1 Question: What's the Next Step For Mountain Bike Suspension Technology?
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Today's top of the line suspension offerings are miles ahead of those rudimentary elastomer and coil spring forks and shocks, featuring sophisticated valving, independent compression and rebound adjustments, and a blend of stiffness and light weight that was unimaginable during mountain biking's formative years. But what does the future hold? When there are single crown forks with 6” of travel that weigh only 4 pounds and are robust enough to handle any type of terrain, what will the next generation of suspension look like? We rounded up a selection of suspension gurus and industry insiders to try and get a hint of what's coming down the line. Understandably, many companies are cautious about divulging too much information about their current projects, but there are still strong hints as to where the suspension world is headed.
Jon Cancellier - Product Manager, RockShox
 | The next step for mountain bike suspension will be the versatility to adapt to a wide range of riding experiences with a single setup. Suspension that has the ability to transform itself from performance that would rival current DH bikes but at the flip of a lever or remote can go to XC firm. Forks that are DH stiff at XC weight. Rear shocks that are DH plush but XC efficient. In addition, we will see products that are easier to set up and interact with for the end user. Less time dealing with settings and more time spent riding on the trail. Lapierre's E:I system was a great step forward in re-thinking the way that we interact with our suspension and the way that our suspension interprets the terrain around us. We feel there are great benefits to not just replacing a mechanical switch with an electronic one but as to where this will take us we'll have to wait and see. |
Bryson Martin - Owner/Founder, DVO Suspension
| I'm not sure we will see big "steps" in MTB suspension technology but rather small steps in refinement. I do like the fact that we are seeing more companies going inverted with single crown designs. Inverted chassis do offer a great feel that conventional designs aren't able to deliver so expect to see more innovations in that direction, especially from DVO. I've been a big fan of inverted designs and first developed an inverted carbon XC fork 15 years ago. I also think electronic tuning or a simplified version of data acquisition may make its way into suspension. It would be great to see how your settings are actually performing on the trail via an iPhone or Android app. For example, electronics in the suspension can indicate if your rebound or compression damping and air or coil spring settings are in the ballpark according to your weight and riding conditions. We are currently working on a app that can answer technical questions or trouble shoot set-up based off what the rider describes he or she is having issues concerns with. It would be like having the knowledge of a DVO technician on hand via an app. But of course, adding a few simplified electronic sensors shouldn't add complexity to the overall suspension system since I feel mountain bikers don't want the hassles of electronic gadgets that are finicky and delicate. Rather, they just want to ride and set it and forget it for the most part with the exception of an XC racer who may not mind hassling with the electronics. |
Darren Murphy - Founder, Push Industries
| What's the next step in MTB suspension technology? To quote the Samsung commercials, "The next big thing is already here" with our patent-pending Dual Overhead Valve System found in ELEVENSIX. For us this type of user driven technology is most important. While our compression valve assembly is relatively consistent with what's found in high end racing dampers, the execution of providing two independent on-the-fly ride characteristics is unique. As for the next step in suspension technology, our focus isn't always on making something new necessarily but rather making the ride better. A lot of times this result comes from something that isn't sexy and doesn't have an acronym associated with it. For example, in the case of our shaft assembly we spend a lot of time on manufacturing tolerances, what type of coatings are used on what parts, seal and seal gland design, as well as fluid testing. The results from these efforts add up to significant gains on the way the bike responds to small bumps and the level of off-camber traction you get, but don't make for the greatest marketing story when one of the big guys comes out with an electronic-diffibulating-bluetooth-actuated-damping-dingho. So without continuing to babble, what is the next step? I think it's going to be spring technology. Incredibly light, performance spring systems that don't require a suspension pump... |
Dan Dacko - Marketing, SR Suntour
| Simpler systems. Sure there are electronics out there pushing to be the next thing and stating to be able to think and react faster than you, but none of them seem to have created a large enough benefit for the greater good (and they are still expensive). But simpler high performance systems seems to be the next step that everyone is moving towards. Simpler usually means less parts, which usually means lighter weight. Simpler usually means that tuning a fork for a certain riding style, weight or conditions is faster and easier to obtain for those that might not be suspension experts. Simpler usually means a system can be made more durable and reliable as tolerances are easier to meet and less moving parts to break or wear out. A simpler system just makes more sense to match with do it all go anywhere trail bikes, the above reasons explain why. |
Jim Morrison - Senior Design Engineer, Cane Creek
| In the immediate future I think we will see increasing numbers of twin-tube dampers like the Double Barrel as the "average" consumer becomes more sophisticated with regard to their suspension setup and performance. We're already seeing the beginnings of this trend with the recent introductions of new products from Ohlins and Fox and it stands to reason that this trend will continue in both front and rear applications. Furthermore, as twin-tube technology becomes more prevalent I suspect we will see some trickle-down into more accessible price-points so even entry-level riders can reap the benefits of this technology. If we look a little further into the future I think we will see a vast expansion of the features "landscape" of bicycle shocks. These additional features will range from improved climbing modes that optimize the damper's performance for low speeds to more refined and adaptable air-springs and beyond. As with all technological advancements, some of these features will be mere gimmicks but some will be truly game-changing. Of course, the packaging of bicycle shocks is always a big challenge so I expect we will see the emergence of some new shock sizes to allow designers a little more room to "play" so to speak. In short, my crystal ball says that the top-end technologies of today will be in the hands of every-man (or woman) tomorrow and the top-end suspensions of tomorrow will further reduce the inherent bicycle suspension performance compromise between climbing and descending. |
Noah Sears - Product and Marketing Manager, MRP
| I think the next step in mountain bike suspension is a re-imagining of rear suspension - what it's there to do and how best to accomplish that. Whereas with front suspension you can only skin the cat so many ways - traditional, inverted, one legged, etc... rear suspension is more integral to frame designs and not necessarily restricted one type of structure or layout. There have certainly been some pretty awesome new technologies introduced in the last few years, but for the most part modern air shocks look a lot like the original Fox ALPS first introduced almost a quarter century ago. That basic packaging and structure is almost universal across all brands. What direction(s) rear suspension goes is anyone's guess, but my prediction is that there are some pretty wild concepts on drawing boards now, and most likely even in the prototyping phase. You have to think that with this industry's never ending arms race to produce the lightest, most-capable bikes, that there are damper designs out there that defy suspension orthodoxy. I'm not talking about the incorporation of electronics that simply take the place manual adjustments or do the suspension tuning for you, that stuff is here and has yet to really prove revolutionary. I'm talking about suspension technologies so different from the current norm you'll not only be scratching your head when you see them, you'll wonder how you ever rode what you've got now! |
Clarke Dolton - Marketing Manager, X-Fusion
| I would say that in the X-Fusion office we are under the suspicion that electronics are the next big thing for MTB suspension, and seat posts as well. We know the technology exists from Moto GP and other motorsports based suspension, we know battery technology is there, so it's really just the compartmentalizing or packaging of those technologies into MTB suspension. Is that direction X-Fusion is heading? Probably not, at least not right now, but we do think this will be the next step. We think we may soon see real time computer controlled damping and it's not hard to imagine Di2 supported suspension as well. As for seat posts, we think a motor driven and electronically controlled post will also come as part of the "electronic movement" and there are many patents out there supporting that idea. The suspension segment of the industry has gotten really tough in the last few years with many manufactures making truly high performance products so X-Fusion is concentrating on keeping our quality, performance and value high to stay competitive. That said, we do have some pretty cool projects in the works that will certainly turn some heads, but I can't talk about that. |
Jeremiah Boobar - Director of Suspension Technology, Cannondale
| We will see more electronic suspension solutions that will offer mountain bikers benefits in terms of performance and ease of use that can't exist without a powered system. We've all seen the potential presented by Accell group's E:I system and Magura's Elect. They offer benefits that could not be realized directly through pure mechanical solutions, which is a great step forward, but not enough of an improvement for the majority of users to accept the additional "hassle" of living with a battery. These new benefits will be so compelling that the issue of managing charging a battery for your mountain bike will become less of an issue for a broader base of mountain bikers. I say all of that knowing that I myself still struggle with the concept of having a power supply to manage my mountain bike. There is something about dealing with a battery that suddenly makes you feel less self-sufficient, which in turn detracts from that experience of being outside and being one with nature. However, knowing the potential benefits, I think I will find a way to deal with my own emotional hang-ups and have a bike that rides faster. If this question was intended to be interpreted more broadly then I would add a few more things. Suspension quality will continue to improve allowing for riders to reduce the amount of travel they use. As the quality of the suspension improves the system can more efficiently dissipate the same amount of energy input by the rider. This means that you can use less travel to maintain the same control. We can see a glimpse of this with the recent introductions of very capable 120mm trail bikes. With the right wheels, tires and bars these little bikes make you wonder how many areas of the world would make you want more travel. |
Mark Fitzsimmons - Race Manager, FOX Racing Shox
| In the future, the mountain bike rider will benefit from two developing directions. The first is bringing high-end suspension performance to more affordable bikes. We want our customers to enjoy the benefits of our RAD suspension efforts on bikes that the working man can afford. The second is further developing electronics into suspension. The sky is the limit on electronic controls. There will be a lot of mountain bike riders that will say, "Why do I need this on my mountain bike?" For starters, every one of our World Cup cross country athletes are racing on electronically controlled suspension. They won the World Championships on it last year. And they are using it by their own choice. We have to remember cycling is a human-powered sport. On a good day, some of us might put out a single horsepower. In order to enjoy endless hours of mountain biking we are battling a power to weight balance. A mountain bike's suspension needs to offer efficiency along with comfort. Electronic advancements will require less maintenance. Before our XC teams were racing on iRD, they were using cable-activated remote levers to control their suspension. Typically, we would have to replace cables once a race as the elements would cause cable drag as water gets into the system. With iRD, we go an entire season without servicing these controls. Another benefit is reduced fatigue. It takes about eight to twelve pounds of lever force to activate mechanical lever controls. This effort over the course of a two-hour ride is very fatiguing. The iRD switch requires less than two pounds of force to activate. Julien Absalon went from controlling his suspension twenty times a race to one hundred times a race because of this advantage. |
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I also love the fact that dudes at MTBStore in Gothenburg, selling Kona, have several rental bikes, which they rent out at a relatively small price, and this is not real trail center (yet?) here or a bike park. Several other stores are starting to offer such services. In this way anyone can ride a bloody great bike from time to time if he can't afford one, and if someone comes to me for a visit and none of my bikes fits him/her, they can rent it and I can make sure they can enjoy local spots to the fullest. I personally value such things above anything else, even above a company sticking to 26", because these are tangible, advancement improving the way people ride in terrain and experience MTB in all forms.
Helium still has weight; if you'd drop a balloon filled with Helium on a place where there is no air, for example on the moon, it will fall down on the ground, just likle a rock.
This being said, replacing Helium by air, would save less weight, than the total weight of the air in the forks. Which I guess even in an air fork with compressed air, would only be about 5 grams maximum.
Then Helium has its weight aswell, so imagine the weight of the air would be 5 grams, the savings would be even less; probably less than 3 grams.
Then Helium excists out of much smaller particles, meaning it will leak through materials, where air would not be able to leak through. This means you'd have to use more dense materials to keep the Helium inside, probably adding 100-200g total to the forks.
This is why Helium is never being used in the cycling industry. Not in tyres, not in forks, not inside frames.
This means that the industry is FORCING me to both buy a new frame that fits tapered steerertubes and where the geometry (/bb height) is based on 27.5" wheels, which I'd need to buy aswell.
But then again, screw that, luckely there is still plenty of choice on the second hand market. I think that will last another 5 to 10 years before we run out of fork options for these sizes in the second hand market.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=I2iUQqp-zU8
I do not want more electronic gizmos. Fewer parts fewer problems. And what kind of sissy needs to replace the cable on a fork lockout EVERY RACE because it gets a little XC dust gets in it? Maybe the athletes should be thumb-wrestling a little more so their digits can bulk up.
The SR Suntour response best. Simplicity.
Strava will soon be the proving grounds that these geeked out bikes are not faster for the average Joe. They are just more expensive for the average schmuck.
The advent of long travel on dirt bikes changed the nature of the terrain, creating whoops and braking bumps in lots of places that are deep enough to hide a pack of cub scouts in. Thus was created a never ending loop of suspension technology fighting to keep up with deteriorating terrain. The point is that advances in technology change the entire experience, not just the bike itself, and perhaps not always in a good way.
If you are in advertising or marketing... kill yourself.
www.youtube.com/watch?t=380&v=CU5OUGS4yFA
added bonus:
www.youtube.com/watch?v=_6hYe6FbA60
@phoenixsun ah thanks, i was pretty sure Radiohead didn't get into viniculture
The question is what is so scary in the idea that we already reached pretty much everything possible in MTB suspension technology? That 2025 forks will not be any better than current Pike or floatX? Why is development and growth sold as something mandatory? To me, all this resizing of hubs, wheels, tyres are a sign of overgrowth, of uncrontrolled surplus. Nobody really needs that, it's like trying to improve marital sex life by renting latest porn, when everyone silently knows that everything's been already done, that you have to get it up and get the other wet, get on top of each other and get on with it. If you don't like it this way then there are only three options: closing your eyes, getting permission to go on a shag week with someone else or simply masturbation. External stimuli are weak, as opposed to intrinisc motivation, you do it, or forget it.
2000 AD Shift from Rockshox Jet (something something) to Rockshox Psylo - dramatic improvement in stiffness and composure of chassis, damper improved incredibly (elastomer to hydracoil).
2004 Psylo to Pike - much better hassis, much better damper, at minimal weight increase. You could huck lots of stuff with that thing, compared to Psylo, not mentoning speeds a which you could ride, average "edible obstacle" size doubled.
2007 Psylo to Lyrik - huge difference both in chassis and damper, you can easily ride DH trails with Lyrik, real LSC damper, very good balance between diving and plushness, with good bottom out control, better rebound - all that with no weight penalty to previous PIKe.
2014 Lyrik to Pike - no improvement in chassis, slightly plusher thanks to new seals, slightly better LSC - less divey than Lyrik while remaining plush, no improvement in bottom out control, same rebound, slight improvement in air spring thanks to tokens, only tangible difference: 300 grams lighter.
@WAKIdesigns, do you know if there is a decent model year Lyrik that came in a straight 1-1/8" steerer?
I'm really curious to see what Noah Sears is talking about: "I'm talking about suspension technologies so different from the current norm you'll not only be scratching your head when you see them, you'll wonder how you ever rode what you've got now!"
I'd like to see coils return in shorer travel. Smoothness and less things to go wrong compare to air.
Most "gains" in the suspension world are always done in the name of performance, where the gains that would matter most to the average user is in practicality.
The highest performing most light weight shocks and forks are more money and more maintenance than they're worth if shit blows up inside them and they need to be rebuilt constantly. My pockets don't refill quickly enough to keep up with a fork that needs more money and attention than some blonde bimbo trophy wife.
Then it reaches a point of diminishing returns, and the suspension becomes ultra expensive and super high maintenance and the people cry...WTF!! I cant keep up with this!! I just Bought the damn thing and now I need to spend How much time and money to rebuild it every Month!! And I cant even do it all at home!!? I need to dismantle my $(insert many zero's) dollar bike and send my fork away for How long!!?? Again!!!!?? Can't I just ride my bike dammit!?
At which point we hopefully see a return to something sensible with a product that is reliable over the course of years, not weeks, and can happily be serviced at home.
I understand that adjustability can be a pain in the ass, especially for newer riders but then if you don't like the stock tune, you're either stuck with something that leaves you longing for more or you have to pay (again) to get a proper revalving which I kind of see as a lose/lose situation. And I don't want to have to pay and maintain stuff like autosag that nobody except rental places really need either. Yes, maybe the higher end products could use some dumbing down but you can't sacrifice performance on a high end product so it is a tough balance.
In the current state of things, I don't want adjustability to go away and I don't think it will unless someone comes with a revolutionary concept where the shock can figure out the right LSR, HSR, LSC, HSC tunes for anybody by itself and EVEN if it did, you'd get people like me who would be curious to see if the bike would handle better with a little more of something and a little less of something else.
There will always be premium customers who want infinite adjustability (racers, for one), but they're definitely not the majority of the market. With the amount of bitching about product cost and maintenance intervals we see here on PB, I expect to see more and more people on Suntour suspension in the future.
(and basically what @BiNARYBiKE said).
also, it would be neat-o if the telemetry was A) easy to read and understand and B) telemetry collection was removable, so I didn't have to think about it all the time, and lug it up every hill.
But yeah, along with the telemetry could come custom settings. Imagine hitting the 'Fromme' setting, or 'Sunshine Coast' or 'Whistler Bike Park' settings, and have your compression, rebound, etc all tuned to where you left it the last time you were in that location. I'm agnostic to negative on most bike electronics at the moment. Di2? Eh, whatever. Something like that? Oh yes, sign me up.
Second idea I had is to attach a pressure sensor to the schrader valve of the fork/shock and record the pressure change over time. This would be not as ideal as a travel measurement but I wonder if it measuring that pressure over time would at all be helpful. Anyone think this would be at all helpful to know? I have no idea.
However what do we actually do with this data? 99.9% of riders wouldn't have the slightest clue as to what the data really means, as they also don't have a System ID of the actual damper assembly to draw reference from for more in depth analyzation, and thereafter - optimization.
We need a front end that will display this data and do all the frequency response analysis and other calculations based on suspension parameters necessary to give the end user of this telemetry equipment a meaningful display of what's going on, and highlight areas that are 'good' 'bad' and 'optimum' perhaps.
Just thinking out loud, but it's a problem I face at work a lot - WTF are we actually going do do with all this 'COOL' data? how do we make it mean something to our clients? The same applies to this idea - and I think it would be a great collaborative effort of all these dudes in the suspension industry - as I'd be surprised if you interviewed them all separately and they even came close to a uniform explanation of how to analyze and use the telemetry data. This would all be in an effort to try to bring a standardized method for tuning.
I also think there are a couple ways to go about it.
It could be a removable external sensor that could detect the movement of a small component in the fork/shock. Like a tiny magnet. Data from this could possibly be interpreted by an app on your phone and translated into something understandable like "Increase LSC Damping", "Reduce Rebound Damping", "Increase sag", etc.
Maybe the telemetry equipment belongs to your local shop, so your not paying for the expensive equipment. It could be part of a purchase agreement, like many shops do with promising free bike tuneups for a year. This should keep the cost down and keep the suspension unencumbered.
This information could also be shared with the suspension manufacturers to get real data about how their products are performing under their target markets.
Such a challenge they face right now is having to make an educated guess about what tune will work best for the greatest number of people. Access to solid data on how their intended markets are using their products would be extremely valuable information, and would go a long ways towards producing true set-and-forget suspension for any style of bike, terrain, and rider. Suspension that behaves predictably and reliably with an appropriate range of usable adjustments.
Maybe a pipe dream... Maybe not. But I think this would spawn a lot of advancements and really benefit the end user.
All of them are just making experiments in the light&cheap department on the consumers cost, driven by the marketing guys.
I'm speechless.
At the end I got bored and tired and switched back to coils!
Personally I believe that most of us amateur mtb riders the important thing is to ride and enjoy it. Unfortunately during the last years we pay so much attention to all these "innovations" (wheel sizes, new standards etc) and instead of just enjoying our rides we get obsessed about all these "next best things" and instead of enjoying our current equipment we just feel bad because now they are "obsolete" by the new bike industry evolutions.
Anyway I suppose that's life. But honestly by the time I will realize that my riding is depending on a battery I will choose another sport.
I'd like to see the next improvements in the manufacturing of forks rather than the forks themselves, I find it depressing that in 2015 two tubes, a spring, and a couple of valves seemingly can't be made for less than £500.
"More control, less fatigue, the ability to travel through rough terrain at higher speeds – the advantages far outweighed the downsides"
You do realise the same arguments could made for putting engines in mountain bikes? Maybe we should be asking ourselves what mountain biking should be, instead of what the technology for it should be - one should drive the other but we have it backwards at moment.
i would say the future should be easier systems but this won't be in managers interest..... unfortunately...
It's easy to say active/electronic suspension is the future, Automotive engineers have been talking about it for many decades and doing it for a few less decades. But even after all these years and all the financial firepower of the automotive industry, it's still an expensive additional option that gives a good gain but for a lot of money. And that's without the fact that they often give an un-natural feel so aren't unanimously loved!
It would need not a small magnet.
But even small magnet is hevier than air.
And also they are brittle.
Well, who knows...this idea needs a development and experimentation and tests.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=JDQOvzFetxs
the other thing I (and five5shot, Pauiko and wbftw) mentioned is using magnets to control dampers, by putting ferrous (such as iron) particles in the fluid and surrounding it all with wire coils that produce a magnetic force when they have a current flowing through them. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnetorheological_damper
Both things are pretty cool technology!
@Pinkbike ! Time for a follow up interview to tug on this guys arm a little!!
This technology is a collaboration of your eyes, brain and body. Doesn't matter how good suspension gets, it will never be as good as the suspension in your arms and legs, and it will never be able to fully replace that.
The less suspension I ride on my bike, the more my arms and legs will compensate
be safe
have a fun
have a bike as simple as it can be (that can fix everything or make a service on my own)
For me, there is a limit how much ellectronic parts, and very high end parts the bike should have.
That's just my opinion and it works with me very well.
everyone just LOVES Craig's work and everything he does to make the guys suspension they did talk to work BETTER !!!!!!
plus his stuff is bombproof and there's no money in that
The average rider isn't going to service a set of forks after every other ride
MTB needs to become accessible to the masses. It never will with the way the prices are trending.
Need it to match / perform as good as my CCDBcs!
Like how tough is it to design a tube that has variable (decreasing) displacement through the travel and a slightly stronger negative (air) spring for zero breakaway at initial? Making a completely linear air shock isn't too hard with a bit of creativity.. Just imagine how many people would go nuts over that if so many are still crazy about today's shocks! PLEASE someone from one of these companies read this and don't quit the air shock dream
Besides, I think @WAKIdesigns can do something about this topic!
I guess it is kind of the same story as with electric power steer in cars: Manufacturers have tried to perfect them for decades by now, but still... a hydraulic system is the better performer. Electric may be more efficient, but when it comes to performance, it is no match.
I would also like to see more geometry adjustment in suspension. I have a 160-140 DPA Pike, and the dropped handlebar height is great for steep climbs, but I would love a shock adjustment that raises the BB for a steeper seat-tube angle more pedal clearance. What I would really love for climbing is a lever that drops the handlebars, raises the BB, and softens both ends with a single adjustment.
-Marzocchi pre 2009 reliability
-lefty stiffness and zero stiction
the next big thing in suspension designed dampers;
-easy set up with better trained staff when purchasing to assist
-tuning for bike size/discipline on all forks
-more reliability on design and higher quality control in china assembly lines
-spare parts more readily available
And my final say...why do manufactures make so many different dampers in their range? Rockshox for instance. Why not put the top end charger in ALL forks? Manufacturing costs? i don't think so. It takes some money to design the cheaper dampers not to mention the parts and time spent. Surely if they ran with a lone damper which was their best design then the costs for the manufacturer would reduce and sales go up.....Plus each and every rider would be happy knowing they have the best technology in their fork/shock.
I am happy with current damping technologies as we already have a vast range but the chassis do need a re think.
Focus on damping performance to make suspension work better. Not more features that are a compromise in all settings as well as price and weight.
Noah Sears (MRP) almost had what I would say. I do think he has a great point on rear suspension designs (let's hope for more systems like the new Commencal).
But I'd like to expand on a small statement of his; we need to re-evaluate what suspension does and how to improve that. What is our current damping technology not able to do? In the same way shim damped suspension replaced damper rods, shims will be replaced as well. Shims have been pushed in motocross (way more than in MTB) and they are at their limit. Without a new design that better controls the flow, we cannot advance. One minor advancement is the Dynamic Suspension Spool Valve (DSSV). Very popular in F1 due to more consistency than shims, but at a high cost. No big performance gain though, just consistency.
Above that, there is a patent pending damper valve being designed and tested in motocross from a small shop with extremely promising results. Once it is dialed in there, expect to see it make it's way to bikes. What I can say about it is that while electronic suspension can only react, it has to wait until you hit the bump to know what to do (if it is even that advanced), this technology knows beforehand.
Rebound; so often thought of as a minor thing. Check out WP's Trax shock. That is technology worth developing.
Carbon, and other fabric, stanchion and slider material uses.
Lastly, we need to minimize the amount of shock sizes. There are far too many eye-to-eye and stroke lengths. It's way more ridiculous than 2 axle sizes and 3 wheel sizes.
what other ways are there to control progression and spring rate for an air spring?
Air pressure is what determines preload (sag).
Progression should be dealt with separately. The only current technology is using a second air chamber separated by a piston and pumped up much higher pressure. Set so when the main chamber starts to progress, the chambers equalize and create a larger effective chamber. Reduces progression. Or 3 chambers.
Manipulating air volume is the only way to control ramp up in an air spring. Pressure scales to the inverse of volume (PV = nRT), there's no way around that. Unless you want to use the damper to ramp up resistance, like Manitou is doing on the Mattoc. But then that's not an air spring issue anymore, it's a damper issue.
Agree with you 100% on shock sizes though. Prices would probably drop like a rock if they could standardize those more.
When you have dual chambers, it would be far easier to set up a for right. First, pick the volume that correlates to the correct spring rate for your weight. Second, set the air pressure to give you the desired sag. Third set secondary air chamber to adjust amount of linearity in the fork. By making your fork more linear, you make more of the travel available without having to resort to extreme sag or low damping. And rebound doesn't have to work with such drastic spring force changes. Hence why coil sprung forks still work better.
Right now, if you are a light rider, you'd have to run extra volume spacers and have tons of ramp up meaning it will be harsher in te end travel and you may not be able to use the last 30% of travel. Not a good compromise. Rather, people use volume to adjust ramp and have to use pressure to juggle sag, dive and spring force. Not good. There's a reason coil springs are sold in different weights.
3 air chambers would be possible I the same way x-Fusion is doing their new shock chamber. Though I would stick to 2 as 3 would be more confusing than necessary.
Pretty wild how bikes have gotten so much better, but the trails being built lately are so smooth and easy. What's the deal?
I'm no engineer, but it has always been an idea of mine. Who knows.
LMFAO @ Fitz. "Typically, we would have to replace cables once a race as the elements would cause cable drag as water gets into the system" yeah cuz you know currently we don't possess technology to isolate a sliding cable from the elements but guess what, we do happen to have the ability to isolate a wire. :s f*ck some of you a*sholes are so stupid. The thing IDK is are you stupid for believing that load yourself, or just stupid enough to think we're stupid enough? Maybe some of us are. :s
That's kinda funny that he has the same name.
hackaday.io/event/5213-hackaday-prize-worldwide-new-york-city
MAKE SOMETHING FOR MY S-L-A-S-H!!!!!!!!!!!
(Manitou make Dorados in 29er size).