, I want to see two runs and I want to see the excitement in the second run. It's just cool to see what these guys do. Jesse Melamed


Practice started in near dark. It was cold and windy. Practice was extended. Finally nature cooperated.


3. More Time for Practice
bigquotesI feel like whenever we get to event day, time is the enemy. Everyone is out here digging for essentially two weeks. By the time the event comes around, everyone is pretty exhausted and there's always a scramble to ride lines and a lot of people the morning of are riding their lines for the first time. I think it's easy to gravitate towards more time, but I also think that if there were more time people would be even more ambitious with the builds - not that the builds aren't ambitious enough. It's kind of a Catch 22, the more time you add, the more time people are going to spend on it. The problem would still be the same.

I think people are still going to be tweaking things but maybe half a day is dedicated to riding. I feel like they've had that in the past where certain days were no shovels. I think those windows of time are important because when you are out here, and you see something like this, no matter what, no matter whose line, no matter how awesome your dig team is, there's always more you can do and it's hard to be comfortable with that and let it go and just focus on practicing and working on your line.
Katie Holden

bigquotesI think in a case like this where it's the first year at a venue, maybe a little more time, but again, yesterday, huge wind stopped a lot of the practicing, and there's nothing you can do about that. You can't plan for that. Maybe next year, ten days at the venue is more than enough, but starting off with such a raw canvas, maybe it wasn't quite enough. Some people maybe bit off a little more than they could chew as far as line choices this year, but they all got the same amount of time, and the same number of diggers, and same opportunity, they knew they had to make it work and it was what it was. Sam Honcharuk

Brendan Fairclough took tenth and the Kelly McGarry Spirit Award.

4. Rawer Terrain
bigquotesI would love to see things be rawer like Rampage of old. I think these guys put in a lot of work and they are really skilled and just come up with some amazing lines and creations and lips and landings, but I think it's turning into too much of a bike park. I would love to see it be more of a mountain. Ben Falkson

bigquotesThis year there wasn't as much raw riding as people said there was going to be. There's quite a lot of manicured jumps and drops - and I like that because they just go huge, but there are only a few guys doing crazy, unique stuff. But I think it's kind of up to the riders.Jesse Melamed

Letting it all hang out.


5. More Recognition for the Diggers
bigquotesAfter being on site for a week and watching the construction of all the lines I really think there should be a lot more attention paid to the builders by the event.

The vast majority of us ride trails primarily built by volunteer builders in our hometowns and that’s where these guys have honed their skills.

I’m excited to go home and ride my bike but Rampage is so gnarly and such a massive media event that it almost feels like it could get disconnected from the greater mountain bike community. I think more coverage of the diggers, their stories and skill sets would be a way for Rampage to encourage the next generation of local trail builders and give back to mountain bikers everywhere.
Stu Davidson


Must Read This Week

327 Comments

  • + 909
 I think they should have a new format.
Let all riders take their first run without receiving scores. Then take an intermission and let the judges rank them all together and release the scores once all the first runs are completed. The judges could compare all the runs on video, and get them stacked correctly. Give the riders 30 minutes after the scores are released to plan their second run. And then run the rest of the comp giving scores as they go. This would eliminate the need to "leave room" for higher scores. It doesnt seem so hard. Yes it would leave a larger time gap for shenanigans but it would be much more fair, and I doubt riders would disagree.
  • + 56
 If I could give you two upvotes...
  • + 33
 That's a great idea. I'm not sure why they don't do this already as this unique event allows for unique ways to vote. It also doesn't screw over the first rider to stomp a run (this year happened to be Fairclough). There seems to feel like a half hour wait time before the riders get up to the top and are ready for 2nd runs so the time to debate that is available.

As for the pay scale, that's needed everywhere especially on this event. Even if you end up last, you should still get paid a good amount. NBC can easily afford it.

Either way, this event is always the best so just a couple of minor tweaks to perfect it even further.
  • + 27
 @scott-townes: The event costs red bull around 3 million I've heard, can't confirm that. But in 2017 they generated 7.4 billion in revenue.
  • + 4
 @jasperwesselman: I'm not surprised on that gross revenue. Yeah, years ago I heard the number was just south of 3 million in operating costs.
  • + 42
 @takeiteasyridehard You could easily use the 30 minute time gap for sponsored replays and mini advertisements, ala more ad money in order to raise the payout to athletes.

2 birds, 1 stone.
  • + 38
 Great idea for scoring!!! I thick for be coverage they should dump the helicopters and use Drones. Have a group set up fly zones for different lines, work with riders so they don't interfere. Waala closer coverage than ever. Props to the coverage crew, best Rampage coverage ever!!!!
  • - 45
flag Tmackstab (Oct 27, 2018 at 14:59) (Below Threshold)
 I've had a similar idea except the riders submit their planned run to the judges prior to the event. They do that in the Olympics with figure skating so the judges know what's coming. If there's any deviation from the planned run then there's docked points.
  • + 6
 @Tmackstab: Figure skating is an extremely controlled environment, whereas mountain biking it ever changing. If a wind gust forces a rider to abort a backflip and take an alternate line, then that takes the motivation away from the rider to make the best of their run knowing they lose anyway because they deviated.
  • - 23
flag scott-townes (Oct 27, 2018 at 15:07) (Below Threshold)
 @ninjatarian: If the wind is strong enough to not toss a backie, they most likely are not doing the rest of their run. Giant wind gusts don't come out of nowhere, its pretty predictable over a short period of time. At the end of the day, if that does somehow happen, no format can control or change that.
  • + 16
 By all standards such an incredible event. Creativity, athleticism, hard work, courage, heartbreak, and triumph... yet always followed by a tidal wave of complaints from the community. I sure wish we could get it sorted.

My vote would be to go rider judged with multiple awards and an overall winner. Best team, Gnarliest line, biggest hit, best trick, fastest, best style, overall best run.

Would that ruin Redbull’s bottom line?

Part of the problem is the tug of war between the guys who tend toward lighter lines with bigger tricks and the guys who do bigger lines with lighter tricks. It’s really hard to judge them the same. You could say that tricks have no value, but how could you remove that progression from the equation?

Also, it is funny all the talk about getting rid of the wood and the “slopestyle” but they manicured the heck out of that mountain. Coming from a guy who only rides the jump trails when I go to whistler, even I thought it was surprisingly buff given all the talk of “returning to the roots.” Like a Fest-style build on really steep terrain.
  • + 20
 @Tmackstab:
Maybe you’re more into figure skating?
  • + 4
 @jasperwesselman: who can even trust you anymore??
  • + 44
 @BiNARYBiKE:
I think a first step on how to implement and judge tricks would be to give them a separate scoring system. What i mean by that is, that a trick that is thrown in while riding a very exposed and gnarly line or drop in the top section needs to give a lot more points than a trick thrown on one of the doubles down below.
That´ll lead to a clear and fair understanding of the value of a rowdy line.

It got blatantly obvious to me once i realized Reeder was passing even on some of the more mid sized drops during his second run but then threw a big trick on the double below just for fun. To those slopestyle guys a backflip is nothing, but going down a medium sized drop seems to still be something they´d rather avoid if possible. So how can the judges award more points to those obstacles and tricks than a rowdy line choice?

There needs to be a clear scoring system that rewards triple the points (or whatever) for a one footer on a ridge line than a backflip on a double down below.

I respect what the slope guys are doing and their skill level, but big mountain riding needs to remain pure in the sense that line choice needs to be the one deciding factor and tricks can only be something to seperate the men from the boys. As i see it, if your line is a smooth slope line, your tricks aren´t worth much, even if they are big, as long as it´s in the context of a big mountain contest.

Funny enough big mountain skiing does not seem to have those problems. While those guys may throw in a trick on some of the mellower feature in the lower section of the face, what get´s you the win is always a technical line mixed with some tricks. No way those judges would reward a big slope trick down below more points than a simple 360 over some gnarly cliff.
Maybe Red Bull should just take a site out of the Freeride World Tour´s rulebook for inspiration?
  • + 3
 Maybe even get rid of points entirely and just rank the runs from best to worst.
  • + 1
 @Loki87: I agree with that for the most part. It's going to be hard because everything is so subjective. Maybe line choice and tricks could rank an equal proportion of the overall score. The trick score portion could be graded on their own formula involving 70% the line where the trick was thrown and 30% the technicality and cleanliness of the trick to determine it's worth. The line portion could be 70% burliness/technicality and 30% amplitude. Idk if that makes sense, or what, but some sliding scale to make it reward freeride style more. Tricks count, but only count big when done on big technical terrain.
  • + 0
 @jflb: women's obviously.
  • + 5
 @Loki87: This guy has the right idea.

Points for a flip on something the average PB reader would possibly consider hitting? Nah.

Points for riding some rough as f*ck line that hasn't been groomed? Yeah.
  • + 6
 Just do it fest style and why not bring in more builders? Faster dig, better finished product and you would have to assume that anyone riding in Rampage would be able to find one more friend to build. Right? \
And lets be real here, PB isn't going to say it and I get that, but dam: The announcers! They suck. Cam isn't to bad, but why not bring in some stand up comics to mix it up with a MTB'er who can explain the riding. I can't stand the "pinnacle of progression", BS vanilla pablum they spew.
  • + 4
 @jasperwesselman: They pay above market value and do more than any one company in mountain biking. Period. The issue isn't Red Bulls frugality, It's the MTB market.
  • + 4
 @p2ryder: I know after having Tmac in the booth for crankworx the change back to non riders was harsh. Put the Claw, Bas and Zink in the booth instead.
  • + 1
 Brilliant idea !!
  • - 3
 Nice idea, heard that somewhere before have we???!!!

f*cking plagiarist!
  • + 2
 @Loki87: The problem with offering less points for slopestyle tricks vs tech lines is that it will likely cut into revenues. The mainstream audience has little appreciation for the difficulty of a tech line. But since they've had so much exposure to X-games type events the big air would seem "better."
  • + 1
 @Loki87: I agree but when so many of the riders share builders to create a single line then it come down to a trick competition as there are only a small number of lines built.
  • + 1
 @deadmeat25: if you're talking to me...I literally plagiarized myself by copying my comment from vital. Or if we both had the same idea...that's because it just makes sense...
  • + 2
 It would also be cool if both runs scores where combined so that whoever wins has the best total score over two runs.
  • + 1
 The only thing I see that could be wrong with that new format would be the possibility of the wind picking up in that hour.
  • + 1
 Yep, that is what I was thinking as well. It is easier to rank the runs looking at them side by side.
  • + 2
 @rrolly:
I don´t think it would really.
They will still be easy to implement in a run and still reward points. There´s really no reason to cut them out on the lower part, but it would encourage the guys to throw them in in the upper parts. A casual triple tailwhip for good measure and 1-2 points on a double on the valley floor will still be worth it as it´s not a huge risk for these guys.
I mean, nobody is hindering Semenuk from building a gigantic kicker on a ridgeline with a narrow landing and throwing a cashroll over it and then head straight for a super steep chute. We´ve also already seen a lot of drop variations up to flat backflips. It´s just that right now those guys do opt for the easier jumps as they are equally rewarding in terms of points.
Semenuk and Lunn already did what i am trying to say.
And i´m sure the general public is much more thrilled by a gigantic backflip drop than a triple cashroll in the valley.
My problem lies in the fact that Strait´s Suicides aren´t really worth any points because they are not techy slopestyle tricks. They just need to at least bring them up to equal value due to the exposure and technicality of the terrain, but judging does not reflect that.
They seem to have line choice and tricks as two completely seperated factors and that is not right.
The technicality of the line, which is something the judges can perfectly asses before the event, needs to be some sort of multiplicator for the score that is awarded to a trick. That way COMBINING the two is what really rewards a rider. Doing only a tech line or tech tricks over perfect doubles, neither can be a winning run. Blending it all together is what it should be all about.
  • + 3
 @jasperwesselman: while I agree with paying much more to the athletes. That’s 7.4 billion in sales not profit this year its apparently 6.8 billion in sales. It does cost money to make a product and ship it to stores as well as sponsoring ridiculously expensive sports/projects. I’m not saying they shouldn’t do better and can’t but I’m just glad they sponsored our sport among others when few others would.
  • + 2
 @loganflores: I specified revenue not profit. No need to correct me. The whole event is tax deductible as well in one way or another.
  • + 5
 @jflb: I prefer curling
  • + 5
 What about sharks with freaking laser beams attached to their heads?
  • + 2
 @knarf1: they did drones last year and in my opinion it was a failure. They used single pilot drones so the video wasn’t very good at all. But a two pilot setup with higher end drones would be the jam. Get you closer to the riders. The heli footage this year got the job done but it wasn’t close enough. Unless nbc is holding footage for the tv broadcast??
  • + 1
 @jasperwesselman: event cost is significantly higher than $3 million... I can say with confidence.
  • + 1
 @rideitall-bmx-dh-road-unicycle: I figured, like I said I can't confirm. I'd heard 3 mil from competitors before but I thought that was pretty low given the logistics and crew out there.
  • - 1
 ..
  • + 2
 @Bryanan: Intelligent people who don't limit their minds to a single point of view?
  • + 4
 They wouldn't have to leave room if they just adopted a Calvinball-based scoring system. No one would have been upset had Fairclough received a Q or an oogy on his first run.
  • + 1
 @jasperwesselman: that is interesting how so? Also this is not the only sport that red bull puts events together for my overall point was that we should appreciate that red bull does so much for extreme sports.
  • + 1
 On the issue of pay riders should be getting paid by the manufacturers. This event is basically straight cost coming out of red bull's marketing budget.
  • + 1
 @Bryanan: What makes you think I need trust from you?
  • + 1
 @friendlyfoe: I'm sure some guys are getting winnings matched by main sponsors.
  • + 1
 @jasperwesselman: all of these guys are sponsored Riders under some form of a contract. I would think that their contract is for a set amount of money and requires them to do certain things like participating in events, doing endorsements etc.. If anything they might get a bonus for performance
  • + 1
 @friendlyfoe: Yeah thats what I mean, like matching winnings as a performance bonus.
  • + 4
 I got an idea !
Rampage could be like Moguls skiing. You announce your line and get a "start score". If you add tricks or riding it so rad you improve your score and if you do any mistake the score is lower...
Then judge wait the end of the first run to announce the score to beat at the second one !
Riders can try to beat it or bet to keep their place.
It could help judges to separate lines and riding skills and be entertaining & educative like " This guy had to send big tricks to beat the radest line"

And why not the "start score" could reward & highlight the best building crew....

Peace
  • + 2
 @jasperwesselman: there's a 1000ft canyon gap to flat between gross revenue and profit. plenty of companies out there that gross even more and occasionally take a loss on the year.
  • + 1
 @conoat: Ya just look at restaurants very little in profit after high overhead. And most people think restaurant owners are rich.
  • + 0
 What about judging like figure skating where the top and bottom score are thrown out? Or perhaps have more judging criteria where judges aren’t trying to reduce a run into only a handful of broadly defined categories.
  • + 1
 @cwatt: Rampage only has two runs so they would throw out both runs? Smile It is the best score of two runs.
  • + 1
 @conoat: Yep you're right. They profited 550mil in 2015. But why would they spend taxed profit that they split with their thai co-owners. They can directly use revenue to fund events like rampage and deduct them.
  • + 1
 @ninjatarian: The american ornithological society hate you.
  • + 235
 7. Brendog not getting robbed?
  • + 6
 Agree
  • + 43
 We've learned nothing since Norbs...
  • + 3
 @PinkyScar: Cleary they have learned jack shit
  • + 2
 @Cordall: I'd give you all my upvotes from now until the end of time if I could
  • + 91
 More Goggles. Athlete should bring more goggles. I have been standing at the side asking for goggle, only few would give away.
  • + 1
 aaand Silva...going to the moon
  • + 143
 1 nomore of that birds eye view from kilometres away were you cant see shit 2 less rat bag kids at the start line yelling out can i have your googles!! can i have your shoes!! 3 actually awarding people for big mountain riding, freeride lines.
  • + 84
 Those kids asking for the goggles seriously annoyed me too
  • + 35
 I have never seen a finish Corral that obnoxious even at a slopestyle event.
  • + 7
 If the judges were looking at the same camera angles we were I don't know how they could score it fairly?
  • + 10
 yeah that was the first year I negatively noticed the camera work. Could not see shit on the heli cam and sometimes the heli even went further away from the rider during the run. Then you couldn't see anything in those shadows and it felt like they had way less cameras on the ground this year.
  • + 16
 wow your running saint brakes, *tap tap lever*
  • + 15
 Was anyone else pissed with the commentators on either side of McCaul? They had no idea what they were talking about and kept getting lost. They were cringe every time they opened their mouths. Cam was constantly correcting them.

Would have been cool if Zink stayed there with McCaul to actually talk lines /tricks /riders, and get rid of the other two.
  • + 17
 Yep. Lines like Silva's: huge, flowy, stylish, fast, no crashes should be awarded better scores. And f#^k those kids off at the end haha
  • + 3
 @dirch: In French we got Gracia and the other guy couldn't get a word in edge ways, which isn't necessarily a bad thing. CG's on world cups too now so I no longer have to suffer neutered Warner and stilted Claudio. Who's the English speaking Gracia? Probably Warner in the Freecaster days. Don't think he's coming back...
  • + 2
 It was pretty dusty this year, running the heli closer would probably generate a lot of dust messing riders and spectators up. Drones would obviously be the better choice for closer action shots, but again the tech for live broadcast from a drone isn't quite up to the task. Another option is building some mediatowers around the riders lines. But that would require investment in some infrastructure and more time.
  • + 11
 Damn kids wanting everything for free. Get a job!
  • + 1
 @Ride406orDie: like knitting soccerballs?
  • + 3
 @dirch: learn german, the german commentators were ex freeriders from bavaria- hilarious. Switched to the english version and straight back. Andi wittmann is the man!
  • + 2
 @jzPV: i agree every word. Riders where great but multi camera director was not that good at all. And camera controller was sleeping on aperture stick ????... Hope they fix few things for next the year
  • + 1
 @dirch: they need proper commentators & mccaul needs voice coaching sounds like hes speaking out his nose
  • + 75
 A serious discussion about how to judge these runs better.
Brendog had one of the most creative lines and high amplitude style. This was one of the most entertaining runs of the whole day. Scored the lowest. Reed boggs unique feature as well... Flip backwards on an open loop? Right before dropping a 50 foot cliff. Insane.
  • + 2
 While the open loop is impressive, should it really be at rampage? The take-off for that thing was the least natural/raw feature in the entire venue. Brendog's line was much more appropriate for rampage, yet scored the lowest. I'd be stoked on the open loop in any other "bike park" slopestyle, but it's not in keeping with the big mountain style of rampage.

Maybe red bull need to run a "build your line" comp in a normal bike park and then weight the scoring in rampage towards big mountain riding?
  • - 4
flag KinkyReggae (Oct 29, 2018 at 6:42) (Below Threshold)
 A 50ft cliff? I don't think you were watching the right contest.
  • + 67
 Fest-style scoring: no first, 2nd,3rd. Only biggest, rawest, smoothest
  • + 13
 Totally agree, that would be a much better way of scoring it, i mean brendog this year, come on.
  • + 7
 Mixed with the weeklong format of Audi Nines this year. Let riders relax, not have to force runs when the wind is still questionable, not have to do their second run after getting up at 6 am to practice, hike up, do their first run, hike up again, and then hold on for dear life on their second run.
  • + 10
 It would also get rid of the go big or die trying mentality.
Those guys wanna go big regardless, but have them push it that extra 1% for a top spot sometimes feels unethical.
FEST is a great example on how the sport progresses regardless of competition, and i´m of the firm opinion that we would end up with a better product in the end due to the fact that riders would not compete for lines but rather work together in order to create something truly special. Imagine those guys bundling their ideas and imaginations for that mountain and the end result then is interpreted by each rider in his own way instead of guys claiming entire zones for themselves.
Just magine what some guys would have been able to do on Brendogs Rock.
We have racing for the fight for the top spot. Let´s make freeriding about progression and free interpretation of the mountain.

As it stands, FEST and Audi Nines work great as a format.
Having those guys go at it as a team in order to progress the sport, in a hostile environment, and then go at it in a competition style format but without actual judging and podium i´m sure would be an even more unreal spectacle than it is now.
  • - 3
 @Loki87: Riders come together to build X many lines down the mountain, working as one big coheasive unit. Just before "practice day" riders draw lots for which line they will be riding for the competition. They get to practice the line, and then run ot for the main event.
  • + 2
 @Loki87: I agree that the event is becoming borderline unethical. With the level of consequence, the pressure to perform needs to be dialed back.

Free Solo did an excellent job of exploring the ethics of turning something with fatal exposure into a spectacle, as well as showing the emotional toll it has on the people surrounding the athlete.

Seeing Szymon Godziek's wife or girlfriend after that crash, hearing Cam try to announce through watching his brother nearly fall off a cliff... The consequences are huge, and I'm not sure its okay to make something like that a tv spectacle.

I love seeing the progression, but I really don't want to see an athlete I admire die on live broadcast.
  • + 2
 @CaptainBLT: I too am concerned that we the consumers are pushing too hard for exciting tv. I know these guys are going to push themselves very far to deliver their greatest performance when they are surrounded by the largest audience of their peers but at some point cooler heads must prevail. Godziek loses his helmet mid-crash and bounces his head off the dirt bank that stops him. His face is marked up from the contact and there is no visible medical or disciplinary (how the F does your full face come off after glancing contact with the ground unless you didn't fasten your chinstrap?) reaction when he gets to the corral. I think Red Bull might want to consider some mandatory withdrawal regulations to protect everyone involved, wives and girlfriends and mothers/brothers included.
  • + 1
 @gringo: and Silva
  • + 57
 Red Bull,

Give the riders what u spend on the helicopters. That’s it thanks.
  • + 1
 Oh goodness yes. Heck without the helis we might be able to get any amount of audio from the runs too
  • + 5
 Drones would work much much better, quicker to deploy, quicker to pickup riders cresting out of view, you could have close follow drone pilots that learn the riders lines, and you could probably have 100 drones for the price of one useless noisy helicopter.
  • + 2
 A big 7 seater helicopter can cost up to $4000 per hour... so only about $421 for each rider if the helicopter is going for 2 hours.
  • + 3
 @cbro7092: There were 2 copters and they were going from sun up to sun down. At $4k an hour for about 12 hours that's almost $100k they could save and give to the riders.
  • + 1
 @tgent: Thats totally crazy!!
  • + 52
 I would honestly be surprised if Brendog came back and I wouldn't blame him. I don't think he should have won by any means but that score was inexcusable for such an amazing run. I understand the judges have a lot of responsibility on their hands, but they should be held accountable and apologize.
  • + 3
 If Brendog shouldn't have won then Rheeder shouldn't have either.
  • + 1
 @colincolin: exactly...I think Silva's run should be up there...then at lest we would have seen more contest!
  • + 1
 @rcrdrvr: Totally. I think the format that others are bringing up where all riders take a first pass and then are scored in relation to each other has a lot of validity. That would have saved a lot of embarrassment for Brendog.
  • + 32
 Camera angles were terrible, no more heli footage, or at least use it as a supplemental not as the main get up. Get back to raw terrain, manicured lines and jumps are cool, but that's not Rampage. Fix the judging, I have seen some great ideas in the comments above, start there. And lastly, pay the damn riders, or at the very least, insure them.
  • - 3
 Once again your watching all this shit for free. yeah we watch a few advertisements here and there but instead of complaining about angles buy a ticket and go watch in person.
  • + 1
 @raddog: It wouldnt be hard to sort some better coverage considering they are spending $$ on the helis.
  • + 1
 @raddog: this article is literally talking about what peoples opinions are to what they think would improve rampage. To tell someone to stop complaining when offering up their opinion is pretty dense of you.
  • + 0
 @richsoffar: stupid shit to be complaining about in the first place. Red bull puts content out all year, every year and you sit on you phone at bitch about every single angle that sucks. Seriously it's obnoxious to see you entitled "riders" complain about free video content.
  • + 0
 @zyoungson: less helis less angles. You do the math.
  • + 31
 I think the scoring system needs to be explained - there's so many upset people EVERY year because they feel that a rider (or riders) haven't been judged fairly. It seems that tricks trump gnar, but a lot of people think there should be parity. Why else should a Gee Atherton or Brendan Fairclough compete otherwise?
I also think the working for each score should be shown from each judge, to explain why a score has been reached.
  • + 0
 This! I love having a few freeracers in the mix! The problem is that they have so many diggers and with the sand bags they can just shape it into a giant bike park. No sandbags, 1 digger max! I watched Gee's run from a few years back when he got second and it was so much more natural. Same with Brendog's run this year. Mind you, I don't think you'll get Gee back after that massive crash he had. Imagine if you could get someone like Martin Maes and Remi Thirion in.
  • + 2
 i think it would be interesting to see the break down that makes up the score.
  • + 3
 My guess is that Brendog maxed out the score(s) for line difficulty and speed... Unfortunately he must have been the lowest scorer in the "tricks" category. Maybe they need to adjust the categories so line choice is worth more than throwing some slopestyle tricks? (not that I can do either. pretty good at crashing though)
  • + 1
 @rockyflowtbay: definitely. With explainination
  • + 27
 7. More Sal Masekala fitness insight.
  • + 1
 haha his uninformed bpm comment made me laugh
  • + 23
 Downscaling...

Am I the only one fearing every year to see one of those guys die at the bottom?
I've met some of them, they're all incredible peoples. It would be so sad to lose a Brendog or an Andreu. =(
  • + 1
 Just a matter of time before someone under or overshoots a big drop bad enough that it happens. The consequences of those lines is insane.
  • + 23
 All Pinkbike commenters must agree to chance of being randomly selected to drop in before being allowed to comment. Selected rider will be given a push if hesitant.
  • + 5
 Then for the second run the amount of down votes represents how many spokes are removed from your wheels.
  • + 1
 I've been there and you'd have to do more than push me.
  • + 21
 As a spectator I'd love to see Rampage go back to the raw days, almost all the way to when guys were sending it into soft untampered soil. Maybe slopestyle and crankworx is about BMX-like precision and tricks, Fest is about going moto-huge, and Rampage can be the competition for the Where the Trail Ends freeriders.
  • + 6
 What if they had areas across the zone where you weren't allowed to build (so only dig to carve out a line but no lips and a discussion to be had about berms) so that way every rider is forced to do a section or two of raw riding
  • + 2
 They used to land and go OTB back in the old days I think a bit of work on the landings is a good thing
  • + 21
 Take those damn kids away from the bottom. Set up some autograph signing after the comp. I want to listen to the riders talk about their run, not some whiny, spoiled punks trying to get the riders goggles before the comp is over.
  • + 14
 Three million $ ? Sounds like an insane amount of money to put that on. Scrap the garbage helicopter footage. Give three skilled drone pilots a $1000 each and you’d have better coverage and save huge money (which you could give to the riders).
  • - 4
flag Dethphist (Oct 28, 2018 at 14:51) (Below Threshold)
 Drones can't broadcast live high def
  • + 1
 @Dethphist: They had drones broadcasting last year and I believe the year before in high def...
youtu.be/ZfxGY-BsUnY?t=1942
  • + 14
 The majority of the camera angles were non sensical...why panned out so far? So much mountain shown with a tiny rider and barely able to see what they were doing. So many times the replay showed a closer view from a different camera--why was the helicopter the main shot? And, with where drone filming has gone, why even use a helicopter??!! The drone can get much closer...follow the rider easier...we see this in video edits so often! And what the hell was with the sound effects? When the rider landed, or turned, or whatever, it sounded like someone slammed a heavy door in a very messy machine shop, or the bike was a pile of loose parts. Sometimes the timing was really off and other times they just didn't make noises at all...I found the "sounds" to be very distracting. Am I the only one?
  • + 6
 nahh i completly agree the camera angles were shocking this year.. hitting huge gaps and the guy looks like a dot and they show it birds eye view... i was so dissapointed
  • + 1
 How about some REAL sounds as they lead/follow with a drone and a wireless mic on the rider picking up all the ground sounds, crowd hoots, and rider expletives with each hit...
  • + 0
 Drones can't broadcast live high def for the event. A heli can.
  • + 0
 @Dethphist:
I don't have first-hand knowledge, but presume that is due to the limited load-carrying capacity of drones and battery limitations on both power for flight and running the processing / high-bandwidth communications equipment necessary.

I've read a couple of articles recently about Hydrogen fuel cells that are compact and light enough to power drones for much longer periods than batteries. One can only hope that this quickly becomes viable for live HD broadcast.
There's enough sun in the Utah desert for Red Bull to generate the necessary Hydrogen on site in the weeks leading up to the event and run the whole Rampage show without fossil fuel (and get better footage)!
Now that would be innovative - Red Bull, give Ballard and Intelligent Energy a call!

blog.ballard.com/fuel-cell-drones
www.intelligent-energy.com/our-products/uavs
  • + 1
 @Dethphist: Upsample video with live delay for processing time...
  • + 1
 Another problem with drones is that they can't descend into their dirty air very quickly. So you'd either have to be further away (like the Heli), or keep swapping drones as the riders did the drops. Very difficult to manage.
I'd like to see some attempts though.
I also found the exposure to be all over the place too - the start line cam way over exposed, the heli cam low res (maybe digital stabilisation caused this) , then finally some decent footage at the bottom from some fixed camera positions.
  • + 1
 @thingswelike: Interesting you say that, as a non photo/video person the camera work looked like a piss take
  • + 12
 They should add a The Golden Keg Award for the best build team. Judged on most innovative/creative build techniques.
Give them a $1000 to split and full on kegger after the event. (oh, and fireworks to play with too)
Cheers!
  • + 15
 Better camera angles of the runs...
  • + 4
 This. Replay angles were good, the initial run footage sucked. FFS, are they shooting from space?
  • + 2
 Some POV stuff would be nice.
  • + 12
 Stop judging based on biggest trick
  • + 1
 Silva's flying should've scored waaaayyyy higher. If that was Sorge...he would've won.
  • + 10
 1. Put an emphasis on technical riding. Brendog had one of the best and most unique lines and got robbed.
  • + 8
 How about a "Builder Auction" at the beginning? All the builders in a room get auctioned off to the riders. Each rider gets 24 beers to use as currency. Then at least the builders get something for their efforts.
  • + 4
 Each build team gets a backpack with random tools to work with
  • + 10
 More cowbell
  • + 6
 For what other major sports pay, it’s a shame these guys don’t get paid more and there isn’t more money available as prizes. These guys are putting their lives on the line. There’s huge risks!!!!
  • + 25
 Major sports get paid because people pay to watch those sports. People don’t pay to watch mountain biking. It’s all sponsor driven and sponsors will only pay to the point where they think they are getting a return on their investment. Its as simple as that.
  • - 1
 I wonder what purses were at straight rhythm. That’s closer to apples to apples. If the moto folks take home more at that event then I don’t know what to say.
  • + 2
 Take up golf?
Not joking. If riders think they should be making what golfers make, they should have taken up golf.
Most guys would ride rampage for free I bet. If they stencilling to do it for nothing, no one is going to pay them the big bucks.
  • + 1
 @jaame: Nailed it. While I would love to see these guys getting paid more, money clearly isn't their primary motivation; progression, personal challenge, fun all seem to be much higher up the riders lists and I suspect they'd still be pushing their limits whether Rampage existed or not.
  • - 1
 @jaame: Red Bull has underdog beginnings in a nonexistent "energy drink" category within the highly monopolized beverage business. That is much the same as what these riders' talents have done for MTB sports since the 80s in a mostly NFL/NBA/MLB country.

In the last decade or two, RB has BORROWED much of it's current cred (marketing) from extreme sport's athletes. Arguing that they're doing any of these extreme athletes a favor since they'd do it for free (or just for personal achievement) is laughable.

These athletes don't owe jack to anyone and should be considered equal to the companies who must acknowledge it's AT LEAST a 50/50 proposition. Riders and their families risk life/limb/mind while these companies "risk" shareholder's money to be recouped by brand recognition/sales, a write-off, or bankruptcy settlement at worst.

Does Red Bull even have any marketing without the daring of their athletes...should these master athletes approach their negotiations the same way that a MBA grad shifts their "bottom line" according to who is asking?

PAY them not only according to the risk of the task but also the relative few in numbers that could/would do it as balls out as they do.
  • + 4
 @Heydre: The law of the market dictates that they make what they are worth.
If you can pack a stadium full of paying customers week in, week out, then obviously you are worth more than if you ride once a year in the middle of nowhere.
  • + 1
 @jaame: "The law of the market"...so specific...care to generalize about "worth" as well.

BTW RB is spending billions on extreme sports most of which have no "packed stadiums" of payers week in/out...I guess RB execs are unaware of your law?

Or is it that they are well aware of what these athletes do and what it's worth to their brand...they're just not willing to share it equitably. Other than their stupid cartoons...it is their marketing and branding.
  • + 1
 @Heydre: don't get your knickers in a twist.
They are worth what they make, and they make enough to satisfy them, evidenced by the fact that they do the event for the money they make for said event. Rampage has happened like, ten times. Obviously they are satisfied with the pay since they keep coming back.
That is not to say I think they are well paid. I wouldn't do that work for that money. It's not worth the risk for me, but for them evidently it is.
Are you one of the competitors? If so, I would suggest forming a union and making some demands about remuneration for the event with the possible threat of a boycott if said demands are not met. Until that happens, the money will not go up. You don't pay more than market value for anything unless you're an idiot, and I'm pretty sure the management at RB are not idiots.
  • + 3
 People have a lot of strong opinions for an event that they have never been a part of.
  • + 3
 @Heydre: I don't think you really understand how the Redbull business model. You seem to imply Redbull's goal is to have people do crazy dangerous things and then they go out and hire people to do it (and that they should be paying them more).

But the reality is that these athletes are doing what they want to do, and Redbull goes out and provide's them the funds and the platform to do it. Whether it be events like Rampage, or funding for movies, or training for a world record at something, these athletes are doing what they want to do, and Redbull is making it happen for them. They aren't telling riders what to do at Rampage or telling Travis Rice what to do in his movies. They support the vision of these top athletes and say what do you need to make it happen. You want to snowboard where? OK heres a plane, helicopter, sherpa, etc to get you there. You want to surf where? OK here's a boat, jet skis, water safety crew, etc. Private halfpipe in the colorado backcountry? No problem. Space capsule, space suit, ground control team so you can skydive from space? Sure thing. Dan Atherton has a vision for the a next level completely gnarly DH race? Have at it.

Since getting a Redbull sponsorship is basically considered the gold standard of action sports sponsorship, maybe we should ask the Redbull athletes how they feel about the company? If they feel like they are getting a bad deal?
  • + 5
 Y'all, this is not a sporting event, it's for-profit entertainment put on by one of the strongest brands in the world. They aren't designing Rampage primarily to be a fair event, or one that's good for mountain biking—they're trying to make the most engaging mountain bike Vegas show. It's the same reason they don't show full downhill runs.
  • + 2
 I agree... which is exactly why I cannot fathom why they chose to go with helicopter views of ants on a hill as their primary form of coverage.
  • + 4
 1 - showing scores from all categories separatly
for example:
style - 9/10 points
line - 6/8 points
tricks - 7/10 points
. etca

2 - better filming
+ more drones in the riding areas / crucial points
+ better angles

+ fillming from so far perespective from heli is not good

3 - realy good amount of money as prizes for first 3 places (for example 50k, 20k, 10k $)
  • + 4
 It goes without saying that these guys and their dig teams are underpaid. But that's hardly Redbull's fault. What incentive do RB have to fork out $XXXXX per rider/ dig team when they already have a queue of would-be competitors taking what's being offered? The riders need to do more- be business savvy, know their worth and approach RB with a plan which makes the best sense to everyone. Priority no.1 (if it's not in place already following Paul Bas' injuries) should be mandatory insurance cover for all competitors and their teams at RBs expense.
A slight digression too- this insidious behaviour whereby the mob complain to the highest power in order to get their way is insufferable (Not PB, but many commenters). If you want something, go out and earn it! Work hard for it and be sure you get it the correct way. That way, and by expecting the same of anyone else then people will be less likely to f*ck one another over if they had an iota of insight into what it must have cost to achieve it in the first place.
  • + 1
 I agree. You also have to look at who is paying the big bucks for prize money and sponsorship. Take road riding and the bike manufacturer is way down the list of team sponsors. In the example in the article the big money came from Nike and who ever makes trans ams. Big money comes from mainstream companies wanting to associate their brand with the sport and the athletes, not from the companies that provide the kit within the sport.
  • + 3
 Lets put this out there. We don't need judges at all. Alternative 'sports' have been forced into the world of grades and measurements by the corporate suits. I can see it now, at a board meeting where they allow a few dudes to wear their brims straight, "We could make it a competition, with prize money." Brett Rheeder didn't win anything, he was awesome before he dropped in, and even still if he did NOT drop in at all. In our natural element, bikers, skaters, and boarders know who had the gnarliest tricks, and who deserves respect. I am not talking about everyone getting a trophy, but rather everyone getting payed. Trust me, you will watch with or without the scores, and the tricks will still be the same. Semenuk wasn't pulling that trick because he stood to make money or get a trophy, that's just where he is in his progression.

If you must score, have the people vote, but its only for those who feel the need to measure something.
  • + 3
 I turned off after three riders. I couldn’t stand the commentators, couldn’t stand the shitty brats at the finish line, couldn’t stand the shit camera angles where you couldn’t see anything, didn’t understand the scoring system and couldn’t stand the bike park slope style vibe.
  • + 2
 That's too bad bc you missed some sick riding.
  • + 3
 I think they should massive cut the number of builder and the time they get to build. It is supposed to be about big mountain riding so clearing just enough dirt to allow a line to be ridden, not weeks to build big sculpted slopestyle jumps, we have crankworks for that
  • + 3
 It's super tricky about the leaving it raw/gnar vs allowing the riders to build more manicured features. I appreciate why some people want to keep it very tech/raw/exposed but I think the most jaw dropping features at rampage are almost always the big drops and canyon gaps which normally take a lot of sand bags and diggers to create. Cam Zink's 360. Kelly McGarry's 60ft backflip. Sam Reynold's superman. Big suicide no handers by Strait and Nell. Those tricks really define rampage for me and are what pull in the big views and big money to the event. Those are big digger built, artificial features for the most.
  • + 3
 First thing they can do is apologize to Brendog for that horsesh*t score they gave him. I'd boycott this event if I was him. You do the most creative, raw, gnarliest line out there and get garbage for a score - how is he supposed to do better?!
  • + 3
 The problem with the format now is that there are at least three distinct styles of riding all judged under one criteria...How can you have an accurate assessment? This is why Bendog was legitimately robbed....

There should be a King of the mountain format not too unlike Crankworks. 3 runs, cumulative score, judged by separate criteria.
1st run is raw natural line. Speed and flow over ridges, through shoots etc. Like the old days.
2nd run Built up lines, ie the slopestyle course we're all used to by now... amplitude, style, difficulty
3rd and final run that is open to the rider interpretation after seeing everyone ride or if they fell short in either other category.

Give the riders and diggers 5 more days to prepare, pay them more money cause...Redbull is fleecing these athletes for the spectacle and ultimately their marketshare. Have a great event where riders actually get their dues.
  • + 1
 I don't know how the judging currently works but if I remember right in half pipe comps it used to be one judge judged height, one rotations and another overall. A similar thing would work for Rampage, Speed judge, tech judge, trick judge. Then show the scores from each judge at the end along with overall.
  • + 3
 Some type of retirement fund or life long medical insurance program. These guys are sacrificing their lives and physical well being, I feel it really needs to be switched to; are we really doing all we can for the riders? cause at the end of the day if it wasn't for them there would be no Rampage.
  • + 3
 Darren Berrecloth seems like an ideal candidate for judging in the future. It would be hard to argue with his thoughts given his experience and insight. Then round out the panel with riders from different disciplines. It would also be cool to see the criteria beforehand as a spectator to better understand the scores. I have such mixed feelings about the event. I watched this year with an elevated foot and a fancy new titanium screw holding it together after awkwardly stepping off a backwards rolling BMX. First run out the gate Godziek overshot that landing and the magnitude of what these riders were doing really settled into me. They are all risking their lives up there- a few feet in either direction for Godziek and an exciting emergence from a cloud of dust could have been replaced with a covered airlift from the event infant of his partner and young child. Not trying to be dramatic here- look at the venue!... that's not pillows of powder they are landing on- it could be rock faces. I couldn't help feeling a bit guilty-like a spectator in the colosseum both admiring the skill and physicality of the gladiators but detached from the very real human consequences and entertained by the risk. I hope the riders are compensated, respected and central in decisions impacting their lives and livelihoods. Thank you first and foremost to the riders and power to them.
  • + 3
 1. Add a women's category. Even if they don't ride at the same level as the men yet, they will get closer when you give them the opportunity. And even if they aren't at the same level, I'd rather watch them ride than listen to all the filler commentary between the first and second men's rounds. The course is built, the cameras are in place and the choppers are fueled. Might as well take advantage of that and fill the gap with something interesting. There are more firsts to be had in the women's category now too: first to compete, to win, first backflip, first 360, etc. etc. There is a women's category in most other extreme sports now. Not having one here reflects poorly on the event and all the sponsors.

2. Have some people's choice voting. The technology exists, it will increase engagement and it will highlight shortcomings in the formal judging. Let the fans chirp in on best ride, trick, line, save, etc.

3. Add a best rookie prize. Statistically, the judging has always put them at a disadvantage for a podium or win so recognize them.
  • + 1
 No offense but who would ride in the women’s category? The reason it doesn’t exist is because there are no women who could handle that terrain. Even some of the best riders like Casey brown and Rachel atherton have basically said no way they could ride out there. Don’t blame the event or the sponsors for not having a category when such category literally doesn’t have any riders.

With regards to people choice, are you suggesting that fan voting be part of the actual scoring? Because that would be a f*cking shitshow. Fans at home have real no perspective on the neuances of each riders lines. They have no idea how difficult a line, jump, or drop really is without waking each line like the real judges do. Also fans are not objective, they have favorites. You’d turn the event into a massive overhyped popularity contest with riders campaigning for votes ever turn of the way.
  • + 2
 I think there should be more big mountain events. Why is there just one? Aggy and Sorge should host a big mountain event somewhere around kamloops, lillooet, or spences bridge type area. This is kinda like its own genre of biking that deserves a bunch of events imo
  • + 2
 Camera angles were mostly crap for the main run. Replays had some pretty great shots. Riders and diggers need to be paid better. And there needs to be a women's category. My 11yr old daughter is beyond stoked about mountain biking and while the World Cup has female competitors the more amazing events to watch like Crankworx, Hardline, and Rampage have no female representation. I'm assuming there aren't enough big name female riders who are into those kinds of competition but it would be nice to see Red Bull (and all the bike companies and usual sponsors) invest in developing female ridership. Gotta keep the stole alive even though most of the female riders are too smart to throw themselves off that many cliffs on a regular basis.
  • + 1
 Theres not enough girls, if any, willing to ride those events though meaning thered be no competition
  • - 1
 @Endurojack:
That's why they need to start developing events to try and increase the ridership. There are plenty of amazing female riders in Free Skiing/Big Mountain events, there's got to be a way to grow that level of competition with mountain biking. It won't be an overnight transition into getting a dozen female riders willing and capable of sending it but a development plan would be amazing. I'm a shit mountian biker so I just want to have lots good riders to inspire my kids into being better riders. Red Bull has the funds to help get that development going and stands to use said programs and riders to make more money so it's a win win for everyone (if they can start paying riders better and giving them good medical and disability coverage).
  • + 1
 @mallowpufft: IF they exist they will rise to the top like any other rider who promotes themselves
  • + 2
 I think Rampage is better than ever. I think the idea of starting from scratch and building your own line is very unique. This years lines were fantastic. People who want it more RAW don't realize that it was more RAW back in the day because they didn't have as many professional digger crews. Bottom line is we want more "RAW" then judging should be based only on style and the line chosen, and tricks should have zero impact. I dont care either way. This mother f*ckers are amazing to watch.
  • + 7
 Hardtail category...
  • + 4
 It should be about raw rowdy lines and drops/airs.

I sure saw a lot of manicured lips and landings, making it more like a slopestyle contest.
  • + 1
 You should drink more Red Bull, it could turn on a few more synapsesin your brain. Right now you are running on no more than 20%. When top guys shit themselves for hitting those lines, I bet it is rowdy enough...
  • + 4
 I dare you to stand at the top of the mountain with your bike and then say it is to much like slopestyle.
  • - 2
 @RynoRodrigosouraus: I dare him to send those easy slope style jumps first...
  • + 8
 It's a bit of a catch 22, if you want to see drops as big as they're currently doing you need a pretty decent landing or someone is going to die.
  • + 0
 Would you like to see the riders die out there? Or would you rather see 20 riders ride down the same boring almost not rideable ridge line? These are your two options if you think it is to over built.
  • + 2
 Multiple categories to podium in - each with a cash prize - slopestyle, big mountain style, and overall. You could have special bonus incentives like most creative line and best rookie. Spread the wealth while at the same time creating a more dynamic viewer experience.
  • + 2
 It would be nice for them to have more time practicing since this is quite a bit bigger event than a slopestyle event! But no matter what, given the circumstances some athletes will make it good one time and not the next.... definitely looked like Semenuk didn’t practice as much as he should have.... but Brett deserved it. He should have won last year...

At this event Ethan Nell should have got scored a little higher... like first or at least second.
  • + 3
 Can we get those crazy drone guys follow the riders down the mountain!? That would be flipping insane and it would give a real impression of how crazy the lines are, you can't get that with a helicopter
  • + 2
 I almost think you need 2 categories. One that is judged like it is now based on slope style tricks and another category just based on the line and ignores the tricks. With how it is now I don’t see why guys like Brendog, Aggy and Silva bother to show up beyond making fans and sponsors happy, but I find their runs to be entertaining and would be sad to see them not show up.
  • + 7
 7. Hardtails only
  • + 3
 EXACTLY!!! and with square wheels, please!
  • + 2
 With the amount of money Redbull are generating, I feel like they should be investing in more cameramen so you can have a better perspective on the massive lines they're all riding. A lot of athletes team up with each other anyways, so I am sure you can stack a couple cameramen on those junctions and have a more hands on angle. The helicopter is rad but the gnar gets a bit lost from those high up angles.
  • + 5
 Too much slopestyle. Therefore I'd rather competition organised by Athertons in Snowdonia, Wales.
  • + 1
 The film angles do a very poor job of helping viewers understand how MASSIVE the mountain is, how steep the terrain is, and just how wild and skilled these riders are. I think there need to be drones (@fpvprovo and @airblastr etc) following each rider, as this creates the best representation I’ve seen of terrain
  • + 1
 The whole 1st 2 nd 3 rd place finishes goes against the creative impulse and rebellious roots of this kind of sporting. I like mountain biking because it’s not the olympics, it’s not about training 2 years for a 1 minute chance. Its for the love of it. Pay everyone the same. Getting in should be the prize.
  • + 2
 Totaly up for a new scoring system 2 podiums and 2 sets of prizes for gnarly and slopestyle lines, as both lines can't be judged the same and gnarly lines do not win rampage no more.
  • + 2
 I think for the viewers they need to get rid of the choppers and bring in drones. All the live footage was too far out and we could hardly see what was happening, probably cheaper and quieter too.
  • + 3
 6. Get Rob and Claudio commentating please. Or an alternative to the current American hyped up nonsense. It just grates me!!
  • + 1
 They should show the individual category scores for each rider. They could give awards for most difficult line, best style/tricks, best flow, etc. Then they could also add up the scores as they do now and that would be the rampage champion. This would clear up a lot of the fans' questions, I think. I hope the judges have already determined the line difficulty scores in the days before, and not making it up on the spot (which could make things inconsistent). They would need the ability to adjust score if someone takes an alternate route.
  • + 1
 Love the comment about diggers - their story and skillsets. For me it's about camera coverage. I know it's all big but that's always lost on camera - difficult to get round, but an entire run being covered from long distance by the chopper loses a huge amount of the amplitude. Better pre-placed camera angles so that the actual steepness, narrowness and size of the features would represent the tracks far better.
  • + 1
 The course and riding is pretty good as is,just needs drones better camera angles and a better judging system.

You can’t expect too raw these days -as raw is not as safe,these riders are risking their lives and at the end of the day no one wants to die riding a bike for kicks.
  • + 1
 how about adding an environmental impact plan? between the rider lines being built and influx of crowds, probably would be good to assess possible negative effects to the area. Hell, it might even make it a more sustainable event.
  • + 1
 They probably do that already, but it's boring to most so they don't shout about it.
  • + 1
 Better coverage! For the effort and risks the riders and diggers go to and the equipment available, Having only one heli super high up and one other camera on course with one top and one bottom doesn’t do the runs justice!
Surely there must be drones available that can put out a reasonable picture?
  • + 1
 How about this... do one in the winter on a ski hill and have them all ride fat and/or plus bikes. At least when they mess up the landing they'll skid across the slope with less rock to face and abrasion of skin. Redbull crashed ice typically attracts larger crowds and more tv coverage for example... and that's just guys on hockey skates...
  • + 3
 1. Not judging it like a slope event
2. Only one digger per rider, more focus on gnar and less "flow" trash
3. NOT JUDGING IT LIKE A SLOPE EVENT
  • + 1
 it pains me to read through these comments and see just how oblivious the general public is to what actually goes on out in the desert. everyone has such strong opinions for something they have no idea about. unless you have stood on the top of this event with a bike, torn your hands and body apart digging for 8 days, or have had to sit and judge 20 of the best riders in the world ride some of the hardest challenging terrain at very high level what grounds do you actually have to sit behind your screen and say things like: It's not "raw" enough, their is to much digging, the judges are not doing a proper job, ect act.
  • + 1
 Most of what you say is true but when Brendog scored 15 points higher than riders who crashed out obviously the judging needs some work. The general agreement is that riding harder lines is not being scored right relative to tricks on cleaner ones in a contest that's supposed to be free ride.
  • + 1
 Plus the article is what would make it better? There's not too many comments taking anything away from the riders or the work the diggers put in. It's unreal what they do, most pp just want it scored fairer and teams paid more.
  • + 1
 I would love to see something like the Chatel competition back then. A slopestyle big bike type of event, that was gnarly. I feel like it’ll be easier to judge if there was only one course, and it’ll open the doors even more for athletes like Adolf Silva and Ethan Nell. Fest Series and the FMB need to work something out. And also rewards for the top 10 finishers it’s insane to get there they deserve it and with what they make they probably need it too.
  • + 1
 Represent the diggers more AND have fewer diggers. The landings were so ridiculously massive and manicured, not that I could do any of the drops. Still, mad props to the athletes and Red Bull. Greatly enjoyed it, and watched the first hour at school with my sixth grade class. They were blown away!
  • + 2
 While each Rider only has two diggers. So you either drop that to one or you make a rule were they cant team up and build features. Teaming up and sharing lines is why these massive features are getting built. For example each Rider only gets 30 sandbags. That massive landing on that big drop easily had 150 sand bags use to build it. ..
  • + 2
 Make the live show entertaining. For whatever reason I love the event but don't watch live as it is really boring. All the camera angles take away from the spectacle of it all. Looks flat
  • + 2
 Call me a millennial all you want but I do not have the attention span to watch it live for 4 hours. I understand why it's that long but it's far too boring live .
  • + 1
 Every sport has video playback for judging now...maybe the judges have to see the riders line from their perspective...GOPROS...for example if you watch Brendogs line...he was sooo freaking smooth while his line was sooo freaking gnarly..the judges would have realized this if they watched his helmet cam...he was scored waaaay to low.
  • + 1
 You can’t judge a run comparatively to the other riders runs that you haven’t seen yet. That’s exactly why brendog got robbed, if they scored him somewhere in the 78-85 range they have to stack others they thought were better above him and it makes for weird 88.5 for fifth and 88.9 for third type scores. I agree with holding all first run scores till everybody gets down and then racking for the second runs accordingly!
  • - 1
 His score is lower but he doesn’t get screwed. If his was one of the better runs his score would stay near the top and the scores overall would just be lower.
  • + 1
 Double thumbs up on the "bike parks suck" comments. What a bunch of friggin' gophers. This is park riding, not MTB, and it sucks to see them wreaking havoc on the landscape. THERE'S NO FUTURE in this kind of mindless destruction, no matter how cool you think it looks.
  • + 1
 A big pool of cash, around 10 million, with multiple prizes for different things such as best run, biggest air, raddest new trick, rawest line or whatever. As mentioned give them more time to practice and ride, and take away the intense competition aspect and bring in more of the comeraderie. And as also mentioned the footage was well below an acceptable standard, especially considering that this stuff is ground breaking and it's a travesty not to have good footage in this day and age.
  • + 1
 Better video footage. Shots were too dark, or too far away or just the wrong angle! C'mon guys you know which route these guys are going.

Some side angle video shots would've been nice. Get rid of the heli and have some actual decent drone pilots to follow the riders.

Claudio & Rob would also be damn good.

I don't have 4 hours to watch it all, but I want to see them all. A highlights program that is an hour long would be great.
  • + 2
 Good prize purse all the way. These guys put their health on the line riding the mountain. To think that they don't all get adequate compensation whilst RB is making a ton or money is nuts.
  • + 1
 Stop broadcasting it live. The camera angles were garbage this year because they are from a heli. The best way to broadcast this would be POV on each rider with a shit ton of drones. Give 3 teams 30 minutes with the footage to turn it into videos and score the people creating the videos as well as the riders. Sure you lose out on watching it live, but the finished product would be sooo much better.
  • + 1
 So does anyone know how much the prize money is and how it's broken down? The only info I could find find was it was $200 000 and that each rider gets $5000 to help with expenses getting there. Does the $5000 each participant gets come out of the $200 000?
  • + 1
 How much? Not enough.
  • + 1
 1) drones instead of the helo - with one of those 360 camera it could setup below the level of a drop's take off, to really show the size
2) British English commentary option with Rob Warner - 3 whining american park bros playing cliche bingo added no technical detail or background
3)If the venue gets repeated next year, let all the existing features be there as a free for all - nobody owning a line from the previous year which greatly disadvantages the rookies.
  • + 1
 Would be curious if riders had to take two runs and first one was just to complete their run with no real tricks so judges get a sense of everyones line and second it's all about what you can do on your run. Would that help the judging and give the rides and extra run to dial in everything?
  • + 1
 I think there should be no drop in points for every where an artist/athlete crashes because of the beautiful work they do.
Semenuk crashed twice....he'll be there next year.....for the new guys who risked everything it will be harder to get chosen again.
Yes they have to earn more but do not have to be mirrored to the f1 or golf world. The reason they are doing this is because they love nature/thrills/building stuff/friendship/life.....they all should get the same rewards and party after that....repeat and give kids a reason to live
  • + 2
 Scores consist of three individual components: line choice/technical difficulty, tricks, style/uniqueness. 4 people on the podium: highest scoring rider for each category + rider with highest overall score.
  • + 0
 Yes I know this is irrelevant, yes I know I've hijacked the thread but some of the most important trails in the UK need your help!

These trails are ridden and built by so so many people, including Steve Peat, Craig Evans, Josh Lewis and the 50to01 crew. If you've seen Wheel Love or Slice of British Pie you've seen these trails!

Please sign the petition to open a dialogue for the protection of this unique trail network.

www.change.org/p/forestry-commission-england-save-wharncliffe-mountain-bike-trails-ee354cb6-9acd-4a22-b986-d58066114526?recruiter=9902559&utm_source=share_petition&utm_medium=facebook&utm_campaign=share_petition&utm_term=06c08fa5bef144a890b49ce0175cbb6d&utm_content=fht-13763121-en-gb%3Av6
  • + 2
 Fo shure
  • + 2
 If bike manufacturers can charge $10k for bikes, $100k purse is drop just of the bucket! These athletes are putting there life on the line!
  • + 4
 Considering the size and weight of Red Bull, $100k is pocket change for them and seeing as they run the event, they should be footing most of the bill for prize money anyway
  • + 5
 @WolfRidge08: One thing I like about Red Bull vs all these other energy drinks companies is that they actually invest in the sport. They support both big and smaller events, arts and whatnot. And they actually have their own medical facilities to help athletes recover when it really goes pear shaped. I've never heard of Rockstar or Monster doing anything similar.

So yeah, these athletes should be paid fairly. Though I'd say a good alternative would be that competitors get access to the same medical facilities should anything go wrong during a RB event. Not sure if this would work for them as hopefully in most cases this shouldn't be needed and nor Monster, nor Red Bull could make anything marketable out of RB caring for Brendan should he get injured.

Just a thought. More money for the athletes is definitely a good one too.
  • + 7
 @WolfRidge08: considering they run TWO Formula 1 teams, 100k is what they spend on decals there. Per race. Per car.
  • + 0
 Definitely more money and they should have more on the diggers for sure and award them for sketchfest dig, and best dig construction. As for the time line leave it many people forget how rampage was pretty much another slopestyle course instead of a big mountain contest, currently with the time it is blending the two great while still giving riders barely enough time to make it safe. That being said zone to zone it might need to be extended. They should look at going back to zone 1 if it hasn't been to dig out.
  • + 1
 Better videography. They know where the riders will be. For what I can only imagine helicopters and fuel cost, a few RED cameras and operators here and there to get a better perspective is surely realistic.
  • + 0
 Alright here’s my opinion for what it’s worth.
1) Get Tippie in the booth with McCaul and get rid of the other two.
2) The judging criteria should be public knowledge and each judges scorecard should be posted. No way Brendog should’ve gotten that score after hitting one of the gnarliest lines.
3) Good god, please give these riders 10-12 build days. Follow that with a mandatory day off. Followed by 4-5 days of practice so they can get the runs dialed. Followed by another mandatory day off before finals. That way the lines are built and dialed the riders runs are dialed and the athletes aren’t completely exhausted before the event. Far less crashes and way more epic sending.
  • + 1
 i heard Cam say during the even that they "limit ticket sales". why would they do that. sell as many as you can. that would certainly go towards paying the riders more. Football stadiums are packed. So Pack rampage.
  • + 1
 You can't sell unlimited tix. It's not assigned seats, its basically a free for all. Too many pp would be dangerous for the riders
  • + 3
 Jubilate ANT View of the elicopter, let in Drones with more close rider following
  • + 4
 Just ride the natural terrain, no shoveling allowed.
  • + 5
 we need more roost!
  • + 1
 ...flatter tables
  • + 1
 faster
  • + 1
 @Gfromars: thats what she said
  • + 1
 I’d like to see the guys ride each other’s lines for comparison. What about this format: Round 1: ride the line you built; round 2: ride someone else’s line. Highest combined score wins.
  • + 1
 Rampage needs better coverage, such an unreal event but the overhead shots just kill it. Get rid of the helis and get some drones with a sweet live feed and more cameras on the hill.
  • + 4
 Restoration of the site to pre-existing conditions.
  • + 4
 Unbiased judges would be a start ...!
  • + 2
 No more backflips. I know they're gnarly, but I think we've all seen enough backflips on every type of vehicle known to man, including the mountain bike.
  • + 3
 More police officers so we don’t have to hear the peanut gallery stating people got robbed.
  • + 1
 More practise, you should put it on first place. Every year is the same story. Too many falls especially this year. Riders didn't have a full run of their lines until the start of competition, that sounds absurd for me.
  • + 1
 thats down to the riders though. Build too much, can't practice. Brendan had completed his line and had a full practice in. Just because people bite off more building than they can chew doesn't mean there isn't enough practice...
  • + 1
 Let rampage die and bring in a new event that is more grass roots.. Make it a big jam session where there is a video contest at the end of 2 weeks.
  • + 1
 A million dollar pot for the top three.... that would cause a "battle royale" style rampage where all riders go big or broke!
  • + 1
 - two last days before finals just the rider and his bike/shovel.

- before the finals lines are judged seperatly for creativity and gnar. shared parts get deduction.
  • + 2
 More Nicholi style celebrations in the finish corral,I saw a bit of that channeling thru Nell and I approve.
  • + 3
 The riders should judge the event as a collective.
  • + 0
 Diggers! This event would be nothing without them. It's always cool to see the riders shout out their diggers but it would be rad to see all the diggers be acknowledged more in the event coverage
  • + 2
 More backflips. Every time the rider catches air, there should be a backflip.
  • + 2
 Let the riders judge the runs after the event. More suspense, more interaction, better results.
  • + 2
 They will still find massive cliffs to trick off of and huge jumps to trick get over it
  • + 4
 Fabio Wibmer
  • - 1
 the rawness of rampage is tough because to drop the absolute nutty drops and trick em is going to require digging. Personally, I think it should be pretty open to the riders as far as what they want to dig and what they want to leave, as they are the experts and are absolutely sending it. The main things I would like to see change in the event after watching the last 7 rampages are the athlete profile/drama built into the contest that Red Bull TV tends to do with anything action sports. The post run interviews are pretty much worthless in all. I think it’d be cool to run it pretty much like a FWT event. One venue for qualifying where everybody has to qualify and one run in the finals at a different venue. I think with a two venue event, things would be left more raw, riders would ride for a sick line with less drama over a big feature and finding overall gnarlier runs because they have to be more creative. Also tricks are cool but it should not be a slope style comp. A gnar backflip in a run should be where everyone’s kinda pushed towards. Andreas run was the most rampage of all the runs and he should’ve been awarded 1st for the speed, gnar, and sketchiness of his run. It was metal.
  • + 1
 Excellent article!!! Thank you for exposing those positive critics

PS: and btw: the podium is just... i don`t know.... I`ll stay polite...
  • + 1
 Allow more of the general public to attend by selling tickets. This would increase revenue and money for the riders.
  • + 1
 Create 2 lines each rider ride them both to equal point scoring how they each handle and use content
  • + 1
 Rampage should have a Novice, Sport, and Expert amateur class as well. That would be interesting. Wink
  • + 2
 No points for tricks, just score on technicality and going big
  • + 2
 Oh yeah and insurance. These guys need lots of insurance
  • + 3
 Uphill Rampage
  • + 0
 Look up RED BULL BAY CLIMB!!! IT'S LITERALLY PAINFUL!!!
  • + 1
 Dude it’s just not prognarcore enough. Not enough bro-brahs and core-ha’s, let’s make it gnar gnar for all!
  • + 1
 Better video coverage, Livestreaming. Bring back the drones, invite @airblaster and mrSteele...
  • + 1
 Better access for fans. THere should be shuttles provided or closer bike valet.
  • + 1
 Wow. It's like a mile ride in. For handicapped maybe shuttles.
  • + 1
 @matttauszik: 4.3 miles, then 3/4 mile walk. Mixing peds and drunk bikers trying to gtfo is a nightmare on a dirt road.
  • + 3
 Drones drones drones
  • + 1
 Event coordinators should work to include more gender and racial diversity.
  • + 2
 How bout some spandex in the mix!
  • + 1
 stop the mcDonalization of mountainbiking.....Give the riders what they deserve....
  • + 1
 Rampage needs my mate Randy.
  • + 0
 What. Why are the Patterson brothers quoted in this? Seems like an odd place for two old BMX guys.
  • + 1
 What was the prize purse this year? Cant seem to find it anywhere
  • + 2
 Recumbent class.
  • + 1
 add a reward for the digging team, like this double half loop !!
  • + 1
 Rider athlete judged, all raw terrain . My 2 cents
  • + 1
 Get some women riders ...
  • + 1
 $50k-$100k let’s do this! Plus an open category!
  • + 1
 Do a night rampage with fireworks on every jump.
  • + 1
 How bout play it like a game of h-o-r-s-e?
  • + 1
 topless girls would be great!
  • - 3
 Let’s keep it G rated, some skin suits!
  • + 1
 How about the Judges pre-ride the lines so
they can do their job better?
  • + 1
 Everyone whip out your motos and have a Hillclimb event.
  • + 1
 Simple. No man Made lips.
  • + 1
 Better camera! More close ups live, follow cam from the side.
  • + 0
 The pros should get more appearance money because they are risking life and limb.
  • + 1
 Voting which includes POV footage.
  • + 1
 They have it backwards it should be an E bike hill climbing contest.
  • + 1
 Free Cupcakes!
  • + 1
 A cameo from Duff Man?
  • + 1
 Rampage world series
  • + 0
 I was expecting black jack and hookers in the answers
  • + 1
 More Cowbell!!
  • + 1
 Cameras. More Cameras.
  • + 1
 7. 50to01
  • + 0
 E-Bikes......
  • - 1
 not having it associated with Red Bull would be a good start.
  • + 11
 Good luck finding another company to lay out that kind of money.
  • + 0
 Cheerleaders.
  • - 3
 Kill the judges. Bring the ones that can see.
  • - 2
 6. More Randy coverage
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