First Ride: The New Santa Cruz Bronson

Jul 3, 2018
by Mike Kazimer  


There's a new Bronson on the block, and it looks a whole lot like a Nomad. But don't be fooled by the similar looks – out on the trail this 150mm machine has an entirely different feel than its longer and slacker sibling. Just like the prior version, it's still an all-mountain bike through and through, although it's more than capable enough to mix it up at an enduro race, or for the occasional visit to the bike park.

There are both carbon and aluminum framed options, with complete bike prices beginning at $3,499 USD for the aluminum R model, and going all the way up to $9,899 for the XTR Reserve model. Want to build up a Bronson with your own selection of parts? An alloy frame will set you back $1,999, and a carbon CC frame goes for $3,299.


Bronson Details

• Intended use: all-mountain / enduro
• Wheel size: 27.5"
• Rear wheel travel: 150mm
• Carbon or aluminum frame options
• 65.1° or 65.4° head angle
• 430mm chainstays
• 12 x 148mm rear spacing
• Sizes: XS-XL
• Complete price: CC: $6999 - $9899 USD, C: $3499 - $6399, AL: $3499 - $4199
• Frame only: AL: $1999, CC: $3299
• Colors: Industry Blue, Primer Grey
• Lifetime frame warranty
www.santacruzbicycles.com



Santa Cruz Bronson 2019
The Bronson's shock has been relocated lower to the downtube, where it's driven by the short lower link, a configuration that's designed to create a more linear, progressive suspension curve.

What's New?

The most obvious change to the Bronson is the rear suspension layout – the shock is now tucked low on the frame, just above the bottom bracket, rather than being attached to the top tube. There are also dual uprights on the rear swingarm (the prior version and the Nomad both have only one upright, on the non-drive side).

It's still a VPP suspension design, thanks to the two counter-rotating links, but by using the lower link to drive the shock Santa Cruz was able to give the bike a linearly-progressive suspension curve – in other words, the suspension should behave the same way when an obstacle is encountered no matter where the shock is sitting in its travel.

Thinking about trying out some extra-wide tires? That's no problem on the Bronson – there's room to go as wide as 2.8”. There are two different versions of each built kit - a 27.5 and a 27.5+ option. The 27.5 builds get a 2.5" Maxxis Minion DHF up front, and a 2.4" DHR II in the rear, mounted on rims with a 30mm internal width, while the 27.5+ versions get even wider rims, and 2.6” Maxxis Minion DHF and DHR II tires. The Plus hype seems to have subsided, but we're starting to see more and more 2.6” tires hit the market, a width that offers more precise handling than a 2.8” or wider tire, while still providing the extra traction and smooth ride that put 27.5+ tires on the map in the first place.


Santa Cruz Bronson 2019
The Bronson's frame design has the shock positioned underneath the seattube.
Santa Cruz Bronson 2019
A flip chip on the lower link allows for the head angle to be adjusted by .3-degrees, and the bottom bracket height by 4mm.


Sweating the Small Stuff

'Refined' is the word that often comes to mind when describing Santa Cruz's bikes – the little details are all in order, like the bolt-on downtube protector that's in place to protect the frame from the damage that shuttling can incur, the threaded bottom bracket, and the carbon tubes molded inside the front triangle to facilitate internal cable routing. There's also plenty of room to carry a full-size water bottle, and a miniature fender that protects the shock from any trail debris that gets flung up by the rear wheel.



Santa Cruz Bronson 2019
A bolt-on downtube protector keeps the frame safe from damage while shuttling (or crashing).
Santa Cruz Bronson 2019
Reduced seat tube lengths make it possible to run longer travel dropper posts.


Santa Cruz Bronson 2019


Geometry - A Little Longer, A Little Slacker

The new Bronson's reach has grown by 15mm compared to the previous model, and the head angle is now a degree slacker in the lowest setting with a 160mm fork. Like the Nomad, there's a flip chip on the lower link that can be used to increase or decrease the head angle and bottom bracket height.

The seat tube angle has been bumped up to 75-degrees, while the actual length has been decreased, which makes it easier to run longer travel dropper posts, or for riders to size up if they're looking for a roomier frame.


Santa Cruz Bronson 2019
The Juliana Roubion uses the same frame as the Bronson, but receives a different paint job, and the build kits include Juliana-branded seats and grips.
Santa Cruz Bronson 2019
Bronson CC XX1 Reserve.
Santa Cruz Bronson 2019
The aluminum Bronson S.

Specifications

Detailing every single possible parts configuration for the new Bronson would be about as exciting as watching paint dry, but there are a few highlights worth mentioning. The first is that every model, from budget to bling, comes with a 12-speed drivetrain, ranging from SRAM NX gruppo found on the entry level aluminum and carbon models, up to either SRAM XX1 or Shimano XTR at the other end of the price scale. RockShox handles the rear suspension, with either a Super Deluxe R or RCT depending on the pricepoint. Up front, a 160mm RockShox Yari is found on the least expensive options, while a Fox 36 Performance, Elite, or Factory fork is spec'd on the rest of the models in the lineup.






I'm in the middle of testing several different bikes at the moment (a tough job, I know), but there's something special about the Bronson that keeps making me grab it over the other test sleds, which is saying something considering that it's not rocking my preferred wheelsize. Is there a 29” version on the way? I sure hope so, but Josh Kissner, Santa Cruz's Product Manager, cagily shrugged off my pestering – we'll just have to wait and see if there's a big wheeled option in the works. In case you're wondering, there's no way that a 29" wheel can be sqeezed in there - the tire will hit the lower rocker link.

I've been able to get in a handful of solid rides in on the Bronson, just enough to come up with a few initial impressions on its handling. I got along well with the previous version, and so far that's been the case with this iteration as well. It's a very intuitive bike to ride, one that doesn't require any special riding techniques to get it to behave exactly the way I want. All of my rides have started with a sustained climb, giving me plenty of time to contemplate just its climbing prowess. The new suspension layout hasn't diminished the Bronson's uphill abilities in the slightest – there's still no need to reach down for that compression lever unless you're facing an extra-long gravel or paved road grind, and even then it's not really necessary. It feels quick and efficient, but without the fully locked-out feeling that sometimes accompanies dual-link designs - it's active enough to maintain grip over rough terrain.


Santa Cruz Bronson 2019
The Bronson's no one trick pony - it climbs almost as well as it descends.

I've also started to experiment with a set of Santa Cruz's Reserve 37 wheels mounted up with a 2.6” Maxxis Minion DHF / DHR II tires tire combo, and that big rubber has already proven its mettle on the climbs – I managed to clean a section of trail the other day that I usually treat as a hike-a-bike. Granted, the dirt was perfect, but those big tires made it much easier to keep from spinning out and losing traction. They probably wouldn't be my first tire choice if I mostly rode on fast, hardpacked terrain, but on slightly slower speed trails that have lots of chunky rock- or root-filled sections the extra grip and stability they provide makes them an intriguing option.

Does the Bronson feel like a mini-Nomad? In a way, yes, although the word 'mini' might be underselling the capabilities of this bike. That 150mm of rear travel is incredibly supple and well controlled, which makes it feel almost bottomless in the really rough stuff. The Nomad may be a bit more forgiving of line choice errors thanks to its 20mm of extra travel, but the Bronson has a more energetic feel to its handling, and it's better suited for rides that include a little bit of everything – up, down, and all around. I'm going to keep putting the miles in over the next couple of months – look for a long-term review later this year.






Must Read This Week

404 Comments

  • + 532
 Ok, Nomad is a mini V10 and Bronson is a mini Nomad, so Bronson is a micro V10 and 5010 is a nano V10? that means that Bronson is also a macro 5010 and mega Blur. Which brings us to conclusion than new Bronson is a mega Blur and nano V10. The DH Goat. Makes perfect sense!

The only question left is that if Nomad is an Enduro bike and 5010 is a DownCountry bike, what is Bronson really? A remnant of All Mountain era? Will historians call it the New School Down Country? Smoke and a pancake? Bong and a Blintz?
  • + 21
 The SC bike choice is now based on skill set, hovering above ground 5010, blasting across it, the Nomad, and for those that cannot decide (or honest with themselves) the Bronson !!
  • + 122
 The Nomad is a FREEEEERIDE Bike and the Bronson is an Enduro bike, fixed

#BRINGFREERIDEBACK
  • + 19
 Crepe and a pipe?
  • + 2
 @timmeh2k: Blintz and a bong?
  • + 13
 @SlodownU: Cigar and a Waffle? I made AP reference on E Battys insatgram when she posted a pic of her golden Eagle cassette #ignored
  • + 33
 This comment makes my head hurt
  • + 3
 Yes.
  • - 9
flag WAKIdesigns (Jul 3, 2018 at 6:11) (Below Threshold)
 @OzMike: don't mistake Bronson with the likes of recently tested Troy though because Brosnan can shred park very well
  • + 20
 Look at Waki getting the love he deserves!
  • + 44
 Upduro > Slopeduro > Downduro > Speed n' Duro
  • + 13
 Can we please get shirts & Sticker with "What Would Waki Do/Say"
  • + 47
 @WAKIdesigns: waki, this comment is gold. Don't ever stop doing drugs.
  • + 2
 @brianpark: stop enabling the problem, that sh!t will catch on!
  • + 34
 You Bromad?
  • + 2
 @brianpark: you forgot E duro, E slope duro and E DH duro
  • + 6
 42.
  • + 1
 The Bronson is a UpEnduro bike or DownTrail bike or Tweener EnduroXC bike.
  • + 1
 @BrianRichards:

After riding the V3 for two years and getting on the V4 this year I will confirm that the new nomad is spooky comfortable bombing chutes vs the trail slaying V3.

Buy a dh bike if you're looking at the new nomad.
  • + 2
 XXC?
  • + 3
 @BrianRichards: Who side Freeride went away? It's a style of riding, not something anyone can remove or stop producing.
  • + 2
 @InfraRed: I'm hoping this is true.
  • + 1
 Waki at his best!
  • + 1
 @JacobSpera: i have an 18 nomad and crush big days all the time. Its more usefil than a DH bike.
  • + 2
 Yes to the 2nd question.

Santa Cruz should explain their bike spectrum like this: Blur = 29 XC, Tallboy = 29 XC/Trail, 5010 = 27.5 Trail, Bronson = 27.5 AM & High Tower = 29 AM, Nomad = 27.5 Enduro, Bro-mad = 29 Enduro, V10 27.5 = 27.5 DH, V110% = 29 DH .

Where's my Bro-mad and V110%!!!
  • + 3
 @will-burr: let me explain you:

V10 - stoke super rad Danny Hart legend
Nomad - it can make freeride great again
Bronson - so Enduro bro so GTFO
5010 - I’m so awake as fuk I feel more feedback
Blur - g@y!!!!
  • - 1
 Nailed it
  • + 6
 @will-burr: by why do we need all these different models when the pedal up like a xc bike and DH like a dh bike? I'm confuffled
  • + 0
 I wrote this when WAKI’s comment had +420 up-votes
  • + 3
 Whatever genre...Just give me a Nomad 29" or a re-designed HT LT, with the new rear-linkage!!! NOW!!!
  • + 0
 Or just get a shock and DC fork with lockout for the V10 and mount wide range cassette to it...
  • + 1
 bottom line....i got 26 27.5 and 29. is there a new size again?
  • + 0
 @OzMike: Waki is a dork like that....
  • + 1
 You lost me at mini v10
  • + 1
 Same as with cars. New VW Polo becomes the Golf. Always size up
  • + 151
 "designed to create a more linear, progressive suspension curve" - so which is it? More linear, or more progressive??
  • + 13
 linear-proressive
  • + 12
 Exactly. Progressive ramps up, linear remains constant....
  • + 78
 Also, it uses 650b 29er wheels.
  • + 42
 They're saying that they've made the curve, which is progressive, has been made more linear. ie it still ramps up, but not as quickly. A progressive curve can be linear or non-linear, in the same way that a REgressive curve can be either linear or non-linear.
  • + 0
 That's what I though. Linear and progressive are opposite right?.... I look forward to hearing an explanation for this one.
  • - 2
 The leverage rate is progressive in a linear fashion. Basically shock shaft speeds increase linearly through the travel, creating more damping.
  • + 6
 I read it as ‘a less progressive curve than before’ but could be completely wrong with that.
Either way it doesn’t help much to explain what’s going on. Just use a graph then all the obtuse and misused suspension jargon is avoided.
  • + 17
 I think they mean exactly that, linear progressive. Likely as opposed to logarithmic progressive or exponentially progressive. It gets progressive at a linear rate throughout the travel.
  • + 1
 @treggs: only if the line is horizontal?
  • + 4
 @martino: Digressive is the opposite to Progressive. Linear means "straight line".. Linearly progressive means the rate of progression does not change. It does not get increasingly progressive.
  • + 33
 @sam264 is correct - the suspension is still progressive - the shock rate increases as it goes through its travel, but it does so in a more linear manner. Picture a diagonal line rather than a hook shaped curve.
  • - 3
 Why has the dumbest comment on here been moved to the top?
  • - 4
flag justanotherusername (Jul 3, 2018 at 3:12) (Below Threshold)
 @sam264: they are not saying that, they are just referring to not having the odd rate changes the previous bike suffered from.

People are wildly confused by the terms linear and progressive here.

PB - can we do a beginner guide to kinematics please to save this stuff being discussed / potential misinformation being banded around as fact.
  • - 2
 @mikekazimer: you sure Mike?

The previous bike wasn't overly progressive but did go through several rate changes throughout its travel so was therefore not a linear system.

Surely all they are saying here is they they have made the system linear rather than what people seem to be assuming it as being 'less progressive' than the previous bike?
  • + 5
 Other websites got it. The first 30% of the leverage stroke is linear, the last 70% is progressive.
  • + 8
 Somebody please correct me if I’m wrong here but I thought progressive/ is a curve and linear is a straight line. Either one can be a falling rate meaning the suspension ramps up. One does so in a different manner to the other is the difference.
So should Mike’s statement read:
‘The suspension is still a falling rate curve ramping up as it goes through its travel but it does so in a less progressive manner. Picture a straighter line rather than a hook shaped curve’?
Am I being pedantic? Am I wrong? Am I confusing matters unnecessarily. Am I all of the aforementioned?
  • + 4
 @iqbal-achieve: the mathematical definition of linear In a graphical sense is a straight line, the bike industry likes to use it in tandem with 'progressive' usually to say it that the rate of progression takes place at a fairly constant rate without large deviation, so you are being pedantic and correct ;-) I can't think of many truly linear suspension systems - Yetis rail?
  • + 15
 @iqbal-achieve, would describing it as linearly-progressive help? Just because it's a straight line doesn't mean it's horizontal - in this case, it's a diagonal straight line - the shock rate increases as the rear wheel goes through its travel.
  • + 6
 @mikekazimer: no, that’s my point -Linear can be falling rate too. (And I take the point that not many designs are truly linear @justanotherusername). What you’re describing I think should be best described as a less progressive falling rate curve. But that doesn’t really help anyway. At what rate does it start and finish? That’s why a graph is best imo if you’re gonna talk about it at all.
  • + 4
 @mikekazimer: not really if you are familiar with the term linear in its mathematical (correct) sense that would just describe a straight line which as I say is not really obtainable from a linkage based system.
  • + 2
 @iqbal-achieve: agreed, as I said this is a bike industry way of describing the situation - it's not correct to the definition of the terms used.
  • + 1
 @justanotherusername: as I understand things ‘progressive’ denotes a sharper curve, not a steeper one. If we were to compare several bikes on the same chart the way it’s described above we could observe the most progressive bikes as also the most linear!
We need charts.
  • + 2
 @Zaff: Sounds like a spring.
  • + 1
 Sorry I should have said ‘more progressive’ denotes a sharper curve, not a steeper one.
  • + 7
 @mikekazimer: it's not shock rate, it's frame's leverage ratio. And a diagonal line means a perfect linear ratio, no matter how steep it is; be it 1:1, 1:2.5 or 1:6, it's still linear. Just to add to the chat Big Grin
  • + 3
 @sam264: so the linear refers to the rate of change of compressione rate as the suspension goes throught the travel. it's the "first" derivative (in space) of the actual force you need to move the suspension, right?
  • + 3
 @justanotherusername: The prior frame was a toned down version of the VPP curve, which was intitially regressive, going linear at the sag point, the progressive. Overall the Bronson 2 was essentially linear over its travel range, which is what made it less of a big hit bike than the Nomad which is progressive at the end of its travel.

The new bike, if it follows what Santa Cruz has been doing, will be linear in the initial travel, becoming progressive in the last 1/3-1/2 of travel. This gives a more bottom out resistance while keeping the initial travle plush, and is how many newer bikes have been tuned as people have started riding trail bikes more agressively.
  • + 1
 @justanotherusername: my take on it is they mean the force required to compress the suspension progressively increases in a linear fashion. These are all things that can coexist mathematically.
  • + 1
 @mikekazimer: No published (or actual) weight for the different versions?
  • + 1
 Scrolled down for this.
  • + 1
 So I believe what they mean is, as previously said by others, is a linear change in the wheel rate.

Ie the derivative of the wheel rate is linear (or very close to it). Which would plot as a straight line.
  • + 1
 The term "linear" is being used to describe two different things.
1) whether or not the rate curve is flat or has a slope (linear or progressive)
2) where it not the slope itself changes (if the amount of progression changes, so linearized it would be to make the slope change less).
  • + 2
 @cool3: The Santa Cruz website has all the weights.
  • + 1
 They've cured the leverage rate, just the silly amount of anti squat that's inherent in VPP designs that's left... It's such a shame they stuck with counter-rotating links. Their engineers must be banging their heads against the wall.
  • + 3
 @Zaff: Exactly. All it means is that the rate-of-change of the progressivity (is that a word?) is constant.

Some to think 'linear' means horizontal, for some reason. In this context, it just means a constant rate of change when looking at mm/mm vs. travel. It can go up (regressive), down (progressive), or be flat.

Source: math.
  • + 1
 @mikekazimer: tell us about the new Maxxis Silk Shield casing!
  • + 2
 @Boych12: Frame weights too? I didn't see them.
  • + 1
 Thank you @fussylou and @carym, I think you guys have got it. Its been changed from regressive to linear for the first part of the stroke, and the remainder is progressive as with the previous version.
  • + 1
 @shlotch: you can have a regressive falling rate. Doesn’t necessarily mean the leverage curve goes up.
  • - 7
flag tgent (Jul 3, 2018 at 11:36) (Below Threshold)
 @mikekazimer: Mike, a linear leverage ratio would imply a horizontal straight line meaning that the ratio stays the same throughout the travel. A progressive leverage ratio could be a down/right diagonal in a perfectly straight line, meaning the ratio of force to wheel travel increases as you go through the travel. Assuming it's a similar shape to the Nomad 4, VPP3 had a regressive-linear-progressive leverage ratio, which had a rising leverage ratio (up/right line), then flat in the sag zone (horizontal line), then progressive as the travel increases (down/right line). This new design has an entirely progressive leverage ratio, and is almost a straight line pointing down/right.
  • + 1
 @Boych12: Thanks.
  • + 1
 @justanotherusername: the word vomit gets really old for sure.
  • + 7
 @tgent: LINEAR DOES NOT MEAN A HORIZONTAL LINE PEOPLE! Linear means the curvature of the leverage ratio is zero.This is a debate you can all solve by yourselves using Wikipedia and a dictionary.
  • + 0
 @KennyWatson: not sure why you got downvoted.

same ppl that conflate 'small bump compliance' with a single shaft speed i guess.
  • + 2
 @tgent: math is not your thing
  • + 14
 @justanotherusername:
1. be y a given shock stroke
2. be x the rear wheel travel as a fonction of y as y=f(x)
3. f is a n-th order polynomial
4. ratio curve = plot of first derivative of f vs. rear wheel travel : y=f'(x)

A. if f(x) is a first order polynomial, f'(x)=a, a is a constant (mathematical sense, e.g. 2) y = a, meaning linear ratio curve (a straight horizontal line) in bike world = a given displacement at the rear wheel give the same shock stroke whatever the position in travel (because everybody understand that even with a LINEAR ratio, the shock stroke will blow along the rear wheel displacement) - so this type of ratio means that the suspension support only rely on the own shock's progressivity, if it has any...

B. if f(x) is a second order polynomial, f'(x)=2ax (first order polynomial) = strictly progressive/regressive ratio curve = a given displacement at the rear wheel give an evenly increasing (or decreasing) shock stroke all along the travel. The amount of increase/decrease by unit length is given by the second derivative of the shock stroke, as f''(x) = a

C. if f(x) is a third-order polynomial, f'(x)= 3ax^2+2bx second-order polynomial = variably progressive (regressive) ratio curve = a given displacement at the rear wheel give an unevenly increasing (decreasing) shock stroke along the travel. The amount of increase/decrease variation in shock stroke along the rear wheel displacement is given by the second derivative of the shock stroke, as f''(x)= 6ax + 2b

D. if f(x)= n+3 order polynomial, f'(x)= n+2 order polynomial : f'(x)=iax^i+(i-1)bx^(i-1)+...+(i-n)jx^(i-n) = variably progressive, linear or regressive) ratio curve along the rear wheel travel = all other composite, schizophrenic and impredictable type of ratio : linear-progressive-regressive, etc.... The amount of increase/decrease variation in shock stroke constantly change along the rear wheel displacement, and can eventually be given by the second derivative of the shock stroke, as f''(x)= (i-1)ax^(i-1)+...+(i-1-n)jx^(i-1-n) for what it worth...

Simply given : type A very difficult to set properly because evrything rely on shock progressivity and/or hydraulics so avoid coils and large volume cans/debonnair

type B and C can be used with both coils and air, nice tuning platform if progressive enough to rely on shock progressvity, will relax hydraulics

type D : guys responsible for this kind of ratio deserve to be banned to ever ride a full suss again, since it is almost impossible to tune a shock correctly for this type of curve because shock spring rate and damping rate are speed and position sensitive, so always varying along the travel with this kinf of kinematic...
  • + 2
 @gnralized: I think I see what you're getting at here, but it seems to over complicate the problem a little. Leverage curves are simply the mechanical advantage the shock has over the rear wheel at any given point in its travel, which just boils down to a geometry problem. Ultimately you could write the rear wheel force as a function of shock force and shock position without having to use any form of polynomial approximation.
  • + 1
 I subscribe to this: www.youtube.com/watch?v=l8VGEh3IbO8&frags=pl%2Cwn Seriously the best overview of bikes with linear (Spec Enduro) to very progressive (Black Market) suspension.
  • + 1
 Seems like some of y'all need a calculus refresher.
  • + 0
 @iqbal-achieve: Of course - though a decreasing rate of change through the travel of the stroke would imply we are no longer talking about a linear(ish) design. Quick, what's the fancy industry term for a negative exponential curve? I'm going with Super Euler Plus Reverse.
  • + 1
 @gnralized: Mind. Blown.
  • + 1
 More linear, progressive, non-linear suspension
  • + 1
 @mikekazimer: a diagonal line is... linear.
  • + 1
 @shlotch: no, linear means a straight line (no curve) but that can still be "diagonal" across x-y axis.
  • + 2
 @gnralized: thank you for reminding me of my uni days.

Don't see how any of it is relevant to the discussion though?
  • + 1
 @mikekazimer: Is there room to fit a coil shock? It looks like there is not very much under that seat tube.
  • + 1
 @pretzelgirl: Mind. Pretzeled.

@sspiff: Yes I do but staying out of it instead.
  • + 58
 Also, 5200$ and a bottom of the barrel Fox Performance fork?!? They ride decent but that’s a joke. 2 pawl DT370 hubs too.

Bike Prices are out of control. That’s a decent build for a 3500$ bike. You have to spend 7 grand to get something that isn’t compromised out of the box.
  • - 33
flag ryan83 (Jul 3, 2018 at 6:23) (Below Threshold)
 If you pay retail, which only dick shops require. Just call around and you can get $1-2k off msrp in that range.
  • + 28
 The alternative working title for this review was: "If there was ever a brand that needed Rider Direct Pricing..."
  • + 4
 @ryan83: ...sigh...
  • + 7
 That's why I'll never buy a Santa Cruz. Unless there are tons of mountain bikers who don't mind spending twice as much money for the same spec, just so they can buy at a local shop, then I really think direct-to-consumer is eventually going to become the only way to buy, and the shops will just carry a few demos, or we'll see more demo events.
  • + 8
 Agree, thats why I bought a Canyon Spectral.
  • + 15
 Vote with your wallet then
  • + 2
 @poozank: I just did a couple weeks ago. It's too bad, I would've loved a Santa Cruz, but I love my money more. Even looking at the used stuff, I got a better equipped 2017 bike and had the money left over for 2 bike park season passes plus a season pass for the wife and daughter to use at the local amusement park while I'm off riding.
  • + 3
 The flip chip costs 2k
  • + 5
 @huntstyle:

I got my gen 3 nomad as a demo for $500 less than the AL capra that wasn't available. I had one reserved and after 3 months of my ship date getting pushed back i finally gave up.
  • + 2
 So stupid. $5200 for a Performance fork, full GX, Code R, DT370, >30lbs

$3700 for a YT Capra gets you a Lyrik, XT/e.13 drivetrain, solid e.13 wheels, Code RS, 30lbs

Canyon will get you the same spec as the Bronson for $3500.

It's a slap in the face and I will be voting with my wallet next time I get a bike.
  • + 3
 5200 bucks for a pretty solid build, supporting your bike shop, and a no-hassle lifetime warranty. what about a carbon frame, a fox performance fork, and gx eagle is compromised? if you don't like it, buy something else.
  • + 6
 @jtayabji what’s the issue with giving your local shop a chance to compete? Don’t assume that a Santa Cruz dealer is charging what is on the website, then decide to buy a YT based on the website price alone. I’m not saying to be an ass about it, but simply ask them what they are willing to sell it for. I worked in shops for years and happily sold bikes well under msrp. The customer then bought other stuff, brought us the bike for service and we were all happy.
  • + 0
 @ryan83: the worst part about a Santa Cruz is everyone pays less for it than you. Rather than be the sucker the shop tries to take advantage of, I will go online. Guess what, the shop is going to charge me up the wazoo whether I bring in a Bronson or a Capra. And the shop is going to make warranty replacement as unpleasant as possible so I’ll roll the dice with a YT that essentially has no warranty.

For 5200$ I want suspension with real adjustments and x01. And wheels that aren’t garbage.
  • + 3
 @sosburn: base level shock. Stock build you're looking at $6999usd to get a shock upgrade. Not to mention that the Fox X2 shock won't fit. Can't see the bling boys wanting RS rear and Fox front...
  • + 1
 @sml2727: Canyon Spectral is an incredible deal. It rides well as well (I have the 2016 version).
  • + 1
 @yzedf: maybe fox will see this as an opportunity to make a compatible version. Not quite sure why it specifically doesn't fit the frame seeing as loads of people run X2s on the nomad. the super deluxe R is fine, but a better option for $5200? buy the frame and build one up with better parts. thats what i do.
  • + 1
 @ryan83: that's not the issue.
  • + 3
 @sosburn: the dpx2 is probably more in line with what Santa Cruz was thinking for the Bronson. I see no reason why Fox should have to make one of their most popular shocks fit one particular bike.
  • + 2
 @huntstyle:
Twice as much? That's exaggerating. And good luck finding any YT's (for instance) at the moment, or a frame-only option...not saying direct-to-consumer is wrong or bad, but it's not necessarily the price/customer-service/value nirvana that it's touted to be...especially if your frame cracks...or when you've sold your rig to buy a bike that gets caught on a shipping container in the middle of a hurricane or trade war....Personally, I tend to buy frames used that are 12-18 months old and building it up the way I want to, so price-wise it's a little less...and I've enjoyed many SC bikes this way (along with a bunch of other awesome brands) that I would never want to buy straight up new at a dealer...
  • + 1
 @yzedf: Push literally just did that with the 11-6 to fit the nomad.
  • + 2
 @wibblywobbly: Sounds like your LBS sucks man, and I feel sorry for you that you don't get to deal with good people that 'fuel the stoke'. My local bike shop is pretty damned good--then again, if you see the bike shop as a place that is 'looking to take advantage of suckers', I'm guessing you are no joy to deal with as a customer, lol.

I agree with you though, new bike prices are waaaay outta hand. SC used to put together a pretty decent bike for the price point, but those days are gone. I'd buy a frame, but would never waste money on a complete from them with low-end fork/wheels/house brand parts.
  • + 1
 @sosburn: press release said Slash, Nomad and others.
  • + 1
 @UtahBikeMike: you're lucky, i would gladly do the same but couldn't find any demo nomad in XL Frown

@phclaw finding used alloy frames tends to be difficult, i personally wouldn't touch used carbon with a 10 foot pole, because people are too stupid and register their warranty for no reason.
  • + 37
 Just need this frame with 29inch wheels pretty please!
  • + 19
 Hightower v2 for sure.
  • + 7
 The 29er’s are coming; Nomad 29 & Hightower 2.0 just wait........
  • - 2
 @Pomki: sounds good to me
  • + 41
 They already make it dude.. like 5 different boring 29ers
  • + 1
 They must have already been testing applying the V10 suspension layout to the Hightower...guess it will be out soon enough.
  • + 1
 hmmm, looks like new colours for Hightower LT, but no change in geometry/linkage?
www.santacruzbicycles.com/en-US/hightower-lt
  • + 2
 @Pomki: I heard its called SC Damon
  • + 1
 @Pomki: Not this year, unfortunately.
  • + 2
 @Pomki: That's what I'm waiting for!
  • + 3
 @Pomki: I can't wait until 2020. Getting a Meta 29 instead.
  • + 6
 my guess is next year they will bring a 29 version of Bronson and call it Hightower V2 (or V3 if consider LT version). And they will "promote" the Tallboy V2 to be the 29er version of 5010, with 130 travel, since now they have the Blur to cover the XC crowd and the gap between Blur and current Tallboy is very narrow (100mm to 110mm travel frame).
  • + 3
 That is the Hightower LT.
  • + 5
 Imagine how badly you'd get torn into on this website like 2 years ago if you said you wanted a 29er lol
  • + 1
 @nfontanella: You still do torn into except a little less because some pro DH and Enduro riders rocking the 29er hoops. Legitimizes it. Haha.
  • + 33
 I guess I don't understand the wish/mention of wanting this with 29" wheels? They have the Hightower LT that is a 150mm 29er. Why would they offer the Bronson as a 150mm 29er? I'm sure they'll re-work the Hightower soon enough and it will be something close to this geometry-wise; which is fine, it just seems odd to mention it in this review and not mention the Hightower LT in the same sentence. It would be like riding my Pivot 5.5c and saying, "boy, I wish they'd make this in a 29er", meanwhile the Switchblade is sitting right there.
  • + 16
 The Hightower LT is a half-baked frankinbike born from the mold of the original Hightower. It’s been dated from the beginning and not a ground-up design. Having ridden both bikes and they work well but are in need of a geo update to keep up with the geo-joneses.
  • + 5
 @ryan83: its more than a geo update that it might benefit from, the linkage works very very different this way without any regressive-progressive shape in the LR curve typical of the other LR's seen in old bronson and in HT/5010.. they ride worlds apart.
  • + 8
 @ryan83: Hey I know the Geo-Joneses! Lovely couple, lots of fun
  • + 4
 @ryan83: Right, I can understand that, but how do you not even reference the LT in the article? If he said "might this be what the next Hightower LT will look like?" then I wouldn't have commented. Just seemed a bit odd.
  • + 3
 @Franziskaner: nice folks, they love the long low head angles for sure
  • + 1
 Sounds to me like they had the wrong @pinkbike reviewer on the job. Whining about how they wish both the 5010 and the Bronson were 29ers. SC already has a full line up of 29ers, surprised @mikekazimer didnt know that. Weird. I'm sure the new 29ers will be stunning as well, can't wait to read the biased bike reviews!
  • + 1
 @yupstate check out who wrote the ad. It’s impossible to remove Kazi’s 29er biased. Just look past the bullshat and pull out the info you want. He’s not the target market anyhow.
  • + 3
 Hightower lt feels like a big trail bike more than a true enduro/am rig. If you want a big wheeled am bike there currently is nothing in Santa Cruz lineup.
  • + 11
 the Hightower LT now comes in a new poop color. What more do you want?
  • + 3
 That’s true. Everyone else offers their bikes in 27.5 and 29 in the same models. So it’s not totally off base that Kaz would address that.
  • + 16
 @whoozh, I'm well aware that Santa Cruz has a line of 29ers - I've spent time on (and written about) the Hightower, Hightower LT, and the Tallboy. But even though the Hightower LT has 150mm of travel, the way that travel is delivered doesn't feel the same as it does on the Bronson.

The current Hightower LT is a fun bike, but it still seems like more of a stopgap, a bike that was created to satiate a demand without needing to open up an entirely new carbon mold. It has a relatively short reach and slack seat tube angle compared to other 29ers that we've seen hit the market recently. That's why I mentioned that I wished there was a 29" version of this bike - I think it would be superior to the current Hightower LT.

Also, I didn't write the article about the 5010 - that was @mikelevy. We came to the same conclusion independently about the bikes we rode. Turns out we both think a 29" version of these new bikes would be nice to see.
  • + 2
 & now Firebird 29 is sitting right there, with its tiny clevis. I'm guessing Santa Cruz will have a devil of a time fitting a 29/2.6" into lower-linkage driven shock config with 160mm travel.
  • + 4
 @yupstate" I'm completely confused by these constant comments as well. In just about every bike review, the comments are: "This would be perfect, if only it had 29" wheels, longer chainstays, longer reach, steeper seat tube angle, slacker head tube, shorter seat tube, a four-bar linkage instead of the actual suspension platform, wider bars, suspension from a different manufacturer and a coil." Soooo, you are clearly not interested in this bike at all... Why don't you read about one that interests you?

I understand that people don't feel the Hightower is as well engineered as the other SC bikes or other long-travel 29ers, but that doesn't mean they should switch everything into 29" wheels. Despite what the reviewers and the comments on Pinkbike suggest, SC obviously sees that there is still a market for ripper 27.5 bikes, and I for one am happy about that.
  • + 3
 I read that comment with a British accent, which made it much more enjoyable @Franziskaner:
  • + 22
 In what situation would anyone notice the difference of a flip chip that changes 0.3 degrees (genuinely curious)
  • + 2
 The ange is probably felt less than the change in bb-hightower.
  • + 3
 You wouldnt notice a 4mm drop in BB height? That's like saying you wouldnt notice if you had 175 or 170mm cranks either.
  • + 3
 You’d feel the difference there and then in the garage straight after you changed it then quickly forget about it. I agree it’s a small change but overall it’s still a change that’ll help you tweak the bike to your own needs. I’d take that over not having any options at all Wink
  • + 3
 My 2018 nomad has similar flip-chip and you notice it quite considerably. Enough that you'd want to change to the slacker version for bikepark and the steeper for everyday riding.
  • + 13
 @er043: stop pretending you’re so dialed that you’d notice a 4mm bb drop. You suck and we all know it.
  • + 7
 @thenotoriousmic: perhaps it’s the ones that suck the most that notice this stuff. The ones going so slow and over analysing everything. Oh shit that’s me
  • + 4
 I came here just to say that. Oba bike with suspension of any kind that is constantly moving and diving that is just a bullshit figure. It's almost an embarrassment to even mention it. The 4mm drop is also useless, less than the difference in 1 crank length.
  • + 4
 @thenotoriousmic: underrated comment
  • + 3
 It's to allow the change in tyres from 2.4 to 2.6/8
  • + 2
 Probably wouldn't notice anything except hitting pedals on roots less
  • - 13
flag er043 (Jul 3, 2018 at 4:57) (Below Threshold)
 @thenotoriousmic: go put 5mm longer cranks on yer bike or drop the BB and see how extra many rocks you end up smashing. Couldnt tell if you are any good on the bike or not from your IG, all I saw were selfies... no roots and rain profile either big man haha.
  • + 17
 @thenotoriousmic: f*ck the 4mm bb drop. My bike has a 50mm bb drop, every time I sit on it. Except if I'm wearing my camelbak with 3 litres of water in it, then I get 55mm, which is totally noticeable. Except if I'm doing a fasted ride after a huge crap, then I only get 47mm bb drop, which is totally noticeable... except that my tyres are effectively harder since I'm lighter, so it kind of cancels out. Still, totally noticeable.
  • + 5
 You fools this is the implementation of the concept of illusion of choice! Dance puppets dance! Big Grin
  • + 2
 It is pretty significant on the nomad as far as pedal strokes go, higher bb makes a big difference for general trail riding on that bike.
  • + 2
 My Jeffsy has a flip chip. I just leave it on the low setting. Haven't even tried to change it, but I doubt I'd be able to tell any difference.
  • - 3
 @er043: stop pretending you’re so dialed that you’d notice 5mm difference between crank lengths. You suck and we all know it.
  • + 7
 @er043: quit trolling people’s IG for comment fodder you creep.
  • + 2
 Just eat a decent cake and your bb will drop 10mm Razz
  • + 20
 Seeing anyone ask for a 29er Bronson makes me think of that time someone asked for a 27.5 Fugitive and Knolly just responded "See: Knolly Endorphin"
  • + 16
 Just stating the obvious. This grey bike matches the Tacoma grey like the tan Nomad matches the Tacoma desert color. Also, this bike looks like it hits all the right numbers. Well done, Santa Cruz.
  • + 2
 very astute, props sir.
  • - 1
 But where’s the one that matches a Prius?

Prob their new downcountry bike will.
  • + 2
 @WasatchEnduro: DOWWWWWN COUNTRYYYYYYYY
  • + 14
 I like how everyone thought the Nomad looked like complete shit, but after a year of getting used to that everyone is liking the look of the Bronson
  • - 4
flag nuttypoolog (Jul 3, 2018 at 22:58) (Below Threshold)
 I think that the horrible, ugly, stupid, nasty, ridiculous, tan-turd paint on the Nomad was what made it look like shit. I've seen a few custom painted Nomads that look SOOOO sick, but the baby diaper yellow Nomad hanging in my garage looks like a mangy pregnant camel. I'm just trying to insult the color as much as I can. It couldn't be any worse. I want to punch whoever approved this crap....

I can't wait for winter so I can strip it down and custom paint it. Last thought is white frame with rainbow lettering! (Will probably do gloss black with flat black, or replicate the teal/pink hotness of the previous Nomad as much as I can).
  • + 3
 @nuttypoolog: 2013 called and said it wanted its bright colors back.

While the "Miami Vice" Nomad V3 and "Tennis Ball Yellow" Bronson V1 were awesome in their days, it's not unpleasant (to some, at least) to have a new sepia-ish/desert-ish color palette. Snowboarding and Freeskiing went pretty much through the same phase a couple years ago. It seems like everyother bike manufacturer uses the same color over and over again.

For one, I totally like these new colors, especially le MY2018 Bronson in army green / black.
  • + 8
 Should be rejoicing that SC isn't forcing 29" wheels like a lot of other companies but instead the reviewer is compaining. Most people that get a 29er end up missing the smaller wheels and going back.
  • + 9
 Not me. I had 29er now 650b and the next bike will be 29er. I can feel the 650b slowing down where the 29er just kept its speed
  • + 2
 True
  • + 6
 @CM999: If I lived somewhere without jumps or turns I would consider 29. But I'm 6' 3" and 29ers still feel terribly boring.
  • - 3
 @casman86: 650b plus gives best of both. turns better but the wheel is begger than 650b and floats over everything and fastest of the 3 because doesn't get slowed down by small bumps or big ones. only downside is a bit less bite in turns with mu current tyres but could get knobbier ones
  • + 6
 @Nick-Marotta: Would never run bigger than 2.5. I prefer going fast. 2.3 minions currently
  • - 1
 No
  • + 7
 @CM999: but can you also feel the 29er being slower to accelerate? Because physics.
  • + 5
 @jwrendenver: Agreed. But thats the compromise Im happy with. Plus for me because the bigger wheel hold more momentum I spend less time accelerating back upto speed.
  • + 1
 @casman86: Fair enough, each to what they prefer.
  • + 3
 Once we can all agree to get over the UCI rules, everyone will have 29" front wheels and 650B rear. Seriously the best of both worlds. People will downvote me and call me a freak now, but time will tell.
  • + 0
 @skylerd: i’ll be sticking with 29 in rear
  • + 1
 The only way I would go back to smaller wheels is 26" on a dj bike, otherwise I'm 100% on the 29er train.
  • + 7
 It wasn't too long ago that Pinkbike was all like why 29? 29ers suck. Why not 27.5? Now it's why not 29? Everything should be 29! And if we go "way back" in the way back machine it was 26 or die.
  • + 5
 They probably want to get everyone bored riding 29ers. Then 26 will feel mind blowingly awesome to ride again and they can sell 26 like crazy, then start the cycle again. Wouldn't surprise me if that was in their long term plan all along. They did it with tire width, they recently had fools buying 2.8 and 3.0 tires like back in the day! Hilarious!
  • + 6
 Also, use to be that 9500$ bucks got you an XX1/XTR build with ENVE’s. Now you get Santa Cruz Carbon wheels. They are fine and all but, shouldn’t the bike cost 8300$?

Now we know why Santa Cruz started making their own wheels.
  • + 7
 Kind of hard to find any fault in this Bronson . Idk if I was splitting hairs maybe an extra inch of SO. Looks extremely well thought out
  • + 2
 Absolutely gorgeous too (especially the Juliana colors!). I always quite liked the looks of the Nomad 4 too, but have to admit this is still a huge improvement.
  • + 2
 @Rusettipasta: yes, nomad, Bronson and a solo. Solid 3 bike quiver
  • - 3
 You can't have stand over and bottles....
  • + 4
 1st fault: rear brake Routing designed for right hand side
2nd fault: rear brake line internal routed
  • + 4
 The new Bronson is beautiful
I think it will be my next bike!!
Why do everyone expect a 29"?
Not all new bikes have to be 29er
27.5 are perfect!!
To each store i go they offer me 29er and they tell me that 27.5 are going to disappear
  • + 7
 That is one seriously good looking bike, and I've love one.

I just can't get over the cost though. Insanity. €10K.
  • + 3
 Or $3500? Did you buy a Toyota or a Ferrari?
  • + 1
 @casman86: you use wrong car brand, Ferrari is made at home in Italy not in china.
its better work with some Chevrolet made by Daewoo
  • + 1
 @vitality: Most Toyotas in the US are actually made here in the US, not China. Not sure where Euro Toyotas are built...
  • + 1
 @bman33: the european ones are built in Japan or Belgium
  • + 3
 @casman86: Vitality has hit the nail o the head here.

In the automotive industry (which I've worked in and remain a part of), branding is a KEY part. However, each company has processes/factories/uniqueness.

If I buy a €30,000 Skoda - it will be good. Say it's a mid range sedan. If I spend DOUBLE that, and spend €60,000 from Mercedes - it's going to be a LOT faster (base spec), likely handles better, corners better etc.

Crucially, it doesn't have the SAME parts on it. It sure as hell isn't built in the same factory.

Moving back to SC.

1) Parts are THE EXACT SAME PARTS that you find on Canyon/YT. The same/equivalent.
2) They all use similar factories. Yes, QC is different per brand - but that's beside the point
3) The new Canyon Strive is half the price. H a l f. www.canyon.com/en-fr/mtb/strive/strive-cf-9-0.html

So, to come back to my point - the price of these wagons is obscene. I'm paying for some better marketing and a (potentially, but no one can really prove this) better bike.

Thus my original point. I would love one of these bikes. They look unreal. But, the price differentiation is just too much (for me).
  • + 2
 @jamesdunford:

Your numbers are off for us in the USA. Probably because Canyon is Germany-based (albeit with the new US distribution/operations), and Santa Cruz is based in California.

In the US, the Strive is $1k less than a similarly-spec'ed Bronson ($5,999 vs $6,999...and you have to build the bike yourself I think or have it delivered built for $150 more). Both use sram carbon cranks, guide rsc brakes. Somewhat minor differences are Canyon uses a lyrik and Santa Cruz uses a Fox 36 Performance; bronson has raceface arc rims/dt-swiss 350 hubs vs deemax on the strive. And the bronosn has a better shock, the super deluxe vs the monarch plus rc3 (although it can be argued the lyrik rct3 is better than the fox fork).

A grand isn't laundry change, but it's not half...

For comparison sake - YT has some great pricing, the top of the line Capra CF Race is priced at $5,199...but again you have to build it, plus they're all sold out on the US website. You can't get any Capra's until late August and those are the mid-range carbon builds at $3,699 (ridiculous price...if you can actually get one - the first shipments of Capras to the west coast had some shipping delays/glitches).

The Strive and Capra are great bikes and great buys...but you're also giving up that element of customer service with a mail-direct company (SC is known for great service...I don't know about Canyon and YT)...plus a lot of us like customizing our rides, and the frame only option is one I usually look at (and I'm usually buying frames a year or two old, just to save cash). YT and Canyon rarely if ever offer frame-only options.
  • + 3
 @phclaw: Interesting points and I take them onboard, maybe this is where buying from the continent you're on helps. I can't comment on Canyon, but as a YT customers who has just received his bike back from them (after fixing it), they've been solid.

Either way, I'm looking at the top spec bike as that's the one I'd like to own (Fox guy right here) and there is no other way of looking at it in Europe, it's €5000 difference for similar specs.

Lastly, on building the bikes - YT/Canyon's are essentially built. You have to put wheels in, put one bolt in a derailleur, add the bars and you're done Smile

That's potentially the best comeback I've read on Pinkbike, thanks for taking the time to right a proper, informative comment fella.
  • + 1
 @jamesdunford: spec options for aluminum frames also are rougher here in us as they don’t offer the higher level builds.

Really the best thing to do in states is buy a lightly used bike with component spec and a new frame. Sell the used frame and then you get best world of a warranty and a cheap parts package.
  • + 1
 @jamesdunford: Thanks man, that's great to hear about YT's customer service (and the fact you really don't have to wrench on them). I know a lot of riders on the west coast (me included) were drooling over the new Capra's in the spring but YT's supply chain left a lot to be desired, with ship dates being pushed back and some just outright canceling orders. Hopefully, those issues will be resolved as they grow the brand in the US.
  • + 1
 @jamesdunford: 2) They all use similar factories. Yes, QC is different per brand - but that's beside the point

Not true, SC has their own exclusive factory in South Asia, they are owners in it, and run it. They moved out of the factories that made Giant/Trek/Spec several years ago and built their own facility. The carbon frames between brands are not built the same, or even close to the same build quality. I work with aerospace composites and I can tell you that SC's manufacturing methods are head and shoulders above the other brands.

I buy a new bike maybe every 5+ years, so if I'm forking out my hard earned money it will be for the best manufactured frame that will last 5-8 years.
  • + 3
 Not that there aren't benefits to low seat tubes but when you have legs longer than the wheelbase itself high seat tubes aren't bad. I have a large bike with a 470mm seat tube height and I worked out I could comfortably run a 230mm dropper post.
  • + 8
 Then why aren't you on xl?
  • + 2
 Dropper posts haven't caught up yet but hopefully they will. The main issue is making sure the frame has enough physical seat tube to fit all of the post required for a dropper of that length.
  • + 2
 @casman86: I like the reach on the large
  • + 3
 @SuperJ07: It's like everybody's different.
  • + 7
 Will it fit a Fox X2 in rear setup?
  • + 1
 I'm wondering the same thing. I read that they chose RockShox because Fox didn't offer some bearing...can someone chime in here?
  • + 2
 nope....

SC on my request: "Unfortunately a coil shock will not fit on the new Bronson. The Super Deluxe fits because it's an air shock with an inline piggy back. The Fox DPX2 will also work for this reason."
  • + 1
 @Ben-P: GJ mate
  • + 1
 @snatchclown: Instead of bushings at both ends, the Super Deluxe on these bikes come with bearings on the side that sees the most rotation to offer the best possible small bump compliance. RWC has been offering needle bearings for shocks for the same reason.
  • + 3
 I love everything about this bike. They took an already fantastic bike and make it even better. So stoked for this model. and the sizing looks spot on for me too (FINALLY!)

I, for one, love the option of running 2.6-2.8 tires. I also love the announcement of the 37mm reserve wheels. It's a good day to be a mtber.

Cant wait to throw a leg over one of these and give it a RIP. I also love the cement color.,
  • + 3
 Probably not its intended use, but with the shock placement down low if you put a frame bag in the front triangle you can make it much wider than most bikes without worrying about crank arm clearance and fit a ton of stuff for bikepacking if you really stuff it. My L nomad can fit like 6 to 8L in the front triangle vs most fs bikes that are in the 3-5L range.
  • + 5
 The most shredding bike packing machine out there! Big Grin
  • + 2
 This was my 2nd thought after "I could fit a shitload of water in that triangle"
  • + 7
 @Connerv6: that much water is technically a pissload.
  • + 3
 @OvaltineJenkins: You my friend are a scholar and a gentleman.
  • + 3
 Yeah.... We should just all buy direct and totally sack off bike shops. Then the world would be a better place, wouldn't it? I mean, who needs bike shops? Haha. Every mountain biker knows far more than some dude working with bikes all day, don't they? That'd sort the industry right out.
  • + 2
 This is actually pretty sweet other than the 12 speed drivetrains. Room for water bottle, decent geometry, threaded BB, aluminum frame only options, good colors. Probably still going to get a Transition Patrol or Scout but now I have another option to consider. Everything else is crap for one reason or another.
  • + 3
 So the Alu Bronson is heavier than Alu nomad.
Is it because double side rear triangle on the new Bronson ? Bronson Carbon is still a bit lighter than nomad carbon tho.
Any idea what’s going on here?
  • + 4
 Disappointing that it only fits one water bottle in the front triangle.

*kidding* just in case someone put their angry pants on this morning and can decipher sarcasm
  • + 0
 As you can see under the down tube there is a port for internal water storage comparment.
  • + 1
 @WAKIdesigns: yes, for 3 liters I heard
  • + 7
 stop pushing 29" wheels
  • + 5
 No one mentioned how dope the riding in the video was? That. Was. Absolutely sick.
  • + 2
 Yeah! My first thought too. More like this please! Creative, fun, different... all things MTB needs.
  • + 5
 was this one redesigned from the ground up or was it just regular redesigned?
  • + 2
 Mike, could you stop with the "is there a 29er version?". We know you like 29ers but some of us think they feel heavy and slow, especially with good rubber. If your reviewing a 29er fine rave away. If it's not a 29er then just review it as such. 700c off road is for cyclocross!!!!!!
  • + 1
 I ride a Santa Cruz and love the way they keep innovating, but this announcement seems to boil down to a couple things: the Bronson has basically become an Ibis Mojo HD4 (good), but on the 5010, the changes are smaller - the rider position shifts an inch forward, the head angle is a half deg less (hi switch setting, 334 BB height is already way low), the wheelbase is 3% longer, and there's a small increase in rear tire clearance. It seems like a stretch to claim that adding another upright to an already bomb-proof rear triangle would drive the linkage better. Am I missing something? Glad to see their build kit improvements, especially the wheels (much better 6069 offset ARC rims, more Reserve upgrade options). They're finally getting their wheelsets together, great.
  • + 2
 HA now i cant tell the nomad from the bronson, thats gonna make for some embarrassment, ME: Hey nice nomad!
RANDOM GUY: uhh its a bronson learn your bike looser. ahhhh that'll be fun!!
  • + 2
 @mikekazimer can you confirm that this bike will not take a Float X2?

And did Santa Cruz really design it that way as part of some deal they made with SRAM to get cheap shocks?
  • + 2
 That upper link stills looks weird and disproportionate like on the Nomad. Santa Cruz is awesome for still making these bikes in aluminum and offer them as frame only as well.
  • + 5
 That's such a good looking bike in the grey.
  • + 1
 Saw this bike in person today (grey) SICK!
  • + 3
 Yeah cool, XL with a 460mm seat tube......genius We get a seat tube of a medium with an XL top tube fit will be awesome for all the gorillas out there riding
  • + 2
 It's for a longer dropper guy.
  • + 2
 Agreed, those of us with long legs are screwed... They don't make droppers long enough...ugh...
  • + 2
 I'm 6'5" with disproportionately long legs compared to my torso, and the 480 mm seat tube on my XL Nomad is just fine with a 170 mm dropper. I think that even with 20 mm less seat tube post length I wouldn't have any issues.
  • + 2
 @therev34: I ride a 520mm ST and can run a 170mm dropper. I am a bigger guy who has broken every full suspension bike I have ridden (been riding mtb since the 80's). With that much seatpost out of the frame it puts a TON of leverage on the frame and the seatpost, this is going to lead to more broken frames and droppers. Notice that the Bronson frame is now much heavier...I am guessing they had to beef up the frame massively.

Anyway I rode an XL Davinci Django during a demo day, and I loved the bike...but even with 500mm ST I had a crazy amount of seatpost showing:
imgur.com/2RHUiUi
  • + 3
 @pedalhound: I'm 6' 3" and xl frames with 500mm seat post are good for me but would prefer 480mm or less so I can get the bike into dirt jump mode. There's a lot of xl bikes with 520mm seat tubes still, I avoid those but they may be good for your situation.
  • + 2
 Demo'd an XL nomad and was my complaint as well. I'm 6'2" and by no means too huge for an XL, but had to run the 150mm dropper at it's minimum insertion. Kinda dumb.
  • + 2
 @gticket: Yup... Long droppers can only go so far.

@casman86 If you want a DJ buy one... You will have more fun on it than you will forcing your trail bike into DJ mode.
  • + 2
 @pedalhound: I recently moved to Bentonville, lots of jumps on the trails here but not actual DJ jumps. Maybe I'm in a unique situation. This is a place where you want a "do everything" bike. If I had the money I would also have a DJ just for practicing manuals and dicking around.
  • + 2
 It looks like a coil shock would fit sitting still. Would it rub in the frame cutout during travel? Not saying that it needs a coil, just want to know if I would have the option.
  • + 1
 i'm a little confused about the hi/lo options.

so Hi = steeper STA and HTA, making it better for climbing, also more reach less stack

and Lo = slacker STA and HTA, making it better for decending, less reach more stack?

is that correct?
  • + 2
 That should be correct. Also:

Hi = higher bottom bracket

Lo = lower bottom bracket
  • + 1
 "In case you're wondering, there's no way that a 29" wheel can be sqeezed in there - the tire will hit the lower rocker link."

So, that means that a 29er would have to have an almost 2cm longer CS, probably 1.5cm, forgoing 2.6" tires, which is sensible anyhow. Good. ESTA also improved (with TT in the sweet spot at XL, for me). Sign me up for that bike when it gets released! In my heart I'm a Santa Cruz fanboi anyways.
  • + 1
 so looking at the aluminum models why is the bronson heavier then the nomad. 2nd question is the leverage curve similar to the nomad 4 ? meaning itll suck for heavier people ? Nomad 3 works for me but the 4 wont specially without a coil.
  • + 2
 I would say that I'm firmly in the heavier people category at 250 lbs w/o a pack on, but I absolutely love my Nomad 4 with the air shock (I originally wanted the coil but didn't want to fork over another $600 to move up to the next build kit).
  • + 1
 no worries, a coil shock won't fit the bronson anyways.... i ask sc
  • + 5
 So can we order the Juliana colour but with Santa Cruz graphics?
  • + 1
 No kidding. That JULIANA font is on par with what you'd see on a bike at Walmart.
  • + 5
 Why is the aluminum so heavy? S comes at almost 15kg (33lbs)??
  • + 4
 even the carbon frame option is kind of heavy for a 150mm travel bike
  • + 7
 @K1maxX: Lifetime warranty so overbuilt at the expense of the weight
  • + 1
 Do we know actual frame weights?
  • + 6
 @funkendrenchman: from 34.51lbs to 28.68 from the R+ to the blinged out XTR. Aluminum S went from 30.19 to 33.05 and Carbon S from 29.07 to 30.56. XX1 was 23.13lbs.

Significant weight increase across the board. Odd that reviews make a big deal about a few grams less weight but will ignore a pound and a half gain.
  • + 2
 It's all in that extra upright!
  • + 1
 @bruvar: Oh and aslo heavier than Nomad in aluminium (carbons are lighter).
  • + 2
 @K1maxX: yes they are heavy and the new Bronson will be 200g heavier than the old one
  • + 2
 that alu frame isn't optimized (like for example Rotwild does), it's just a cheaper frame
  • + 1
 @vhdh666: Still wow is it heavier than Nomad's? Is it so overbuilt?
  • + 1
 @vid1998: I don't know if it's heavier than a Nomad
  • + 1
 @vhdh666: According to their site alu Bronson R an S are heavier than Nomads and the specs are the same.
  • + 3
 Yo! #Intense @intense, please take note and give us alloy frame options #intense4life
  • + 1
 yep, waiting for intense reply!
  • + 2
 Why anyone would buy this bike at those prices is beyond me when you can save ~$1500+ on any of the direct-buy brands for similar builds. Crazy.
  • + 3
 Try getting a capra or strive right now....no availability...plus you give up customer service element if your frame cracks, etc...not saying YT and Canyon aren't solid companies, but you won't get that aspect...and that is....IF you can actually find a bike in stock (and forget buying a frame only and building it up yourself...)
  • + 1
 @phclaw: YT equivalent to the Bronson is the Jeffsy 27, not the Bronson. Plenty of those available. SC version of the Capra would be the Nomad.

Comps:
Jeffsy 27 CF = $3500 / Bronson S Carbon C = $5200
Jeffsy 27 AL = $2300 / Bronson R AL = $3500

I can cover an awful lot of shipping for whatever warranty issues come up with the $1500 I saved on the front end.
  • + 1
 @phclaw: Also, good luck getting SC to support a warranty on a second-hand frame. SC told me to go f*ck myself when I cracked the rear triangle on my second-hand Gen 1 Bronson.

Plenty of Jeffy 27s in stock at the moment.
  • + 1
 I'm not sure about every other area of the world, but in BC, the first thing I noticed is the huge number of Bronson's and Nomad's that went for sale on PB after this article came out.
  • + 2
 I sold my 2016 Bronson about a year ago. My buddy runs a shop that sells Santa Cruz, he told me do dump it quickly right after the new Nomad came out. He knew the Bronson remake was coming. Haha!. Running a Pivot Mach 5.5 now and digging it. I do like the new Bronson though..
  • + 2
 as usual, no mention of the actual vs effective seat angle, but looks pretty slack to me. thanks, but hard pass from a tall guy...
  • + 4
 Throwback to those 2014 nomad colors
  • + 2
 That upper link makes the whole bike look a lot more appealing than the nomad's.
  • + 2
 I really dig bike vids featuring RatBoy but in this case...... What the actual F**K?!!!!!!
  • + 2
 Nice to see SC leading the charge with all-12-speed bikes for this iteration.
  • + 1
 Unless you are a Shimano rider. Then your cost of entry just went from $5,699 to $9,899. Yeow! At least they sell the frame only...
  • + 0
 Clever how they've managed to rid their bikes of many of the crappy traits of VPP while still keeping the design. If they did a Horst bike it would no doubt ride great but I bet it'd look stunning.
  • + 1
 I like, however, that upper link looks like a terrible pinch point for my sack on those late evening ‘free rides’ I like to take
  • + 3
 BEST VIDEO EVER! Thank you SC and Rat Boy!
  • + 1
 When does Santa Cruz make a steel hardtail or at least something simpler and raw than does not work worse but that, at least, free us from any useless mental wankings?
  • + 3
 Not sure what he but.....fuck....so ugly
  • + 1
 Need to take it for a few test laps here: www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Bt4Ly9_9Qg


Santa Cruz would surely sell their whole production batch there!
  • + 3
 Interested to see what they’ll do with the 5010 now
  • + 14
 Lol ok I wasn’t left in the dark long
  • + 3
 Hello of a lot better looking that the Nomad Looks incredibly refined.
  • + 3
 What fork offsets are they using on this new Bronson?
  • + 4
 Very EVIL
  • - 1
 haha.. you'll get lynched.. first thought that looks like a nomad, second thought, ain't that rear shock copied off the Evil
  • + 1
 @whatyadoinsucka: Funny you say that. I'm looking at my insurgent right now going man, I've had this bike for a while. Sure the reach is longer but what bike doesn't grow every year. Chainstays, hta, pretty much spot on. Not to mention the best part, low COG shock placement.
  • + 1
 @mikekazimer
What air pressure did you run in the 30mm Reverse wheels? And which one are you running in the 36mm Reverse wheels?
  • + 1
 I was running 21 psi front / 23 psi rear with the 30mm rims and a 2.5" / 2.4" tire combo, and 19 psi front / 21 psi rear with the 2.6" tires on 37mm rims. Keep in mind that the conditions where I live tend to be loamier and softer than other parts of the world - I'd likely run slightly higher pressures if I was somewhere like Utah or Arizona.
  • + 1
 @mikekazimer: hi mike. Are the plus size rims 27.5 or 26? Thanks!
  • + 1
 @mikekazimer: Thanks for the caveat on the pressure. If I ran 21/23 here in Colorado, I would roll the tires off during a race, bike park or places like Moab unless it was full on DH tires
  • + 1
 @mikekazimer: Thank you, Mike!
  • + 1
 What's up with the new Maxxis "Silk Shield" casing? Noticed it on the HTLT and jumped over to the Maxxis website. Looks promising!
  • + 4
 Other than that it sounds like a new condom brand? Safe riding!
  • + 1
 It's not a new casing, it's just another puncture breaker, like EXO.
  • + 1
 Keen to demo and compare against my Bronson v2 which I’ve always ran with a 160mm Lyrik. Looks tasty
  • - 1
 With all due respect to my favorite bike company... This is the most redundant bike I have ever seen produced and the Nomad is going to end up the most sales-cannibalistic model bike in history.
  • + 1
 When you buy "frame only" does it come with a shock? What shock lengh does it take?
  • - 1
 This is exactly the Bronson geo I want and the colors are sweet but the Rockshox only option is a deal killer....come on Fox let’s make this happen, daddy wants a new sled!!
  • + 1
 Metric shocks have not brought down leverage ratio’s all that talk about longer stroke in less space was bs.
  • + 1
 Who would buy the blue / Green one?

Grey one looks nice to me but perhaps a bit boring. Not sure on the colours.
  • + 1
 Longer? Yes - check. Slacker? Yes - check. Steeper seat tube? Yes - check. Must be better - where do I pay?
  • + 1
 SOOOOOO NICE Drool the more reviews I read about this new design, the more it makes me want to get another Bronson!!!
  • + 0
 Damn.. I absolutely love my nomad but I wouln't mind trading in for this frame, love that upper link too. But man, mismatching shock/fork brands?
  • + 1
 That's how I feel about Transition's bikes. I love everything about them but unless you get the top of the line spec or entry level spec they come with mismatched fork/shock brands.
  • + 5
 i know what you're saying here but is it really a huge issue? Its long been the case with many brands. Granted, I have little experience with tons of different shock platforms personally, but is the difference so big to cause a problem? Of those bikes i have ridden with different brands front and rear, i cant say its been any less enjoyable. Or is this a 'factory look' thing?
  • + 1
 I’m more intrigued as to why they chose the Super Deluxe over all other options. I can vouch for it being leaps and bounds better than the Monarch. I can’t say for Fox but a reoccurring theme at my shop has been that everyone needs the biggest volume spacer available in the DPX2 and X2 to stop their bikes from bottoming out at nearly max pressure.
  • + 2
 @m47h13u: Read elsewhere Santa Cruz stated that the new Rockshox shocks are available with a bearing mounted shock where as fox are not. It is apparently a much better system for this linkage.
  • + 1
 @DuncyH: funny how Fox has been making trunnion mounted shocks for Trek for what seems like a lifetime but suddenly the industry shifts and they’re behind with something they almost created.
  • + 1
 @m47h13u: sounds familiar!
  • - 2
 Santa Cruz have always made lovely looking bikes, the Nomad and now the Bronson are not nice looking. Plus the colours are just odd. Geometry is getting better though. I’m sure these bikes will ride well, but they don’t make me want one.
  • + 18
 These "odd" colors is what a 2020 line-up of the rest of the industry will look like.
  • + 3
 I concur on the fugly colors Ozak. Makes one wonder about the availability of hallucinogens up there in Santa Cruz
  • + 2
 @YoKev: no need to wonder. They’re quite readily available.
  • + 5
 I think you just have poor taste the colors are fine and the bike looks nice, and if I was looking for a bike and I would get a nomad or a bronson.
  • + 12
 The Bronson comes in primer, so you can paint it any color you like.????
  • - 2
 Agreed, colours suck big hairy balls. Every time they get a colour they just fudge it up then next season. Since PON bought SC I swear all the colours are being chose by Germans anyway, hence the depressing colours and lots of greys...!
  • + 2
 SC colors used (still are?) to be made up by roskop (?), therefore may look a little different than the largest brands. Specialized, etc, buy the yearly color trend book and pick colors from there. Same book is used by other industries, ie auto, fashion etc. SC colors/logos are getting more like surly, which used (still is?) to paint all their bike in blue collar / industrial colors.
  • + 3
 @clarky78: PON is Dutch. The current Nomad colours are inspired by Fritessaus and a Van Gogh night sky while the Orange should explain itself.
  • + 1
 @qldmtb: quality comment.

Personally I like the specs of the new bikes, buy am put off by the colours and that shock right in the way of all the spray... mudguard or not, that rear shock eye is going to get effed. New Capra in red looks a lot better than this. Believe that.
  • + 1
 In my opinion there is just too much going on with that rear suspension design.
  • + 2
 Makes Evil's lower-linkage driven design look pretty clean. They should collaborate on tube shapes. Plus Evil already has this in 29 LT.
  • + 2
 Thought this was my next bike....until I saw the price! Gulp! :O
  • + 2
 Best Video i've seen in a long time
  • + 1
 European price of 2019 SC bike are about 300 euros more expensive than 2018 (ie for the Hightower)... any explanation ?
  • + 2
 You can thank TRUMP for that price increase!
  • + 2
 @drivereight: Don't think he has much to do with this as he obviously has no idea how global supply chains work. Euro Santa Cruz bikes are made in China along with their components and assembled in Europe.
  • - 1
 Looking forward to new Hightower lt they must have in pipeline. The regular Hightower is great as is but the lt doesn’t perform as well as many of Santa Cruz’s other bikes.
  • + 2
 Grafitti-ing rocks is kuuuuuule
  • + 2
 Not impressed with the colours for 2019 bikes.
  • + 1
 it looks like the rear (uk on left) brake hose internal routing Santa Cruz thing is still a thing with this bike......
  • + 1
 WOW! I need these dual uprights on the rear swingarm for my Nomad now.. It's a bit flimsy at the back to be honest.
  • + 1
 Love to see a Bronson Vs Tracer shoot out....
  • + 1
 Is There a new Hightower on the way also?
  • + 1
 @santacruzbicycles here’s hoping you do a raw aluminium frame. Cheers!
  • + 1
 By far the raddest promo vid ever
  • + 1
 IT'S COMING HOME...................................
  • + 1
 Any word on frame only weights between al, c, cc?
  • + 1
 Guess I gotta scrap my V2
  • + 2
 Nice evil calling color.
  • + 1
 I can only enjoy the hype..buy this bike? Maybe no
  • + 1
 Can i fit a coil shock in this beauty?
  • + 1
 Yes.
  • + 1
 @mikekazimer what stroke shock?
  • + 3
 210x55mm.
  • + 1
 @mikekazimer: you think an X2 or DHX2 is going to fit in there once they figure out the bearing mount?
  • + 1
 210x55mm
  • + 1
 @mikekazimer: would a 216mm DVO jade coil fit in it? (Forgive my ignorance)
  • + 1
 @suboptimalOC: No coil shock will fit in the frame inline only..
  • - 2
 Jesus, that's a short seat tube...I would need to have at least a 250mm dropper post. That would put so much leverage on the frame. I really am not a fan of this trend... No Sale!
  • - 3
 So Santa Cruz made an Ibis HD4.... geo is almost identical.

No super boost 157?

Why only Rock Shox in back? They make a great fork, but I hate, hate, hate their shocks. This bike deserves an X2 and not some beginner shock.

This should be an awesome bike. VPP bikes with the shock driven off the lower link ride so much better than the upper link ones going down hill. They jump better and the suspension doesn’t pack in like the upper link bikes and pedal just as well. I owned a Bronson 2 and own a v10. Also have a lot of time on the new Nomad. This bike should fix everything I didn’t like about the last Bronson. Don’t think I’m going to sell my HD4 for this though. Despite the fact that this frame will be actually finished properly, won’t creak and probably won’t brake, I’m down with Santa Cruz.

They have an ebike coming and I refuse to buy a bike from anyone that makes an ebike. But more than that, every interaction I’ve ever had with Santa Cruz has been negative - their reps are self-important jerks and while they do have an awesome warranty, I just always get a feeling dealing with them that they hold their customer in contempt.
  • - 3
 Worst marketing video ever....didn’t realize they were trying to market the Bronson as a dirt jumper/trials bike. Also, enough with the drug references, and edm music. Might as well have had skrillex riding this bike down the trails.
  • + 14
 You tell the kids to get off your lawn yet today?
  • + 1
 @Hill-Seeker: A few times this morning. Why?
  • + 1
 I think Rat loves Portugal, that flag in his home/boat *.*
  • + 1
 Why didn't they make the Nomad with the dual upright rear triangle?
  • + 1
 nice bike.. shame its small for everybody over 185
  • - 2
 "but those big tires made it much easier to keep from spinning out and losing traction. " .... why not learn technique and not wait for a new bike or bigger tires to come out?
  • + 2
 Santa Cruz, winning!
  • + 0
 finally, they fixed geo; looks awesome;

and they make them in alu !!
  • + 0
 Looks only a mother could love, and prices only a motherf**cker could pay.
  • + 2
 i think you're in the wrong sport. santa cruz's prices are about the same as every other company.
  • + 3
 @dtrotter: If by "every other company" you mean Yeti, then you're right. But take a look at comparative builds on bikes by Canyon, YT, Spot, etc. Santa Cruz comes in about $1500-2000 higher in every instance. They're about $500+ more expensive than bikes like Ibis, Intense, and Transition.

For instance, look at the $5200 "Carbon S" build: you get Performance suspension, GX Eagle, crappy RF rims laced to DT Swiss 370 hubs, and low-level Code R brakes. Then look at the same price point from the other companies listed below: it's typically XO1 level drivetrains, Factory suspension, much better wheels, and Guide RSC or Shimano XT brakes. They're not even close.
  • + 1
 @stevemokan: Yep, top of the line Jeffsy is $5k and comes with all Fox Factory, XTR, Guide Ultimate, Renthal Fatbar, E13 carbon rims, etc.
  • + 3
 @huntstyle: can’t compare a bike arriving in a box to a lifetime guarantee on a frame/bearings and a guarantee for parts availability when you’re on your only vacation in 2 years. Santa is def Expensive but you get a better distribution network than most brands and a better finish than what comes on a trek or specialized.
  • + 0
 @stevemokan: *compare them to other NON direct brands and they are right on par.
  • + 1
 @bulletbassman: fully agree, SC has the lifetime warranty even on bearings, wide distributor range, so you can fully rely on their support during bike park vacation, also they do not put the restriction on bike categories such as EU companies (CAnyon for example)
  • + 1
 @dtrotter: Tell that to my £800 Nukeproof.
  • + 1
 @bulletbassman: So, fair enough. None of that invalidates my point, does it?
  • + 1
 @clownpnd: Guys, I'll let you in on a secret - I've replaced the bearings on my four year old bike once, and they cost around £20. They're not that expensive. You're talking as though they're a significant maintenance cost. If you want to pay the extra grand or so for some badge and aftercare, fill yer boots - but you're willingly being bent over by SC.
  • + 1
 @gkeele: bearings life 1 yaer of active raiding, bike parks/snow etc...
Also 150mm frame could be smashed at the bike park no questions asked, to me intense / SC companies that have best in class suspension design, warranty, customer service and riding characteristics - for that i'm paying. I do not see any problems purchasing Capra's and other brands, each person able to find what suits him best...
  • + 1
 Can it fit a float X2?
  • + 2
 No, SC specifically listed on the website (under FAQ section) that an X2 and CC DB Air will not fit. That's a bummer.
  • + 3
 @gasmanxj: I really thought Santa Cruz were onto a winner but I think there is a bit of an oversight here. Seems very strange to limit what can be fitted to just a handful of shocks when there's so much choice out there now.

Fitting Coils seems to be all the rage and they likely won't fit, not being able to fit an X2 or CCDB I feel will cut off a lot of the market, it certainly cut out any vague dreamy idea of me getting one. I think I'll just keep enjoying my V3 Nomad for another year at least.

My biggest concern though is what about riders being sponsored by companies other than Rockshox (Syndicate comes to mind, but there's many others), they just won't be able to run the Bronson because of sponsorship problems with running certain parts?

Also seen that the nomad builds are now specced with mismatching suspension too.
  • + 1
 @DuncyH: Same here im considering buying this bike or a ripmo but the shock selection is disappointing for the price. Nothing against rockshox i just love fox. I have a foxair shock havent serviced in 6 years and it runs like new. Honest no joke since 2012
  • + 1
 Can you fit a Float X2?
  • + 1
 $5199 for C S pff...
  • + 1
 Is that paper bag?
  • - 1
 No Press Fit bottom bracket ? That's a deal breaker for me...
  • + 17
 -Said no one ever
  • + 1
 @McBoxer: water bottle mounts? That's a deal breaker for me...
  • - 1
 Barf...
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