Just about two years ago Forbidden entered the mountain bike world with the
Druid, a 130mm trail bike that used a high single pivot suspension design, complete with an idler pulley.
Now it's time for the follow-up act. Meet the Dreadnought. If you're not familiar, a dreadnought is a class of battleship that emerged in the early 20th century. These ships had as many big guns and armor as possible, and were built for ocean domination. It's hard to come up with a bike name that hasn't been used, one of the reasons we often see companies just resorting to using travel numbers, but I'm a fan of this bike's name – it seems fitting for what it's designed to do.
Forbidden Dreadnought Details • Wheelsize: 29" or mixed via Ziggy link
• Travel: 154mm rear / 170mm front
• Carbon frame
• 63.5° head angle
• Chainstay length: 450mm (size L)
• Weight: 34 lb / 15.4kg (As shown, size L)
• Sizes: S - XL
• Price: $6,499 USD as shown.
Frame with EXT Storia: $4,049 / Frame with Push ElevenSix: $4,249 USD
•
forbiddenbike.com Moving from ships to mountain bikes, this Dreadnought has 29” wheels, 154mm of rear travel and a 170mm fork. For riders interested in going the mixed wheel size route, Forbidden offer the Ziggy link, a replacement lower link that's used to adapt the bike's geometry to a 27.5” rear wheel.
What's the Dreadnought for? Well, Forbidden have purposely refrained from putting it in any one category. It's a mountain bike, and if riders want to use it as a longer travel trail bike they can do that, just as easily as they could do an enduro race or hit up a bike park on it.
Frame Only... For NowAt the moment, you can only purchase the Dreadnought as a frame only, with either a Push Eleven Six or an EXT Storia coil shock. Color options are stealth or Deep Space 9, which is a glossy two tone black and blue. Those fancy shocks do bump the price up, and it'll cost $4,049 with the EXT shock, or $4,249 USD for the Push.
Eventually, you'll be able to get the frame with a Float X2 shock, which will put the price at $3,499 USD.
This bike shown here is the XT complete, which will be priced at $6,499 when it's available sometime in the second quarter of the year. An SLX complete will also be added later in the summer.
Frame DetailsThe frame shape closely resembles that of the Druid, but this one has been tested to standards usually reserved for DH bikes, and it's even dual crown compatible. There's chainslap protection on the seatstay, internal cable routing through the top tube, and room for a full size water bottle inside the front triangle.
There a cute little read fender, accessory mounting bolts under the top tube, and a bash guard / chain guide. Chain guides with lower guides aren't as common these days, but that's something of a necessity due to the idler pulley design – it help keep the chain wrapped around the chainring, and prevents it from bouncing off.
GeometryLet's take a quick run through of the key geometry numbers. There's a 63.5-degree head angle, a 484mm reach on a size large, and a 450mm rear center, also on a large. Forbidden changes the rear center length depending on the frame size in order to preserve the same level of balance for all rider heights. This is done with the shape of the front triangle - instead of using multiple swingarms, they're able to move the bottom bracket position to lengthen the front center.
There are a total of 4 sizes, from small to XL, which have reach numbers ranging from 440 to 506 millimeters, and a rear center length of 422 to 464mm. The effective seat tube angle measures 76-degrees across the board, and the
actual seat tube angle gets steeper on the larger sizes, to help make sure taller riders don't end up too far over the rear wheel.
Suspension DesignThe Dreadnought uses a high single pivot suspension design, which creates an axle path that's rearward throughout the entirety of the travel. According to Owen Pemberton, the bike's designer, that means the motion of the rear wheel closely mimics that of the fork. So instead of having the rear wheel go slightly backwards and then forwards, it moves back, away from whatever bump it's encountering. The leverage curve is progressive, with a fairly steep rate change at the end of the stroke that provides plenty of bottom-out resistance no matter if an air or coil shock is used.
Anti-squat sits around 115-120% at sag, and then drops off as it goes further into its travel. Those number were chosen to keep suspension calm during pedaling, even during out of the saddle efforts where a rider's weight shifts forward.
Ride ImpressionsHow's the Dreadnought ride? Well, it's not really a big, lumbering battleship like the name might imply. It feels big but not lazy, and it's easy to carry good speed through rough sections, with a nice ramp up at the end of the travel that makes harsh bottom outs nearly impossible. I've been running 32% sag, and Forbidden says it's possible to go all the way to 38% sag without adversely affecting the performance.
As slower speeds it feels pretty normal and neutral – it's at higher speeds in rougher terrain that it feels like something different. There's so much stability, and it you can really carve into turns without losing traction. Bikes with this suspension design tend to be a little less poppy, and that's the case here, but by running fairly quick rebound I've been able to reduce that trait, and even on manmade jump trails it's been a good time.
If I had more time I'd likely toss on a higher rise bar, and maybe hunt down a longer travel dropper post to get that seat all the way out of the way in the steeps, but that's really it. Unfortunately I need to send this bike back relatively soon, but we'll work on getting one in for a longer term review to really dig into its strengths and weaknesses.
"It was amazing and rode really well. I didn't have any problems with the idler, but because it's there, it could theoretically break, so I give this bike 1 donut out of 5." *gets into British engineered Mini that breaks down every 83.4 miles and drives away*
This is a seriously good looking bike, both to the eye and on the geo chart. It will be a winner.
Do you feel it was more to steepen the ST angle, or shorten the reach?
As I mentioned below, I would have been fine with a little steeper seat angle, but I was able to find a comfortable position on this bike without much issue. And there was still room to slide the seat even further forward if I wanted.
Jeeezus, humorless children
Try not to let all the downvotes get you so upset.
Forbidden's website "INTENDED USE: ENDURO / BIKEPARK"
Lol semantics aside this is a sweet looking bike!
As someone who switches between 458 chainstays (Sight VLT 29) and 435 chainstays (Ripmo AF) the difference is more noticeable than the 1deg head angle, or 10mm reach that differs between the two. I think 445 might be a good sweet spot, but more bikes need adjustable chainstays. Long for bike park season, short for winter trail rides.
As a guy who prefers a short rear center, currently riding a GG Shred Dogg with 423mm RC, I'd like to see the bike start a little shorter; maybe I could get downsize to a medium frame, but I'm probably sized for a large.
I'd really have to ride this bike to see if it'll work, so not a bike I'd buy blind.
It's a shame they tweaked the front triangle to adjust RC. If they'd gone with tweaking the rear triangle there'd be the option to run a shorter or longer rear triangle.
Side note: I would be curious to see if varying HA across sizes would help keep "similar" handling across a range. It would cater to more people if chainstays were adjustable.
This bike probably rides great at speed while straightlining gnarly stuff and running downhill jump lines, but yeah, probably a touch on the long side for all mountain riding. It ought to climb okay, so for enduro use it could be worthy.
I'm actually more interested in the Druid, still contemplating one, though long wheelbase on that bike is also something to consider.
But yikes, that frame only price is UP there.
Hopefully the new Norco Range (which is also rumored to be a high pivot) will be priced a better? Something that mere mortals can afford?
You're right, some of it is because of the fancy shocks. With the Fox shock its still seems to be above average, but not by as much. Probably in line with more boutique brands though (which admittedly I don't look at the carbon boutique brands very often, which is probably part of the reason behind my sticker shock).
Specialized Enduro is $2900 with a DPX2 (and until recently was $2700).
GG frames cost ~$2300 without a shock.
Norcos Sight C is $3050 with a Fox Float X2, and the Aluminum frame is $1650 with a RS Super Deluxe.
I'm hopeful that the Range will also be available in Alloy. I'd say its pretty even odds looking at Norcos other bikes (Sight is in both AL and Carbon, Optic is half carbon, Fluid and Shore are both alloy only). So fingers crossed I guess.
A Yeti SB130 is $4800 CAD with a DPX2 - I'm scared to look for a SB150 with an X2 - it would be over $5000 CAD for sure. An SB150 is $3900 USD.
I'd say Forbiddens aren't cheap, but they're cheaper than a lot of other high-end boutiquey brands...
If you're going after rock bottom prices without major compromise, nothing can stand against Marin's Alpine Trail Carbon for $2100 USD. You can get the aluminum full build (no frame only option) for $2500 with deore and a Yari; probably part it all out for $800 and you've got yourself an aluminum frame for even less.
Specialized sold their first gen stumpy evo for like $1700 frame only (aluminum), but they don't have an aluminum evo nor do they sell a frame only.
I actually have a druid build coming together for this season and couldn't be more stoked.
One thing I can't change about the build but I would like to is the idler and guide... was E13 the only company that could provide these parts? It would be extra cool to see Oneup, We Are One, or Raceface provide those parts. Keep it all Canadian.
It has 155% squat in the 16t gear. They should show the whole range. This harks back to my previous point about people possibly cherry picking curves. Also worth noting that there's no mention of what height of center of mass they chose when calculating those anti-squat curves. For all I know, the Actofive could have normal 120-130% anti-squat in the relevant pedalling gears.
I just checked Levy's review of the Actofive and he doesn't mention the amount of pedal bob, but he says things like "The German bike will move along nicely if you stay seated and spin circles rather than stomp out fires" and "When left fully open, the coil-sprung shock is never going to make for a bike that leaps forward when you get on the gas".
I wonder if a bike with ~170% anti-squat in the pedalling gears would have reverse pedal bob or reduced traction because of the suspension excessively firming up during the pedalling strokes. We should keep in touch! I'll send you a direct message.
Dread = Fear
Nought = Nothing
I just don't understand why cable entry points aren't angled out a bit more steeply, or put right at the front of the head tube so you don't have to cover the frame in protective film to stop cable rub. It's not like people are needing to shift and x-up at the same time...
Is it a conspiracy by Big FrameWrap?
I want one.
Is it harder to bunnyhop due to increasing chainstays lenght while suspension compression?
How heavy is the frame with shock?
www.pinkbike.com/news/review-deviate-highlander-there-can-only-be-one.html
www.vitalmtb.com/photos/features/PIT-BITS-Val-di-Sole-World-Cup-Downhill,11844/Brendan-Faircloughs-High-Idler-Prototype-Scott,123095/sspomer,2
Not saying it’s not an awesome frame - I’m sure it is. But sounds like a steep/fast park bike.
Just being optimistic
There's also the difference in chainstay lengths between the two bikes - 432mm on the Evil vs 450mm on the Dreadnought, which also affects where your weight will end up in relation to the rear axle.
Yeti SB150 29er: 347
Guerilla Gravity Gnarvana 29: 349
Trek Remedy 29: 349 (low) 354 (high)
Specialized S-Works Enduro 29: 354
A tad low by today's standards; folks will want to size crank length shorter for sure.
And with >30% sag as-tested I am surprised the author didn't mention pedal strikes.
I’m 1.75m and coming from a Geometron. The Large sizing seems right for myself, but the seat tube length is then too long.
Kazimer: "here is the definition of a dreadnought and pictures!"
J.Blunt
I know I'm ranting! Sorry, we are all feeling the impact of this.
I love the new YT 24" but that's such a joke. I don't think I've ever seen their site say they had anything in stock, even before 2020!
I hope you get your bike soon!
Yeah I guess there are more 29ers, but you still have loads of choices
I should have clarified that the frame price is too expensive-full build is on par/reasonable.
To your first comment-Having not ridden the Dreadnought makes ZERO difference. I've owned/ridden everything under the the sun-DW, Horst. High Pivot (Commencal Supreme SX) etc. and currently own a Revel Rail (CBF) suspension platform which is the best overall platform I've experienced thus far. They are all just bikes and ALL work very well and there isn't any FRAME that is worth $3,499-$4,249 unless it is an E-bike or spins gold. I don't care if it is a boutique brand-the FRAME price is too high.
It a beautiful frame and I'm sure it rides great, etc.but I'd never pay $1,000-$1,500 ish more for a frame just cuz.