If it ain't broke, don't fix it. Just perfect it. The third iteration of the Tues chassis went straight to the top of two podiums in Lošinj last weekend between the legs of Aaron Gwin. After the race, we checked out the third iteration bike and attempted to not die riding it down the Lošinj World Cup track.
The new Tues guards its predecessor's silhouette but has received some evolutionary changes to the kinematic, sizing, finish and detail. The biggest difference is the introduction of a carbon chainstay to complete the chassis. There are two models to choose from: the CF Race version is priced at €3999/$3999 USD and the CF Pro Race is priced at €5499/$5499 USD. All sizes and models should be available from 6th June.
YT Tues Details
• Intended use: DH
• Wheel size: 27.5"
• Rear wheel travel: 200mm
• 63.5º head angle
• Full carbon frame
• 435mm chainstay, 440mm for XL/XXL
• Sizes: S - XXL
• Price: €3999 - €5499 EUR / $3999 - $5499 USD
• Yt-industries.com Frame Details The Tues has received a number of small updates to the frame. The cable routing now has internal tubes that carry it through the frame and those cables are clamped under the main rocker link to stop rattle. The internal routing entrance port at the headtube is angled upwards to avoid contact with race number boards. The pivot hardware is now all accessed from one side (as requested by the Mob mechanics), there is an integrated downtube protector and the carbon chainstay has integrated protection, too. The carbon chainstay is said to save 300g, and 200g have been shaved from the front triangle. This gives the Pro Race model a claimed weight of 15.2kg.
The downtube has been shaped to lower shock and linkage deeper into the frame, which drops the centre of gravity slightly whilst allowing the bike to maintain its silhouette throughout the stroke of its travel. Gwin pointed out a few brands' bikes that look good in the pits, but kooky when they are sitting into the travel, and who wants their bike to look nasty in riding pictures?
The rear hub is still 150mm wide and uses a Syntace X12 axle; the dropouts also have recesses to receive the wheel, one of the benefits of a 157mm axle. The derailleur hanger is shaped to avoid chain suck between the cassette and frame and the chain can also be hooked onto the hanger when removing the rear wheel.
All the bearings are now cageless full complement bearings and the pivots with the highest loads (main pivot and Horst pivot) use double row bearings. These bearings should add longevity to the pivot's life and there's been an addition of an extra lip seal to keep out dirt and water from the moving parts.
Tire clearance has been improved from the MK2 to MK3 Tues as well as heel clearance when pedalling.
Suspension The suspension has stayed pretty much the same; Head-Engineer Stefan Willared and Aaron Gwin said they had conjured up some ideas for an all-new system, but in the end, they were only creating more problems than they were improving. They slightly adjusted some pivot positions to tune the ride. The main difference is 15% increase in the anti-rise figure which means the suspension will be less active under braking but should do a better job of preserving the bike's dynamic geometry. This a benefit that'll give amateur riders a feeling of safety where the pros are so accurate with line choice and braking points. There are a few tracks that this feature will help the pros on, too, such as the super steep Val di Sole.
End stroke progression has been slightly reduced by 5% to get more use out of the last few mm's of travel, but the Tues is still one of the most progressive bikes on the market. This also means that coil spring fans should have no problem switching from air to a physically sprung shock. YT hasn't moved to a metric shock, instead, they have stayed with the huge 267x89mm stroke damper as the longest available Metric shock is 250x75mm.
There has been a small increase in mid-stroke support. Gwin wanted to raise the bottom bracket to have a little more ground clearance in the middle part of the travel, but in the end, the team decided to keep the static height the same and increase the dynamic ride height. Changing the suspension's curve slightly should raise the BB by 2mm with the same suspension settings compared to the previous bike – something that only American Superheroes will likely notice.
Geometry and Sizing The geometry is also essentially the same. The head angle stays at 63.5º and the bottom bracket drop is -7mm, the chainstay is 435mm on S-L sizes but has an extra 5mm added to the XL and new XXL sizes. All frames have gained an extra 5mm of reach, and the XXL has a whopping 495mm reach giving tall riders plenty of breathing space. All frames can be used with adjustable offset cups from Acros to add or subtract 4mm to the reach, Gwin is currently riding an XL with -4mm cups.
Build Kits To begin with, there are only two options of build kit, both based on the full carbon frame although we would not be surprised to see an alloy version in the future as well as a big wheeler. The Pro Race 'Mob Edition' is the headliner at €5499/$5499 USD (prices have dropped by around 15% in North America after a change of distribution channel) and is said to be identical to the bike the Mob races, the only difference being the racers have custom tunes (like all of the top riders) and lacks the FTD Flat Tire Defender system which is not an option to install when selling complete bikes online.
If you don't want to be in the Mob, there is a Pro Race version with the same components that has a liquid metal/black colourway. The Race version drops in at €3999/$3999 USD and offers essentially the same build with slightly lower spec parts like the black coated Fox Performance suspension and alloy components from Renthal and E13 over their carbon counterparts.
CF Pro Race 'Mob Edition' €5499
I was able to hit 7-8 runs on the Losinj World Cup track the day after last weekend's race. It was brutal and forming an opinion of the Tues was close to impossible around (literally) falling off blind drops and struggling for grip on the one-minute of track that was still open to ride.
However, I opted for the XXL size which has the same 495mm reach as the Commencal Supreme V29 I have been riding comfortably on my local trails. Dropping in on the XXL Tues, I was mostly s*** scared of the track, new bike and my lack of skill so ended up riding too far off the back of the bike. I would happily ride the XL in these conditions or reduce the reach with -4mm headset cups. The XXL is probably the only downhill bike, along with the Commencal V29 and Nicolai G19, that will give riders over 6'3"/190cm a comfortable downhill ride.
Shorter riders might need to slam the saddle forwards to avoid tire buzz. My saddle height was comfortable for me, but still buzzed the tire which was also something that happened more to shorter test riders on the same day. It is nice to see a brand adding different chainstay lengths between sizes, but I think there is still a disconnect between an 85mm change in reach between sizes and only 5mm at the chainstay.
The most noticeable feature of the Tues was the drive it creates when pumping or compressing through the travel – it just wants to take off down the trail. It also flies off jumps which is going to make this one hell of a fun park bike when the lifts are open.
There isn't much else to comment on – everything seemed dialed and just did its job. The cable routing and chainstay protectors keept things quiet, and all the bike's features blended seamlessly into a subtle package. In its third iteration, the Tues seems to have nailed all the angles: sizing, geometry, price, weight, style and attention to detail. It is a bike that can be taken from the box, suspension pressured, set up tubeless, and be raced to win. I'm looking forward to getting one on the track to line up against the competition as I focus the rest of my year on testing downhill bikes.
m.pinkbike.com/news/tech-randoms-loinj-dh-world-cup-2018.html
Maybe this bike win a world cup DH, but there is still no room for a water bottle...
Better you get Brook McDonald who suddenly rides way better than beford - THAT is for sure because of the bike, not vice-versa.
Learn something every day !
If this was any of the big brands, the top end would cost 8900$ and the 6600$ “entry level” would have NX, Deoroe brakes and a Rhythm 40 a dual crown Sektor.
After years of being screwed, their customers are going elsewhere.
I think if you are someone who isn't mechanical or willing to spend the time on the bike, this becomes a bigger issue where those cost savings will diminish as you bring your bike for service to a bike shop. Bike shops will be fine (perhaps even better off) so long as they have in-stock parts and great mechanics. The ones who rely on new bike sales are the ones who will be hurt most.
In the end, I see it as an inevitable shift in the way we consume and riders are the ones who will benefit from this level of competition among manufacturers.
On the other hand, when was the last time a bike shop actually worked with you on DH bike? In my experience it's "we can order that for you" and "you ride DH, you know how to set this up". Most of the time they don't even have extra coils and you are going out the door with what it came with. Is it too much to ask for my butt to be kissed a little when I'm dropping six stacks on a bike?
I expect my YT to need assembly and I expect to wait for replacement parts. I know that going in. When my Demo creaks and the shop has to order a different wait coil for me it is not expected and leaves a sour taste in my mouth.
Still loving my 27.5 Jeffsy and all its awesomeness - for the bargain price of $2,000.
@Poulsbojohnny: I see distributors getting all pissy that a person was able to use modern tech and buy something for likely their cost from elsewhere and as a result not granting warranty.
Everyone is in it to win it. We've all got kids to feed and mortgages to pay. Hell, I don't work for free. One cannot expect anyone else to either. The market will set the price of bikes, and at the moment the marketplace is changing and the prices are adjusting. I think the distributors are the ones who we don't need, to be honest. We get a better experience if we buy at anytime we perceive as cheap direct from the brand, and if we need parts or work doing we go to a shop. We can hold the new parts before we decide what to buy, there is an expert on hand to offer advice, and by cutting out the distributor the prices come down. Consumers aren't the only ones who can order off the net. Shops should be doing it too, direct from manufacturers overseas. Why do we need distributors any more? Decent shops can keep their profits up by offering servicing on suspension parts. That ain't cheap, yo.
Imho there being a relevant market (relative to 650B) for 29" downhill bikes is something that still stands to be proven.
Yes there´s people proclaiming how they would totally buy one, but how many of those will go out there and actually guinea pig the first production run?
Commencal are the only ones who did not come out with only a limited number run of frames so far. Trek and Intense are small numbers only afaik. So i think most manufacturers are still testing the waters and are not yet fully committed, which makes sense really, since they cannot simply force 29ers on us like they did with 650B because there are actual physical limitations to the wheels and also for some people (height being the most prevalent one) when it comes to 29er bikes.
I´m not saying 29ers don´t make sense for some people, but since the dh-bike market is already pretty small, dividing their product portfolio into two options may cause more problems than good for some manufacturers.
I guess YT simply decided it´s not worth to split their focus and just let other manufacturers have those few and far between 29er sales for now. It´s not like those 650B Tues will rot in some warehouse just because others are selling 29ers. They can jump on the 29er bandwagon any time they want and as long as their 650B bike keeps beating all those 29ers, i guess it´s a rather wise tactic for them.
This makes all the more sense as MTB, and DH in particular, are rather volatile markets that seem to rather benefit those who adapt to changes compared to those who precipitate them.
The builds are that much better and people don’t see the reason so spend an extra 2500$ on the big brands bikes.
Sales go down, redesigns get pushed back, sales continue to go down, maybe there isn’t a next generation. DH continues to die.
Who would have thought that the market for DH bikes, which are second bikes and toys used a few times a month is sensitive to price....
I’m not a YT fan at all, but they are killing it and the big companies are sleeping. All those people that bought YT DH bikes now have YT trail bikes this year.
Are you drunk?
If DH is dying thats solely because big suspension trail bikes render them useless for anything but racing. Hell, even SC categorises new Nomad as "Trail & Freeride" bike
Send to me it's YT that isn't really keeping up. Yes, Gwin probably doesn't want to race a 29, that doesn't mean they shouldn't sell one alongside the 27.5 like others are doing. I mean come on, they haven't even brought an alloy Tues with the new carbon one. At this point the Tues is just an exercise in selling Gwin's products (brakes, tires, grips etc).
I could not name a single bike manufacturer that withdraw their DH bike from line up.
Relax, enjoy and go ride your f***** bike
The dimension that really matters is the wheelbase and the rider position relative to front and rear axles. On a DH bike rider position must be slightly skewed toward rear end, wheelbase must be long enough for stability, and headtube angle must be slack enough. If you want a 1220 mm wheelbase and a 435 mm chainstays, as well as a 63.5 HA you cannot get a lot more reach.
One thing is clear to me - dh bikes have pretty much always been shorter than trail bikes in the reach. In my mind the idea is to keep a reasonable wheelbase and as said above to do that with the slack head angle and often longer chainstays of a dh bike means shortening the front-centre by shortening the reach. The shorter reach may also allow the rider to be more dynamic.
Conversely if you want your trail bike to have a similar feeling wheelbase to your dh bike then you’ll need a longer reach.
How much is by design, coincidence, etc? I dunno.
On a personal level I know I can get enough weight on the front end to corner confidently on my current trail bike. If I could morph the thing into a dh bike by slackening the head angle 4° the front wheel would be too far away for me and I’d lose that confidence in the corners (though maybe gain some elsewhere, but any bike can go fast in a straight line, I digress) so what I’d do is slacken the head angle (better for steeps) and then reduce the reach/ front centre to bring that wheel back in and under my weight and control. I’d switch to a longer stem too.
There are other factors, the slacker HA and longer fork requires you to be able to be more forward then a trail/enduro bike to get the weight on the front wheel. Also too stretched and the range of movement starts to decrease which is needed for body language over obstacles.
Why does nobody talk about torso length when it comes to bike sizing?
@ThomDawson: Yep, not an exact science by any means. Sometimes it feels right because it does. How many people happily ride sizes that don't seem to make sense for them? A black and white explanation is inevitably wrong.
Do you think you or other PinkBike staff could ask him whether it was the bike or him or both that helped him through this race? By "him" I mean did he do any extra or new training over the off season. And by bike, did the 29er and new design help? Thanks.
Oh? Specialized and Trek makes faster bikes? Willing to bet Gwin would disagree with that.
I was just trying to be a smartass...
The US prices do not include sales tax, the EU prices include VAT. €3315 *1.2 = €3978. The pricing is almost identical.
Okay I got it, we've (amateur connsumers) git a pretty darn good geo and suspension and Gwinny has some extra 15% to speed, just in case he lost his brakes or chain. Well done and thanks Aaron for not going into 29"
Its the fourth version of the Tues:
Tues
Tues 2.0
Tues CF / Tues AL
Tues 2018
On the other hand I calculat roughly with CHF 3'000.00 in (new) parts, so I come close to the price of the top version. Actually, with the new Fox 40 it's almost 4'000.00.
Perhaps late to the party, but running the keg now that they're here!
www.bikefriday.com/folding-bikes
#metoo
I'll be reviewing one fully in the future on tracks that I am capable of riding.
My focus was more on the fact that everyone said it was a boring, flat, short, and generally uninteresting race track. The fact that our have some background and still had trouble kinda emphasises that point.
Schladming 2006, I finished 69th with a crash. I raced there again two years later, ruptured my spleen and nearly died. Stopped racing downhill after that!