The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly: Which Saddles Pinkbike's Editors Put on Their Own Bikes

May 5, 2023
by Matt Beer  
We review a lot of kit here at Pinkbike. In fact, sometimes it can feel like a constant merry-go-round of helmets, gloves, tires, or if we're extra lucky the latest bikes. It often transpires that we spend little time on the things we actually like most and more time trying to understand why things don't fit, work or feel as good as the manufacturer insists they should.

Pinkbike tech editors spend a lot of time on their ass. It's fair to say that most of our job requires sitting at a desk or pedalling a bike. Touch points on a bicycle are sensitive areas that can be as particular to the bike as they are to the individual riding them, but there’s no arguing that pedaling mountain bikes uphill has undoubtedly become more comfortable in recent years due to steeper seat angles and deeper research into ergonomic saddle designs.

Whether you’re an enduro newbie or a well-seasoned XC veteran, a few minutes in the saddle will let you know if your body agrees with the makeshift chair you’re sitting on.



Specialized Power Mirror
Specialized Pro Power Mirror


Specialized calls the 3D-printed liquid polymer Mirror Technology that features a "patent-pending matrix of 14,000 struts and 7,799 nodes." They also claim that this construction can't be achieved by using conventional. All I know is that it's so damn comfy.

I took a huge gamble when I first bolted this saddle to a bike the evening before a two-day backcountry adventure. Normally, I’d advise against such risky business, however, the profile, support, and soft padding were unworldly from the get-go. After riding over 100kms of singletrack with a loaded-down pack and no chamois, I was sold.


Matt Beer
Position: Tech Editor, paragraph texter
Chamois: No
Preferred saddle features: Rounded edges, short nose
Chosen saddle: Specialized Pro Power Mirror
Price: $325 USD
Whatever tech buzz words Specialized uses, the fact is that the technology works. It's so cushioned that it's almost like a waterbed in a way, where the top layer moves almost independently at a particular point. Underneath, there’s a carbon base made from repurposed carbon scraps that is plenty flexible and the titanium rails keep the weight down to 245g in the 143mm width that I prefer.

I love the flattish top that supports my sit bones and rounded edges that don’t cut into the sides of my legs as I pedal along. The nose is also fairly short, which avoids poking into my quad when I’m moving about the bike on descents. The only downside is that the honeycomb structure can cake up with thick mud.

Nukeproof Giga 297
Nukeproof Giga 297

As for the position, I tend to run the saddle near the forward limits on most bikes so my sit bones land on the widest, most cushioned area. I’ll also tilt the saddle so the nose is flat and the scooped rear half of the saddle is just below a negative rise.

The Power Pro Mirror simply works for me. I’m sure there will be comments made about the $325 USD MSRP, but you can’t put a price on comfort.

Nukeproof Giga 297



photo
WTB Silverado


Compared to Matt's choice, the Silverado comes across as pretty low-tech, with no struts or nodes in sight. It's a time-tested staple of WTB's lineup, but you'll notice that this one featured in the photos here looks a bit different from the currently available version. The team at WTB have been working on an update to this classic that should be available quite soon, and I'm already a fan. The currently available Silverado is also a favorite, and would have been my choice if my butt hadn't been graced with the smooth comfort of this updated model.


Dario DiGiulio
Position: Tech Editor, pizza lover
Chamois: Never Ever
Preferred saddle features: Flat top, Center channel
Chosen saddle: WTB Silverado
Price: $48-250 USD, depending on rail material
Since last June, I have spent thousands of miles perched atop this little guy, so suffice to say I'm convinced this is the one for me. The ultimate selling point was comfortably riding the entire Colorado Trail on the Silverado, which amounted to 11 full days of pedaling, with a backpack and no chamois. Since then, it's been on a variety of bikes, with no problem suiting each one's unique geometry and use case.

In WTB's ever-growing saddle lineup, the Silverado comes across as something of a Goldilocks, with a seemingly ubiquitous place on many brands' spec sheets. This is likely due to the neutral shape and padding, with neither erring too extreme in any direction. If you're someone who wants the cushiest saddle around, this might not be the one, but I'm of the opinion that shape beats squish in delivering ultimate comfort.

The updates to the Silverado seem to revolve around the construction, with some subtle tweaks to the shape. The microfiber cover is now one continuous piece, removing the side fabric area that would consistently wear down on my older models. With a slightly shorter nose and flatter top, the new saddle is even better suited to modern bikes, where steeper seat tube angles require less of a road-like long nosed shape. The flat top and sloping tail make the Silverado very cozy on long climbs, and there's still enough of a nose for sustained flat pedaling.

photo
photo

As you can see, I tend to angle my saddle down pretty aggressively, with a rough rule of thumb of setting it so that the nose points at the stem. This usually means 5-6° down from flat, but with sag and a steep climb, things feel flat and comfortable. The Silverado has a very long clamp area on the rails, so I'm not quite at the extreme-forward mark, but on most saddle I'm right up to the rear bend in the rails.

The WTB Silverado stands as my high water mark, with nothing else I've tried matching its long-term comfort. With a few different pricing levels and multiple fit options, there should be a variant to suit just about anyone.

photo




Transition Spur Kazimer
Specialized Power Pro Elaston with Mimic


Specialized's Power Pro saddle has moved to the top of my list of favorites, and this particular one has been on my personal bike for the last two seasons. It's the shape that does it for me – it's fairly short in length, with enough width at the back to alleviate any pressure points. It's still narrow enough to stay out of the way on the descents, and there aren't any sharp edges – one of my pet peeves is when the back of a saddle has an uncovered hard plastic part that's just waiting to jab into a sensitive area.
Mike Kazimer
Position: Managing Tech Editor, bagel fiend
Chamois: No
Preferred saddle features: Shorter length, no sharp edges at the back
Chosen saddle: Specialized Pro Elaston with Mimic
Price: $206 USD

The model I've been riding has titanium rails, a carbon fiber shell, and Specialized's soft Mimic foam at the front. The cellulite look at the rear of the saddle is caused by the small beads that are expanded into the foam – Specialized says this is to improve comfort and support on long rides, and based on all the time I've spent on this saddle so far I'd have to agree.

I tend to run my saddles fairly level, or tipped a degree or two downward, but nothing too extreme. The position in the seatpost clamp depends on the bike's seat tube angle; it'll be right in the middle if the seat angle is steep enough for my liking, or slid forward to steepen things up a bit if not.

Like any contact points, saddles are a matter of personal preference, but the profile of the Power saddle does seem to work for lots of riders, and even the less-expensive models are still great options for anyone looking to upgrade from an uncomfortable stock seat.

photo




photo

I've never been too fanatic about things like saddles, even though a saddle is one of the few contact points between a rider and their bike. However, I've spent enough time on the SQ Lab 611 saddle that I need to credit that one as my favorite.

The 611 came into my life a good six or seven years ago, when I was dating someone who worked at a bike shop and adopted many of the warranty rejects. It's not exactly a great thing for this saddle that many of them were bent badly enough to be warrantied, but that was good for me, as my ex and I both ended up with several, and the apparent bendability of the rails meant we could force them back into shape. I put them on all my bikes and swapped them out before selling the bikes.

Alicia Leggett
Position: No idea, to be honest. News writer of some sort. Kind of techy sometimes. Not currently working.
Chamois: Yes
Preferred saddle features: Doesn't angle the rider too far forward or backward
Chosen saddle: SQ Lab 611 Ergowave
Price: $153.89 USD / 139.95 Euro
photo
photo

I appreciate when a saddle makes the rider feel nicely centered over the bike, and this one fits that bill. I run it flat, and the back of the saddle supports my sit bones, so essentially no weight sits anywhere else.

I've talked to several other people over the years who love this saddle, too, so it definitely isn't just me (see Nikki Rohan's test back in 2020). I'm pretty convinced SQ Lab cracked the code on this one, making a saddle that works for a wide range of riders. The saddle is available in four different widths, too, so it seems to be available to suit a wide range of riders.

All in all, SQ Lab as a company strikes me as 'the right amount of nerdy,' which I bet a lot of us here can relate to... just another reason the company has earned its place in my heart and on my bike.




photo
Specialized Power

I've tried a lot of saddles over the years and I keep coming back to the Specialized Power. It's got a wide channel which puts all your weight on the sit bones, where it should be. The nose is super short and you sit a little further forward than other saddles. Back in the day, this was a great feature because it effectively gave you slightly steeper seat angle. Now that seat tubes are pushing 80-degrees in many cases this is not always necessary, but I find it a comfortable saddle anyway.
Seb Stott
Position: Tech Editor, porridge connoisseur
Chamois: Always
Preferred saddle features: Wide pressure-relief channel
Chosen saddle: Specialized Power (any model)
Price: From £80

By comfortable, I don't mean it's soft and plush - in fact, it's quite firm - but it keeps your weight off the soft and delicate parts and gives plenty of support for putting down the Watts on steep climbs. Even the narrower version is pretty wide, so it's best paired with a long dropper post to keep it well out of the way. I've tried several versions and I can't say which is comfiest, so I'd recommend whichever suits your budget.

photo
photo
Ergon SM Enduro

Having said that, I'm not wedded to the Power and still like to try out different perches. Recently I've got on similarly well with the Ergon SM Enduro Comp. Anything with a fairly flat hull and a deep, wide channel can work for me.



photo
Syncros Tofino

At times I can be needlessly picky but with saddles, I honestly am not invested whatsoever. I don't wear a chamois, and I find very little difference between models. There might be one or two bad-eggs, but I normally just ride whatever is cheap, on a bike or in the parts bin and not broken. In the past little while, I've had this Syncros Tofino saddle on a Bold test bike and, at the very least, it's relatively light and looks nice - which is enough for me.
Henry Quinney
Position: Tech Editor, kettle supervisor
Chamois: Only if it's really really wet
Preferred saddle features: Not looking horrible
Chosen saddle: Syncros Tofino R 2.0
Price: $149.99 (which seems like quite a lot)




Author Info:
mattbeer avatar

Member since Mar 16, 2001
348 articles

282 Comments
  • 277 1
 Would be an interesting poll: chamois vs. no chamois

Personally, have never thought about riding without a chamois on a ride over 5 miles.
  • 24 0
 I'm with ya there. It does make a comfort difference for longer cycles
  • 130 0
 Taints of steel at Pinkbike.....
  • 80 3
 I did a 9 hour ride with a cham 3 years ago and swamp ass is an understatement. Stoped using one and never looked back. Rode 24 hours straight 2 years ago with no chamois, iron taint for the win
  • 57 1
 @emery033, we did one a few years ago: www.pinkbike.com/news/pinkbike-poll-do-you-wear-a-chamois-while-mountain-biking.html. It might be interesting to do it again and see if anything has changed.
  • 11 0
 Depends on the saddle. When I had a good saddle, I went for a 68 mile race without chamois and din’t feel a thing. My new saddle I can go 2 miles and it hurts. It’s even a body geometrey which I’ve had good luck in the past, but this one is not my cup of tea apparently.
  • 26 11
 The chamois is a scammy. I ditched it and will never go back, just a nice wicking athletic seamless boxer brief. Also, no more saddle sores now!
  • 14 3
 @mikekazimer: I can't even ride my Peloton without a chamois!
  • 5 4
 @skiandmtbdirtbag: I guess spend the money on a good saddle on save on chamois.... not a bad plan.
  • 23 0
 @porkchopsandwich: it would be a taintalizing poll if it gets brought back
  • 17 30
flag MuskratMatt (May 5, 2023 at 11:58) (Below Threshold)
 A chamois is just a bacterial sponge
  • 4 1
 @lehott: I haven't tested this, but I think it would be really interesting to try. I ride with my kids for an hour or so without chamois and I'm fine. Also I don't wear one on a spin bike nor when commuting. But I still feel I 'need' to wear a chamois when "mountain biking".
  • 6 1
 My past four 15mi+ rides have been chamois-less and I’m so surprised that I’ve been sore free. I think that a majority comes down to saddles, bike fit to ensure you’re in the right position and quality underwear.

I’m legit thinking about doing my next Bikepacking trip without a chamois. Especially considering my stint on the CT was more hiking than biking uphill anyways.
  • 9 1
 I can't think of any benefit for ditching the chamois other than saving money and based on the prices of some of these saddles money doesn't appear to be much of an issue for some.
  • 13 1
 SHOCKED! Is riding with a WET CHAMOIS really a thing? @Henry do you soak it beforehand? Have you ever tried soaking it in tea? Red bull? Maybe if you soak it in tire sealant you could squeeze some out and into a tire if you get (in) a pinch?
  • 3 0
 @skiandmtbdirtbag: same here. I've been riding for ten years without one, actually never owned one. My longest day in the saddle was 10.25hrs just two weeks ago and I was totally fine. The saddle was a cheap Ergon something i got used of german Buy and Sell. Seems like I am pretty lucky here, since I've never been sore after any ride really.
  • 23 3
 Dry asses are happy asses. Sweat diapers just hold in what needs to be let out.
  • 11 4
 One question for the all the Chamois people :

Where do your cocknballs go?

Recently purchased a reputable brands chamois, I was professionally measured, then ordered online to save some money (big mistake), and have never been in more discomfort in my life. Felt like my urethra was being crushed in a vice. I checked the labels multiple times not understanding how this was a "Mens" product. There's 0 conceivable place for one to store their tackle.

This was an expensive $100+ 5 minute test since you can't return the things after they are worn to most shops.
  • 4 0
 I recently switched to no chamois and worked my way up in milage. I also switched my saddle and found one that worked MUCH better for me. Between the two, I have zero swamp ass which eliminates the nasty saddle sores, and pressure points on long rides are nearly non-existent because of the saddle shape and size. I wear wool boxer briefs in place of the chamois - they do well with moisture and don't stink. I tested synthetic boxer briefs that I use for backpacking and did not like them as much as the merino wool. My longest ride to date is 43 miles without chamois.
  • 5 1
 @Cheddar420: Mine tend to always be in the same place, depending on weather and all. Although I get what you're saying, as I do sometimes have to adjust when a ball gets smashed between my thigh and the saddle.
  • 7 0
 I never could get along with feeling like I was wearing a diaper. Found the Bontrager Sport saddle (yes the cheap one) years ago, and have been riding it on all my bikes ever since.
  • 12 0
 @Cheddar420: check out bn3th North Shore liners. They literally have a pouch that lets all the important bits go wherever they want.
  • 4 1
 Never chamois
  • 11 0
 What type of underwear are you chamois-less people wearing? Any time I've been riding without a chamois I find my boxer shorts bunch up very uncomfortably. To be fair I haven't found a chamois yet that is that comfortable, but they are usually less uncomfortable than bunched up boxer shorts.

I also am yet to find a saddle that is comfortable for more than an hour so all my riding is just trying to find the least uncomfortable set-up.
  • 1 0
 @mikekazimer: I'm kinda bummed that poll didn't have an option for "never tried, but considering it".
Also side note: doing plenty of 6-12 mile rides has only made me struggle to pick between trying chamois and a different saddle; that debate seems like a good potential article.
  • 54 0
 @Cheddar420: hey if anyone tells you they are "professionally measuring" you for chamois you should probably run, cause that's definitely not a thing.
  • 1 0
 @Cheddar420: some brands are terrible for this, I have a TLD one that is basically very slow castrator...

I bought another set of cheap Endura chamois, they come in 2 packs for around €30 and have a very minimal cushion. Very comfortable and discrete.
  • 3 0
 @andeh23: that's silly, adding a pouch to boxers just to go around the fact that slips are not fashionable...

Not to mention $85 for it? those things are made for pennies and sell in aliexpress for a fiver

But seriously, try slips.
  • 9 0
 @salespunk: Ive found stationary bikes make a bad saddle fit more pronounced. I thought I had a saddle I liked and when covid hit I put that bike on a fluid trainer, I couldnt pedal for more then 10 minutes in that setup. Turns out when actually out riding around you rock and tilt which alleviates pressure points but once the bike stops moving it highlights them.
  • 7 1
 @Cheddar420: tuck them between the buns
  • 12 1
 @MuskratMatt: you know you can wash them. . .right?
  • 7 2
 I tried going without. I have several nice pairs of boxers that felt like they worked great. After just a few rides, I had saddle sores. Back to a chamois, no more sores. I ride roughly 1000 hours a year, Strava shows me at over 100,000 miles. So I don't think it is just an issue of riding more. I also have two of the saddles listed above, and really like them, so that's not the issue either.
  • 6 0
 @Cheddar420: ever seen Ace Ventura? Yeah, don't do it that way.
Also, BN3TH has the pocket option - it's a good introduction to a chamois for the uninitiated
  • 1 0
 @porkchopsandwich: although the mimic on kazimer's bike is supposed to imitate the soft, sensitive, fleshy bits below down yonder
  • 7 0
 @JSTootell: After 100,000 miles of riding you should have calluses on butt/taint.
  • 1 6
flag Aburjakowsky (May 5, 2023 at 14:05) (Below Threshold)
 No Chamois #Beaman probably on the wrong saddle or not adjusted right on the angle. Plus you have more control on the steeps not wearing one
  • 3 0
 I never use a chamois. too much movement, it's like gettting a 90s gel seat. I had some low-end ones with barely any padding which weren't bad, but mainly cause it packed everything in.
  • 2 0
 WTB Pure distance saddle works for me, has right amount padding for 2 to 3 hour rides. I sometime wear chamois but always feel like I sh_t my pants walking around in them.
  • 1 0
 @skiandmtbdirtbag: iron rusts so quickly- swamp butt would be a problem
  • 3 0
 @jefe: this guy gets it. Recently started riding chamois free and I ain’t going back.
  • 1 0
 Been riding chamois all my life till realize now it only makes sweating my as...s which I hate... Totaly outdated with proper seats ans seamless wicking boxers... Any brand recommendation?
  • 2 0
 @gschwell: do you have a recommendation for a truly seamless one?
  • 3 0
 I stopped using a chamois a few years ago after getting a bad case of swamp ass during a biking trip in a hot and humid climate. I also realized that the chamois in the bike shorts covered about half of the area where my sit bones contacted the my saddle. The best thing I discovered is that good fitting cotton undies with a bit of Lycra content are the best for cycling. If your saddle actually fits properly you don’t need a chamois.
  • 4 0
 @tbubier: Depends on how she was measuring and her qualifications.
  • 13 0
 What do a cheap castle and a chamois have in common?

No ballroom…
  • 1 0
 @MuskratMatt: I can't tell if thats a dis or a compliment coming from a Muskrat....
  • 3 0
 @MuskratMatt: have your Mom do a load of laundry for you,champ
  • 5 0
 @tbubier: effing hilarious!! I'm crying. I thought the same thing. What "tool" did they use for the measurements?? LMFAO
  • 4 0
 @sweatyseagull: I cut the chamois out of the liner shorts that come with mtb shorts, turns them into a really nice pairtof riding underwear that don't ride up
  • 1 0
 For the upright position on mtb’s I don’t think they are necessary. I always wear one on the more on my gravel bike where the bars are well below the saddle.
  • 2 0
 Anyone chamois hating has never ridden in Asos. Such a bad life choice. Cant afford more shorts, cant ever go back. Down to my last 2.
  • 4 0
 @Cheddar420: Where do you find someone to professionally measure cocknballs?
  • 5 0
 @Super7: any good bike fitter…
  • 2 1
 Probably depends on how much time you spend sitting. XC: I really want a good chamois. DH: don't really care.
  • 4 0
 I haven't used an adult diaper on a bike in years whether it's a 2hr or 12hr ride. The key is finding a saddle or two that fits your butt. I'm a lot more comfortable now than I ever was in my chamois decade+.
  • 1 0
 @porkchopsandwich: I was thinking the same thing!!! Lol
  • 1 0
 @tbubier: sounds like he got a dose of karma ordering online afterwards lol
  • 2 0
 I agree. A chamois makes a lot of difference for me on long rides. But I also hate most chamois. I use the B3nth North Shore Chamois and it is the best of both worlds. Freedom for the front and a little protection for the undercarriage. Not trying to be graphic but they really are game changing for me.
  • 1 0
 @tbubier: to paraphrase a friends episode, “that’s how they measure for chamois… in prison!”
  • 6 0
 @sweatyseagull: I wear wool boxer briefs and they are super comfy. As for saddle comfort make sure you have the proper width saddle. I used to ride whatever saddle came with the bike, then after bending my rails, a friend loaned me a narrow saddle and it literally changed everything to do with comfort. A good way to measure your butt bones is to sit on a couple of layers of cardboard and measure center to center of your butt bone imprint. Use that measurement wen selecting a saddle.
  • 1 0
 Same here. I tried without a few years back but it was not comfortable at all for me. But I’ve heard it said that you can ride a padded seat or padded shorts. Pick your poison. I don’t care for a super thick chamois though. And the padded shorts we wore 20 years ago aren’t nerely as nice as what we have now. Bonded seams and elastic chamois is where it’s at.

I run the SQLab 611 ergo wave on the hardtail and squishy bikes. My first ride this year was good. Usually the next ride is a bit painful but not bad this season. Before the SQLab seats it would take four or five rides to harden up the arse but not this season. I’m impressed.
  • 3 0
 @MOBrules: saddle width is super important. Most decent bike shops should have a pressure sensitive pad to measure your sit bones. But I really like your DIY cardboard idea.
  • 3 0
 @PauRexs: I buy the Fruit of the Loom “breathable” boxer briefs on Amazon. They are cheap and dry fast. Switched to no Chamois about 4 years ago and don’t regret it.
  • 1 0
 Was a full-time chamois believer then started riding without, I don't think I'll go back now.
  • 3 0
 @sweatyseagull: b3neath synthetic underwear. Pouch for the furniture.
  • 2 0
 @MuskratMatt: you can wash them
  • 2 0
 @MuskratMatt: that’s why you wash it after every ride.
  • 2 0
 @Cheddar420:

You duct tape it to your inner thigh
  • 1 0
 @mikekazimer: There was an article by a bike saddle (road/tri) designer who said as saddles get better padded, then chamois padding becomes less and vice versa. Its an industry see-saw.
  • 1 0
 I need my big balls up and out of the way before I send. Suspenders for the ultimate support.
  • 4 0
 I got out of wearing the chamois for bikepacking as we were doing weeklong trips of 150km or so a day and the added friction, moisture contact etc. was a nightmare. To transition I found saddles that fit better and built back some tolerance and have been free for about four years. This includes daily commutes (10 km and 600m elevation), 2-3 mountain bike rides a week during biking season and number of big bikepacking trips a year. For saddles I'm mainly on an SQ Lab on my mtb and a Brooks B17 on the bikepacking. Zero issues. I think most mountain bike rides are short enough it just doesn't matter though- chamois, boxers, briefs, commando... you'll probably survive and if it works for you do it. Didn't work for me (after years of it working for me) so I stopped doing it. All bodies and preferences are different.
  • 1 0
 @andeh23: Comfy for short rides but wouldn't reccomend on wet or hot sweaty days. Things not being secured has led to some pretty rough chafing during the above mentioned scenarios.
  • 2 0
 @sweatyseagull: Try Step One underwear. I had issues with bunching but found these to be excellent at avoiding that. A bit pricey but have been well worth it, ended up changing out all my existing stuff for them.
  • 3 0
 @Cheddar420: Here's what yu need: bn3th www.bn3th.com they have the room/pocket to keep your "mens parts" comfy! The padding is 2nd to none!
  • 1 0
 @barrysbikes: I have had the same experience with Bn3th. North shore chamois is minimalist but great quality, washes well and is so comfortable. No squishing up front and some protection behind with the padding. Best of all worlds
  • 2 0
 @iiman: As a European guy, just to get this straight…
Is a 'boxer' the loose fitting, coton underwear type? And are people in the USA still actually wearing those?
Here most men wear the tight(er) variant, with some stretch to the fabric, and some wear slips. They are not considered very sexy/fashionable I think, but I find those the most comfortable, so I wear those.

The ones I wear while riding are a from a slightly different fabric, that dry quicker and stretch more, so better suited as a first layer for sports. I ditched chamois a few years ago, never liked the diaper feeling.
  • 1 0
 @Super7: doublecrownaddict...
  • 1 0
 @WhateverBikes: Boxer briefs are what people are wearing. And yeah, cotton with Lycra is the way to diaperless riding.
  • 2 0
 @Cheddar420: Try this one. Their "pouch technology" is the real deal. Say goodbye to having smashed junk. It breathes a lot better also...

www.bn3th.com/products/north-shore-bike-liner-short-black?variant=31939076915318
  • 1 0
 @MOBrules: Doesn't your saddle need to be slightly wider than your "sit bones"?
  • 1 0
 I've been riding with chamois for the last 6 or 7 years, and after reading all the opinions here I gave it a try yesterday without it... Didn't feel nearly as sore as I expected for a 1,5 hours ride, and for some reason pedaling felt more "efficient" in some way.

I'm using a SDG BelAir V3 saddle.

To avoid my boxers bunching up, I put some anti-sliding thing that comes in a ketchup-like bottle I bought off Amazon (it's supposed to be used on the sole of kid's socks to avoid them slipping)

I'll keep trying it for the next rides and see how the behind feels...
  • 1 0
 My theory is this: Average American/Euro pale dudes with barely any hair on their bodies can run no chamois. Latino etc with um....plenty of hair....gotta run a chamois. I'm from Colombia and have tried no chamois/no chamois butter etc. Just not happening.
  • 3 0
 @WhiteroomGuardian: Don't tell this pale dude about being hairless..
  • 2 0
 @WhiteroomGuardian: Brillo butt eh?
  • 1 0
 Ever since I tried the "Trail Boxer Brief" from Zoic I have been Chamois-less on every ride. I'm sure there are other options out there that are similar to the Zoic ones I use. Basically a comfortable, seamless boxer brief that is tight fitting and supportive.
I still use chamois butter but I will not be going back to a chamois... ever.
  • 1 0
 @gschwell: AGREED!!!! I would’ve never thought of riding 50+ miles without a chamois and truth be told it feels so much better to ride 50+ miles without it.
  • 2 0
 I promise you, if you can learn to ride without a chamois it will change your world! Sometimes I still think I need a chamois for the long ride and then I put one on all I can think of is “I hate this!”. It takes a little while to get used to it but you’ll never go back to wearing one but it’s definitely a personal preference.
  • 27 0
 Interesting how almost all of the saddles are slammed all the forwand in the pictures. Are we going to see even steepper seat tube angles?
  • 13 0
 I think we need steeper seat tubes. That would fix it
  • 12 1
 people have given me shit for having my saddle far forward. isn't that the point of the rails to begin with?
  • 20 4
 as an XC rider, I cannot seem to get mine far enough back...we need offset dropper posts....figure it out engineers
  • 7 7
 @SATN-XC: That’s really interesting. I race and ride XC but my riding style must be more aggressive. Why do you put your saddle so far back? I don’t see that much of an advantage especially because then you need to get more weight over the front wheel so you don’t loop out.
  • 16 4
 Interesting observation. Had to go back and check it out. Indicates to me that the bike frame is too big / too long a reach.
  • 3 1
 @TyBronder: In my sample size of, me, the reach of the bike really dictates how far forward or back I can run the saddle. My longer reach bikes like the Pole Evolink (485 reach) and the Enduro (495 reach) I could slam the saddle all the way forward no problem. Now with my Ripley (475 reach) much more than half way forward on the rails and my hands go numb. Maybe seat tube angle also plays a part in that? Probably does.
  • 14 0
 Or have we reached the limit of LLS (long low slack) and as a result are we riding bikes that are too big
  • 6 0
 @TyBronder: could just be a body type thing, not sure. I'm a little over 6' with long legs. Most of the taller guys I ride with use an offset post or would prefer one. I ended up removing the dropper from my Oiz and now I run a rigid offset Thomson post.
  • 1 0
 @SATN-XC: me too, long legs I guess. The saddle position on my enduro bike is pretty standard, but my saddle is fully rearward on the rails on my hardtail and I could still go back further to find a better seated pedaling position. An offset clamp dropper post would be ideal.
  • 5 2
 They're probably all too short for their reach.
  • 10 1
 @nickfranko, probably not. Seb's like 10 feet tall.

I'd say all the bikes we ride fit well when going downhill, but sometimes it's necessary to slide the seat forward to create a more upright and comfortable riding position if the seat angle isn't steep enough to match our preferences. Seats have rails for a reason - that's how you dial in the fit for pedaling.
  • 2 0
 Saddle on my enduro bike is all the way forward. It is my absolute favorite bike and fits me perfect. My XC bike is slid all the way back. But I sized the frame down.
  • 1 0
 @SATN-XC: specialized command post
ircc is an offset dropper I’ve got two of ‘‘em on two different bikes and they’ve been pretty solid for a couple years now.
  • 4 0
 @SATN-XC: I believe 9.8 makes offset dropper posts
  • 1 0
 @mikekazimer: Hey Mike, do you not find that some seat rails are TOO short to move forward? Following the recommendation on the seat rail markings, I find that I tend to max out to the line on the rail. True, that maybe my bike's seat tube angle is not steep enough ('18 Rocky Instinct w/ STA 74.5 deg), but it's also a function of how much I'm allowed to push that seat forward.

Overall, I don't mind moving myself forward, temporarily, on steeper climbs. Moderate ones, seat position, in seatpost clamp, works well for me. Would like to have more option to move it forward, if I want, that's all. Seems like most manufacturers have limited horizontal adjustment, maybe??
  • 2 3
 @cdnmtbkr: you can 100% ignore the max lines on most saddles. Never had an issue using the very end of a rail.
  • 2 0
 @mikekazimer: Now there's an opportunity for someone to create a dropper that automatically adjusts the angle and fore-aft position as well.
  • 6 0
 @plustiresaintdead: it doesn't work like that if you have some weight on you.i watched a guy destroy 3 saddles in 3 rides slamming the rails after someone suggested he maxed out the rails. I have personally killed plenty of rails at a maxed out position, yet never when I had the clamp in the marked area.

100% is not accurate.
  • 1 0
 @Jacquers: they already do
  • 1 0
 @SATN-XC: I'm pretty sure more than half of existing droppers are offset.
  • 1 0
 @RonSauce: fair enough!
  • 4 0
 I just need a frame that has the 480 reach of a large but the ETT length of a medium. I have to slam the saddle all the way forward on my bikes because the seat tube angle isnt steep enough for the reach I like, even then I still inch forward on the saddle while pedaling. A medium feels much better when pedaling but a large feels much better when standing, so I go with a large.
  • 2 0
 I had to do this once because it was the wrong size bike for me, with Reach and TT15mm too long. The only way to compensate it, was to run the shortest stem possible and slam the saddle Frwd all the way. The bike was fun on flatter flow trails with smaller jumps but steeper DH's with multiple chunky lines and quick cornering were sketchy AF.
  • 1 0
 @grnmachine02: That makes sense. Ive always rode xc bikes so I dont have much say for longer reach bikes. Im hoping to try a Yeti sb150 and has quiet a bit more reach than my current pivot mach 4. Your hand numbing problem is really interesting as well. I had that issue last race season but thought that it was just I wasn’t used to aluminum bars and harsher grips. When I replaced the bars with carbon the problem went away but the drop was a bit more and I got a longer stem and that seemed to help. Ive always ridden with a seat slammed forwand just because I like a more upright feel but I’m going top experiment a bit more now, thanks!
  • 1 0
 @SATN-XC: Thats probably true. I do generally ride a size larger because I don’t like to feel as cramped and I like to feel more stable at high speeds. It might also have to do with the type of trails I ride. I don’t know what your terrain is like but here in Wyoming and on front range in Colorado, the climbs are quiet steep and I find myself sitting on the very front of my saddle with 15+ percent grades. Body type also definetly plays a part. I’m 5’8” with a shot torso and long legs and long arms so this plays into needing abigger frame for my legs so the forward seat allows for the reach to feel more comfortable. I also prefer an upright position because being too bent over hurts my back and neck. I rode a medium supercaliber last season which is what I should ride but this season I went with a Pivot Mach 4sl because of it being a little bit longer reach, wheel base, and travel.
  • 2 0
 @SATN-XC: I have the same issue, and I dont want to use a longer frame or stem but my saddle is slammed back on my xc rig. I'm on a rigid post though which helps a bit, but if someone made a decent offset dropper I'd be consider it.
I do have the saddle all the way forward though on my trail bike which has the same effective reach (more or less)
  • 1 0
 I figured it was just too large of bike for the test rider
  • 1 0
 @plustiresaintdead: I’ve bent many a seat rail from running my saddle to far back; granted, this was many years ago
  • 1 0
 @TyBronder: I also prefer a more upright position, so I ended up getting some pretty high rise bars to get that back after moving the saddle rearward. The hand numbing thing had me confused for a long time. I thought by being more upright I’d have less pressure on my hands. Turns out, it’s the opposite. Good luck! Hopefully it helps.
  • 2 0
 @SATN-XC: 9point8 has had an offset dropper for years
  • 1 0
 Trying to get at least over the bottom bracket instead of behind it
  • 1 0
 @jlok: can’t do that without lengthening CS on most bikes
  • 1 0
 @cdnmtbkr: there was a very short lived trend of ‘29er’ specific saddles that pushed riders forward and had straight rear rails. Fizik Thar for example - absolutely worth trying to find one if you run your seat high.
  • 1 0
 @SATN-XC: 9Point8 droppers have forward and rearward offset heads available.
  • 19 0
 I'm pretty elated to see the SQ Lab 611 Ergowave saddle here. I've been using one for a few years now, and it's on all my bikes at this point. I happened upon it pretty randomly, but it was love at first sit.
  • 2 0
 same here!
  • 1 0
 I loved my 612 ergowave, but now love the "active" version even more...that little bit of give really makes a difference!
  • 1 0
 Fan of SQLab saddles here. Once you try, never go back again with another brand
  • 1 0
 So happy about your feedback, appreciated a lot.
It's all about finding the right fit,
by measuring sit bone distance, then choosing the right saddle width and saddle model.
If you want to have a lough, see our latest vid, teasing this topic:
www.youtube.com/watch?v=nquh2lM75X8&t=10s
  • 1 0
 I ordered a 611 that I saw on sale on a whim without measuring. Got lucky and it was the right size when I later measured. It's my favorite saddle right now on my XC/gravel bike. I need to try it on my trail bike that has an Ergon currently. I also picked up a 612 active recently but didn't find it as comfortable on my trainer, but most saddles seem to be uncomfortable on the trainer. I definitely want to see how it feels out on a real ride.
  • 13 0
 Interesting how dominant the S Power is... for MTB. I love the saddle on my road bike, but its stated design is to keep you in a static, aero position, typically for flatter segments. Longer-nosed saddles like the Romin Mirror give you more range to perch yourself on changing pitches.

You also find long noses on pretty much all OEM builds. Are you all not shifting forward, or just standing on the steepest climbs? Are the manufacturers getting it wrong?
  • 10 0
 I definitely shift my weight forward on climbs, but I also think that steeper seat angles have made the dramatic weight shifts less necessary - you don't need to get as far forward to maintain traction. Even on the Power saddle I've never found the shorter length to be restrictive while climbing.
  • 2 1
 I ride the Specialized Power on my XC bike and WTB Silverado on my big bikes. I find the Power saddle has some sharp edges when descending and I need more room to move fore and aft on Enduro bikes.
  • 2 0
 I don't miss the free prostate exam from scooching forward on my saddle when climbing on my old geo bike. Current STA is 76 degrees, and it so much easier to climb with; however, I would be curious to try even steeper.
  • 5 0
 There are times I feel like I am the only person who doesn't like the Specialized Power Saddle. The foam and the construction is fine, and I've tried to use them before, but all of them are way too wide for me. 143mm is too big to be the smallest size. I only really feel comfortable on longer saddles, 135mm or narrower, 130 being ideal. I wish I could vibe with it because I like the mimic tech.
  • 3 0
 Tried the power on one of my XC bikes 5 years ago and was sold. The short length is nice when the seat is dropped, and the firm and wide chassis has allowed me to survive several rides when i forgot my chamois.155mm on all of my bikes now including my big travel rig.
  • 1 0
 Current saddles are a Chromag Lynx DT on my MTB and a Selle Smp evolution on my road and ravel bikes, but I also use Selle Italia SLR on the road too. Testing out a few different Selle Smp saddles
  • 1 0
 @AddisonEverett: That Chromag Lynx saddle is my favorite. Tried several others, but the shape and padding are perfect for me.
  • 2 0
 @AddisonEverett: I think the Power Saddle was original intended for women, who tend to have wider sit bones. I suspect that is the reason why the small is a 143
  • 1 0
 @mtmc99: the Mimic version was definitely developed for women, but I believe the og with the cutout was unisex. I have heard that the Power Arc, while still 143 wide in the smallest version, is shaped a bit differently so that it rides narrower. But wider saddles, all around 140, have been a trend recently on stock bikes
  • 1 0
 @Jason300b: It is a great saddle, absolutely love mine.
  • 2 0
 @AddisonEverett: u could get Power Expert in 130mm version.
Its even more narrow then Power ARC 143mm, from which sitting area is more narrow then on Power 143mm.
  • 3 1
 @mtmc99: originaly was intended for aero position on short versions of TRI (sprint, olympic) where real TRI bikes are not allowed.
From 2014/2015 is this for sure the saddle (130, 143, 155, 168 ), where most of my customers say: This on is the best! (Im a proffesional bike fitter for years - working mostly w/Spec, Bontrager, Giant, Syncros, WTB, Prologo, but also quite a lot w/ Selle Italia, Ergon, Infinity, Fizik)
  • 1 0
 Seat tube angles on modern frames mean you don't have to move forward anymore. At least on my Privateer 141 (78.9 STA on size P1) the saddle is positioned in the center and no matter how steep I don't have to move at all. I also find sitting and pedalling works better than standing at all inclines. I only stand occasionally during very long climbs to switch stance and use different muscles.
  • 2 0
 @salespunk:
Same. I have a power arc collecting dust, it is super comfortable, but it bruises the hell out of the inside of my legs on spicy descents.

It makes me curious about other spec saddles because it is definitely comfortable.

More shops need demo programs for seats.
If it was as transformative as some people say. I'd buy a $300 saddle if I knew it would be the case for me, but I cant buy one as an experiment, that's just crazy.
  • 3 0
 @justwan-naride:
It depends on leg length and actual seat tube angle as well, but it seems like steeper than 79 or so starts to go too far.

I am on a crossworx Dash 290, 79 degree seat tube and the actual seat tube angle is also quite steep.

It's good, but I actually have my saddle pushed rearwards all the way. I don't think I'd want steeper. It's still much steeper than my rascal was with the seat all the way forward, and that's despite 155mm travel vs 130mm travel (sags more). I love that it's never feels saggy and the front end always feels planted.
  • 1 0
 @KennyWatson: I agree, there has to be a limit. Right now I wouldn't want a steeper STA, but I wouldn't go back to slacker angles either. I briefly rode a Santa Cruz Hightower which happened to be my size and fit like a glove, but while climbing I felt like I was hanging off the back, like someone let the most of the air out of the rear shock. Then again the actual STA on the 141 is 75.5 while most SC frames are in the 60something zone.
  • 1 0
 @KennyWatson: specialized has a try and return policy
  • 1 0
 I would disagree - It’s just a great saddle plain and simple. I have a sever skin condition that causes deep cysts all in my chamois region (delightful, I know), and the power saddles have helped me start riding again (road, gravel, MTB, etc.) due to the way they position pressure on the sit bones and not on the soft parts.
  • 1 0
 @Cantle406: I used to have similar issues. Don't know if you have tried it, but Lotrimin applied twice per day, whether riding or not, eliminated the issue and it has been six months now.
  • 11 0
 Hey Dario, not to be a hater, but is this a typo or BS ??
"Since last June, I have spent thousands of hours perched atop this little guy"
Seems pretty unlikely. Assuming the bare minimum number to qualify for "thousands" (2000) that would require an average of >6 hours a day, every day, for 11 months straight.
If it is true, you might want to read up on the concept of overtraining.
  • 7 0
 Not mentioned BUT for the straight up then down riding that is mostly what is out here found the anomaly switchgrade help considerably with comfort especially going up hill no matter the saddle. The climb position virtually eliminates the direct pressure on the taint...this even tho I mostly got it since i like my saddle tilt back for descents (from racing dh)
  • 3 1
 and yes it's expensive but like Matt stated 'you can’t put a price on comfort'
  • 5 1
 @artistformlyknowasdan: I use this same logic when justifying any new bike-related purchase - You can't put a price on good times!
  • 4 0
 @MegaMatt5000: it’s good logic. life’s short, if you can buy the bike do it
  • 1 0
 @artistformlyknowasdan: I don’t know about that. Turns out I put my price for comfort around $100-120.
  • 6 0
 I won the Power Mirror in a raffle at my local shop. I was always curious about it, since I've ran the regular Power for years, but I didn't want to spend all that money on a saddle. I hate that it's so good, cause now I don't ever want to go back.
  • 8 0
 How does one transition from wearing a chamois to not wearing one?! Gradually… or go all in?!
  • 45 0
 If you have to ask, you're not ready
  • 22 0
 Every time I've worn a chamois I've transitioned to not wearing it. So far, at least.
  • 15 6
 You may not be able to, there is no benefit and you risk a "negative outcome". Its a hipster brag I fell for and am back wearing my diaper lol idgaf, my body needs it
  • 1 0
 It's a bit of a binary situation really. But in all seriousness just dive in.
  • 1 2
 Start your ride without. After a few miles put it on. Next ride go a few miles more without before putting it on. After a hold dozen rides you should be good to gom
  • 2 0
 I made the mistake of not wearing one for years to wearing one. Now I can't quit....I need an intervention.
  • 6 2
 @mariomtblt: Or, all chamois I tried resulted in swamp ass and horrible chafing. I've been butt pad free for years with no "negative outcomes."
  • 4 1
 @pisgahgnar: we all have different asses man what can I say, you are lucky haha
  • 8 4
 It's simple, you just need to find a good saddle. Chamois came from road bikes where the saddle need to be light and alsu hurt your eyes. There is no reason not to have a good saddle on mtb. Just read the article, all good saddles are here.
  • 4 0
 Do or do not, there is no try.
  • 3 7
flag mybaben (May 5, 2023 at 13:31) (Below Threshold)
 @mariomtblt: Agreed! It's totes a hipster flex, like riding a fixie. Chamois for the win.
  • 2 0
 @mybaben: I think some of it comes down to cheap crappy Chamois, there is a difference just like a cheap crappy saddle. I use Chamois butter too.
  • 2 1
 @kuna26: Agreed. At the end of the day comfort really comes from 3 things lining up, a high quality saddle, one that actually fits your anatomy, and a high quality chamois.
  • 1 1
 @mybaben: right on!
  • 4 1
 If you have a lot of natural butt padding, if your saddle is very padded, if you're very light... you can get by without. For everyone else, put your baby lotion and diaper on.
  • 3 0
 Wait, hold up… I missed the memo. Are chamois not cool now?
  • 2 0
 @TheR: there’s no memo. Ride your bike and wear what makes it comfortable and fun to ride your bike.
  • 2 0
 @mariomtblt: And we all don’t live in the humid af southeast. Probably has more to do with it.
  • 4 1
 @pisgahgnar: chamois cream for chafing, game changer. It's the micro abrasions that tear your @$$ up. Chamois cream lubricates those 2 surfaces. You can ride for 10 hours and still be fine with cream. Feels weird putting it on though. But with the cream, more is always better. Ha ha.
  • 4 1
 @sofakingwetarded: I think only roadies learn about chamois cream. I don't think they teach that in mountain bike school. Sad.
  • 2 0
 @TEAM-ROBOT: you’re sad bro with your chaffed azz
  • 2 0
 @sofakingwetarded: as a reformed triathlete I’ve gone the cream route. But in recent years I’ve got a good system going with compression shorts, baggies, and - good saddle that doesn’t require chamois regardless of the amount of time I’m out there. Four days a week with hours on the bike on the weekend and it just works.
  • 2 1
 What’s the point of making the experience worse? Telling your friends that you’re somehow more cool for not wearing one?
  • 3 2
 @dualsuspensiondave: Define worse, for me there is nothing worse than a sweaty ass, your mileage may vary.
  • 10 1
 Love this kind of content & I love my Chromag Trailmaster saddle.
  • 7 0
 Ergon SM Enduro is my current favourite. Keen to try the SQLab 611 though...
  • 2 0
 Same here. Love that saddle.
  • 4 0
 Anyone else have issues with the WTB Silverado creaking as you pedal? Well, technically, the creaking is occurring at the seatpost clamp, but it only happens when there is a Silverado clamped in there. We have two of them in our household and both are annoyingly noisy. All of the other saddles on all of our other bikes are completely silent.
  • 1 0
 I've had that issue with older Silverados of mine, seems to have gone away with more recent ones I've been using. If the creak does start, you can drip some lube or green loctite into the nose of it and it should go away for a while.
  • 1 0
 My Volt does, but I got used to it. It's the best saddle I have ever had on my mtb.
  • 2 0
 Try unscrewing plastic parts under the saddle, Torx10 I think. And grease rail/plastic contact points and grease those plastic covers as well where those contact metal and plastic. Just thinnest layer is enough, screw back but don’t over tighten. Literally yesterday fixed my wtb pure. Or if you are lazy just spray some lube in there. Chain lube penetrates well even if you drip 1-2 drops.
  • 7 0
 Chromag Trailmaster
  • 3 0
 I used to ride the Silverado. I liked it too, it was quite comfy. But after destroying a few too many, I've switched to Chromag Lynx DT. Very comfortable, very tough, and very durable. I have one on three of my bikes now.
  • 6 1
 Seb over here with the low key BD energy “wide pressure-relief channel”. We see you Seb ;-)
  • 2 0
 The stock specialized “bridge” saddle that comes stock on the cheaper trail and enduro builds is incredible for MTB I’ve found. I run the power saddles on road bikes but after trying it on a mtb I went back to the basic spec bridge saddle.

Best part is you can find them for cheap as take offs.
  • 5 0
 Only if it’s really really wet? What, the chamois is wet?
  • 5 0
 Hey Matt Beer, you CAN put a price on comfort, and it's less than $325!
  • 1 0
 Always Chamois for me. Started with road bikes, now mostly gravel and mtbs (90% of my rides). Used to use SW toupe for years, but after trying the SW power saddle, I switched. 5 bikes. Four SW power saddles and one Pro power saddle mirror. Honestly, can't tell a huge difference between the mirror and non-mirror saddles, but both are very comfortable for me. If I had to choose just one, I'd probably go with the mirror. Only downside, $$$ especially with 5 bikes.
  • 1 0
 WTB Koda FTW, comfort- and price-wise, so far, but have felt good on an older (can't recall model) Ergon. Would like to go back to an Ergon and perhaps try one of the new SDG Bel-Air V2 saddles one day. Any opinions on the SDG Bel-Air?
  • 2 1
 Tried one for a bit but didn't like it. The covering was too grippy and made it hard to move around on the bike. The covering also started to separate from the foam after only a couple weeks use.
  • 2 0
 New SDG Bal Air 3 is the comfiest saddle I’ve used in a while. I came off a Silverado. Not sure what the comment above is about being too grippy. The cover is the same as my Silverado but the foam and shape just fits me better. Mine and my friend’s have been super durable too. Highly recommend.
  • 1 0
 @covekid: I had the V3. The cover started separating from the foam a few inches in front of the logo in the center channel recess.
  • 1 0
 Currently a WTB Silverado fan, but a torn rotator cuff has me biking stationary these days, and it's just a bit narrow in the 142mm width. Tried the Specialized Power in 155, but somehow it still gets up into the soft tissue. Any recommendations for a wider Silverado?
  • 5 0
 The WTB Volt in the wide is very comfy for me. If you look at the shape its essentially the opposite of the power saddle,it has a very wide sturdy rear and sides. I run them on all my bikes and have a power saddle sitting in the bin. It just works for me and luckily its super cheap. They just creak a bit.
  • 2 0
 Things that I learnt:-
1) separating the porridge connoisseur and kettle supervisor roles are vital to avoid a conflict of interest in you web business.
2) My WTB saddle was a bargain
  • 1 0
 Personally I'm a BikeYoke Sagma man. Hard but fair, and with elastomer vibro-damping. So much to talk about. Have two on different bikes, weirdly the carbon railed one is heavier than the cheaper alloy one, manufacturers claimed weights are the other way around.
  • 2 0
 Whatever saddle you find that fits your butt, buy several. Because inevitably the mfr will change or discontinue the design. You'll also realize a chamois was only a band-aid to the root of the problem.
  • 1 0
 Fabric Line-S is a good option for folks who want to test a shorter/wider saddle but don't want to pay Specialized prices. The Line-S Pro is $180 at 180g which is lighter than the $350 Power Pro with Mirror and just 10g heavier than the $450 S-Work Power. The Line-S also a really significant and wide channel, but is more traditional in it's upper construction, so it's easier to clean than the Mirror lineup.

I've been really happy with it and the only reason I don't run it on all my bikes is because I've got wide Specialized Phenoms elsewhere that are still really good.

Unfortunately the only saddle I've had to bin (or rather resell) mutliple times is the WTB Silverado. I've acquired 3 now on various bikes and they all lasted one ride. I blame the lack of adjustable width. I'd probably like WTB saddles if they made them 155mm or wider.
  • 1 0
 Chamois? Don't you mean riding diapers? Chamois today are way too thick and reduce bike feel. I steer with my hips, not my bars. I want feel and response. Bike Chamois are only as thick as they are today because bike manufacturers only have two weapons in their advertising arsenal; light and fast... Light equals fast, but light equals discomfort and weakness as well. All this has caused saddle manufacturers to ignore materials and comfort as a whole. This has generated some really nasty saddles and some really thick short liners... You can put all the gaps and mesh and widen till the cows come home. It doesn't change the facts. Light saddles SUCK! Thick chamois SUCK! Let me help you industry fiends with some qualified legit common sense apparel design tips.

1. Industry leaders need to colab! Adopt a set of standards for chamois thicknesses and seat padding, so you can design saddles and liner shorts in unison. Make the padding levels in both thinner but better material. Offer a few options that make sense to consumers that don't know any better yet. This is 2023 not 2003, go to a material trade show once in while TLD and FOX I'm talking to you.... People that don't ride chamois, don't because they loose bike feel and hate the over thickness. This will never change until saddles change.

Hargood tips:
2. Stop using HD foam in your high end saddles and move it to your low end saddles but combo it with memory or open cell foam. Put thinner layers of GEL in your high end saddles and compensate for the weight with carbon bases, rails and titainium rails. Just make the rail height appropriate to compensate for padding height. I ride sensible saddles, but feel like WTB could make a better saddle with the ingredients it already has... WTB you either sell 450 gram saddles that feel like a dream, but are made of the heaviest materials in the industry or 120 gram saddles that I like to call taint killers... Where is my 200 gram carbon and TI PURE wide with Gel dream saddle? Not the lightest but I would take the 80 g hit for gel in an ultra light swoop nose saddle any day of the week. If your lightest saddle and the Pure gel chro-mo got together and f*cked, the offspring of those two saddles would be the best saddle you ever birthed....
  • 1 0
 I rode with chamois for years and years…. Started riding with just athletic boxer briefs and never looked back. Less pressure on the taint resulting in less numbness. Not feeling like I have to change instantly and the fact that it will dry in a reasonable time is great if going to hang out after the ride. No negatives that I’ve found.
  • 1 0
 re: the Specialized Power Pro

Finally Finally Finally someone on this Earth who understands me in not wanting to crash my 'washers' on every - literally every - XC bump encountered. In other owrds:

- If You are going downhill
- sit on the back of Your saddle
- using Your ass
- instead of Your balls.

Helps a lot. Also the saddle angle.
  • 2 1
 a few years back Giant had a clearance sale on its Contact SL Saddle in a cool black and white...$30.00, down from like $120 or something....bought 4. Never really gave it much though...light, cheap...sold.
  • 2 0
 Seb Scott...how quickly do you go through saddles with the seat absolutely slammed forward like that? Thats got to put some stress on the rails
  • 4 0
 Chamios, must be some sort of new fangled way of spelling, "chamois"
  • 2 2
 If ya need a chamois then your seats no good, find the seat that’s comfy with no chamois then you know you got the right seat, they do exist it’s just that you haven’t found it yet. SQ lab for the win, when you know you know
  • 1 0
 That SQ labs saddle is the Ergowave "Active" for what its worth...I love that saddle and actually the 612 more, but the "Active" version is substantially more comfortable than the non-active version imo
  • 4 1
 "eWe" love to see more professionalism
  • 1 0
 Treat your ass as well as you treat your feet. If you care for it, you will do the right thing. Selle Italia, La Sportiva...Italian (faux) leather is wondrous!
  • 2 0
 that ergon seat about to get tagged for a warranty reject claim. i've never seen a seat slammed that far forward O_O
  • 4 1
 Where's Levy on this one?? Is he still rocking the Tioga hammock?
  • 5 0
 Rumor is he doesn’t use a saddle.
  • 4 1
 "Price: $48-250 USD, depending on rail material."

GTFOH.
  • 4 1
 Dario has spent AT LEAST two thousand hours on a Silverado in 11 months?
  • 1 1
 So is everyone just free balling..I feel you need something to contain ..and underwear just ends up bunching up.. nothing worse than having a loos ball get slammed between your saddle and thigh
  • 1 0
 The best underwear I’ve found for biking is Runderwear. Seamless and has silicone on leg elastic. They stay put and are very comfortable.
  • 1 0
 Need 3d print files of all the editor's butts for comparison to my own. Or you know what, if a local shop sets up a saddle library, that would be better and less weird.
  • 2 0
 I typically don't comment on articles anymore. Just was wondering why only one saddle width was listed.
  • 1 0
 maybe i shouldn’t be surprised no one uses a fizik mtb saddle. i use a fizik antares r1, will probably be the only carbon fibre on my bike for a long time.
  • 2 0
 Would be good to know the sitbone width and weight of everyone, put their choices in context and all.
  • 1 0
 Someone please help @DarioDiGiulio. His hands/arms must hurt too bad from holding himself on the saddle to adjust the tilt of it!
  • 1 0
 Any thoughts on saddles never having a reference measurement on how far forward the rails actually put your seating position relative to seat clamp?
  • 4 1
 Ergon SM10. That is all.
  • 2 0
 Sdg ibeam on my downhill bike
  • 3 0
 lots of Spesh saddles
  • 11 10
 Can't unsee a bunch of people who put the title 'Editor' next to their name but can't spell the word chamois.
  • 10 1
 If you use the proper pronunciation ("sham-WOW") it's hard to misspell.

BAM!
  • 2 0
 eWe?
  • 2 0
 @thomasjkenney1024: You're gonna love your nuts
  • 1 0
 shammy
  • 3 1
 "Pinkbike tech editors spend a lot of time on their ass."

Are they all sitting on Henry for long periods of time? Wink
  • 1 0
 the power comp saddle is as good as the mirror and its like 90 bucks, so yeah lmao,
  • 4 0
 The comp is good, but that Mirror is straight magic.
  • 1 0
 I forgot my cham one ride a few years ago and converted from an always to gravel and long rides only.
  • 1 0
 Ive tried dozens of different saddles and the best for me by far is the Silverado
  • 2 0
 @Dario: pizza lover
also Dario: "pizzarhea" sticker on bike

hmm...
  • 3 0
 it's a lifestyle
  • 2 0
 @dariodigiulio: its the law to eat pizza since youre italian. just deal with the consequences
  • 1 0
 I have been using the WTB Silverado for many many years. It is the best seat I have found.
  • 1 0
 Everyone runs their saddle forward and bikes are still being produced with sub 78° seat angles...
  • 1 0
 Love the ergon! But mine is horrendously noisy since day 1 a year ago. Anyone with suggestions on fix?
  • 1 0
 Chamois-only when it’s wet. So you can grow some sweet fromundo mushrooms?? Ick!!!!
  • 2 0
 I only ride a brooks saddle on my dh.
  • 1 0
 I'm surprised the bulk of the PB staff don't wear chamois, lots of people I know do, but I don't.
  • 2 0
 Dario - you have good taste Smile
  • 3 1
 We mustn't let saddles drive a wedge between ass.
  • 1 0
 With the markings and indentations on his saddle, I think Kazimer rides with stones in his shorts!!
  • 3 1
 Brooks Cambium C15 all weather carved. Your A$$ will love you.
  • 1 0
 From the looks of most of these setups, all the riders are riding frames that are too large for them. Huh?
  • 1 0
 @henryquinney - I'm gonna take you at your word, and give the "really really wet" chamois a go.
  • 2 0
 #teamSYNCROS
  • 3 2
 Ergon has the best saddles imo
  • 1 0
 Dario "Kulhavy" DiGiulio.
  • 1 0
 The man's onto something.
  • 1 0
 This reminds me, time for my annual quest for Fizik Gobi XM saddles.
  • 1 1
 Wear a chamois, even for DH. It has saved my jiblets on more than one occasion!
  • 1 0
 Take it to the next level with the Ergon SMC sport gel! Love mine.
  • 1 0
 Hope Spec doesn't get sued by the guys who make those Purple mattresses.
  • 2 1
 Nice to see Alicia but where is Levy?
  • 2 3
 So many saddles and width mentioned just once? For me 155 mm works good, and I havent heard of anybody suffering from saddle being too wide. 140 mm std is obsolete.
  • 3 0
 Speak for yourself. I find 140mm too wide and 155mm would be completely out of the question. The narrower 135mm Ergon Enduro is my current favorite.
  • 2 1
 @nnowak: I wrote "for me". True question is, is there more people finding 140 mm uncomfortable, than people finding uncomfortable with 155 mm? Chamois or not can also play a part, I ride without.
  • 4 0
 @stpan: You wrote "I havent heard of anybody suffering from saddle being too wide". Now you have.
  • 1 0
 do those 3d printed saddles get mud caked in them?
  • 1 0
 at least theres no ISM saddles
  • 1 0
 Why? Not a fan?
  • 1 0
 Seb definitely needs grim donut seattube angle.
  • 1 0
 Charge spoon
  • 1 0
 I have loved this saddle for years. I have one on all of my bikes. Cheap and feels good.
  • 1 0
 @Docster: Came here to say the exact same thing! For the past decade I have run a Spoon
  • 1 1
 Nukeproof Horizon makes all other saddles irrelevant
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